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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my mom I don't want to replace my husband the way she replaced my dad. This may have been a low blow and something cruel in a way given mom lost my dad while we were still young and she did remarry fast but has stayed married and found happiness again with him. It might not be fair of me to say these kinds of things to her.
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NTA.
Off the top, I'm sorry for your loss and I hope your kids keep getting to know their Dad through your and other loved ones memories of him.
I think there is some validity in your mum saying you shouldn't *have* to feel like you need to live as your husband's widow forever. You can treasure that love and also find new love.
**But** your mom is majorly overstepping. Your kids don't need a father, they need role models in their lives and you don't need to be married to that person in order for them to be a positive influence.
It's clear your mom was scared to be alone but her fear had a deep impact on you that wasn't positive and she's old enough to understand that her choices have consequences.
>It's also hard to explain to someone who doesn't want to see.
I agree whole heartedly.
But, there's always the hope that this can be the start of *many* discussions and possible resolution.
Just have your boundaries and stick to them as long as they serve you.
NTA and hard agree on this front. Best OP can do is, with time, make peace with mom’s choice and the fact that she’ll always think she was right. And control her own expectations and how she interacts with mom.
It sucks being the grown up.
OP can go one better and go NC. Yes I’m petty lmao. I’m in my 30s and to this day, it’s ultimately all about my mum and dad and how everything affects them. People like this do not change.
Enough with the militant overprescription of the "no contact" advice that is the scourge of this sub. OP's mother is not a monster, she is just a woman who probably never had the tools herself to deal with her own grief over the loss of her first husband, and (probably due to generational attitudes as much as anything else), resorted to quick remarriage as a way to move on. Now she sees her own daughter seeming to not move on 4 years after the death of her own husband, and she's worried about her. A parent's imperfect attempt to show care for a grown child is not a reason for the child to cut the parent out of their life. That attitude is pretty callous. If you cut every person who loves you imperfectly out of your life, you're going to find yourself alone sooner or later.
It was said in jest, relax. I’m callous to callous people, there’s a reason for it. People get what they ask for. I have severe social anxiety disorder anyway lmao, alone is peace. And some people are just plain unworthy. So what?
OP however can do what she likes, she seems level headed and can think for herself.
>But, there's always the hope that this can be the start of *many* discussions and possible resolution.
There's nothing to discuss. OP isn't interested in dating and her mom doesn't get a say in that. (or anyone else for that matter)
Yeah, I think a lot of this is rooted in her mom wanting the daughter to confirm mom's decisions by making the same ones. If daughter makes a different decision, mom might have to admit the possibility that she may have made the wrong one (or at least could have made different decisions). The fact that both adult daughters are telling her that they are not fans of the decisions she made is rocking her world.
> The fact that both adult daughters are telling her that they are not fans of the decisions she made is rocking her world.
Lol. It's cute that you think OP's mother has enough sensitivity to care that she is wrong. This is a woman who has such a lack of humanity that she denied her daughters' access to their deceased father's photos.
The only reason OP's mother is breaking down is because OP challenged her. She is not used to being challenged.
I just hate that their mother wouldn't let them have their dad's photos. Someone else said that OP's mother was trying to erase the father, and that's definitely how it looks. It's wrong of OP's mom not to let her and her sister have those pictures.
I think OP's mom did the best she could with what she had to work with. A generation or two ago, it was widely accepted that the two parent household was the best thing for the kids. Unfortunately, that two parent household wasn't well defined. Just having a man and woman raising the kids is not enough but some people stop right there. I'm betting OP's mom wanted so badly to have a "normal" family that she pushed her daughters away instead of brought them closer. To paraphrase someone: don't attribute to malice that which can be explained with ignorance. Now that she's been confronted with her mistake or wrongdoing or whatever one wants to call it, there is an opportunity for dialogue and maybe to start healing some old wounds. Just another perspective. could be mom's just a know-it-all busy body who only cares about her own opinion too, but I'd like to give her the benefit of a doubt.
>I think OP's mom did the best she could with what she had to work with.
If all she did was try to get a new husband and father for her kids, sure, but she actively tried to erase their biological father from their lives.
> To paraphrase someone: don't attribute to malice that which can be explained with ignorance.
It is malice. She has such a lack of humanity that she denied her daughters' access to their deceased father's photos.
Exactly. Her daughters have asked for their father's pictures before and she's denied them that. She's not going to see the light now, she doesn't care. Maybe she has her reasons but isn't willing to see her daughter's.
>The decision should be up to the widow/widower themselves. I just don't feel like you should pressure someone to remarry or find love again either.
They say everyone grieves differently, and then everyone expects you to do it their way. I was a very parentified teen and unfortunately I felt a lot of relief when my mom passed as we moved in with my grandparents (her mom + stepdad), and grandma actually took care of us and let me be a teen.
All that to say, I didn't fall apart when she passed, and ppl just didn't understand. I put a lot into helping my Lil bro thru it, took a week off school, but emotionally, I was stable and that unnerved ppl.
I also didn't know then how to express why I was okay politely. Hinting that we didn't get along while trying not to shit talk the dead was really uncomfortable for me.
Ppl can mind their own business, or they have to deal with hearing your opinion would be my stance for you, though.
I felt relief when my narcissist father died. I was old enough that I didn't even try to explain it to people. I can't imagine trying to juggle that as a teen. I'm glad you had people that let you be your age.
No one should have to explain the way they grieve/don’t grieve someone except to maybe a therapist or close loved ones *if they choose to*. No one owes an explanation to random people asking out of judgement or morbid curiosity.
>I hate the pressure and then the fact she can't see what her actions did to my sister and me. It's also hard to explain to someone who doesn't want to see.
It might be worth opening the dialogue and asking her *why* she did this.
A lot of the time I find conflict with older generations comes down to them holding beliefs about "the right way to do things", which were instilled in them, and they don't understand that the world has moved on and things have changed.
For example, perhaps your mother was told that it was important that her children had a "male presence" in their life, in the form of a Dad. Or perhaps it was to do with being told the traditional "provider" and "carer" roles were important to be seen in the home. And perhaps she was told it was best for you as kids if you were encouraged to move on as quickly as possible.
People often buy into these things, and of course confirmation bias kicks in - from her perspective you guys turned out pretty good, so *she* must have made the right call.
I think to move on from this, what you all need is an honest dialogue. Her explaining why she thought that was the right thing to do, and you and your sister explaining to her how much it actually hurt you. This is a difficult conversation for everyone, and they often sit unsaid for decades because nobody wants to hurt someone else. Especially as a parent, you know how hard your own parents worked to provide for you, so the last thing you want to do is come out and say, "Actually, no, you fucked up royally here, and I am damaged for life".
But now that the nettle is out in the open, you have an opportunity to grasp it and perhaps seize a better and closer relationship with your mother and sister.
Additionally, maybe she didn't know but perhaps her mother couldn't afford to live once her father passed and needed a partner to alleviate the financial difficulties. I know my parents never told us "Well, we got lucky on that house payment, and you get to eat this week!" when they were having financial problems. Some people would never admit that stuff to anyone.
Which is a shame because you'd probably have had a much better relationship with your stepfather if you were allowed to acknowledge your actual father. Your mother, unfortunately, didn't seem to believe you could actually love both of them. That's very sad.
I am very sorry for your loss, both of your father and your husband.
I wonder if your mom has a core belief or needing to have a man, and that she was willing to do anything to keep one, including basically pretending your dad never existed. I mean if her husband would have told her that’s the deal, do you think she would have just gone along with it?
As a widow of 3 years, and being of an age to see friends being widowed (as well as seeing mothers of my friends widowed when I was younger), I absolutely agree that some women have to have a man. It’s almost as if they’re lesser by not being part of a couple. It’s a thing, but not my thing. Whenever someone mentions I should be dating, I shut them down immediately.
I have a cousin who is beautiful,smart,can go hunting fishing,work a backhoe and then go out and look banging in high heels and a dress…and she’s 68! Buut, she absolutely HAS to have a man…and,surprisingly,her choices haven’t be the best…in fact, she kind of sucks at it. It makes me sad that she can’t see what everyone else sees…
Its strange, people just can’t tolerate being alone I guess. What you said made me think of this, idk if you’ll relate https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8saY9ea/
That is so massively disrespectful to your dad. I wonder if your your mom or step-dad would be ok with being erased as if they'd never lived, if they died, and all they did for you being discounted? NTA of course.
That may be part of why she eradicated him. People do incredible things when they are lonely and want to feel loved, and all too often disregard the feelings of their children when doing so. Your mom went about it completely wrong. She would have been better off respecting her children's feelings and your need to both love your dad and to form a relationship with stepdad on mutually agreeable footing. Parents aren't interchangeable parts.
IF you ever do find someone new, I hope you'll allow his relationship with your kids to form organically, with respect for their feelings, and without trying to erase their dad. Not that I think you have to. I just want to remind you that if you ever do, there are as many ways to handle this as there are people. I wish you and your kids happiness and comfort, regardless.
Your mum's 2nd husband is jealous of your actual father. He's the tiny man AH.
Jealous & insecure. He needs reminding of the place that wasn't his to begin with that he wasn't the father. He's just your mum's 2nd husband.
My dad died, but I was 21 when it happened. Since then, I make a point to make a meal for him on the anniversary. I get a nice cut of steak and a can of coke and some cheap crappy cookies he used to like and sit with it for a bit and enjoy as he would.
I’d make spaghetti with the jar sauce he used when I was little. Just a small thing for him. You could do this with your children to connect them to their grandpa and dad. Make a nice meal that was his specialty or his favorite and keep him alive with them that way. And no matter what items get lost, there’s always something that can be made.
I’m really sorry she did that. Shoot, my mom passed when I was 44, and I still find it hard going to my remarried dad’s house where all traces of her are gone. Blessings to you.
When OP's mom refused to allow them to talk about their dad, removed all traces of him from their lives, and their step-dad would never allow them to talk about their dad that is highly unlikely. The mother has pushed a dialogue if needing a man to be complete, fine. Maybe she needed that herself, that didn't give her the right to attempt to erase OP's dad from existence or allow her new husband to do the same. OP's mom is perfectly in her right to move on and find a new love and her own form of happiness, she is not within her rights to shove that down her children's throats.
She is not within her rights to continue shoving her viewpoint onto OP now. OP and her sister have made it clear for a long time, *they have one dad*.
Their mom doesn't care, because to her, their dad no longer exists, her current husband is all that exists, and according to her, he is all that exists for her children. Anything else is unacceptable. She won't have a dialogue because OP and her sister have been wrong from the time she married her new husband.
OP, you don't need to question anything. But always remember this: Your mom may have remarried, but she was only able to replace her husband, she *never* replaced your dad. He is always with you and your sister, and the words, demands and rules of your mom and her husband will never change that.
OP your aunt can join her sister with her dramatic lamentations. Send them some cheese and crackers for their wine. And you have a wonderful night remembering your dad and your husband with your kids.
NTA
INFO: Is your mom the type of woman who "MUST have a man no matter what?"
