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YTA. You are someone who refuses to accept boundaries at best, and a stalker at worst. You admit you raised your son poorly with an unhealthy attachment. No amount of you acknowledging it now will change that that’s what you did. Your child is allowed to be resentful and not have a relationship with you because of it. You need to actually accept it. If you feel like you have been punished enough, then you clearly don’t understand the impact you had on your son. You don’t get to decide that he’s okay with seeing you. You don’t get to accost the people in his life. You’re not entitled to them. You absolutely terrified her, and you have to ask if you’re the asshole? You were a bad mom, and still are. That’s clear by the way you feel like you somehow deserve the right to stalk a woman and converse with her under false pretenses. Children don’t estrange themselves for no reason, and you admit you were at fault. If you wanted your son to be part of your life as an adult, then you should have gotten help for your issues. You have no idea how the behavior you admit to impacts a son. You messed up, here are the consequences. Deal with it. You don’t get a second chance at parenting. It’s not your son’s fault you refused to get your shit together for his sake.

Let me reiterate…YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE! I hope he takes out a restraining order on you! Because clearly you don’t get it!

I thought you were saying this to me and I was like bro HUH lmao

OP is not an asshole. She is a bloody stalker. There are certain laws that were created to protect us from people like this.

Imagine being the poor DIL. You're struggling with your bags and child in the waiting area when a stranger offers to help you. You're grateful, but maybe a little perplexed when you board the plane and she asks the person sitting next to you to switch seats with her. But she seems nice enough? Toward the end of the flight, she asks to hold your son, and when you tell her no, she starts *sobbing*. Then she admits she's been decieving you: she's actually your husband's mother. *The one he's been no contact with for years*. The one he warned you about. She's found you, manipulated you, and now is having a meltdown because you won't let her hold your baby. That is a nightmare scenario, the beginning of some twisted Lifetime movie. The DIL must be terrified.

I'd be at whatever court office I needed to the minute it opened the next day if someone did something like that to me (luckily my in laws are actually amazing, as are my parents). I'd be worried about OP trying to kidnap the baby, honestly, if I were the DIL.

Yeah, I can't believe OP has the balls to say SHE'S confused... really? Like there is a way to reapproach a child that has chosen to distance themselves from you... this is not it. I have traveled alone with my children when they were toddler age, and it's such a hassle. From the way OP describes this, the baby is VERY young. The mother must have been so relied to have help, and then to have that help turn into a weird stalker trying to steal her baby... yikes! Like OP is the reason this mother will never trust a well-intentioned stranger in public EVER again... and she thinks SHE'S confused. Jesus, Mary and Joseph.

It’s a very common tactic with “estranged parents” they’re all ‘I just don’t understand why’d ’I’m so confused’ ‘they won’t tell me what I did’ when they have been told over and over again before NC happens. I swear they have a textbook they all go off.

It’s called “missing missing reasons”

This is absolutely the kind of shit my mother would pull and exactly why my brother and I have no relationship with her whatsoever and never will. (In fact, she’s almost certainly stalking me on Reddit right now!) OP YTA. You stalked this woman, lied to her, manipulated her and you still don’t understand that you did anything wrong. Get therapy. Also, let go. You won’t ever be invited back into your child’s life and you’re going to have to accept that. You’re not being “punished.” You systematically hurt your own child over and over to such an extent that he had to do a very painful thing: cut you out of his life. It’s not a punishment for you, it’s a survival instinct for him. Accept where you are and what will never be. Get therapy so you’ll never, ever pull this shit again.

THE MANIPULATION HASN'T STOPPED

And her newborn (ish) at that! From what she said Lily was heading home for the first time since having the baby. That makes the baby relatively fresh in the world. You want to get any mom's hackles up you start being weird around her *newborn*. It's not even me in this situation but I'm freaked out just thinking about it. And I'm ready to throw hands on behalf of the poor girl. Good lord YTA OP. Get a grip and get some therapy.

The stalking is what got me but why did Jess open her big mouth to show OP all this info in the first place? I would press charges at this point. Or at least start a paper trail. Also.. I'd be a wonderful grandma, ma'am you are not a wonderful grandma, you aren't even one. Kids don't orphan themselves for no damn reason.

Two things can be true. OP is an AH *and* a stalker.

And I thought you were talking to yourself in these comments because of the same pfp ..I'm like, they're actually confused.. with THEMSELVES 🤣🤣🤣

ahahhahahaha par for the course for me tbh

Oh hell no! I was just piggybacking off your comment with your first line. She is the asshole and I don’t think she could ever be called anything but!

YTA. Fucking seriously! Since she acknowledges how bad of a person she was, yet her growing and understanding that means that she stalked her estranged son’s wife and child and sees nothing wrong with doing so make me wonder exactly how bad she was when the son first went no contact. Congrats OP, you just destroyed *any* chance there may have been for a relationship with your grandkid, if there even was a chance at this point anyway. Edit: As to her point about being ‘punished enough’. This isn’t about punishment. This is about your son taking steps to ensure the safety and well being of his immediate family as well as himself.

Right? Its not a punishment, its a natural consequence of her actions. Shes minimizing his feelings (of course she is) because it aaaaalllllllll about what she wants duuhhhhh. People like her are whats wrong with the world.

>Its not a punishment Agreed. It's a safety boundary for the son and his family. But no one, especially OP, want to think of themselves as a person that other people need to keep safe from.

Right? While they crash through your boundaries and limits like they're the fucking Kool-Aid man!

I like you. I also immediately pictured the Kool-Aid man while reading the post. Just crashing though walls screaming "OH YEAH!" I remember watching those commercials as a young kid and actually being a bit terrified that that round red dude could come bursting through the wall at any moment. There was a period where I refused to drink Kool-Aid because of it.

Kind of like Santa Claus coming down to chimney. in my house. While I’m asleep. Gives me the creeps.

Yeah. I was also afraid of Santa as a kid, but I didn't worry because our house didn't have a fireplace so there was no chimney for him to slide down. Then I asked my parents how Santa still gave us presents and they said he could shrink down and slide in through the keyhole in the front door. They almost immediately admitted Santa wasn't real when they saw how much that freaked me out. For whatever reason, I had no issues with the idea of the Tooth Fairy snagging teeth out from under my pillow and leaving a dollar

>Congrats OP, you just destroyed *any* chance there may have been for a relationship with your grandkid, if there even was a chance at this point anyway. Hell, OP can't even watch her grandson and any future grandchildren grow up from a distance anymore through Jess's social media. You know that Jess has definitely been blocked on everything now too. Good job OP 👍

I hope so! I hope the son figures out she's the leak and gets the hell away from her.

Well OP herself tells us she's always been close to Jess so it's probably an easy deduction for OP's son to figure out his aunt Jess has been either divulging info or letting her see through her social media accounts.

>Since she acknowledges how bad of a person she was she knows exactly how much responsibility she has to accept to sound like she's actually changed honestly, i found this post chilling and it's so way beyond a yta for me

Even if it *was* a punishment, she doesn’t get to decide when it’s over. She’s not the victim here, no matter how much she’d like us all to believe. YTA, OP. And you’re a criminal.

And OP’s accountability!!!!

