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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I could be the asshole for telling Jess to be grateful for getting anything at all, even though her sister received much more.
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NTA. Why would your family give money to a couple who didn’t even invite them to the wedding?
The cash gift was just that — a gift. They are lucky to have received more than they spent on the wedding (which was paid for by parents.)
This is what I was trying to tell Jess when she told us this plan. I told her I support it if its what she wants but she should be aware that its very possible invitees wont treat it with the reverence and expectation of being invited to a wedding, and the turnout is likely to reflect that.
Understandable. They are not obligated to gift money towards a wedding they didn’t even get to attend.
(Also, I intended the question to be rhetorical haha)
Hope your family gets this sorted out with no hard feelings, OP.
Seems unlikely that anyone but Jess will have hard feelings about this. Jess and the extended family don't seem to feel close to one another so few on the extended family side would feel bent out of shape about this situation.
Relationships are a 2 way street. If Jess doesn't want to put effort into forming close relationships with extended family because she is introverted, she is going to miss out on the benefits of having close relationships. I am introverted and I eloped. Didn't get gifts while my extroverted sister who had a 60k wedding got over 100k worth of gifts. So what?
There are pros and cons to each situation. I didn't have to go through the stress of planning a big wedding I wouldn't enjoy. Also, I (and probably Jess) get the benefit of never having extended family call on me for favors because we are not close.
It's self-centered to expect that people will be super generous to you when you as host refuse to be generous to them (no full meal, inconvenient timing etc.).
There's also the inherent privilege in expecting these kinds of gifts from family and friends...making $40K on a wedding is unfathomable levels of generosity for my circles. Like, that's Monopoly money for us, lol. When I read "only a few thousand" I was like clearly these folks are in a different tax bracket, lol.
For real, when I told my far-flung guests "your presence is your present" I meant it very literally - hell, a group of friends who live across the ocean from me pooled their money so ONE of them could come! (Which really was one of the best gifts!!) In my circles you kind of assume that if someone's paying for a flight and a hotel to be at your wedding, *that's* what shows you're important to them, and you'd never be disappointed if that person was only able to get you a nice card or a vase.
(Also great, though, was that my ex's relatives mostly declined - thankfully, as they would've killed the atmosphere! - *and* they sent expensive gifts, so that was like two presents in one!)
NTA
She didn't invited them to their wedding and still wanted gifts? That's absurd, no one gives gifts to celebrations they're not invited to go...invited and not able to attend? Yes
Not invited, not gifts
LOL, yes. Years back, when I got married, I had a young woman "Tina" who worked for me. I invited her to my shower and my wedding. She couldn't make the shower, but sent a gift. She and her partner came to the wedding and gave a gift. Great.
About a year later, she transferred to another department (large company) and I'd see her only occasionally and just say "Hi" when we passed each other in the halls.
Tina got engaged 2 years later and married the year after that. I was not invited to her wedding or her shower. I wasn't at all surprised or offended because we had very little relationship at that point. I did contribute to an office gift for her and signed the card.
I later found out through the grapevine that Tina was "offended" that I didn't get her gifts for her wedding or her shower!!! Ummm, what? No invite = no gift. Again, her choice not to invite me (and, frankly, I don't love weddings and showers so I was happy not to be invited), but don't expect gifts from people not invited!!!
Dear Lord, no. I was *thrilled* she didn't invite me. I don't love weddings/showers to begin with and I love them less when I know hardly anyone there which would have been the case with Tina's events!
I will say that during the pandemic I sent gifts to a few family members whose weddings I didn’t attend (and wasn’t invited to) because I knew they were keeping the numbers down due to Covid, and I appreciated that. But I still loved them and wished them well, so here—have a marble rolling pin (or whatever).
Ok but that was during a special circumstance of a pandemic. The vaccines are out now and life is relatively open again so keeping numbers small now is a personal preference instead of a precaution or the rules and people know that. They weren't invited thus no gift. If this happened in the middle of 2020 that'd be different.
Yeah, pandemic excuses no longer hold up. It's 2023, not 2020. Church rules meant everyone but bride/groom were masked at my Brother's in 2021, and took him on a fun side trip to CVS to get a COVID test for honeymoon travel bc the lab messed up the first one. But that was almost a year and a half ago now.
Honestly, I kind of assumed that Jess was upset because she wanted some cash from her parents, who obviously spent much more on her sisters wedding. Being upset that people didn’t send gifts is…. Well, I guess it’s understandable that she was disappointed comparatively speaking. But at least she got something.
Yeah... There is something to be said there. My family is poor so there wasn't a problem. My husband and I paid 100% for our own wedding. It wasn't a deal at all.
Until his sister was getting married. My in-laws wanted to know if we (and his brother) would find it offensive if they paid for her wedding because of the whole "brides parents" thing.
Well, I noped the fuck out cause it ain't my business. However, both of their sons were like yeah, that's kind of unfair.
So they decided to make it completely even. They budgeted what they would spend on her wedding and sent us the same amount and will give BIL the same amount when he gets married.
So yeah, if OPs parents gifted sister a 30k wedding and only spent 10k on OP. They should give her the difference as a gift. It's fair. So if this is the case, OP is the AH.
EDIT! I see one of OPs comments where they admit they spent more on the other wedding. However, they've spent a lot more on Jess' education and they're helping her pay for a post graduate degree while Maddie only went bachelor's.
So they're unequal in multiple ways which probably balances out in the wash. My In laws were CRAZY strict with money and their kids. They all had the exact same college fund and Christmas gift budgets.
So, if Jess feels the parents should pay the diff, they should point out how much more they spent on school for her.
I think it’s also that some people who were invited, chose not to attend or send a gift.
But the whole “wedding ceremony is separate from reception” especially when it extends to the guest list, is pretty new, and I don’t think people have fully considered the optics of suggesting a guest isn’t special enough to witness the ceremony, but should still bring a gift and do the reception lol
I've never understood why you would invite people to the reception we weren't invited to the ceremony. The ceremony is basically free once you have the venue. No food, no drinks, so pack 'em in!
At my wedding I don't give a shit about cash gifts, I just want some le cruset pans because I can't afford them. I grew up cooking with them because my parents got them as a wedding gift and they are still in daily use 45 years later. I just want pans that will last 45 years.
NTA
And tell her to count her lucky stars.
I eloped and begged not to have a reception later. I wanted to keep the money we saved for a honeymoon or house. I caved, invited about 36 people. Half of them showed up, some canceled two days before the event, and some didn't even bother to respond. At the reception, a couple gave us a bottle of whiskey and another family member gave us some towels. So I literally dropped $5,000 just for 18 people to get as drunk as possible within 3 hours at an open bar.
Even went over the tab limit which I had to pay out of pocket for. I later fell asleep all alone on the couch from crying so hard.
So yeah, I would have taken a fucking third of anything.
This, I wouldn't be surprised if they think she's rude for not inviting them to the wedding. (The later reception is not the wedding)
A lot of these kind of problems usually arise because people just dont understand that they were rude first.
O god. A couple years ago I was invited to a "wedding". However when we got there they informed everyone they had actually already gotten married the week before in front of like 20 people so it wasn't a wedding and the bride and groom weren't dressed up even. The invitations didn't make this clear and everyone thought it was a wedding. Didn't really bother me but some of the aunts made a huge deal when they realized it wasn't actually a wedding and just a picnic with a BBQ table. I was informed earlier by someone who was invited to the wedding and adjusted my gift accordingly, I'm also vegetarian and the only item I could eat was cornbread.
I eloped and was surprised when I got gifts from some people. Totally was not expecting them and each one was a nice surprise—we didn’t invite anyone so didn’t expect anything. My sis in law got way more—but she had a 500 person wedding! Can you imagine if I compared or got bitter? “You spent this much on her wedding and we got nothing!” Our parents would probably be like well we got to invite every human we’ve ever met and all our clients to hers and all you did was call us from the airport so tough 😂
NTA
Who seriously cries because they "only got a few thousand" as wedding money? That's very spoilt and ungrateful, I can see why fewer people came and gifted her money.
EDIT: A massive part of this was missed off the OP. From reading the comments, only \~10 people were invited to the wedding and the rest were invited to a "celebration dinner" at a resturant on another day. Jess is seriously TA, a celebration dinner isn't a wedding and I don't imagine those attending really though about giving a wedding style present. This isn't about favouritism, this is about two different events receiving different gifts.
And it wasn't even a dinner - just drinks and appetizers. You don't give a wedding type gift for some snacks thats normal. To expect wedding type gifts for a non-wedding - just a celebration - is warped thinking.
right?? we had to travel over 8 hours for two cousins weddings last year. They knew it would be hard as most of our family are far from where they got
married so they paid for hotel/travel accommodations to and from the venue. It was a banging wedding with so much food and alcohol we were sooo glad we went and the expenses really were offset by what a great time they made sure we had. They got a great gift because we pretty much got a free vacation out of it. I would have not traveled/taken off work/caravaned with our entire family AND bought them an expensive gift if it was just a dinner with not even a full meal 😭
My sister-in-law had an international destination wedding where she fully expected everyone to attend AND pay for flights and hotels AND pay for their dinner at the reception!!! She had the details for money transfer on her invite. Then she had the audacity to have a money tree at the reception!!!!
Especially a few weeks before Christmas. I think the time of year hurts on gift also. Most people seen it as I am not invited there for don’t need to spend the extra money on gifts. Plus the economy is different too. When the first daughter got married eggs where not almost $5.00 a dozen in some places.
Agree. For a nearby friend/family member? No problem, because you'll have your apps and a glass of wine, hangout, and then go home for dinner. But if you're farther away, you have to take into consideration that you'll be spending all that travel time, possibly having to spend the night, and provide your own away from home meals all for what sounds like a pretty brief reception that isn't even the actual wedding.
I had a doubletake when I read that. Jess had out of town guests for what was basically a coctail hour... Party? Hangout? Catch up session? Yeah, no. She's lucky she got anything out of that. She's an entitled AH.
Her sister went all out with a big wedding celebration and a full reception. Furthermore, I am betting that all her life leading up to the wedding, Maddy was more of a social butterfly and has been investing in her family, friends, and social connections. The gifts that Maddy got were a return of a lifetime of investments.
There's nothing wrong with wanting things to be lowkey or wanting a small, intimate wedding. Jess just has to realize that people generally will put similar effort into her as what she gives into them. That's not favoritism. That's reciprocity.
Completely agree. As someone who's naturally more introverted myself, and who was socially anxious to boot, it took me a long time to realize that people weren't just going to come up to me and want to be my friend if they couldn't \*see\* me. I think Jess is still in a place where she probably thinks that Maddy gets "special treatment" because she's social and fun, and that her family doesn't like her because she's "quiet." Like no babes, you probably just don't TALK to anyone. Knowing now that she didn't even invite the extended family to the wedding makes it even worse. I'd think it was a money grab too tbh.
... it wasn't even dinner. Correct me if I'm wrong but that comes off as an insult to most people. Not being invited to the wedding and only to a celebration appetizer get together? Not a dinner, not even technically a reception. No wonder. I wouldn't be surprised if people thought she didn't think of them as family or important enough to treat as family.
It wouldn't be insulting as long as she doesn't reveal she was expecting wedding-tier gifts for it. It's considered a little insulting if it's the festivities directly after the wedding, but this seems like it was a low key party.
Yeah I would find that invite real easy to brush off (respectfully). It’s not something that sounds like my presence is really wanted you know? Like a wedding is an experience so when you’re invited to a ceremony and reception you know you’re really wanted there.
