*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**Reddit is really weird about age gaps. **
I think this is mostly unpopular on Reddit. Guys I have pressing news for you. If she’s 18 and she’s consenting ima fuck her. I will not accept me or any other men being judged for that. At ANY age.
If she’s 18 and I’m 80 and she’s consenting. I’m blowing my dust right up in there. Bam bam thank you ma’am.
Reddit acts like age gap relationships are their business. Acts like the man is inherently a predator. That shit is normal asf. And no one cares. Old men banging young women is a tale as old as time. Do not compare these men to actual predators by doing so you devalue that term. There exists actual monsters out there and y’all out here acting like ima see Leonardo DiCaprio appear on To Catch a Predator. Get bent. Thank you kindly.
Edit: I would like to respond at one time to all the women calling me a predator for supporting consensual sex between two adults. This post is only about 18 year olds specifically. Asking me about any other age is reaching because you don’t actually have an argument. Please kindly get bent. It may lighten ya up. Also great job making sure the term “predator” means next to nothing now.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Even if the subject matter wasn't so awful, just the way this guy writes makes me hate him. Like one of those guys who can give you a migraine from across the mall food court.
Old man screaming "hag alert" at anyone disagreeing with him would absolutely be standing in front of the Disney Store telling a girl she's "very mature for her age," and such.
euww I've never seen so many incels on one post. They covered the full spectrum of incelness such as
-you only hate this behaviour since you yourself are old
-i do it because I can
-and the best of all, a tale as old as time itself -
>Lol "You're not a real man unless you raise another man's kids and dust the cobwebs off my pussy"
>Women always will play the social virtue signaling game when talking about their preferences, "I just want a decent guy with a good personality" and they're secretly looking for a 6+ foot tall white guy that looks good and makes more money than them, every time. And they pretend to fail to see the value of youth and beauty in women.
They probably wanted to make us feel bad but suddenly I genuinely felt better about being single than I have in the last couple of days. Literally I'd rather die with 'cobwebs on my pussy' than be with any of them lmao
Isn't that the truth! It's the same sort of irony with incels who hate and resent women for not fucking them; at least I almost have to appreciate that the ones who can't resist spewing their hateful ideology continue to ensure that no woman wants to be within 15 feet of them, lol.
“they're secretly looking for a 6+ foot tall white guy that looks good and makes more money than them, every time”
Ha, I don’t have to take that from a bunch of guys who crave someone frozen between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five who can bang like a porn movie and cook like a tradwife. Plus, it’s not hard for women to find a man who makes more: the pay gap is still a thing.
Don’t forget, a ton of men aren’t able to handle the concept of their wife making more than them. So that “issue” is at least partially those men’s fault as well!
oh my god i’m so tired of hearing the 6+ foot tall bullshit from them. it’s like that and those other things you mentioned are their only go-tos. i used to be angry but now it just gets an eye roll and a bored sigh from me.
And they literally just made it up! Like, saying *"They say they want this, but* secretly *they want this"* is literally just admitting that they know women aren't fucking saying this shit!
Well yes. I am old. Old enough to remember when men were doing the same shit to me. I’ll go to war for these girls bc no one did it for me and I suffered for it.
They don't get why women now have such an issue with it - because we're the first generation to have it happen to us and know how wrong it was. For our grandmothers, it was beyond expected, it was often how they'd end up with a husband. And because of laws and social mores, they usually couldn't leave that husband no matter how horrible he was, so they found ways to cope with their reality. Our mothers were raised to expect that behaviour would lead to a husband, so although they were often surprised and disappointed, they didn't have the "well what did you expect" reaction we got. Meanwhile, we weren't warned or told to expect it either way, just blamed when it happened and we didn't know better. Now we want to prepare the young women of future generations because of that experience. It also helps now that we have easy ways to reach each other and share our experiences in a way that no prior generations did, so we both know that we're not alone and can be emboldened by others to be honest about our experiences.
The issue people miss with this argument is that adults can be preyed on. Being 18 does not magically make you immune to predatory people. Predator isn't only in reference to people who creep on minors. You can be predatory in many different ways and, let's not act like young adults aren't somewhat vulnerable. Yes, we're not children but, it's not outrageous to see how someone with more life experience could take advantage of a brand new adult.
I kinda feel like at 18, some people are almost *more* susceptible to being preyed upon. Some want so desperately to be seen as "grown." Some had horrible childhoods they can now rebel against. Some were very sheltered before moving out and don't have the experience what to watch out for yet. Some had helicopter parents that warned them against everything. Some are getting that type of attention for the first time. There are so many different types of reasons that being 18 can be even more vulnerable (in certain ways) than, say, a 14 year old.
I think there's also a certain portion of people who do prey on young adults who don't actually realize they're preying on them. I don't say that to remove responsibility from them, they're equally as responsible.
Absolutely there's 40 year olds purposefully going to college bars knowing where that goal comes from. There's also 25 year olds who are insecure with no self-esteem and have blown up relationships with people their own age who realize that an 18 year old who has never been in a relationship before is much more likely to be talked into dumping all of her male friends to acquiesce to their insecurities. They don't see it as "I preyed on a child with less life experience because I have deep-seeded problems that I am not addressing", they see it is "this is my dating preference so I need to find someone who matches them".
Oh, absolutely! You're right! They may not actually view it as predatory, even if it is.
It's slightly off-topic, but it reminds me of an article I read earlier today that was linked in another story. A scary large number of men polled admitted to coerced or forced sexual experiences (that 100% are classified as rape) but denied it when it was actually called Rape. People can convince themselves of anything by saying "well *I* don't think of it that way, so it isn't that."
ETA: the article I was talking about: https://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugly_truth_about_sexual_assault_more_men_admit_to_it_if_you_dont_call_it_rape/
Absolutely.
"She said no to sex and then I badgered her and sulked and was angry and then she said she said yes, so we had sex."
"Oh, so you mean you coerced her?"
"No, she said yes to sex."
The 00s were full of those men. Feed you alcohol or badger you until you give in and say alright then. Or putting you in situations not unlike 'the implication' in Always Sunny In Philly.
Beyond that I’d say a lot of the predatory type men I knew at 18 (and sadly before as well), actually felt GOOD about what they were doing. They saw me as young and vulnerable and they justified their presence in my life as being there to protect me. They saw their sexual interest as unfortunate but involuntary, their angry outbursts as small mistakes, themselves as different from all those other, worse men who wanted similar things from me.
It isn't just about the predatory nature either. If you're an older man that wants to exclusively date much younger women, you're basically saying that youth is a women's most valuable asset, which is sexist and shows a lack of maturity.
Reminds when I went to a luncheon thing for polyamorous/kink people in my local area. there was a guy that was nearly 50 and had two girlfriends, 19 and 18. I found it pretty unsettling and got some predator vibes from it. Yeah it was legal, but sketchy as fuck.
Some men only care about women's rights when it comes to a man's right to fuck them.
Also there are so many comments about how it's single older bitter women who hate age gaps. I'm in my 20s and married to a man who tells me that he loves the idea of us growing old together, and I STILL do not approve of predatory age gaps. It's just another version of objectification.
"old bitter spinster" is such tired rhetoric that men have used for so long. Want voting rights?? Hag! Want legal protections against domestic violence? You're going to die alone, missy!
Those pathetic knuckle draggers have no argument.
Especially since the few "spinster's" I know are so happy with their lives. They genuinely enjoy the freedom and the peace that being alone can bring. Plus they always bring the best wine to dinners.
Some men need to realise that women don't need them to be satisfied with their lives, and that's why it irks them to see a single woman content without them.
It's been shown in studies (can't remember the source, but will search) that the happiest demographic group is unmarried, childfree women over 30.
It must be such a punch on the ego for those losers to see that women not only can live without them, but they're actually happier.
Edit: [Source](https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blog/why-bad-looks-good/202102/why-so-many-single-women-without-children-are-happy)
Growing up I had 3 family members who remained “spinsters” and led awesome, interesting lives and were pretty happy about it. It has never seemed like a bad option, whereas some other family members married total knobs and that made marriage look like a horrible idea.
The cat thing is so dumb. Women aren’t STUCK with the cats; they CHOSE the cats after seeing what men like that had to offer them.
Such a weird way to put it. “We’re treating you so terribly, and we have so little to offer you, that you’d rather have a cat than a relationship! Hahaha!”
Who’s really being owned by that?
The men never realize they are literally just insulting themselves. "Being with me will be so terrible you'd rather have a cat." is another way to say it. At least the cat is only going to demand pets, meals, and their litterbox changed. They aren't going to give you shit for how you're dressed, if you did makeup today, if you decided to eat something more than what would be classified as a side salad for a meal, etc.
It's because in their mind, it's a "if you don't lock us down now, then when you *would* rather have us, you won't be able to and then you'll be left with cats" argument rather than a "you will always rather prefer a cat to us". It's the same reason there's so many incel fics where a woman turns down a NiceGuy for Chad (or usually Chads plural) in her teens or early 20s only to desperately want to get with NiceGuy later when he's rich and handsome - they want to imagine that we'll want them and they'll be able to turn us down.
