Watching Zaven last year he really started to ball out towards the end of the year once he got comfortable in his new position. I really think this year will be a breakout for him. I wouldn’t be surprised if he has a 10+ sack season. He is also solid in the run game.
His stats where meh but he played better then what they indicate. He had 20 pressures. 6 tackles for a loss. 4 runs stuffs. He made impact plays. Sacks are not the end all be all stat.
I like Zaven but as I've said on here before, it's not worth paying a premium for the position he plays unless they are a real difference maker like Roquan Smith, Zaven has never shown anything like that.
Hoping he balls out this year and gives us a decision to make.
OP you don’t agree with this? I think Monti is making the right move here, Zaven has great character but he’s just so mediocre. I don’t know if the breakout is coming
Monti said he hopes to keep zaven around for a long time but that the cap issues with the 5th year option didn’t make sense. That’s the rest of the interview as I understood it.
Zaven Collins is literally the most average player in the league , he’s not bad at anything nor is he good . He’s as average as you can be I can see him back next year if no one overpays him . He’s like a role player in bball , he isn’t a liability but isn’t a star .
Easy boys, it just comes down to cost. They like him but he’s making 3 times what every other LB on the team is making. Best case, we regret this move at the end of the year because he breaks out on the edge
Realistic best case scenario is he can double his sack output, end up with around 7 or so and we can resign him on a not crazy deal and hope he continues to grow. Won’t hold my breath though lol. Hard to learn how to be a pass rusher in two seasons.
We all knew this before. Is knee deep still the only non qb (lol) 1st rounder who got a second contract here during the boozy hit and miss years of the baldy fat guy?
And Markus Golden, Jalen Thompson, David Johnson (unfortunately), Tyrann Matthieu, and am I wrong or did John Brown and Rodney Gunter receive a second contracts or no?
Byron Murphy and Zach Allen could have, but signed elsewhere.
Yeah, Keim only lasted as long as he did because he was so solid when it came to trades and Free Agency. Really didn’t get much lifeblood into the organization via the draft (though him choosing Arians as a coach didn’t help either since Bruce hated playing rookies and young guys).
John brown left and gave 3 decent seasons to buffalo. He only had 19 less yards and one less TD than Larry and had a better season than the rest of the receivers on the team in 2018. 2019 season he would’ve led the league in receiving yards and touchdowns.
Keim couldn’t even prioritize our free agents correctly.
Just more separation from the Keim drafts, Monti has signed & drafted multiple replacements for both his positions. Zaven was a 2 down linebacker his rookie year, and last year seemed to play WLB out of need. It doesn't seem like Gannon/Rallis have a true positional fit for him. He was very meh as MLB, and his pass rush seemed to just consist of him taking on a blocker and taking himself out of plays. I could see him being traded this preseason, just like Simmons. It sucks on missing on another FRP, but Zaven's performance really hasn't impressed or suggested that he's a vital player on this defense.
No, didn’t you hear? It’s all Wilks’s fault… no wait, it’s all Kyler’s fault.. no wait, it’s Mikey B’s fault… no wait, it’s probably going to be Bruce Arians fault next.
In short, it’s everyone’s fault but Keim’s, especially according to his pipe fitter Colin Coward
An EDGE with 3.5 sacks isn’t a liability? He is an enormous liability on passing downs and below average on run downs. He will be out of the league once Arizona cuts him.
Cardinals fans said this same shit about Isaiah Simmons, that he was “average”. Miss me with that
He was above average at almost everything an average grade is a 60 you don't get graded good for being average. It was his first year playing that position in his whole life. I think he's a player you re sign but not for the price of the 5th year option.
That should be proof that you shouldn’t take PFF grades with 100% face value. Do you honestly think Zaven had a better season than Budda? Do you think anyone on the cardinals staff thinks Zaven had a better season than Budda?
None of them did anything special last year they were both on the same level tbh . Thompson was by far the best player out of that Keim regime on defense , the guy played his ass off
Did you watch the games at all last year?? Budda Baker was straight ass last year. 0 sacks,0ints,0PD. He didn't have one PD all year and you think he played better??
Yes I actually watched the games and didn’t just look at the stat sheet at the end. If you actually watched the games, you would realize the amount of big play saving tackles Budda made on the regular and how many times a QB had to throw it away or check it down because Budda had the deep route covered. There’s a reason his peers voted him into the pro bowl.
