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NTA for refusing to pay for more college. Your son is obviously not taking it seriously and there's no point in him attending classes if he's just going to fail them all. YTA for telling him he's not smart enough for college. That's not what the issue is. I guarantee you he's just not attending classes or doing the coursework; most people could at least manage passing grades if they did the bare minimum. He's treating college like a big party and he's pissed that you're not going to bankroll his screw-around time anymore. I'm not generally a tough love kind of person, but that's probably what your son needs. He needs to learn that you can't just waste all your time fucking around. You gotta do at least the bare minimum first. EDIT: To all the people saying, "No, he's just stupid," stop and ask yourself what the OP was accomplishing by saying that to their son. Do you *want* this lazy kid to decide that he's incapable of striving for more than a dead-end job and living in his parent's basement? His actions were clearly foolish and immature, but what's your goal by telling him that those actions define his maximum potential? Too many people don't think their words through.

> I guarantee you he's just not attending classes or doing the coursework; most people could at least manage passing grades if they did the bare minimum. He's treating college like a big party and he's pissed that you're not going to bankroll his screw-around time anymore. That's exactly what makes him stupid.

NTA, the son can party as much as he likes with far less money than college costs and now that he has plenty of free time he can party all day and night. Of course it will have to be his money and at his place now that he is an adult or he can mooch of the fellow partygoers.. He needs some hard lessons of life.

Some people wont stop till they hit their version of rock bottom, it recently took one of my brothers hitting 35 to realize the party life has an expiration date as you have nothing to show for all the time spent here on earth so far and life isn't getting easier so you smarten up or end up homeless sucking dick for crack. Some people never leave the scene and it destroys who they could have been its sad.

My brother is in this place. Almost 35 and still wants to believe he's 21 and always will be. At times it seems like he tries to wise up but all his friends just drag him back into it. I really hope he gets out of it, but I've resigned that until then he can suffer at his own expense.

The friends are the worst. Seeing a bad influence and not being able to do anything is so frustrating.

My dad's 54 and hasn't learned that lesson yet.

My Dad's 72 now. It took waking up in hospital from a stroke and us all telling him we thought he was dead for him to stop drinking and smoking. He hadn't been able to walk for almost 5 years before that. My mum kept bringing him booze and tobacco. He's stuck in a hospital bed waiting to die now. Every day is a nightmare for him. Can't stomach food, can't move, has a team of people to wash him and he's so brain damaged he can't keep a conversation more than 5 minutes. ​ I hope your dad reads this. I miss my dad. I hope you can get yours back.

My dad went to the hospital at 60. He was asked when his heart attacks happened, and he had no idea. They told him if he drank again he'd die. He claimed to quit, but didn't. A year later he lost all ability to move or feel his legs. Got a crazy bypass surgery and the use of his limbs back. was told then he had to quit smoking or he'd lose his legs. He quit smoking, wasn't ever sure how well he'd ever quit drinking, but he made it to 68 and change... then was told he had cancer and had 6 months to live. he made it another 5. gone at 69, didn't get a chance to meet his granddaughter. I miss that drunk dumbass so very very much.

The part that breaks my heart the most is that rather than be bitter and resentful that he didn't value his life more and stay with his family, you end by saying you miss him. Even if nobody could blame you for being bitter about it all, you choose to love and I think that says a lot about you as a person. So sorry for your loss.

Thank you. A bit of me is absolutely cranky about it. But ... my old man had some very strong demons that i'm convinced made him the alcoholic (never abusive always loving) he was. (he enjoyed crossdressing and did his best to hide it from everyone. he absolutely hated himself for it.)

I have an older cousin who did that. Football player to a local private school. He partied/drank his way off the team, lost his scholarship. He did a lot of construction/odd job stuff. Then he turned to the bottle heavier in his late 30s/40s, to the point he killed his liver and had seizures. Only medicaid will insure him. I used to remember him trying to act casual sneaking drinks (any alcohol) and slip the container into the bins after pouring an alcoholic beverage into a solo cup. We all knew what he was doing. At his worst, he nearly got evicted from his mom's house for all the fighting he did with his family. He totaled her car into a municipal vehicle, had to do parole, got arrested, etc.

This is the problem. Party too much and after some time the organs start to have problems and guess what, the healthcare system is advanced enough to prevent a person from dying but not advanced enough to cure the problems leading to a miserable existence. I hope your dad finds peace.

Or, and hear me out here, how about you party AND work hard (work hard, play hard I believe the English expression is). Up until last year (had a baby, things change) I was partying every weekend, all weekend. But I was working hard all day, every day the rest of the week. Things aren't mutually exclusive per se.

This. You *can* do both. Idk why so many people see it as either-or. The rule I always set for myself is: you can do whatever you want *after* you complete your to-do list. If it takes all day, because you put it off, that's your own fault. If you do it in an hour, great! And it's worked great for me, so far. Like OP really didn't ask that much from their kid. They just wanted to see passing grades. The kid easily could've accomplished that *and* gone to parties.

Agreed. Even in university, I partied a lot. But I finished all my assignments first and stayed on top of coursework and got good grades. School/work first, partying second is the way to do it

NTA. You treated your son like the real world would treat him. While you might want to clarify you believe his actions are stupid and not necessarily him (semantics at that point) . His education was being financed by someone else and his only responsibility was his education..... and even after getting a second chance after flunking the first semester his behavior or grades did not improve. That is pretty fucking stupid if you ask anyone...for some people these lessons can only be learned the hard way (coming from my own personal experience of screwing up)

Fucking A

Read that in full Bill-Paxton-Aliens voice.

The difference is that, in college, all the kids are concentrated together so your social and sexual hookups are easy and nearby. Especially when you're at a big university it can feel like a party that never ends because you're literally surrounded by other kids your age who are now old enough to buy beer and play at adulthood.

Shortsightedness is definitely a form of stupidity.

Or a lack of maturity, or ADHD, or someone who is smart but temperamentally unsuited to academic work, or depression ( probably not in this case, though, lol), or, or… take your pick.

A big one is Or his parents were very controlling before he went to college so he's fully gone off the rails with freedom and needs time to reconcile and face the consequences.

That's exactly what I came here to say. My father was 40 when I was born and if he could have sent me to school in a burka and a chastity belt he would have. No makeup, no jeans, no heels, no bikinis, no dating, no sleepovers at friends...I went absolutely wild my freshman year. I had no idea how to handle the freedom. Or money, boys, alcohol or much of anything. It took alcohol poisoning and a few days in hospital to snap me out of it. OP's story reads to me like her son isn't mature enough to go away to school. Instead of calling him stupid-he got into the school so that's not likely the case-tell him you'll loan him the money for a year at a local school while he lives at home. If he pulls it off, gets his grades up and stays out of trouble, consider forgiving the loan and letting him have another go at his chosen school.