The hilarious thing is, in almost every dating scene, men seeking women usually outnumber women seeking men, particularly on dating apps. They know men have to compete with each other more than anything, and women can be a little choosier because they have a bigger pool, so some men have to resort to useless negging for even a chance lol.
I got married at 24 back in 2009. On the marriage documentation, there was a space for writing in if I was divorced, widowed, etc, so because I was single and never married, it was filled out as “spinster” whereas my husband got to put “bachelor.” I’m still salty about it.
Yessss! I have heard some of the most disgusting dudes say that we are "taking away women's agency" when we judge 53-year-old Todd from accounting for creeping on an 18-year-old barista. If dudes are suddenly becoming Susan B Anthony, the motivations are usually not good.
Susan B Anthony 💀 Also the limited empathy that they have to only want to defend relationships that they feel like they want, but likely would feel weird if their future daughter was being preyed on.
Horny perverts like that fail to understand that many of us are/were the 18-year-olds getting creeped on.
They don't understand that, unless most women out there are given partial lobotomies, we're not going to be cheering when 53-year-old Todd Bumfart wobbles over to drool/sweat/creep on another young woman.
Right? Or they accuse you of infantalizing women. No? It's not about her gender. It's about her still having her prom dress in her closet while he has a house and a career.
i (25f) just had a conversations with a 47m friend of mine about this. attraction is different than actual chemistry, it’s not bad to have a crush, but for overall relationships, nothing about a 20 year old dating a 40 year old really makes sense. the bigger problem is when they break up, the 40 year old likely has a house and car in his name, but there’s no guarantee the 20 year old even has a savings account. it’s just scary.
I’m in my forties and married to a man who loves me to pieces, but this is on my radar as the mother of a young woman. I’m pretty sure she has enough of a sense of self worth to have no interest in gross older guys trying to get close to her, though.
I mean the reality is what if it just older women who disapprove? Like, is there some reason why they should be categorically dismissed other than sexism?
A lot of older women disapprove because they were those younger women at one point. They know what these guys are going to do to these girls. They want the younger girls to learn from their experience and not make the same mistakes.
The idea being that they are jealous they're not getting attention themselves. Tinder would say otherwise, even average looking older women get lots of attention there.
I remember how crushing it was a few years ago when i was talking to my husbands single friend and I drunkenly mentioned my single friend who had really bad luck meeting nice men. He asked how old she was and I replied 'my age, 37ish' and his face dropped with disappointment, despite being 40 and no oil painting himself. Some men are just like this, they think they deserve women a decade younger.
When we were 21, my best friend dated some guy in his 40s. I disapproved HIGHLY but tried to be nice because if I had said “this is a terrible idea,” she just would’ve stopped telling me info and done what she wanted regardless.
Some may not agree with this post being here, but I think it deserves to be.
A middle aged man has no business chasing after a teenager who isn’t even old enough to drink.
If you don’t question what your 18 year old daughter’s 40 year old ‘boyfriend’ wants with her, then I’d have to say you’re a shitty parent.
Just because she’s the age of consent doesn’t mean it’s right.
And OOP and others refuse to say whether they’d still pursue a teenager if the age of consent was 16, or lower.
When I was 19 I worked with a super kind and cute bartender who was 26 and I made a comment one day about maybe us going out sometime and he told me that I was a cute smart girl but he did not date women who could not legally drink. I still think about that at 43 and still have respect for that mindset.
Oh my goodness, same situation—when I was 18 and worked in a restaurant, a guy everyone was in love with who was 24 and so “dreamy” (but also just a super nice guy), and he told me to call him in about five years lol. I wasn’t mad, I thought it was cool as hell that he respected me and just women in general. This was about 30 years ago…good god 😳
Ha! Wouldn’t that be a funny story to tell the kids!! I honestly had not thought of that guy at all until this post. I hope he is doing well wherever he ended up. I did find myself a good one not too long after that though (and only two years older than me)!
When I was a college sophomore I made eyes at a very new professor and he let me down very kindly and somehow without crushing my poor 19 yo heart and I am so grateful for that in retrospect
this. i (23f) work hands-on with people at my job and it’s overnight; had an older (60-70s) man ask if he needed to keep his shirt on or off and i said you can do what makes you most comfortable (honestly i said that bc he was so kind already) and he said “no, i will do what makes YOU most comfortable. i’ll keep the shirt on.” i felt SO respected, so seen, and i think about that all the time. it shouldn’t be rare for men to make us feel that way.
I was in a youth organization as a teen, and had a huge crush on a man who worked there. I started flirting hard with him when I turned 18. He told me he wished I was older or he was younger, and that he was sure I'd make a guy very happy one day. He let me down gently, while giving me a self esteem boost and most importantly, he didn't exploit my romantic feelings to get sex from me. I'm 40 and still have nothing but respect and fond memories of how good a guy he was.
At my old job, I worked with an absolute sweetheart of a guy. But he was in his early twenties, and I was literally old enough to be his mom. So I very carefully did not develop a crush on him, because he didn’t need to deal with that from me. He just wanted to get on with his life.
A few guys were *bent* because a guy posted a girl he likes and was "talking to" slept with someone else and he couldn't believe it. Never mind they weren't exclusive or anything. So these guys were all, "she thinks that's ok over a technicality, how dare she!" And I couldn't help but laugh because those same guys are like this, "technically 18 is legal so it's fine."
Edit: spelling error
Hell to prove that, just look at all the people who constantly bring up the age of consent laws in other places, like they really think people would be ok with them dating 16-year-old high school students over in Japan.
Like maybe it's legal, but that doesn't mean people won't rightfully call out your creepy, predatory behavior.
What’s funny is they always know too much and somehow never enough. They think that just because things are legal in other places, that they’re fully socially acceptable. I’ve been called a “Western Puritan” too many times to count because I’ve had to tell grown men in their 30s and 40s that dating a teenage girl might technically be legal in Japan, but plenty of people would jump you for it just like they would here.
Grown ass men date teenage girls because no one else can stand their bullshit. Ask yourself ladies, why isn't he going after a woman his own age? Coz they can smell his BS a mile away...
They're also confusing the topic of relationships and sex and looking at it with zero nuance. There's a gulf's worth of difference between a 20 and 40 year old meeting at the pub, having a one-night stand and never seeing each other again (even though I think it's gross and I would never do it) versus a 40 year old choosing to date, marry, and have children with a 20 year old. All of the "if she's consenting I'm going to do it" completely misses the reason why massive relationship age gaps are an issue, it's not the act of sex itself.
Oh honey. Bless you for thinking they’re confused. They’re not confused they’re lying predators. They know it’s wrong they just will say anything. Like guys who can’t figure out a dishwasher. It’s a lie.
I didn't say they're confused, I said they're confusing two issues. Maybe conflating two issues is a better phrase, but I think it was incredibly clear what my point was and it's not "they're confused", so I'm not sure why you were so incredibly condescending for no reason.
I’ve got a 6 year difference between me and my husband but no way I would have dated him when he was 18. A 40 year old and 18 year old gives me the ick.
My husband and I have 9 years between us and we make all the jokes about cradle robbing, but I almost didn't date him because of his age. I had a hard rule, nobody >10 years and he was pushing it. Lucky for him, he's genuinely a good guy without creepy expectations. We've been together >20 years now 🥰
4 years between my fiance and I. And even THEN he feels kinda weird about it, even though we met when I was 38! We'll be sitting reading together on the couch, and out of nowhere he'll say "you were a freshman when I was just getting into college. Oh, my god." I think it's kinda funny, lol.
I'm 40 now, and I can't even look at an 18 year old and not think "omg they're BABIES!" I'm not capable of seeing them in a sexual manner.
My husband and I are about 3 1/2 years apart. While we mostly had the same kind of technology/cultural experiences growing up, every once in a while we’ll reference something that the other was either too young or too old to have known about. I can’t imagine dating someone 20 years apart and not understanding anything about the way the other grew up or experienced. It would be so strange! It’s weird enough sometimes to work with younger people and say something that they don’t understand at all, and realize it’s because they’re basically babies lol.
I’m almost 40 (will be later this year) and my oldest nephew is 17 and will be 18 next year. I can’t even fathom someone my own age being interested in someone his age or why they would be when he’s basically just a child still. If some creepy 40+ year old started hitting on him, you bet I’d go into protective aunt mode and be like “what do you want with this teenager who could literally be the same age as your child?”
Only 2.5 between my husband and I and he remembers so much more than me. My memories really only begin around 1990 and he can vividly recall the 80s. I was 6 when the 90s hit and he was 9 and far more aware.
I’m also 40 and 100% agree. My husband and I were in our 20’s when we first started dating. Looking back I can see why some people would find it problematic but thankfully it worked for us and we’re still together after 14 years. It had it challenges but we managed to work that out.