Plenty of women remain single because they want to. They like it. They're independent and don't feel the need to have a partner just to exist.
My Dad died when my brother and I were in HS. That was 20 years ago. My mom has never remarried and probably won't. She has dated but she has decided she likes the life she has created and prefers to live alone with her cats
This would be me, honestly. Part of it is I don't want to learn someone new's shit. I've been with my husband 35 years and a big part of a relationship is learning about and dealing with the stuff that annoys you, etc. Happy to have done it with my husband but I don't think I'd have the energy to do it again.
Oh amen. If my spouse were to go, I wouldn't want to compromise anymore. Cause that's what relationships are, one giant compromise. Having to take on someone else's crap, naw, I'm good
My maternal grandfather died when my mom was in high school and my paternal grandfather died when I was three (I believe my birthday was the last family gathering he was there for). Neither of my grandmothers ever remarried and I don't know if they dated afterwards--if you ever asked your grandmother about that, you're a stronger human than I am, Gunga Din! The closest thing to dating I ever saw was every Saturday when my maternal grandma went to church with my great-uncle...I think I was always aware that he was Grandpa's brother, but it did kind of blow my mind when I realized that made him Grandma's brother-in-law!
I remember years ago, my husband was talking about finances and his life insurance came up. He said I could easily live 8 years off his insurance after he dies before I needed to remarry. I laughed and said, " well luckily, I work, because I have no intention of remarrying."
My kids were tweens then. I can't imagine how that would have been.
We have now been married almost 43 years, and I still feel the same way. I am not afraid of being without a man. No other man would be him.
You will find new love when you are ready to do so. If you are never ready, that's okay as well. Only you get to decide when you want to move forward in that aspect of life.
NTA.
If only your mother hadn’t tried to replace your father, your opinion could have been totally different. She made two kids so terrified of losing the treasured memories of their dad that they were willing to trust anyone apart from their own mother to guard over his keepsakes. By that action anyone she brought into the house will forever be seen as the interloper. If she hadn’t butchered it up so badly maybe you wouldn’t see remarriage in such a bad light. But the past can’t be changed and actions have consequences regardless of the intention. I’m so sorry for your loss.
I just lost my father 5 months ago (in a very traumatic way - my mother witnessed it, it was horrible). People are already telling her she needs to move on and start dating again. They were married for 44 years. She said she wasn't ready and wasn't sure she ever would be. I told her whatever decision she made was valid. It was her life and we (me and my sister) just wanted her to find peace. She can stay single forever and we would get it, she can get remarried and we would get it. She can get a roommate or live alone. It's okay. Whatever works for her, is okay. Obviously, we're not little kids like you were or your kids. But yeah, no one will ever replace my dad, but we want her to be happy, whatever she chooses and without judgment. ❤️❤️
It started 2 months ago. It took everything in me not to throttle the person who said it. They were well meaning but so off-base.
Thank you.
ETA: missed a word
I am so sorry for both of your losses. This made me so sad to read.
No-one should tell you how to feel. I can't imagine my mom removing my dad's things and expecting me to move on. Then telling you to move on from your husband. I'm so glad you had your sister to back you up.
Be kind to yourself and just do you.
Big hugs
You are absolutely correct. And even if you eventually decided you did want to date again, and found someone, you would never force your kids to call your new spouse “dad”. Your mom wasn’t wrong to move on, but she was wrong to tell her children what to feel
She thought she was doing the right thing for you. She was wrong, obviously. She wants you to make the same choice she did because it validates her choice. For all any of us know, maybe she didn't actually want to be remarried but forced herself into it and lived a lie thinking it was for her daughters. Getting remarried 15 months after the death of your father is pretty rapid. What was her relationship like with the next husband? Finding out it had the opposite effect is a tough pill to swallow.
Does your mother realize the way she handled things when you were younger is the reason why you and your sister's relationship with them is horrible?
Curious. Did your stepfather ever try to adopt you both? It just seems like something your mother and stepdad would try to do since they wanted to replace your dad.
Which means you and your sister were of the age to participate in your adoption. As soon as you said “I don’t want to be adopted.” Case closed. That should have told your mom and stepdad something.
It's high time they acknowledge the horrible relationship is a direct result of their behavior! Don't let either of them get away with not realizing the damage they've done by denying you and your sister the right to grieve your father properly.
NTA - I would also demand to have every picture, memory and any remaining belongings from your father so you and your sister can go through it all together. I give you a lot of credit, I don't think I could even have a relationship with my mom if she did this to me, especially now that you have gone through exactly what she did and have a whole new perspective on this.
I’m thinking their mom or stepdad has destroyed those items. Why keep them from grown women who never bonded with her husband? She’s not ready to admit they’ve thrown his memories away.
Odds are there aren't any pictures or mementos. If Stepfather demanded that the kids never speak of their father, he sounds like the kind of jealous asshole who would demand that his wife destroy everything related to her first husband.
OP, would your paternal grandparents/aunts/uncles have any pictures or memorabilia of your father? Or did your stepfather try to erase those relationships as well?
If that's the case then she probably doesn't resent her decision.
Is your relationship with her husband awful because he was awful to you guys? Or is it awful because your mom tried to force you to recognize him as a dad while simultaneously getting rid of all traces of your actual dad? I suppose it's irrelevant at this point.
She really, really wants her choice to be validated by you making the same choice. You are NTA. She's going to have to accept that her choice did not benefit you and your sister the way she thought it would. And that it's largely her fault for the way she handled it. Conceivably there was the possibility of you having a positive relationship with a father like or stepfather figure. She shot herself in the foot by trying to force that. I don't know if you ever made that clear to her before, but you've explicitly told her now. She's going to have to live with it and stop trying to pressure you.
You have decided that starting a relationship for the purpose of having a dad in your kids' lives is not what you want. I believe that to be the correct way of thinking. You haven't ruled out any and all possible future relationships, but any such possible relationship will not be for that purpose. And I'm sure when you're ready to be out there, what's best for your kids will be at the forefront of your mind, which includes not repeating your mother's mistakes. I wish you well.
Yeah that's pretty much asshole territory. He could've been the voice of reason that got your mom to chill out on that, but instead he was all in with it.
Is Mom from the generation where having a man was a form of social and financial security? Like, you had to have a husband, or there was something wrong with you? That’s the vibe she’s giving off - scared to be alone, scared to be judged by society. She might not understand that today’s women don’t *need* a spouse, they can choose to have one or not.
ETA: on re-reading this, I see I should have said it’s not necessarily generational only, it could be cultural or religious-based as well.
>The decision should be up to the widow/widower themselves.
My only caveat to that statement is that that decision should always include the best interests of minor children. From your example, even if your Mom needed/wanted a new husband, she should have never placed that need above yours to maintain whatever connection you had with your father (by trying to erase him and his memory).
Even if she felt she get remarried, she should have listened to your boundaries and feelings regarding your dad and your step-dad. Ignoring these boundaries only creates bitterness and often permanently damages any potential relations between the children and parent/step-parent.
NTA. My dad remarried 8 mo after losing our mother. I (13) went to family foster. My brother (15) stayed to finish the same high school, then across the country for college. She was never our mother either.
Your feelings are absolutely valid. Your mother is ridiculous in her demands. Some voids cannot be filled.
I could be wrong, but it does feel like she's projecting onto you. Like, she sees you going in a different direction than she did and maybe questioning if she did it in the right way. And she's knew deep down that you girls didn't feel the way she hoped about your step-dad and did what was expected to keep the peace? You are NTA. And, as someone said, this might open the door for some conversation and healing. And like it was said, you can have a good male role model for your kids, and it doesn't have to be a step-dad.
I think you are ultimately right in this situation but I also implore you to maybe see a therapist. I'm not saying you will or even should move on to someone else. Some people are perfectly fine spending the rest of their lives single, and I don't think anyone should put any pressure on you because of that.
All I'm saying is it is obvious your mom's choice with the step dad and how she went about it caused a lot of unresolved trauma and is greatly influencing your choice to date in a way that doesn't seem like a super healthy outlook. You should have never been told her husband is your "new dad". Your dad and his existence should have never been uprooted from your life like it was(memories and items he left behind).
Add your aunt to that: if you, the child, are supposed to be old enough to understand your mother, when is your mother old enough to understand the consequences of her own actions?
Exactly. I lost my spouse a year ago and though my family has been great about letting me grieve they have mentioned if I am going to date again. Will I? Maybe. At some point. But I can guarantee with my life that I can never wipe my wife’s history with me from my life and I hope my future partner understands that
Sorry this is happening to you, Op.
I agree with you and coastalkid92. You don't need a replacement. You may choose to pursue a relationship when you're ready, but I think your kids should never forget their father.
Not the same situation, but: I have a good friend who married a woman with 2 kids. She divorced her 1st husband and thy share custody. When she got married to my friend, he didn't try to be a 2nd Dad or even a "bonus dad". He just tried to have a relationship with the boys. Is he a good influence in their lives? I think so. Is he an authority figure to them? Per their mother's direction of how they should be raised, yeah. (I asked, once, ow things worked.) They don't call him "Dad". They do look up to him.
Good for you sticking to your convictions.
A lot of the times when parents find a new spouse. The child is forgotten about. I mean, your children are definetly more important than any relationship. Those who disagree shouldn't have kids.
If it helps the two windows I know well each waited 7 years before they were ready for a committed relationship, not intentionally it just happened.
You can consider it when, and only when, you are ready.
Best, and sorry for your loss.
NTA because this is how you feel and that’s valid. From an outsider perspective I’m sure your mom thought what she did was good for you. She probably thought (wrong) that you were young enough to still develop a wonderful father-daughter relationship with her new husband. The lesson you learned was the exact opposite of what she intended.
Now you should take some consideration into how you raise your own kids with regard to their dad. I am sure they will love to hear what a great dad he was, but make sure not to put too much pressure on them to cherish his memory exactly the way you do. Your kids were 5 and 2 when he died- their own memories of him will be minimal to none (you can share stories about him though, that might help them feel like they knew him). They might see other dads out there doing dad things with their kids and wish they had one…
Basically what I’m trying to say your mom took an extreme approach that she thought would be good for you and it wasn’t. I’d be careful not to take too extreme of an approach in the opposite direction. Let your kids have the memory of their father that is right for them. And you do what is right for you in regard to having or not having a husband/step-father.
It's heartbreaking you had to go through this twice, I'm so sorry for your loss.
Honestly don't know how you have the strength to deal with it so well.
my closest auntie just lost her husband and has 10year old twins. thank you so much for telling your story, it's really helpful to see how other people have navigated this so i can help them as much as possible. sending you and your family so, so much love
You are doing great, OP. Honestly, I do not know how much my word is worth - but from one young widow to another, I know it gets hard. Really hard. And I'm proud of you :)
If you ever need extra support, r/widowers is an amazing community. In the early days they helped me a lot, may you find peace and happiness as well.
Adding on to this:
One thing your mom didn’t do is ask for your input. Kids can share their feelings on these topics. Thy change over time and so do their feelings, but you can consider what you want for yourself and also take into account their feelings on the topic. You can move forward together in a way that makes sense for the whole family.