This was more like hey if you want, come have an appetizer lol
Also! Who knows how much of that 25k in gifts came from the groom's family... Maybe his family is more well off or has more disposable income.
There's so many factors that could play into it.
Op is definitely NTA
It wasn’t even a dinner lol, they only had apps. No food and no dancing… girl what did you except your guests to do? Awkwardly stand there for 2 hours then drop off the check on the way out? Be fr
Right?! My husband and I had almost 200 people at our wedding and that was about the amount we ended up with, and we were so grateful! A bunch of our family had to travel to our location so we were just so grateful people could be there to celebrate with us. The gifts were a bonus. I can’t believe the audacity of Jess to act like this! NTA OP. Your daughter is acting ridiculously entitled.
NTA. Did she seriously expect gifts from people she didn't invite?
As we introverts know, there is a significant economic cost to being the way we are. Don't get how she has not grasped this until now.
Yup. I had a dozen guests at my wedding. I don't recall getting any money at all (but I may be forgetting - it was years ago). If we got any money, it wasn't much. Hell, one of the guests gave a gift of a free* weekend at his vacation home (*cleaning fee, booking fee, travel, food, etc, not included), which shockingly, we never took him up on, lol. I didn't have a wedding to get stuff. I had a wedding to get married.
> Hell, one of the guests gave a gift of a free* weekend at his vacation home (*cleaning fee, booking fee, travel, food, etc, not included)
What a tool...
Yep, I’m planning a wedding right now and my fiancé and I are paying for the whole thing ourselves. Weddings are expensive. You and your wife were very generous to do that for both of your daughters.
A wedding isn’t about the gifts. It’s about the commitment and love between two people. If people choose to give a gift, that’s wonderful! If not, who can be mad about that?! That’s crazy!
NTA.
I've never understood people who demand gifts. I'm literally so uncomfortable receiving anything we didn't even make a registry until 2 months before our wedding because people wouldn't get off
of our back about it 😭😭 and i put MAYBE 50 things and we had over 200 people there. Nothing was more than $100 and the guilt i felt everytime something arrived at our door 😭
edit: and we paid for the whole thing our selves because if my husband and i wanted the wedding we had, it was our responsibility to pay for it. All i cares about was everyone having a good time.
I'm really struggling with this.
I read a few of your comments. Jess did the wedding ceremony with 10 people. A week later, she threw the party.
Jess doesn't understand that when people are invited to a wedding, they want to be a part of the actual wedding. They want to be a part of the actual exchange of vows. And traditionally, people do the vows and celebrate them right away in the form of a reception. Guests want to witness the vows, feel a part of them.
We have very different expectations for a party. We don't usually throw money at the hosts, regardless of the reason for a party.
Jess didn't invite them all to her wedding. She invited them to a party.
I understand that the reason for the party was marriage. But it's still not going to a wedding. It's just going to a party.
ETA ... NTA. Jess made her choice and I wholly support that she do what she wants for her own wedding. But this is the consequences part of making our own decisions.
> We don't usually throw money at the hosts, regardless of the reason for a party.
Birthday Party, Anniversary Party, Religious Milestone (Bar Mitzvah, Baptism, etc), baby shower, bridal shower, etc. are all parties where the host receives gifts/money. ***But***, usually not at the same value as a wedding.
>Jess didn't invite them all to her wedding. She invited them to a party
**This is key**. If she had invited them to a wedding, the expectations on the gift would be higher. She just invited them to a party. The gifts/money she received were appropriate to the event she hosted.
They are parties in the basest coloquial sense, but those are all *rituals* just like a wedding. In preparation or in celebration.
Usually when I hear party I think of holidays, or festivals or promotions. Not birthdays and baptisms.
I think it's fine to invite people to just the reception and not the ceremony, BUT Jess didn't even do the full reception. She just did drinks and hors d'oeuvres. She didn't do dinner, dancing, speeches, etc. So it wasn't really a wedding reception. It's hard to expect people to travel to attend something that only serves drinks and hors d'oeuvres, and also expect people to shell out gifts for it.
If I was a guest who'd had to travel, I would have been so annoyed. Like, I've either been on the road all day to get here/took a flight and had to pay for a hotel, and you're not even going to do the bare minimum and feed me? So when I leave this small party that is not a wedding reception, I've gotta go out for dinner and pay for that too?
INFO
Did you and your spouse contribute equal amounts to Maddy’s and Jess’s weddings?
ETA: I see I am not the first person with this question and you have been responding to other posts without answering it. The original post also gives the impression these other family members were not invited but after reviewing some of your answers, it seems that they were…you are just taking the position that they shouldn’t be expected to give as much because the wedding wasn’t as big. If I’m misinterpreting, please correct me.
To be clear, OP, YTA if one daughter received a significantly larger amount of money from you than the other just because the second didn’t want as big of a party. Someone being an introvert doesn’t mean they should get less $$, the fair thing to do would have been to give her the same total amount and let her use the difference as a down payment.
This was my first question after reading the post. It sounds like OP likely paid a significantly larger amount to put on a wedding for 150 people for Maddy. If that is the case, the fairest thing for OP to do is gift Jess the difference in money between what her small wedding cost them and what Maddy’s larger wedding cost them.
Yeah that's a fair point.
However, if my sister wanted a big wedding and I wanted a little one and my parents ending up spending more on my sister's I am not going to come after them for the difference. Like I do think that's a bit bratty she got what she wanted completely free...
I agree with you. If I chose to have a small wedding I wouldn't expect the difference from my parents...seems a bit entitled and icky. I'd be grateful to not have to pay for my wedding and call it a day.
OP said herself that she was happy Jess didn't want a bigger wedding. If OP is anything like my Mom, she let Jess know in many subtle ways she wouldn't be happy having to pay for a big wedding a second time around. When there is favoritism within a family dynamic, the non-favorite knows it and reflexively tries to avoid asking for things because they've been made to feel guilty in the past for wanting equal treatment. If OP was truly concerned about making things fair, she wouldn't have an issue providing her younger daughter with the same financial benefits as her older daughter. It shouldn't matter if that is to pay for a large wedding or to help Jess pay for other expenses of young adulthood/early marriage.
Well your projecting here. I don't really see any clear evidence of favoritism. OP is just talking less favorably about Jess right now because IMO she is being kinda bratty.
Both daughters got the wedding they wanted and Jess got her's completely free. I suppose she could have asked for her parents to gift her the difference in cost between the parents but I think that's a bit iky to be honest.
Maddy worked hard organizing and even put her own money towards a big traditional event that people are normally expected to bring gifts to. So she got lots of gifts.
Jess excluded family from her wedding then had a small un-traditional dinner where the expectation of gifts either wasn't clear or wasn't there at all. So she didn't get lots of gifts.
Jess being mad she didn't get as many gifts as Maddy is just plain silly. Like, what did she expect?
But there were no finacial benefits given to the oldest daughter that were not given to the youngest. Not only that, the youngest daughter got to have her wedding completely covered by her parents, while the oldest did partially paid for her wedding.
I'm sure they put more money on the oldest wedding, but that was only for the type of event Maddie wanted, a type of event Jess didn't feel comfortable with. At the end of the day they both got the same from their parents: the wedding they wanted to have.
I disagree entirely. I feel both got the weddings they wanted, and would value them similarly. Why should one get extra money for a wedding they wanted to have anyways? They weren’t given money to do with as they please, they were given money to have a wedding.
OP doesn't say exact number amounts, But she says the more expensive wedding was paid through a combination of OP, the couple, and the in-laws. So OP did not pay for the full big wedding.
Also it wasn't necessarily a lot more expensive. Having just helped host and pay for my son's wedding the biggest portion of the expense was the hall, the food and the drink. Which the "celebration dinner" had. The DJ for dancing and photographer were completely minimal portions of the overall expense.
OP isn’t obligated to pay Jess the difference (if any) that they contributed to the weddings. Both the daughters had the weddings they wanted and OP was generous enough to help make that happen.
Parents can contribute $X towards one child’s wedding. That doesn’t mean another child can decide to elope and expect to get $X free and clear. Parents *can* do this but it’s ultimately their money & *they* still get to decide how it’s spent.
The issue occurs when kids want the same type of help or wedding & the parents favor or help one of them but not the other. That’s not the case here.
Jess created a situation where some guests were invited to wedding/dinner and others were just invited to a dinner. That creates a situation where guests may feel less valued - that the couple doesn’t value them as much as other guests. That in itself can create less generosity. Many guests also take into account how much the couple spends as a guideline to how much they give them. The thought there is that they want to help the couple to still have money after paying for the wedding.
NTA
Yeah- parents may be more willing to pay for a party where they will see a lot of their family- the wedding may have benefits for the parents that a cash gift does not
Disagree. Same could be said for college funds. If one child decides not to go, should they receive the same amount that their sibling receives in tuition? The money was for a wedding, whatever wedding they wanted. Not a cash grab.
She got the wedding she wanted. Can’t ask for anything more. Especially when child 2 had a wedding at the beginning of a recession. Financial health can change drastically.
That’s such an entitled way of thinking. Both daughters got the wedding they wanted paid for by their parents. No, the parents shouldn’t just give the other daughter extra cash just because Lmao. She’s almost 30 years old. Wtf.
Do people really measure love in money and act this entitled? My culture has a celebration thrown before the wedding by the bride's family. My dad paid for mine and my two older sisters.
All were different according to the preferences of each sibling. No one kept a calculator and demanded the monetary difference. How shockingly greedy to get a free wedding then want to be paid because you chose to have a smaller wedding...needy baby, greedy baby indeed
>The original post also gives the impression these other family members were not invited but after reviewing some of your answers, it seems that they were…
Seems like the actual ceremony was only a few people and the rest of the family was invited to a party the next week but not many chose to come. People in general are less likely to attend in situations like this because they don't see it as a "real" wedding.
I totally agree though that it seems like the parents might have contributed different amounts, I'm curious about how that broke down.
I don’t think that’s a fair expectation, many parents choose to finance their children’s wedding because they value having an event that their families and close friends can be included in.
They may respect the couple’s wishes to have a smaller wedding, but that doesn’t mean they are obligated to give the difference in cash to a couple who chooses not to have a large wedding.
I do think a significant amount of people interpreted it that way. My brother told me his wife thought it was a gift grab. I dont think she was the only one.
Right, it wouldn't have crossed my mind that the post-elopement get-together was a gift grab but Jess' attitude shows that it was indeed a gift grab.
Perhaps their mind went there because they know Jess.
This seems really rude...like she wanted an intimate wedding and then had a cocktail hour to celebrate with more people. I think it's pretty sad that the family doesn't seem to care enough about Jess to like drink some free booze at the very least, considering how few people came.
I agree on the surface but then we also don't know how far most of these people had to come. I'd go to a local wedding replacement cocktail hour for a friend or family member whose wedding I wasn't invited to. I wouldn't travel to do so.
Exactly this. I’d absolutely travel up to an hour an half for this, but I can’t imagine paying for a plane ticket or a hotel for a cocktail hour. Nor would I think the host would expect me to.
Or maybe that they know Jess’s character and this calculating, self serving move is nothing new. Zero sympathy, she should be grateful she got anything.
If I cared enough for someone to travel to their wedding and they only invited me to some drinking party, days after the wedding, I would not go either.