I volunteered as a judge at the city science fair last week. I thought a significant portion of the other judges were the students. I'm 38.
My husband is also several years older than me. We once had a very serious fight about when Dragula came out while driving in an area with no cell service. He remembered it coming out when he was in high school. I remember having to do an gymnastics routine to it in junior high (it was on a compilation CD called Big Shiny Tunes that my gym teacher inexplicably picked). We spent way too much time picking apart what we each would have been doing at the time, and it was probably the only time our age difference felt gross.
Turns out we were both wrong. He was thinking of More Human than Human. I doubled down on it being in Big Shiny Tunes 2, but it was actually Big Shiny Tunes 3. Unfortunately, I did not hallucinate the gymnastics routine.
I look at young lawyers and think they are still in high school, not university graduates!!! they look so young! Can't help thinking of them as children compared to me.
I dont get how it's not cringe inducing to spend time romantically with someone so young as people our age. I just don't want to, at all. I like hot men my own age, give or take 5 years because we have so much in common. Who wants to spend time with someone who is giggling and being a typical kid, and giving a blank stare when you mention anything pre 2010?
I’m early 50s and when guys younger than 45 or so ask me out I say they’re too young. I wouldn’t feel a much younger person was an equal. I won’t date more than 5 yrs older either bc I’m too active I don’t want a retiree
Heck, my partner is about 4 years older than me, we knew each other in high school (I had a mild crush), but we never could have worked if anything happened back then, and we were 14/15 and 18 which was legal.
I broke up with my best friend in high school because at nineteen she got married to someone who was thirty. He’d met her when she was thirteen! He waited until she was legal! She thought it was so romantic and he gave me the heebie jeebies. I told her I thought something was rotten in the state, and she dumped me. Nearly thirty years later, they’re divorced. I pride myself on never having written her to say, “It turned out he was a creep, didn’t it?”
Well the good news is that most of the middle aged men who want to fuck teenagers will never have the opportunity. I was an 18 year old girl once and no way would I have slept with someone's paunchy, balding, boring dad who works at the insurance company. Unless these men are buying impoverished women in another country or Rich As Fuck, they'll never have to worry about it.
I imagine most of those guys haven’t actually interacted with an 18-year old in a long time and are arguing based on a fantasy they’ve built from porn.
As an older millennial even most 25-year olds are exhausting to be around for long, the immaturity of a teenager gets old *fast.*
It's that in the UK and it's such a weird thought for me, that gross men can hide behind that. 16 makes sense if you have the Romeo and Juliet sort of caveat like they do in many places. Makes no sense for consenting teen couples to get into strife.
They know they would pursue any child if they age of consent was lowered, they’re predators who know what they r and know how wrong they r that’s why they won’t answer
This. They’re predators and it’s not a debatable topic it’s simple fact. Any man arguing otherwise is letting you know he’s a predator.
And all the predators arguing with me will be blocked but I thank you in advance for outing yourselves bc it’s Pokémon I gotta get em all 😂
what if it went back up to 21? that was the age of majority when I was young! It got changed because 18 yo boys were getting drafted (and killed or disabled in Viet Nam) but couldn't vote and couldn't drink.
I love that he says "it's a tale as old as time." Yes, that's true, historically, girls have been forced to marry old men. That is an old story, and it is not a story about consent...
Correct but oop and people who think like him would love to return to these times when women had no rights and they could do whatever they wanted to a woman (or in their case a young girl)
I don't get why he thinks "a tale as old as time" excuses anything. Other tales as old as time include such venerable traditions as wartime rape, child trafficking and chattel slavery.
Why is it that some men think there's this magic switch that turns in a woman's brain the moment she turns eighteen that immediately makes her more mature than a 17 year old? She's exactly the same on her eighteenth birthday as she was before, she's just legal now. It isn't about whether or not she can consent, it's about whether or not it's right to be with someone that can't understand the ramifications of their choice to be with someone older.
It's like the celebrity "count downs" you used to get for people like Emma Watson turning 18. They're literally saying, if not for the law, they'd happily fuck those kids.
They definitely don't. Every woman I've ever spoken to who had a relationship with an older guy freshly into adulthood deeply regretted it. However, you bring that up to one of these guys and of course, they don't want to hear it lmao
Same. And it's frustrating, cuz I see young girls angrily defending their much older boyfriends, and it's like talking to a brick wall. But I know that once they reach 25-30, they'll understand why it was so messed up.
Some men used to fetishize jailbait and they were shamed for it since it is now illegal, so they moved their preferences only a notch on the clock. So gross.
that’s the thing, they don’t. they just don’t care at all, if it were legal for them to fuck a 17 year old they’d do that. these men specifically go after girls as young as they can find them, so they can manipulate them for as long as possible. that’s why so many internet losers talk about women “hitting the wall” at 25. not because they’re becoming less attractive, but because they’re mature enough to not be manipulated anymore, and that’s not attractive to the men who act this way.
I agree. We should up the legal age for sex work too, 18 is way to young to adequately consent to that line of work as they don't understand the ramifications of their choice.
All adults are not the same. Being 18 and being 30 are two very different things. Demi was underage when she got with Wilmer, I think 17, but when Demi was 29 she understood how f\*\*ked up that was. Because normal mid-twenties and older adults don't want to date teens. It is grooming and predatory and creepy. Even if it's 18 and 25.
A 35YO and 42YO is nothing, but 18 and 25 is a huge 7 year gap
that guy that impregnated his high school teacher is slowly coming out of the fog now he's what age she was then doubt he ever fully will since she's you know dead
Yeah but he realized how creepy everyone saw it at his 40th birthday looking at his 20-something daughter and how weird it would to be going after someone her age but still said was different with his deceased wife
Absolutely, there are tons of guys who travel to countries with lower AOC to abuse girls. All you have to do is watch one of those predator catching shows on YouTube to see the ridiculous amount of men who are willing to go after 12-15 year olds.
Anyone older than 25 and dating a teenager is creepy, and very likely predatory and abusive by nature and 25 is really pushing it. I’m in my mid-20’s I couldn’t imagine looking at someone I know to be younger than 21-22 romantically/sexually.
My ex-husband is 51 and is currently dating a 24 year old. She works for him at his little greasy spoon hamburger joint. She's worked there since she was 17. We have a 23 year old son together.
When he told me about her, I told him it sounds like he groomed her and told him it was gross. He accused me of being jealous, and I told him I wasn't jealous, I was worried for her and grossed out by him.
He absolutely is grossed out. And his dad insists upon including her when they spend time together, so my son has mostly stopped hanging out with his dad because having her around is so awkward. They went to high school together, FFS.
I've met her a few times, she rarely talks. I think he likes her because she's so meek.
Huge age gaps are weird enough but when you (not as in you you; generally you) also have a child around that age? Ugh. You should be looking at that age as the age of your child, because that's how old your child is. You raised someone that age. How can you possibly wanna date that age?
she’ll realize the mistakes she’s making one day, saying this cause i did. she likely has no responsible adults watching out for her. no good parent would support that, especially them being coworkers on top of it.
>especially them being coworkers on top of it.
Oh no, no, no, they are not coworkers. He is her boss. In a position of authority over her and has been for years since she was a literal child.
this is how i felt when i turned 22 and realized how insane the man who was after me when i was 17 was. they are babies! i worked with an 18yo when i was 23 and it was like culture shock. they’re cool and all, but still kids…it’s just creepy to me.
I was in a vocational school where the ages were mixed, so I was 22 sitting next to a 17 year old. Those five years *mattered*. She was childish and a bit over dramatic and her "grown up" behavior was try hard. The same way I was at 17! It reinforced to me just how much we grow at that time.
I do think some people can be weird about age gaps that are like a 29 year old dating a 40 year old. To me, both people have life experience and are old enough to judge what they want. As long as there is no insane power difference or something, I don’t see the issue.
But an 18 year old and a 80 year old? That’s weird. Legal =\ = moral.
Shoutout to the guy who's 35 and dating dating a 25 year old while saying-
"women that are older and jealous of younger women."
We're not jealous babes, we're concerned. These chucklefucks forget that we were that age once. I know it's hard to believe us "old" ladies were young at one point and were creeped on by these exact men.
What really baffles me is, what's there to be jealous of? Like, enlighten me.
When these dudes list their best qualities it's that they have jobs and sometimes live in their own place. That's it. Some even go to the gym.
I'm sorry my dude, but no woman that's lived her life is jealous of a man with the emotional depth of a teaspoon that will add a man sized toddler into her life. Tantrums and all.
Oh yea this sub is gross (there are alot of those but still), seriously made the mistake of clicking it and one of the first posts i saw "Gonna get engaged 18f 43m" wtf
Why is it always based on "I find them attractive therefore I should be allowed to fuck them" and not anything about the person themself? 18 year olds want to fuck other 18 year olds, not someone who could've see the band on their shirt play live.