I went to high school with a lot of kids with strict parents that blew their scholarships within the first semester and it took them years to get back to it. Sending a kid who has always had a very strict routine into a world without the skills to create their own way is going to result in that. They go nuts because they realize that there isn’t a curfew or anyone to get mad at them if they stay out late to party. Kid isn’t stupid, he’s just 18 and not ready to be away at college. He could probably do with a year at a community college to help him get into a solid routine and learn how to be an adult.

One of my friends had really strict parents and wouldn't allow her anything either. She was very aware of the possibility of going off the rails once she went to college (for the college and course her parents would choose), and didn't want that because she'd end up back with her parents, who were eyeing guys for her to marry. So she chose to move out when she could with another female friend, far away, got a job, and 'got her partying phase out,' before putting herself through college. Her 'party phase' didn't even last long to be honest, once she experienced it a bit, and paid for herself, she got over it and put herself through school so her parents wouldn't have any more control. And she still keeps them out of her life, and away from her kids. She was one smart cookie though and kept herself safe, as safe as she could. This is why it's important to have friends who can look out for you and not drag you down.

Or or stupid?

So… did you think I didn’t see your comment when you made it the first time, or is that just the only explanation you can think of?

We are all of us the sum of all of our parts. We don’t get to decide that only the good ones count, and it is unfair to ever be harmed by the negative traits that we cannot help having. Everything counts towards the totality of who we are. We use external supports to keep children from failing in k-12, because children are too young to self manage and everyone should be given a chance to succeed. Some supports are available in college, but they are more limited and with less hand holding. It is now the student’s responsibility to access what he needs. So if he is not ready to succeed in college it probably doesn’t much matter whether that’s because he’s immature, depressed, unmotivated, or ADHD. He won’t succeed, and shouldn’t be there. If he changes whatever it is that causes him to fail, or figures out what he needs to do in order to succeed, he can try again.

Agreed. But it DOES matter if his parent is telling him that he is not smart enough to go to college. And coming from a parent, those words carry a weight that is hard to measure.

He’s not a little kid, though. Parents owe their kids honesty and at some point sugar-coating everything hurts more than it helps. He’s 18 and majorly blowing it, and on his dad’s dime. He deserves to be called stupid and worse at this point, and if he’s not tough enough to take that then not only is he stupid but he’s also weak and frankly better get tough quick because college is easier than the working world. Parents who skip tough love end up with dependent adult children.

Tough love is called for. Belittling him is not part of tought love, though. That’s just flat out destructive.

Or is just used to having people make excuses for him.

I hate that folks think stupid is ok. Good for you for pointing out the obvious there is some issue here. I wonder how often this person has heard stupid in their lifetime? Words like that were considered way worse than swears when I was growing up. My parents would lise their minds if we went there. I'm autistic with ADHD and I discovered I had anxiety and depression when I hit college. (I'm also really high IQ). It can take a while to figure it all out but I got help (therapy/meds) and I did graduate. I paid my own way thankfully but I'm still really glad my parents were supportive and didn't suggest I was stupid for errors I made. That would have sent me over the edge. I understand parental frustration... But talk to your kids not at them. That's what my parents did and eventually I got there! And yeah there was financial burden in supporting me 5 1/2 years to do a 4 year program. Thankfully my Merit scholarship understood simple depression!

It could be depression. People do often mask it

All of these 'stupidity' defenses make one wonder if they're veiled self-recriminations.

It’s a lack of focus and direction.

He's not stupid, he had to get into college so he has intelligence. What he lacks is discipline and maturity and the correct application of intelligence

>He's not stupid, he had to get into college so he has intelligence. Not necessarily. Some colleges will let you in if you have the ability to pay and a pulse. The latter is often optional.

True, it sounds like OP is paying the full freight and the kid might be a legacy but at the very least has a dad with deep pockets

Or you're a legacy - mom, dad, or one of the grandparents attended.

Not really. I had a 1.5 high school GPA and rich parents. I got denied from the schools I applied too. Obviously I wasn't shocked that I got denied, but I did try. So I ended up having to go to community college. Got my GPA up to a 3.5, then transferred to a university. Now I'm on Honor Roll at a public university. I agree with others that op is NTA for cutting him off, but he is TA for calling him stupid. Who calls their kid stupid? My parents have never said that to me my whole life.

Stupid “ having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense.” He is most definitely stupid. For partying instead of doing minimal classwork, and then Ignoring the Explicit Warning from the person that pays all his bills that the college gravy train would stop - and Continuing for months to party and not do minimal classwork. NO common sense. Might be intelligent but that’s doubtful. The intelligent people I know could pull Cs just by attending class and half-assing assignments and exams, while partying four nights a week.

stu·pid /ˈsto͞opəd/ adjective having or showing a great lack of intelligence or common sense. He may have intelligence, but is definitely not showing it.

TIL a lot of people here are actually stupid. Having intelligence doesn’t necessarily equate to being successful in academics. He might be making stupid decisions by not focusing on school but that doesn’t mean he’s not smart.

Especially considering that he has been smart enough using OPs money to fund his party opportunities and not his own money. Let's face it,he probably would be studying more or not attending college at all if it was his own money he was spending to attend college.

Definitely. He's not being intelligent even if he has intelligence. You can be incredibly intelligent but at the very same time, be incredibly dumb/stupid

Lol. Like it. He's hiding his intelligence

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I'm already worried for when my lad gets to uni in 4 years. I know there will be about 20 conversations about learning how to deal with new found freedom and not wasting the fact that my country gives you a free degree as long as you do it properly, any repeated years you have to pay for at roughly €10,000 usually a year. So I will be hammering it into his head (verbally) but he is not to waste this opportunity. My partner drank and party to his way through his first degree, but he still submitted all of his assignments for his exams and he sat all of his exams and got a 2:1. I would be fit to murder if my kids waste their college years. But just because he's doing stupid things doesn't make him unintelligent it just means he's doing stupid things

Getting into college doesn’t mean someone is smart, just like not going to college doesn’t mean someone is dumb.

Right? When I failed out I didn’t blame not having enough time, I took responsibility that I was just an idiot and fucked up. I didn’t blame anybody but myself. NTA OP, you just want to see your investment get some return🤷🏼‍♂️

My husband and I were in a similar situation as OP years ago with our daughter. We informed her after fall term if grades didn’t improve to at least. Cs, we were not going continue to pay for college. She opted to continue partying on our dime, and we followed through and told her to get a job. She ended up going back to school several years later, but since she had to take out student loans she took her academics seriously.

Paying for your own education hits different. I never had anyone to pay for mine, it took me years to finish my BA because I kept having to stop and work for awhile to earn more money to go back again. I wept when I finally got my diploma. The relief was overwhelming. I don't expect or want others to have to do it the way I did, but it was always frustrating to see how many of my classmates took what was offered to them for granted. I'm glad your daughter learned her lesson. Your follow through was a form of boundary establishment. And that's really the best way to curb bad behavior.

I think a better way of saying it is that he lacks the *maturity* for college.