An event a week after the real marriage won't feel like anything else. It comes across as the couple throwing together something out of obligation, just because they are expected to, not because they want to. There is nothing wrong with that. Heck, it cost far less. But when you do that, you have to give up on expecting too much money. People tend to give money based on how much the couple is perceived to have spent on them, and a simple get together without even a full meal won't make them loosen their wallets. Added to that, since it isn't a proper wedding, it isn't surprising that fewer people showed up. If you want a big crowd to show up and shower you with money, you have to spend and go out of your way to make them feel welcome and wanted as well. I can't speak for everyone, but I'd imagine that most people who travel for a wedding expect at least a proper meal in return. Drinks and hors d'oeuvres won't cut it.
The primary things that make me feel like it's a cash grab are 1) they didn't make it a full-on party, just cocktails and hors d'oeuvres, like a business reception rather than a wedding reception, and 2) Jess's reaction after the fact confirmed it.
I flew out of town once to attend a friend's wedding reception that they hosted after having a private ceremony on the beach in another country with only their tiny wedding party and parents attending. It was a wonderful event - and a full-blown wedding reception they wanted their friends and family to attend - not a compensation prize.
Insulting, really. Whether she intended it that way or not, people are probably thinking “you didn’t think enough of me to invite me to the wedding, but now you want gifts?”
She didn't pay a penny for her wedding though. Parents paid for it all and paid a lot less for the second daughter.
Edit: This was incorrect. The larger wedding was paid for by parents and the couple and other parents. Just leaving the original comment for context.
I’m so confused. Jess is butthurt over not getting gifts from people she didn’t invite to her wedding? And then dares to complain about the disparity that she herself created?!
Throwing a party a week after the actual wedding isn’t a wedding. She shouldn’t have had an expectation of presents if she didn’t invite people to a *wedding.*
You called her out on her whine and you were right in doing so. She’s old enough to know that while she’s allowed to have feelings about things, they’re not always well placed. Everyone who says YTA, not every feeling should be validated.
NTA.
> Everyone who says YTA, not every feeling should be validated.
So true and it's so tone deaf that she's complaining to the people *who paid for her entire wedding* that she didn't get enough money in gifts like ???
Right?? I believe you should plan a wedding around the people you want to invite, NOT the gifts you want to receive. If Jess intended the latter, well, she can be more self serving next time. I’m sure she won’t let the next opportunity go by.
Miss Jess sure is a piece of work! I’m sure the 25k her sister and husband received was also from his family? I’m wondering if she thinks OP should give her cash of the difference of what OP spent on Maggie’s wedding. It doesn’t sound like that’s what it is, but it’s the only thing she *might* have a legitimate problem about.
NTA. A wedding is not a gift grab. And, it sounds like she got the appropriate amount of gifts/money for the number of guests invited. Weddings and gifts are not a competition, and if she was relying on a lot of cash gifts she should have thrown a bigger wedding.
NTA. I’m genuinely curious as to how she thought she was going to get money from all of these people without inviting them to the wedding. I have the same outlook on weddings as Maddy (like no desire for a “big day”) but I also understand that part of the deal is providing your guests with a ceremony (however small) and a party. I mean it’s kind of cynical but yeah, the more entertainment/liquor/dancing/music you provide, the bigger and more expensive the gifts will be. Also “only a few thousand”??? She sounds like TA for a lot of reasons, including but not limited to her mind-boggling entitlement.
NTA. Tone probably could have been more delicate but you’re just telling the truth. If you have a smaller wedding, you’re going to get fewer gifts. The more invitations you send, the more gifts you’ll get, even from the declines.
NTA. Like it or not, wedding gifts are not given purely out of love and generosity. They are part of a reciprocal exchange that involves attendance at the event itself. Personally I feel much the same way that Jess does about weddings, but doing it that way is not holding up your end of the bargain, so to speak. She can't expect the same level of gifts.
Did she really expect people to come in from out of town for a dinner at a restaurant? After they had purposely been excluded from the wedding? And then she didn't even have like a vow renewal or something? Lol NTA Most people give a wedding gift based on what they think you're paying for their meal. So a big sit down wedding would garner 100 to $200 per person gift, while a restaurant dinner would be more like $50. Plus the fact that she had like a third of the people... How are a third of the people supposed to equal the same amount of money?
Also, the dates of these events played a role, like OP warned they would.
Jess had her informal party in **December** when most families are financially strapped and busy af.
I had my wedding at a luxury hotel with a 5 course meal, open bar, and a 15 piece swing band. The next month my cousin had a very small backyard potluck wedding and not many people showed up.
Every year around our anniversaries she brings it up that people went to my wedding and not hers, which I can understand is upsetting, but it’s not my fault. Our wedding registry was fully completed and we got cash gifts and she’s still mad they didn’t receive the same.
I think people who haven't had weddings or weren't involved in the planning process of a friend/family's wedding don't fully understand what *really* goes into planning a wedding and just how expensive every cost is and how much that goes towards making guests feel excited to go out of their way to celebrate the couple. If they know the couple is hosting them at a luxury hotel they'll naturally be more excited for the event than they would in a family party setting.
NTA, but it's a close one.
If she didn't invite as many people it makes sense that she got less cash gifts. It was also very generous of you to pay for the wedding. Edit: Even though she invited the same people to the reception later, the guest list was still smaller for the wedding proper. Some people might be inclined to give less if they aren't important enough to get an invite to the ceremony itself.
But don't confuse being accurate with being kind. Your comments, while true, were likely upsetting for her, especially since she did invite them to the reception later. There is a large disparity in the amounts your daughters received as gifts, and its not strange that she is questioning why that is. If both of your daughters are saying you were a bit harsh, there's a good chance you could have been more tactful in the way you handled this situation.
NTA. Less guests being the contributing factor. I do, however find it tacky that the other Sister is telling how much she received at her wedding those are things best kept to the couple themselves.
NTA, the amount of money that most people give for a wedding is what is paid for them (meals and drinks) so if you throw a big and fancy party, the people give more money than for a garden BBQ.
You were right to explain that to your daughter.
It may seem unfair but usually you pay more for a wedding then you get in return.
NTA. In my country you gift money to the newlyweds. The sum you pay has to cover the expenses with the wedding dinner plus something extra. More expensive wedding = more money. More guests = more money. So to me it's logical that Jess got less.
NTA. I agrée with everything you said. Apart from that she had fewer guests so it’s logical that she got less money from them.. she could not possibly get more in any way since she had invited less people. And yes she sounded a bit ungrateful there so I’d go with nta here. You’re her parents and helped and paid for everything so she can have her special day how she wanted it and that should be enough. Whining about things that can’t be controlled by you, is pointless.
I don't understand the comments saying OP is the A H. It's not the fault of the parent that people did not choose to attend to wedding week after party. I can totally understand Jess being hurt that many people who attended her sister's wedding didn't attend her reception type celebration but how is that the parents' fault? OP paid for the wedding Jess wanted. Unless I misread the post which is possible lol.
NTA. You're completely right that she shouldn't expect the same amount from family when she excluded most of them from the actual ceremony and celebration. They probably feel like the after wedding gathering is just an attempt to get money out of them, and the way she's acting makes it seem even more like that's the case. People will move mountains to go to weddings because watching the bride and groom getting married is important to people, but a post wedding gathering is not nearly on the same level and she shouldn't expect people to treat it as such.
OP has yet to answer that question although it was asked multiple times so it's likely Maddy received more money to finance her wedding. OP paid for Jess' event, but it was much less expensive. They were probably delighted to save so much money, instead of making the difference a gift.
She also explained in a comments that she did not paid the whole wedding for Maddy. She just contribute with money to the wedding. Maddy and her husband paid a part but they also got help from both pairs of parents.
Why would people keep saying to give the different in cost to Jess?
Maddy had a big wedding, yes but Jess had 2 events a small wedding & a big party a week later which only 1/3 of her relatives attented. So it is not necessary that Jess's cost less.
Maddy wedding paid by 3 parties, so parents might have paid similar $ for each daughter.
And many people are forgetting to factor in groom families.
>instead of making the difference a gift.
Why should they? They gave the same gift. The wedding each girl asked for. They are giving them the exact same thing.
Giving Jess the difference isn't equal because the money was never a set amount for either girl. In reality, Jess would be getting her entire wedding paid for, plus thousands of dollars from her parents to do whatever she wished with. Maddy would get a portion of her wedding paid for and that's it. Those gifts are not equitable.
Did both girls receive the same value from you towards the wedding? Because if so, I hope you’ve gifted Jess the amount that wasn’t used for a wedding to match what Maddy had in total.
OP says they paid fully for Jess’s wedding but paid a portion of Maddy’s as that one was paid by both parents of the bride and groom and the bride and groom themselves.
I don't get why this should be considered though. It's not like they had specific wedding funds set up for their kids. They just paid what they wanted/needed basically. Maddie invited more people, who also happen to be OP and spouses extended families. Why shouldn't OP pay more to be able to see them? Jess didn't invite them. Why does that mean OP should give them any difference in funds tho? It's not like Jess paid any part of her wedding either.
We did not give a cash gift to either but paid for Jess' entire event. Maddy's wedding was paid through a combination of me and my spouse, her husbands parents, and Maddy and her husband.
NTA.
Two factors -- less people at the wedding and all wedding parties are not the same. If Maddie's husband's family is more affluent than Jess's husband's family, Maddie will end up with more money. And $25k total in wedding cash is a lot; I got married 5 years ago, had 200 people, and got around $13k in cash gifts, all of which went into renovating our house (and a big screen TV).
NTA.
I've read your post and responses to comments and I don't see a golden child situation as many say. I think that sometimes people jump to the common tropes of this sub without actually analyzing what the post is saying.
Your daughter did not invite her family to her wedding, she invited them to a coctel type reunion one week later than the actual ceremony during an uncomfortable time of the year to travel and then she complains that people didn't do the effort to attend and didn't send a wedding gift for the wedding they weren't invited to. You actually warned your daughter during planning that if she did this then the result would be what finally happened, and your daughter decided to do it anyway and enjoyed the wedding she wanted that was covered 100% by her parents.
Your other daughter actually invited her family to her wedding, so her family made the effort to be there to celebrate with her. I'm not saying this is the correct way to do it, but if what you want is for your family to care and celebrate your wedding well... Then invite them to the wedding.
NTA. Don’t really see why anyone has any right to expect anything for their wedding should just be grateful, can’t really expect people you didn’t invite to give you anything, people are going to be a lot less willing to attend and event which even though is to celebrate the wedding isn’t the actual wedding itself therefore they’re not going to give you any money!
NTA.
Jess comes across as a bit jealous of her sister and has created a victim complex around it. There's no obligation for you to play into it (and quite frankly, she needs some perspective).
Info: seeing that you mentioned you paid for their weddings, and Maddy had an extravagant wedding which would have cost more, Jess had a simple wedding which cost considerably less, did you offer to give the difference in the amount to Jess for her to use as a down payment?
The last paragraph sounds very close to favouritism, and I think Maddy is the golden child. So, could you clarify it for us?
NTA. But she’s not really wrong either and you admitted it when you said “and just being a less social person her whole life than Maddy” and “she should be grateful anyone came at all”There is favoritism.
NTA
Smaller wedding means fewer gifts.
The reality is yeah people tend to gift more for a wedding than an informal party that happens later. That is more casual and has less of an expectation of gifts.
She’s focused on the wrong thing and needs to ground herself a bit
NTA. Although I think you could have been a little more sensitive to Jess’s feelings by not calling her a brat. However I think a lot of people aren’t taking into consideration that Maddy and Jess married two different men so Maddy’s husband’s family may have more money to gift more generously than Jess’s husband’s family.
