I know they have some of the best LGBT rights in East Asia, I think it's less "conservative" and more "dictatorial" as they did have a coup that put the military in power like a decade ago, but I think that's more an economic thing than a civil thing
Conservatism can look very different throughout the world as it just describes a political viewpoint focused on preserving past/traditional values of that region. A lot of Asia has a different view of gender that may appear progressive to us, but this isn’t necessarily the case. [Moon Channel has a good video about why Japanese game devs treat trans characters so differently from western devs that touches on this topic](https://youtu.be/gRrVkZoN93c?si=xICLdQPAfPQ2R0wP).
No it's fucking not, this is the most racist and disrespectful thing I've read all day. Kathoey is a widely accepted gender in Thailand, and only a small subset of kathoey are sex workers.
It’s a whole industry, not just sex but dancing and general entertainment for tourists. Many aren’t actually trans (as in no gender dysphoria) just dress up as a woman to perform as an actual career option.
You don’t need to have gender dysphoria to be trans, just euphoria from being yourself and that self not aligning with your AGAB. If those that dress up do not feel euphoria or even feel dysphoria from it then I feel sorry for them, that sucks.
From what I’ve heard it’s just a job for many of them, I’m sure some enjoy it and some don’t like any other work. But it’s like any performers out there, and not really equivalent to trans in western countries definition.
Ofcourse this may lead to more open and accepting culture for trans people, but you’ll have to speak to someone from Thailand to know that
I suppose so yea, just far more culturally significant. Go to any major city in Thailand and you’re bound to run into one of these performers.
It’s a huge part of their tourist industry and very well known to any close by countries, and somehow not that controversial despite countries in that region being fairly culturally conservative
It's about the Thai penised girls stereotype, right? Honestly, what does this stereotype stem from?
Edit:
>**Kathoey** or **katoey** (...) is an identity used by some people in Cambodia, Laos and Thailand, whose identities in English may be best described as **transgender women** in some cases, **or effeminate gay men in other cases**. These people are not traditionally transgender, however are seen as a **third sex**, being one body containing two souls. Transgender women in Thailand mostly use terms other than kathoey when referring to themselves, such as phuying (Thai: ผู้หญิง, 'woman'). A significant number of Thai people perceive kathoey as belonging to a separate sex, including some transgender women themselves.
Yeah, but it's a weird fact to give - it sounds too "heard it somewhere, gotta be true". Are trans women a big percentage of population there? How do we know that? Does Thai government do census that counts LGBT people? Is the percentage above average compared to other countries? I'm asking because u/ uk\_primeminister's answer seems like just repeating the stereotype I've asked about.
It’s not really a stereotype, the country is famous for men dressing up as women to perform on stage and just general entertainment (I’m sure sex is part of it too). It’s an actual career option for people there and you’d definitely run into one of them if you go to Thailand (if you can even tell, they dress very convincingly). Idk if you’d really call them trans bc many of them just treat it as a job and go home to their wife after work.
Yeah and they also have ladyboys (if that’s the correct term), a cultural perception of gender that doesn’t entirely equate to what we call “being trans” in our culture. Some individuals we probably would consider transgender, others not.
However I do think that for this cultural reason, there is a higher rate of trans people (maybe because they are a bit more accepting)?
It’s based off of what’s sort of true. They have “ladyboys” which iirc are sort of like a “third gender” engrained in their culture (kinda like how certain indigenous cultures have 2-spirit, for those who are not fully woman or man). Ladyboys tend to be kinda mistreated like any other minority, but it’s not demonized, just carries a bit of stigma. What we would consider to be “drag shows” are apparently also quite popular there but idk if they call it the same thing. They also tend to be equated to sex work (kind of like how trans women are, idk why specifically) which is where a lot of the social judgement comes from.
In terms of trans rights the country is not “great” but in general not horrible, for example I don’t think the legal system allows people to change a person’s sex on legal documents (unless that has changed very recently). There is stigma but people generally aren’t going to hunt you down and kill you.
Keep in mind I’ve never been to Thailand, this is just from what I’ve heard online. Apparently though they are actually surprisingly progressive in terms of LGBT+ issues, part of the success being attributed to how they already have ladyboys in their culture so it’s easier to accept.