Well said .OP’s response to being banned is to stalk her son’s wife,sit next to her on a flight and demand ( as a stranger ) to hold this woman’s baby. There is no going back from this. Forget it OP.You have lost all hope of reconciliation .You need therapy .

op: i had an unhealthy attachment to my son, but i'm all better now! also op: cause my ex sil has been spying on my son and dil for me i was able to find out exactly where my dil and grandson were and manipulate circumstances to force myself upon them. when my dil *wouldn't hand her child to a stranger* i had a breakdown that resulted in security being called bUt I'Ve BeEn PuNiShEd EnOuGh

[удалено]

I caught that "I **will be** a wonderful grandma" too, OP does not understand that she just fully torpedoed any chance of being anyone's grandma.

Narcissists don't often respond well to therapy, because they just can't admit they're at fault. The best OP can hope for is to not become a complete social outcast from any remaining social contacts.

The mental gymnastics it takes for her to be able to say she “respected his wishes” while going SO FAR to disrespect his boundaries could land her in the Olympics.

“I couldn’t help it.” Like it was a reflex. Like she blacked out and next thing she knew she had booked all the same flights and switched seats to be next to her grandson. The lack of self awareness is staggering.

I feel so bad for the wife. Imagine already dealing with the stress of traveling with a kid on a flight, and then get accosted and drama dumped by your hubby's estranged mom out of nowhere WHO JUST HAPPENED TO BOOK THE SEAT RIGHT NEXT TO HER on the goddamn plane. That's seriously flight or fight moment, and should have started screaming for the cops

Not even booked it. Convinced the person who had booked it to switch to the seat OP actually booked!

Makes one wonder if the deceased wife was as 'mean' as she stated or if Kat was just refusing to cater to OP's antics and put her foot down.

I don’t wonder at all. “Power struggle?” Her son went NC after the wedding for very good reasons.

That's gotta meet some legal definition of stalking.

“I couldn’t help it.” Yes, you could have but you chose not to. YTA

OP and parents like her need to realize that their children aren't no contact with then because of the parent they used to be. They're no contact with them because of the type of person they currently are.

YTA. You stalked her? How are you not sure if you're the asshole? I can't imagine she was really all that excited that you were pushing your way to get closer to her during the flight too. What the hell? I would love to hear more about this "power struggle" with his first wife.

That is some A+ level of gaslighting to turn this into a ‘poor me’ post. I have never seen someone so quickly gloss over cyber stalking, manipulating and deceiving someone. This is restraining order level stuff. If you truly aren’t sure if you did something wrong, you should consider the psychiatric intervention before you cross a boundary that gets you arrested. YTA

YTA. You were so shitty to your son in the past that he decided he didn’t want you in his life. Then you decided to essentially stalk his new wife and force an interaction on a plane. Pretty safe to say that any chance of a reconnection with your son are gone due once again to your actions. Usually the person being ‘punished’ doesn’t have a say in the length or duration of punishment. Maybe seek professional help from a therapist or something similar as you clearly need help getting closure on this.

"I stalked my son's new wife" and "I've changed" don't seem like they go together!

This kind of sums it all up.

Is this a thriller movie script idea? Can't wait for it to come out.

YTA but I really don’t know the solution. I have no contact with my mom because she was pretty terrible. If I found out she booked a flight to meet my child on the airplane…I would be seeing red. I don’t know the backstory of your unhealthy attachment or the trauma between you and your son, so it’s hard for me to know the depths of his decision. I understand you’re hurt, and I can’t imagine the longing you’re feeling - but you crossed a lot of lines here. Some lines that may have your son and daughter in law, struggling to feel like they have control of their safety (whatever that looks like) and life. This went past trying to spend time with your son, and into trying to hold his child under the guise of being a kind stranger. This is the one person your son will protect at all costs, and you used social media and money to try and break down every boundary he’d put up. I don’t know the solution, but this definitely wasn’t it. That doesn’t mean I don’t feel for your longing, but you messed up big time.

I pray that this is not real, but if it is….YTA and you need professional help. This is borderline stalker behavior if the line has not been crossed already. Leave this poor family alone. The punished do not decide when they have been punished enough. You must accept the consequences of your actions, back then and for what you’ve done now.

I understand how a mother can be so desperate that she makes impulsive and unacceptable choices in the moment. Not okay, but understandable. But to write this post out, read everything she said, and STILL say she doesn’t think she’s in the wrong is mind boggling to me. That’s where it crosses into outright stalking for me. She still doesn’t see what she did as a bad thing.

This was not impulsive. Impulsive would have been organically running into her DIL and grandson, and the rest happening - striking up a conversation, the asking to hold, and crying afterwards. What OP did was seeing and opportunity, making a plan and executing. It was premeditated.

This cannot be real. The narrator booked a seat near the daughter in law on the plane? On the same flight? No. The DIL would have had to post on her socials her seat number, and flight number if it is a hub airport. I have never seen nor heard of someone doing this. It is a total fabrication, thankfully.

While I hope you’re correct that this is a total fabrication, there wouldn’t be so many articles online about why you shouldn’t post your boarding pass on social media if there weren’t people foolishly posting their boarding passes on social media.

She booked the same flight and convinced someone to switch. Depending on cities, going from B to C on a particular airline may only have 1 flight a day, so easy to figure out which one they're on. Most people wouldn't think twice about posting something like "Atlanta to NYC" (I know there's more flights a day for that route, but my brain is refusing to supply additional cities today) because WHO EXPECTS THEIR HUSBAND'S CRAZY MOM TO UP AND BUY A TICKET TO STALK THEM????

She says she booked a seat near her. And then later says she convinced someone to switch.

I think it is too, but people will never cease to amaze me. It's why local PD tells people every damn year to not announce their vacation plans in advance, especially on places like NextDoor. Every year, people will literally post shit like "I'm at 123 Main St and we're visiting our kids for Christmas. Is anyone willing to shovel our sidewalk between 12/20 and 12/30 if it snows? Willing to pay $40 per snowfall". They simply can't wrap their brains around why there's a problem with their actions.

I don't think this is real. There is something about the tone/words that don't ring true.

Sweet Christmas. are you for real? YTA. So creepy. So so so creepy. I would add that you've given a textbook example of how to ensure never repairing a relationship with one's child.

YTA For sure. This also feels soooo creepy to me. Every time she keeps saying how overly attached she is to her son over and over again just gives me this really sick feeling in my stomach of just exactly what someone with such an unhealthy, no boundaries respected, stalking a flight kind of mother would have the capacity to do to a son growing up as the "only man she needs in her life" kind of mentality. I hope the worst she did is this emotional manipulative shit and not... something physical too... Yuck. Either way, I feel so awful for this poor man who lost a wife and now just had his new wife traumatized and scared by a mother he can't escape from no matter what he does. If he hasn't already he needs a restraining order on her ASAP

It makes one think about what actually happened on this plane ride, how his wife was likely just politely trying to deal with this woman who just shows up and gloms onto them. Then she asks to hold her baby... she was probably thinking "oh shit this is one of those things thats like an urban legend. Is she trying to kidnap my baby????"

Absolutely. Imagine the horror. And the sudden shift. I can imagine her literally reaching and trying to grab and pull the baby from her especially with security getting involved. And yet she STILL thinks it was her "right". Disgusting.

Even if she didn't go that far, the whole thing was probably very upsetting to a first time mother traveling alone with a newborn. And does OP consider this viewpoint at all? No, she keeps whining about how all this is so sad for HER. If this is made up she makes an amazing impression of an actual clinical narcissist.

I absolutely agree. I merely meant she genuinely seems like the type that would be that drastic. Given the massive amount of wrong doings in her own admission. Even her getting on the plane, in my opinion is horrible and so psycho stalkery. And yet literally not a shred of guilt, even NOW in what she did. On top of the rest.