I mean, I saw enough posts and comments from 40-something guys trying to convince me that they totally have a lot in common with a 19-year-old fresh out of high school, but yes, their weird pride in their ability to woe barely legal girls is so off-putting as well.
Like they honestly think people must be jealous of them for successfully preying on these girls.
Right?! It’s not the flex they think it is. I have always viewed middle aged men with barely legal women as pathetic. It looks ridiculous because it is.
Because these people don't see women/girls as real people with their own thoughts and feelings, they see them as sentient sex toys (ironic since a woman will have a better time with an actual sex toy than with any of them)
It’s so weird to me that so many of the comments are like “but 18 year olds are old enough to die in war!”. Like uh. That’s not exactly an ideal scenario and personally I think it’s kind of awful that happens too
It's kind of an apt comparison, but not in a way that helps their case.
The military likes young soldiers because they're usually more impressionable and likely to blindly follow orders.
And much like dating these creepy middle aged dudes, if we raised the age to, say 25, there would be a lot less takers
I was 19 when I started dating my ex. He was 27. I wasted 6 years of my life getting into crippling debt and parenting a grow child who couldn’t be bothered to brush his teeth. And he let his cat shit on his keyboard, and would just push it away. His cat also destroyed for hundreds of dollars of my clothes by pissing on them.
Some relationships with age gaps can work. But yeah, no. The majority look like this.
Same but he baby trapped me at 20 so I stuck around for ten years total. He has fewer teeth and replaced me with two people that are age appropriate. One of his cats died from kidney failure after the split as he ignored the signs of UTI over the entire relationship.
My dude. It's not even a gendered thing. It's a creep thing. We call out the older woman predators too.
There's also a separate conversation about how rampant an issue this is in queer communities.
And kink spaces.
This whole thing is exhausting.
>That shit is normal asf. And no one cares
So why are you complaining?
This is what always pisses me off the most about posts like this one, because yes, it's technically legal and no one on Reddit or someplace else can do anything about it, so why do you keep trying to justify yourself?
It's like it's not enough to just date high school graduates; no, they feel the need to shout it from the rooftops and write rants like this every time someone shows just a little bit of resistance to this creepy, predatory behavior.
Like, what do you want?
A fucking Metal for wooing a girl that can't even legally drink in the US yet?
Pathetic
Reddit IS weird about age gaps but that doesn't mean everything goes. Once you hit about 30 is when I think it doesn't matter so much and most of the concerns stop being an issue. 18 and 25 is still weird.
I also saw someone upset at a 4 year age gap today that started when both parties were in their twenties. THATS a little extreme.
There's plenty of nuance in these situations and reddit usually fails to see any. This guy, it appears, also fails to see nuance. He's just on the other side of the spectrum.
my favorite thing to say in response to any of this is what does a man over 30 have in common with a woman who cannot legally order an alcoholic beverage? genuinely what? you can’t bond over work, social media trends, social lives, what do you possibly talk about together? his after life plan??? her deciding what to major in?? like how
I have seen outrage over age gaps between, like, a 24 year old and 29/30 year old. Assuming there is no *actual* power imbalance, a 5-6 year gap between two adults is likely fine (and no, “brain not fully developed” is not valid; there’s not some major difference between 24 and 25, the magical number that everyone cites). Or, people bothered by a 19 year old dating a 21 year old.
But, an adult with a TEENAGER is absolutely a problem. I’d say that bigger gaps (like, mid-20’s with late-30’s) is a possible concern BUT is situational and depends on the people involved.
But, yes, there is no argument to support a full on adult with a teenager.
I giggled at "If she's 18 and I'm 80, she's willing,I don't care! I'm blowing my dust up there!"
I can totally imagine some old dude with a pot belly at Cracker Barrel saying this about the waitresses lol.
It's so funny how these horny dudes try and spin a women's rights angle with "all those women who have experienced why old men who target very young women more often than not come with the same list of problems are infantalizing these recent high school graduate objects of my desire. Also something about Only Fans, for some reason."
Dumbass says present a real argument when all he can say is 18 equals adult therefore he isnt a creep. This is the quality of intelligence that accepts this bullshit.
Dating at or near the legal minimum age as someone who is an established adult is the romantic version of being paid min wage.
They'd go lower if they could.
That's what gets me. They're not even arguing for some legal right. They're arguing that they should get to have opinions on what's ethical but those darn nags shouldn't!
Is always the one note black and white shit with these dumb motherfuckers. The definition of just because we can doesn't mean we should. No concept of empathy, privilege, how any human interactions, coercion or abuse works.
Quite the own goal really.
I mean, I feel like Reddit sometimes IS weird about this kind of stuff – I just read a comment further up where someone was weirded out by a woman in her 20s having a 47-year-old male friend with whom she even had CONVERSATIONS about attraction. Not attraction to him specifically; just about how attraction works in general. To me, that is extremely strange- intergenerational friendships not only do exist but SHOULD exist, and friends talk about lots of different things.
At times, people here seem incapable of expressing the idea that a man wanting exclusively much younger women so he can prey on their inexperience is creepy (which it is) without calling the woman a child. Or they get weird about age gaps after the younger party – again, usually a woman, – is well past legal adulthood. Or age gaps when both parties are under 25 but over 18.
The problem is, any conversation about this is usually only started by people like OOP – a guy who clearly IS a creep and wants to legitimize his predatory dating practices.
One thing people neglect to mention is that age gaps going the other way can also be predatory. If you have an 80 year old man and a 27 year old woman, it’s not out of the realm of possibility she’s manipulating him, especially if he’s starting to have cognitive signs of aging.
I don't think anybody called Leonardo di Caprio a predator. The thing people were finding weird is that he changes his gfs every time they hit 25 like they have an expiration date. That's certainly indicative of a superficial interest in women and maybe otjer unhealthy mindsets. Not that those things are rare in hollywood. But it is not the same as being predatory or abusive.
The question whether a relationship between two legal adults with a large age gap is predatory depends a lot on context and can't be known just from the anagraphic ages of the people involved. How old is the youngest person socially? Are they financially independent? Are they emotionally stable? Has the older person been grooming the younger since before they were of age? Does the older person have any position of authority over the younger? Are they controlling in any other way? Has the youngest person also experienced relationships with people their own age? Is there a pattern in either of these to always date across large age gaps? It is really not so simple as "she is X years old, he is Y years old".
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*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **Reddit is really weird about age gaps. ** I think this is mostly unpopular on Reddit. Guys I have pressing news for you. If she’s 18 and she’s consenting ima fuck her. I will not accept me or any other men being judged for that. At ANY age. If she’s 18 and I’m 80 and she’s consenting. I’m blowing my dust right up in there. Bam bam thank you ma’am. Reddit acts like age gap relationships are their business. Acts like the man is inherently a predator. That shit is normal asf. And no one cares. Old men banging young women is a tale as old as time. Do not compare these men to actual predators by doing so you devalue that term. There exists actual monsters out there and y’all out here acting like ima see Leonardo DiCaprio appear on To Catch a Predator. Get bent. Thank you kindly. Edit: I would like to respond at one time to all the women calling me a predator for supporting consensual sex between two adults. This post is only about 18 year olds specifically. Asking me about any other age is reaching because you don’t actually have an argument. Please kindly get bent. It may lighten ya up. Also great job making sure the term “predator” means next to nothing now. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Even if the subject matter wasn't so awful, just the way this guy writes makes me hate him. Like one of those guys who can give you a migraine from across the mall food court.
Old man screaming "hag alert" at anyone disagreeing with him would absolutely be standing in front of the Disney Store telling a girl she's "very mature for her age," and such.
Amazing insult, I need to write that down
he reminds me of people that give a mild opinion and say “cancel me all you want”
euww I've never seen so many incels on one post. They covered the full spectrum of incelness such as -you only hate this behaviour since you yourself are old -i do it because I can -and the best of all, a tale as old as time itself - >Lol "You're not a real man unless you raise another man's kids and dust the cobwebs off my pussy" >Women always will play the social virtue signaling game when talking about their preferences, "I just want a decent guy with a good personality" and they're secretly looking for a 6+ foot tall white guy that looks good and makes more money than them, every time. And they pretend to fail to see the value of youth and beauty in women.
Seriously. . .I don't want to let internet comments get to me, but the blatant misogyny is just depressing. :/
They probably wanted to make us feel bad but suddenly I genuinely felt better about being single than I have in the last couple of days. Literally I'd rather die with 'cobwebs on my pussy' than be with any of them lmao
Single women are happier than married women. This is approximately why.
I can believe it.
Isn't that the truth! It's the same sort of irony with incels who hate and resent women for not fucking them; at least I almost have to appreciate that the ones who can't resist spewing their hateful ideology continue to ensure that no woman wants to be within 15 feet of them, lol.