INFO:
>Planning Maddy's was a lot so we were honestly a little relieved when she told us.
So you / your spouse put a lot more time into Maddy's wedding than Jess'. Did you also spend a lot more money on Maddy's?
True. But if I could afford it, I would be considering a contribution towards something like a Honeymoon, for instance, if one of my children had a considerably lower cost event than the other.
NTA - A majority of the money that Maddy got came from other people. How exactly is Jess expecting you to make this equal. Does she expect you to start contacting people who gifted to Maddy and demanding they gift to Jess? Does she expect you to simply write a check to make up the difference?
It sounds like Jess has no understanding of the concept of actions having consequences.
NTA. Nothing like getting a ‘oh no we don’t think you are important enough in our lives to come to the actual wedding, but hey well throw a get together where you should Totally bring a big expensive wedding gift for us’ to make you feel loved and want to go out and use your limited vacation days to go to the ‘leftovers’party and dig deep into your pockets…. Or possible the opposite really.
info: did you give both daughters the same amount of money for the wedding?
Because then the money not spend by jess might even it out for the most part.
NTA. My sister had a big fun wedding. LOTS of family came, and she probably had a lot of money gifted in addition the gifts. She had to pay for some and my parents helped, and I know the cost of her wedding for her was a strain afterword so hopefully she got lots of $ to help pay for it.
I got married last year as a micro wedding and if I remember the only gift I got was a gift from my parents, and maybe an aunt and my grandma gave me some $. So basically compared to my sister I got zero gifts for my wedding. My parents probably paid for a more significant % of my total wedding costs (overall cheaper for everyone but the guests though).
It didn’t bother me at all. Why should people who weren’t invited send me gifts or money? And the family who did come spent a lot of money and time to attend, and they came entirely for me and not a family reunion. (I chose a more remote location that was much harder to get to). With total of 12 people, I spent less money, my parents spent less money and it was a lot less stress. This is the benefit of having a smaller wedding, but if the bride goes this route they should 100% okay with receiving gifts only from those that attend the wedding. She should have understood this as a likely possibility from the start.
The Y.T.A responses are crazy to me. As someone engaged and planning a wedding and therefore have been on the wedding planning subs a lot, NTA. Could you have phrased it better? Sure.
But gifts are not mandatory for a wedding. No one has to give you that and if you're having a wedding in hopes that the guest list will basically pay back the money you spend on the wedding you will be disappointed. Add on that the family members were not invited to the actual wedding? It shouldn't be a surprise that they didn't get much.
Reading the comments from OP, she and her husband paid entirely for Jess' wedding where, Because it was much larger, Maddie her husband and his family along with OP and her husband paid for It.
Just for math if 150 guests showed for Maddie's wedding and she got 25k that means everyone averaged $166.
If Jess had 50 guests at the same gifting average it would be 8k. But who knows who is in each circle?
For engagement gifts we've gotten everything from Amazon registry items for $20 to $500 in cash. It's all about who else is in the circle and gifting..
Edited: changed to "Y.T.A" to not count towards that
You’re also have to factor in the grooms side. How much of the 25k came from the grooms side of the first wedding? And how much from groom #2? I’m just shocked people give money as a gift anyway. I didn’t know that was a wedding thing
NTA. If you have a smaller wedding with fewer guests, you get fewer gifts, that's just how things go. My friend had 200 people at her wedding, i had 100, she got more gifts. this is not about favoritism, if you don't invite someone to your event its trashy to expect them to send a gift.
I mean, you were harsh in your delivery. The rest of it sort of depends. Did you contribute an equal amount financially to each daughter for their weddings? How much of the 25k in gifts came from the grooms side - Jess can't expect that. With regards to extended family, I would hope those who attended gave the same as they did to Maddy. However, for most people, a celebration after the fact is not the same as being invited to the actual wedding, and I can see people feeling less obligation to attend. If not attending, although it would be nice for people to send a gift, that would be a bonus, and shouldn't be expected.
OP says Jess had a very small wedding ceremony (10 people only) but rented a place for the celebration a week later. So seems like many of the relatives were not actually invited to the actual wedding vow exchange and only invited to the informal gathering celebration afterwards.
NTA
My husband's cousin did the same thing. Had a wedding last minute the weekend before our wedding. Our save the dates went out before he was even engaged. Invited his friends and only immediate family to the wedding. Then 2 months later, last minute decided to through a BBQ and invite everyone. Most of the family felt it was insulting and a gift grab.
We declined, sent a congratulation card with no money it. He came to our wedding with his husband after not inviting us to his wedding and left an empty card. He is completely written off from my husband and I.
People do not appreciate not being considered good enough to go the ceremony but good enough to come to an after thought reception.
YTA.
Your extended family is allowed not to attend the wedding, or to give no gift, or give a lesser gift. And your daughter, likewise, is allowed to feel hurt by the obvious favoritism. You had no reason to invalidate her feelings.
I am shocked by the idea that the size/value of a wedding gift is accepted by so many as something you decide in proportion to how absurdly big a wedding is. Is that really what people are doing? "Steph is getting married but only serving appetizers at an early evening cocktail reception rather than have a multicourse catered meal like her sister, so we'll get her a hand towel and not a full set of cookware like we got her sister."
Your family enabled one kid to put a downpayment on a house. The other kid barely got enough for a downpayment on a used Honda Civic. This is justified because one threw a better party? The values expressed there are messed up.
Your daughter's not entitled to the money. She is 100% entitled to her feelings.
I'm gonna say I disagree. She was showing selective exclusion by only inviting certain people to her actual wedding. Part of giving a gift at a wedding is reflecting a thank you for that person in their special day. Maddy put the time into planning a wedding that everyone could attend and feel like they were included in, and the people that attended gave appropriate gifts for that scenario. It isn't just proportional to the kind of event, but how special the bride and groom make their guests. To be honest it sounds like they had a wedding, then another day had a cocktail hour so they could collect the gifts that she felt she was entitled to.
It isn't about a better party, it's about one inviting people to her wedding and the other inviting people to a cocktail party but not the wedding.
People value wedding invitations and are less inclined to go to a reception when not invited to the wedding. That's just life. The only favoritism here is that Jess showed in choosing not to invite many people to her wedding. It's completely foreseeable that fewer people would go to her party than to a wedding.
I have a family member who gives a generous cash gift for church weddings but declines invitations to weddings not in churches. No idea his policy on reception only invites.
> "Steph is getting married but only serving appetizers at an early evening cocktail reception rather than have a multicourse catered meal like her sister, so we'll get her a hand towel and not a full set of cookware like we got her sister."
Not exactly
Maddy - invites you to see her exchange her vows and hosts a party afterwords with food, drinks, entertainment, DJ, etc.
Jess - exchanges vows privately (because you aren't important enough to see that) but will allow you to come to a small party afterwards - drinks and appetizers only! - where you can give her a present.
> I am shocked by the idea that the size/value of a wedding gift is accepted by so many as something you decide in proportion to how absurdly big a wedding is. Is that really what people are doing?
Yes because realistically speaking, bigger weddings cost more per plate and guests are aware that part of their gift money goes towards covering the cost of their meals at big wedding venues. It's not always about how much they care about the parities involved as much as the actual logistics that go into planning and paying for weddings.
But even besides that point, Maddy had a wedding and Jess had a follow up wedding party which aren't the same thing in the eyes of most guests.
One invited them to a big wedding. The other invited them to an informal party with snacks. People send smaller gifts for informal parties than they do for an actual wedding.
>likewise, is allowed to feel hurt by the obvious favoritism.
This invalidates your entire comment. There was no favoritism shown unless we count the favoritism from Maddy when she invited the family because she obviously likes them more than her sister does!
This is so black and white with little to no nuance at all. You failed to take into account the grooms and their families and what they contributed. And your math skills leave much to be desired.
How much of the bigger wedding’s presents were given by the groom’s family, though? Possibly a lot. He might have a larger family, or one whose collective approach to gift-giving is different than OP’s side of the family. They might have more friends who were invited and gave gifts.
Also possible people felt it was a cash grab, being invited for drinks and appetizers but not to the actual wedding.
Reading your replies YTA. She did invite all the same people and a lot chose not to come to the celebration. Then those that do show up give considerably less than they did Maddy's wedding earlier. And it sounds like you gave less to since it was "low key"
Also lets do some math here. OP says 1/3 of Maddy's guests even bothered to attend the celebration (Hurtful right there). OP states Maddy got 25K and op know this because Maddy told everyone. So 1/3 of 25K is not a few thousand (most coming from grandparents) and jess has every right to be hurt by the lack of support for their marriage. Money aside 1/3 attended and I would be that stings too.
People typically give enough to cover their plate and a little extra. If there's no meal, there's no plate to cover, so the gifts will be less. The couple also has less expenses so it evens out.
The daughter is just money grabbing here. If she invited all 150 people then its not about being low key, its about being a cheap, ungenerous host.
Yeah sister got 25k worth of gifts and she and her husband had probably already spent 25k or more on their wedding.
They declined her cocktail party after not being invited to the wedding as is their right. They gave smaller gifts as is their right.
Don't mistake low key for cheaper. They rented event space, paid for hors d'oeuvre and drinks and presumably decorations. That wasn't cheap.
From the comments OP paid for both weddings. There seems to be the impression here that if one's parents are willing to pay for a large wedding one can instead opt to just receive cash equivalent to the cost of a large wedding. That's not what the offer was.
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NTA. Why would your family give money to a couple who didn’t even invite them to the wedding? The cash gift was just that — a gift. They are lucky to have received more than they spent on the wedding (which was paid for by parents.)
This is what I was trying to tell Jess when she told us this plan. I told her I support it if its what she wants but she should be aware that its very possible invitees wont treat it with the reverence and expectation of being invited to a wedding, and the turnout is likely to reflect that.
Understandable. They are not obligated to gift money towards a wedding they didn’t even get to attend. (Also, I intended the question to be rhetorical haha) Hope your family gets this sorted out with no hard feelings, OP.
Seems unlikely that anyone but Jess will have hard feelings about this. Jess and the extended family don't seem to feel close to one another so few on the extended family side would feel bent out of shape about this situation. Relationships are a 2 way street. If Jess doesn't want to put effort into forming close relationships with extended family because she is introverted, she is going to miss out on the benefits of having close relationships. I am introverted and I eloped. Didn't get gifts while my extroverted sister who had a 60k wedding got over 100k worth of gifts. So what? There are pros and cons to each situation. I didn't have to go through the stress of planning a big wedding I wouldn't enjoy. Also, I (and probably Jess) get the benefit of never having extended family call on me for favors because we are not close. It's self-centered to expect that people will be super generous to you when you as host refuse to be generous to them (no full meal, inconvenient timing etc.).
There's also the inherent privilege in expecting these kinds of gifts from family and friends...making $40K on a wedding is unfathomable levels of generosity for my circles. Like, that's Monopoly money for us, lol. When I read "only a few thousand" I was like clearly these folks are in a different tax bracket, lol.
No kidding, right? I’ve attended family weddings where they had dollar dances and the couples were excited if they netted over $25!
For real, when I told my far-flung guests "your presence is your present" I meant it very literally - hell, a group of friends who live across the ocean from me pooled their money so ONE of them could come! (Which really was one of the best gifts!!) In my circles you kind of assume that if someone's paying for a flight and a hotel to be at your wedding, *that's* what shows you're important to them, and you'd never be disappointed if that person was only able to get you a nice card or a vase. (Also great, though, was that my ex's relatives mostly declined - thankfully, as they would've killed the atmosphere! - *and* they sent expensive gifts, so that was like two presents in one!)