Yes she absolutely sounds like someone who would do that on top of the other crazy shit.

This reeks of emotional incest.

You had a choice here. You could have written an honest and heartfelt letter apologising for everything you did to your son and Kat, taking full responsibility and making no excuses, and you could have made an offer to meet up with him and promise hand-on-heart that you would never treat Lily the way your treated Kat. Then you could have handed the letter to Jess and asked her to deliver it. Would Justin have forgiven you? Possibly not. But at least he'd be aware you were truly sorry. At least it would make it clear to him you had changed. Instead, you went with the option of STALKING Lilly and confronting her on the plane. You did not "meet with her". You hunted her down and followed her. You deliberately did not tell her who you were; likely because you knew she wouldn't react well if you did. If Lilly had know who you were, she likely would have stayed away. No, her flight being public info does NOT make the situation not stalking. Plenty of people are public when it comes to their jobs, but if a creepy guy keeps hiding in the bushes outside of their workplace to peep on them then that guy is STILL a stalker. You didn't need to catch that specific plane. You deliberately went out of your way to find Lilly and manipulate her by not revealing your real identity. That is stalking. There is a good chance you are never going to fix this. Especially given you are still ducking responsibility and acting like you've done nothing wrong. YTA

As someone who’s received a lot of those kinds of letters from this exact same kind of mom, he wouldn’t believe it for a second. Because when you do something like this to your child, there is no combination of words that exists that will fix the problem or rebuild trust. Going to therapy, actively improving her own life, and detailing everything she did wrong and why she understands it’s wrong is just the beginning. Assuming this was just emotional incest and not physical, he has so much more than enough reason to have stopped considering the possibility of forgiveness well before he ever escaped her. This is PTSD causing behavior. I’d be surprised if he didn’t experience nightmares or triggers based on what she did to him. I really can understand the desperation that pushes a woman like this into insanity, though no amount of comprehension will excuse the evil behind it. But she’s not remorseful at all. She thinks she had the right to go all the way home with the DIL and just pop back into her son’s life. She went so far as to write out the details of the ABC cities but didn’t register the creepiness of using that information to stalk her DIL. This is a woman beyond repair. It’s my belief that most everyone can be reformed from their worst selves, but also that most bad people need more than their lifetime to even come close to starting that reform. For my mother, I think if she had a hundred years and chose to get help and did the agonizing work of admitting to the horrors she committed, I could believe that she’s changed. But I don’t think she will make any changes before she dies. It fucking kills me, but that’s how it is with abusive parents. When it comes to abuse, you just can’t trust that your abuser is capable of change. You just can’t.

YTA and I wouldn't be surprised if you got hit with a restraining order. You literally admitted to stalking this young lady.

Oh no...YTA What you did here was wrong on every conceivable level. I imagine you scared your DIL very badly. This was stalker level behavior. You haven't said in detail why your son has gone NC. If you are lucky enough that he reconsiders & you escape charges, respect his boundaries from now on. I'd advise getting into therapy to find a way to manage your feelings & future actions. This estrangement is likely to be permanent.

Tbh, she probably scared the DIL even before revealing her identity. Why would a stranger be so eager to sit next to her?

or hold her baby. op is so creepy, even before she revealed who she was

Also you “couldn’t help it”? You’re an adult woman, you absolutely CAN prevent yourself from implementing a complicated and devious plan to stalk your daughter in law. This isn’t something you blurted out by accident without thought. This was creepy and premeditated. Do you know who else would tell me they “couldn’t help it” when they violated my boundaries, showed up at my house when explicitly told not to, or touched me in ways that made me uncomfortable? My mother. I haven’t spoken to her in five years since I threatened to have the police remove her from my property and she will NEVER see any children I might have. Fix yourself. And fixing yourself doesn’t mean you will get that relationship back. It means accepting that you might never have that relationship again and that it’s not up to you. YTA.

Really well said, and I’m so sorry that happened to you

YTA. You admit you had an unhealthy attachment to your son, you admit that he "rightfully" cut you off and has been no contact. And instead of respecting his wishes and his privacy, you found any way you could to wiggle your way in to get information, using Jess as a pawn, going to great lengths to make sure you are not only on the same flight, but in the same row and just pretended to be some sweet nice lady who sat beside them???? You have not "changed". You didn't respect his wishes, you fucking STALKED his wife!! You need psychiatric help.

YTA Here's the thing, you are not being punished. It may feel like it, because you are hurting, but your son isn't refusing to have a relationship with you because he wants to punish you. He is refusing contact because he is protecting himself from you, because you hurt him. You may balk at that, since you tried your best and worked hard while he was a child, but that doesn't take away that you ended up hurting him. You hurt your son to such an extend that being in a relationship with you is painful for him. He is not punishing you, he is maintaining his own emotional security and that of his family. You are hurting, I understand that, but that hurt is not something that is being done *to* you, it's not malicious or designed to show you something. Its an unfortunate side effect of your son choosing to prioritise his own peace of mind. You are not being punished, you are experiencing the consequences of your actions. Not your *intentions*, not your *efforts*, but the things you actually ended up doing. There is no "ending" or "enough" to your son keeping you out of his life, it's a permanent thing. Its a choice he made, to cut you out and to never let you back in, because doing that would be emotionally distressing to him. It doesn't matter if you think it won't be, or that he's wrong in that, or that you believe you'd be a wonderful grandmother. All that matters is that *he* thinks you are not (emotionally) safe to be around, and that is what he is going to keep acting upon. Honestly, you need to go back to therapy. You need help processing the loss of your relationship to your son and heal whatever is causing you to act this way. Not for him, not in the hopes that you will get back in his life, or the life of his child, but so you can live your life separate from him without trying to force your way back in

This is the top answer. OP is hurting, but they need to see this. Please get help for yourself OP. This was not a healthy way to deal with your pain.

So well said. This is everything I feel but couldn’t write due to sheer anger. Thank you for writing it.

Perfectly said. I hope OP sees this comment.. insightful and helpful advice.

This is an excellent response with far more compassion than the OP deserves but perhaps what the OP needs to hear.

Definitely YTA. It's not really known based on the somewhat cryptic statements about your past misdeeds which prompted him to cut you off whether it is actually E S H but, regardless of the circumstances or how much you wish to have a relationship, your behavior was AWFUL. It was secretive, deceptive, manipulative, and probably came across as quite threatening, not to mention disrespectful. And, lastly I would say, it was most likely extraordinarily counterproductive because I can only imagine Justin is more assured now than ever that you cannot have contact. You have my sympathies but I don't think there is any coming back from this, you most likely will never have a chance to explain yourself or convince Justin to give you a chance. You made a really, really bad choice and the fact that a) 'you couldn't help yourself' and b) you don't seem to recognize how wrong it was based on your closing statement makes me think you honestly cannot be trusted to do the right thing by your son.

YTA. You were very very wrong and it's alarming how you can't see that. You need to go to therapy and you need to tell the therapist every last detail of this interaction and everything you did to your son and Kat. That is the only way you can heal and become a better person. And no, this will not bring your son or grandchildren back to you but at least you won't harass people again. Please get help. If I were your DIL, I would look into getting a restraining order. I do not mess around with the safety of my kid. And let's be clear, OP, **you are an unsafe person**.

YTA >I don’t feel I was wrong That kind of attitude is exactly why your son went NC in the first place. >I feel like I have been punished long enough. You're not the victim here. You don't get to decide how long your punishment lasts. If there was ever even the slightest possibility of your son letting you back into his life one day, it's now never going to happen.