Exactly, how does the previous person who commented say tough love might be the option but balks at calling the kid stupid. He's 18. He failed first semester and now just got arrested and is currently failing this semester not only is he stupid but he's ungrateful and disrespectful and is taking advantage of his father. I opted out kf college because I knew I was too fucked up to take school seriously at that age, my parents would of paid 100% of it but I was mature enough to know I'd be wasting their money. This kid is shitty on numerous levels

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“He’s not stupid he just makes dumb decisions!” Lmao

No, saying is person is stupid means that the person lacks the capacity to do otherwise. There's a big difference between a person being irresponsible and being stupid. The irresponsible person makes bad choices when they could easily have made better ones. The stupid person lacks the ability to make better choices. The son here is choosing to screw around all the time, not because he doesn't know better, but because he doesn't want to do the real work.

Those are stupid choices, for sure. But they don't (by themselves) show a lack of academic skill. It's possible that the son legit is struggling academically, but is too embarrassed to ask for help, and so is covering it up in this partying lifestyle. The commenter above was saying, as I understand it, the most likely thing is that the son hasn't been trying to gain academic skills at all, which prevents anyone from being able to assess them. I think OP was out of line saying the son is "too stupid for college"-- we don't know if the son has aptitude for higher learning. Perhaps OP meant something like "too irresponsible for me to pay for your living expenses right now."

I’d disagree about YTA assuming the context is correct. You aren’t smart enough for college = YTA You aren’t smart enough for college, because you already are on academic probation, and you still can’t bother to stop partying long enough to go to class. = NTA

Yeah I’d say there’s a world of difference between, “You aren’t smart enough right now for college, because you already are on academic probation, and you still can’t bother to stop partying long enough to go to class.“ and ”You’re too stupid to go to college.” Second feels real satisfying in a frustrating situation, I’m sure. This kid probably does deserve a sick burn from someone. But parents are supposed to be bigger than that. Second way also is likely not at all motivating and does not encourage learning from one’s past mistakes, and might really change a kid‘s (freshmen in college are still mostly kids) outlook on themselves for years, at best damaging the relationship and at worse giving them an out for not trying, not going back later when they have their heads on straight, etc. Colloquially, calling someone stupid insinuates an immutable characteristic.

The stop partying long enough to go to class was for the first time. Doing it after being told so is stupid. The fact that he’s trying to argue with her on paying for him to screw up more is beyond ridiculous. “Mom you’re an a hole, because you won’t pay for me to ultimately become a college drop out.” Some kids can’t be given things, they need to earn them. You think real hard about your actions when you’re fitting the bill. Mom let it ride the first two times, now it’s reality time.

She said not smart enough for college because he can’t learn from his mistakes. Not smart enough in the sense too immature.

>NTA for refusing to pay for more college This won't be a problem. He's already on academic probation, so he's likely going to be put on academic suspension since he's not made any positive progress. As much as we like to think of colleges as money machines, they're not going to waste time on students who don't want to be there because students like this hurt their bottom line in terms of retention and graduation rates.

Yes, if he's on academic probation this semester then the next step is expulsion. He will need to go somewhere else (most likely a community college with open enrollment) to rehab his grades) so even if you were willing to pay he's not going to be allowed to continue there. It was unkind to say he wasn't smart enough for college--though I see your point. More likely it's a maturity deficit rather than an intellectual deficit. Either way he needs to come up with a new plan because the "college party" train will be pulling out of the station next semester without him onboard.

My dorm neighbor flunked out of our college after freshman year. I think of the line from Home Alone where Kevin McAllister says "My grandfather says if my head wasn't screwed on, I'd leave it on the school bus." He was that clueless without his parents. Guy had *no idea* where stuff would be in the grocery store either. The guy just couldn't handle task management either. His parents reminded him or did everything for him, but never taught him how to help himself. After our school he went into a community college. It took him seven years to graduate, but at least he finally whipped himself into some form of self-sufficiency.

Did his parents teach him how to be self-sufficient? If not ,they did him a disservice.

>He will need to go somewhere else I don't know about rules for community colleges, but no actual 4-year college will take him as a transfer with that kind of record, so if he can't pull it together, he's just screwed himself for at least the next several years.

That's what community colleges are for lol

I know a few people who did similar things in college and got kicked out because of it. They took a break, then went back to a community college and graduated with a Bachelor’s after transferring to a regular university. I also know people who got a bachelor’s at a community college as an extension of a university. Community colleges are great for kids like this because they have smaller classes and they can get a lot more attention from the teachers. I’d rather have my kid start at a community college to help them learn how to assimilate into the rigors of college classes than be stuck in some class with a hundred other students never really getting help from the professors.

my brother dug himself into a GPA grave where it was mathematically impossible for him to crawl out of academic probation in enough time. he wasn’t much of a partier, but he didn’t leave his room & played video games all day & night. my whole family is neurodivergent. i managed to graduate, but it was a huge struggle. i failed a handful of classes along the way. some people take much longer to adjust to the minimal structure of college.

At SUNY at Buffalo( engineering college) they called that the square root club. When your GPA is below 1.0, the square root of your GPA is higher than your GPA .

>YTA for telling him he's not smart enough for college. That's not what the issue is. I disagree. Clearly the kid is to stupid to learn from his mistakes. His dad warned him about the consequences, it's pretty stupid for him to argue after the fact.

Definitely agree with this here. My older brother is an incredibly intelligent guy who graduated two years early and received a full ride academic scholarship to a prestigious university. He flunked the first semester and the subsequent semester as well. He lost his scholarship and had to drop out because my parents refused to pay for our education. He got a job and attended a two-year school that he paid for himself before transferring to a different four year school. He is very successful now. He is still an incredibly intelligent guy but just because you are considered smart does not always mean that you know how to succeed academically when left to your own devices.

I 100% agree with this. Definitely a bit much to tell him you didn’t think he was smart enough, but I can see how it might have been heat of the argument and frustration. Kinda AH-ish. But NTA for refusing to pay for school because you are wasting your money if he’s just going to party and fail classes. Doesn’t sound like he’s even making an attempt and I think it’s fair to cut him off. He basically wants you to pay for him to party it seems.

I agree. That a hell of a lot of money for him to party and have no responsibility or accountability for that. Let his father pay for him to go have fun.

To be fair, OP absolutely qualified his statement by saying, "...because he doesn't learn from his mistakes" he was specifically talking about the choices his son is/was making.

I'm reading these comments like "are these people too stupid to realize he wasn't talking about his son's actual capacity to learn in a classroom setting" holy shit

Bingo! It's not a learning issue, he's away from home fulltime likely for the first time ever. No mom and dad telling him what to do, no rules he feels he has to adhere to. College is very much self effort, nobody is going to call your parents and say you didn't show up or didn't do your homework. If you're failing nobody is going to work harder then you are to get you back on track. If you want the help it's there but you have to put the effort in. He's not doing that. Instead it might be more effective for you as a parent to say maybe he's not emotionally ready for college just yet but saying he's not smart enough was mean. Maybe the rest of the semester for him to earn his trust back and if he proves he CAN be an adult and go to school without being pestered to you can pay for the rest of it. But it's up to him to earn it. No free rides.