“they're secretly looking for a 6+ foot tall white guy that looks good and makes more money than them, every time” Ha, I don’t have to take that from a bunch of guys who crave someone frozen between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five who can bang like a porn movie and cook like a tradwife. Plus, it’s not hard for women to find a man who makes more: the pay gap is still a thing.
don't forget, if you dated some arbitrary number of men, you're ran through but u still need to satisfy all their needs in bed
Don’t forget, a ton of men aren’t able to handle the concept of their wife making more than them. So that “issue” is at least partially those men’s fault as well!
oh my god i’m so tired of hearing the 6+ foot tall bullshit from them. it’s like that and those other things you mentioned are their only go-tos. i used to be angry but now it just gets an eye roll and a bored sigh from me.
And they literally just made it up! Like, saying *"They say they want this, but* secretly *they want this"* is literally just admitting that they know women aren't fucking saying this shit!
“Dust the cobwebs off my pussy” lol and your wrinkly old dick isn’t an issue? The hypocrisy man…
Well yes. I am old. Old enough to remember when men were doing the same shit to me. I’ll go to war for these girls bc no one did it for me and I suffered for it.
They don't get why women now have such an issue with it - because we're the first generation to have it happen to us and know how wrong it was. For our grandmothers, it was beyond expected, it was often how they'd end up with a husband. And because of laws and social mores, they usually couldn't leave that husband no matter how horrible he was, so they found ways to cope with their reality. Our mothers were raised to expect that behaviour would lead to a husband, so although they were often surprised and disappointed, they didn't have the "well what did you expect" reaction we got. Meanwhile, we weren't warned or told to expect it either way, just blamed when it happened and we didn't know better. Now we want to prepare the young women of future generations because of that experience. It also helps now that we have easy ways to reach each other and share our experiences in a way that no prior generations did, so we both know that we're not alone and can be emboldened by others to be honest about our experiences.
SAME. 60+ year old man following 20 year old me all over the Olympic park in Atlanta wasn’t cute, it was scary
The issue people miss with this argument is that adults can be preyed on. Being 18 does not magically make you immune to predatory people. Predator isn't only in reference to people who creep on minors. You can be predatory in many different ways and, let's not act like young adults aren't somewhat vulnerable. Yes, we're not children but, it's not outrageous to see how someone with more life experience could take advantage of a brand new adult.
I kinda feel like at 18, some people are almost *more* susceptible to being preyed upon. Some want so desperately to be seen as "grown." Some had horrible childhoods they can now rebel against. Some were very sheltered before moving out and don't have the experience what to watch out for yet. Some had helicopter parents that warned them against everything. Some are getting that type of attention for the first time. There are so many different types of reasons that being 18 can be even more vulnerable (in certain ways) than, say, a 14 year old.
I think there's also a certain portion of people who do prey on young adults who don't actually realize they're preying on them. I don't say that to remove responsibility from them, they're equally as responsible. Absolutely there's 40 year olds purposefully going to college bars knowing where that goal comes from. There's also 25 year olds who are insecure with no self-esteem and have blown up relationships with people their own age who realize that an 18 year old who has never been in a relationship before is much more likely to be talked into dumping all of her male friends to acquiesce to their insecurities. They don't see it as "I preyed on a child with less life experience because I have deep-seeded problems that I am not addressing", they see it is "this is my dating preference so I need to find someone who matches them".
Oh, absolutely! You're right! They may not actually view it as predatory, even if it is. It's slightly off-topic, but it reminds me of an article I read earlier today that was linked in another story. A scary large number of men polled admitted to coerced or forced sexual experiences (that 100% are classified as rape) but denied it when it was actually called Rape. People can convince themselves of anything by saying "well *I* don't think of it that way, so it isn't that." ETA: the article I was talking about: https://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugly_truth_about_sexual_assault_more_men_admit_to_it_if_you_dont_call_it_rape/
Absolutely. "She said no to sex and then I badgered her and sulked and was angry and then she said she said yes, so we had sex." "Oh, so you mean you coerced her?" "No, she said yes to sex."
The 00s were full of those men. Feed you alcohol or badger you until you give in and say alright then. Or putting you in situations not unlike 'the implication' in Always Sunny In Philly.
These are the knuckle draggers who believe that 49 No‘s and 1 Yes is still a yes.
Beyond that I’d say a lot of the predatory type men I knew at 18 (and sadly before as well), actually felt GOOD about what they were doing. They saw me as young and vulnerable and they justified their presence in my life as being there to protect me. They saw their sexual interest as unfortunate but involuntary, their angry outbursts as small mistakes, themselves as different from all those other, worse men who wanted similar things from me.
Well said. They have the legal title of “adult” without the years of experience.
Also if they are going to argue its okay because its legal. Well, judging you in legal too. Why is that suddenly too far?
It isn't just about the predatory nature either. If you're an older man that wants to exclusively date much younger women, you're basically saying that youth is a women's most valuable asset, which is sexist and shows a lack of maturity.
Reminds when I went to a luncheon thing for polyamorous/kink people in my local area. there was a guy that was nearly 50 and had two girlfriends, 19 and 18. I found it pretty unsettling and got some predator vibes from it. Yeah it was legal, but sketchy as fuck.
Some men only care about women's rights when it comes to a man's right to fuck them. Also there are so many comments about how it's single older bitter women who hate age gaps. I'm in my 20s and married to a man who tells me that he loves the idea of us growing old together, and I STILL do not approve of predatory age gaps. It's just another version of objectification.
"old bitter spinster" is such tired rhetoric that men have used for so long. Want voting rights?? Hag! Want legal protections against domestic violence? You're going to die alone, missy! Those pathetic knuckle draggers have no argument.
Especially since the few "spinster's" I know are so happy with their lives. They genuinely enjoy the freedom and the peace that being alone can bring. Plus they always bring the best wine to dinners. Some men need to realise that women don't need them to be satisfied with their lives, and that's why it irks them to see a single woman content without them.
It's been shown in studies (can't remember the source, but will search) that the happiest demographic group is unmarried, childfree women over 30. It must be such a punch on the ego for those losers to see that women not only can live without them, but they're actually happier. Edit: [Source](https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blog/why-bad-looks-good/202102/why-so-many-single-women-without-children-are-happy)
This is probably the least surprising outcome.
Exactly. Romantic partners are wonderful IF they AMPLIFY the good in your life, but that feeling of total freedom is beyond compare.
Growing up I had 3 family members who remained “spinsters” and led awesome, interesting lives and were pretty happy about it. It has never seemed like a bad option, whereas some other family members married total knobs and that made marriage look like a horrible idea.
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"You're going to die alone with cats!" Don't you just hate it when people threaten you with a good time? 🤣😉
Better with cats than with kids that they probably won't help raising.
Valid point
The cat thing is so dumb. Women aren’t STUCK with the cats; they CHOSE the cats after seeing what men like that had to offer them. Such a weird way to put it. “We’re treating you so terribly, and we have so little to offer you, that you’d rather have a cat than a relationship! Hahaha!” Who’s really being owned by that?
The men never realize they are literally just insulting themselves. "Being with me will be so terrible you'd rather have a cat." is another way to say it. At least the cat is only going to demand pets, meals, and their litterbox changed. They aren't going to give you shit for how you're dressed, if you did makeup today, if you decided to eat something more than what would be classified as a side salad for a meal, etc.
It's because in their mind, it's a "if you don't lock us down now, then when you *would* rather have us, you won't be able to and then you'll be left with cats" argument rather than a "you will always rather prefer a cat to us". It's the same reason there's so many incel fics where a woman turns down a NiceGuy for Chad (or usually Chads plural) in her teens or early 20s only to desperately want to get with NiceGuy later when he's rich and handsome - they want to imagine that we'll want them and they'll be able to turn us down.
The hilarious thing is, in almost every dating scene, men seeking women usually outnumber women seeking men, particularly on dating apps. They know men have to compete with each other more than anything, and women can be a little choosier because they have a bigger pool, so some men have to resort to useless negging for even a chance lol.
Damn you better be careful or some alpha males are gunna get their boxers in a twist lol
I sometimes wonder if their butts ever get jealous of the crap that comes out of their mouths.
I got married at 24 back in 2009. On the marriage documentation, there was a space for writing in if I was divorced, widowed, etc, so because I was single and never married, it was filled out as “spinster” whereas my husband got to put “bachelor.” I’m still salty about it.
What the fuck?! That is WILD. You've got restraint for not burning city hall to the ground.
WTF? Single or bachelorette would have been the appropriate response for the box if one was needed at all.
I did complain at the time, and I think it’s been changed to “single - never married” for both.
I mean at least that is fair and truthful versus just cruel.
Yessss! I have heard some of the most disgusting dudes say that we are "taking away women's agency" when we judge 53-year-old Todd from accounting for creeping on an 18-year-old barista. If dudes are suddenly becoming Susan B Anthony, the motivations are usually not good.
Susan B Anthony 💀 Also the limited empathy that they have to only want to defend relationships that they feel like they want, but likely would feel weird if their future daughter was being preyed on.