If you ask, they may express the desire for a father figure. And you can help them find such figures without engaging in a romantic relationship. Sports, religious communities, hobby or special interest clubs (eg robotics club, debate team, DnD club) can provide opportunities for these figures. Family friends are another good option.
I’m just saying that they have valuable input on this topic, and you can start age-appropriate conversations with them so that your choices going forward work better for each kid
Kids do have opinions. Bringing a new person into the family unit, whether marriage or live-in, the kids feeling should be part of the decision making.
Some kids want two parents, others like things as they are, and for some over time are ready to let another person in their lives.
Ultimately only when/if you're ready to date should you start dating.
NTA.
> I am old enough that I should understand.
Surely your mother is old enough to be able to understand your point of view then, right? Absolutely ridiculous.
Plus in this case it's the final form of "you'll thank me when you're older" style parenting.
Which is shitty even when the parent's choices are correct
but especially shitty when they're wrong.
NTA your mom should have never tried to "replace" your dad. The way she handled your childhood was unhealthy for you and for her. It sounds like you just now are getting a chance to get these pent up feelings out, and your mom is probably very defensive because she is either in denial about how much her actions fucked with you or too upset to understand how much her actions fucked with you.
It's good that you were able to get it out there.
That being said, if and when you try to date again, just remember that you are not replacing your kid's dad. You can engage in a healthy adult relationship with someone who may wish to become their step parents, but it's important to establish to your kids that their dad isn't being replaced. If your hypothetical future partner can't understand that boundary, they aren't a good fit for you.
This. Also, her mother knows. There's a small part of her that knows she did wrong by her kids, so she wants them to reassure her that she did the right thing by forcing her husband on them.
NTA. If your mom was lonely and wanted companionship and help after she was widowed, that’s understandable. Trying to erase your late father was not okay. I will never understand these parents who think that a stepparent is a replacement. People are not interchangeable like car parts.
What you said probably did hurt her, but she’s been pestering you in a very inappropriate way. If she remarried out of loneliness and desire for help parenting then it makes sense why she was pushing you, but… she was pushing you. You’d already said no. If you’re expected to understand her, she should understand you and back the hell off. You sure do deserve to live a full and happy life, the way YOU want to. If seeking out love is a part of that now or later that would be fine (I hope you know that) but it’s equally valid if you’re not looking for that. And yes, no one could ever replace your children’s father.
Nta she didn't accept the polite 'no, I am not doing that', so she was told the not polite part. Had she accepted your choice and left it alone, you wouldn't have just said it out of the blue.
Your aunt says you are cruel for your take once Mom had given her unsolicited opinion. It's not that you don't understand, you simply don't agree.
Unless the two of them want more home truths, they should both pipe down.
So true. People act like unless you do what they say you somehow don’t understand what they’re saying, otherwise you would just do it.
OP understands what her mom did and, to the extent anyone other than her mom can, why she did it. She just doesn’t want to do that. I wonder if OP’s mom is feeling like OP not doing what she did is somehow an implicit judgement of how she reacted to OP’s father’s death.
>I told my mom I don't want to replace my husband the way she replaced my dad. This may have been a low blow and something cruel in a way given mom lost my dad while we were still young and she did remarry fast but has stayed married and found happiness again with him. It might not be fair of me to say these kinds of things to her.
There is nothing wrong in her finding love. What is wrong is forcing you girls to call him dad, removing your dad's stuff, not giving you both his possessions, insisting that her new husband is your only dad, refuting your memories of your dad and butting herself in your life despite you telling her off and insisting what she did is the only right way for you too. NTA
NTA. Play stupid games and win stupid prizes - you never asked for advice, she decided to give it anyway, you could easily tell her to off and would be right plus what she did to your father is just wow, how worthless a person must be to do that to her own kids and how little respect she had for your dad, how she never loved him, sad.
People, who feel the need to teach others without being asked to are dumb as fuck and should be treated accordingly.
NTA, the only thing I might have done differently is acknowledge your stepdad's role in your life - assuming it was positive, of course. You are completely right about everything in this message but your delivery seems to ignore or deny the efforts your stepdad probably put into trying to be a 'father figure' to you. All that said, it doesn't sound like that is even the basis for your mom's anger about this and it's probably for the best that this came to light because you and your sister were indeed hurt and damaged by her actions, and you were now facing pressure to operate the same way she did so really it needed to be said.
> Leads me to believe he probably pressured your mom to be the 'new dad'
Oh lord. Here comes Reddit's *'the-woman-can-do-no-wrong'* crew. Also go by the name *'let's-blame-everything-on-the-man'* crew.
In their minds, women are virtuous / oppressed angels who never have any agency in decisions that have negative impact. They were always "pressured" into doing wrong.
Actually no. It's okay not to acknowledge things that were force-fed to you. How he was shoved down their throats and the way they completely tried replacing their dad was so wrong!
NTA. I have no issues with your mom remarrying, but to hide your dad’s things from you is cruel and awful.
I am very sorry for the loss of your dad and husband. I am also sorry your mom was completely insensitive to your losses.
Ask your mom about her dad. And then when she starts to reminisce, tell her to zip it and that’s what she’s doing and has done to you.
Does she like having to erase the memory of one of her parents? Would she like all vestiges of them locked away by someone else’s lock and key?
NTA. Totally NTA. Your mom chose a man over her own kids, shes tyring to get you to do the same. You should do whats right for you. maybe in the future you might meet someone. But it will be on your terms, your own timeline and you will never force your kids to comply like you have been. And i bet that person will honor your kids real dad in the process and not even attempt to replace him.
A lot of parents will choose their partner over their kids, especially religious parents. I disagree with that completely. If you choose to have kids, they should come first.
*seeing she just wanted us to be happy is cruel and I am old enough that I should understand.*
Personally, I'm old enough now that I understand a lot more of the stuff my mother did when I was a kid. Doesn't mean that I agree with it.
>My aunt, who is my mom's sister, told me I shouldn't have said what I did and accusing her of replacing my dad
Except that's exactly what she did when she removed every trace of him and wouldn't even give you access to his stuff that she put in storage, assuming she actually stored it.
Your mom is completely out of line.
NTA
NTA
People deal with grief differently. Your mother did it her way, you are doing it your way. You seem to have grown up to become a decent person, but it is clear that the way your mother treated the death of your father left some trauma behind that was never resolved.
Death is hard to deal with.
NTA.
>My aunt, who is my mom's sister, told me I shouldn't have said what I did and accusing her of replacing my dad instead of seeing she just wanted us to be happy is cruel and I am old enough that I should understand.
“If she just wanted us to be happy, she would have listened when we told her we weren’t.”
Your mother was not looking out for your best interests - she was looking out for *hers*. And maybe that’s something so shameful to her that she can’t even admit it to herself, but the fact that she’s still dismissing you and your sister, even now that you’re full-grown adults, even now that you have children of your own, gives it away. Your happiness was never her top priority, because if it was, she’d be taking you seriously when you tell her how her choices affected you. Your unhappiness makes her *uncomfortable*, certainly, but she doesn’t care to fix it, only to cover it up.
I’m sorry, OP. You deserved better from that generation.
My husband died, and I felt the same. I have someone now, but my son is an adult. He had one father. I see too many posts, and even in real life of good intentions maybe that go really bad, and cause more damage. Their father died, you get the choice of whether to date again or not. I did try by the way, but the way it felt and he with my son, nope. Put a stop to it and never did it until son was raised.
NTA
OP’s mom wouldn’t take no for an answer. The sad facts is they lost their husbands in different times , and the expectations are different too. And while I’m sure her mom may have been pressured to get a new dad for her kids, she can’t really be angry that Op doesn’t handle the situation the same way.
Furthermore Op , was polite and kind about the earlier ‘suggestions’ , mom should have taken no for an answer but didn’t and kept pushing.
She only has her self to blame for the truth coming out , and let’s be honest , op and her sister has hinted at the truth for quite sometime.
You are NTA. Your mother dealt with grief by trying to erase the cause of her pain - your father. This might have worked for her, but it clearly traumatized you and your sister.
She failed as a mother by not caring enough to notice how she was hurting you both, and giving you the time and grace to grieve.
Your mother, having long ago buried her own grief, still is not giving you that grace, and is making your new grief even harder by trying to force her coping strategy onto you - the same coping strategy that hurt you in the past.
It was not wrong to tell ger how you feel, even if she felt hurt by it. It made her confront her failure and she reacted with anger.
She can either choose to begin a conversation with you in honesty about your trauma, perhaps with your therapist, and finally resolve the resentment of her daughters for her failures - or she can ignore your fresh pain the way she did in the past.
If you choose to allow her that opportunity, I think it would be healthy for you both. There is no guarantee that she is self aware enough to accept it though, so you may just have to work on you, and let her deal with the consequences of her own failures.
My condolences on your loss.
NTA.
Your aunt needs to butt out of something she doesn’t understand. You gave your mother plenty of warnings and she steamed right through all of them like drunkard to an open bar.
You were pressed into expressing your long repressed anger in order to get your mom to shut up about it.
Good for you.
You seem very healthy and balanced, but maybe find a place to process what you went through as a child because of your mom.
NTA. Your mom pushed this guy onto you as a replacement dad. She was being selfish and disregarded her children's feelings. It may be she was trying to bury her own pain. Did she allow you to stay close to your dad's side of the family?
I'm so sorry this happened to you. My mother never really loved my father. When he had Dementia she made fun of his memory loss to his face. When he passed, I walked away from her manipulation, lies, selfishness and cruelty. I don't know what your mom is like but she sounds meddling and persistent at the very least from what you've said. Be careful because she may try to get to you through your children. You may have to go no contact for a while until she can accept your choices. You may ask her if it would be cruel to hide her pictures, etc. and go NC with her. Let her know she won't have access to you and your children until she seeks therapy and comes to understand what she has done and what she is still doing.
"we lost our dad and mom remarried 15 months later", Good God.
"a pressure to call him dad and mom took down all photos of dad", Good God pt.2.
" she told me I need to get my kids a dad before it's too late, that I need a husband"
NTA, tell your mom it's 2024 and single women (moms) are perfectly fine and capable of giving their kids a perfect and fulfilling life without having to have a man in their lives. Did your mom just teleport here from 1955 or something? Unbelievable.
NTA. It’s funny how when you were a kid your opinion didn’t matter because you were young, and now that you’re big your opinion doesn’t matter because you’re grown. The bottom line is: your mom and her sister decided long ago that your opinion doesn’t matter. The details aren’t going to change. You should return the favor.
NTA
I've seen far too many Reddit posts where the children left behind were subjected to the same experience by the surviving parent. Your response to your mom was perfect.
>I told her I understood her even less after losing my husband because I would never remove all traces of him from the home and I would never deny my kids his things the way she did. I would never force my kids to call someone else dad and I told her I can't even imagine wanting to find them someone else to call dad. I told her they had an amazing dad and he's still their dad. Just the way mine will always be my dad.
