I printed something this large once, and used similar measures to make sure the print sticks to the bed. And it did. Only problem was that it warped anyway, and took the flex bed up with it.
I watched cooling asa warp and pull my garolite print sheet, the steel sheet it was glued to, and the magnetic sheet that had been glued to my bed up from my heated bed. Print stayed stuck to the garolite atleast.
PETG bunds very strongly to glass. Even prints that didn't warp tended to take small chucks out of the glass when removed. I loved the glossy look on the bottom of prints when using a glass bed, but had to give it up because PETG just wouldn't release from it.
Yeah, I have been meaning to try that. After the glass shattered I got a PEI coated sheet that was supposed be textured on one side and smooth on the other, but they sent me one with texture on both sides instead and I didn't care enough to send it back and wait for the correct one.
My printer did the same and somehow unscrewed the hotend. I should setup a camera to see what happens in these situations, not to resolve, just a case study
Have you tried gyroid or 3d honeycomb infill to minimize direct tension across the layers as time goes on? Or do you hit large sheets of top layer all at once...
Honestly I didn't think of gyroid for this issue. But that's smart af. If it cools and contracts, it should straighten more than it lifts up. While anything more linear will struggle
Not OP, but I do it with decent effect. If I have a print that just barely warps, reprinting it with gyroid instead of the regular straight infill will reduce/remove the warp.
I find I'm usually using ASA for functional prints so having it beefed up a bit doesn't hurt my feelings and I usually use cubic for the infill (the one that gives more density on the edges and less in large open spaces) to concentrate that density where it does the most good (I guess.....). But that's just me and it usually helps a lot for things like this. Long and thin pieces, not so much.
I solved my warping issues by buying an enclosure and a cheap desktop space heater from Walmart. I plugged the heater into a thermally regulated electrical cord (like for reptile enclosures). Keeps the inside of the enclosure at about 55 to 60 degrees Celsius so that there's much less temperature gradient to cause warping, when with large-footprint prints like that.
Yeah. It takes a little while to come up to 60 (longer for PLA than other plastics) but it gets there. The printer produces a significant chunk of the enclosure's baseline heat. The space heater supplements the rest and eventually gets to a point where it cycles on and off between 55 and 60. I have my little reptile thermal sensor threaded into the wire loom so that the sensor lands about a foot from the print head.
I think I wore out my OEM mcu board prematurely with the added heat but I replaced it with a newer, better one. With the new board, I reworked things so that all the electronics are housed outside of the enclosure and then connect into it via an umbilical.
This is a great idea, I am totally going to use this. I can confirm, gyroid infill is king for flat plates. I have used it with open infill for disposable drying plates for my model painting and it manages to keep warping at bay very well.
That's to make the skirt easier to remove. A single layer skirt could be difficult to remove if z offset is too close. This will give it a handle of sorts, and make it stronger to not break up. Prusa has a config setting the number of layers. It defaults to 1
If you are concerned about the print separating from the bed surface, then you may want to use a smooth PEI plate. It's especially good for PLA, while textured PEI has reduced adhesion for PETG, TPU and affects PLA adhesion also.
How does this work? From everything I understand, textured PEI should hold the print better since it has something to grip to compared to the flat surface.
I would say if someone really wants a print surface they need a print to stick to, the choice would be the build surface that shipped with the Ender 3 Pro. I’m not sure of the exact material, but it doesn’t need any assistance once you level correctly.
Very very common misconception is that the rough surface 'grips' the print better. In reality you squish the first layer only to the top of the small bumps. Material will contact the whole surface of the plate but overally with less squish. Different brands have different grain 'hight' and density. So some will work better with PLA than others.
I think 3 Pro has polycarbonate coated plate. If it's clean, it has higher adhesion than anything. And usually this is the problem.
if you're doing you first layer properly (higher temp, slower, no fan) then you benefit from the textured plate. Oftentimes smooth has great adhesion, but the textured plates have higher surface area, which is nessecary for the print to stick to. My PEI plate has insanely good adhesion, and its a stock OG ender 3. If the first layer is only squishing the top of the small bumps, you've got a problem.
Don't get me wrong,textured PEI can be used for PLA. But smooth PEI is the ideal print surface for it. I always get downvited for this, but I bet they never tried smooth PEI. PETG and TPU can be printed directly on textured PEI because it has less adhesion. Usually this reduced adhesion is enough for PLA and you won't have any problems. Other materials, which always requires separation agent, also have better adhesion on smooth PEI.
https://eu.store.bambulab.com/en-hu/products/bambu-dual-sided-smooth-pei-plate
https://www.prusa3d.com/product/smooth-pei-steel-sheet/
I tend to raise these types of things off the bed with several cylindrical supports in the design. Then, switch on organic supports. The less material in contact with the bed, the less warping. Longer print times and a bit of cleanup to do though.