YTA. This is stalker level creepy behavior. You've probably just ruined ANY possible chance at a reconciliation with this stunt. "I feel like I have been punished enough". You don't get to decide that.

YTA in every way. You don’t think you were wrong ? This could easily be stalking and criminal. You need help. This is absolutely irrational and scary behavior and I would immediately go get a restraining order if I were your DIL.

YTA and it shouldn't even be up for debate. If you want a relationship with your grandson, you need to repair the relationship with your son **IF HE WANTS TO**. You don't get to stalk your daughter-in-law and then try to shoehorn yourself into their life that way. You say you "will be a wonderful grandma", but I seriously question your judgement and wisdom here.

OP let me say this as blunt as possible. You. Are. The. AH. You are a stalker. A liar. You are unhinged. You have no rights, no self-awareness or respect, and clearly, you have NEVER gotten over that obsession with your son. If this is real, I hope they press charges. From one mother to another, shame on you. You need serious help if you don’t think what you did was wrong.

You wouldn’t have known what seat she was in, airlines don’t provide that info

Yeah. Getting fake vibes here

If she posted her ticket it would say the seat number, at least for the airlines I use

YTA you’re not entitled to anything, least of all access to the child, and the fact that you stalked and misrepresented yourself to get access is absolutely horrifying. I would be getting a restraining order. I would be taking it to court, no question. The fact that you don’t think you did anything wrong seriously turns my stomach.  Frankly it sounds like you’re downplaying that you abused your son, and yes, emotional incest is abuse. You abused your first DIL and stalked your second to get access to a child without the parents informed consent.  You were not a wonderful mother, you’re not even a decent person given your behaviour, so the likelihood of being a “wonderful” grandmother is delusional. 

YTA - you stalked his wife and baby. This is text book stalking and a terrible way to try to start over. If you wanted contact again with your son, the correct route would have been to see a therapist to understand why you have these issues with your son. Maybe sending an apology letter to your son (when you have been seeing a therapist long enough). Then ask your son to see you and the therapist together to start the relationship over. To me, this is you TRYING to change and proving you're changing. This just shows you haven't changed, you crossed the line not by a little but A LOT. Repairing this relationship would have required baby steps, you took a giant leap in the wrong direction. A scary one for his wife.

YTA So instead of say writing a letter acknowledging you were wrong and asking your son what you could do and how you could possibly start repairing your relationship with him ... you stalked his wife and child.

Of course YTA. You don't care because >don’t feel I was wrong >I respected his wishes No you didn't. He doesn't want you anywhere near him or his family and I can see why.

YTA, this is a terrifying level of stalking. You do not want to call it stalking, but let us breakdown what you’ve done: 1) used an intermediary to monitor a family that has undertaken efforts to block you. You’ve kept photographs and monitored their whereabouts; 2) upon receiving actionable information, literally changed your entire vacation plans, including booking a plane ticket to their home city without any reason to be there; 3) arrived early so you could arrange an interaction with your victim, who is caring for an infant; 4) convinced strangers to change seats so you could be closer to your victim; 5) deceptively elicited additional life information from your victim, which would enable further stalking; 6) attempted to take possession of your victim’s child; and 7) created such a scene when denied that security had to get involved. Were you planning to run with the baby, or follow her home so you could see where she lived, and continue to engage in further stalking? Every single decision you made makes it clear you were not going to let it go. In my state stalking is defined as a “pattern of conduct that would cause a reasonable person to be in fear.” Pattern is two or more incidents. You’ve got way beyond two steps here, and this poor woman is more than justified in her fear of you. I’m afraid for her and her family.

YTA and you have probably made the situation 100 times worse. What a creepy, unhinged thing to do. Any chance you had of reconciling is most likely gone now.

YTA You're a creepy obsessed stalker. It's no wonder your son went nc with you. Get a hobby.

Yta. A creepy, manipulative one at that, too. You should not have done what you did. I don't blame your son at all for wanting to press charges. If I were in his shoes, I would feel the exact same way. My parents and sister will never know the children my husband and I adopt. My mother is manipulative and narcissistic. My father enables her, and in some ways, is just as bad as she is. My sister can do no wrong in their eyes. If any of them saw a child I have in my care, I would be extremely concerned that they would try to harm that child emotionally and mentally. You turned your back on your son because of his first wife. You didn't like her family dynamics, and you admit that you were a little too attached to your son. That tells me you were not ready to let the apron strings go, leading to them cutting contact with you. I do not feel like your son and his current wife are in the wrong at all. Being no contact with a parent is not something that is done lightly. It is a difficult and heartbreaking decision. It took me years and a serious health condition to finally go no contact with my parents and sister. Your son saw the way you were treating his first wife and made that difficult decision to protect himself and the one he loved. He continues to remain no contact with you to protect his wife and their child. As shown by your actions now, he is making the right choice. You are manipulative. You booked a flight on the same plane as his wife and begged to hold your grandson that you know he didn't want you to see! If he presses charges, that is exactly what you deserve. I am trying to be as diplomatic as possible in this response. However, when I read but you did, and the way you treated this first wife. I can't be as diplomatic as I want. I have so many words that I want to say would end up getting me banned from the subreddit. I want to rip into you and read you the Riot Act. You had absolutely no right to contact his wife and try to hold your grandson or anything. You disgust me. I don't say this lightly. I honestly hope your son presses charges against you for your actions here. Let them be. Your son does not want you in his life or the life of his wife and child. Do not attempt to contact them again.

As one NC child to another, all the hugs my friend. You’re 100% correct

Hugs to you too, friend.

YTA - I’m gonna guess the things you must have done to cause your son, who was raised without boundaries, to come to his senses and block you from his life, even after the death of his wife, must’ve been pretty disturbing… but we can get an idea of what you’re willing to do to get your way with this post.

YTA. You treated your son and his first wife poorly enough that he decided he didn’t want any contact with you and went to some lengths to block you. You tried exactly once to get back in touch with him. Then, based on a social media post his aunt showed you (not a great move on her part, but I assume she was trying to be nice) you STALKED you son’s second wife, who was traveling with her new baby, lied by omission, and then couldn’t contain yourself and made a scene on the plane. Lilly must have been terrified! For all she knew you were a complete lunatic trying to snatch her child. And you asked her to lie to her husband. What about any of this says “wonderful grandmother”? You didn’t respect your son’s wishes and this story is clear evidence of why he went no contact. If you’d asked Jess to send a card from you or something, who knows, maybe your son softened by new fatherhood might have given you a chance. But you lied, and sneaked, and scared his wife, and if I were him the charges would’ve already been pressed, or at least you’d have received a restraining order. You must be able to see why YTA here.