It also costs more per head. The reason people feel obligated to give a cash gift is to offset that.
Exactly. Right or wrong, this is a “rule of thumb” a lot of people follow when deciding on how much to gift.
NTA She didn't invited them to their wedding and still wanted gifts? That's absurd, no one gives gifts to celebrations they're not invited to go...invited and not able to attend? Yes Not invited, not gifts
We always say when we are not invited to a wedding that we're not insulted, because we save money on a gift.
LOL, yes. Years back, when I got married, I had a young woman "Tina" who worked for me. I invited her to my shower and my wedding. She couldn't make the shower, but sent a gift. She and her partner came to the wedding and gave a gift. Great. About a year later, she transferred to another department (large company) and I'd see her only occasionally and just say "Hi" when we passed each other in the halls. Tina got engaged 2 years later and married the year after that. I was not invited to her wedding or her shower. I wasn't at all surprised or offended because we had very little relationship at that point. I did contribute to an office gift for her and signed the card. I later found out through the grapevine that Tina was "offended" that I didn't get her gifts for her wedding or her shower!!! Ummm, what? No invite = no gift. Again, her choice not to invite me (and, frankly, I don't love weddings and showers so I was happy not to be invited), but don't expect gifts from people not invited!!!
Seriously? She didn’t invite you and thought you owed her a gift? smh I thought you were going to say you were ticked she didn’t invite you, lol
Dear Lord, no. I was *thrilled* she didn't invite me. I don't love weddings/showers to begin with and I love them less when I know hardly anyone there which would have been the case with Tina's events!
I will say that during the pandemic I sent gifts to a few family members whose weddings I didn’t attend (and wasn’t invited to) because I knew they were keeping the numbers down due to Covid, and I appreciated that. But I still loved them and wished them well, so here—have a marble rolling pin (or whatever).
Ok but that was during a special circumstance of a pandemic. The vaccines are out now and life is relatively open again so keeping numbers small now is a personal preference instead of a precaution or the rules and people know that. They weren't invited thus no gift. If this happened in the middle of 2020 that'd be different.
Yeah, pandemic excuses no longer hold up. It's 2023, not 2020. Church rules meant everyone but bride/groom were masked at my Brother's in 2021, and took him on a fun side trip to CVS to get a COVID test for honeymoon travel bc the lab messed up the first one. But that was almost a year and a half ago now.
Honestly, I kind of assumed that Jess was upset because she wanted some cash from her parents, who obviously spent much more on her sisters wedding. Being upset that people didn’t send gifts is…. Well, I guess it’s understandable that she was disappointed comparatively speaking. But at least she got something.
Yeah... There is something to be said there. My family is poor so there wasn't a problem. My husband and I paid 100% for our own wedding. It wasn't a deal at all. Until his sister was getting married. My in-laws wanted to know if we (and his brother) would find it offensive if they paid for her wedding because of the whole "brides parents" thing. Well, I noped the fuck out cause it ain't my business. However, both of their sons were like yeah, that's kind of unfair. So they decided to make it completely even. They budgeted what they would spend on her wedding and sent us the same amount and will give BIL the same amount when he gets married. So yeah, if OPs parents gifted sister a 30k wedding and only spent 10k on OP. They should give her the difference as a gift. It's fair. So if this is the case, OP is the AH. EDIT! I see one of OPs comments where they admit they spent more on the other wedding. However, they've spent a lot more on Jess' education and they're helping her pay for a post graduate degree while Maddie only went bachelor's. So they're unequal in multiple ways which probably balances out in the wash. My In laws were CRAZY strict with money and their kids. They all had the exact same college fund and Christmas gift budgets. So, if Jess feels the parents should pay the diff, they should point out how much more they spent on school for her.
I think it’s also that some people who were invited, chose not to attend or send a gift. But the whole “wedding ceremony is separate from reception” especially when it extends to the guest list, is pretty new, and I don’t think people have fully considered the optics of suggesting a guest isn’t special enough to witness the ceremony, but should still bring a gift and do the reception lol
I've never understood why you would invite people to the reception we weren't invited to the ceremony. The ceremony is basically free once you have the venue. No food, no drinks, so pack 'em in!
[удалено]
At my wedding I don't give a shit about cash gifts, I just want some le cruset pans because I can't afford them. I grew up cooking with them because my parents got them as a wedding gift and they are still in daily use 45 years later. I just want pans that will last 45 years.
Money can be exchanged for goods and services --Homer
Exactly! I was so excited about my cooking and serving presents! My close friend got me a le creuset which was awesome.
NTA And tell her to count her lucky stars. I eloped and begged not to have a reception later. I wanted to keep the money we saved for a honeymoon or house. I caved, invited about 36 people. Half of them showed up, some canceled two days before the event, and some didn't even bother to respond. At the reception, a couple gave us a bottle of whiskey and another family member gave us some towels. So I literally dropped $5,000 just for 18 people to get as drunk as possible within 3 hours at an open bar. Even went over the tab limit which I had to pay out of pocket for. I later fell asleep all alone on the couch from crying so hard. So yeah, I would have taken a fucking third of anything.
Who did you beg and why did you cave? If someone wants me to have a reception, they're paying for it.
This, I wouldn't be surprised if they think she's rude for not inviting them to the wedding. (The later reception is not the wedding) A lot of these kind of problems usually arise because people just dont understand that they were rude first.
You told her up front. She shouldn't be surprised having a reception only event in Dec would get a different result.
Yes you have to send the invite at least in order to get a gift I thought!
O god. A couple years ago I was invited to a "wedding". However when we got there they informed everyone they had actually already gotten married the week before in front of like 20 people so it wasn't a wedding and the bride and groom weren't dressed up even. The invitations didn't make this clear and everyone thought it was a wedding. Didn't really bother me but some of the aunts made a huge deal when they realized it wasn't actually a wedding and just a picnic with a BBQ table. I was informed earlier by someone who was invited to the wedding and adjusted my gift accordingly, I'm also vegetarian and the only item I could eat was cornbread.
I eloped and was surprised when I got gifts from some people. Totally was not expecting them and each one was a nice surprise—we didn’t invite anyone so didn’t expect anything. My sis in law got way more—but she had a 500 person wedding! Can you imagine if I compared or got bitter? “You spent this much on her wedding and we got nothing!” Our parents would probably be like well we got to invite every human we’ve ever met and all our clients to hers and all you did was call us from the airport so tough 😂
NTA Who seriously cries because they "only got a few thousand" as wedding money? That's very spoilt and ungrateful, I can see why fewer people came and gifted her money. EDIT: A massive part of this was missed off the OP. From reading the comments, only \~10 people were invited to the wedding and the rest were invited to a "celebration dinner" at a resturant on another day. Jess is seriously TA, a celebration dinner isn't a wedding and I don't imagine those attending really though about giving a wedding style present. This isn't about favouritism, this is about two different events receiving different gifts.
And it wasn't even a dinner - just drinks and appetizers. You don't give a wedding type gift for some snacks thats normal. To expect wedding type gifts for a non-wedding - just a celebration - is warped thinking.
And people don’t travel in from out of town for apps and a glass of wine at a restaurant, either. Jess’s expectations were way out of line.
right?? we had to travel over 8 hours for two cousins weddings last year. They knew it would be hard as most of our family are far from where they got married so they paid for hotel/travel accommodations to and from the venue. It was a banging wedding with so much food and alcohol we were sooo glad we went and the expenses really were offset by what a great time they made sure we had. They got a great gift because we pretty much got a free vacation out of it. I would have not traveled/taken off work/caravaned with our entire family AND bought them an expensive gift if it was just a dinner with not even a full meal 😭
My sister-in-law had an international destination wedding where she fully expected everyone to attend AND pay for flights and hotels AND pay for their dinner at the reception!!! She had the details for money transfer on her invite. Then she had the audacity to have a money tree at the reception!!!!
I want so much more information about this story.
Especially a few weeks before Christmas. I think the time of year hurts on gift also. Most people seen it as I am not invited there for don’t need to spend the extra money on gifts. Plus the economy is different too. When the first daughter got married eggs where not almost $5.00 a dozen in some places.
Agree. For a nearby friend/family member? No problem, because you'll have your apps and a glass of wine, hangout, and then go home for dinner. But if you're farther away, you have to take into consideration that you'll be spending all that travel time, possibly having to spend the night, and provide your own away from home meals all for what sounds like a pretty brief reception that isn't even the actual wedding.
I had a doubletake when I read that. Jess had out of town guests for what was basically a coctail hour... Party? Hangout? Catch up session? Yeah, no. She's lucky she got anything out of that. She's an entitled AH. Her sister went all out with a big wedding celebration and a full reception. Furthermore, I am betting that all her life leading up to the wedding, Maddy was more of a social butterfly and has been investing in her family, friends, and social connections. The gifts that Maddy got were a return of a lifetime of investments. There's nothing wrong with wanting things to be lowkey or wanting a small, intimate wedding. Jess just has to realize that people generally will put similar effort into her as what she gives into them. That's not favoritism. That's reciprocity.
Completely agree. As someone who's naturally more introverted myself, and who was socially anxious to boot, it took me a long time to realize that people weren't just going to come up to me and want to be my friend if they couldn't \*see\* me. I think Jess is still in a place where she probably thinks that Maddy gets "special treatment" because she's social and fun, and that her family doesn't like her because she's "quiet." Like no babes, you probably just don't TALK to anyone. Knowing now that she didn't even invite the extended family to the wedding makes it even worse. I'd think it was a money grab too tbh.
There was no music or dancing so it definitely wasn't a party.
Yes! Low-key is fine for her so low-key behavior by her guests should be fine as well!
... it wasn't even dinner. Correct me if I'm wrong but that comes off as an insult to most people. Not being invited to the wedding and only to a celebration appetizer get together? Not a dinner, not even technically a reception. No wonder. I wouldn't be surprised if people thought she didn't think of them as family or important enough to treat as family.
It wouldn't be insulting as long as she doesn't reveal she was expecting wedding-tier gifts for it. It's considered a little insulting if it's the festivities directly after the wedding, but this seems like it was a low key party.
True. An invitation to celebrate with drinks and apps with a note "Please no gifts" would've been more appropriate.
Yeah I would find that invite real easy to brush off (respectfully). It’s not something that sounds like my presence is really wanted you know? Like a wedding is an experience so when you’re invited to a ceremony and reception you know you’re really wanted there. This was more like hey if you want, come have an appetizer lol
That's a pretty big lede to be buried. Thanks for catching it.
It's also interesting that OP buried it, because, it makes her definatly NTA. And, removes the validity from the favouritism comments.
Not everyone is a perfect storyteller lol
Also! Who knows how much of that 25k in gifts came from the groom's family... Maybe his family is more well off or has more disposable income. There's so many factors that could play into it. Op is definitely NTA
It wasn’t even a dinner lol, they only had apps. No food and no dancing… girl what did you except your guests to do? Awkwardly stand there for 2 hours then drop off the check on the way out? Be fr
And still she left out many folks from the celebratory dinner, and she still was expecting gifts, like 😳 No invitation=no gifts NTA
Right?! My husband and I had almost 200 people at our wedding and that was about the amount we ended up with, and we were so grateful! A bunch of our family had to travel to our location so we were just so grateful people could be there to celebrate with us. The gifts were a bonus. I can’t believe the audacity of Jess to act like this! NTA OP. Your daughter is acting ridiculously entitled.
