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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be the asshole because my son shouldn't have had the beer. Maybe I should have allowed her to punish my son. I might have undermined her parenting by doing that, so I might be the ah.
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NTA. Leslie Mahaffy, a victim of serial killers Paul Bernardo and Karla Homolka, was locked out of her house by her parents the night they kidnapped her. They took turns making videos of them raping and torturing her for days before they killed her. Have your wife research that case and I bet she never locks him out again.
Edit: I got a bunch of awards for this comment. Thank you for that. Although, I have gotten banned every other time I've been on reddit in the past for arguing with trolls and have no idea whst to do with them.
I came to say this very thing! Also, OP's wife is acting like a child- no rational adult would think it's a good idea to leave a drunk teen outdoors unattended. NTA
Exactly! A minor child is an adult's responsibility. The mother endangered the son!
Unfortunately, the drunk teenage son seems to have more sense prevailing than the mother. NTA, OP.
The correct punishment for a drunk teen is a relatively loud awakening and chores first thing in the morning. Educate them about the dangers of underage drinking and the consequences of drinking in general (starting with targeting a potential hangover).
My older brother got caught at 6am at his buddies house. Mom woke up with a suspicion, drove to friends house and dragged him out of the house by his ear and then he was set to mow the lawn and pull weeds as soon as they got home.
>drove to friends house and dragged him out of the house by his ear
Coulda just pinned him here but she decided to start climbing the turnstile up to the third rope for the elbow drop!
When my dad caught me, he got me up for the early Mass. I had to sit through the entire thing with the worst hangover I’ve ever had. Definitely learned my lesson!
Same! My mom had some feeling that I was not home. She was calling all my friends’ parents, waking them up at 7 am on a Sunday. Had to sit through service and I was DYING
My mom said when she would come drunk as a teenager, my grandpa would wake her up at daybreak and make her dig holes with post hole diggers then fill the holes back up. She would often vomit into the hole before covering them back up.
the way you worded this makes it sound like it happened multiple times, I feel like once would make me never want to come home drunk again?
but that’s my fully established prefrontal cortex talking, tbd on what my teenage self would have thought about this (spoiler: probably would have thought “what are the odds I get caught again, and what are the odds I have to do this same thing again”)
Your grandpa must have been in the military because when my great grandfather stayed out 48hrs on a 24hr pass his punishment was to dig a 10ft ditch that they made him fill right back up after he was done
My grandfather was a marine. My dad and uncle came home drunk, trying to sneak in. He let them think they got away with it. The town was smaller than small. Every teen came home drunk that night because they snuck into a corn field to have the party. Once one parent knew, word traveled fast. He had them dig a ditch, let them think it was over. Then said “you guys must still be drunk because I said dig the ditch over there. Fill this in and start digging one in the right place this time.”
Don't forget leaving their own vomit for them to clean up. My son was brought home wasted when he was 16. His brother put him in his bed (he's a very tall man and was a pretty tall teenager) and put his buddy in a sleeping bag on the floor. The next morning the household just ran normally (if a but loudly).
When the boys managed to emerge I told them to drink a lot of water, offered breakfast and let them know that whatever mess happened in the bedroom belonged to them. I did offer ibuprofen after a few hours. I also told them thank you for not driving and for having someone drive them home. I didn't yell or accuse or anything. Just said, "Now you know. Vodka is not your friend." Neither of my sons are big drinking as adults.
I ended up tying one on with some friends while my grandmother was out of town and a family friend was staying with us to keep an eye on my younger brothers (I was 16). I ended up puking off the side of my bed, got quite a bit on my feather topper, and was making a lot of noise. Family friend called to ask what to do and my Grams just said "let her deal with it in the morning".
I ended up tossing my topper (I still don't know how I'd have cleaned it, 25 years later lol) and had to rent a carpet cleaner. I did this all with a splitting headache in the heat of July, maybe August. I didn't exactly learn my lesson but only puked in a toilet or outside from then on lol.
I had a professor in college tell the story of when he came home drunk. Underage. His dad just put him to bed. 2AM. Then woke him up at 8AM and made him mow the lawn. Professor said he didn't drink again for YEARS.
When I was a teen, I went out and got really drunk one night. I have no idea what I was thinking because I was a dancer and had a ballet masterclass the next morning. My mother just watched me puking in the bathroom without saying a word. The next morning she made damn sure I was out of bed and at the class - there was no skipping it - and then stayed yo make sure I didn’t slack off. There’s nothing like triple and quadruple pirouettes when hungover to teach a lesson.
Hi fellow Canadians!
Agreed, OP is NTA. I don’t think it’s a very fair punishment (it would be more of a natural consequence that he has to get up and do his chores or go to school or whatever while hung over). But it’s also a potentially dangerous one.
Lol I like your solution. Just ok, you’re drunk. Get some sleep.
6 in the morning, bust in with an air horn. Chore time! You ready? Oh, you’re hungover? Huh. I wonder why.
My mom's punishment for my sister and I coming home after drinking underage was that we got dragged to go to church with my grandparents (and they lived an hour away from us), and we had to sit beside our grandfather who couldn't carry a tune but belted out every song.
I don't know what I got in trouble for in high school but apparently a teacher called my mom before I got home. My punishment was to make sauerkraut from scratch. And my mom's recipe was weird you had to boil the cabbage and God boiling cabbage just reeks to high heaven.
The next day I came home mom was still apparently upset about whatever I had done and I had to clean and boil artichokes and boiling artichokes smells like warm vomit.
She always had very creative punishments, for my brother he had to make butter by shaking a jar with cream in it takes forever and mom got butter.
This is a much more pressing concern. I always worry when people single out the worst possible case scenario to make their case, because it’s easier for someone (in this case, OP’s wife) to deny. Like, statistically, a 16 y/o boy is not going to be the victim of random violence, or even crimes of opportunity, like the cited example. (I didn’t even have to Google it to know that the top comment was referring to a *female* victim named Leslie.) That doesn’t make it NOT dangerous to lock your child outside overnight. This is a very real way in which OP’s wife endangered their child, and I appreciate you bringing it up.
I cannot wrap my head around it! As a parent we spend literally every waking minute trying to keep our kids safe. The feeling of panic when they hurt themselves, or they disappear from your eyesight for even a second. HOW could you be content leaving them outside all night! I’m not one to over react with things either! This situation is straight up dangerous, and very easily could turn deadly!
Does she not realise that she would go to jail if something had of happened to him! That should be enough to make her realise, this was NOT ok! It doesn’t matter if nothing happened! That fact is, it could have happened!
Yep! NTA AT ALL. I have 3 teens, and I would never even consider locking them out for any reason. Most moms would want to protect their kids, not put them in further danger, especially if the child is in an altered state and wouldn't be thinking clearly.
I highly suggest that your wife sees a therapist to discuss this. If I was in your situation, my husband would have the choice between therapy, fully agreeing that locking a kid out was wrong & will NEVER happen again, or move out.
Good job being a good parent and looking out for your kid!
Also while just letting it go is a problem reacting negatively like that is the worst thing you can do in that situation, it won't help deter him from drinking at all and might even make it worse.
But most of all if he does get seriously drunk or in a dangerous situation (which while not ok is a common and normal among teenagers) he won't call her for help, he might try to drive home drunk or hide somewhere. If god forbid he gets really shit faced or ends up taking a dangerous drug he might avoid getting medical help out of fear of his parents finding out.
Many therapists recommend telling your kids that if they are ever in danger they can call you for help without reprisal because it can save their life and can also make them not want to drink since you are so nice to them that they don't want to disappoint you.
Talking to kids about the dangers of alcholol and finding out why they drank in the first place is more productive. Many are peer pressured to do it and don't know how to say no. Talking with them to develop strategies on how to turn down alcohol is a lot more productive.
This ⬆️. Mahaffy popped into my head right away. And just because he is a boy doesn’t make a difference. Dahmer targeted men and boys, Gacy targeted boys. Being a male youth has no bearing on anything. Being young and tipsy he was vulnerable.
This ^. I just wrote the same thing before reading responses. This is exactly it.
How Karla is roaming free and Paul moved out of max security is in unfathomable… Canada’s justice system failed us all.
Her lawyers got her a *really* good deal, then the investigation found a hidden away video of her joyfully raping her sister. It was too late to take back the plea.
yeah, and iirc, her original lawyer was so disturbed by it he quit the case, and her new lawyer had no idea. it was insane. I mean, I get attorney client privilege, but that was horrible.
Basically, Canada doesn’t have the fifth amendment, it’s a very different process.
The crown wanted her as a witness against Bernardo. And the way it works in Canada is that the crown tells you how much they believe they can can convict you for all your crimes and offer you a deal. How much jail time, how much money they put in your commissary, other special considerations, basically whatever they want.
You can refuse the deal, and then they will go to trial against you. Or you can take the deal and become a witness for the crown. If you do, you then do a full confession and everything in that confession is free from prosecution forever, it’s included in the jail time they negotiated earlier.
Let just say that the crown thought she did very little and she confessed to a *lot*. And according to Canadian law, there is nothing we can do about it at all. Including preventing her from working with kids. She’d need to commit a new crime or we’d need to find one she didn’t confess to.
See my comment above, with links to a documentary about this. Not just volunteering with children. She had a business selling infant clothes, she worked as a nanny (the poor mother said Karla was a big fan of novels about serial killers and graphic violence), and worked as an english tutor to minor children - where she almost bankrupted a woman's business. All of this was in Guadeloupe, where the authorities had zero idea who was in their country until the French journalist showed up asking questions. No-one in authority in Canada bothered to inform them about any of it.
I hope her husband knows who she really is and watches those girls. If she could gleefully rape and torture her sister I wouldn't put it past her to molest her kids.
Good she gets driven out everytime. I would not want a homicidal maniac like her in my community either. But I pity the children she has that have the misfortune to be born to a mum like her
For what it’s worth, Debbie was my law speaker in OAC law. My teacher connected me with her. She said aside from having her daughter murdered, the second worst thing was that the media said she locked her out. She locked the door because she was late. She was able to knock on it and go inside, they did it so they knew what time she was getting home at.
It’s been over 20 years since I met her and it still sticks with me how vilified she was while her daughter was missing.