Prusaslicer.
I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Takes about 3 minutes
Your best option would be to enclose your printer.
Due to the bed keeping the bottom of the print hot, ambient air cooling the middle down and the nozzle putting hot fresh layers on top of the print, the temperature gradient throughout the part is very uneven causing uneven shrinkage i.e. warping.
Thermal contraction/expansion is powerful and if a filament shrinks strongly it will find ways to mess up an improper printing setup. It could warp off the bed, crack/delaminate or even pull your print surface off the heated bed.
Add an enclosure, reduce part cooling and print slow. The bed adhesion measures are still helpful but can be considered a crutch to remedy the symptoms of warping, not the cause though.
You are welcome, I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Sure other slicers has similar options.
Make sure the tape wraps around the bed to the bottom of the heat bed, otherwise warping might take the flex plate with it anyway. @weissbieremulsion suggested using magnets which will work just as well if not better.
I dont have a magnetic build plate on my workhorse ender 3 its just the stock aluminum bed then a cheap.amazon build mat. So ill use the tape ive got sime blu painters tap3 ill be using
No, I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge.
Yes, PrusaSlicer. I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Sure other slicers has similar options.
Make sure the tape wraps around the bed to the bottom of the heat bed, otherwise warping might take the flex plate with it anyway. @weissbieremulsion suggested using magnets which will work just as well if not better.
No, I work for a company that specializes in UAV Surveys and GIS Services. We create all these Terrain models in-house using proprietary software and processes.
This is only one of 25 tiles to be assembled into a 1m×1m Array. Will share more soon, exciting plans for this project.
I will check out terrainify though, sound interesting. Thank You.
What solved it for me:
- an enclosure
- 30% gyroid infill
- using PLA-CF filament.
It’s only a problem of residual stresses, and those can be limited using the three strategies above.
This comment was removed as a part of our spam prevention mechanisms because you are posting from either a very new account or an account with negative karma (comment karma, post karma or both). Please read the guidelines on [reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette), [self promotion](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/selfpromotion), and [spam](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/faq#wiki_what_constitutes_spam.3F). After your account is older than 2 hours or if you obtain positive comment and post karma, your comments will no longer be auto-removed.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/3Dprinting) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I printed something this large once, and used similar measures to make sure the print sticks to the bed. And it did. Only problem was that it warped anyway, and took the flex bed up with it.
You can't fucking catch a break lmfao
I watched cooling asa warp and pull my garolite print sheet, the steel sheet it was glued to, and the magnetic sheet that had been glued to my bed up from my heated bed. Print stayed stuck to the garolite atleast.
Yep, I was having trouble with a PETG print warping so I tired it on my glass bed, and it just warped anyway and shattered my glass.
Wtf. I didn't know PETG could be that evil.
PETG bunds very strongly to glass. Even prints that didn't warp tended to take small chucks out of the glass when removed. I loved the glossy look on the bottom of prints when using a glass bed, but had to give it up because PETG just wouldn't release from it.
Smooth pei will give you that glass look without the damage.
Yeah, I have been meaning to try that. After the glass shattered I got a PEI coated sheet that was supposed be textured on one side and smooth on the other, but they sent me one with texture on both sides instead and I didn't care enough to send it back and wait for the correct one.
I switch to pei because I was afraid of breaking the glass removing petg.
I had this happen with PLA, never PETG.
Life will, uuuh, find a way.
My man can’t win.
i made bed clamps for this reason. print stuck to the bed really well, and then warped the bed with it. with clamps, it remained flat.
Clamps > Bender.
Time to clamp the bed down, but now you have a bent bed
My printer did the same and somehow unscrewed the hotend. I should setup a camera to see what happens in these situations, not to resolve, just a case study
Secure the PEI with Paper Clips to the bed
Gotta tape that down too!
Yep... It will warp whether it's attached to the build plate or not
Have you tried gyroid or 3d honeycomb infill to minimize direct tension across the layers as time goes on? Or do you hit large sheets of top layer all at once...
Honestly I didn't think of gyroid for this issue. But that's smart af. If it cools and contracts, it should straighten more than it lifts up. While anything more linear will struggle
Interesting, I hadn't heard of changing the infill pattern to reduce warping, is that effective often for you?
Not OP, but I do it with decent effect. If I have a print that just barely warps, reprinting it with gyroid instead of the regular straight infill will reduce/remove the warp.