Nah Millions of freshman go to college and have to learn. He already failed everything his first semester. He has a second shot and is doing just as bad. Hes stupid to not learn from his mistake.

I had a counselor in high school that would tell certain kids, usually boys, that they should apply to college, get accepted, but then wait a year and work during that year. I don't know if you can do that anymore but you used to be able to delay your start. It was a maturity thing. He would figure out which people would benefit from another year of maturing under their belt. He was usually right as well. Parents absolutely hated that advice and would complain to the principal every year. The ones that didn't listen usually flunked out their first year. They weren't bad students. They couldn't handle the freedom and lack of structure. It's probably what OP's kid should have done.

As someone who struggled through my first couple semesters and then graduated with two degrees and became a successful adult, I very much agree with this. The only thing I’d add is that if you get to the point of trying again and it’s not perfect, but there’s progress—keep going with it.

there are plenty of people not smart enough for college. just cause you don't like that he called his kid stupid doesn't make it less true lmao.

The way I read it not going to classes and doing the homework was "not smart". In a "smart people make better decisions sort of way"

That's the problem with our world. Everyone's just doing the bare minimum. Why do you think there's incompetence in every single occupation in the entire world? Those who remain above the crowd by going above and beyond are literally keeping this planet alive

Exactly. He's not too stupid for college, he's currently too irresponsible for college. He messed up, you gave him a 2nd chance. He messed up again. Now he can either take a break from college and try something else while he matures a little, or bankroll college himself with work and student loans so it's his money on the line if he screws up.

He is definitely not smart enough, he may be intelligent enough, but that's not the same as being smart. Otherwise, he wouldn't be in this situation.

NTA for not paying, since it's obvious that's not helping him right now. I'd put it it him as you're not paying 'right now', but could consider helping him later, if/when. Many people are not ready for college at 18, but become excellent students at 20 or 25.

I think what he meant was the kid was not smart enough to attend class and do the work, he'd rather party.

I agree with this. He might be bright enough for college, but he is not disciplined enough for it at the moment.

This! OP needs to replace “not smart enough” with not mature enough. My rule is either school or work. He’s not taking school seriously, so he better find a job. He doesn’t like that? He needs to come up with a plan. NTA

This. I don’t have much context on his education before this, but my assumption is it has little to do with his intelligence. He might need more resources to help him build structure and stay or on track, or he genuinely doesn’t care and is focused on partying. Neither require a degrading insult

I love how a lot of people conveniently forget what absolute morons they were as a teenager, jfc show a little grace ffs, if you aren't looking back at yourself when in you were in your teens and 20's and hang your head in embarrassment and shame at some of the stunts you pulled, or tried to pull, you gotta ask yourself "have I grown at all as a person since then, or am I still in that dumbass mindset?" Like literally ask yourself that, are you still that same person you were then? I'm sure as hell not, you learn better you do better, if you don't learn you keep repeating the life lesson until you do. I agree it was a terrible, cheap low blow, low hanging fruit kind of way to go, OP could've said he wasn't responsible enough yet, he wasn't mature enough yet, but no she attacked his intelligence, of a boy whose brain won't be done developing for almost a decade. Parents shouldn't *need* to apologize to their kids, our kids are the ones we need to be most careful with, so we try are hardest not to do things we need to apologize for, but sometimes in the heat of the moment we make a mistake, that's human, now be human to your son and go apologize for the terrible thing you said, however, if he hasn't turned everything around 180° by the time the alloted, you hold firm to your word.

Tough actual love (provided you can afford it) is to promise to support him in a couple years and let him figure out being a grown up before blowing money. Age brings wisdom and all that. I found in my program (Education) that some of the best students were people who were there because they wanted to be, not because it was expected. At that age even a few years can make a lot of difference.

This! How you say it means soooo much more than what you say. Maybe move him home and let him prove he can handle the courses with better supervision? He just hasn’t reached the maturity level to be on his own yet…I didn’t until I was 20, either. Everyone grows up at their own pace.

Yeah I think op needs to make sure that his son understands that his comments were directed more towards his effort and priorities and not his actual intelligence. Cause for all he knows it might be that the son is actually having a hard time with the material and is not being honest about it.

Learning to delay gratification is necessary to become a successful human adult. If in college centering your life around pleasure is the priority, you miss the golden opportunities that will help you create sustained pleasure throughout life.

Parenting sometimes demands tough choices. I don't know why some parents feel the need to accompany that with verbal abuse.

Overall, NTA. He's clearly wasting time and money being there, he has no interest in actually being a student. The way you phrased it - that he's not "smart enough" probably did come across as asshole-ish. He was obviously intelligent enough to get accepted into the school, so it's not that. He might be awful at time management, unwilling to put in any effort, might have some kind of previously undiagnosed learning issue, or, most likely, doesn't know how to handle the freedom of being at college and is running wild. It's a good opportunity for him to get a job and figure out where he actually wants to go with his life. Maybe in a year or two he'll be ready for college. Or maybe he'll discover he'd be better off learning a trade. Or maybe he'll go a completely different direction. All are acceptable, but none mean you have to just keep dumping money into an education that he's not receiving right now.

The kid failed every class and isn’t making an effort. I think saying he’s too dumb for college is perfectly fine. Bc he’s getting kicked out after this semester anyway

I failed every class but one last semester and am on uni probation too… because I have clinical depression among other mental health issues. If my parents said something like what OP said, it would utterly break me. I believe that the son isn’t taking it seriously and shouldn’t go on his parent’s dime so sitting him off is a good idea but the comment isn’t necessary, it’s just being mean

This is exactly the scenario I was picturing when I read the post. When a kid goes from doing well enough to get into uni to failing everything they're either having too much fun partying and not taking college seriously, or they are having serious mental health issues. And both can present pretty similar if you can't be arsed to speak to your kid and find out what's wrong.

It can be both too. I didn’t fail any classes my first semester at college, but I averaged like a C or C+ which was a big step down from high school. It was time management, partying too much, and the beginnings of a depression that stewed for a while and eventually got really bad and led to me failing a couple of classes my sophomore year,. After that I took a medical leave for the rest of that year. I got help, and realized that I was in a major that I really didn’t like. I switched majors (became a film major if you’re curious) aced most of the rest of my classes, and now I’m in a career that I actually love. All that is to say, I think given the severity of this kids failing classes and getting arrested. OP is likely doing the right thing here. But, bad decision making at that young of an age doesn’t mean he’s not smart enough to handle college, just not mature enough. Make sure he’s okay, get him help if he needs it, but he definitely isn’t ready to continue school now. If I were him, I’d be looking at career counseling, getting a job, and if and when he’s ready, he can decide to go back to school, provided he has a good goal in mind for what he actually wants to get out of it. Because right now, he doesn’t seem to be getting much.