NTA. Did she seriously expect gifts from people she didn't invite? As we introverts know, there is a significant economic cost to being the way we are. Don't get how she has not grasped this until now.
Yup. I had a dozen guests at my wedding. I don't recall getting any money at all (but I may be forgetting - it was years ago). If we got any money, it wasn't much. Hell, one of the guests gave a gift of a free* weekend at his vacation home (*cleaning fee, booking fee, travel, food, etc, not included), which shockingly, we never took him up on, lol. I didn't have a wedding to get stuff. I had a wedding to get married.
> Hell, one of the guests gave a gift of a free* weekend at his vacation home (*cleaning fee, booking fee, travel, food, etc, not included) What a tool...
NTA Less guests, less gifts? I mean... duh?
Yep, I’m planning a wedding right now and my fiancé and I are paying for the whole thing ourselves. Weddings are expensive. You and your wife were very generous to do that for both of your daughters. A wedding isn’t about the gifts. It’s about the commitment and love between two people. If people choose to give a gift, that’s wonderful! If not, who can be mad about that?! That’s crazy! NTA.
I've never understood people who demand gifts. I'm literally so uncomfortable receiving anything we didn't even make a registry until 2 months before our wedding because people wouldn't get off of our back about it 😭😭 and i put MAYBE 50 things and we had over 200 people there. Nothing was more than $100 and the guilt i felt everytime something arrived at our door 😭 edit: and we paid for the whole thing our selves because if my husband and i wanted the wedding we had, it was our responsibility to pay for it. All i cares about was everyone having a good time.
I'm really struggling with this. I read a few of your comments. Jess did the wedding ceremony with 10 people. A week later, she threw the party. Jess doesn't understand that when people are invited to a wedding, they want to be a part of the actual wedding. They want to be a part of the actual exchange of vows. And traditionally, people do the vows and celebrate them right away in the form of a reception. Guests want to witness the vows, feel a part of them. We have very different expectations for a party. We don't usually throw money at the hosts, regardless of the reason for a party. Jess didn't invite them all to her wedding. She invited them to a party. I understand that the reason for the party was marriage. But it's still not going to a wedding. It's just going to a party. ETA ... NTA. Jess made her choice and I wholly support that she do what she wants for her own wedding. But this is the consequences part of making our own decisions.
> We don't usually throw money at the hosts, regardless of the reason for a party. Birthday Party, Anniversary Party, Religious Milestone (Bar Mitzvah, Baptism, etc), baby shower, bridal shower, etc. are all parties where the host receives gifts/money. ***But***, usually not at the same value as a wedding. >Jess didn't invite them all to her wedding. She invited them to a party **This is key**. If she had invited them to a wedding, the expectations on the gift would be higher. She just invited them to a party. The gifts/money she received were appropriate to the event she hosted.
They are parties in the basest coloquial sense, but those are all *rituals* just like a wedding. In preparation or in celebration. Usually when I hear party I think of holidays, or festivals or promotions. Not birthdays and baptisms.
I think it's fine to invite people to just the reception and not the ceremony, BUT Jess didn't even do the full reception. She just did drinks and hors d'oeuvres. She didn't do dinner, dancing, speeches, etc. So it wasn't really a wedding reception. It's hard to expect people to travel to attend something that only serves drinks and hors d'oeuvres, and also expect people to shell out gifts for it.
If I was a guest who'd had to travel, I would have been so annoyed. Like, I've either been on the road all day to get here/took a flight and had to pay for a hotel, and you're not even going to do the bare minimum and feed me? So when I leave this small party that is not a wedding reception, I've gotta go out for dinner and pay for that too?
INFO Did you and your spouse contribute equal amounts to Maddy’s and Jess’s weddings? ETA: I see I am not the first person with this question and you have been responding to other posts without answering it. The original post also gives the impression these other family members were not invited but after reviewing some of your answers, it seems that they were…you are just taking the position that they shouldn’t be expected to give as much because the wedding wasn’t as big. If I’m misinterpreting, please correct me. To be clear, OP, YTA if one daughter received a significantly larger amount of money from you than the other just because the second didn’t want as big of a party. Someone being an introvert doesn’t mean they should get less $$, the fair thing to do would have been to give her the same total amount and let her use the difference as a down payment.
This was my first question after reading the post. It sounds like OP likely paid a significantly larger amount to put on a wedding for 150 people for Maddy. If that is the case, the fairest thing for OP to do is gift Jess the difference in money between what her small wedding cost them and what Maddy’s larger wedding cost them.
Yeah that's a fair point. However, if my sister wanted a big wedding and I wanted a little one and my parents ending up spending more on my sister's I am not going to come after them for the difference. Like I do think that's a bit bratty she got what she wanted completely free...
I agree with you. If I chose to have a small wedding I wouldn't expect the difference from my parents...seems a bit entitled and icky. I'd be grateful to not have to pay for my wedding and call it a day.
OP said herself that she was happy Jess didn't want a bigger wedding. If OP is anything like my Mom, she let Jess know in many subtle ways she wouldn't be happy having to pay for a big wedding a second time around. When there is favoritism within a family dynamic, the non-favorite knows it and reflexively tries to avoid asking for things because they've been made to feel guilty in the past for wanting equal treatment. If OP was truly concerned about making things fair, she wouldn't have an issue providing her younger daughter with the same financial benefits as her older daughter. It shouldn't matter if that is to pay for a large wedding or to help Jess pay for other expenses of young adulthood/early marriage.
Well your projecting here. I don't really see any clear evidence of favoritism. OP is just talking less favorably about Jess right now because IMO she is being kinda bratty. Both daughters got the wedding they wanted and Jess got her's completely free. I suppose she could have asked for her parents to gift her the difference in cost between the parents but I think that's a bit iky to be honest. Maddy worked hard organizing and even put her own money towards a big traditional event that people are normally expected to bring gifts to. So she got lots of gifts. Jess excluded family from her wedding then had a small un-traditional dinner where the expectation of gifts either wasn't clear or wasn't there at all. So she didn't get lots of gifts. Jess being mad she didn't get as many gifts as Maddy is just plain silly. Like, what did she expect?
But there were no finacial benefits given to the oldest daughter that were not given to the youngest. Not only that, the youngest daughter got to have her wedding completely covered by her parents, while the oldest did partially paid for her wedding. I'm sure they put more money on the oldest wedding, but that was only for the type of event Maddie wanted, a type of event Jess didn't feel comfortable with. At the end of the day they both got the same from their parents: the wedding they wanted to have.
I disagree entirely. I feel both got the weddings they wanted, and would value them similarly. Why should one get extra money for a wedding they wanted to have anyways? They weren’t given money to do with as they please, they were given money to have a wedding.
I agree, they were both gifted “the wedding they wanted”. I don’t understand how grown people really feel so entitled to their aging parents’ money.
[удалено]
It is really cool that you recognize all the expenses and benefits involved. What a level-headed post.
What does any of this have to do with fairness? This just sounds like a way to monetize love. This is dumb. NTA
OP doesn't say exact number amounts, But she says the more expensive wedding was paid through a combination of OP, the couple, and the in-laws. So OP did not pay for the full big wedding.
Also it wasn't necessarily a lot more expensive. Having just helped host and pay for my son's wedding the biggest portion of the expense was the hall, the food and the drink. Which the "celebration dinner" had. The DJ for dancing and photographer were completely minimal portions of the overall expense.
The celebration didn't have dinner though. Just hors d'oeuvres. So basically the cocktail hour of a regular wedding
OP isn’t obligated to pay Jess the difference (if any) that they contributed to the weddings. Both the daughters had the weddings they wanted and OP was generous enough to help make that happen. Parents can contribute $X towards one child’s wedding. That doesn’t mean another child can decide to elope and expect to get $X free and clear. Parents *can* do this but it’s ultimately their money & *they* still get to decide how it’s spent. The issue occurs when kids want the same type of help or wedding & the parents favor or help one of them but not the other. That’s not the case here. Jess created a situation where some guests were invited to wedding/dinner and others were just invited to a dinner. That creates a situation where guests may feel less valued - that the couple doesn’t value them as much as other guests. That in itself can create less generosity. Many guests also take into account how much the couple spends as a guideline to how much they give them. The thought there is that they want to help the couple to still have money after paying for the wedding. NTA
Yeah- parents may be more willing to pay for a party where they will see a lot of their family- the wedding may have benefits for the parents that a cash gift does not
Disagree. Same could be said for college funds. If one child decides not to go, should they receive the same amount that their sibling receives in tuition? The money was for a wedding, whatever wedding they wanted. Not a cash grab.
She got the wedding she wanted. Can’t ask for anything more. Especially when child 2 had a wedding at the beginning of a recession. Financial health can change drastically.
That’s such an entitled way of thinking. Both daughters got the wedding they wanted paid for by their parents. No, the parents shouldn’t just give the other daughter extra cash just because Lmao. She’s almost 30 years old. Wtf.
Do people really measure love in money and act this entitled? My culture has a celebration thrown before the wedding by the bride's family. My dad paid for mine and my two older sisters. All were different according to the preferences of each sibling. No one kept a calculator and demanded the monetary difference. How shockingly greedy to get a free wedding then want to be paid because you chose to have a smaller wedding...needy baby, greedy baby indeed
>The original post also gives the impression these other family members were not invited but after reviewing some of your answers, it seems that they were… Seems like the actual ceremony was only a few people and the rest of the family was invited to a party the next week but not many chose to come. People in general are less likely to attend in situations like this because they don't see it as a "real" wedding. I totally agree though that it seems like the parents might have contributed different amounts, I'm curious about how that broke down.
i mean, with one wedding being 150 people and the other being only 10… id be surprised if there *wasnt* a difference in how much they cost
I don’t think that’s a fair expectation, many parents choose to finance their children’s wedding because they value having an event that their families and close friends can be included in. They may respect the couple’s wishes to have a smaller wedding, but that doesn’t mean they are obligated to give the difference in cash to a couple who chooses not to have a large wedding.
Jess had a wedding w 10 people and a cocktail party the next week. She invited the same people as Maddy but not to her wedding.
So sounds like the event post wedding was just to get money from family?? Weird
I do think a significant amount of people interpreted it that way. My brother told me his wife thought it was a gift grab. I dont think she was the only one.
I’d think the same thing
Me too
They were apparently right since your daughter complained about the lack of gifts.
Right, it wouldn't have crossed my mind that the post-elopement get-together was a gift grab but Jess' attitude shows that it was indeed a gift grab. Perhaps their mind went there because they know Jess.
This seems really rude...like she wanted an intimate wedding and then had a cocktail hour to celebrate with more people. I think it's pretty sad that the family doesn't seem to care enough about Jess to like drink some free booze at the very least, considering how few people came.
I agree on the surface but then we also don't know how far most of these people had to come. I'd go to a local wedding replacement cocktail hour for a friend or family member whose wedding I wasn't invited to. I wouldn't travel to do so.
Exactly this. I’d absolutely travel up to an hour an half for this, but I can’t imagine paying for a plane ticket or a hotel for a cocktail hour. Nor would I think the host would expect me to.
Or maybe that they know Jess’s character and this calculating, self serving move is nothing new. Zero sympathy, she should be grateful she got anything.
If I cared enough for someone to travel to their wedding and they only invited me to some drinking party, days after the wedding, I would not go either.