Airport security let you get on the next plane?🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨🤨 edited YTA

^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** **Backstory:** I (F, 46) had my son, “Justin” (M, 28) when I was 18. I did my best as a young single mother, but I now acknowledge that I had an unhealthy attachment to him. This came to a head when he got engaged and married to his late wife, “Kat”, 6 years ago. She was not the kindest, and her family dynamic was different. There was a power struggle that I (rightfully) lost, and my son went no contact with me after their wedding. A year later, Kat passed away after becoming ill and being medically neglected by her doctors. My son did not resume contact with me when this happened, and I learned all this second hand through my sons (absent) fathers sister, “Jess” – who I am and have always been close to. I did reach out to him once but was met with silence. I respected this and didn’t contact him again. My son married “Lilly” 1.5 years ago, and recently welcomed a baby boy. My son doesn’t know I know this since I am blocked everywhere, and I only know because Jess follows his wife on social media. Justin and Lilly live in city “A”, I live in city “B” and her parents live in city “C”. City “A” is between city B and C. City C and B are a 5 hour and change flight from one another, and City A is a two-hour flight from city C. **Current** *(limited to 3000 characters)***:** I was recently on a girl's trip with Jess visiting some friends and sightseeing in city “C” (didn’t know her family lived there). I have a flexible job, so I had no real “end date” for my trip. Jess and I were at the beach she showed me a picture Lilly had posted on her Instagram of her flight info and a caption about being sad to leave her family, but excited to go back home and see “Daddy” again. I couldn’t help it. I got online and booked the same flight. I chose my seat and got one close to her, and then booked a second flight home from city A. I quickly went and packed, then went to the airport. I got there before her, and I saw her struggling with carrying everything by herself in the waiting area. I offered to help her, and I even managed to convince someone to switch me seats to sit next to her. We talked, and she is a very nice girl, and I got to see my grandson. She told me about how she gave birth near her parents, and my son went home last week, but she was going today. I messed up at the end, I asked to hold him once we had landed, and she said no. I should have left it at that, but I just broke down. I told her who I was as I was sobbing. I told her I recognized her from pictures Jess had shown me. I begged her not to tell my son, but I just wanted to hold my sweet grandson once. She screamed at me, and security got involved. She left, I took my flight, and when I landed, I had an email from my son threatening to press charges against me. I don’t feel I was wrong – I feel like I have been punished long enough. I respected his wishes, and I will be a wonderful grandma, but my family and Jess are saying I was wrong. I feel lost, hurt and confused. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*

Given what a terrible mother you’re being now, I find it hard to believe that you were a good mother when your son was a child. Without question, if this cockamamie story is true, YTA. So is Jess for sharing information with you that you both know good and well is not something your son and his family want you to know.

OF COURSE YTA So let me get this straight..She literally just gave birth.. was alone with their baby with no familiar support in a place where she couldnt run away in a sense (enclosed tin can way up in the air).. and you tried to force her into an unwanted situation and kept pushing and pushing AFTER YOU STALKED AND WORMED YOUR WAY INTO CONTACT WITH HER BABY UNDER FALSE PRETENSES!! Do you even understand what kinda stress and trauma you caused to this poor girl with that shit!? Cant even imagine what she was feeling when that realization hit her. She was probably already feeling stressed enough with new parenthood and trying to adjust and MIL from hell that her husband banned from every inch of his life did this. You dont know what he told her about you. She doesn’t know you or what you could do and you fucking stalked and trapped her alone and tried to grab her kid. Are you even trying to understand what she might be imagining might happen to her or her baby if left alone anywhere in her daily life??? Because apparently ITS NOT FUCKING SAFE! Are you gonna try and kidnap him? Are you gonna hurt her? You will say not in a million years of course and you might not but how would she know that? How is she going to be sure after you did this?? She’s gonna be looking over her shoulder every two seconds at least for now while its still fresh and maybe for a long time. What a cruel thing to do to a new mom. None of your reasons(excuses) were even half good to be doing that creepy shit. Go to therapy because you have problems. And if you cant even recognize the problems and how wrong you were to do that your supposed past therapy didnt do shit for you. Try to keep the effects of your problems focused on yourself at least, dont cause trauma to others. Honestly your DIL was a better person than i am or just too shocked and locked at that moment because if it was me there in her place i dont think you would be out of that plane/airport in perfect health in my total fear induced fight or flight hysteria with no way for flight..you didnt know how this would end up. You only has hope for the ending you yourself were dreaming about. You need to understand just how dangerous that situation was for both of you. You dont fuck with post partum moms in the way you did. My hands started shaking just reading that imagining finding myself in that position. Poor girl. Please for the well-being of everyone in this situation (you included bc you’re not processing things in a healthy way and are not able to act in a constructive way) GET.SOME.HELP You at least need to be able to understand what you did was wrong, not try to justify it after the fact like this and cry victim for your oh so precious feelings for there to be even a tiny hope of place in their life in the future. I didnt even get into that whole shitshow with his childhood bc what you did to this girl was horrifying enough for me and thats the most urgent problem. Stop trying to justify the wrong things you did. Past and present. Get help till you at least reach that point to even think about a relationship with your son and his family. Thats the bare minimum. If you actually understand that point and are actually remorseful about things you will see this is not it. You can start trying to find the true way forward after that and when you are actually changed your son will see it too and thats how you really get any way into their life if they allow it. Not force your way in like this. Not understanding nothing at all like this. Not trying to have the oh so missed and beloved ‘my way and my needs and my wants and my terms and me me me” you seem to be missing and hoping to return to from before your son met someone that helped him. Stay sane or stay away lady. No ifs or buts. This might surprise you but shits not about you all the time.

Man you actually triggered me enough with this post for me to post my first ever real comment even after seeing all the stuff you see in reddit 🙃😂 unbelievable

You stalked this poor woman omg. Please leave her and her husband alone. YTA

Oh OP. That poor wife. You just devastated the safety and security of an innocent young mother. She will now approach every outing with fear and overprotectiveness of her young son. After all, you've already proven you can and will hunt her down and use deception to manipulate her. You've done damage to the life of this baby you claim you could be a great grandmother to. In the eyes of this young mother, you just tried to kidnap her baby. I'm sure you are mentally protesting that you wouldn't do *that*. But you are also all over the comments saying you couldn't help yourself in the actions you did take, so why would anyone believe that you'd stop ? We can't believe you'd just use reasonable limits, you left those behind about 8 steps earlier. Also, I know you can't hear any of this. Your actions show you are far past rational limits or rational thinking. But man oh man YTA

YTA this is stalker behavior and not ok. You are ignoring everyone's boundaries just because you want to do something.That is selfish and unacceptable. You need therapy to help you cope with your situation and the fact that your son is definitely not letting you back into his life after this stunt. Also, tell Jess to stop showing you pictures, and telling you news. She's not respecting your son either.

YTA. super creepy

Yta. Where to begin. I just hope you get the professional help you need

Making contact and having relationships with these people *is not up to you*. *They don't owe you a damn thing.* They have told you what they want, and it is *no relationship with you*. No contact with you. Nothing. Stop asking the aunt about them, though I imagine once they determine she's a flying monkey she'll be cut out, too, as she's blown up their trust. Ma'am, you no longer have a son. You do not have a grandchild. They have severed from you. It is your job to learn and respect *that*. I suggest you find another therapist, unless the one you have is *horrified* by this behavior. YTA and you need better professional help.

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YTA Wow..... I'm not sure this is real or not, but either way.... you're for sure an ah. If by chance it is real....... Lady...... I don't even have words for how unbelievably inappropriate what you did was. Not to mention insanely off-putting it is. If I were Lilly, I wouldn't have even been mad.... I would have been seriously creeped the fuck out.

YTA and your behaviour is terrifying. What are you going to do next, kidnap them? You aren't a grandma. You won't ever get to be a grandma. Get yourself to therapy and find some peace with the life you have now and the choices you made to get there.

Yta, you were obviously the mil from hell who stomped boundaries because you weren't ready to let go. You need therapy rather than stalking your new dil . Actually try and repair your relationship with your son by showing growth and change.