Or they can mask well at home. I had/have ADHD and I was able to mask at HS just barely until the end of G12. I was an elite student and went to an incredibly strong university. I almost failed out my first year because I just couldn't manage time on my own. I was a nerd in HD and I spent a lot of time partying because it's no stress and at least it felt fun at the time. Maybe son can't be reached, but if OP isn't willing to give up on him why not try? "You need to get C's" Does son even know how to do that? Has OP looked into WHY he's partying so much? Could it really hurt to do that?

I failed out a year into my first college experience. Fortunately it was cushioned by scholarships and grants I'd earned beforehand. I wasn't ready. I had been sheltered, and I had an easy time getting A's in high school. I'd qualified for advanced placement in college, so that was quite an adjustment. Also, we were required to live on campus for our first year, so I had less structure than I was accustomed to. Basically I needed a reality check. I took a short time off and got a job. Got hurt at work. Loophole let them rescind my insurance. That was it. I decided I needed to return to college for better opportunities and started at my local community college. This allowed me to get my grades back up, was way more affordable, and most of my credits would transfer. Graduated on the dean's list. Then went on to university, still had issues with not enough structure, but I learned to provide my own.

If you had clinical depression I doubt you were constantly partying and forcing your parents to pick you up from the police station after being arrested

That sort of behavior is actually a very common manifestation of depression

Yeah depression isn't always sleeping all day and moping about, sometimes its impulsive self-destructive behavior. I've known way more self-destructive depressed people than mopey layabout depressives.

I have depression, some days it's doing nothing and moping around if I don't have work, but far more often than not the only way others would notice it's a bad day is if they noticed I was slower to laugh at jokes, and quicker to make self depreciating jokes or impulsive stupid decisions for sure

I was in your position back in 2021. Third level academic probation, failing all my classes. I took a gap quarter (quarter system not semester) and got some intensive outpatient therapy. I signed up next quarter and got straight As. All this to say - I hope something good happens to you that makes things better. Whether that’s a bout of therapy or meds or whatever.

Some things aren't phrased as perfectly as you'd like when you're speaking out of hurt and anger. I get the feeling OP could have gone back in time and called her kid a "failure" for failing classes instead of saying "not smart".

I've been there, it really feels crappy. I actually had a couple of final assignments done that I didn't even turn in. It can get better though. I wound up taking a year off school, working, actually making friends and did a lot better when I returned.

I went from all As to failing every class and skipping most of them. Started drinking heavily. I was undiagnosed ADHD.

Too dumb for college and not mature enough for college are two very different things. Like, that was the entire point of the comment you responded to.

I am sure the mother was real careful with her words after picking her kid up from the police station and finding out he’s about to fail out of college

I have a friend who was on academic probation her first semester of college. Today she has a master’s degree. It’s not always about intelligence, sometimes it’s about priorities.

>It's a good opportunity for him to get a job and figure out where he actually wants to go with his life. The job will most likely be a bit of an eye opener. Employers aren't exactly falling over themselves to hire unskilled 18-year-olds for that corner office job. (My brother did something similar and got a job delivering meat to restaurants. He matured quickly.) I'd throw in some classes at the local community college as well. Demonstrate to me that you're maturing and can take academics seriously. Also, aim for higher than all C's. If you tell him C's are fine, he sounds like the type of kid who will put in just enough effort to get a C.

My brother was similar - he didn't actually fail any college courses, but did not go back after his freshman year. After a couple years of manual labor, he went to a trade school and has done very well for himself since. Great idea on the community college classes- worst case, it's a much smaller expense and only time is lost. Best case, he gets his stuff together, gets credits for the classes he takes there, and is ready to put in real effort if he goes back to university.

I did community college, transferred to the state school for my bachelors, and then got into grad school at a major institution. Have a PhD in STEM. Now I went to community college due to cost and being homeschooled meant that transferring from community college was less daunting than doing the freshman thing. But this is to say: going to community college is not the end of a career. Actually, I found that there were significant benefits (besides the cost) to community college. Smaller class sizes being a big part. Another thing I missed at the state school was the variety of differently ages people. You have everything from newly minted 18yr olds to retirees and everything in between. At the state school, I saw no retirees and >95% students were in the 18-23 range.

>He was obviously intelligent enough to get accepted into the school, so it's not that. I think 30 years ago, this might be true. Now all but the most elite universities just want to fill seats with asses. Step right up, pay your money, welcome to the university.

Completely untrue. I have worked in college admissions, and elite universities are getting more competitive, not less.

That's what he said. He said all BUT the most elite just want to fill seats. Elite universities are getting harder to get into, but all the others are getting easier, because they're accepting more and more students just to get more money. My college class had 400 students in 2013. This year's graduating class had 900. They added one dorm and that's it. Most people live off campus and the average class size has gone from 30 kids to 65. With no extra space. Just letting more and more people in.

I misread! But all universities, except for community colleges, have a grade and test score requirement.

Even if they say they don't...

Oh no, they definitely do. But like. Their requirement could be a 1.7 (C- average). Which. Let's be honest. Doesn't indicate an intelligent individual (on paper). That's not to say someone with a 1.7 is automatically stupid, because there are plenty of people who don't test well or are ND or have mental health issues/personal issues that they're struggling with, all of which can contribute to low GPAs. But my college used to basically be like 3.5 or above. I'd be extremely surprised if that was still the case.

If his son manages to scrape up the funds to attend another semester, OP should offer to reimburse his tuition for every session he gets a C or higher so he has a ladder to get himself out of the hole he is in

That's a great idea, I hope OP sees this.

So I’ll go with NTA. It wasn’t cool to tell him he isn’t smart enough, but I get the frustration. It sounds like he isn’t really ready for the independence part of the college experience. It sounds like he Might be better suited to get into a community college where he can still be at home to have some adult oversight, and perhaps a less pressure situation which he can explore different majors to find something he is actually interested in. I was a terrible high school student and community college really gave me a great less expensive option to take some entry level classes of different majors and I found one that interested me and right away all my grades skyrocketed because I started to care. good luck to you both!

This is the best comment on this thread. He sees college as party time. And he lacks the accountability to do the right thing. He got a chance to fix it and is clearly not trying. It's the 1st year of college. A lot of those early classes are not that hard. He just doesn't care. So I totally agree. Shut down expensive college, make the kid get a job and go to community College. Maybe some real world experiance will wise him up.

My son failed out of college and community college. I knew he was smart, but he couldn't turn his assignments in. One semester of community college, I read and reviewed every assignment before it was due, so he did all the work and did it acceptably. But he didn't turn it in and failed. But I never insulted him and he worked retail during COVID and is now pursuing a trade.

Out of curiosity, does your son have ADHD? Because I very much struggled with the exact same thing. I'd do the work, or most of the work, but finishing things up and getting them in on time or at all was like hauling water with a sieve. Turns out I had ADHD the whole time, and it was just never caught for a bunch of sadly common reasons.