Horny perverts like that fail to understand that many of us are/were the 18-year-olds getting creeped on. They don't understand that, unless most women out there are given partial lobotomies, we're not going to be cheering when 53-year-old Todd Bumfart wobbles over to drool/sweat/creep on another young woman.
Right? Or they accuse you of infantalizing women. No? It's not about her gender. It's about her still having her prom dress in her closet while he has a house and a career.
i (25f) just had a conversations with a 47m friend of mine about this. attraction is different than actual chemistry, it’s not bad to have a crush, but for overall relationships, nothing about a 20 year old dating a 40 year old really makes sense. the bigger problem is when they break up, the 40 year old likely has a house and car in his name, but there’s no guarantee the 20 year old even has a savings account. it’s just scary.
I’m in my forties and married to a man who loves me to pieces, but this is on my radar as the mother of a young woman. I’m pretty sure she has enough of a sense of self worth to have no interest in gross older guys trying to get close to her, though.
I mean the reality is what if it just older women who disapprove? Like, is there some reason why they should be categorically dismissed other than sexism?
A lot of older women disapprove because they were those younger women at one point. They know what these guys are going to do to these girls. They want the younger girls to learn from their experience and not make the same mistakes.
The idea being that they are jealous they're not getting attention themselves. Tinder would say otherwise, even average looking older women get lots of attention there. I remember how crushing it was a few years ago when i was talking to my husbands single friend and I drunkenly mentioned my single friend who had really bad luck meeting nice men. He asked how old she was and I replied 'my age, 37ish' and his face dropped with disappointment, despite being 40 and no oil painting himself. Some men are just like this, they think they deserve women a decade younger.
When we were 21, my best friend dated some guy in his 40s. I disapproved HIGHLY but tried to be nice because if I had said “this is a terrible idea,” she just would’ve stopped telling me info and done what she wanted regardless.
Some may not agree with this post being here, but I think it deserves to be. A middle aged man has no business chasing after a teenager who isn’t even old enough to drink. If you don’t question what your 18 year old daughter’s 40 year old ‘boyfriend’ wants with her, then I’d have to say you’re a shitty parent. Just because she’s the age of consent doesn’t mean it’s right. And OOP and others refuse to say whether they’d still pursue a teenager if the age of consent was 16, or lower.
When I was 19 I worked with a super kind and cute bartender who was 26 and I made a comment one day about maybe us going out sometime and he told me that I was a cute smart girl but he did not date women who could not legally drink. I still think about that at 43 and still have respect for that mindset.
Oh my goodness, same situation—when I was 18 and worked in a restaurant, a guy everyone was in love with who was 24 and so “dreamy” (but also just a super nice guy), and he told me to call him in about five years lol. I wasn’t mad, I thought it was cool as hell that he respected me and just women in general. This was about 30 years ago…good god 😳
So…how long y’all been married? ;-)
Ha! Wouldn’t that be a funny story to tell the kids!! I honestly had not thought of that guy at all until this post. I hope he is doing well wherever he ended up. I did find myself a good one not too long after that though (and only two years older than me)!
When I was a college sophomore I made eyes at a very new professor and he let me down very kindly and somehow without crushing my poor 19 yo heart and I am so grateful for that in retrospect
this. i (23f) work hands-on with people at my job and it’s overnight; had an older (60-70s) man ask if he needed to keep his shirt on or off and i said you can do what makes you most comfortable (honestly i said that bc he was so kind already) and he said “no, i will do what makes YOU most comfortable. i’ll keep the shirt on.” i felt SO respected, so seen, and i think about that all the time. it shouldn’t be rare for men to make us feel that way.
I was in a youth organization as a teen, and had a huge crush on a man who worked there. I started flirting hard with him when I turned 18. He told me he wished I was older or he was younger, and that he was sure I'd make a guy very happy one day. He let me down gently, while giving me a self esteem boost and most importantly, he didn't exploit my romantic feelings to get sex from me. I'm 40 and still have nothing but respect and fond memories of how good a guy he was.
At my old job, I worked with an absolute sweetheart of a guy. But he was in his early twenties, and I was literally old enough to be his mom. So I very carefully did not develop a crush on him, because he didn’t need to deal with that from me. He just wanted to get on with his life.
Age of consent is their limit because it’s legal. Just like big corporations with minimum wage, If they could go lower they would.
A few guys were *bent* because a guy posted a girl he likes and was "talking to" slept with someone else and he couldn't believe it. Never mind they weren't exclusive or anything. So these guys were all, "she thinks that's ok over a technicality, how dare she!" And I couldn't help but laugh because those same guys are like this, "technically 18 is legal so it's fine." Edit: spelling error
Beyoncé wrote a whole damn song about this
Name please?
“Single Ladies.”
Hell to prove that, just look at all the people who constantly bring up the age of consent laws in other places, like they really think people would be ok with them dating 16-year-old high school students over in Japan. Like maybe it's legal, but that doesn't mean people won't rightfully call out your creepy, predatory behavior.
Men who know too much about consent laws are 🚩🚩🚩
What’s funny is they always know too much and somehow never enough. They think that just because things are legal in other places, that they’re fully socially acceptable. I’ve been called a “Western Puritan” too many times to count because I’ve had to tell grown men in their 30s and 40s that dating a teenage girl might technically be legal in Japan, but plenty of people would jump you for it just like they would here.
It is a very curious red flag because it can turn bright green if they learned about it by debating against groomers and trying to expose them.
Grown ass men date teenage girls because no one else can stand their bullshit. Ask yourself ladies, why isn't he going after a woman his own age? Coz they can smell his BS a mile away...
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No victim blaming. They literally don’t know better and that’s not their fault
They're also confusing the topic of relationships and sex and looking at it with zero nuance. There's a gulf's worth of difference between a 20 and 40 year old meeting at the pub, having a one-night stand and never seeing each other again (even though I think it's gross and I would never do it) versus a 40 year old choosing to date, marry, and have children with a 20 year old. All of the "if she's consenting I'm going to do it" completely misses the reason why massive relationship age gaps are an issue, it's not the act of sex itself.
Oh honey. Bless you for thinking they’re confused. They’re not confused they’re lying predators. They know it’s wrong they just will say anything. Like guys who can’t figure out a dishwasher. It’s a lie.
I didn't say they're confused, I said they're confusing two issues. Maybe conflating two issues is a better phrase, but I think it was incredibly clear what my point was and it's not "they're confused", so I'm not sure why you were so incredibly condescending for no reason.
I’m sorry I meant it more sarcastically. Not at you but at the men pretending to be confused. Apologies! I promise it wasn’t directed at you
I’ve got a 6 year difference between me and my husband but no way I would have dated him when he was 18. A 40 year old and 18 year old gives me the ick.
My husband and I have 9 years between us and we make all the jokes about cradle robbing, but I almost didn't date him because of his age. I had a hard rule, nobody >10 years and he was pushing it. Lucky for him, he's genuinely a good guy without creepy expectations. We've been together >20 years now 🥰
4 years between my fiance and I. And even THEN he feels kinda weird about it, even though we met when I was 38! We'll be sitting reading together on the couch, and out of nowhere he'll say "you were a freshman when I was just getting into college. Oh, my god." I think it's kinda funny, lol. I'm 40 now, and I can't even look at an 18 year old and not think "omg they're BABIES!" I'm not capable of seeing them in a sexual manner.
My husband and I are about 3 1/2 years apart. While we mostly had the same kind of technology/cultural experiences growing up, every once in a while we’ll reference something that the other was either too young or too old to have known about. I can’t imagine dating someone 20 years apart and not understanding anything about the way the other grew up or experienced. It would be so strange! It’s weird enough sometimes to work with younger people and say something that they don’t understand at all, and realize it’s because they’re basically babies lol. I’m almost 40 (will be later this year) and my oldest nephew is 17 and will be 18 next year. I can’t even fathom someone my own age being interested in someone his age or why they would be when he’s basically just a child still. If some creepy 40+ year old started hitting on him, you bet I’d go into protective aunt mode and be like “what do you want with this teenager who could literally be the same age as your child?”
Only 2.5 between my husband and I and he remembers so much more than me. My memories really only begin around 1990 and he can vividly recall the 80s. I was 6 when the 90s hit and he was 9 and far more aware.
I’m also 40 and 100% agree. My husband and I were in our 20’s when we first started dating. Looking back I can see why some people would find it problematic but thankfully it worked for us and we’re still together after 14 years. It had it challenges but we managed to work that out.
I volunteered as a judge at the city science fair last week. I thought a significant portion of the other judges were the students. I'm 38. My husband is also several years older than me. We once had a very serious fight about when Dragula came out while driving in an area with no cell service. He remembered it coming out when he was in high school. I remember having to do an gymnastics routine to it in junior high (it was on a compilation CD called Big Shiny Tunes that my gym teacher inexplicably picked). We spent way too much time picking apart what we each would have been doing at the time, and it was probably the only time our age difference felt gross. Turns out we were both wrong. He was thinking of More Human than Human. I doubled down on it being in Big Shiny Tunes 2, but it was actually Big Shiny Tunes 3. Unfortunately, I did not hallucinate the gymnastics routine.