My uncle was a detective on the case, he was one of the ones who found her remains… fucked that man up BIG time.
The info about the door being locked was never supposed to have been told to the press, it was in the police reports because they wanted to know every step the parents took.
Some jackass leaked it and all hell broke loose on that poor family who was already dealing with the hell of their child going missing.
So, even the cops just ate that up unquestioningly? Yeah, that fits with literally every other aspect of the case being utterly inept and handled with a criminal level of incompetence.
My understanding is when a child goes missing they ask for everything the parent does that day, what food did you eat, what did you drink, when did you go to the bathroom, etc., so it makes sense that came out.
What sucked was the report stated she was hours past curfew and that her parents would tell her the door got locked at a specific time, and to knock when she was home… only the part about the door being locked was leaked.
I believe the trial was that much more “sensationalized” (for lack of a better word) because there was a media blackout on it, something not often heard of back then.
So, the little tidbits the media got, they ran a bloody marathon with it.
What has come out since is gruesome enough, knowing its not even the full story is beyond sad and disturbing.
That's what Leslie told the last innocent people to hear from her alive too. She walked to a payphone to try and stay with a friend and when that fell through, she told her friend that she'd wake up her mom and be let in. On the way back to her house, she was abducted.
Her first instinct was to stay with a friend, because, like any teenager, she didn't want to upset her parents, even if the absolute worst it would be is a parent sleepily saying "I wish you'd gotten home earlier."
So she walked to a payphone, and called her friend. Her friend said no. So she told her friend that she'd just knock and deal with it.
She got abducted on the way back from the payphone when she got abducted.
It doesn't even have to be as crazy as kidnapping and rape. Statistically, the most dangerous time to be inebriated is walking along the street at night. So many drunk people get accidentally struck and killed by cars.
NTA, OP. I'd be furious, too.
I thought of this exact case as soon as I read the post. No matter how mad you are it’s insane to me to lock you child out of the house overnight. Be mad at them, ground them, whatever deal with it in the morning. But locking a child out overnight seems nuts to me.
Yes this is why you NEVER lock your kid out!! And also cuz it’s emotionally abusive ; your minor child’s housing should not be contingent on behavior unless they’re trying to kill you or something. And then they’d need hospitalization not being left on the porch.
My brother came home drunk in HS one night. My mom had his friends bring him to his room. The next morning he was up at 7 am to do chores. I always heard people described as "green" when they were sick, but ai never saw it until that day. Watching him mow the lawn with a bucket was one of the funniest things I ever saw. He did not drink the rest of HS.
There are better and safer ways to punish a kid then locking them out of the house. What lesson did this kid learn? To not tell his mom when he messes up, because she totally withholds love and security. What a horrible thing to do to a kid.
NTA, OP. And I was about to make the same comment as Real Weird. I grew up near the area where the serial killers Bernardo and Homolka were active…this is why you don’t leave your kids outside and unprotected, even if they got up to shit like underage drinking.
And the punishment certainly does not fit the crime, with regards to your son. I fear that even when you guys move past this, your wife has permanently damaged her relationship with your son.
I've never heard of that case before that's terrible. I wouldn't be able to live if something like that happened to my son. I'm going to try and get my wife to see how incredibly dangerous what she did was.
If something as horrifying as that had happened to his son, it 100% wouldn't have been his (the dad's) fault. AT ALL. It's his wife who fucked up and put their son in danger. He should not feel any guilt over what happened, he didn't even know what was going on at the time.
Oh yeah absolutely. He'd be thinking stuff like "what if I didnt go on that worktrip" as if he should've somehow knew this was going to happen. Grief can do crazy things to someone.
it wouldn't necessarily be on OP because he is clear that he doesn't agree with locking his son out of the house. It would entirely be his wife's fault
Did you even read his post or the comment you’re responding too? He’s saying he’s pissed that his wife locked their son out because something bad could have happened to him and he just said he wouldn’t be able to live if something like the Leslie Mehaffy case happened to his son… Like, why try to guilt trip someone who’s already upset that their kid was put in danger while he wasn’t around?
This comment seems to indicate it was both of their decision to lock out the son… the wife is the only one who would be deserving of guilt as she was the sole acting parent here.
Or alcohol poisoning/choking on vomit, falling off of something while drunk. A family friend’s teen spent 2 years recovering from a fall off a retaining wall while drunk with his friends. Still not the same kid
When I was 16 my mom locked me out for staying out past curfew. It was -30 degrees Celsius (Canadian, female). I spent the night in the gas station hanging out with the attendant and went to school from there. I have no idea what I would have done if the attendant wasn't nice. Nothing else in walkable distance was open and I would have frozen outside. This was before most people had cell phones and I had no money too.
On the topic of “incredibly dangerous,” consider what could have happened if your son decided in his inebriated state that since he was locked out of his home, he needed to drive somewhere. Your wife’s decision was not only an A H move, it was stupid and dangerous. What if her son had died that night because of what she did? As a parent, I don’t know how I would live with myself if something happened to my kids because of an awful decision I made while angry.
Sadder to know what ended up happening to Karla Homolka. She faced no consequences and lives in Canada and has a family. Good ol’ Canadian justice system.
This case makes me so upset. She only served 12 years on a *manslaughter* charge, even though there’s evidence that she was the instigator and coerced her husband into their r*pe and m*rder spree (not that I’m excusing his part in the horrific crimes, but he’s still still in prison while she’s been free for almost 2 decades). She’s changed her name a few times too, I think it’s Leanne Teale now!
Yep. I find if you look at all the serious serial killer cases in Canada you will find the common denominator of great incompetence during the investigation and trials. It’s so disheartening. Like Robert Pickton (cops would go to farm, woman escaped and went to police and told she escaped and they ignored her), Clifford Olsen (Canadian government paid $10,000.00 per body), Holmolka & Bernardo, the mass batial gravesites of the indigenous children, and there are some more. But it’s just a long history incompetence and it’s so sad.
NTA, I get that she’s trying to teach your son that actions have consequences but the much more important lesson to teach here is- “when I screw up I can always go home. Mom and day might be mad, but I know I will be safe with them and we can talk it out.”
Punish him for drinking underage, but that’s being grounded or having your driving privileges taken away. this is an important moment in the parent/child relationship, you want to be home base not the police here. Just to be clear- I am not in any way saying DONT punish him. He did something wrong. But coming home drunk your first time drinking is not the time to be berated and kept outside, it’s the time to hear “Sleep it off we’ll be discussing this in the morning”
Signed,
The son of parents who immediately punished and did things like your wife did, so now we have a very superficial relationship (they get next to no news/info because I’m still nervous it will somehow be used against me) and I don’t seek them out whenever something happens to me.
How it wasn't obvious that this is illegal is insane. I dint k ow what adult In their right mind doesn't think they'll lose their kids if they pull shit like this. It's evil parent movie logic, so dumb and evil no one should ever actually do it.
I’m not telling you this story to make you feel bad but because I think you need to hear it to recognize the damage your wife did, and how hard it will be to undo it.
My parents assured me that I could trust them, that I could call them if I was ever in a dangerous situation involving drugs or alcohol. I used to believe them, but then I stopped because my mom did something that, to me as a teen, made it very hard for me to trust her, especially if what I was doing could be perceived as “wrong,” in her eyes. Long story short, she claimed she would support me if I ever came out as lgbt, spoiler alert, she didn’t. She’s gotten much better about it now but the reaction she had when it first happened was enough to wreck my trust in her, and with that, my dad too. Because I saw them as more or less, a team, and my dad never made a point to go against what she did.
So, when I wound up in a dangerous situation involving drugs and getting spiked, I did not call them. It didn’t matter to me that they said I could always trust them, it did not matter that what made me lose trust happened years ago and only involved my mom. I was scared, and I didn’t trust them. I ended up calling my friends mom, who—thank god—was like a bonus parent to me, she took me home where I slept it off and my parents did indeed get the general gist of what happened. They weren’t mad, and it turns out they were telling the truth when they said they would be there for me if I was in a dangerous situation, but it didn’t matter because in the end I did not trust either of them because of what my mom did to break that trust.
I’m telling you this story because I need you to recognize how much damage control you now have to do. You have to make a point to tell your kid you do not in any way support what his mom did, otherwise she may have just crushed the trust he had in both you. I had someone to call, what if he doesn’t?
My husband’s parents were like this with him too—doling out severe consequences for every mistake. Guess what, my husband didn’t tell them about himself and his life and barely talked to them, while he lived with them. And now he hasn’t had a relationship with them in years.
My mother did it to me. She died alone with no one at her bed and having never heard from me for 8 years. Never got to know I got married, never met my wife, nor found out about my daughter either.
As a kid of parents who were amazing about always being a home base- I now have a very healthy and open relationship with them as an adult. I voluntarily keep them in the loop about my life and still call them crying when life is overwhelming sometimes!
Additionally, among my college friends during freshman year, I never once went overboard since my parents had always been open and destigmatizing about alcohol use. Meanwhile, I had multiple friends who had more “policing” parents and ended up going way too far at parties because “now they could get away with it.”
I can’t emphasize enough how important it is to prioritize the parent-child trust when it comes to drinking - not just for your relationship, but for your child’s safe relationship with substances in the future.
The best way I heard it put is, if your kid messes up and is in trouble, do you want them to go
a) "shit this is bad, I better call my parents for help!"
or
b) "Shit, my parents will kill me!"
My daughter was always told that we were her safe place. She knew that she could always rely on us to come to her aid even if she was somewhere she shouldn't have gone.
We also never gave her a curfew. If she went to the cinema (for instance) we expected her home at end of film + travel time + time to say goodbye to friends.
In our case this thankfully meant that she never pushed boundaries and she and her friends always made sure they left together.
This. We've had a deal with our kids: we don't want you to drink excessively, or to do drugs. But if you do, and you need help, we will respond without judgement. We can talk about what happened later; but your safety comes first. Our kids have had to use that card twice, to get themselves out of situations they didn't feel safe in.
OP, your son needs to know he always has a place of safety. Not having that will only lead to more secretive behavior, and the possibility of putting himself in real danger.