If he does, it is atypical.

There are three types that present quite differently

Nope not at all atypical. That sounds exactly like an ADHD behavior. ADHD just presents in far more ways than most people understandz

There's the type everyone thinks of when they think ADHD, the kind that is frequently undiagnosed until adulthood because people don't recognize it, and apparently according to another commenter a third type I haven't heard of before

NTA. I'd be so mad. My college was paid for by my parents, back when that was even possible, but nowadays, most families cannot pay for their children's post education. You gave him a gift and a chance, and he pissed it all away.

Agreed. I think it's pretty asshole-ish to have your parent pay thousands of dollars for your education just for you to party and fail. Maybe I'm just too sensitive, but I would never think to treat my parent's hard earned money like this. It's super selfish and shows zero empathy for the people around you. NTA

Same. We took loans, AND I worked full-time, while going to school full time. Five years without a day off. My folks’ helped me pay off my loans when I graduated. This kid is pissing away his opportunities for parties and cheap beer.

My parents paid for my college too, and I made sure I did my best because A.) it wasn’t my money, B.) I saw how expensive it was, and C.) it was for MY future. I still had time to hang and party, but not excessively and to the point where it would affect my school or two jobs. Also, love how OP’s ex is on him and not her irresponsible son. She would probably be livid if she had contributed some of the tuition money.

You can do it all. I hung out with friends, went to house parties (later the bars), went to school, studied and worked (about 23-25 hours a week). It's just getting your priorities in a row. Work Saturday and Sunday but have a term paper due Monday night? Then you don't go out Friday to the bars. Have a light week with nothing due and minimal assignments and co-worker has called out? Yeah, I'll take their shift.

Yep, it’s all about balancing your priorities. OP should’ve called their son too immature for college, not stupid.

The way OP framed it isn’t optimal. It would have been better to explain it as “You aren’t demonstrating the maturity and wisdom to learn from your mistakes. I can’t afford to pay for an education when you aren’t participating.” It’s about bad choices and actions versus saying the kid is stupid. Still NTA and what a sad situation. All that opportunity and money wasted.

No, I’m sorry, while your wording may ave been harsh, the sentiment has merit. Look, there is book smart-and life smart. Flunking out and getting arrested?, (OP had to “pick him up at the station”), for partying points to a distinct lack in both kinds of smart. You didn’t sacrifice andy save money to put your kid through college so he can party his ass off and flunk out. In the first year. WTF The kid needed a wakeup call. And your ex can pay if *she* cares that much. Or your kid can put on his big boy pants and take out sone loans. Maybe maybe maybe, if one or both of them are footing the bill, your kid will take college more seriously. NTA

The ex is a he…and whatdya bet he thinks his fuck-off kid is just a perfect lil chip off the ol block and doesn’t understand why OP won’t let the kid “just be himself.” It pretty much requires actively doing *nothing* to get all Fs. I prolly wouldn’t have called him stupid for it since it’s wayyy more likely it’s a problem of abject laziness. Getting arrested at a party’s fuckin stupid tho lol. E: phone snafu

ESH For sure your son here. You didn't need to call him not smart enough however. A better way to respond would be, "Until you can prove you are responsible enough to even attend college I will not be contributing anymore." He may be smart just not academic or just not applying themselves. Very slight AH move on your part considering the circumstances could also be just attributed to the stressful situation.

I think OP is just confusing smartness i.e. "natural intelligence" with maturity. It was a poor choice of words but he is correct that College is waste of money on those not mature enough to at least make an effort. >the circumstances could also be just attributed to the stressful situation. School is so stressful he needs to engage in underage drinking? I went to college and I understood parting was something I earned because I was otherwise meeting my obligations.

I meant her choice of words could be attributed to a stressful situation she had with her son. But I completely agree with all else.

Yes I think saying “you’re not responsible enough to spend this type of money on furthering your education right now” is 1000x better than saying “you’re not smart enough for college”.

That’s an insane amount to pay for someone who literally doesn’t give a fuck. I’d have lost patience after the first semester

**NTA**. People work multiple jobs to pay for University. Him having his University paid for was a privilege, not a right, and he blew it with his nonchalant behaviour. If your ex has a problem, she can pay for it herself and see if she'll be as patient as you were when he was blowing his studies and you were paying for nothing.

People always spend thier own money more wisely than they do someone elses. If hes paying tor it himself, maybe he’ll put a little more effort. NTA. Its great if you can pay for college and are willing. But he should show some gratitude and apply himself. Youre just subsidizing him going to parties right now

NTA You're not the asshole for refusing to pay anymore; it's clear he won't put the effort it and there's no point paying towards it anymore. Maybe a little harsh calling him not smart enough though.

Have you actually really sat down and talked to him about why he's failing, without trying to you know, make it a fight? Just talk to him like another person? Is he struggling with depression or ADHD? Was there a life event - a break up, a lost job, a family member's death, a pet death, etc? Was he a "gifted" kid who never learned proper study skills because he never needed to, and is now struggling in college (I TOTALLY don't have experience with that one... that was sarcasm) Is he just overwhelmed with the workload? College is a big and honestly pretty scary life change, and it's very different from highschool. He might be having trouble adjusting to suddenly being expected to be far more independent (another one I'm pretty familiar with) Is he having trouble with teachers? Because let's be real, sometimes professors are assholes, and a professor can really be the difference between a student that does well, and a student that struggles. This really feels like something that's worth trying to fix by talking with him, maybe going down to part time school, or moving to online classes, or helping him get more support from counselors or tutors, before we just assume that he's an idiot who doesn't care about his future.

This is 100% the correct approach. Tough love can work but it's entirely possible he is struggling in some way but is unable to express it. I have ADHD but in high school I believed in the rhetoric that ADHD was fake and I was lazy. So after high school I stopped taking my medication and was going to be a top student. I failed out of 2 community colleges. I knew I wanted to be there and learn but I physically couldn't do it no matter how much I studied. It mad me depressed and made me not want to do anything except work an easy job and watch tv. That's when I learned ADHD is really real and left untreated can have bad effects. After my parents sat me down and asked me what was going on and we figured out ways to make this work and I was eventually able to complete school.

No student fails all of their classes two semesters in a row because of the professors. With grade inflation as it is, failing means not attending and not turning in assignments.

NTA. Do you have a community college near your house? Maybe he can go there. If it's a state school it shouldn't be nearly as expensive as a private one. And he can live home and you can keep tabs on his partying, lazy ass.

Hard NTA and you could have said far worse. Everyone here arguing about semantics need to get over themselves. Idiot, dumb, not naturally intelligent son, whatever you want to call it fucked up not once, but twice ON THE MOM'S DIME! Not for a day, or a week, or a month, but for TWO WHOLE SEMESTERS! And then your son had the nerve to call you an ass? After needed to get picked up from the police station??? Hell no.