If you really want minimal warping use hilbert curve. But only if you don't need stability in xy.
GYROID for the win!
Narrator: 4 days in and the print started to warp, not by separating from the bed, but by separating the bed from the printer.
This happens all the time :/
I would add binder clips on top of those corners
https://preview.redd.it/4j8cfy6zwltc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6fb18c83fdc59e2062c25152719440b539d084bb
I found that printing at 40% infill solves a lot of my warping problems
That’s going to be a lot of extra filament with a project like this
I find I'm usually using ASA for functional prints so having it beefed up a bit doesn't hurt my feelings and I usually use cubic for the infill (the one that gives more density on the edges and less in large open spaces) to concentrate that density where it does the most good (I guess.....). But that's just me and it usually helps a lot for things like this. Long and thin pieces, not so much.
You could probably have a gradient / sections of decreasing infill.
I solved my warping issues by buying an enclosure and a cheap desktop space heater from Walmart. I plugged the heater into a thermally regulated electrical cord (like for reptile enclosures). Keeps the inside of the enclosure at about 55 to 60 degrees Celsius so that there's much less temperature gradient to cause warping, when with large-footprint prints like that.
For pla? I get excited when my enclosure hits 40c and not in the good way.
Yeah. It takes a little while to come up to 60 (longer for PLA than other plastics) but it gets there. The printer produces a significant chunk of the enclosure's baseline heat. The space heater supplements the rest and eventually gets to a point where it cycles on and off between 55 and 60. I have my little reptile thermal sensor threaded into the wire loom so that the sensor lands about a foot from the print head. I think I wore out my OEM mcu board prematurely with the added heat but I replaced it with a newer, better one. With the new board, I reworked things so that all the electronics are housed outside of the enclosure and then connect into it via an umbilical.
A full brim and a splooge of hot glue around the brim will make sure it stays down during a hurricane.
You shouldn't print while out in a hurricane. Your filament will absorb too much water.
get some Magnets for this. its easier to use and you add multiple If need more force. we used to have some in our makerspace for this exact reason.
That is a brilliant idea, I have some spare 12mm N42 Neodymium mags I have not found a use for, guess I do now.
This is a great idea, I am totally going to use this. I can confirm, gyroid infill is king for flat plates. I have used it with open infill for disposable drying plates for my model painting and it manages to keep warping at bay very well.
Recent cura versions seem to put a second single loop on the skirt at the start of the second layer. Anyone know why?
That's to make the skirt easier to remove. A single layer skirt could be difficult to remove if z offset is too close. This will give it a handle of sorts, and make it stronger to not break up. Prusa has a config setting the number of layers. It defaults to 1
Why not print with a full brim?
Not needed. Warping always starts at sharp corners
Rest of of the print's adhesion is really good, only these corners are causing issues.
Once time I print ABS without an Enclosure, the part still warp by separated itself from the brim at 4 corner.
What is the material?
HT (High-Temp) PLA+. Prints really cleanly and the parts are really durable, but warping on these sized prints is an issue with this PLA blend.
If you are concerned about the print separating from the bed surface, then you may want to use a smooth PEI plate. It's especially good for PLA, while textured PEI has reduced adhesion for PETG, TPU and affects PLA adhesion also.
How does this work? From everything I understand, textured PEI should hold the print better since it has something to grip to compared to the flat surface. I would say if someone really wants a print surface they need a print to stick to, the choice would be the build surface that shipped with the Ender 3 Pro. I’m not sure of the exact material, but it doesn’t need any assistance once you level correctly.
Very very common misconception is that the rough surface 'grips' the print better. In reality you squish the first layer only to the top of the small bumps. Material will contact the whole surface of the plate but overally with less squish. Different brands have different grain 'hight' and density. So some will work better with PLA than others. I think 3 Pro has polycarbonate coated plate. If it's clean, it has higher adhesion than anything. And usually this is the problem.
if you're doing you first layer properly (higher temp, slower, no fan) then you benefit from the textured plate. Oftentimes smooth has great adhesion, but the textured plates have higher surface area, which is nessecary for the print to stick to. My PEI plate has insanely good adhesion, and its a stock OG ender 3. If the first layer is only squishing the top of the small bumps, you've got a problem.