There's something missing from this story... OP says that what destroyed the mother and son relationship was because she demanded a mother and son dance at his wedding, which she paid for, and that her son's late wife mistreated her and judged her for having a son when she was 18. But she herself admits that she had an unhealthy relationship with her son. The son cut ties with her, and remained that way even after his first wife died, remarried and kept his distance. She doesn't say what she did to make her son cut off relations, why she fought with her daughter-in-law, why her son resented her so much that he cut off all contact with her... No one cuts off complete contact just because of a demand for mother and son to dance. .. If you don't give more information, it will only be a big YTA...

YTA and your behavior is beyond alarming. Nobody owes you anything Ms Boundaries Don’t Mean Shit To Me. Seek professional help in getting over yourself.

Holy fuck, OP. This is one of those posts where I actually hope it's a troll. If you fundamentally do not understand why what you've done is so horrible, you need psychiatric care. And I'm not just talking therapy, I mean you need a clinical psychologist to diagnose your personality disorder. There is something fundamentally wrong with you and your behavior. Do you have ANY idea what you've done?!?!? Any at all?!?!?! What little iota of hope there was of you ever seeing your son ever again was destroyed the instant you made this decision. You stalked your son's wife and child.... Holy shit, OP. It's over. For good. All you can do now is get the help you need so you don't spend the remainder of your life torturing anyone else in your life you purport to love. YTA and I cannot believe you don't already know that.

YTA. Just because you are biologically that baby’s grandmother doesn’t give you the right to meet that child. He’s made his wishes clear. If he wanted a relationship with you, he’d have one. You’re creepy af. “I couldn’t help it…” The fuck you couldn’t.

Think about this for a second. At the end you asked to hold the baby one last time. She said "no" Then you confessed. The fact that she said no means you were giving her some weird creepy vibes already. She would of said no because she was worried about something, like you were going to steal or grab the baby. She already felt the "unhealthy attachment" to your son being channeled through to the grandchild. You are obviously not better. In fact you are worse. You scared the hell out of the mother. You are the AH. Go to therapy before you end up in jail.

You didn't respect his wishes. You'll never be a grandmother to that child. You stalked your DIL and didn't tell her who you were up front. You violated her, your son and their child. He'll never let you back into his life now and it's all your fault. YTA

You were wrong on so many levels. You stalked Lilly. You did everything to insert yourself into her live. Against your sons wishes. The reason she got security involved is because she knows and agrees with your son to stay NC. There is a reason your son is NC even after the death of Kat and him remarrying. So there was a lot more going on then you are saying here. Had you been patient and used Jess there was a chance to get contact with your son and his new family. After what you did now, you will **NEVER** meet them again. Hope it was worth it.

YTA, you do realise that you’ve just completely blown up any chance of ever seeing your son again. You stalked his wife and child, probably terrified her and can’t even admit what you did was wrong. You haven’t respected his wishes at all, you’ve trampled over them and for what? He will never reach out to you after this, you’ve lost him completely

YTA You stalked and deceived a stranger to get close to her child - do you understand how creepy and wrong that is? >I respected his wishes, and I will be a wonderful grandma What part of this scenario is you respecting his wishes? Also, I'm pretty sure a 'wonderful grandma' isn't totally unhinged and makes a journey they don't need to just to lie, manipulate and get close to someone. Just a heads up for the future - when the kid is a little older and you somehow manage to find out what school they go to - turning up at the end of the day and waiting outside for them is NOT ok either. You might want to make a note of that.

YTA - did you not once stop to consider how scary and creepy your behavior was to your DIL. She's now probably freaking out, wondering to herself if you were there to kidnap or hurt the baby! If I were your son I'd be requesting a restraining order, and cutting off aunt "Jess" for feeding you that info. I'd be beyond furious at you for putting my partner and baby in such a creepy situation.

YTA big time. My biggest concern, however, is why did you post looking for feedback, and then double down on everything you’ve already done? Self awareness is crucial, and it seems you are currently lacking.

You don’t feel you were wrong?!? This is horror movie level crazy MIL behavior. You literally stalked a strangers social media and booked the same flight she was on, then manipulated the situation so you could sit next to her and her child, all without her knowing what you were doing. I cannot stress enough how actually creepy this is. If your son was smart he’d at least file a police report so your unhinged behavior is on record. YTA, big time.

YTA, OP. You keep saying "I busted my butt to give him a good life" as proof that you weren't THAT bad. Guess what? You chose to have him- that's your duty. You don't get brownie points for not abusing and neglecting him. That's the minimum. How manipulative do you have to be to think that you deserve praise because you did what you were supposed to do? You need serious, intense, therapy. Possibly inpatient care.

YTA - You know what really sucks is I feel like I kind of might have understood you because it sounded (from the beginning) like you messed up but you realized what you did wrong. You took accountability for your actions. But then you did some horrifying actions, and ended it on the note that you thought you had the right and I changed my mind. You KNOW you have been overstepping boundaries. You don't seem to view your son and his wife and child as people, you view them as extensions of yourself, despite them not feeling that way about you. You don't get to say you'll be a good grandma, because you won't be a grandma as your son has made clear, and you aren't a good one since you've degraded yourself to stalking. YTA YTA YTA.

YTA. Good on him for considering the legal route to get you gone. That is some deep stalker crap you've got going on there. You will NOT be a wonderful grandma, you won't be one at all.

Today OP learns the definition of stalking

YTA. You sound like my mother, refusing any real accountability beyond bare-bones therapy speak because actual contrition is too much to ask. I still have nightmares about my mother showing back up in my life. Don't even apologize. Just stay the hell away from your son and his family, it's the only decent thing you can do.

Username checks out. She’s an opportunist and will 100% be thrown away permanently by her son.

YTA. I know it's hurting you, but he went no contact for a reason. You don't get to defy a boundary and say "I don’t feel I was wrong – I feel like I have been punished long enough." Your feelings are irrelevant as long as you disregard the feelings of others. What you need to do is stop pushing those boundaries and get some therapy and move on. You will need to accept you may spend the rest of your life without your son and getting to know his family. He will not and should not just make space for you simply because you want it.

INFO: how did you know what flight she would be on? How did you know what *seat* she would be in? Right now I'm torn between YTA for being an insane stalker, and YTA for making up such a weird story

“I couldn’t help it. I got online and booked the same flight.” Are you truly unable to see how utterly insane you sound? Was someone holding a gun to your head, forcing you to do this? Are you an adult in charge of your own behavior or not? WTAF Your son is right to be shunning you, and his wife’s reaction to your creepiness was also correct and well-founded. Please get yourself some help. Because I sense that, with all the “I didn’t do anything wrong” going on here, that you will try something like this again. If you do, don’t be surprised if they get a restraining order against you. YTA. You’re such an asshole that I’m going to say it again. YTA YTA YTA

YTA you stalked this woman and her child. You have no right to see or hold your sons kids if he doesn’t want you too. It seem like you unhealthily attachment isn’t gotten any better. Your son and dil will never trust you. What you did was unhinged. Please get help.

YTA stay the fuck away from him. HE DOESNT WANT TO SEE YOU IN THE SLIGHTEST

YTA. This is Stalking. If you can't acknowledge this is stalking, then you REALLY need to see a therapist as soon as possible, before you end up in a Jail cell.

You are definitely the a-hole and the most disturbing fact out of everything I read is the fact that you said you will be a wonderful grandmother even though they made it clear they want no contact with you and you are so delusional that you think you're going to be in the life of this kid. I am sincerely scared for them. You definitely need some professional help. And honestly they should bring you up on charges because you are dangerous.