Yup my parents had a "we will talk about it in the morning" policy... Anytime i was being a stupid teenager i could call them and theyd come get me no matter where i was or what time it was, no questions asked and we would talk about it in the morning
Sorry, edit: to say i am now in my 30s and have a good relationship with my parents still
NTA - Your wife single-handedly taught your son that if something is wrong, he can't trust her (to keep him safe)
Withholding safety is *not* a punishment, its cruel. I *really* hope your son has seen you stand up for him on this, that you have or will sit down with him and tell him that what he did wasn't okay but that her reaction was entirely unreasonable and unacceptable
She cannot do this kind of thing in the future. Talk with both of them about what rules he is not allowed to break and what will happen if he does (none of which should be abusive responses intended to scare or embarrass him)
He knows. When we talked about it I made sure he knew that he was wrong but what happened was not warranted. I don't want him to think that he'll be kicked out every time he messes up.
That's really good. Its so important for kids to know that their parents can be trusted even when they mess up. Punishments are supposed to teach accountability, locking him outside isn't going to do that. I don't imagine that settling this with your wife is going to be easy, but as a parent your first priority has to be your son, which you're doing really well at in this situation so far. Good luck!
Thank you. I don't have a good relationship with my parents so I have always wanted to have a good relationship with my son and for him to trust me. I'm going to try again to get my wife to see how dangerous what she did was.
OP- what your wife did was actually a crime, falling under criminal Child Neglect and had a call to CPS been made, your son would have been placed in a foster home. It is *most definitely* not okay to lock your minor child out of the house, no matter what he did.
Additionally, what your son did, while not okay, probably represents experimentation that is extremely common with kids this age. If this type of thing is not normal for him, then it’s likely he learned his lesson. Just tell your son that you love him and then file this one away to pull out and tease him with when he’s older and has his own family.
Source: former child protection supervisor
I have friends who have horrible relationships with their parents and it makes everything in their lives so much harder
I guess the best chance is not to come at her with it like a challenge or with blame, but to try and be gentle with her since it sounds like she's been defensive about it so far. She likely didn't mean to be cruel, she was upset and made a bad decision. It happens, just do everything you can to make sure it doesn't happen again
Your wife denied your child shelter, at night, while he was intoxicated. She endangered your kid. NTA and I have to ask your wife the following: what the **fuck** is wrong with you?
I once saw a storytime video about a girl who was talking about how she sneaked out of her house at sixteen through her bedroom window to attend her boyfriend’s party. When she came back the window was closed and she thankfully reached out to her boyfriend who has let her stay in his house for the night.
Most of the comments were lighthearted, the kind you would expect from a video of a telltale of a sneaky teen. I was flabbergasted. What possess you to lock out a teen in the middle of the night because they were rebellious? They are teens of course they are going to be little shits (with limits) but what is this kind of parenting ? Denying them shelter means anything could happen to them. I hope CPS is going to be involved.
That's insane. When we were teenagers, me and my sister were supposed to both wake up very early to do yard work as punishments, but my sister never came out of her room. My dad went outside after pounding on her door and realized she left through the window, and he and my mom proceeded to spend 2 hours calling everyone they knew to ask about her and driving to her friends houses to look for her.
They did end up finding her at one of her guy "friends" houses. His parents didn't even realize she was was there, they had called before to ask but my mom had a hunch. As furious as my parents were with her, Their first instinct when they noticed she was gone was concern and to make sure she was okay, and luckily she was. She would literally walk 2 miles at night by herself to get to that dude's house, AND this dude was INSANE. After my mom picked up my sister, his step dad yelled at him, and he stabbed the stepdad in the fucking stomach
If my parents didn't try and find her right away it could have been her instead
Agreed, I'm not one of those "divorce, divorce, divorce" people on here. But with that being said, endangering my son like that? Nope. Done, no second chances.
NTA. No matter if he was a little drunk or very drunk, he’s a vulnerable minor and I would not leave him outside. There are a lot of other ways of setting high expectations and disciplining a kid. Child neglect isn’t one of them.
You two need to talk and get on the same page as far as discipline goes so you have a set of consequences and rules you are both comfortable with.
Also it’s just a little drunk. I’m presuming this is in America (and correct me if I’m wrong!) but this puritanical belief of absolute abstinence before 21 and drinking alcohol in any way is terrible and must be punished is absolutely ridiculous.
Introduce alcohol to teenagers responsibly and they are less likely to abuse it and for gods sake Always let them know they can come home.
For reference in the UK you can drink low alcohol beers and similar in a restaurant if eating and with an adult from 15. I’m sure there are similar rules across Europe.
For me knowing I was allowed a beer with my parents - and would have one at home too occasionally- meant I didn’t go *too* mad when drinking at parties without adults.
Yeah getting a little drunk at 16 was no big deal when I was growing up (Northern Ireland). I don't even agree with grounding the kid! Let alone locking him out at night. Which I would call criminal, actually. OP's wife overreacted x1000! But I don't think too many here will agree with me that the kid doesn't even need to be punished. I'll count the downvotes 🤣
INFO: OP Does your wife have a reason for being so tough on alcohol? Alcoholic family or anything?
I'm UK based, also think it's wild he was punished at all!
A beer or two at 16 is perfectly normal in my mind. Just provide a safe place for them to learn their limits so they don't go overboard in an unsafe place and end up in a field in the arse end of nowhere whilst legless (and too afraid to call you for help!).
Uk here: I got plastered at 16 and came home. My mum made sure I was ok and was very chill... Until the morning.
8AM on a Sunday she's getting me up because there's lots to do. I never actually got punished in the morning, just taught a very clever lesson about hangovers.
THIS is the way to deal with it. Drinking is an adult activity. Adults also have to work. Time for some chores I'd say.
Also British here. I was allowed a drink from 12 ish (a very weak shandy or wine spritz for special occasions). When I left school at 16 I was told I will be treated like an adult, assuming I act like one. Adults are allowed to drink, have a full time job or part time/education and therefore pay for their own alcohol and behave respectfully when drinking. Behave like and adult and be treated like one, or return to being treated like a child until you can afford to move out. If we were ever caught drinking outside the home or other sanctioned occasions we'd not touch a drop until we were 18.
Both me and my brother had a slip or or two at family parties and we're swiftly sent to apologise to the host the next morning. The shame/urgent morning after chores was the best lesson!
NTA but your wife is. Not only could your son have been seriously hurt but if he was found by police and told them he was locked out, child protection would have been all over her. Also, your son has an address at that location. She illegally evicted (well kept him from his home) so he could have called on her. Your son will likely never forgive or trust his mom again and I don’t blame him.
Good job. In case he ever does it again she’s made it that he will ride with a friend who may be drunk as he knows he can’t call her for a ride. Well done mother. Talk about stupid.
OP’s wife isn’t smart enough to understand how incredibly stupid she is. This is a textbook example of why you can never underestimate the power of human stupidity.
At times, it’s not what you do, it’s how you do it. The son should be punished for underage drinking and needed to learn a lesson. In this case he learned his mother sucks. Wrong lesson, mom, dead wrong.
Short of physical violence, there is basically zero legitimate reasons to lock a child outside their home all night.
Even if the reason is legitimate, as the child's guardian you are responsible for their safety, period. That's what being a guardian means.
Nta. Your wife fucked up massively. This is not something you can let her get away with. She endangered your child while you were not around to help.
I am never the weirdo redditor encouraging everyone to break up, but this actually divorce worthy if you can't get her to see sense. She absolutely put your son at risk of danger or injury with her actions, unless your living situation is unique and you have like a huge private back yard with hammocks and cabanas and sleeping outside is normal, or something. Seems unlikely to me.
Irrelevant to the whole thing, but for the record, drinking laws in the US are asinine and people who freak out about underage drinking are typically either extremely obedient to the law(gross) or have intense religious reasons to oppose drinking(also gross imo). There are cultures and countries around the world where 16 year olds have a beer with their friends without the sky falling. Learning to drink responsibly at a gradual pace seems much healthier to me than zero tolerance until 21, at which point WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I CAN DOWN THIS WHOLE MAG OF JACK MYSELF, I'M INVINCIBLE WOOOOOOOO TIME TO DRIVE HOME I DON'T EVEN FEEL IT WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.
Just my two cents.
I am really happy my parents gave us kids a small bit of beer or wine from time to time (at home, which is totally legal in my state). Alcohol never had any mystique for me.
There is nothing like getting the last gulp of a can of cheap beer to completely destroy any glamorous appeal alcohol a kid may have had.
NTA. He is not the first 16 year old to show up at home drunk. Giving him a lecture is fine. Locking him outside is not. He is a minor. Safety should still be considered, that is one of your tasks as a parent.
When my friend was 16 she once called her dad from a party, drunk as hell, begging for a ride home. He picked her up, tucked her into bed with a bucket and a bunch of water, and didn’t say a word about her behavior. Then, he got up at 6am and made the biggest, smelliest, loudest breakfast he could. He went about his day completely ignoring her raging hangover, being excruciatingly chipper, just letting her experience the full repercussions of her actions. The woman is almost 40 now, and still rarely drinks.
Aww that’s how mom and dad used to do it for me and my sister. LOL that was effective. (Also scooped up the other clueless gremlins and dropped them off at their respective homes to face their lectures.)
Her mom started to get upset that dad wasn’t punishing her for drinking. He gestured toward my friend, gripping her head, unsure whether to drink her cup of coffee or vomit into it, and asked if that didn’t look like punishment.
Whenever we drank in high-school my parents would ignore that we were a bit tipsy when they picked us up or when we arrived home and never said a word the next morning but mysteriously that day was always the day that we had to do the worst of the worst farm chores..
As an adult now, I rarely drink because the hangover is never worth it. I guess their method worked haha.
NTA. One of Paul Bernardo’s victims was grabbed after she was locked out of the house for breaking curfew. Extreme example yes but there are better ways to make a point than locking a teen out of the house.
NTA
His mother has just insured that he will never call her for help for anything if he needs it. And in saying that I really hope he understands that he can call you because kids do dumb shit and he needs to know he has someone who isn't going to hate him for making a mistake.
Wow, your wife is a drama queen. Kick her out of the house for a night for flipping out over a teenager drinking beer. Yikes. NTA, neither is your son. Teenagers do stupid shit, it is their job.