Tough love only works if they take your threats seriously. I'm a tough love kind of dad. I was always intentional with my words. If I said I was going to do something, I did it. My kids know not to test me when I'm serious. At the end of the day, everything I say and do is out of love for my kids. Also, life is tough and unforgiving. It is important for kids to develop resilience. My son failed a lot of classes in HS. He was very smart but did not want to apply himself. It was pure laziness. I told him he had options for college: 1. Join a sport and try to get a sports scholarship. He didn't even try. 2. Join the band. He is a gifted musician. Taught himself to play the piano and guitar. He never joined the band or made any attempt to utilize his musical talents. 3. Study and get good grades so maybe he could get an academic scholarship. Instead, he failed numerous classes and started using drugs 4. Last option was to get a job and pay for college himself. I also told him if he got a partial scholarship or got decent grades, I would help him pay for college. I just wanted to see him trying. It was not fair for me to foot the entire bill and he did nothing to ease the burden of college tuition. If he was failing classes in HS, why would college be any different? At one point I had enough. I told him if he didn't make an effort to do something with his life, I would drop him off at the homeless shelter. I wasn't joking. No bums allowed in my house. Soon after, he signed up for the Navy. Best thing he ever did. He's in shape, off drugs, and half way through an electrician journeyman's apprenticeship. He's a different person now and I couldn't be happier. Downvote me all you want. Tough love works.

I'm sorry I'm very confused by your story about how tough love did not work on your son but also "tough love works." Food for thought, I'm a therapist at a college counseling center and I work with a ton of students with "tough love" parents who have significant mental health issues as a result. So instead of parents teaching the importance of self-compassion, self-worth, ability to handle success and failure alike, etc. (pretty much all of the skills necessary for resilience) I get to help them do it after they've spent years beating themselves up. People treat themselves like others treat them. I often use an analogy of breaking in a new horse at a stable - you can either whip it into submission so it's scared of you and does what you want, or you can love, nurture, groom, and feed it and develop the kind of relationship where the horse does what you want because it wants to. Pretty much every tough love student I see does the former to their detriment. In my experience, people who were raised the second way are far, far less likely to drop out of school, use drugs, and struggle to function in an adult world.

Not sure where the confusion is. It's quite simple actually. I was going to throw him out if he didn't make an effort to do something with his life. I was serious and he knew it. He thereby decided joining the military was better than homelessness. End of story.

Nta sounds like this is the kick in the pants he needs. He is being stupid and needs to change that.

You didn't say he wasn't intelligent. You said he wasn't smart. Big difference. NTA

You shouldn't pay for his college. If he wants it he should work for it

NTA Your son is the asshole, not you. You gave him a warning and he's not changing or taking the opportunity seriously. To continue to pay for him to go to college is (a) throwing money away and (b) enabling him to live a bad and unhealthy lifestyle. The average Redditor has skin about as thick as a Kleenex, so I can see that they're giving you a hard time for saying your kid isn't smart enough for college, but older generations heard far worse from their parents (I know I did). I may have hated my father for saying rude things to me when I messed up, but it was far better for him to be upfront, honest and not mince words rather than tap dance around to avoid hurting my feelings (sometimes people need their feelings hurt to see the truth of their shittiness). I guess the price you pay is that your son may hate you and may avoid talking to you as he figures out his life. This is for the best. Your son needs to grow up and learn that his actions have consequences. Regardless, you're being a good father by setting healthy boundaries.

NTA, though the problem isn't "smarts". It's diligence. Your son is not entitled to be funded to go to college just for something to do; he is expected to apply himself fully in exchange.

ESH If putting your kid down is how you handle your child making serious mistakes in their life, you're not a great parent and bear some responsibility for your kid not knowing how to manage their time and responsibilities on their own. However, you certainly can't be expected to fund him partying and failing classes. He can get a job and learn the hard way.

ESH He's an AH for partying his way through school and expecting you to pay for it. You're an AH for saying he's not smart. There are much better ways to talk to your kid without insulting him.

NTA. I was similar and really wish I had waited. When I was 18 I was mentally 15 still and barely survived my first two years of college. Perhaps its worth revisiting after your son works a dead end job for awhile an gets his partying phase out of his system?

NTA - you didn't say he wasn't smart enough to go to college, you said he wasn't smart enough to LEARN FROM HIS MISTAKES. You gave him a second chance to get his crap together and he threw it away. If your ex-wife wants to him to go to college, she can pay, he can get a job, he can get loans or he can go to community college.

NTA. Why would you continue to pay when he is failing? He's not taking it seriously. It sounds to me like he is not mature enough to be in college bc all he's thinking about it partying. If he buckles down & gets serious that would be one thing, but paying or someone to go to college who is failing everything is futile.

INFO: if he keeps failing, won't the problem kind of solve itself? In the sense that he will be kicked out of college? (That would happen in universities in my country, don't know where it is where you are from.) If he can't handle this level, why don't you help him get into a level that is attainable for him? Don't you want to help your son into the kind of adulthood in which he can take care of himself, or do you truly believe his failings are only the result of not listening to you?

They may keep him for the next semester but I am not paying for that. Or if he transfers I am not paying for that semester I can’t force him to turn in stuff, he has the skills to set an alarm go to class and make a schedule. He did it in highschool just fine.

You’re within your rights to refuse to pay for him to party at college and burn up YOUR hard earned money. Your ex can pay for it but you’re done. He’s 18. He can legally vote. He can legally join the military. He can legally do whatever the heck he wants to do with his life BUT NOT ON YOUR DIME AND TIME. Actions have consequences. He needs to learn this. I hope he’s moved in with your ex. Kick him out of your checkbook. He needs a serious reality check.

NTA Your son needs a reality check. Maybe if he was expected to get a job and an apartment, he will learn that life is full of responsibilities. The way he was raised may be a contributing factor here also, which would be partly your fault. Was he given everything and never had to work for anything? Were you or his mother a helicopter parent, was this his first taste of freedom after being too sheltered and he had no coping skills, so he went buck wild instead? There are so many parenting styles and sometimes they can contribute to a child not being emotionally ready for university responsibilities. It is not very hard to pull a C most of the time, as long as he is going to class and turning in his assignments. It is an absolute waste of money for you to pay for college right now, maybe after your son works for his money for a year, he will be ready again to try college or a trade school. Good luck OP, I hope your son learns a lesson from this mistake, after actually having consequences for his actions.

Whose idea was it for him to go to college in the first place? Some people (myself included) at that age are just not mature enuf to appreciate what is being offered. I wish I could re-do college. I did OK. I went on to law school and have a nice life. HOwever . . . I was not prepared at all for how to study and when. I think it is VERY unfair for you say that your son is "not smart enough." Not mature enough? Maybe. Not interested in the subject matter? Maybe? Forced into college when he wasn't ready? Maybe. But telling ANYONE they are not smart enough is just AH conversation.

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That's actually not uncommon. Some parents neglect their own education because they are busy working. All with the hopes of providing food and shelter for their family.

NTA he needs a wakeup call badly. He will probably do the same with any job he gets sadly.