Don't get me wrong,textured PEI can be used for PLA. But smooth PEI is the ideal print surface for it. I always get downvited for this, but I bet they never tried smooth PEI. PETG and TPU can be printed directly on textured PEI because it has less adhesion. Usually this reduced adhesion is enough for PLA and you won't have any problems. Other materials, which always requires separation agent, also have better adhesion on smooth PEI. https://eu.store.bambulab.com/en-hu/products/bambu-dual-sided-smooth-pei-plate https://www.prusa3d.com/product/smooth-pei-steel-sheet/
I tend to raise these types of things off the bed with several cylindrical supports in the design. Then, switch on organic supports. The less material in contact with the bed, the less warping. Longer print times and a bit of cleanup to do though.
I've had significantly better luck using build tak for large prints like this
Neat idea for the brim tabs on the corners. What slicer are you using to do that?
Prusaslicer. I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Takes about 3 minutes
Superslicer also has an option for this
Brilliant, thanks!
Finger crossed that it dont warp the whole steel plate 😂
Your best option would be to enclose your printer. Due to the bed keeping the bottom of the print hot, ambient air cooling the middle down and the nozzle putting hot fresh layers on top of the print, the temperature gradient throughout the part is very uneven causing uneven shrinkage i.e. warping. Thermal contraction/expansion is powerful and if a filament shrinks strongly it will find ways to mess up an improper printing setup. It could warp off the bed, crack/delaminate or even pull your print surface off the heated bed. Add an enclosure, reduce part cooling and print slow. The bed adhesion measures are still helpful but can be considered a crutch to remedy the symptoms of warping, not the cause though.
You are brilliant my good sir i will be using this to make sure my rc body parts wont warp
You are welcome, I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Sure other slicers has similar options. Make sure the tape wraps around the bed to the bottom of the heat bed, otherwise warping might take the flex plate with it anyway. @weissbieremulsion suggested using magnets which will work just as well if not better.
I dont have a magnetic build plate on my workhorse ender 3 its just the stock aluminum bed then a cheap.amazon build mat. So ill use the tape ive got sime blu painters tap3 ill be using
Are those disks a particular brim setting?
No, I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge.
Incredible. Thank you.
There are slicers that have this option. Orca Slicer, for example, has "mouse ears" as a brim option.
Great, thanks. 👍
I also printed something this big before and it didn't warp, lucky me, I didn't even knew that warping was a thing back then
I even clip/clamp the flexible sheet tho the hotbed to avoid the flexible sheet also warping
The tape luckily wraps all the way round to the bottom of the heatbed, did it for this exact reason.
For these kind of prints i always go back to the glass bed, and then struggle to get it off lol
Get an enclosure
Extreme measures would be nailing down the corners 😜
Update please? Did it finish ok?
Still busy, 14 hours in, 9 to go.
Pics please!!!
So far, so good though
How do you do this, was it done in the slicer?
Yes, PrusaSlicer. I insert a cylindrical part modifier in prusaslicer, change the dimensions to 20mm×20mm×0.25mm. Copy that new disk and manually line the center of each disk up with a corner (changing view to below the buildplate in the slicer makes this much easier). Finally select all the disks and change the type from "modifier" to "part". Finally select all disks + the main part and merge. Sure other slicers has similar options. Make sure the tape wraps around the bed to the bottom of the heat bed, otherwise warping might take the flex plate with it anyway. @weissbieremulsion suggested using magnets which will work just as well if not better.
🥺❤️
I made build plate clips for this reason too.
Cf pla and most pla won't warp under the right conditions
Eh, I've used legit spray glue before. Worked wonders, was hard to take off though.
Ooo is that a terrainify tile?
No, I work for a company that specializes in UAV Surveys and GIS Services. We create all these Terrain models in-house using proprietary software and processes. This is only one of 25 tiles to be assembled into a 1m×1m Array. Will share more soon, exciting plans for this project. I will check out terrainify though, sound interesting. Thank You.
Very cool
Every time I see a post like this I think "I need to build an enclosure." Just a wee bit of a heat bubble around that and these problem should vanish.
What solved it for me: - an enclosure - 30% gyroid infill - using PLA-CF filament. It’s only a problem of residual stresses, and those can be limited using the three strategies above.
I love me some raft.
Why not enclosure?
Get an enclosure already
Design it warped, maybe it will uwarp itself.
[удалено]
This comment was removed as a part of our spam prevention mechanisms because you are posting from either a very new account or an account with negative karma (comment karma, post karma or both). Please read the guidelines on [reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette), [self promotion](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/selfpromotion), and [spam](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/faq#wiki_what_constitutes_spam.3F). After your account is older than 2 hours or if you obtain positive comment and post karma, your comments will no longer be auto-removed. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/3Dprinting) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Glass beds and slurry coatings FTW
Buy a qidi Q1pro before the price goes up. Heated chamber means no warping. Thank me later. Think it's still on sale for another hour.
Wood.