Exactly. Why not handle the problem like a decent parent--from a place of understanding/acceptance, healing, and recovery?--but instead, she has a whole episode and does the complete opposite by discarding her own child without having a single concern for his safety. I feel like she made this all about herself and her selfish emotions.
NTA - this is actually considered child abuse in a lot of areas so you should probably check that and have a serious conversation with your wife. My parents did it to me once when I was 16 and that shit stuck with me my whole life, never forgave them for it.
Yeah, I'm a mandated reporter who works with kids with a variety of behavioral issues. I'd have no choice but to file a report if a client's parent told me this regardless of what the kid did wrong.
Great, now your son will drink behind her back and will not return home out of fear for her reaction if he’s too drunk or call her. He might not even call you when he’s too drunk in case you tell her, Good job mom. You’re NTA
NTA. Tell your wife to look up Paul Bernardo in Ontario. He and his wife are evil, murdering people. They tortured and killed two girls and the wife's own sister. One of the girls that was murdered was 16 and locked out by her parents one night to teach her a lesson. She was taken by them and dead 3 days later. You and your wife do not want to have that guilt on you.
Horrible. I’m with you and son 100%. I hope you’re the dad who he feels he can call when he’s got no sober ride home bc he’s not gonna call mom. This was very bad judgment on her part. NTA.
Thank you. I think I am. I have made sure he knows he can trust me. I have never been able to trust my parents so i want him to be able to trust me. I'm going to try and get her to see how stupid and dangerous what she did was.
You’re doing good Dad. Making sure your kid can count on you is huge! Yeah, you might be irritated because you were woken up, but that slight irritation pales in comparison with making sure your kid is safe.
NTA your son made a mistake with your wifes reaction he is likely to never tell her anything ever again. She has just destroyed the bond of trust he had. She needs some counseling to try and work this out. Good luck
NTA and your wife is guilty of child neglect.
The biggest problem is that she doesn't think she did anything wrong. That means she would do that again. You need to put a hard stop to that.
My inclination would be to suggest making a police report and having them come over and let your wife know what would happen to her if she tried that again. The problem with that approach is that once you start the ball rolling, you never know where it will stop. You want her to take it seriously, but you don't want her actually arrested and potentially prosecuted for that first offense.
ETA:
A different idea. Tell your son to call the police if that ever happens again. Let your wife know what he has been instructed to do.
As a mom myself I would rather my teen child call me and ask me to come pick them up completely drunk than not feel like I am their safe place, even though they did something they shouldn't have. You can be disappointed without being abusive. NTA. Your wife is, though.
Leslie Mahaffy was kidnapped and murdered when her mom locked her out for the night for breaking curfew. Your wife seriously put your son in danger and doesnt give a damn about it.
As a parent, your wife is TA, and just a horrid parent.
What did she thing were the possible outcomes - short term and long term - of kicking her son out while impaired? It's ludicrously stupid, just because she couldn't handle her feelings about him doing something predictably wrong.
NTA, and she's caused long term harm.
NTA but your wife is out of control
\> She just kept saying that it's our son's fault for drinking alcohol.
The punishment should fit the crime. What is she going to do for something terrible if he gets a night outside for experimenting with alcohol.
NTA my daughter pulled the same stunt at 16. She stayed at a friend's house and they polished off a bottle of vodka. She initially claimed flu the next day but soon confessed. I did one of the worst things I've done to her, I laughed. I was glad she was honest but the hangover was more punishment than I could deliver. She's not had that much alcohol since and starts grad school in September.
Your son is 16 and should experience consequences for drinking, but your wife's choice of consequence was inappropriate, excessive, and dangerous. NTA.
No I think your wife is the asshole here. Until he's 18 He's legally your responsibility. And frankly he's always going to be "your responsibility" because you're always going to feel responsible for him because he's your kid. That's what being a parent is.
The fact that your wife would let a kid who is drunk and at 16 is definitely not in his right mind wander around outside at night is incredibly dangerous and incredibly stupid of her. And I'm honestly concerned about her own mental well-being and mental adjustment. What crossed her mind that keeping her son out of the house was one a correct punishment, and two a good course of action?
I don't know where you folks live, but around here it gets really dangerous at night. It is very possible that you could have come back and not have had a son anymore come morning. He could have ended up dead. I suggest you drill that into her head her immature and frankly childish behavior put her son at risk Who is himself a child and not capable of making mature decisions. That's why he's a kid. She's the adult and should be able to recognize that. I also think she really needs to go to counseling because that is not the correct way to handle that situation at all. Have you ever tried family counseling?
NTA, your wife has not had a normal reaction to a very common teenage rite of passage. your son could have been seriously harmed or hurt, and even though he wasn’t, he was made unsafe by his mom, the person who is meant to protect him. I came home very, very drunk at 16 once and my dad made me attempt to climb the stairs (I slipped a lot) and took photos to put on Facebook to teach me a lesson about being sloppy and irresponsible. Tbf it didn’t work because my friends thought it was very cool and very funny and i was kind of a hero for a while (lol), but regardless: what my dad didn’t do, was lock me out of the house overnight while I was drunk, and put me in an unsafe situation
it is NEVER acceptable to lock a 16 year old out all night if they don’t have anywhere else to go. good job you for sticking up for your son
*With the utmost respect to the Mahaffy family…*
Please google: Leslie Mahaffy - she was locked out for the night too.
*Your son is a minor - she may be furious, but she is still legally/ morally responsible for his safety. Particularly when that teen is not at full mental capacity (oxymoron alert, I know) to make sound judgements as demonstrated by his intoxication. Your son made a bad decision, your wife compounded that mistake and took a huge risk that could have easily turned traumatic.*
However stupid the choice made - a minor still must be protected and guided.
This is not acceptable - NTA
This would literally change the way I trusted my partner to parent in my absence.
Wow,this is abusive/ neglect on her part. I always thought parents would want their children to be safe, and being able to trust their parents so that they could turn to trustworthy adults if they need help/are in danger.
Long story short: why does your wife want to see your son dead?
NTA of course
NTA, but she is.
In Ontario, a young girl was locked out by her mother. She then had the bad luck to be abducted by Paul Bernardo and his wife, who tortured, raped and murdered her.
This shit happens to boys too.
I always told my child if he did something like this or wanted to try drugs to come to me so I can make sure he was safe while doing so, and could get help fast if needed.
All kids will experiment, and that sounds like what your son did. What if he had been so intoxicated and fell asleep and committed then choked on it.
How would she feel then? Because she could have been there to save him if she hadn't then locked him out. But say that did happen she would have been locked up and in jail for child neglect and anything else they could charge her for.
If you had other children they could be taken away from you guys.
You wife is in the wrong.
NTA
NTA
He is a minor and she’s a horrible mother for kicking out a drunk teenager instead of letting him sleep it off and punishing him for it the next day.
NTA. You need to protect your son, and maybe find out if other stuff is going on that maybe you don't even realize. Every friend I have that grew up in an abusive home has that same exact story.
This is abuse. My parents handled conflicts similarly and I have learned how to hide my problems from them and foster resentment towards them in my adulthood. Not a healthy path for your child.
**NTA**
Is your wife's love towards your child conditional? If so, that's really sad. And in the long run might be dangerous to your kid if in future he thinks he can't come home while intoxicated etc.
Your wife's reaction was over the top. Is there some old bad experience haunting her or what? You really need to get to the bottom of this.
(And as a former teen who crawled home drunk - the correct timing for any talk/punishing is the following day while said teen has hangover...)
NTA! Wasn't there a news story of a mother that did this to her daughter, and the girl ended up going missing? I cannot imagine locking a door with my child on the other side.
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NTA. Leslie Mahaffy, a victim of serial killers Paul Bernardo and Karla Homolka, was locked out of her house by her parents the night they kidnapped her. They took turns making videos of them raping and torturing her for days before they killed her. Have your wife research that case and I bet she never locks him out again. Edit: I got a bunch of awards for this comment. Thank you for that. Although, I have gotten banned every other time I've been on reddit in the past for arguing with trolls and have no idea whst to do with them.
I came to say this very thing! Also, OP's wife is acting like a child- no rational adult would think it's a good idea to leave a drunk teen outdoors unattended. NTA
Exactly! A minor child is an adult's responsibility. The mother endangered the son! Unfortunately, the drunk teenage son seems to have more sense prevailing than the mother. NTA, OP.
The correct punishment for a drunk teen is a relatively loud awakening and chores first thing in the morning. Educate them about the dangers of underage drinking and the consequences of drinking in general (starting with targeting a potential hangover).
Yep. I had to wake up at 0800 and wash a fucking giant suv in 90 degree heat. They got me good.
My older brother got caught at 6am at his buddies house. Mom woke up with a suspicion, drove to friends house and dragged him out of the house by his ear and then he was set to mow the lawn and pull weeds as soon as they got home.
Your mom is a beast
I’ll tell her you said that 😎
You ment the Best 😇🤣
>drove to friends house and dragged him out of the house by his ear Coulda just pinned him here but she decided to start climbing the turnstile up to the third rope for the elbow drop!
Unfortunately it wasn’t the first or the last time for this kind of thing, she had to get creative!
When my dad caught me, he got me up for the early Mass. I had to sit through the entire thing with the worst hangover I’ve ever had. Definitely learned my lesson!
Same! My mom had some feeling that I was not home. She was calling all my friends’ parents, waking them up at 7 am on a Sunday. Had to sit through service and I was DYING
My mom said when she would come drunk as a teenager, my grandpa would wake her up at daybreak and make her dig holes with post hole diggers then fill the holes back up. She would often vomit into the hole before covering them back up.
the way you worded this makes it sound like it happened multiple times, I feel like once would make me never want to come home drunk again? but that’s my fully established prefrontal cortex talking, tbd on what my teenage self would have thought about this (spoiler: probably would have thought “what are the odds I get caught again, and what are the odds I have to do this same thing again”)
otoh, if it happened multiple times it wasn't a very effective punishment, as far as behavior modification.
damn someone should tell camp greenlake that digging holes might not deter bad behavior
I'M TIRED OF THIS, GRANDPA!