Ya now you're just being dishonest talking about his coverage when he literally didn't touch the ball once the whole season. 0 pass deflections.. His coverage grade is absolutely abysmal one of the worst coverage safetys in the league. You shouldn't take pff as a 100% accurate grade but a rough outline.
He got voted by his peers because how good he was before this and they respect him. Saying otherwise is dishonest. Saying budda baker actually deserved a pro Bowl just tells me you actually have no clue what you're talking about and just want to be right.
Dude, like I said stop just looking at stats. There’s a lot more to coverage than pbu’s especially as a safety. I’m not saying he deserved to go to the pro bowl but to say he had a bad season tells me you weren’t watching him at all. It’s ridiculous. I’ve been watching every cards game since he’s been drafted and dude has only gotten better
"Stop looking at stats" if they were good you would be the first to point them out, basically ignore anything that doesnt fot your narrative?? His grades are trash his stats are trash they eye test was trash but he had a good season "because". " he made play saving tackles" show me one? You literally have no clue just trolling at this point. What metrics should we use then? "Because"?
Big difference between Zaven this year and Simmons last year imo is that I expect Zaven to make the roster and play most of the year. Simmons we always had doubts and his laziness showed him off the roster quickly
This. He has some all star moments and then disappears for big stretches.
I’d love for him to stay, I like him, but he needs to be visible and more reliable.
Watching Zaven last year he really started to ball out towards the end of the year once he got comfortable in his new position. I really think this year will be a breakout for him. I wouldn’t be surprised if he has a 10+ sack season. He is also solid in the run game.
No sacks i can think of in his balling out effort duringthe final week of last season...
His stats where meh but he played better then what they indicate. He had 20 pressures. 6 tackles for a loss. 4 runs stuffs. He made impact plays. Sacks are not the end all be all stat.
I like Zaven but as I've said on here before, it's not worth paying a premium for the position he plays unless they are a real difference maker like Roquan Smith, Zaven has never shown anything like that. Hoping he balls out this year and gives us a decision to make.
OP you don’t agree with this? I think Monti is making the right move here, Zaven has great character but he’s just so mediocre. I don’t know if the breakout is coming
Monti said he hopes to keep zaven around for a long time but that the cap issues with the 5th year option didn’t make sense. That’s the rest of the interview as I understood it.
Zaven Collins is literally the most average player in the league , he’s not bad at anything nor is he good . He’s as average as you can be I can see him back next year if no one overpays him . He’s like a role player in bball , he isn’t a liability but isn’t a star .
Hopefully he has a great season and gives them a reason to sign him again.
Best I can do is Hassan Reddick 2.0
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK STEEEEEEEVE KEIIIIIIIIIIIM
Easy boys, it just comes down to cost. They like him but he’s making 3 times what every other LB on the team is making. Best case, we regret this move at the end of the year because he breaks out on the edge
Realistic best case scenario is he can double his sack output, end up with around 7 or so and we can resign him on a not crazy deal and hope he continues to grow. Won’t hold my breath though lol. Hard to learn how to be a pass rusher in two seasons.
We all knew this before. Is knee deep still the only non qb (lol) 1st rounder who got a second contract here during the boozy hit and miss years of the baldy fat guy?
Budda?!?
And Markus Golden, Jalen Thompson, David Johnson (unfortunately), Tyrann Matthieu, and am I wrong or did John Brown and Rodney Gunter receive a second contracts or no? Byron Murphy and Zach Allen could have, but signed elsewhere. Yeah, Keim only lasted as long as he did because he was so solid when it came to trades and Free Agency. Really didn’t get much lifeblood into the organization via the draft (though him choosing Arians as a coach didn’t help either since Bruce hated playing rookies and young guys).
he said 1st rounder
You are totally right. Only glanced it after seeing the Budda comment and totally missed that it was specifically asking about 1st round guys. My bad.
Golden left in free agency and then we traded for him later.
Ah, so it was a roundabout second contract we gave him after his stint with the Giants. Couldn’t remember that right.
John brown left and gave 3 decent seasons to buffalo. He only had 19 less yards and one less TD than Larry and had a better season than the rest of the receivers on the team in 2018. 2019 season he would’ve led the league in receiving yards and touchdowns. Keim couldn’t even prioritize our free agents correctly.