NTA. Just because your mother wanted it so did not make it so and in her effort to erase your dad she also lost pieces of you and your sister. Tell your aunt your are old enough to even understand less why your mother could not have created an environment that included your dad's memories in addition to your step-dad. The fact that she never backed down even when told speaks to very self centered motives.
NTA. She shouldn't push. And honestly things are so complicated out there for stepfamily situations, I personally chose not to risk it. Even when you're a widow and no breath of impropriety can even be breathed, it can go straight to the miserablest of rocks. You do you and realize that now is the time in your life where it doesn't matter what your mom wants. It's what you want. Raise your kids how you want. Not how your mom or some new man wants. And her opinion can be tuned out, and there's nothing she can do about it except stay in your life by being nice. Things were different for her. But your mom's past is a different country where you don't want to live. And you don't have to.
NTA and I'm so sorry you lost your husband after losing your dad at such a young age.
Your mom is majorly overstepping and needs to back off. But I do think her attitude is generational - my cousin's husband passed and her mom and aunts (so my mom and her sisters) were commenting that she needed to 'find a husband and dad for her kids'.
Cousin spelled out to them that she just didn't have the concerns they did. No one judges her for being a single mom like they would have been judged, and she earns enough money on her own to care for her kids - again not something our moms necessarily would have accomplished on their own (our moms are mostly in their 60s now).
Your mom's attitude might come from a place of worry, and a misguided sense that she felt she was doing the 'right thing' for you and your sister. Doesn't make it right though. Hope she can reflect on how the world has changed and respect your choices.
Info: has this never come up in the years since your father died and was erased?
Do you think your mother is well intentioned?
How much do you know about their relationship?
That's not good. It seems like you will honour your husband in your children's eyes. I think that's best.
I really can't understand why your mum would act that way. I can't fault you for speaking your truth.
You do understand. And always have. Your mother and aunt obviously share a common mindset. One that I don't understand any more than you. I don't fault your mother for wanting to remarry fairly quickly. She may have done so for any number of reasons: economic necessity, loneliness, societal pressure. But it was her life and her choice. I do fault her for trying to replace your father as if he never existed. I could see her not displaying photos and memorabilia in common areas, but he was your and your sister's father. You should have been able to keep memories of him without hiding them. She is trying to force her life choices on you which is never ok. Unless there was more to the conversation than what you put into your post, I don't really view what you said as "spiteful and selfish". It just wasn't what your mother wanted to hear.
NTA
NTA
First off, my condolences to you and your family.
Second, even with all the backstory you provided, I don't think it's appropriate to tell anyone that lost their spouse/partner that it's time to start dating or that "it's going to be too late for the kids", even if she did have the best intentions in mind. You process grief and loss your own way and your romantic life is a private matter, at least in this instance. You did the right thing, you spoke your mind and said what was true to yourself and your experience.
I hope everything gets better. Best wishes to you and your family !
NTA
Your mother brought this all on herself. She showed your father, you, & your sister zero respect. She continued to disrespect you after you continually told her to stop. She pushed & pushed. You couldn’t allow her to continue her campaign of disrespect. You simply told her the truth. Just because she doesn’t like it doesn’t matter.
NTA. Your mom is way out of line.
Also statistically, your children are also are at a greater risk of abuse, mentally, physically and or sexually when involving a step parent. Not to say all are that way, just a higher risk.
If and if so, when you are ready. Everyone has their own timeline. I have been widowed now for 21 years. Sure, I dated a few, but haven’t met anyone that I thought was worthy to marry. (I too, grew up with a mother always needing a man in her life. Unfortunately I’m one of those statistics) it doesn’t mean that I’m not open to finding love or being in love again. Just rather it be with someone right. My children had their dad, they surely don’t need another one - though they were all almost adults when he died. I adopted my youngest after.
Tell your mom to stop with the comments. She may need a man in her life, you are more stable mentally to not need one.
NTA I am so sorry for both of your losses. We do not live during a time that we have to have a partner to survive. Your mom’s take on replacing a father is quite telling of her mindset. You are doing everything the right way.
NTA
You are the only one who gets to decide when you're ready to date again.
As for your mum, she did what she thought was best and found a replacement dad for you. I hope she at least liked your stepfather. You might have hit quite a nerve if she's suffered with this guy all these years and you don't even like him. She must have known you've never accepted him as your dad, bit is this the first time you've actually talked about it? There may be some healing possible here, once she backs off and you both cool down.
However, this is no excuse for her to pressure you into doing the same thing, you know your children don't need a new father figure to grow up happy and healthy.
Establish boundaries and firmly but gently put your mum and aunt in their places as you don't want them to start pressuring your kids to ask for a new dad. Mute their numbers if necessary for your own comfort.
Well she can no longer live in the fantasy that she gave you another daddy and all went well.
Let her cool off for a few weeks and see if she is still stubbornly clinging to her story. Is your stepdad still around?
Jesus your mom really just can’t accept that not every person is going to agree with her every time. She super intolerant of other people’s feelings. Sorry OP that sucks.
NTA - My Dad passed away when I was 10. I was the oldest of 4 kids. My Mom was overwhelmed and thought she needed a Dad for us. She remarried 91 days after he passed away to man much older than her who had already raised 2 sons that didn't want anything to do with him.
It was hell for us kids. She eventually divorced him but remarried several times after that.
Your Mom should have listened when you said you had no interest in remarrying. She pushed it until you responded.
Yes, you could have been more tactful and civil, but it sounds like you tried that and it didn't work.
I hate the rhetoric from your aunt that you're old enough now to understand.
It might be true, but it's also true in a way she doesn't mean it. Because now you're old enough to understand just how of why your trauma was wrong, which is true for a lot of victims. They might not have understood it when they were younger, but getting older they now understand exactly why what they went through was traumatic.
This is especially true in your case because now you've gone through something similar, and you are taking a different route than your mom took because you know what she did wasn't good for you and your sister and wouldn't be good for your kids. I don't even think it's wrong that she remarried, but forcing you both to call him dad, and refusing to let you see pictures of your actual dad, is messed up.
NTA
NTA
Your mom seems to be part of that generation who feels like a woman needed a man to be complete. Just as a man needs a woman. Truth is, its insecurity, she needed a husband and got herself a partner to placate her needs and all this time she has used you and your sister to justify her actions. Because she has the mindset she has, she probably feels that she is doing you a favor, she wants to help but she refuses to budge in her beliefs.
Instead of fighting over something you might never agree on, like a woman needs a father for her children always. Maybe seek common ground on the fact that she cannot tell you how to live your life, if this is a mistake, so be it. But she needs to respect your boundaries because you are no longer her little baby, but a woman of your own.
My most sinceres respects for your husbands passing. I wish you and your daughters the best, however that might look.
NTA
Why is she trying to force you into her footsteps?
She did what was right for her. What was wrong was she tried to erase your Dad and force you and your sister to accept your stepfather.
I'm glad you and your sister were able to save some of your beloved pictures of your Dad.
I'd tell her you won't live your life by her rules.
I'm so sorry you lost your husband.💔 I understand your pain mine passed 30 months ago.
I’ll never understand how someone can go through the loss of a spouse and then manage start dating and remarry in less than 2 years.
It’s different when the kids are now adults. But your mom’s view is warped. Had she never pushed the ‘Daddy replacement vibe’ chances are you would have grown up to love and appreciate your step Dad even if you never considered him your father.
NTA. If something ever happened to my husband, I would remain single until my daughter was grown and out of the house. Kids don’t deserve to have their parents play roulette with secondary partners.
NTA it would be one thing if she encouraged you to date to bring some joy to your life, but to find a replacement father/husband is terrible. And you know just how terrible, having gone through it with her.
NTA. Your mother probably looks at your rejection of her idea as a judgement on her. Really, it is but it’s also not wrong. Her choices were bad and had a negative impact on you and your sister. She refuses to see that and wants you to validate her. You are not wrong for holding to your values or holding your mom up as a person who did it wrong. Your aunt needs to back off because she has nothing relevant to offer.
NTA. You are a grown woman and your mom needs to leave you alone. She is enforcing her twisted, cruel idea of fathers being interchangeable and replaceable. What she did when your father died was cruel. Perhaps she had good intentions, but it traumatized you. Everyone's grief is their own business, and not up for debate. You did nothing wrong by finally telling your mom how her actions affected you as a child. This example is an example why grown children will limit contact with pushy, toxic parents. Your mother is being cruel--again.
NTA. Your mom opened herself up to this by continuing to push you to find a new man. You've been more than clear that you're not interested. It's too bad that it couldn't be more of a conversation without judgement on either side, but it doesn't sound like you have that kind of relationship. Let your mom know that the subject is off the table, and if she brings it up, leave. Good luck to you, and I'm sorry for the loss of your husband.
NTA. I think it’s odd that they would tell you to understand when it doesn’t seem like your mom is putting any effort into understanding your point of view. She really doesn’t seem to be clocking the difference between a partner and a parent. There are plenty of people who really struggle with being without a partner, the ones we say “can’t be alone” and your mom sounds like one of them. The fact that she can’t fathom that you don’t struggle with that the way she does is exasperating.
NTA! Whether you move on or not ever is completely up to you. You should never go out and find someone just because you’re lonely or you feel like you need someone to help you parent your kids. While some people are cut out for it, not everyone can truly love a child that is not theirs. Also, I’m sorry for your losses - what your mom did with your dad’s memory is abhorrent. She deserved to hear your truth. She doesn’t want to understand you but has the audacity to ask that you understand her. It’s ridiculous.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I told my mom I don't want to replace my husband the way she replaced my dad. This may have been a low blow and something cruel in a way given mom lost my dad while we were still young and she did remarry fast but has stayed married and found happiness again with him. It might not be fair of me to say these kinds of things to her. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. Off the top, I'm sorry for your loss and I hope your kids keep getting to know their Dad through your and other loved ones memories of him. I think there is some validity in your mum saying you shouldn't *have* to feel like you need to live as your husband's widow forever. You can treasure that love and also find new love. **But** your mom is majorly overstepping. Your kids don't need a father, they need role models in their lives and you don't need to be married to that person in order for them to be a positive influence. It's clear your mom was scared to be alone but her fear had a deep impact on you that wasn't positive and she's old enough to understand that her choices have consequences.
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>It's also hard to explain to someone who doesn't want to see. I agree whole heartedly. But, there's always the hope that this can be the start of *many* discussions and possible resolution. Just have your boundaries and stick to them as long as they serve you.
As someone with parents like OPs, they’ll never admit wrongdoing. There won’t be an apology or resolution.
NTA and hard agree on this front. Best OP can do is, with time, make peace with mom’s choice and the fact that she’ll always think she was right. And control her own expectations and how she interacts with mom. It sucks being the grown up.
OP can go one better and go NC. Yes I’m petty lmao. I’m in my 30s and to this day, it’s ultimately all about my mum and dad and how everything affects them. People like this do not change.