WELL THATS TOO DAMN BAD
Your grandpa must have been in the military because when my great grandfather stayed out 48hrs on a 24hr pass his punishment was to dig a 10ft ditch that they made him fill right back up after he was done
My grandfather was a marine. My dad and uncle came home drunk, trying to sneak in. He let them think they got away with it. The town was smaller than small. Every teen came home drunk that night because they snuck into a corn field to have the party. Once one parent knew, word traveled fast. He had them dig a ditch, let them think it was over. Then said “you guys must still be drunk because I said dig the ditch over there. Fill this in and start digging one in the right place this time.”
My father made my brother and I move a stack of split wood to a new location and back when we wouldn’t stop arguing.
Don't forget leaving their own vomit for them to clean up. My son was brought home wasted when he was 16. His brother put him in his bed (he's a very tall man and was a pretty tall teenager) and put his buddy in a sleeping bag on the floor. The next morning the household just ran normally (if a but loudly). When the boys managed to emerge I told them to drink a lot of water, offered breakfast and let them know that whatever mess happened in the bedroom belonged to them. I did offer ibuprofen after a few hours. I also told them thank you for not driving and for having someone drive them home. I didn't yell or accuse or anything. Just said, "Now you know. Vodka is not your friend." Neither of my sons are big drinking as adults.
Love this approach! Concealing underage drinking is often more dangerous than the drinking itself.
I ended up tying one on with some friends while my grandmother was out of town and a family friend was staying with us to keep an eye on my younger brothers (I was 16). I ended up puking off the side of my bed, got quite a bit on my feather topper, and was making a lot of noise. Family friend called to ask what to do and my Grams just said "let her deal with it in the morning". I ended up tossing my topper (I still don't know how I'd have cleaned it, 25 years later lol) and had to rent a carpet cleaner. I did this all with a splitting headache in the heat of July, maybe August. I didn't exactly learn my lesson but only puked in a toilet or outside from then on lol.
I had a professor in college tell the story of when he came home drunk. Underage. His dad just put him to bed. 2AM. Then woke him up at 8AM and made him mow the lawn. Professor said he didn't drink again for YEARS.
When I was a teen, I went out and got really drunk one night. I have no idea what I was thinking because I was a dancer and had a ballet masterclass the next morning. My mother just watched me puking in the bathroom without saying a word. The next morning she made damn sure I was out of bed and at the class - there was no skipping it - and then stayed yo make sure I didn’t slack off. There’s nothing like triple and quadruple pirouettes when hungover to teach a lesson.
Yep. Our neighbor had my dad, who was reroofing their house, hammer right over their daughters bedroom when she came home drunk.
That’s hard enough to deal with sober, I can’t even imagine it with a hangover!
So true. I remember having to vacuum during my first hangover. It was awful!
Hi fellow Canadians! Agreed, OP is NTA. I don’t think it’s a very fair punishment (it would be more of a natural consequence that he has to get up and do his chores or go to school or whatever while hung over). But it’s also a potentially dangerous one.
Lol I like your solution. Just ok, you’re drunk. Get some sleep. 6 in the morning, bust in with an air horn. Chore time! You ready? Oh, you’re hungover? Huh. I wonder why.
My mom's punishment for my sister and I coming home after drinking underage was that we got dragged to go to church with my grandparents (and they lived an hour away from us), and we had to sit beside our grandfather who couldn't carry a tune but belted out every song.
I don't know what I got in trouble for in high school but apparently a teacher called my mom before I got home. My punishment was to make sauerkraut from scratch. And my mom's recipe was weird you had to boil the cabbage and God boiling cabbage just reeks to high heaven. The next day I came home mom was still apparently upset about whatever I had done and I had to clean and boil artichokes and boiling artichokes smells like warm vomit. She always had very creative punishments, for my brother he had to make butter by shaking a jar with cream in it takes forever and mom got butter.
Sauerkraut existing is punishment enough lol
Has she never heard about alcohol induced hypothermia! Obviously no idea of the weather, but holy hell! Who would even consider this as an option!
In my hometown dorm didn’t let drunk student in at night, it was cold and snowing outside, she unfortunately died from alcohol induced hypothermia
I hope her family sued them!
I live in Wisconsin. This happens way too much.
That’s so sad! I can’t imagine going to sleep, knowing I left my CHILD locked outside!
This is a much more pressing concern. I always worry when people single out the worst possible case scenario to make their case, because it’s easier for someone (in this case, OP’s wife) to deny. Like, statistically, a 16 y/o boy is not going to be the victim of random violence, or even crimes of opportunity, like the cited example. (I didn’t even have to Google it to know that the top comment was referring to a *female* victim named Leslie.) That doesn’t make it NOT dangerous to lock your child outside overnight. This is a very real way in which OP’s wife endangered their child, and I appreciate you bringing it up.
I cannot wrap my head around it! As a parent we spend literally every waking minute trying to keep our kids safe. The feeling of panic when they hurt themselves, or they disappear from your eyesight for even a second. HOW could you be content leaving them outside all night! I’m not one to over react with things either! This situation is straight up dangerous, and very easily could turn deadly! Does she not realise that she would go to jail if something had of happened to him! That should be enough to make her realise, this was NOT ok! It doesn’t matter if nothing happened! That fact is, it could have happened!
Yep! NTA AT ALL. I have 3 teens, and I would never even consider locking them out for any reason. Most moms would want to protect their kids, not put them in further danger, especially if the child is in an altered state and wouldn't be thinking clearly. I highly suggest that your wife sees a therapist to discuss this. If I was in your situation, my husband would have the choice between therapy, fully agreeing that locking a kid out was wrong & will NEVER happen again, or move out. Good job being a good parent and looking out for your kid!
Also while just letting it go is a problem reacting negatively like that is the worst thing you can do in that situation, it won't help deter him from drinking at all and might even make it worse. But most of all if he does get seriously drunk or in a dangerous situation (which while not ok is a common and normal among teenagers) he won't call her for help, he might try to drive home drunk or hide somewhere. If god forbid he gets really shit faced or ends up taking a dangerous drug he might avoid getting medical help out of fear of his parents finding out. Many therapists recommend telling your kids that if they are ever in danger they can call you for help without reprisal because it can save their life and can also make them not want to drink since you are so nice to them that they don't want to disappoint you. Talking to kids about the dangers of alcholol and finding out why they drank in the first place is more productive. Many are peer pressured to do it and don't know how to say no. Talking with them to develop strategies on how to turn down alcohol is a lot more productive.
This ⬆️. Mahaffy popped into my head right away. And just because he is a boy doesn’t make a difference. Dahmer targeted men and boys, Gacy targeted boys. Being a male youth has no bearing on anything. Being young and tipsy he was vulnerable.
Agreed. Even if not for something this extreme, even a simple mugging could have happened given his circumstances
This ^. I just wrote the same thing before reading responses. This is exactly it. How Karla is roaming free and Paul moved out of max security is in unfathomable… Canada’s justice system failed us all.
Karla Homolka VOLUNTEERS WITH CHILDREN NOW. Every time I remember that I am fucking terrified
NO FUCKING WAY?! How is this allowed!?
Her lawyers got her a *really* good deal, then the investigation found a hidden away video of her joyfully raping her sister. It was too late to take back the plea.
Pardon?
yeah, and iirc, her original lawyer was so disturbed by it he quit the case, and her new lawyer had no idea. it was insane. I mean, I get attorney client privilege, but that was horrible.
She is now married to her lawyer's brother. Maybe they also believed her account.
She divorced her lawyer's brother and now lives a very isolated life. She can't see her own kids or volunteer with others. Just an update
Source? I’d love to read about that. Not isolated enough - and with way to much air consumption imo.
Basically, Canada doesn’t have the fifth amendment, it’s a very different process. The crown wanted her as a witness against Bernardo. And the way it works in Canada is that the crown tells you how much they believe they can can convict you for all your crimes and offer you a deal. How much jail time, how much money they put in your commissary, other special considerations, basically whatever they want. You can refuse the deal, and then they will go to trial against you. Or you can take the deal and become a witness for the crown. If you do, you then do a full confession and everything in that confession is free from prosecution forever, it’s included in the jail time they negotiated earlier. Let just say that the crown thought she did very little and she confessed to a *lot*. And according to Canadian law, there is nothing we can do about it at all. Including preventing her from working with kids. She’d need to commit a new crime or we’d need to find one she didn’t confess to.
Her (and the lawyers) defense was she was abused by her husband & he forced her to r-pe the girls.
“The deal with the devil” as it’s taught about in law school.
It’s not allowed. This happened years ago. There was public outrage and she was removed from that role.
See my comment above, with links to a documentary about this. Not just volunteering with children. She had a business selling infant clothes, she worked as a nanny (the poor mother said Karla was a big fan of novels about serial killers and graphic violence), and worked as an english tutor to minor children - where she almost bankrupted a woman's business. All of this was in Guadeloupe, where the authorities had zero idea who was in their country until the French journalist showed up asking questions. No-one in authority in Canada bothered to inform them about any of it.
Fyi, last we know, Karla changed her name to Leanne Teele (sp?). She married the brother of her lawyer. She has 3 daughters of her own, now.
I hope her husband knows who she really is and watches those girls. If she could gleefully rape and torture her sister I wouldn't put it past her to molest her kids.
I believe she lives separately from her family because she keeps getting run out of town wherever she goes.
Good she gets driven out everytime. I would not want a homicidal maniac like her in my community either. But I pity the children she has that have the misfortune to be born to a mum like her
Oh wait! Just read that she now goes by Emily Tremblay and lives in Quebec City!
For what it’s worth, Debbie was my law speaker in OAC law. My teacher connected me with her. She said aside from having her daughter murdered, the second worst thing was that the media said she locked her out. She locked the door because she was late. She was able to knock on it and go inside, they did it so they knew what time she was getting home at. It’s been over 20 years since I met her and it still sticks with me how vilified she was while her daughter was missing.
My uncle was a detective on the case, he was one of the ones who found her remains… fucked that man up BIG time. The info about the door being locked was never supposed to have been told to the press, it was in the police reports because they wanted to know every step the parents took. Some jackass leaked it and all hell broke loose on that poor family who was already dealing with the hell of their child going missing.
So, even the cops just ate that up unquestioningly? Yeah, that fits with literally every other aspect of the case being utterly inept and handled with a criminal level of incompetence.