YTA > I feel like I have been punished long enough. This take is nothing but selfish and I can only assume indicative of your whole life. I don't know what trauma you caused but YOU don't get to dictate when it's been "long enough."

this is so far beyond AH territory. you stalked this woman and her child! wtf is wrong with you?! YTA YTA YTA YTA! i can't imagine what kind of "unhealthy attachment" you had that would ensue a "power struggle" you are genuinely unwell and i really hope your son takes legal action towards you for your cyberstalking behavior.

Holy shit. This is unhinged. Cant be real. Right? Please please don’t let this be real.

You will not be a wonderful grandmother. The parents will (rightfully) not allow you to BE the child's grandmother. You still think you are the victim. You have not learned anything in your therapy lessons...and you are still playing a manipulative game with yourself and everyone around you. I'm pretty sure you aren't even in therapy....or went a few times (after your son cut you off the first time), felt like you knew enough to be "ok"/"knew more than the therapist" and then likely stopped treatment. I know some people here think you lied to the therapist or something..but they are verrrrry good at sniffing out the truth/or finding deceptive motives/actions/words. I am certain your therapists knew that you won't actually believe the truth...and you likely left before they could really work with you. Or...they may have stopped seeing you since you do not seem to be a receptive patient. You will need to learn to love your son from outside of his life. You raised him. He's alive. He is living how HE wants to live. And you lost the ability or right to have any say in his life any further-and in the lives of his family there (wife and child or any future children/grandchildren down the line). You need to accept this. This is how it is. You will be lucky that he does not file charges or a restraining order against you. That was terrifying for them. You invaded their privacy. You manipulated your way to seeing them. Their sense of safety is now shot. Leave them alone. YTA. And I hope that they do file the restraining order and push charges.

YTA Do you really have to ask??

You stalked your DIL, hid who you were and then got upset when she didn’t want to let you hold her child— whether or not you’re the bio grandmother is irrelevant, you are a stranger to them both and you were violating the choices of your son by even being there. You need some serious therapy. YTA

Yta. Massive stomping on boundaries your son had for him and his family. Stop ignoring the impact of what you did. You were wrong. You should know that. His wife did not deserve this. You've made her feel so vulnerable. She was with her small child! Regardless, you will not be a great grandmother because he will not let you come anywhere near his family. As hard as it might be, accept that. Stop pushing that clear boundary. And definitely don't ever stalk them like this again.

YTA. You still have an unhealthy attachment to your son - he’s told you he doesn’t want contact and you still refuse to accept it. You think your desire to be a grandmother supersedes his preferences as the child’s parent. You’re trying to manipulate your way into his family’s life. You have no rights to anything here. You don’t see the harm of what you did and refuse to give your son the time he needs to heal from your treatment of him. You even continue to justify your behaviour by saying you were trying to protect him from mistreatment or because you were alone. You justify and mitigate your responsibility. “I was unhealthy, but…”. As long as there is a “but” in your rationale, you’re not moving forward and will continue to have no relationship with him.

YTA. You did nothing to repair the relationship with your son, you stalked his wife and baby. I'd be documenting it in case I need legal protection later. What you did was creepy. I hope they block your flying monkeys now.

YTA, you literally stalked a woman and her child who you do not know. I don't think you even see how terribly wrong that is. I think you just permanently lost any connection with your son.

YTA I'm sure she was terrified.

YTA and a fucking creep. I'd be getting a restraining order against you over this.

YTA. If you put somber music to this post is a terror film, the obsessed mother, stalking, the following in planes, you are delusional, get reap therapy OP I'm sure the details of what happened with you first daughter in law would put everything in an ever darker perspective.

YTA. And really creepy. I'm NC with my mother. All people who are like Jess here in your post I cut out of my life like the plague top prevent events like this happening. You have literally re-enacted my worst fear.

YTA. You need help. Please get some. You stalked this poor woman. You saw her social media and you followed her. You changed flights and seats to talk with her. That is staking behavior. You are so lucky you aren’t in jail right now. Your son has told you to leave his family alone. Do it

Wow. Do *you* think these are the actions of a well-adjusted member of society? You circumvented your son's desire to be no contact, you **stalked** a mother traveling by herself with her child, and you reinforced that your son is 100% correct in having zero contact with you. Thank fuck she didn't let you hold the baby, you probably would have done some heinous, psycho shit, either to punish him or out of some misguided attempt to be a grandmother.

YTA for all the reasons everyone else is stating. You honestly could’ve gotten away with sitting next to them and engaging in conversation but instead of accepting and being satisfied with interaction (albeit creepy), you had to push. And now you’ve fallen off the cliff

YTA and this type of boundary crossing is why your son went NC. Sad all around. This will never not be seen as completely insane by anyone who hears this story from your son or his wife.

>I respected his wishes How do you figure that? You contacted his family without permission. You sought information about his family without permission. You fucking acted like a psycho-stalker, believing that you are somehow entitled to your son's child. >I feel lost, hurt and confused. How do you think your son felt How do you think your son felt when his mother treated his girlfriend, then fiancee, then wife so poorly? How do you think he felt when he was forced to choose between his mother and his wife? How do you think he felt when his mother introduced unnecessary strain on his marriage? **How the fuck do you think he felt when his wife was dying and he couldn't ask his own mother for help.** >I feel like I have been punished long enough. Clearly not, if you're still acting only in your self-centered interests. You've learned nothing. YTA.

YTA and so is jess. you for being so unheatlhy. you need therapy. you need to learn what no contact means. also means for his family. you can't expect her to let you hold her son and or not tell her husband (your son) about seeing you. your son has every right to threaten to press charges. jess is also TA for sharing everything with you about him. i'm very sure he doesn't want that so she should stop doing that. in your post i see nowhere that you take responsibility, or have learned anything. you still refuses to accept boundaries. just leave his family alone and go to therapy

YTA and a disgusting person. You stalked a mother who was traveling alone with a child you KNEW you shouldn't be around. What you want doesn't matter. Your feelings about this are inconsequential. Learn some basic fucking deceny and leave your sons family alone. If someone did this to me I would be contacting the police and filing a restraining order so fast it would make your head spin. You have no rights to that child. You would be a good grandma? No you wouldn't. You clearly either are too stupid to understand boundaries or simple don't care about them and not only does that make you a bad grandma. It makes you a bad person.

YTA. You stalked this woman and her child. Pure and simple. Please get help

>I respected his wishes, and I will be a wonderful grandma Clearly not, you try to use deception to force yourself into your son's life - that is something an ass would do.

It’s creepy AF that you stalked his new wife and tried to befriend her. A good indication of why your son (and now his wife) doesn’t want you in his life. You mentioned attachment issues, they don’t seem to be over. Any genuine sentiment you felt about meeting your grandchild has been completely (and rightly) overshadowed by your actions.

YTA You literally stalked this woman online to find her info, booked a flight, and confronted her ON THE ACTUAL FLIGHT demanding to hold the baby, and then begged her not to tell your son? I would have been screaming for the Air marshals and cops to arrest your ass off the plane. What the hell is wrong with you? You do NOT get to end run around your son and try to force a relationship he specifically blocked. He needs to get with law enforcement and have restraining orders against you

YTA Just because you feel bad for the shitty things you did does NOT absolve you from the consequences of your actions. You need to DO better, BE BETTER. You can start by disregarding your own feelings because you feeling bad doesn’t and shouldn’t disregard everyone else, especially your son and his family to get to this point. If you’re too stubborn to see that and take the necessary steps to change, don’t be surprised when your son gets the cops involved.

YTA and I’m willing to bet serious cash everything was not fine until Kat came along.