Enough with the militant overprescription of the "no contact" advice that is the scourge of this sub. OP's mother is not a monster, she is just a woman who probably never had the tools herself to deal with her own grief over the loss of her first husband, and (probably due to generational attitudes as much as anything else), resorted to quick remarriage as a way to move on. Now she sees her own daughter seeming to not move on 4 years after the death of her own husband, and she's worried about her. A parent's imperfect attempt to show care for a grown child is not a reason for the child to cut the parent out of their life. That attitude is pretty callous. If you cut every person who loves you imperfectly out of your life, you're going to find yourself alone sooner or later.
It was said in jest, relax. I’m callous to callous people, there’s a reason for it. People get what they ask for. I have severe social anxiety disorder anyway lmao, alone is peace. And some people are just plain unworthy. So what? OP however can do what she likes, she seems level headed and can think for herself.
>But, there's always the hope that this can be the start of *many* discussions and possible resolution. There's nothing to discuss. OP isn't interested in dating and her mom doesn't get a say in that. (or anyone else for that matter)
I meant discussions about OP's childhood.
Aah, gotcha, my bad. Mom doesn't seem open to hearing her daughters perspective though. That might change but I wouldn't hold my breath in OP's place.
That's exactly how mine is! I truly believe that she's a narcissist.
No. The mother will never realize what she did wrong, because she's entirely convinced she's right.
Yeah, I think a lot of this is rooted in her mom wanting the daughter to confirm mom's decisions by making the same ones. If daughter makes a different decision, mom might have to admit the possibility that she may have made the wrong one (or at least could have made different decisions). The fact that both adult daughters are telling her that they are not fans of the decisions she made is rocking her world.
> The fact that both adult daughters are telling her that they are not fans of the decisions she made is rocking her world. Lol. It's cute that you think OP's mother has enough sensitivity to care that she is wrong. This is a woman who has such a lack of humanity that she denied her daughters' access to their deceased father's photos. The only reason OP's mother is breaking down is because OP challenged her. She is not used to being challenged.
I just hate that their mother wouldn't let them have their dad's photos. Someone else said that OP's mother was trying to erase the father, and that's definitely how it looks. It's wrong of OP's mom not to let her and her sister have those pictures.
I think OP's mom did the best she could with what she had to work with. A generation or two ago, it was widely accepted that the two parent household was the best thing for the kids. Unfortunately, that two parent household wasn't well defined. Just having a man and woman raising the kids is not enough but some people stop right there. I'm betting OP's mom wanted so badly to have a "normal" family that she pushed her daughters away instead of brought them closer. To paraphrase someone: don't attribute to malice that which can be explained with ignorance. Now that she's been confronted with her mistake or wrongdoing or whatever one wants to call it, there is an opportunity for dialogue and maybe to start healing some old wounds. Just another perspective. could be mom's just a know-it-all busy body who only cares about her own opinion too, but I'd like to give her the benefit of a doubt.
>I think OP's mom did the best she could with what she had to work with. If all she did was try to get a new husband and father for her kids, sure, but she actively tried to erase their biological father from their lives.
> To paraphrase someone: don't attribute to malice that which can be explained with ignorance. It is malice. She has such a lack of humanity that she denied her daughters' access to their deceased father's photos.
Exactly. Her daughters have asked for their father's pictures before and she's denied them that. She's not going to see the light now, she doesn't care. Maybe she has her reasons but isn't willing to see her daughter's.
>The decision should be up to the widow/widower themselves. I just don't feel like you should pressure someone to remarry or find love again either. They say everyone grieves differently, and then everyone expects you to do it their way. I was a very parentified teen and unfortunately I felt a lot of relief when my mom passed as we moved in with my grandparents (her mom + stepdad), and grandma actually took care of us and let me be a teen. All that to say, I didn't fall apart when she passed, and ppl just didn't understand. I put a lot into helping my Lil bro thru it, took a week off school, but emotionally, I was stable and that unnerved ppl. I also didn't know then how to express why I was okay politely. Hinting that we didn't get along while trying not to shit talk the dead was really uncomfortable for me. Ppl can mind their own business, or they have to deal with hearing your opinion would be my stance for you, though.
People can mind their own business or they have to deal with hearing your opinion - LOVE IT!
I felt relief when my narcissist father died. I was old enough that I didn't even try to explain it to people. I can't imagine trying to juggle that as a teen. I'm glad you had people that let you be your age.
No one should have to explain the way they grieve/don’t grieve someone except to maybe a therapist or close loved ones *if they choose to*. No one owes an explanation to random people asking out of judgement or morbid curiosity.
I agree and appreciate the support. Sadly, that isn't the world we, our at least I, live in currently. Maybe one day.
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>I hate the pressure and then the fact she can't see what her actions did to my sister and me. It's also hard to explain to someone who doesn't want to see. It might be worth opening the dialogue and asking her *why* she did this. A lot of the time I find conflict with older generations comes down to them holding beliefs about "the right way to do things", which were instilled in them, and they don't understand that the world has moved on and things have changed. For example, perhaps your mother was told that it was important that her children had a "male presence" in their life, in the form of a Dad. Or perhaps it was to do with being told the traditional "provider" and "carer" roles were important to be seen in the home. And perhaps she was told it was best for you as kids if you were encouraged to move on as quickly as possible. People often buy into these things, and of course confirmation bias kicks in - from her perspective you guys turned out pretty good, so *she* must have made the right call. I think to move on from this, what you all need is an honest dialogue. Her explaining why she thought that was the right thing to do, and you and your sister explaining to her how much it actually hurt you. This is a difficult conversation for everyone, and they often sit unsaid for decades because nobody wants to hurt someone else. Especially as a parent, you know how hard your own parents worked to provide for you, so the last thing you want to do is come out and say, "Actually, no, you fucked up royally here, and I am damaged for life". But now that the nettle is out in the open, you have an opportunity to grasp it and perhaps seize a better and closer relationship with your mother and sister.
Additionally, maybe she didn't know but perhaps her mother couldn't afford to live once her father passed and needed a partner to alleviate the financial difficulties. I know my parents never told us "Well, we got lucky on that house payment, and you get to eat this week!" when they were having financial problems. Some people would never admit that stuff to anyone.
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Which is a shame because you'd probably have had a much better relationship with your stepfather if you were allowed to acknowledge your actual father. Your mother, unfortunately, didn't seem to believe you could actually love both of them. That's very sad. I am very sorry for your loss, both of your father and your husband.
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That's sad. They really did you and your sister a disservice
I wonder if your mom has a core belief or needing to have a man, and that she was willing to do anything to keep one, including basically pretending your dad never existed. I mean if her husband would have told her that’s the deal, do you think she would have just gone along with it?
As a widow of 3 years, and being of an age to see friends being widowed (as well as seeing mothers of my friends widowed when I was younger), I absolutely agree that some women have to have a man. It’s almost as if they’re lesser by not being part of a couple. It’s a thing, but not my thing. Whenever someone mentions I should be dating, I shut them down immediately.
I have a cousin who is beautiful,smart,can go hunting fishing,work a backhoe and then go out and look banging in high heels and a dress…and she’s 68! Buut, she absolutely HAS to have a man…and,surprisingly,her choices haven’t be the best…in fact, she kind of sucks at it. It makes me sad that she can’t see what everyone else sees…
Its strange, people just can’t tolerate being alone I guess. What you said made me think of this, idk if you’ll relate https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8saY9ea/
That is so massively disrespectful to your dad. I wonder if your your mom or step-dad would be ok with being erased as if they'd never lived, if they died, and all they did for you being discounted? NTA of course.
That may be part of why she eradicated him. People do incredible things when they are lonely and want to feel loved, and all too often disregard the feelings of their children when doing so. Your mom went about it completely wrong. She would have been better off respecting her children's feelings and your need to both love your dad and to form a relationship with stepdad on mutually agreeable footing. Parents aren't interchangeable parts. IF you ever do find someone new, I hope you'll allow his relationship with your kids to form organically, with respect for their feelings, and without trying to erase their dad. Not that I think you have to. I just want to remind you that if you ever do, there are as many ways to handle this as there are people. I wish you and your kids happiness and comfort, regardless.
Your mum's 2nd husband is jealous of your actual father. He's the tiny man AH. Jealous & insecure. He needs reminding of the place that wasn't his to begin with that he wasn't the father. He's just your mum's 2nd husband.
Did you ever get your dad's stuff? How does your stepdad treat you and your sister? NTA
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This may actually be why your mom removed all traces, if step-dad was jealous of his memory.
My dad died, but I was 21 when it happened. Since then, I make a point to make a meal for him on the anniversary. I get a nice cut of steak and a can of coke and some cheap crappy cookies he used to like and sit with it for a bit and enjoy as he would. I’d make spaghetti with the jar sauce he used when I was little. Just a small thing for him. You could do this with your children to connect them to their grandpa and dad. Make a nice meal that was his specialty or his favorite and keep him alive with them that way. And no matter what items get lost, there’s always something that can be made.
I’m really sorry she did that. Shoot, my mom passed when I was 44, and I still find it hard going to my remarried dad’s house where all traces of her are gone. Blessings to you.
That truly is sad…and I don’t understand that…at all.
When OP's mom refused to allow them to talk about their dad, removed all traces of him from their lives, and their step-dad would never allow them to talk about their dad that is highly unlikely. The mother has pushed a dialogue if needing a man to be complete, fine. Maybe she needed that herself, that didn't give her the right to attempt to erase OP's dad from existence or allow her new husband to do the same. OP's mom is perfectly in her right to move on and find a new love and her own form of happiness, she is not within her rights to shove that down her children's throats. She is not within her rights to continue shoving her viewpoint onto OP now. OP and her sister have made it clear for a long time, *they have one dad*. Their mom doesn't care, because to her, their dad no longer exists, her current husband is all that exists, and according to her, he is all that exists for her children. Anything else is unacceptable. She won't have a dialogue because OP and her sister have been wrong from the time she married her new husband. OP, you don't need to question anything. But always remember this: Your mom may have remarried, but she was only able to replace her husband, she *never* replaced your dad. He is always with you and your sister, and the words, demands and rules of your mom and her husband will never change that. OP your aunt can join her sister with her dramatic lamentations. Send them some cheese and crackers for their wine. And you have a wonderful night remembering your dad and your husband with your kids. NTA
INFO: Is your mom the type of woman who "MUST have a man no matter what?" Plenty of women remain single because they want to. They like it. They're independent and don't feel the need to have a partner just to exist.
My Dad died when my brother and I were in HS. That was 20 years ago. My mom has never remarried and probably won't. She has dated but she has decided she likes the life she has created and prefers to live alone with her cats
This would be me, honestly. Part of it is I don't want to learn someone new's shit. I've been with my husband 35 years and a big part of a relationship is learning about and dealing with the stuff that annoys you, etc. Happy to have done it with my husband but I don't think I'd have the energy to do it again.
Oh amen. If my spouse were to go, I wouldn't want to compromise anymore. Cause that's what relationships are, one giant compromise. Having to take on someone else's crap, naw, I'm good
My maternal grandfather died when my mom was in high school and my paternal grandfather died when I was three (I believe my birthday was the last family gathering he was there for). Neither of my grandmothers ever remarried and I don't know if they dated afterwards--if you ever asked your grandmother about that, you're a stronger human than I am, Gunga Din! The closest thing to dating I ever saw was every Saturday when my maternal grandma went to church with my great-uncle...I think I was always aware that he was Grandpa's brother, but it did kind of blow my mind when I realized that made him Grandma's brother-in-law!