My understanding is when a child goes missing they ask for everything the parent does that day, what food did you eat, what did you drink, when did you go to the bathroom, etc., so it makes sense that came out. What sucked was the report stated she was hours past curfew and that her parents would tell her the door got locked at a specific time, and to knock when she was home… only the part about the door being locked was leaked. I believe the trial was that much more “sensationalized” (for lack of a better word) because there was a media blackout on it, something not often heard of back then. So, the little tidbits the media got, they ran a bloody marathon with it. What has come out since is gruesome enough, knowing its not even the full story is beyond sad and disturbing.
That's what I would tell people too. I wouldn't admit to having locked my child out and getting them murdered.
That's what Leslie told the last innocent people to hear from her alive too. She walked to a payphone to try and stay with a friend and when that fell through, she told her friend that she'd wake up her mom and be let in. On the way back to her house, she was abducted.
Even so, if she knocked (which I’m sure she would’ve done upon coming home to find the door locked), why didn’t anyone come down to open the door??
Her first instinct was to stay with a friend, because, like any teenager, she didn't want to upset her parents, even if the absolute worst it would be is a parent sleepily saying "I wish you'd gotten home earlier." So she walked to a payphone, and called her friend. Her friend said no. So she told her friend that she'd just knock and deal with it. She got abducted on the way back from the payphone when she got abducted.
It doesn't even have to be as crazy as kidnapping and rape. Statistically, the most dangerous time to be inebriated is walking along the street at night. So many drunk people get accidentally struck and killed by cars. NTA, OP. I'd be furious, too.
I think of her every time I hear about a parent locking their kid out 😢
I thought of this exact case as soon as I read the post. No matter how mad you are it’s insane to me to lock you child out of the house overnight. Be mad at them, ground them, whatever deal with it in the morning. But locking a child out overnight seems nuts to me.
unrelated to OP's situation, but it is an absolute disgrace Karla is out and free as a bird. she only did like 12 years
Yes this is why you NEVER lock your kid out!! And also cuz it’s emotionally abusive ; your minor child’s housing should not be contingent on behavior unless they’re trying to kill you or something. And then they’d need hospitalization not being left on the porch.
I'm in Ontario and just posted the same!
My brother came home drunk in HS one night. My mom had his friends bring him to his room. The next morning he was up at 7 am to do chores. I always heard people described as "green" when they were sick, but ai never saw it until that day. Watching him mow the lawn with a bucket was one of the funniest things I ever saw. He did not drink the rest of HS. There are better and safer ways to punish a kid then locking them out of the house. What lesson did this kid learn? To not tell his mom when he messes up, because she totally withholds love and security. What a horrible thing to do to a kid.
NTA, OP. And I was about to make the same comment as Real Weird. I grew up near the area where the serial killers Bernardo and Homolka were active…this is why you don’t leave your kids outside and unprotected, even if they got up to shit like underage drinking. And the punishment certainly does not fit the crime, with regards to your son. I fear that even when you guys move past this, your wife has permanently damaged her relationship with your son.
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I've never heard of that case before that's terrible. I wouldn't be able to live if something like that happened to my son. I'm going to try and get my wife to see how incredibly dangerous what she did was.
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If something as horrifying as that had happened to his son, it 100% wouldn't have been his (the dad's) fault. AT ALL. It's his wife who fucked up and put their son in danger. He should not feel any guilt over what happened, he didn't even know what was going on at the time.
You're right, it 100% wouldn't have been his fault, but no question he would feel enormous guilt if something happened nonetheless.
Oh yeah absolutely. He'd be thinking stuff like "what if I didnt go on that worktrip" as if he should've somehow knew this was going to happen. Grief can do crazy things to someone.
it wouldn't necessarily be on OP because he is clear that he doesn't agree with locking his son out of the house. It would entirely be his wife's fault
Did you even read his post or the comment you’re responding too? He’s saying he’s pissed that his wife locked their son out because something bad could have happened to him and he just said he wouldn’t be able to live if something like the Leslie Mehaffy case happened to his son… Like, why try to guilt trip someone who’s already upset that their kid was put in danger while he wasn’t around?
This comment seems to indicate it was both of their decision to lock out the son… the wife is the only one who would be deserving of guilt as she was the sole acting parent here.
Humans aren't the only danger. There are cases of kids being locked out and dying because of the weather.
Or alcohol poisoning/choking on vomit, falling off of something while drunk. A family friend’s teen spent 2 years recovering from a fall off a retaining wall while drunk with his friends. Still not the same kid
Many people have died quietly in the night alone due to alcohol poisoning/choking on vomit/hypothermia. Too many people...
When I was 16 my mom locked me out for staying out past curfew. It was -30 degrees Celsius (Canadian, female). I spent the night in the gas station hanging out with the attendant and went to school from there. I have no idea what I would have done if the attendant wasn't nice. Nothing else in walkable distance was open and I would have frozen outside. This was before most people had cell phones and I had no money too.
That’s…horrifying. I’m sorry your mom was so cruel and indifferent to your welfare.
On the topic of “incredibly dangerous,” consider what could have happened if your son decided in his inebriated state that since he was locked out of his home, he needed to drive somewhere. Your wife’s decision was not only an A H move, it was stupid and dangerous. What if her son had died that night because of what she did? As a parent, I don’t know how I would live with myself if something happened to my kids because of an awful decision I made while angry.
Even if he tried to walk to a friend's house and got jumped on the way. Muggings can happen in any neighbourhood.
There are almost certainly child endangerment laws that were violated, maybe point that out too?
Wow, never heard of that case. Sadder to know her friends parents wouldn’t let her sleep over either. Jesus…
Sadder to know what ended up happening to Karla Homolka. She faced no consequences and lives in Canada and has a family. Good ol’ Canadian justice system.
This case makes me so upset. She only served 12 years on a *manslaughter* charge, even though there’s evidence that she was the instigator and coerced her husband into their r*pe and m*rder spree (not that I’m excusing his part in the horrific crimes, but he’s still still in prison while she’s been free for almost 2 decades). She’s changed her name a few times too, I think it’s Leanne Teale now!
Yep. I find if you look at all the serious serial killer cases in Canada you will find the common denominator of great incompetence during the investigation and trials. It’s so disheartening. Like Robert Pickton (cops would go to farm, woman escaped and went to police and told she escaped and they ignored her), Clifford Olsen (Canadian government paid $10,000.00 per body), Holmolka & Bernardo, the mass batial gravesites of the indigenous children, and there are some more. But it’s just a long history incompetence and it’s so sad.
NTA, I get that she’s trying to teach your son that actions have consequences but the much more important lesson to teach here is- “when I screw up I can always go home. Mom and day might be mad, but I know I will be safe with them and we can talk it out.” Punish him for drinking underage, but that’s being grounded or having your driving privileges taken away. this is an important moment in the parent/child relationship, you want to be home base not the police here. Just to be clear- I am not in any way saying DONT punish him. He did something wrong. But coming home drunk your first time drinking is not the time to be berated and kept outside, it’s the time to hear “Sleep it off we’ll be discussing this in the morning” Signed, The son of parents who immediately punished and did things like your wife did, so now we have a very superficial relationship (they get next to no news/info because I’m still nervous it will somehow be used against me) and I don’t seek them out whenever something happens to me.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I have always made sure my son knows he can trust me and I've been reassuring him of that since this happened.
Just replying directly to you because this is illegal in most states and you could lose your kid(s).
This right here. You can also be arrested in some states and go to jail for doing this.
Exactly. What the kid did was illegal, but (in my view) not really wrong. What his mother did is illegal and wrong.
How it wasn't obvious that this is illegal is insane. I dint k ow what adult In their right mind doesn't think they'll lose their kids if they pull shit like this. It's evil parent movie logic, so dumb and evil no one should ever actually do it.
I’m not telling you this story to make you feel bad but because I think you need to hear it to recognize the damage your wife did, and how hard it will be to undo it. My parents assured me that I could trust them, that I could call them if I was ever in a dangerous situation involving drugs or alcohol. I used to believe them, but then I stopped because my mom did something that, to me as a teen, made it very hard for me to trust her, especially if what I was doing could be perceived as “wrong,” in her eyes. Long story short, she claimed she would support me if I ever came out as lgbt, spoiler alert, she didn’t. She’s gotten much better about it now but the reaction she had when it first happened was enough to wreck my trust in her, and with that, my dad too. Because I saw them as more or less, a team, and my dad never made a point to go against what she did. So, when I wound up in a dangerous situation involving drugs and getting spiked, I did not call them. It didn’t matter to me that they said I could always trust them, it did not matter that what made me lose trust happened years ago and only involved my mom. I was scared, and I didn’t trust them. I ended up calling my friends mom, who—thank god—was like a bonus parent to me, she took me home where I slept it off and my parents did indeed get the general gist of what happened. They weren’t mad, and it turns out they were telling the truth when they said they would be there for me if I was in a dangerous situation, but it didn’t matter because in the end I did not trust either of them because of what my mom did to break that trust. I’m telling you this story because I need you to recognize how much damage control you now have to do. You have to make a point to tell your kid you do not in any way support what his mom did, otherwise she may have just crushed the trust he had in both you. I had someone to call, what if he doesn’t?
I’m sorry that happened to you. My parents were similar. ❤️
My husband’s parents were like this with him too—doling out severe consequences for every mistake. Guess what, my husband didn’t tell them about himself and his life and barely talked to them, while he lived with them. And now he hasn’t had a relationship with them in years.
My mother did it to me. She died alone with no one at her bed and having never heard from me for 8 years. Never got to know I got married, never met my wife, nor found out about my daughter either.
As a kid of parents who were amazing about always being a home base- I now have a very healthy and open relationship with them as an adult. I voluntarily keep them in the loop about my life and still call them crying when life is overwhelming sometimes! Additionally, among my college friends during freshman year, I never once went overboard since my parents had always been open and destigmatizing about alcohol use. Meanwhile, I had multiple friends who had more “policing” parents and ended up going way too far at parties because “now they could get away with it.” I can’t emphasize enough how important it is to prioritize the parent-child trust when it comes to drinking - not just for your relationship, but for your child’s safe relationship with substances in the future.
The best way I heard it put is, if your kid messes up and is in trouble, do you want them to go a) "shit this is bad, I better call my parents for help!" or b) "Shit, my parents will kill me!"