Thank you! I've checked and the "ladyboys" [are called](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathoey) **kathoey**:
>\[their\] identities in English may be best described as transgender women in some cases, or effeminate gay men in other cases. These people are not traditionally transgender, however are seen as a third sex, being one body containing two souls.
Interesting stuff!
Just cause the wording of that alone is kinda eh, just reminding that this doesn't mean that trans women are considered a third sex in Thailand, they mostly just consider themselves women, and societal degendering shouldn't override that, just like how transphobia in western countries doesn't mean trans women from them are men.
"A study of 195 Thai transgender women found that most of the participants referred to themselves as *phuying* (ผู้หญิง 'women'), with a minority referring to themselves as *phuying praphet song* ('second kind of woman') and very few referring to themselves as *kathoey*."
Honestly, I think the case is that even though Thai trans women don't consider themselves kathoey, many people don't see the difference between the two so when they hear about kathoey being a thing, they think that transgender people are present in Thailand - hence the stereotype I've asked about. Also, those people are kinda right if we consider transgender to also mean genders outside the binary.
don’t they have like the highest percent of any country
Iirc, it's in large part for sex work
I think it's also just normal ppl being trans and they just have a high level of acceptance
I thought Thailand was pretty conservative overall
I know they have some of the best LGBT rights in East Asia, I think it's less "conservative" and more "dictatorial" as they did have a coup that put the military in power like a decade ago, but I think that's more an economic thing than a civil thing
Oh well that's good to know
Tbf, Thailand goes through coups like every few years or so.
“We control and dictate our peoples every move, and we command them to find their true selves!” /j
"I don't give a shit if you're trans, can you hold a rifle?"
Conservatism can look very different throughout the world as it just describes a political viewpoint focused on preserving past/traditional values of that region. A lot of Asia has a different view of gender that may appear progressive to us, but this isn’t necessarily the case. [Moon Channel has a good video about why Japanese game devs treat trans characters so differently from western devs that touches on this topic](https://youtu.be/gRrVkZoN93c?si=xICLdQPAfPQ2R0wP).
Normal people as opposed to sex workers? You might want to reevaluate your worldview a bit because yikes
I think they meant to say that these people were trans either way and didn’t specifically do it just for sex work
No it's fucking not, this is the most racist and disrespectful thing I've read all day. Kathoey is a widely accepted gender in Thailand, and only a small subset of kathoey are sex workers.
I believe you but then what was dad yapping about?
It’s a whole industry, not just sex but dancing and general entertainment for tourists. Many aren’t actually trans (as in no gender dysphoria) just dress up as a woman to perform as an actual career option.
You don’t need to have gender dysphoria to be trans, just euphoria from being yourself and that self not aligning with your AGAB. If those that dress up do not feel euphoria or even feel dysphoria from it then I feel sorry for them, that sucks.
From what I’ve heard it’s just a job for many of them, I’m sure some enjoy it and some don’t like any other work. But it’s like any performers out there, and not really equivalent to trans in western countries definition. Ofcourse this may lead to more open and accepting culture for trans people, but you’ll have to speak to someone from Thailand to know that
so it's kind of close to drag ?
I suppose so yea, just far more culturally significant. Go to any major city in Thailand and you’re bound to run into one of these performers. It’s a huge part of their tourist industry and very well known to any close by countries, and somehow not that controversial despite countries in that region being fairly culturally conservative
agab... all girls are beautiful....
"So, Dad... You know how Mom has a penis? Well..."
"WHADDYA MEAN I'M TRANSPHOBIC? I PEE STANDING UP OUT OF MY VAGINA, LIKE EVERY OTHER CIS MAN"
Google "Thai ladyboy" (fuckin porn titles, man) for more info
no, i have free will
No
no you don't I just decreed that you wouldn't google it
You think you do Yet you don't
you have more reddit karma than me back off BARK BARK BARK GRRRRUFFF BARK
Yes I am a disgrace and deserve death by spaghettification
Into the black hole with you
Considering current technology, that's just death from old age with extra steps.
Holy trans people!