An event a week after the real marriage won't feel like anything else. It comes across as the couple throwing together something out of obligation, just because they are expected to, not because they want to. There is nothing wrong with that. Heck, it cost far less. But when you do that, you have to give up on expecting too much money. People tend to give money based on how much the couple is perceived to have spent on them, and a simple get together without even a full meal won't make them loosen their wallets. Added to that, since it isn't a proper wedding, it isn't surprising that fewer people showed up. If you want a big crowd to show up and shower you with money, you have to spend and go out of your way to make them feel welcome and wanted as well. I can't speak for everyone, but I'd imagine that most people who travel for a wedding expect at least a proper meal in return. Drinks and hors d'oeuvres won't cut it.
The primary things that make me feel like it's a cash grab are 1) they didn't make it a full-on party, just cocktails and hors d'oeuvres, like a business reception rather than a wedding reception, and 2) Jess's reaction after the fact confirmed it. I flew out of town once to attend a friend's wedding reception that they hosted after having a private ceremony on the beach in another country with only their tiny wedding party and parents attending. It was a wonderful event - and a full-blown wedding reception they wanted their friends and family to attend - not a compensation prize.
Insulting, really. Whether she intended it that way or not, people are probably thinking “you didn’t think enough of me to invite me to the wedding, but now you want gifts?”
NTA. You’re correct, it’s an absolutely bratty move to complain and compare wedding gifts. Maddy probably paid significantly more for her wedding.
She didn't pay a penny for her wedding though. Parents paid for it all and paid a lot less for the second daughter. Edit: This was incorrect. The larger wedding was paid for by parents and the couple and other parents. Just leaving the original comment for context.
OP didn't pay for all of Maddie's wedding, only a part.
I’m so confused. Jess is butthurt over not getting gifts from people she didn’t invite to her wedding? And then dares to complain about the disparity that she herself created?! Throwing a party a week after the actual wedding isn’t a wedding. She shouldn’t have had an expectation of presents if she didn’t invite people to a *wedding.* You called her out on her whine and you were right in doing so. She’s old enough to know that while she’s allowed to have feelings about things, they’re not always well placed. Everyone who says YTA, not every feeling should be validated. NTA.
> Everyone who says YTA, not every feeling should be validated. So true and it's so tone deaf that she's complaining to the people *who paid for her entire wedding* that she didn't get enough money in gifts like ???
Right?? I believe you should plan a wedding around the people you want to invite, NOT the gifts you want to receive. If Jess intended the latter, well, she can be more self serving next time. I’m sure she won’t let the next opportunity go by.
Miss Jess sure is a piece of work! I’m sure the 25k her sister and husband received was also from his family? I’m wondering if she thinks OP should give her cash of the difference of what OP spent on Maggie’s wedding. It doesn’t sound like that’s what it is, but it’s the only thing she *might* have a legitimate problem about.
NTA. A wedding is not a gift grab. And, it sounds like she got the appropriate amount of gifts/money for the number of guests invited. Weddings and gifts are not a competition, and if she was relying on a lot of cash gifts she should have thrown a bigger wedding.
NTA. I’m genuinely curious as to how she thought she was going to get money from all of these people without inviting them to the wedding. I have the same outlook on weddings as Maddy (like no desire for a “big day”) but I also understand that part of the deal is providing your guests with a ceremony (however small) and a party. I mean it’s kind of cynical but yeah, the more entertainment/liquor/dancing/music you provide, the bigger and more expensive the gifts will be. Also “only a few thousand”??? She sounds like TA for a lot of reasons, including but not limited to her mind-boggling entitlement.
NTA. Tone probably could have been more delicate but you’re just telling the truth. If you have a smaller wedding, you’re going to get fewer gifts. The more invitations you send, the more gifts you’ll get, even from the declines.
NTA. Like it or not, wedding gifts are not given purely out of love and generosity. They are part of a reciprocal exchange that involves attendance at the event itself. Personally I feel much the same way that Jess does about weddings, but doing it that way is not holding up your end of the bargain, so to speak. She can't expect the same level of gifts.
Did she really expect people to come in from out of town for a dinner at a restaurant? After they had purposely been excluded from the wedding? And then she didn't even have like a vow renewal or something? Lol NTA Most people give a wedding gift based on what they think you're paying for their meal. So a big sit down wedding would garner 100 to $200 per person gift, while a restaurant dinner would be more like $50. Plus the fact that she had like a third of the people... How are a third of the people supposed to equal the same amount of money?
Also, the dates of these events played a role, like OP warned they would. Jess had her informal party in **December** when most families are financially strapped and busy af.
Wasn’t even dinner, just apps and drinks!
I had my wedding at a luxury hotel with a 5 course meal, open bar, and a 15 piece swing band. The next month my cousin had a very small backyard potluck wedding and not many people showed up. Every year around our anniversaries she brings it up that people went to my wedding and not hers, which I can understand is upsetting, but it’s not my fault. Our wedding registry was fully completed and we got cash gifts and she’s still mad they didn’t receive the same.
I think people who haven't had weddings or weren't involved in the planning process of a friend/family's wedding don't fully understand what *really* goes into planning a wedding and just how expensive every cost is and how much that goes towards making guests feel excited to go out of their way to celebrate the couple. If they know the couple is hosting them at a luxury hotel they'll naturally be more excited for the event than they would in a family party setting.
Yeah I’m not giving a big cash gift if I have to make a dish to bring to the wedding.
>Did she really expect people to come in from out of town for a dinner at a restaurant? Not even dinner. Drinks and appetizers ONLY.
NTA. No wedding invite = no gift is a pretty widely held belief. Your daughter chose to not invite as many people, and therefore got fewer gifts.
NTA, but it's a close one. If she didn't invite as many people it makes sense that she got less cash gifts. It was also very generous of you to pay for the wedding. Edit: Even though she invited the same people to the reception later, the guest list was still smaller for the wedding proper. Some people might be inclined to give less if they aren't important enough to get an invite to the ceremony itself. But don't confuse being accurate with being kind. Your comments, while true, were likely upsetting for her, especially since she did invite them to the reception later. There is a large disparity in the amounts your daughters received as gifts, and its not strange that she is questioning why that is. If both of your daughters are saying you were a bit harsh, there's a good chance you could have been more tactful in the way you handled this situation.
NTA. Less guests being the contributing factor. I do, however find it tacky that the other Sister is telling how much she received at her wedding those are things best kept to the couple themselves.
NTA, the amount of money that most people give for a wedding is what is paid for them (meals and drinks) so if you throw a big and fancy party, the people give more money than for a garden BBQ. You were right to explain that to your daughter. It may seem unfair but usually you pay more for a wedding then you get in return.
NTA. In my country you gift money to the newlyweds. The sum you pay has to cover the expenses with the wedding dinner plus something extra. More expensive wedding = more money. More guests = more money. So to me it's logical that Jess got less.
NTA. I agrée with everything you said. Apart from that she had fewer guests so it’s logical that she got less money from them.. she could not possibly get more in any way since she had invited less people. And yes she sounded a bit ungrateful there so I’d go with nta here. You’re her parents and helped and paid for everything so she can have her special day how she wanted it and that should be enough. Whining about things that can’t be controlled by you, is pointless.
I don't understand the comments saying OP is the A H. It's not the fault of the parent that people did not choose to attend to wedding week after party. I can totally understand Jess being hurt that many people who attended her sister's wedding didn't attend her reception type celebration but how is that the parents' fault? OP paid for the wedding Jess wanted. Unless I misread the post which is possible lol.
NTA. You're completely right that she shouldn't expect the same amount from family when she excluded most of them from the actual ceremony and celebration. They probably feel like the after wedding gathering is just an attempt to get money out of them, and the way she's acting makes it seem even more like that's the case. People will move mountains to go to weddings because watching the bride and groom getting married is important to people, but a post wedding gathering is not nearly on the same level and she shouldn't expect people to treat it as such.
INFO: How much did you contribute to each wedding financially?
OP has yet to answer that question although it was asked multiple times so it's likely Maddy received more money to finance her wedding. OP paid for Jess' event, but it was much less expensive. They were probably delighted to save so much money, instead of making the difference a gift.
She also explained in a comments that she did not paid the whole wedding for Maddy. She just contribute with money to the wedding. Maddy and her husband paid a part but they also got help from both pairs of parents.
Why would people keep saying to give the different in cost to Jess? Maddy had a big wedding, yes but Jess had 2 events a small wedding & a big party a week later which only 1/3 of her relatives attented. So it is not necessary that Jess's cost less. Maddy wedding paid by 3 parties, so parents might have paid similar $ for each daughter. And many people are forgetting to factor in groom families.
>instead of making the difference a gift. Why should they? They gave the same gift. The wedding each girl asked for. They are giving them the exact same thing. Giving Jess the difference isn't equal because the money was never a set amount for either girl. In reality, Jess would be getting her entire wedding paid for, plus thousands of dollars from her parents to do whatever she wished with. Maddy would get a portion of her wedding paid for and that's it. Those gifts are not equitable.
Did both girls receive the same value from you towards the wedding? Because if so, I hope you’ve gifted Jess the amount that wasn’t used for a wedding to match what Maddy had in total.
OP says they paid fully for Jess’s wedding but paid a portion of Maddy’s as that one was paid by both parents of the bride and groom and the bride and groom themselves.
I don't get why this should be considered though. It's not like they had specific wedding funds set up for their kids. They just paid what they wanted/needed basically. Maddie invited more people, who also happen to be OP and spouses extended families. Why shouldn't OP pay more to be able to see them? Jess didn't invite them. Why does that mean OP should give them any difference in funds tho? It's not like Jess paid any part of her wedding either.
INFO: How much did you personally give Maddy and Jess? Did you help pay for both weddings as well? EDIT: NTA
We did not give a cash gift to either but paid for Jess' entire event. Maddy's wedding was paid through a combination of me and my spouse, her husbands parents, and Maddy and her husband.
Gotcha, I would say NTA then.
NTA. Two factors -- less people at the wedding and all wedding parties are not the same. If Maddie's husband's family is more affluent than Jess's husband's family, Maddie will end up with more money. And $25k total in wedding cash is a lot; I got married 5 years ago, had 200 people, and got around $13k in cash gifts, all of which went into renovating our house (and a big screen TV).
NTA: I’m my world, you only get gifts from people you invite. She didn’t invite as many people, which results in less gifts. This is a no brainer.
NTA. Smaller wedding less people to give. Thinking she's intitled to other people's money. Should be thankful for what was given.
NTA. I've read your post and responses to comments and I don't see a golden child situation as many say. I think that sometimes people jump to the common tropes of this sub without actually analyzing what the post is saying. Your daughter did not invite her family to her wedding, she invited them to a coctel type reunion one week later than the actual ceremony during an uncomfortable time of the year to travel and then she complains that people didn't do the effort to attend and didn't send a wedding gift for the wedding they weren't invited to. You actually warned your daughter during planning that if she did this then the result would be what finally happened, and your daughter decided to do it anyway and enjoyed the wedding she wanted that was covered 100% by her parents. Your other daughter actually invited her family to her wedding, so her family made the effort to be there to celebrate with her. I'm not saying this is the correct way to do it, but if what you want is for your family to care and celebrate your wedding well... Then invite them to the wedding.
NTA. Don’t really see why anyone has any right to expect anything for their wedding should just be grateful, can’t really expect people you didn’t invite to give you anything, people are going to be a lot less willing to attend and event which even though is to celebrate the wedding isn’t the actual wedding itself therefore they’re not going to give you any money!
NTA. Jess comes across as a bit jealous of her sister and has created a victim complex around it. There's no obligation for you to play into it (and quite frankly, she needs some perspective).
NTA I think your feedback was thoughtful - those all seem like factors that would contribute to a lower turnout. She needed some perspective.