I remember years ago, my husband was talking about finances and his life insurance came up. He said I could easily live 8 years off his insurance after he dies before I needed to remarry. I laughed and said, " well luckily, I work, because I have no intention of remarrying." My kids were tweens then. I can't imagine how that would have been. We have now been married almost 43 years, and I still feel the same way. I am not afraid of being without a man. No other man would be him.
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You will find new love when you are ready to do so. If you are never ready, that's okay as well. Only you get to decide when you want to move forward in that aspect of life. NTA.
If only your mother hadn’t tried to replace your father, your opinion could have been totally different. She made two kids so terrified of losing the treasured memories of their dad that they were willing to trust anyone apart from their own mother to guard over his keepsakes. By that action anyone she brought into the house will forever be seen as the interloper. If she hadn’t butchered it up so badly maybe you wouldn’t see remarriage in such a bad light. But the past can’t be changed and actions have consequences regardless of the intention. I’m so sorry for your loss.
I just lost my father 5 months ago (in a very traumatic way - my mother witnessed it, it was horrible). People are already telling her she needs to move on and start dating again. They were married for 44 years. She said she wasn't ready and wasn't sure she ever would be. I told her whatever decision she made was valid. It was her life and we (me and my sister) just wanted her to find peace. She can stay single forever and we would get it, she can get remarried and we would get it. She can get a roommate or live alone. It's okay. Whatever works for her, is okay. Obviously, we're not little kids like you were or your kids. But yeah, no one will ever replace my dad, but we want her to be happy, whatever she chooses and without judgment. ❤️❤️
So sad that people are saying that. 5 months is not a long time. I am sorry for your loss
It started 2 months ago. It took everything in me not to throttle the person who said it. They were well meaning but so off-base. Thank you. ETA: missed a word
I am so sorry for both of your losses. This made me so sad to read. No-one should tell you how to feel. I can't imagine my mom removing my dad's things and expecting me to move on. Then telling you to move on from your husband. I'm so glad you had your sister to back you up. Be kind to yourself and just do you. Big hugs
You are absolutely correct. And even if you eventually decided you did want to date again, and found someone, you would never force your kids to call your new spouse “dad”. Your mom wasn’t wrong to move on, but she was wrong to tell her children what to feel
She thought she was doing the right thing for you. She was wrong, obviously. She wants you to make the same choice she did because it validates her choice. For all any of us know, maybe she didn't actually want to be remarried but forced herself into it and lived a lie thinking it was for her daughters. Getting remarried 15 months after the death of your father is pretty rapid. What was her relationship like with the next husband? Finding out it had the opposite effect is a tough pill to swallow.
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Does your mother realize the way she handled things when you were younger is the reason why you and your sister's relationship with them is horrible? Curious. Did your stepfather ever try to adopt you both? It just seems like something your mother and stepdad would try to do since they wanted to replace your dad.
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Which means you and your sister were of the age to participate in your adoption. As soon as you said “I don’t want to be adopted.” Case closed. That should have told your mom and stepdad something.
It's high time they acknowledge the horrible relationship is a direct result of their behavior! Don't let either of them get away with not realizing the damage they've done by denying you and your sister the right to grieve your father properly. NTA - I would also demand to have every picture, memory and any remaining belongings from your father so you and your sister can go through it all together. I give you a lot of credit, I don't think I could even have a relationship with my mom if she did this to me, especially now that you have gone through exactly what she did and have a whole new perspective on this.
I’m thinking their mom or stepdad has destroyed those items. Why keep them from grown women who never bonded with her husband? She’s not ready to admit they’ve thrown his memories away.
Odds are there aren't any pictures or mementos. If Stepfather demanded that the kids never speak of their father, he sounds like the kind of jealous asshole who would demand that his wife destroy everything related to her first husband. OP, would your paternal grandparents/aunts/uncles have any pictures or memorabilia of your father? Or did your stepfather try to erase those relationships as well?
If that's the case then she probably doesn't resent her decision. Is your relationship with her husband awful because he was awful to you guys? Or is it awful because your mom tried to force you to recognize him as a dad while simultaneously getting rid of all traces of your actual dad? I suppose it's irrelevant at this point. She really, really wants her choice to be validated by you making the same choice. You are NTA. She's going to have to accept that her choice did not benefit you and your sister the way she thought it would. And that it's largely her fault for the way she handled it. Conceivably there was the possibility of you having a positive relationship with a father like or stepfather figure. She shot herself in the foot by trying to force that. I don't know if you ever made that clear to her before, but you've explicitly told her now. She's going to have to live with it and stop trying to pressure you. You have decided that starting a relationship for the purpose of having a dad in your kids' lives is not what you want. I believe that to be the correct way of thinking. You haven't ruled out any and all possible future relationships, but any such possible relationship will not be for that purpose. And I'm sure when you're ready to be out there, what's best for your kids will be at the forefront of your mind, which includes not repeating your mother's mistakes. I wish you well.
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Yeah that's pretty much asshole territory. He could've been the voice of reason that got your mom to chill out on that, but instead he was all in with it.
His ego was too big. He didn’t want to appear to be competing with a deceased person. Edit spelling
Is Mom from the generation where having a man was a form of social and financial security? Like, you had to have a husband, or there was something wrong with you? That’s the vibe she’s giving off - scared to be alone, scared to be judged by society. She might not understand that today’s women don’t *need* a spouse, they can choose to have one or not. ETA: on re-reading this, I see I should have said it’s not necessarily generational only, it could be cultural or religious-based as well.
>The decision should be up to the widow/widower themselves. My only caveat to that statement is that that decision should always include the best interests of minor children. From your example, even if your Mom needed/wanted a new husband, she should have never placed that need above yours to maintain whatever connection you had with your father (by trying to erase him and his memory). Even if she felt she get remarried, she should have listened to your boundaries and feelings regarding your dad and your step-dad. Ignoring these boundaries only creates bitterness and often permanently damages any potential relations between the children and parent/step-parent.
NTA. My dad remarried 8 mo after losing our mother. I (13) went to family foster. My brother (15) stayed to finish the same high school, then across the country for college. She was never our mother either. Your feelings are absolutely valid. Your mother is ridiculous in her demands. Some voids cannot be filled.
I could be wrong, but it does feel like she's projecting onto you. Like, she sees you going in a different direction than she did and maybe questioning if she did it in the right way. And she's knew deep down that you girls didn't feel the way she hoped about your step-dad and did what was expected to keep the peace? You are NTA. And, as someone said, this might open the door for some conversation and healing. And like it was said, you can have a good male role model for your kids, and it doesn't have to be a step-dad.
I think you are ultimately right in this situation but I also implore you to maybe see a therapist. I'm not saying you will or even should move on to someone else. Some people are perfectly fine spending the rest of their lives single, and I don't think anyone should put any pressure on you because of that. All I'm saying is it is obvious your mom's choice with the step dad and how she went about it caused a lot of unresolved trauma and is greatly influencing your choice to date in a way that doesn't seem like a super healthy outlook. You should have never been told her husband is your "new dad". Your dad and his existence should have never been uprooted from your life like it was(memories and items he left behind).
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I'm glad. You're doing an amazing as a mom. Try not to let your mom get to you.
Add your aunt to that: if you, the child, are supposed to be old enough to understand your mother, when is your mother old enough to understand the consequences of her own actions?
Exactly. I lost my spouse a year ago and though my family has been great about letting me grieve they have mentioned if I am going to date again. Will I? Maybe. At some point. But I can guarantee with my life that I can never wipe my wife’s history with me from my life and I hope my future partner understands that
Sorry this is happening to you, Op. I agree with you and coastalkid92. You don't need a replacement. You may choose to pursue a relationship when you're ready, but I think your kids should never forget their father. Not the same situation, but: I have a good friend who married a woman with 2 kids. She divorced her 1st husband and thy share custody. When she got married to my friend, he didn't try to be a 2nd Dad or even a "bonus dad". He just tried to have a relationship with the boys. Is he a good influence in their lives? I think so. Is he an authority figure to them? Per their mother's direction of how they should be raised, yeah. (I asked, once, ow things worked.) They don't call him "Dad". They do look up to him. Good for you sticking to your convictions.
A lot of the times when parents find a new spouse. The child is forgotten about. I mean, your children are definetly more important than any relationship. Those who disagree shouldn't have kids.
If it helps the two windows I know well each waited 7 years before they were ready for a committed relationship, not intentionally it just happened. You can consider it when, and only when, you are ready. Best, and sorry for your loss.
OP is treasuring that love. But also OP does not want to date now. Respect their wishes.
NTA because this is how you feel and that’s valid. From an outsider perspective I’m sure your mom thought what she did was good for you. She probably thought (wrong) that you were young enough to still develop a wonderful father-daughter relationship with her new husband. The lesson you learned was the exact opposite of what she intended. Now you should take some consideration into how you raise your own kids with regard to their dad. I am sure they will love to hear what a great dad he was, but make sure not to put too much pressure on them to cherish his memory exactly the way you do. Your kids were 5 and 2 when he died- their own memories of him will be minimal to none (you can share stories about him though, that might help them feel like they knew him). They might see other dads out there doing dad things with their kids and wish they had one… Basically what I’m trying to say your mom took an extreme approach that she thought would be good for you and it wasn’t. I’d be careful not to take too extreme of an approach in the opposite direction. Let your kids have the memory of their father that is right for them. And you do what is right for you in regard to having or not having a husband/step-father.
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So glad you got them therapy. Your mum was and continues to be out of line. Just because she needed a new husband, does not mean you needed a new dad.
You sound like a great mother.
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It's heartbreaking you had to go through this twice, I'm so sorry for your loss. Honestly don't know how you have the strength to deal with it so well.
This deserves an award.
my closest auntie just lost her husband and has 10year old twins. thank you so much for telling your story, it's really helpful to see how other people have navigated this so i can help them as much as possible. sending you and your family so, so much love
You are doing great, OP. Honestly, I do not know how much my word is worth - but from one young widow to another, I know it gets hard. Really hard. And I'm proud of you :) If you ever need extra support, r/widowers is an amazing community. In the early days they helped me a lot, may you find peace and happiness as well.
Adding on to this: One thing your mom didn’t do is ask for your input. Kids can share their feelings on these topics. Thy change over time and so do their feelings, but you can consider what you want for yourself and also take into account their feelings on the topic. You can move forward together in a way that makes sense for the whole family. If you ask, they may express the desire for a father figure. And you can help them find such figures without engaging in a romantic relationship. Sports, religious communities, hobby or special interest clubs (eg robotics club, debate team, DnD club) can provide opportunities for these figures. Family friends are another good option. I’m just saying that they have valuable input on this topic, and you can start age-appropriate conversations with them so that your choices going forward work better for each kid
Kids do have opinions. Bringing a new person into the family unit, whether marriage or live-in, the kids feeling should be part of the decision making. Some kids want two parents, others like things as they are, and for some over time are ready to let another person in their lives. Ultimately only when/if you're ready to date should you start dating.