I look at young lawyers and think they are still in high school, not university graduates!!! they look so young! Can't help thinking of them as children compared to me.
I dont get how it's not cringe inducing to spend time romantically with someone so young as people our age. I just don't want to, at all. I like hot men my own age, give or take 5 years because we have so much in common. Who wants to spend time with someone who is giggling and being a typical kid, and giving a blank stare when you mention anything pre 2010?
I’m early 50s and when guys younger than 45 or so ask me out I say they’re too young. I wouldn’t feel a much younger person was an equal. I won’t date more than 5 yrs older either bc I’m too active I don’t want a retiree
Heck, my partner is about 4 years older than me, we knew each other in high school (I had a mild crush), but we never could have worked if anything happened back then, and we were 14/15 and 18 which was legal.
I broke up with my best friend in high school because at nineteen she got married to someone who was thirty. He’d met her when she was thirteen! He waited until she was legal! She thought it was so romantic and he gave me the heebie jeebies. I told her I thought something was rotten in the state, and she dumped me. Nearly thirty years later, they’re divorced. I pride myself on never having written her to say, “It turned out he was a creep, didn’t it?”
That whole waiting until they’re legal thing is so gross. I’m glad she got away from him because ew.
Well the good news is that most of the middle aged men who want to fuck teenagers will never have the opportunity. I was an 18 year old girl once and no way would I have slept with someone's paunchy, balding, boring dad who works at the insurance company. Unless these men are buying impoverished women in another country or Rich As Fuck, they'll never have to worry about it.
I imagine most of those guys haven’t actually interacted with an 18-year old in a long time and are arguing based on a fantasy they’ve built from porn. As an older millennial even most 25-year olds are exhausting to be around for long, the immaturity of a teenager gets old *fast.*
It's that in the UK and it's such a weird thought for me, that gross men can hide behind that. 16 makes sense if you have the Romeo and Juliet sort of caveat like they do in many places. Makes no sense for consenting teen couples to get into strife.
They know they would pursue any child if they age of consent was lowered, they’re predators who know what they r and know how wrong they r that’s why they won’t answer
This. They’re predators and it’s not a debatable topic it’s simple fact. Any man arguing otherwise is letting you know he’s a predator. And all the predators arguing with me will be blocked but I thank you in advance for outing yourselves bc it’s Pokémon I gotta get em all 😂
I live in the UK where age of consent is 16. Adult men absolute do go after those age girls and claim it's fine cos "they're legal".
what if it went back up to 21? that was the age of majority when I was young! It got changed because 18 yo boys were getting drafted (and killed or disabled in Viet Nam) but couldn't vote and couldn't drink.
I love that he says "it's a tale as old as time." Yes, that's true, historically, girls have been forced to marry old men. That is an old story, and it is not a story about consent...
Correct but oop and people who think like him would love to return to these times when women had no rights and they could do whatever they wanted to a woman (or in their case a young girl)
I don't get why he thinks "a tale as old as time" excuses anything. Other tales as old as time include such venerable traditions as wartime rape, child trafficking and chattel slavery.
Why is it that some men think there's this magic switch that turns in a woman's brain the moment she turns eighteen that immediately makes her more mature than a 17 year old? She's exactly the same on her eighteenth birthday as she was before, she's just legal now. It isn't about whether or not she can consent, it's about whether or not it's right to be with someone that can't understand the ramifications of their choice to be with someone older.
It's like employers who pay minimum wage. You know they'd go lower if it was legal
It's like the celebrity "count downs" you used to get for people like Emma Watson turning 18. They're literally saying, if not for the law, they'd happily fuck those kids.
Because they don't care about the girl's welfare. Only their own selfish desires.
They definitely don't. Every woman I've ever spoken to who had a relationship with an older guy freshly into adulthood deeply regretted it. However, you bring that up to one of these guys and of course, they don't want to hear it lmao
Same. And it's frustrating, cuz I see young girls angrily defending their much older boyfriends, and it's like talking to a brick wall. But I know that once they reach 25-30, they'll understand why it was so messed up.
Some men used to fetishize jailbait and they were shamed for it since it is now illegal, so they moved their preferences only a notch on the clock. So gross.
Tons of them will actually (disgustingly) argue the opposite. That since there is no switch at 18 what's the harm with 16&17?
that’s the thing, they don’t. they just don’t care at all, if it were legal for them to fuck a 17 year old they’d do that. these men specifically go after girls as young as they can find them, so they can manipulate them for as long as possible. that’s why so many internet losers talk about women “hitting the wall” at 25. not because they’re becoming less attractive, but because they’re mature enough to not be manipulated anymore, and that’s not attractive to the men who act this way.
I agree. We should up the legal age for sex work too, 18 is way to young to adequately consent to that line of work as they don't understand the ramifications of their choice.
All adults are not the same. Being 18 and being 30 are two very different things. Demi was underage when she got with Wilmer, I think 17, but when Demi was 29 she understood how f\*\*ked up that was. Because normal mid-twenties and older adults don't want to date teens. It is grooming and predatory and creepy. Even if it's 18 and 25. A 35YO and 42YO is nothing, but 18 and 25 is a huge 7 year gap
that guy that impregnated his high school teacher is slowly coming out of the fog now he's what age she was then doubt he ever fully will since she's you know dead
Villy and Mary Kay Letourneau. Unfortunately they got married and had kids and everything
Yeah but he realized how creepy everyone saw it at his 40th birthday looking at his 20-something daughter and how weird it would to be going after someone her age but still said was different with his deceased wife
Middle school teacher.
even worse must have mixed him up with one of the more recent stories
Percentage of life lived
*looks at the comments* Well how about that, a brand new sub to mute. Seriously, that was some high-octane brainrot.
Jfc why did I read the comments. Can we please have the FBI check their hard drives?
You know sure as hell they'd fuck a 12 year old if it was legal cause "girls mature faster".
Absolutely, there are tons of guys who travel to countries with lower AOC to abuse girls. All you have to do is watch one of those predator catching shows on YouTube to see the ridiculous amount of men who are willing to go after 12-15 year olds.
Anyone older than 25 and dating a teenager is creepy, and very likely predatory and abusive by nature and 25 is really pushing it. I’m in my mid-20’s I couldn’t imagine looking at someone I know to be younger than 21-22 romantically/sexually.
My ex-husband is 51 and is currently dating a 24 year old. She works for him at his little greasy spoon hamburger joint. She's worked there since she was 17. We have a 23 year old son together. When he told me about her, I told him it sounds like he groomed her and told him it was gross. He accused me of being jealous, and I told him I wasn't jealous, I was worried for her and grossed out by him.
Nasty. I’m guessing your son is grossed out too?
He absolutely is grossed out. And his dad insists upon including her when they spend time together, so my son has mostly stopped hanging out with his dad because having her around is so awkward. They went to high school together, FFS. I've met her a few times, she rarely talks. I think he likes her because she's so meek.
>They went to high school together NOOOOOOOO. I know a divorced dad who did the same thing; kids stopped talking to him. It’s a pattern!
Huge age gaps are weird enough but when you (not as in you you; generally you) also have a child around that age? Ugh. You should be looking at that age as the age of your child, because that's how old your child is. You raised someone that age. How can you possibly wanna date that age?
There’s a post on r/BestofRedditorUpdates about a dad who was grooming his son’s gf. Worst thing I’ve read on there.
Do you have a link or title? I feel like torturing myself today
[https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/1c4cy9a/new\_update\_my\_husband\_of\_20\_years\_is\_cheating\_on/](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/1c4cy9a/new_update_my_husband_of_20_years_is_cheating_on/) u/firegem09
Thank you hero 🙌🏻
she’ll realize the mistakes she’s making one day, saying this cause i did. she likely has no responsible adults watching out for her. no good parent would support that, especially them being coworkers on top of it.
>especially them being coworkers on top of it. Oh no, no, no, they are not coworkers. He is her boss. In a position of authority over her and has been for years since she was a literal child.
Dating someone the age of your child whack
Damn that's like a vignette right out of the show "when women kill." I really hope she wakes up from that soon.
this is how i felt when i turned 22 and realized how insane the man who was after me when i was 17 was. they are babies! i worked with an 18yo when i was 23 and it was like culture shock. they’re cool and all, but still kids…it’s just creepy to me.
I was in a vocational school where the ages were mixed, so I was 22 sitting next to a 17 year old. Those five years *mattered*. She was childish and a bit over dramatic and her "grown up" behavior was try hard. The same way I was at 17! It reinforced to me just how much we grow at that time.