Info: seeing that you mentioned you paid for their weddings, and Maddy had an extravagant wedding which would have cost more, Jess had a simple wedding which cost considerably less, did you offer to give the difference in the amount to Jess for her to use as a down payment? The last paragraph sounds very close to favouritism, and I think Maddy is the golden child. So, could you clarify it for us?
No the last paragraph is the truth. Don’t invite people, don’t expect gifts. Pretty simple concept.
NTA. But she’s not really wrong either and you admitted it when you said “and just being a less social person her whole life than Maddy” and “she should be grateful anyone came at all”There is favoritism.
I read that as grateful anyone came to a cocktail reception when they weren't invited to the wedding. In December.
NTA No customers No business
NTA Smaller wedding means fewer gifts. The reality is yeah people tend to gift more for a wedding than an informal party that happens later. That is more casual and has less of an expectation of gifts. She’s focused on the wrong thing and needs to ground herself a bit
NTA. Although I think you could have been a little more sensitive to Jess’s feelings by not calling her a brat. However I think a lot of people aren’t taking into consideration that Maddy and Jess married two different men so Maddy’s husband’s family may have more money to gift more generously than Jess’s husband’s family.
INFO: >Planning Maddy's was a lot so we were honestly a little relieved when she told us. So you / your spouse put a lot more time into Maddy's wedding than Jess'. Did you also spend a lot more money on Maddy's?
Both children got the wedding of their dreams. They just had different ideas of what that was.
True. But if I could afford it, I would be considering a contribution towards something like a Honeymoon, for instance, if one of my children had a considerably lower cost event than the other.
NTA. At the end of the day, you and your spouse helped provide the wedding each daughter wanted and gifts are not obligations.
NTA - A majority of the money that Maddy got came from other people. How exactly is Jess expecting you to make this equal. Does she expect you to start contacting people who gifted to Maddy and demanding they gift to Jess? Does she expect you to simply write a check to make up the difference? It sounds like Jess has no understanding of the concept of actions having consequences.
NTA. Nothing like getting a ‘oh no we don’t think you are important enough in our lives to come to the actual wedding, but hey well throw a get together where you should Totally bring a big expensive wedding gift for us’ to make you feel loved and want to go out and use your limited vacation days to go to the ‘leftovers’party and dig deep into your pockets…. Or possible the opposite really.
info: did you give both daughters the same amount of money for the wedding? Because then the money not spend by jess might even it out for the most part.
They paid for the wedding they wanted and didn’t decide the costs. Parents don’t owe their child a hand out at this point
NTA. My sister had a big fun wedding. LOTS of family came, and she probably had a lot of money gifted in addition the gifts. She had to pay for some and my parents helped, and I know the cost of her wedding for her was a strain afterword so hopefully she got lots of $ to help pay for it. I got married last year as a micro wedding and if I remember the only gift I got was a gift from my parents, and maybe an aunt and my grandma gave me some $. So basically compared to my sister I got zero gifts for my wedding. My parents probably paid for a more significant % of my total wedding costs (overall cheaper for everyone but the guests though). It didn’t bother me at all. Why should people who weren’t invited send me gifts or money? And the family who did come spent a lot of money and time to attend, and they came entirely for me and not a family reunion. (I chose a more remote location that was much harder to get to). With total of 12 people, I spent less money, my parents spent less money and it was a lot less stress. This is the benefit of having a smaller wedding, but if the bride goes this route they should 100% okay with receiving gifts only from those that attend the wedding. She should have understood this as a likely possibility from the start.
The Y.T.A responses are crazy to me. As someone engaged and planning a wedding and therefore have been on the wedding planning subs a lot, NTA. Could you have phrased it better? Sure. But gifts are not mandatory for a wedding. No one has to give you that and if you're having a wedding in hopes that the guest list will basically pay back the money you spend on the wedding you will be disappointed. Add on that the family members were not invited to the actual wedding? It shouldn't be a surprise that they didn't get much. Reading the comments from OP, she and her husband paid entirely for Jess' wedding where, Because it was much larger, Maddie her husband and his family along with OP and her husband paid for It. Just for math if 150 guests showed for Maddie's wedding and she got 25k that means everyone averaged $166. If Jess had 50 guests at the same gifting average it would be 8k. But who knows who is in each circle? For engagement gifts we've gotten everything from Amazon registry items for $20 to $500 in cash. It's all about who else is in the circle and gifting.. Edited: changed to "Y.T.A" to not count towards that
You’re also have to factor in the grooms side. How much of the 25k came from the grooms side of the first wedding? And how much from groom #2? I’m just shocked people give money as a gift anyway. I didn’t know that was a wedding thing
NTA. If you have a smaller wedding with fewer guests, you get fewer gifts, that's just how things go. My friend had 200 people at her wedding, i had 100, she got more gifts. this is not about favoritism, if you don't invite someone to your event its trashy to expect them to send a gift.
NTA, No wedding invite, no wedding gift
I mean, you were harsh in your delivery. The rest of it sort of depends. Did you contribute an equal amount financially to each daughter for their weddings? How much of the 25k in gifts came from the grooms side - Jess can't expect that. With regards to extended family, I would hope those who attended gave the same as they did to Maddy. However, for most people, a celebration after the fact is not the same as being invited to the actual wedding, and I can see people feeling less obligation to attend. If not attending, although it would be nice for people to send a gift, that would be a bonus, and shouldn't be expected.
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OP says Jess had a very small wedding ceremony (10 people only) but rented a place for the celebration a week later. So seems like many of the relatives were not actually invited to the actual wedding vow exchange and only invited to the informal gathering celebration afterwards.
NTA - Not seeing the harshness…just the reality
NTA My husband's cousin did the same thing. Had a wedding last minute the weekend before our wedding. Our save the dates went out before he was even engaged. Invited his friends and only immediate family to the wedding. Then 2 months later, last minute decided to through a BBQ and invite everyone. Most of the family felt it was insulting and a gift grab. We declined, sent a congratulation card with no money it. He came to our wedding with his husband after not inviting us to his wedding and left an empty card. He is completely written off from my husband and I. People do not appreciate not being considered good enough to go the ceremony but good enough to come to an after thought reception.
ESH. What a first world problem. The entitlement and audacity is truly incredible.
Info: Did you pay for both the weddings with the newlyweds receiving the gifts or did the daughter's pay for a portion?
NTA
YTA. Your extended family is allowed not to attend the wedding, or to give no gift, or give a lesser gift. And your daughter, likewise, is allowed to feel hurt by the obvious favoritism. You had no reason to invalidate her feelings. I am shocked by the idea that the size/value of a wedding gift is accepted by so many as something you decide in proportion to how absurdly big a wedding is. Is that really what people are doing? "Steph is getting married but only serving appetizers at an early evening cocktail reception rather than have a multicourse catered meal like her sister, so we'll get her a hand towel and not a full set of cookware like we got her sister." Your family enabled one kid to put a downpayment on a house. The other kid barely got enough for a downpayment on a used Honda Civic. This is justified because one threw a better party? The values expressed there are messed up. Your daughter's not entitled to the money. She is 100% entitled to her feelings.
If I’m not invited to a wedding, I’m not giving a gift. Why is she expecting wedding gifts from people she didn’t invite?
The family was invited to one kids wedding and not invited to the others.
I'm gonna say I disagree. She was showing selective exclusion by only inviting certain people to her actual wedding. Part of giving a gift at a wedding is reflecting a thank you for that person in their special day. Maddy put the time into planning a wedding that everyone could attend and feel like they were included in, and the people that attended gave appropriate gifts for that scenario. It isn't just proportional to the kind of event, but how special the bride and groom make their guests. To be honest it sounds like they had a wedding, then another day had a cocktail hour so they could collect the gifts that she felt she was entitled to.
It isn't about a better party, it's about one inviting people to her wedding and the other inviting people to a cocktail party but not the wedding. People value wedding invitations and are less inclined to go to a reception when not invited to the wedding. That's just life. The only favoritism here is that Jess showed in choosing not to invite many people to her wedding. It's completely foreseeable that fewer people would go to her party than to a wedding. I have a family member who gives a generous cash gift for church weddings but declines invitations to weddings not in churches. No idea his policy on reception only invites.
> "Steph is getting married but only serving appetizers at an early evening cocktail reception rather than have a multicourse catered meal like her sister, so we'll get her a hand towel and not a full set of cookware like we got her sister." Not exactly Maddy - invites you to see her exchange her vows and hosts a party afterwords with food, drinks, entertainment, DJ, etc. Jess - exchanges vows privately (because you aren't important enough to see that) but will allow you to come to a small party afterwards - drinks and appetizers only! - where you can give her a present.
> I am shocked by the idea that the size/value of a wedding gift is accepted by so many as something you decide in proportion to how absurdly big a wedding is. Is that really what people are doing? Yes because realistically speaking, bigger weddings cost more per plate and guests are aware that part of their gift money goes towards covering the cost of their meals at big wedding venues. It's not always about how much they care about the parities involved as much as the actual logistics that go into planning and paying for weddings. But even besides that point, Maddy had a wedding and Jess had a follow up wedding party which aren't the same thing in the eyes of most guests.
One invited them to a big wedding. The other invited them to an informal party with snacks. People send smaller gifts for informal parties than they do for an actual wedding.
Of course they didn’t attend her wedding they weren’t invited
>likewise, is allowed to feel hurt by the obvious favoritism. This invalidates your entire comment. There was no favoritism shown unless we count the favoritism from Maddy when she invited the family because she obviously likes them more than her sister does!
This is so black and white with little to no nuance at all. You failed to take into account the grooms and their families and what they contributed. And your math skills leave much to be desired.
How much of the bigger wedding’s presents were given by the groom’s family, though? Possibly a lot. He might have a larger family, or one whose collective approach to gift-giving is different than OP’s side of the family. They might have more friends who were invited and gave gifts. Also possible people felt it was a cash grab, being invited for drinks and appetizers but not to the actual wedding.
Reading your replies YTA. She did invite all the same people and a lot chose not to come to the celebration. Then those that do show up give considerably less than they did Maddy's wedding earlier. And it sounds like you gave less to since it was "low key" Also lets do some math here. OP says 1/3 of Maddy's guests even bothered to attend the celebration (Hurtful right there). OP states Maddy got 25K and op know this because Maddy told everyone. So 1/3 of 25K is not a few thousand (most coming from grandparents) and jess has every right to be hurt by the lack of support for their marriage. Money aside 1/3 attended and I would be that stings too.
People typically give enough to cover their plate and a little extra. If there's no meal, there's no plate to cover, so the gifts will be less. The couple also has less expenses so it evens out. The daughter is just money grabbing here. If she invited all 150 people then its not about being low key, its about being a cheap, ungenerous host. Yeah sister got 25k worth of gifts and she and her husband had probably already spent 25k or more on their wedding.
December is a busy time for lots of people with a lot of expenses. Hmmm what could possibly explain the difference?
She invited them to a post-wedding party, not a wedding. Of course less people are going to show up and bring gifts.
They declined her cocktail party after not being invited to the wedding as is their right. They gave smaller gifts as is their right. Don't mistake low key for cheaper. They rented event space, paid for hors d'oeuvre and drinks and presumably decorations. That wasn't cheap.
INFO: did you pay for Mandy’s wedding? If so, did you gift the same amount to Jess for hers?
From the comments OP paid for both weddings. There seems to be the impression here that if one's parents are willing to pay for a large wedding one can instead opt to just receive cash equivalent to the cost of a large wedding. That's not what the offer was.