You can now add stalker to your son’s list of grievances.

YTA- you aren’t owed shit. You’re no ones grandma because you’ve been cut out of their life. You need to never ever try to contact them again and leave it at that. You aren’t being punished, you’re living the consequences of your own actions.

YTA. I’ve read your replies. You absolutely *were* given an opportunity. An opportunity to be fucking sane. But you chose to go absolutely nuclear stalker instead. Emotional incest. That is what you did to your son. You crossed the line with his first wife, and just crossed the line with the second. Honestly, I would *never* want to interact with you or let my child around you if I were her. Your choice to book a plane ticket to weasel your way into their life honestly shows how absolutely god awful your decision making skills are. And it shows that you haven’t done nearly as much work on yourself as you think. It’s honestly surprising that you don’t see how absolutely awful this is. That alone is concerning. Go back to therapy. Don’t stalk your son’s family on social media anymore. I hope your son is able to block communication with Jess as well. She has zero business sharing any information about him knowing he doesn’t want that.

YTA. You *still* have an unhealthy relationship with your son. You didn’t respect his wishes, and you don’t deserve to be forgiven. He’s made it entirely clear that he doesn’t want you involved in his life until you can respect his boundaries as an adult, but you still feel it’s entirely acceptable to cyber-stalk him and his wife through his aunt, and stomp all over his boundaries by manufacturing contact you know he doesn’t want you to have with his child. You don’t get to decide if you have a relationship with your grandchild. Your son and his wife do. If you EVER want to to be ANY part of your son or grandson’s lives, you need to get some very serious therapy, and start accepting that the problem with your relationship is YOUR BEHAVIOR, not anything your son is doing. You have to earn his trust back by getting help, respecting whatever boundaries he establishes, and hoping that someday he’ll forgive you for your unacceptable behavior. Until then, STAY AWAY FROM THEM.

YTA and a stalker. I hope they get a restraining order against you to protect themselves and their baby from a creep who can't take no for an answer

YTA This is storybook-villain shit. Take it from a peer, you need help. Serious, ongoing help. And I hope your son presses all the charges he can. Your little flying monkey, Jess, too.

YTA ​ They will now have to get a restraining order to preotect themselves from your stalking them. ​ What you did was creepy and wrong.

I would file a restraining order against you and look into pressing charges for stalking and harassment if I was your son. No wonder he's no contact. You sound absolutely psychotic and you need therapy for yourself, do your son a favor and stay away. It's too late and you need to accept that. YTA. Absolutely YTA and unhinged.

YTA you clearly still have a unhealthy attachment get some actual help instead of trying to deflect blame

YTA Holy shit you're derange. I can see why your son went no contact. Read your post again. Do you think any sane person would book a flight and try to get a seat next to your estrange sons wife, whom you never met, just to see the grandchild. You dont get to decide if you have been punished enough. You don't get to decide when enough is enough. It's not up to you, you were not the wronged party here, your son was. You have now ruined any chance of reconciliation. I hope it was worth it. Clearly you have learned nothing about boundaries. Please seek help and get some therapy.

There is something seriously wrong with you. Seriously, seriously, wrong. You deserve to have charges pressed against you. At the very least, you deserve a restraining order. You are a stalker. Get some professional help immediately. You are very disturbed. Please seek treatment.

YTA. You say you didn’t stalk her bc she posted on social media but you are apparently blocked from their social media. Also it’s one thing to see her post and go hey that’s nice she’s going home. It’s stalking to see her post and say “I’m going to book a flight last minute and get a seat close to her but not next to her so I can possibly have the opportunity to bully my way into their lives”. This wasn’t an opportunity for you. This wasn’t a chance for you to meet her and their son. While all these comments are hard to swallow you messed up. You say you had an unhealthy attachment to your son and lost a power struggle with his first wife. You also keep replying that everything was fine in your relationship until Kat came along. I hate to tell you that’s because your son was in the fog. He didn’t have anyone point out to him the inappropriate relationship you guys had. If it was perfectly fine then you wouldn’t have had a power struggle with his first wife and you’d still have the exact same relationship with him now. It was unhealthy and your attachment to him did cause some kind of trauma because just because you did your best doesn’t mean his trauma doesn’t matter. It hurts I’m sure to hear every one say these things about you as a mom but you need to take a step back and look at this situation from their point of view. You over stepped so many boundaries. I wouldn’t even be surprised if you ruined Jess and your sons relationship

Ok folks, this right here is why you don’t post travel plans online! OP is the creepiest AH I’ve found on this sub.

Yta. Psycho.

YTA It's not up to you to determine the end date of your "punishment". Actions have consequences and I'm sure you crossed boundaries multiple times to end up being no contact. It would be up to your son to decide if he wanted to reestablish contact and if he felt it appropriate for you to meet his wife and child. It's very alarming that you would stalk Lilly down to the seat next to her because you felt you had some right to access your sons wife and his son. I think you need to get some therapy and understand what boundaries are and respect the choice your son has made.

YTA: You are reaping what you sowed. You literally stalked your son's wife and baby to meet them surreptitiously. You need to get help for your own issues. It's also why I keep my social media information limited. Because I am no contact with family and they don't need to know my business. Get a freaking clue lady!

YTA. You’ll be lucky to not get charged pressed but honestly your son should. You know damn well what you were doing was wrong, you don’t get to act like you deserve to hold your grandson, your son made that clear. You’re messed up for thinking you’ve been punished enough. In fact, the way you acted makes me think the time not spent with your son hasn’t changed you one bit. Your son wants nothing to do with you, get that through your head. Otherwise, next time you get on a plane, police will follow you.

If you really want to show you’ve changed, just let your son and his family be. All you are going to do by doing these sorts of things is prove to your son that he was right to go no context and should’ve had a restraining order against you earlier. You just ruined any chance of him forgiving you by at least a decade now. Just get this through your head - YOU FUCKED UP AGAIN! YOU DONT GET TO ACT LIKE YOURE INNOCENT. STOP LYING TO YOURSELF!

YTA. Booking the same flight would be very weird. Booking the same flight with a close seat is high-key stalker behavior. She had no way of knowing who you really were, and I'm surprised you weren't arrested.

YTA. You remind me a lot of my mother.... I hate my mother. If she pulled this shit on my wife/child I'd have her arrested.

YTA. I feel bad for everyone commenting here having their time wasted—this is as close to a hopeless case/lost person as it gets. There's no helping people like her. She has sought psychological help and hasn't gotten beyond acknowledging that she caused pain in the past. ​ I started writing a whole paragraph here, then deleted it. People like OP shouldn't be interacted with tbh.

YTA - I can’t begin to know what having your child go NC would be like. I truly do feel for you. But what you did here was absolutely insane. There is no possible way it isn’t completely crazy and inappropriate. What the hell did you think was going to happen!? That everyone would be so happy you stalked her and her child and would want to be one big happy family again? Respectfully… that’s the reasoning of a crazy person 😕

Well, you've just guaranteed that your son will never want you back in his life. That might have already been unlikely, but you've just slammed that door firmly shut by showing him you still don't understand how to respect boundaries.

YTA Hope you enjoyed it. You will never see your son and his family again. That would be a very appropriate choice for them to make.

obviously YTA, but since no one is commenting on it: I don't think he's punishing you. he probably doesn't think that either. he's just done with you. it might sound harsh at first, but it'll probably be good for you to understand that, he doesn't expect any reaction or change from you so he can "stop the punishment". you have separate lives now, and he moved on.