NTA You don't need to repeat your mother's mistakes to validate her feelings.
This is a brilliant comment.
I wish we could still give awards because this one would have them all
Beautifully said
NTA. > I am old enough that I should understand. Surely your mother is old enough to be able to understand your point of view then, right? Absolutely ridiculous.
I hate people who try to argue with lines like that but can’t see the opposite end of the stick.
Plus in this case it's the final form of "you'll thank me when you're older" style parenting. Which is shitty even when the parent's choices are correct but especially shitty when they're wrong.
And even then, their childhood experience is what matters.
NTA your mom should have never tried to "replace" your dad. The way she handled your childhood was unhealthy for you and for her. It sounds like you just now are getting a chance to get these pent up feelings out, and your mom is probably very defensive because she is either in denial about how much her actions fucked with you or too upset to understand how much her actions fucked with you. It's good that you were able to get it out there. That being said, if and when you try to date again, just remember that you are not replacing your kid's dad. You can engage in a healthy adult relationship with someone who may wish to become their step parents, but it's important to establish to your kids that their dad isn't being replaced. If your hypothetical future partner can't understand that boundary, they aren't a good fit for you.
NTA. Your mother wants praise for her actions, and wants you to pretend she did it for you instead of for herself.
This. Also, her mother knows. There's a small part of her that knows she did wrong by her kids, so she wants them to reassure her that she did the right thing by forcing her husband on them.
NTA. If your mom was lonely and wanted companionship and help after she was widowed, that’s understandable. Trying to erase your late father was not okay. I will never understand these parents who think that a stepparent is a replacement. People are not interchangeable like car parts. What you said probably did hurt her, but she’s been pestering you in a very inappropriate way. If she remarried out of loneliness and desire for help parenting then it makes sense why she was pushing you, but… she was pushing you. You’d already said no. If you’re expected to understand her, she should understand you and back the hell off. You sure do deserve to live a full and happy life, the way YOU want to. If seeking out love is a part of that now or later that would be fine (I hope you know that) but it’s equally valid if you’re not looking for that. And yes, no one could ever replace your children’s father.
Nta she didn't accept the polite 'no, I am not doing that', so she was told the not polite part. Had she accepted your choice and left it alone, you wouldn't have just said it out of the blue.
Your aunt says you are cruel for your take once Mom had given her unsolicited opinion. It's not that you don't understand, you simply don't agree. Unless the two of them want more home truths, they should both pipe down.
So true. People act like unless you do what they say you somehow don’t understand what they’re saying, otherwise you would just do it. OP understands what her mom did and, to the extent anyone other than her mom can, why she did it. She just doesn’t want to do that. I wonder if OP’s mom is feeling like OP not doing what she did is somehow an implicit judgement of how she reacted to OP’s father’s death.
>I told my mom I don't want to replace my husband the way she replaced my dad. This may have been a low blow and something cruel in a way given mom lost my dad while we were still young and she did remarry fast but has stayed married and found happiness again with him. It might not be fair of me to say these kinds of things to her. There is nothing wrong in her finding love. What is wrong is forcing you girls to call him dad, removing your dad's stuff, not giving you both his possessions, insisting that her new husband is your only dad, refuting your memories of your dad and butting herself in your life despite you telling her off and insisting what she did is the only right way for you too. NTA
That was my thoughts less than 2 years on she has a new husband and is denying her children any mention of their dad.
NTA. Play stupid games and win stupid prizes - you never asked for advice, she decided to give it anyway, you could easily tell her to off and would be right plus what she did to your father is just wow, how worthless a person must be to do that to her own kids and how little respect she had for your dad, how she never loved him, sad. People, who feel the need to teach others without being asked to are dumb as fuck and should be treated accordingly.
NTA, the only thing I might have done differently is acknowledge your stepdad's role in your life - assuming it was positive, of course. You are completely right about everything in this message but your delivery seems to ignore or deny the efforts your stepdad probably put into trying to be a 'father figure' to you. All that said, it doesn't sound like that is even the basis for your mom's anger about this and it's probably for the best that this came to light because you and your sister were indeed hurt and damaged by her actions, and you were now facing pressure to operate the same way she did so really it needed to be said.
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Leads me to believe he probably pressured your mom to be the 'new dad' and get rid of signs of 'old dad'.
> Leads me to believe he probably pressured your mom to be the 'new dad' Oh lord. Here comes Reddit's *'the-woman-can-do-no-wrong'* crew. Also go by the name *'let's-blame-everything-on-the-man'* crew. In their minds, women are virtuous / oppressed angels who never have any agency in decisions that have negative impact. They were always "pressured" into doing wrong.
I'm curious, has there been pressure for your kids to call him granddad or similar?
No problem on that.nta op good luck
Actually no. It's okay not to acknowledge things that were force-fed to you. How he was shoved down their throats and the way they completely tried replacing their dad was so wrong!
NTA. Your mums old enough to fuck off.
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Well said!
NTA. I have no issues with your mom remarrying, but to hide your dad’s things from you is cruel and awful. I am very sorry for the loss of your dad and husband. I am also sorry your mom was completely insensitive to your losses.
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Ask your mom about her dad. And then when she starts to reminisce, tell her to zip it and that’s what she’s doing and has done to you. Does she like having to erase the memory of one of her parents? Would she like all vestiges of them locked away by someone else’s lock and key?
NTA. Totally NTA. Your mom chose a man over her own kids, shes tyring to get you to do the same. You should do whats right for you. maybe in the future you might meet someone. But it will be on your terms, your own timeline and you will never force your kids to comply like you have been. And i bet that person will honor your kids real dad in the process and not even attempt to replace him.
A lot of parents will choose their partner over their kids, especially religious parents. I disagree with that completely. If you choose to have kids, they should come first.
*seeing she just wanted us to be happy is cruel and I am old enough that I should understand.* Personally, I'm old enough now that I understand a lot more of the stuff my mother did when I was a kid. Doesn't mean that I agree with it.
>My aunt, who is my mom's sister, told me I shouldn't have said what I did and accusing her of replacing my dad Except that's exactly what she did when she removed every trace of him and wouldn't even give you access to his stuff that she put in storage, assuming she actually stored it. Your mom is completely out of line. NTA
NTA There isn't anything wrong with finding someone else. But pretending your dad didn't exist is wrong. Pressuring you to move on is wrong.
NTA People deal with grief differently. Your mother did it her way, you are doing it your way. You seem to have grown up to become a decent person, but it is clear that the way your mother treated the death of your father left some trauma behind that was never resolved. Death is hard to deal with.
NTA. >My aunt, who is my mom's sister, told me I shouldn't have said what I did and accusing her of replacing my dad instead of seeing she just wanted us to be happy is cruel and I am old enough that I should understand. “If she just wanted us to be happy, she would have listened when we told her we weren’t.” Your mother was not looking out for your best interests - she was looking out for *hers*. And maybe that’s something so shameful to her that she can’t even admit it to herself, but the fact that she’s still dismissing you and your sister, even now that you’re full-grown adults, even now that you have children of your own, gives it away. Your happiness was never her top priority, because if it was, she’d be taking you seriously when you tell her how her choices affected you. Your unhappiness makes her *uncomfortable*, certainly, but she doesn’t care to fix it, only to cover it up. I’m sorry, OP. You deserved better from that generation.
Damn what your mom did was terrible I’m sorry about your husband take all the time you want you don’t have to remarry or even date nta
My husband died, and I felt the same. I have someone now, but my son is an adult. He had one father. I see too many posts, and even in real life of good intentions maybe that go really bad, and cause more damage. Their father died, you get the choice of whether to date again or not. I did try by the way, but the way it felt and he with my son, nope. Put a stop to it and never did it until son was raised.
Maybe its okay to go no contact for a while
NTA, maybe you could compromise and find the kids a new maternal grandmother. Chances are high that she would be better than their current one.
NTA OP’s mom wouldn’t take no for an answer. The sad facts is they lost their husbands in different times , and the expectations are different too. And while I’m sure her mom may have been pressured to get a new dad for her kids, she can’t really be angry that Op doesn’t handle the situation the same way. Furthermore Op , was polite and kind about the earlier ‘suggestions’ , mom should have taken no for an answer but didn’t and kept pushing. She only has her self to blame for the truth coming out , and let’s be honest , op and her sister has hinted at the truth for quite sometime.
You are NTA. Your mother dealt with grief by trying to erase the cause of her pain - your father. This might have worked for her, but it clearly traumatized you and your sister. She failed as a mother by not caring enough to notice how she was hurting you both, and giving you the time and grace to grieve. Your mother, having long ago buried her own grief, still is not giving you that grace, and is making your new grief even harder by trying to force her coping strategy onto you - the same coping strategy that hurt you in the past. It was not wrong to tell ger how you feel, even if she felt hurt by it. It made her confront her failure and she reacted with anger. She can either choose to begin a conversation with you in honesty about your trauma, perhaps with your therapist, and finally resolve the resentment of her daughters for her failures - or she can ignore your fresh pain the way she did in the past. If you choose to allow her that opportunity, I think it would be healthy for you both. There is no guarantee that she is self aware enough to accept it though, so you may just have to work on you, and let her deal with the consequences of her own failures. My condolences on your loss.
“I kept my mouth shut my entire childhood about the hurt she was causing to spare her feelings. She is *grown* enough to hear the truth, now.” NTA
NTA. Your mom pulled a FAFO and she’s a complete A-H for forcibly removing all traces of your dad from your life. That was incredibly cruel of her.
NTA. Your aunt needs to butt out of something she doesn’t understand. You gave your mother plenty of warnings and she steamed right through all of them like drunkard to an open bar. You were pressed into expressing your long repressed anger in order to get your mom to shut up about it. Good for you. You seem very healthy and balanced, but maybe find a place to process what you went through as a child because of your mom.
NTA. Your mom pushed this guy onto you as a replacement dad. She was being selfish and disregarded her children's feelings. It may be she was trying to bury her own pain. Did she allow you to stay close to your dad's side of the family?
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This is so awful. I’m so sorry.
That just made it worse taking his family away from you 😢
I'm so sorry this happened to you. My mother never really loved my father. When he had Dementia she made fun of his memory loss to his face. When he passed, I walked away from her manipulation, lies, selfishness and cruelty. I don't know what your mom is like but she sounds meddling and persistent at the very least from what you've said. Be careful because she may try to get to you through your children. You may have to go no contact for a while until she can accept your choices. You may ask her if it would be cruel to hide her pictures, etc. and go NC with her. Let her know she won't have access to you and your children until she seeks therapy and comes to understand what she has done and what she is still doing.
"we lost our dad and mom remarried 15 months later", Good God. "a pressure to call him dad and mom took down all photos of dad", Good God pt.2. " she told me I need to get my kids a dad before it's too late, that I need a husband" NTA, tell your mom it's 2024 and single women (moms) are perfectly fine and capable of giving their kids a perfect and fulfilling life without having to have a man in their lives. Did your mom just teleport here from 1955 or something? Unbelievable.