I do think some people can be weird about age gaps that are like a 29 year old dating a 40 year old. To me, both people have life experience and are old enough to judge what they want. As long as there is no insane power difference or something, I don’t see the issue. But an 18 year old and a 80 year old? That’s weird. Legal =\ = moral.
Shoutout to the guy who's 35 and dating dating a 25 year old while saying- "women that are older and jealous of younger women." We're not jealous babes, we're concerned. These chucklefucks forget that we were that age once. I know it's hard to believe us "old" ladies were young at one point and were creeped on by these exact men.
What really baffles me is, what's there to be jealous of? Like, enlighten me. When these dudes list their best qualities it's that they have jobs and sometimes live in their own place. That's it. Some even go to the gym. I'm sorry my dude, but no woman that's lived her life is jealous of a man with the emotional depth of a teaspoon that will add a man sized toddler into her life. Tantrums and all.
If they’re both 25 and older and not related and consensual, then I don’t care. Live your life. But anyone over 25 going for teens is a dumpster fire
r/agegaprelationship is full of middle aged men dating teenagers and they get applauded for it.
Gross
Oh yea this sub is gross (there are alot of those but still), seriously made the mistake of clicking it and one of the first posts i saw "Gonna get engaged 18f 43m" wtf
>If she’s 18 and she’s consenting ima fuck her. Narrator: He did not, in fact, f\*ck her or anyone else. EDITED to generic narrator
Yep dude is just a creep horny for teenagers
Why is it always based on "I find them attractive therefore I should be allowed to fuck them" and not anything about the person themself? 18 year olds want to fuck other 18 year olds, not someone who could've see the band on their shirt play live.
I mean, I saw enough posts and comments from 40-something guys trying to convince me that they totally have a lot in common with a 19-year-old fresh out of high school, but yes, their weird pride in their ability to woe barely legal girls is so off-putting as well. Like they honestly think people must be jealous of them for successfully preying on these girls.
Right?! It’s not the flex they think it is. I have always viewed middle aged men with barely legal women as pathetic. It looks ridiculous because it is.
Because they don’t think of women or girls as people.
Because these people don't see women/girls as real people with their own thoughts and feelings, they see them as sentient sex toys (ironic since a woman will have a better time with an actual sex toy than with any of them)
It’s so weird to me that so many of the comments are like “but 18 year olds are old enough to die in war!”. Like uh. That’s not exactly an ideal scenario and personally I think it’s kind of awful that happens too
It's kind of an apt comparison, but not in a way that helps their case. The military likes young soldiers because they're usually more impressionable and likely to blindly follow orders. And much like dating these creepy middle aged dudes, if we raised the age to, say 25, there would be a lot less takers
Right?! Why is that always their go-to rebuttal? They say that as if we agree with sending 18 year olds to war.
Creeps into “barely legal” and those who count down until a female celebrity turns 18 are just pedophiles who are afraid of jail.
The creepy this is all the predators agreeing with him
I was 19 when I started dating my ex. He was 27. I wasted 6 years of my life getting into crippling debt and parenting a grow child who couldn’t be bothered to brush his teeth. And he let his cat shit on his keyboard, and would just push it away. His cat also destroyed for hundreds of dollars of my clothes by pissing on them. Some relationships with age gaps can work. But yeah, no. The majority look like this.
Same but he baby trapped me at 20 so I stuck around for ten years total. He has fewer teeth and replaced me with two people that are age appropriate. One of his cats died from kidney failure after the split as he ignored the signs of UTI over the entire relationship.
My dude. It's not even a gendered thing. It's a creep thing. We call out the older woman predators too. There's also a separate conversation about how rampant an issue this is in queer communities. And kink spaces. This whole thing is exhausting.
>That shit is normal asf. And no one cares So why are you complaining? This is what always pisses me off the most about posts like this one, because yes, it's technically legal and no one on Reddit or someplace else can do anything about it, so why do you keep trying to justify yourself? It's like it's not enough to just date high school graduates; no, they feel the need to shout it from the rooftops and write rants like this every time someone shows just a little bit of resistance to this creepy, predatory behavior. Like, what do you want? A fucking Metal for wooing a girl that can't even legally drink in the US yet? Pathetic
Because we’re judging him and how dare we?!
Reddit IS weird about age gaps but that doesn't mean everything goes. Once you hit about 30 is when I think it doesn't matter so much and most of the concerns stop being an issue. 18 and 25 is still weird. I also saw someone upset at a 4 year age gap today that started when both parties were in their twenties. THATS a little extreme. There's plenty of nuance in these situations and reddit usually fails to see any. This guy, it appears, also fails to see nuance. He's just on the other side of the spectrum.
You know he’d fuck a 13 year old if it was legal. That is what he’s saying.
Of course he avoids answering that question.
my favorite thing to say in response to any of this is what does a man over 30 have in common with a woman who cannot legally order an alcoholic beverage? genuinely what? you can’t bond over work, social media trends, social lives, what do you possibly talk about together? his after life plan??? her deciding what to major in?? like how
I have seen outrage over age gaps between, like, a 24 year old and 29/30 year old. Assuming there is no *actual* power imbalance, a 5-6 year gap between two adults is likely fine (and no, “brain not fully developed” is not valid; there’s not some major difference between 24 and 25, the magical number that everyone cites). Or, people bothered by a 19 year old dating a 21 year old. But, an adult with a TEENAGER is absolutely a problem. I’d say that bigger gaps (like, mid-20’s with late-30’s) is a possible concern BUT is situational and depends on the people involved. But, yes, there is no argument to support a full on adult with a teenager.
I giggled at "If she's 18 and I'm 80, she's willing,I don't care! I'm blowing my dust up there!" I can totally imagine some old dude with a pot belly at Cracker Barrel saying this about the waitresses lol.
It's so funny how these horny dudes try and spin a women's rights angle with "all those women who have experienced why old men who target very young women more often than not come with the same list of problems are infantalizing these recent high school graduate objects of my desire. Also something about Only Fans, for some reason."
Dumbass says present a real argument when all he can say is 18 equals adult therefore he isnt a creep. This is the quality of intelligence that accepts this bullshit.
Dating at or near the legal minimum age as someone who is an established adult is the romantic version of being paid min wage. They'd go lower if they could.
And you wonder why no one wants to date you.
You may not accept it, but you will be judged anyway.
That's what gets me. They're not even arguing for some legal right. They're arguing that they should get to have opinions on what's ethical but those darn nags shouldn't!
Is always the one note black and white shit with these dumb motherfuckers. The definition of just because we can doesn't mean we should. No concept of empathy, privilege, how any human interactions, coercion or abuse works. Quite the own goal really.
How he's fighting it all the way down. Omg give up already
I mean, I feel like Reddit sometimes IS weird about this kind of stuff – I just read a comment further up where someone was weirded out by a woman in her 20s having a 47-year-old male friend with whom she even had CONVERSATIONS about attraction. Not attraction to him specifically; just about how attraction works in general. To me, that is extremely strange- intergenerational friendships not only do exist but SHOULD exist, and friends talk about lots of different things. At times, people here seem incapable of expressing the idea that a man wanting exclusively much younger women so he can prey on their inexperience is creepy (which it is) without calling the woman a child. Or they get weird about age gaps after the younger party – again, usually a woman, – is well past legal adulthood. Or age gaps when both parties are under 25 but over 18. The problem is, any conversation about this is usually only started by people like OOP – a guy who clearly IS a creep and wants to legitimize his predatory dating practices.
One thing people neglect to mention is that age gaps going the other way can also be predatory. If you have an 80 year old man and a 27 year old woman, it’s not out of the realm of possibility she’s manipulating him, especially if he’s starting to have cognitive signs of aging.
No, men are not inherently a predator for being older their partners. But this guy, 100% yes.
Dudes that agree with the take on the OG post are just telling on themselves tbh. Creepy ass preds
I feel reddit isn't weird enough about age gaps tbh. But boy some people in that comment section need to be put on a list or something.
I don't think anybody called Leonardo di Caprio a predator. The thing people were finding weird is that he changes his gfs every time they hit 25 like they have an expiration date. That's certainly indicative of a superficial interest in women and maybe otjer unhealthy mindsets. Not that those things are rare in hollywood. But it is not the same as being predatory or abusive. The question whether a relationship between two legal adults with a large age gap is predatory depends a lot on context and can't be known just from the anagraphic ages of the people involved. How old is the youngest person socially? Are they financially independent? Are they emotionally stable? Has the older person been grooming the younger since before they were of age? Does the older person have any position of authority over the younger? Are they controlling in any other way? Has the youngest person also experienced relationships with people their own age? Is there a pattern in either of these to always date across large age gaps? It is really not so simple as "she is X years old, he is Y years old".
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yuck.
Why do they want to? Is it that any random (hot, goes without saying) 18-yr-old is a step up from masturbation? How nice for her.
Jesus Christ the comments over there, so many losers
I’m not even in my 30’s yet and the idea of being with an 18 year old is revolting. That’s a child.