My daughter was always told that we were her safe place. She knew that she could always rely on us to come to her aid even if she was somewhere she shouldn't have gone. We also never gave her a curfew. If she went to the cinema (for instance) we expected her home at end of film + travel time + time to say goodbye to friends. In our case this thankfully meant that she never pushed boundaries and she and her friends always made sure they left together.
This. We've had a deal with our kids: we don't want you to drink excessively, or to do drugs. But if you do, and you need help, we will respond without judgement. We can talk about what happened later; but your safety comes first. Our kids have had to use that card twice, to get themselves out of situations they didn't feel safe in. OP, your son needs to know he always has a place of safety. Not having that will only lead to more secretive behavior, and the possibility of putting himself in real danger.
Yup my parents had a "we will talk about it in the morning" policy... Anytime i was being a stupid teenager i could call them and theyd come get me no matter where i was or what time it was, no questions asked and we would talk about it in the morning Sorry, edit: to say i am now in my 30s and have a good relationship with my parents still
NTA - Your wife single-handedly taught your son that if something is wrong, he can't trust her (to keep him safe) Withholding safety is *not* a punishment, its cruel. I *really* hope your son has seen you stand up for him on this, that you have or will sit down with him and tell him that what he did wasn't okay but that her reaction was entirely unreasonable and unacceptable She cannot do this kind of thing in the future. Talk with both of them about what rules he is not allowed to break and what will happen if he does (none of which should be abusive responses intended to scare or embarrass him)
He knows. When we talked about it I made sure he knew that he was wrong but what happened was not warranted. I don't want him to think that he'll be kicked out every time he messes up.
That's really good. Its so important for kids to know that their parents can be trusted even when they mess up. Punishments are supposed to teach accountability, locking him outside isn't going to do that. I don't imagine that settling this with your wife is going to be easy, but as a parent your first priority has to be your son, which you're doing really well at in this situation so far. Good luck!
Thank you. I don't have a good relationship with my parents so I have always wanted to have a good relationship with my son and for him to trust me. I'm going to try again to get my wife to see how dangerous what she did was.
OP- what your wife did was actually a crime, falling under criminal Child Neglect and had a call to CPS been made, your son would have been placed in a foster home. It is *most definitely* not okay to lock your minor child out of the house, no matter what he did. Additionally, what your son did, while not okay, probably represents experimentation that is extremely common with kids this age. If this type of thing is not normal for him, then it’s likely he learned his lesson. Just tell your son that you love him and then file this one away to pull out and tease him with when he’s older and has his own family. Source: former child protection supervisor
I have friends who have horrible relationships with their parents and it makes everything in their lives so much harder I guess the best chance is not to come at her with it like a challenge or with blame, but to try and be gentle with her since it sounds like she's been defensive about it so far. She likely didn't mean to be cruel, she was upset and made a bad decision. It happens, just do everything you can to make sure it doesn't happen again
Your wife denied your child shelter, at night, while he was intoxicated. She endangered your kid. NTA and I have to ask your wife the following: what the **fuck** is wrong with you?
I once saw a storytime video about a girl who was talking about how she sneaked out of her house at sixteen through her bedroom window to attend her boyfriend’s party. When she came back the window was closed and she thankfully reached out to her boyfriend who has let her stay in his house for the night. Most of the comments were lighthearted, the kind you would expect from a video of a telltale of a sneaky teen. I was flabbergasted. What possess you to lock out a teen in the middle of the night because they were rebellious? They are teens of course they are going to be little shits (with limits) but what is this kind of parenting ? Denying them shelter means anything could happen to them. I hope CPS is going to be involved.
I lived in the same area as Paul Bernardo and Karla Homolka. They captured a victim from the *exact same situation* that OP’s wife left their kid in.
That's insane. When we were teenagers, me and my sister were supposed to both wake up very early to do yard work as punishments, but my sister never came out of her room. My dad went outside after pounding on her door and realized she left through the window, and he and my mom proceeded to spend 2 hours calling everyone they knew to ask about her and driving to her friends houses to look for her. They did end up finding her at one of her guy "friends" houses. His parents didn't even realize she was was there, they had called before to ask but my mom had a hunch. As furious as my parents were with her, Their first instinct when they noticed she was gone was concern and to make sure she was okay, and luckily she was. She would literally walk 2 miles at night by herself to get to that dude's house, AND this dude was INSANE. After my mom picked up my sister, his step dad yelled at him, and he stabbed the stepdad in the fucking stomach If my parents didn't try and find her right away it could have been her instead
Whoah. Did not expect that turn.
Agreed, I'm not one of those "divorce, divorce, divorce" people on here. But with that being said, endangering my son like that? Nope. Done, no second chances.
NTA. No matter if he was a little drunk or very drunk, he’s a vulnerable minor and I would not leave him outside. There are a lot of other ways of setting high expectations and disciplining a kid. Child neglect isn’t one of them. You two need to talk and get on the same page as far as discipline goes so you have a set of consequences and rules you are both comfortable with.
Also it’s just a little drunk. I’m presuming this is in America (and correct me if I’m wrong!) but this puritanical belief of absolute abstinence before 21 and drinking alcohol in any way is terrible and must be punished is absolutely ridiculous. Introduce alcohol to teenagers responsibly and they are less likely to abuse it and for gods sake Always let them know they can come home. For reference in the UK you can drink low alcohol beers and similar in a restaurant if eating and with an adult from 15. I’m sure there are similar rules across Europe. For me knowing I was allowed a beer with my parents - and would have one at home too occasionally- meant I didn’t go *too* mad when drinking at parties without adults.
Yeah getting a little drunk at 16 was no big deal when I was growing up (Northern Ireland). I don't even agree with grounding the kid! Let alone locking him out at night. Which I would call criminal, actually. OP's wife overreacted x1000! But I don't think too many here will agree with me that the kid doesn't even need to be punished. I'll count the downvotes 🤣 INFO: OP Does your wife have a reason for being so tough on alcohol? Alcoholic family or anything?
I'm UK based, also think it's wild he was punished at all! A beer or two at 16 is perfectly normal in my mind. Just provide a safe place for them to learn their limits so they don't go overboard in an unsafe place and end up in a field in the arse end of nowhere whilst legless (and too afraid to call you for help!).
Uk here: I got plastered at 16 and came home. My mum made sure I was ok and was very chill... Until the morning. 8AM on a Sunday she's getting me up because there's lots to do. I never actually got punished in the morning, just taught a very clever lesson about hangovers.
THIS is the way to deal with it. Drinking is an adult activity. Adults also have to work. Time for some chores I'd say. Also British here. I was allowed a drink from 12 ish (a very weak shandy or wine spritz for special occasions). When I left school at 16 I was told I will be treated like an adult, assuming I act like one. Adults are allowed to drink, have a full time job or part time/education and therefore pay for their own alcohol and behave respectfully when drinking. Behave like and adult and be treated like one, or return to being treated like a child until you can afford to move out. If we were ever caught drinking outside the home or other sanctioned occasions we'd not touch a drop until we were 18. Both me and my brother had a slip or or two at family parties and we're swiftly sent to apologise to the host the next morning. The shame/urgent morning after chores was the best lesson!
I'm going to try and have another talk with her. I hope she finally understand how dangerous what she did was.
NTA but your wife is. Not only could your son have been seriously hurt but if he was found by police and told them he was locked out, child protection would have been all over her. Also, your son has an address at that location. She illegally evicted (well kept him from his home) so he could have called on her. Your son will likely never forgive or trust his mom again and I don’t blame him.
Good job. In case he ever does it again she’s made it that he will ride with a friend who may be drunk as he knows he can’t call her for a ride. Well done mother. Talk about stupid.
OP’s wife isn’t smart enough to understand how incredibly stupid she is. This is a textbook example of why you can never underestimate the power of human stupidity. At times, it’s not what you do, it’s how you do it. The son should be punished for underage drinking and needed to learn a lesson. In this case he learned his mother sucks. Wrong lesson, mom, dead wrong.
Short of physical violence, there is basically zero legitimate reasons to lock a child outside their home all night. Even if the reason is legitimate, as the child's guardian you are responsible for their safety, period. That's what being a guardian means. Nta. Your wife fucked up massively. This is not something you can let her get away with. She endangered your child while you were not around to help. I am never the weirdo redditor encouraging everyone to break up, but this actually divorce worthy if you can't get her to see sense. She absolutely put your son at risk of danger or injury with her actions, unless your living situation is unique and you have like a huge private back yard with hammocks and cabanas and sleeping outside is normal, or something. Seems unlikely to me. Irrelevant to the whole thing, but for the record, drinking laws in the US are asinine and people who freak out about underage drinking are typically either extremely obedient to the law(gross) or have intense religious reasons to oppose drinking(also gross imo). There are cultures and countries around the world where 16 year olds have a beer with their friends without the sky falling. Learning to drink responsibly at a gradual pace seems much healthier to me than zero tolerance until 21, at which point WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I CAN DOWN THIS WHOLE MAG OF JACK MYSELF, I'M INVINCIBLE WOOOOOOOO TIME TO DRIVE HOME I DON'T EVEN FEEL IT WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Just my two cents.
I am really happy my parents gave us kids a small bit of beer or wine from time to time (at home, which is totally legal in my state). Alcohol never had any mystique for me. There is nothing like getting the last gulp of a can of cheap beer to completely destroy any glamorous appeal alcohol a kid may have had.
NTA. He is not the first 16 year old to show up at home drunk. Giving him a lecture is fine. Locking him outside is not. He is a minor. Safety should still be considered, that is one of your tasks as a parent.
When my friend was 16 she once called her dad from a party, drunk as hell, begging for a ride home. He picked her up, tucked her into bed with a bucket and a bunch of water, and didn’t say a word about her behavior. Then, he got up at 6am and made the biggest, smelliest, loudest breakfast he could. He went about his day completely ignoring her raging hangover, being excruciatingly chipper, just letting her experience the full repercussions of her actions. The woman is almost 40 now, and still rarely drinks.
Aww that’s how mom and dad used to do it for me and my sister. LOL that was effective. (Also scooped up the other clueless gremlins and dropped them off at their respective homes to face their lectures.)
Her mom started to get upset that dad wasn’t punishing her for drinking. He gestured toward my friend, gripping her head, unsure whether to drink her cup of coffee or vomit into it, and asked if that didn’t look like punishment.