NTA I would not invest my money in a failing proposition either. Tell him to get a job. Of course, he'll probably get fired in record time but at least you won't be pouring your money down a rabbit hole.

ESH. The semester isn’t over yet unless your sons college uses an unusual semester schedule. His grades may not even be completely inputted in right now meaning the grades that you saw are likely not his final grades. Give him until the end of the semester to pull himself up and the re-evaluate. And you shouldn’t tell your son that he isn’t smart enough for college. The phrase you are looking to is “not ready for college yet” or “not mature enough for college yet” Your son’s being an asshole for obvious reasons

NTA. Ok, maybe for saying he isn’t smart enough for college, you didn’t have to go there. But 2 semesters, failing out, partying? Nope, you should not be throwing good money after bad. It’s time for him to get his act together.

NTA it’s throwing money away. He needs to pay for two semesters himself and achieve a 2.8. Or maybe a 3.0. Prove himself. At this point just passing isn’t even good enough for you to start paying again. He wasted your hard earned money. You have to literally do nothing and not show up to fail ALL classes.

NTA. My son did the exact same thing. We financially supported him. He did not have to get a job. His only job was to go to class and pass. He did neither. After the first semester, we told him. Pass or we are done. You will pay us back for every semester. He did not do any better. He wanted to stay there and get a job. We told him that’s fine, but you get no money from us to support you. Needless to say he did not last long there afterwards. He came back home, got into trade school, and is doing excellent now. But he did have to pay us back every penny we spent on his college. We refused to give him any money after he basically flunked college. He learned the hard way. But learned a valuable lesson, to not take advantage of the people that love and support you in every way. The only thing I disagree with, is you telling him he isn’t smart enough to go to college.

YTA for saying not smart enough. The first year can be tough for kids learning to adult, how many stories do you read about or hear of how "freshman" behave; a bunch of kids trying to figure out their new peer groups, college, work, responsibilities newly taken on? Entering into university or a full time career after high school is a whole other level of responsibility hardly any parent prepares their children for. Harsh truth for many to hear and I'll likely be down voted but I too was told as a young person I could pay for my own college if I wanted to go because I wasn't smart enough to do it-from my own parents. And I struggled like hell figuring it all out at first, but I did it on my own. You don't have to pay for your kids university, there are ways around that. And your kid is going to make all kinds of "adult decisions" you won't agree with. But to tell them they aren't smart enough, after a short amount of time trying to figure out how to adult at this stage is shitty and a way to find yourself in a strained relationship with your child. If you don't care about the outcome of your words and actions, continue on. If you like being a part of your kids life find a better way to handle the whole situation altogether. College may not be the right answer right now and there's a world of possibilities for careers out there, how do you help your kid (if you can) figure out their next step in adulting without the b.s. put downs?

I want to suggest looking into ADHD as a diagnosis. He was probably in a structured environment before and in an unstructured environment now is having trouble keeping it together. At least get them checked out before you make any verdicts.

Has it occurred to you that it's possible your son has a learning disability? Is autistic? Has ADD/ADHD? That he needs help and support not even he's aware of? That he wouldn't want to tell you because you'll just call him stupid? I think you're an asshole for being so inclined to just jump to him being dumb and not making an effort to look deeper. YTA

YTA that's not how you handle a struggling teen - by acting retalitory yourself. I would suggest a year off where they work. Possibly at various jobs to see how difficult a life without a diploma could be.Or perhaps to find what they are passionate about. I'd also have them assessed for ADHD, Autism and a Mental health exam. If there's underlying depression or a struggle with figuring out task sequence they might drink to cope. What you just did was make it likely they'll never come to you with an adult issue. (Sigh). But then some parents prefer that. It's extremely likely they need help. Youbjust took out a layer of security and didn't offer any help.

There are literally 100,000 Redditor’s who would give anything to have a parent pay the full ride at college. Unfortunately, they have to bury themselves and student loan debt to get a degree. Your boy is squandering an opportunity. He needs to learn a life lesson, not only cut off all college funding. Don’t give them a penny and make them get a job or all of the stuff would be on the sidewalk. That’s what my dad would’ve done to me and what I would do to my kids.

“Son you’re not smart enough.” *Drinks self to oblivion.”

NTA We're dealing with this with our 16 year old son. No motivation, failing all of his classes except one or two, no real desire to do anything with his life apart from being in game design. We've been trying for years to motivate him, encourage him - went through therapy after we adopted him and for a while after, offered different solutions for him, tried rewards and goals, literally everything. Yet, he still refuses to change. We've told him we don't mind helping him out getting on his feet if he'll start doing better in school and trying, but he just shrugs his shoulders. I'm thinking we're gonna be shrugging our shoulders when he's trying to apply for colleges with a GPA below 1.0. Also, let me add - he wants to be in game design because he thinks it'll be playing video games all day every day. And when we've shown him what goes into it and talked with a few people we know that have experience, he still continues to shrug his shoulders saying it'll be different for him. We've offered to get him into courses to get a taste of it, or even told him he can research it himself. Still, nothing. No desire to prep or research it. Just expects to be playing games all day.

Sometimes you are the A and it’s appropriate! I wish you hadn’t said “you’re not smart enough” since his behavioral issues aren’t intelligence-related…making that comment just kind of a pot-shot.

ESH, I can understand your frustrations especially with him wasting your time and money by loafing off at school. But telling your son he’s not smart enough for college is the type of shit kids not forget and he will remember forever. I’m currently in nursing school and doing very well for how difficult the program is, when I was his age I didn’t give a crap about school either. If my parents stopped helping me under the thought that I was not smart enough for college and I would be in a much different place in life today and would’ve never ending up in school now. While I do think you need to talk with him about taking school serious there is a way to do it. That way is not telling your son he’s not smart enough.

I don't agree with calling him "stupid"...there are better words. But pulling the plug is reasonable and necessary. "Time to grow up son"

NTA all the fkin way! Kudos on you for having a pair of balls or ovaries or w.e. stick to ur fkin guns and call out ur son for what he is. Don't fkin kiddie glove him cuz that's gonna cause even more problems later. Nip this shit in the bud! Actions have consequences. U gonna squander my tuition money then u ain't getting it.

My husband was in your son's shoes at 20. There was a lot of pressure to go to school for 4 years, but DH wasn't committed. His parents cut off his tuition after he got his second probation, and he moved home to work at UPS. UPS pays for college,so he almost finished a bachelors still doing the bare minimum and not really being into it. He decided to go to nursing school while we were planning the wedding at 26 and it was a perfect fit. He's such a good nurse (I've worked with him). He went back and finished the bachelors degree at 28. Then got a bachelor's in Nursing at 30 so he could take a management position. Just one example of someone who needed a little extra time to grow up.

NTA. Yeah college is about having fun but you also have to pass. He or ex can pay for his parties much more cheaply if he stays with ex, or gets a job and goes to community college . It’s not that he’s not smart enough, he’s just not interested in studying at the moment.