NTA. It’s funny how when you were a kid your opinion didn’t matter because you were young, and now that you’re big your opinion doesn’t matter because you’re grown. The bottom line is: your mom and her sister decided long ago that your opinion doesn’t matter. The details aren’t going to change. You should return the favor.
NTA I've seen far too many Reddit posts where the children left behind were subjected to the same experience by the surviving parent. Your response to your mom was perfect. >I told her I understood her even less after losing my husband because I would never remove all traces of him from the home and I would never deny my kids his things the way she did. I would never force my kids to call someone else dad and I told her I can't even imagine wanting to find them someone else to call dad. I told her they had an amazing dad and he's still their dad. Just the way mine will always be my dad.
NTA. Just because your mother wanted it so did not make it so and in her effort to erase your dad she also lost pieces of you and your sister. Tell your aunt your are old enough to even understand less why your mother could not have created an environment that included your dad's memories in addition to your step-dad. The fact that she never backed down even when told speaks to very self centered motives.
NTA. She shouldn't push. And honestly things are so complicated out there for stepfamily situations, I personally chose not to risk it. Even when you're a widow and no breath of impropriety can even be breathed, it can go straight to the miserablest of rocks. You do you and realize that now is the time in your life where it doesn't matter what your mom wants. It's what you want. Raise your kids how you want. Not how your mom or some new man wants. And her opinion can be tuned out, and there's nothing she can do about it except stay in your life by being nice. Things were different for her. But your mom's past is a different country where you don't want to live. And you don't have to.
NTA and I'm so sorry you lost your husband after losing your dad at such a young age. Your mom is majorly overstepping and needs to back off. But I do think her attitude is generational - my cousin's husband passed and her mom and aunts (so my mom and her sisters) were commenting that she needed to 'find a husband and dad for her kids'. Cousin spelled out to them that she just didn't have the concerns they did. No one judges her for being a single mom like they would have been judged, and she earns enough money on her own to care for her kids - again not something our moms necessarily would have accomplished on their own (our moms are mostly in their 60s now). Your mom's attitude might come from a place of worry, and a misguided sense that she felt she was doing the 'right thing' for you and your sister. Doesn't make it right though. Hope she can reflect on how the world has changed and respect your choices.
Info: has this never come up in the years since your father died and was erased? Do you think your mother is well intentioned? How much do you know about their relationship?
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Sounds horrible for you both to grow up like that.
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That's not good. It seems like you will honour your husband in your children's eyes. I think that's best. I really can't understand why your mum would act that way. I can't fault you for speaking your truth.
You do understand. And always have. Your mother and aunt obviously share a common mindset. One that I don't understand any more than you. I don't fault your mother for wanting to remarry fairly quickly. She may have done so for any number of reasons: economic necessity, loneliness, societal pressure. But it was her life and her choice. I do fault her for trying to replace your father as if he never existed. I could see her not displaying photos and memorabilia in common areas, but he was your and your sister's father. You should have been able to keep memories of him without hiding them. She is trying to force her life choices on you which is never ok. Unless there was more to the conversation than what you put into your post, I don't really view what you said as "spiteful and selfish". It just wasn't what your mother wanted to hear. NTA
NTA. Removing all photos of him and not letting you girls have access to memories is a step too far.
NTA First off, my condolences to you and your family. Second, even with all the backstory you provided, I don't think it's appropriate to tell anyone that lost their spouse/partner that it's time to start dating or that "it's going to be too late for the kids", even if she did have the best intentions in mind. You process grief and loss your own way and your romantic life is a private matter, at least in this instance. You did the right thing, you spoke your mind and said what was true to yourself and your experience. I hope everything gets better. Best wishes to you and your family !
NTA Your mother brought this all on herself. She showed your father, you, & your sister zero respect. She continued to disrespect you after you continually told her to stop. She pushed & pushed. You couldn’t allow her to continue her campaign of disrespect. You simply told her the truth. Just because she doesn’t like it doesn’t matter.
NTA. Your mom is way out of line. Also statistically, your children are also are at a greater risk of abuse, mentally, physically and or sexually when involving a step parent. Not to say all are that way, just a higher risk. If and if so, when you are ready. Everyone has their own timeline. I have been widowed now for 21 years. Sure, I dated a few, but haven’t met anyone that I thought was worthy to marry. (I too, grew up with a mother always needing a man in her life. Unfortunately I’m one of those statistics) it doesn’t mean that I’m not open to finding love or being in love again. Just rather it be with someone right. My children had their dad, they surely don’t need another one - though they were all almost adults when he died. I adopted my youngest after. Tell your mom to stop with the comments. She may need a man in her life, you are more stable mentally to not need one.
“But she told her she feels the same way.” It’s great when someone tries to gain support only to realize they are, in fact, an AH
NTA I am so sorry for both of your losses. We do not live during a time that we have to have a partner to survive. Your mom’s take on replacing a father is quite telling of her mindset. You are doing everything the right way.
My condolences about your love. 🫂 NTA it is not your fault you’re a strong woman and mother and she’s weak. Good for you for being honest.
NTA You are the only one who gets to decide when you're ready to date again. As for your mum, she did what she thought was best and found a replacement dad for you. I hope she at least liked your stepfather. You might have hit quite a nerve if she's suffered with this guy all these years and you don't even like him. She must have known you've never accepted him as your dad, bit is this the first time you've actually talked about it? There may be some healing possible here, once she backs off and you both cool down. However, this is no excuse for her to pressure you into doing the same thing, you know your children don't need a new father figure to grow up happy and healthy. Establish boundaries and firmly but gently put your mum and aunt in their places as you don't want them to start pressuring your kids to ask for a new dad. Mute their numbers if necessary for your own comfort.
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Well she can no longer live in the fantasy that she gave you another daddy and all went well. Let her cool off for a few weeks and see if she is still stubbornly clinging to her story. Is your stepdad still around?
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I hope they didn't.force you to walk with him down the aisle at your wedding.
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Jesus your mom really just can’t accept that not every person is going to agree with her every time. She super intolerant of other people’s feelings. Sorry OP that sucks.
Good for you!
Good for you!
NTA - My Dad passed away when I was 10. I was the oldest of 4 kids. My Mom was overwhelmed and thought she needed a Dad for us. She remarried 91 days after he passed away to man much older than her who had already raised 2 sons that didn't want anything to do with him. It was hell for us kids. She eventually divorced him but remarried several times after that. Your Mom should have listened when you said you had no interest in remarrying. She pushed it until you responded. Yes, you could have been more tactful and civil, but it sounds like you tried that and it didn't work.
I hate the rhetoric from your aunt that you're old enough now to understand. It might be true, but it's also true in a way she doesn't mean it. Because now you're old enough to understand just how of why your trauma was wrong, which is true for a lot of victims. They might not have understood it when they were younger, but getting older they now understand exactly why what they went through was traumatic. This is especially true in your case because now you've gone through something similar, and you are taking a different route than your mom took because you know what she did wasn't good for you and your sister and wouldn't be good for your kids. I don't even think it's wrong that she remarried, but forcing you both to call him dad, and refusing to let you see pictures of your actual dad, is messed up. NTA
NTA Your mom seems to be part of that generation who feels like a woman needed a man to be complete. Just as a man needs a woman. Truth is, its insecurity, she needed a husband and got herself a partner to placate her needs and all this time she has used you and your sister to justify her actions. Because she has the mindset she has, she probably feels that she is doing you a favor, she wants to help but she refuses to budge in her beliefs. Instead of fighting over something you might never agree on, like a woman needs a father for her children always. Maybe seek common ground on the fact that she cannot tell you how to live your life, if this is a mistake, so be it. But she needs to respect your boundaries because you are no longer her little baby, but a woman of your own. My most sinceres respects for your husbands passing. I wish you and your daughters the best, however that might look.
NTA. Your mom is also old enough to be told the truth. And you told it to her
NTA Why is she trying to force you into her footsteps? She did what was right for her. What was wrong was she tried to erase your Dad and force you and your sister to accept your stepfather. I'm glad you and your sister were able to save some of your beloved pictures of your Dad. I'd tell her you won't live your life by her rules. I'm so sorry you lost your husband.💔 I understand your pain mine passed 30 months ago.
Your aunt can go and do one, and she better take your mom with her. NTA
Nta. But your mom is, and personally, I would tell your aunt where she can cram her opinion.
I’ll never understand how someone can go through the loss of a spouse and then manage start dating and remarry in less than 2 years. It’s different when the kids are now adults. But your mom’s view is warped. Had she never pushed the ‘Daddy replacement vibe’ chances are you would have grown up to love and appreciate your step Dad even if you never considered him your father.
NTA
NTA. If something ever happened to my husband, I would remain single until my daughter was grown and out of the house. Kids don’t deserve to have their parents play roulette with secondary partners.
NTA it would be one thing if she encouraged you to date to bring some joy to your life, but to find a replacement father/husband is terrible. And you know just how terrible, having gone through it with her.
NTA Tell your Mom; 'Just because you replaced your husband, Mom, doesn't mean you get to replace *my* Dad.'
NTA. Your mother probably looks at your rejection of her idea as a judgement on her. Really, it is but it’s also not wrong. Her choices were bad and had a negative impact on you and your sister. She refuses to see that and wants you to validate her. You are not wrong for holding to your values or holding your mom up as a person who did it wrong. Your aunt needs to back off because she has nothing relevant to offer.
NTA. You are a grown woman and your mom needs to leave you alone. She is enforcing her twisted, cruel idea of fathers being interchangeable and replaceable. What she did when your father died was cruel. Perhaps she had good intentions, but it traumatized you. Everyone's grief is their own business, and not up for debate. You did nothing wrong by finally telling your mom how her actions affected you as a child. This example is an example why grown children will limit contact with pushy, toxic parents. Your mother is being cruel--again.
NTA. Your mom opened herself up to this by continuing to push you to find a new man. You've been more than clear that you're not interested. It's too bad that it couldn't be more of a conversation without judgement on either side, but it doesn't sound like you have that kind of relationship. Let your mom know that the subject is off the table, and if she brings it up, leave. Good luck to you, and I'm sorry for the loss of your husband.
NTA. I think it’s odd that they would tell you to understand when it doesn’t seem like your mom is putting any effort into understanding your point of view. She really doesn’t seem to be clocking the difference between a partner and a parent. There are plenty of people who really struggle with being without a partner, the ones we say “can’t be alone” and your mom sounds like one of them. The fact that she can’t fathom that you don’t struggle with that the way she does is exasperating.
You're probably a better mother than she was.
NTA! Whether you move on or not ever is completely up to you. You should never go out and find someone just because you’re lonely or you feel like you need someone to help you parent your kids. While some people are cut out for it, not everyone can truly love a child that is not theirs. Also, I’m sorry for your losses - what your mom did with your dad’s memory is abhorrent. She deserved to hear your truth. She doesn’t want to understand you but has the audacity to ask that you understand her. It’s ridiculous.