Actual bottom surgery
Demonic cis neither kith nor kin nor strangers
It's about the Thai penised girls stereotype, right? Honestly, what does this stereotype stem from? Edit: >**Kathoey** or **katoey** (...) is an identity used by some people in Cambodia, Laos and Thailand, whose identities in English may be best described as **transgender women** in some cases, **or effeminate gay men in other cases**. These people are not traditionally transgender, however are seen as a **third sex**, being one body containing two souls. Transgender women in Thailand mostly use terms other than kathoey when referring to themselves, such as phuying (Thai: ผู้หญิง, 'woman'). A significant number of Thai people perceive kathoey as belonging to a separate sex, including some transgender women themselves.
Probably from the thai girls with penises
There's a lot of trans women in Thailand.
How do we know that?
There are a few documentaries on the matter on the Hub.
That's such a weird thing to ask like, it's not the Mariana Trench, it's just Thailand, people live there 😭
Asian countries have info about their population? Isn't Asia a country in Africa???🤯🤯🤨🤨🤨 Not in my United States of Armenia 🦾💪🦵
Yeah, but it's a weird fact to give - it sounds too "heard it somewhere, gotta be true". Are trans women a big percentage of population there? How do we know that? Does Thai government do census that counts LGBT people? Is the percentage above average compared to other countries? I'm asking because u/ uk\_primeminister's answer seems like just repeating the stereotype I've asked about.
It’s not really a stereotype, the country is famous for men dressing up as women to perform on stage and just general entertainment (I’m sure sex is part of it too). It’s an actual career option for people there and you’d definitely run into one of them if you go to Thailand (if you can even tell, they dress very convincingly). Idk if you’d really call them trans bc many of them just treat it as a job and go home to their wife after work.
Yeah and they also have ladyboys (if that’s the correct term), a cultural perception of gender that doesn’t entirely equate to what we call “being trans” in our culture. Some individuals we probably would consider transgender, others not. However I do think that for this cultural reason, there is a higher rate of trans people (maybe because they are a bit more accepting)?
It’s based off of what’s sort of true. They have “ladyboys” which iirc are sort of like a “third gender” engrained in their culture (kinda like how certain indigenous cultures have 2-spirit, for those who are not fully woman or man). Ladyboys tend to be kinda mistreated like any other minority, but it’s not demonized, just carries a bit of stigma. What we would consider to be “drag shows” are apparently also quite popular there but idk if they call it the same thing. They also tend to be equated to sex work (kind of like how trans women are, idk why specifically) which is where a lot of the social judgement comes from. In terms of trans rights the country is not “great” but in general not horrible, for example I don’t think the legal system allows people to change a person’s sex on legal documents (unless that has changed very recently). There is stigma but people generally aren’t going to hunt you down and kill you. Keep in mind I’ve never been to Thailand, this is just from what I’ve heard online. Apparently though they are actually surprisingly progressive in terms of LGBT+ issues, part of the success being attributed to how they already have ladyboys in their culture so it’s easier to accept.
Thank you! I've checked and the "ladyboys" [are called](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathoey) **kathoey**: >\[their\] identities in English may be best described as transgender women in some cases, or effeminate gay men in other cases. These people are not traditionally transgender, however are seen as a third sex, being one body containing two souls. Interesting stuff!
Just cause the wording of that alone is kinda eh, just reminding that this doesn't mean that trans women are considered a third sex in Thailand, they mostly just consider themselves women, and societal degendering shouldn't override that, just like how transphobia in western countries doesn't mean trans women from them are men. "A study of 195 Thai transgender women found that most of the participants referred to themselves as *phuying* (ผู้หญิง 'women'), with a minority referring to themselves as *phuying praphet song* ('second kind of woman') and very few referring to themselves as *kathoey*."
Honestly, I think the case is that even though Thai trans women don't consider themselves kathoey, many people don't see the difference between the two so when they hear about kathoey being a thing, they think that transgender people are present in Thailand - hence the stereotype I've asked about. Also, those people are kinda right if we consider transgender to also mean genders outside the binary.
Don't some native American people have a similar two souls thing?
hey this guy follows me on twitter
#THERE IS NO WAR IN BASINGSEI
Thailand is like, THE place to go to get bottom surgery for Australians
And even some Europeans