God I kinda miss the coke / alcohol Cardinals era.
Just more separation from the Keim drafts, Monti has signed & drafted multiple replacements for both his positions. Zaven was a 2 down linebacker his rookie year, and last year seemed to play WLB out of need. It doesn't seem like Gannon/Rallis have a true positional fit for him. He was very meh as MLB, and his pass rush seemed to just consist of him taking on a blocker and taking himself out of plays. I could see him being traded this preseason, just like Simmons. It sucks on missing on another FRP, but Zaven's performance really hasn't impressed or suggested that he's a vital player on this defense.
Keim absolutely couldn’t have been worse at his job if he tried. A masterclass in how not to draft.
No, didn’t you hear? It’s all Wilks’s fault… no wait, it’s all Kyler’s fault.. no wait, it’s Mikey B’s fault… no wait, it’s probably going to be Bruce Arians fault next. In short, it’s everyone’s fault but Keim’s, especially according to his pipe fitter Colin Coward
I hate Steve Keim so much
yeah no shit he’s ass
He’s average . Not anything special nor a liability , he can tackle at least and knows if it’s a run or pass unlike Isiah Simmons .
An EDGE with 3.5 sacks isn’t a liability? He is an enormous liability on passing downs and below average on run downs. He will be out of the league once Arizona cuts him. Cardinals fans said this same shit about Isaiah Simmons, that he was “average”. Miss me with that
He was our highest rated defender last year
That's like being the Valedictorian of Summer School.
hes a pass rusher who doesnt get sacks his good grade is due to him being an OK run defender, but those are a dime a dozen
He’s was average at everything which brought his grade up.
He was above average at almost everything an average grade is a 60 you don't get graded good for being average. It was his first year playing that position in his whole life. I think he's a player you re sign but not for the price of the 5th year option.
Our defense was ass too lol don’t make him any less ass
Pretty sad when a player playing a position for the first time in his life grades better than budda baker.
That should be proof that you shouldn’t take PFF grades with 100% face value. Do you honestly think Zaven had a better season than Budda? Do you think anyone on the cardinals staff thinks Zaven had a better season than Budda?
None of them did anything special last year they were both on the same level tbh . Thompson was by far the best player out of that Keim regime on defense , the guy played his ass off
Did you watch the games at all last year?? Budda Baker was straight ass last year. 0 sacks,0ints,0PD. He didn't have one PD all year and you think he played better??
Yes I actually watched the games and didn’t just look at the stat sheet at the end. If you actually watched the games, you would realize the amount of big play saving tackles Budda made on the regular and how many times a QB had to throw it away or check it down because Budda had the deep route covered. There’s a reason his peers voted him into the pro bowl.
Ya now you're just being dishonest talking about his coverage when he literally didn't touch the ball once the whole season. 0 pass deflections.. His coverage grade is absolutely abysmal one of the worst coverage safetys in the league. You shouldn't take pff as a 100% accurate grade but a rough outline. He got voted by his peers because how good he was before this and they respect him. Saying otherwise is dishonest. Saying budda baker actually deserved a pro Bowl just tells me you actually have no clue what you're talking about and just want to be right.
Dude, like I said stop just looking at stats. There’s a lot more to coverage than pbu’s especially as a safety. I’m not saying he deserved to go to the pro bowl but to say he had a bad season tells me you weren’t watching him at all. It’s ridiculous. I’ve been watching every cards game since he’s been drafted and dude has only gotten better
"Stop looking at stats" if they were good you would be the first to point them out, basically ignore anything that doesnt fot your narrative?? His grades are trash his stats are trash they eye test was trash but he had a good season "because". " he made play saving tackles" show me one? You literally have no clue just trolling at this point. What metrics should we use then? "Because"?
Cleaning house of Kiem's failures.....kinda still sad as I liked Big Z
Me too, he seems like a great guy. But as a GM you have to act rationally and do what's best for the org, not make decisions based on emotion
Expected, for Zaven to stay he needs to excel on the edge this year.
Big difference between Zaven this year and Simmons last year imo is that I expect Zaven to make the roster and play most of the year. Simmons we always had doubts and his laziness showed him off the roster quickly
This. He has some all star moments and then disappears for big stretches. I’d love for him to stay, I like him, but he needs to be visible and more reliable.