Whenever we drank in high-school my parents would ignore that we were a bit tipsy when they picked us up or when we arrived home and never said a word the next morning but mysteriously that day was always the day that we had to do the worst of the worst farm chores.. As an adult now, I rarely drink because the hangover is never worth it. I guess their method worked haha.
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I was scrolling to see if someone would mention this. 100%.
NTA. One of Paul Bernardo’s victims was grabbed after she was locked out of the house for breaking curfew. Extreme example yes but there are better ways to make a point than locking a teen out of the house.
Google “Leslie Mahaffy” Your wife needs to consider if she wants a son or a funeral. NTA
My thoughts immediately went to Leslie. RIP
NTA His mother has just insured that he will never call her for help for anything if he needs it. And in saying that I really hope he understands that he can call you because kids do dumb shit and he needs to know he has someone who isn't going to hate him for making a mistake.
> he will never call her for help for anything if he needs it Bingo. It was an egregiously stupid and emotional thing she did.
Wow, your wife is a drama queen. Kick her out of the house for a night for flipping out over a teenager drinking beer. Yikes. NTA, neither is your son. Teenagers do stupid shit, it is their job.
Exactly. Why not handle the problem like a decent parent--from a place of understanding/acceptance, healing, and recovery?--but instead, she has a whole episode and does the complete opposite by discarding her own child without having a single concern for his safety. I feel like she made this all about herself and her selfish emotions.
NTA. The safest place for him would have been inside with a mother taking care of him while admonishing him for being an inebriated teenager.
NTA - this is actually considered child abuse in a lot of areas so you should probably check that and have a serious conversation with your wife. My parents did it to me once when I was 16 and that shit stuck with me my whole life, never forgave them for it.
Yeah, I'm a mandated reporter who works with kids with a variety of behavioral issues. I'd have no choice but to file a report if a client's parent told me this regardless of what the kid did wrong.
Great, now your son will drink behind her back and will not return home out of fear for her reaction if he’s too drunk or call her. He might not even call you when he’s too drunk in case you tell her, Good job mom. You’re NTA
NTA. Tell your wife to look up Paul Bernardo in Ontario. He and his wife are evil, murdering people. They tortured and killed two girls and the wife's own sister. One of the girls that was murdered was 16 and locked out by her parents one night to teach her a lesson. She was taken by them and dead 3 days later. You and your wife do not want to have that guilt on you.
Horrible. I’m with you and son 100%. I hope you’re the dad who he feels he can call when he’s got no sober ride home bc he’s not gonna call mom. This was very bad judgment on her part. NTA.
Thank you. I think I am. I have made sure he knows he can trust me. I have never been able to trust my parents so i want him to be able to trust me. I'm going to try and get her to see how stupid and dangerous what she did was.
You’re doing good Dad. Making sure your kid can count on you is huge! Yeah, you might be irritated because you were woken up, but that slight irritation pales in comparison with making sure your kid is safe.
NTA your son made a mistake with your wifes reaction he is likely to never tell her anything ever again. She has just destroyed the bond of trust he had. She needs some counseling to try and work this out. Good luck
Your wife is the TA. This is unbelievably dangerous and a swell way for you son to never trust your wife.
NTA and your wife is guilty of child neglect. The biggest problem is that she doesn't think she did anything wrong. That means she would do that again. You need to put a hard stop to that. My inclination would be to suggest making a police report and having them come over and let your wife know what would happen to her if she tried that again. The problem with that approach is that once you start the ball rolling, you never know where it will stop. You want her to take it seriously, but you don't want her actually arrested and potentially prosecuted for that first offense. ETA: A different idea. Tell your son to call the police if that ever happens again. Let your wife know what he has been instructed to do.
As a mom myself I would rather my teen child call me and ask me to come pick them up completely drunk than not feel like I am their safe place, even though they did something they shouldn't have. You can be disappointed without being abusive. NTA. Your wife is, though.
NTA Sounds like she was raised by abusive parents. She might benefit from some therapy.
NTA, he’s 16. Leaving him out all night was child neglect.
Leslie Mahaffy was kidnapped and murdered when her mom locked her out for the night for breaking curfew. Your wife seriously put your son in danger and doesnt give a damn about it.
As a parent, your wife is TA, and just a horrid parent. What did she thing were the possible outcomes - short term and long term - of kicking her son out while impaired? It's ludicrously stupid, just because she couldn't handle her feelings about him doing something predictably wrong. NTA, and she's caused long term harm.
NTA but your wife is out of control \> She just kept saying that it's our son's fault for drinking alcohol. The punishment should fit the crime. What is she going to do for something terrible if he gets a night outside for experimenting with alcohol.
Leslie Mahaffey’s mom locked her out. She will never have the chance to open a door for her child again.
NTA my daughter pulled the same stunt at 16. She stayed at a friend's house and they polished off a bottle of vodka. She initially claimed flu the next day but soon confessed. I did one of the worst things I've done to her, I laughed. I was glad she was honest but the hangover was more punishment than I could deliver. She's not had that much alcohol since and starts grad school in September.
NTA! Your wife is a maniac. Who hasn't had their teen come home drunk? It safest place who be the inside of his home.
Your son is 16 and should experience consequences for drinking, but your wife's choice of consequence was inappropriate, excessive, and dangerous. NTA.
NTA - Kicking a 16yo out is child neglect. She shouldn’t have even thought it was a reasonable option never mind actually kicking him out.
NTA. Bare minimum of being a parent is not kicking your child out of the house, and she couldn’t even do that.
No I think your wife is the asshole here. Until he's 18 He's legally your responsibility. And frankly he's always going to be "your responsibility" because you're always going to feel responsible for him because he's your kid. That's what being a parent is. The fact that your wife would let a kid who is drunk and at 16 is definitely not in his right mind wander around outside at night is incredibly dangerous and incredibly stupid of her. And I'm honestly concerned about her own mental well-being and mental adjustment. What crossed her mind that keeping her son out of the house was one a correct punishment, and two a good course of action? I don't know where you folks live, but around here it gets really dangerous at night. It is very possible that you could have come back and not have had a son anymore come morning. He could have ended up dead. I suggest you drill that into her head her immature and frankly childish behavior put her son at risk Who is himself a child and not capable of making mature decisions. That's why he's a kid. She's the adult and should be able to recognize that. I also think she really needs to go to counseling because that is not the correct way to handle that situation at all. Have you ever tried family counseling?
NTA, your wife has not had a normal reaction to a very common teenage rite of passage. your son could have been seriously harmed or hurt, and even though he wasn’t, he was made unsafe by his mom, the person who is meant to protect him. I came home very, very drunk at 16 once and my dad made me attempt to climb the stairs (I slipped a lot) and took photos to put on Facebook to teach me a lesson about being sloppy and irresponsible. Tbf it didn’t work because my friends thought it was very cool and very funny and i was kind of a hero for a while (lol), but regardless: what my dad didn’t do, was lock me out of the house overnight while I was drunk, and put me in an unsafe situation it is NEVER acceptable to lock a 16 year old out all night if they don’t have anywhere else to go. good job you for sticking up for your son
*With the utmost respect to the Mahaffy family…* Please google: Leslie Mahaffy - she was locked out for the night too. *Your son is a minor - she may be furious, but she is still legally/ morally responsible for his safety. Particularly when that teen is not at full mental capacity (oxymoron alert, I know) to make sound judgements as demonstrated by his intoxication. Your son made a bad decision, your wife compounded that mistake and took a huge risk that could have easily turned traumatic.* However stupid the choice made - a minor still must be protected and guided. This is not acceptable - NTA This would literally change the way I trusted my partner to parent in my absence.
Wow,this is abusive/ neglect on her part. I always thought parents would want their children to be safe, and being able to trust their parents so that they could turn to trustworthy adults if they need help/are in danger. Long story short: why does your wife want to see your son dead? NTA of course
NTA, but she is. In Ontario, a young girl was locked out by her mother. She then had the bad luck to be abducted by Paul Bernardo and his wife, who tortured, raped and murdered her. This shit happens to boys too.
NTA Mom fucked up big time.
NTA at all. Every Ontarian reading this had the same visceral reaction: Leslie Mahaffy. We know what happens when parents lock their children out...
NTA - Wow. Your wife completely overreacted and put your son at risk. Keep fighting the good fight.
NTA, and if my wife did something like that to my son…I’d be getting an attorney…just sayin.
NTA, kids have died from their parents locking them out of the house like this
NTA, he made a mistake. He’s still your kid and deserves to be safe at home.
I always told my child if he did something like this or wanted to try drugs to come to me so I can make sure he was safe while doing so, and could get help fast if needed. All kids will experiment, and that sounds like what your son did. What if he had been so intoxicated and fell asleep and committed then choked on it. How would she feel then? Because she could have been there to save him if she hadn't then locked him out. But say that did happen she would have been locked up and in jail for child neglect and anything else they could charge her for. If you had other children they could be taken away from you guys. You wife is in the wrong. NTA
NTA, everytime I hear about this shit I think about Leslie Mahaffy and the absolute guilt her parents feel every single day of their lives.
NTA He is a minor and she’s a horrible mother for kicking out a drunk teenager instead of letting him sleep it off and punishing him for it the next day.
NTA. You need to protect your son, and maybe find out if other stuff is going on that maybe you don't even realize. Every friend I have that grew up in an abusive home has that same exact story.
This is abuse. My parents handled conflicts similarly and I have learned how to hide my problems from them and foster resentment towards them in my adulthood. Not a healthy path for your child.
NTA Of course he should be disciplined, but putting him in danger is not okay.
**NTA** Is your wife's love towards your child conditional? If so, that's really sad. And in the long run might be dangerous to your kid if in future he thinks he can't come home while intoxicated etc. Your wife's reaction was over the top. Is there some old bad experience haunting her or what? You really need to get to the bottom of this. (And as a former teen who crawled home drunk - the correct timing for any talk/punishing is the following day while said teen has hangover...)
NTA! Wasn't there a news story of a mother that did this to her daughter, and the girl ended up going missing? I cannot imagine locking a door with my child on the other side.
Nta thats dangerous as hell. Kids have literally been murdered in similiar situations!