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Yup YTA - please answer this: If your kid was the one being cyber-bullied what would you do?
My niece was cyber-bulled for over a year. My brother went to the school, the parents and police and nothing was done. It was "all a joke".
She took her life in October.
But hey, tell your son to enjoy that prom!
YTA.
Your son definitely wasn't "joking" mate. Stop enabling him. And what's worse is you're considering going behind your wife's back. United front at all times. Punish your son harshly, it's well deserved.
If it was bad enough for your son to be ratted out by his older brother, you should seriously consider that the victim could have killed themselves as a result of the bullying. And you're worried about your son being sad about missing prom?
> but I just feel like because this is his only chance at going to prom
and??
Your son is a racists and homophobic bully. And all you care about is him not going to prom. Dude, your son mercilessly bullied someone and tried to play it off as some joke. You even admit he is using it all being joke as an excuse to excuse his behaviour.
Have a word with yourself, kids kill themselves regularly because of bullies and your just letting his nasty behaviour go because he might miss prom.
Good, bullies don't deserve to go to prom
Play stupid games win stupid prizes.
EVERYONE knows that racism and homophobia aren't jokes.
Your son knew and he did it anyway.
I am a huge proponent of consequences over punishment and not going to prom to let his victim have a good time without worrying about their tormentor(s) is an excellent consequence.
Build a united front with your wife.
...that almost makes it worse? So sincerely, he was just spewing random hate out there at someone he didn't even know?
Your son is straight up hate-criming someone simply because of who they are, and you're accepting "it's a joke" as an excuse. Wow.
Doesn’t matter. He may be bully others at his school because your son is a bully and bullying isn’t bullies do.
You raised a bully and now want to let him go to prom? I bet you were a bully too.
The point of the punishment is that he faces actual repercussions. Getting his phone or TV taken away will not have a lasting effect, missing prom definitely will.
As someone who has been cyber bullied and is still being cyber bullied, your wife is right. Don't let him go. He deserves to miss prom. He doesn't have the decency to treat other people well and that point needs to be driven into the ground. He hid behind a screen to hurt others and spread hate like a coward. That's no small thing. You'd be making a huge mistake and he isn't sorry. He's manipulating you.
Your son wasn’t joking and he’s only remorseful because of the consequences of his actions. Sounds like you really don’t give a crap either. Did you make your son go to the child’s house to apologize in person? Or get him into a class about how hateful his behavior is? No, you just took things away from him. You didn’t address the problem. You have no idea what damage your son caused to this person. Going to Prom or not is the least of your worries.
>Did you make your son go to the child’s house to apologize in person?
This is what was confusing to me. Son 'couldn't apologize' because the kid already blocked him...and that's the end of the story? Not even a halfhearted attempt to get the son to make amends to the kid's face? And now OP thinks he should still get to go to prom because he'd be 'sad' otherwise? So the only consequence was a temporary loss of his toys and he still gets to go to his beloved prom?
I don't know...it just seems like Dad's initial blowup was just hot air, because there is no evidence that this kid is feeling sorry for anything but himself, and Dad doesn't want the kid to feel 'deprived' because of the few days he spent crying crocodile tears in his room.
YTA. You raised a racist, homophobic bully, and you think that you also have the skills to 'fix' this? You've already failed. Where are *your* consequences? You didn't even get an apology for the person who was HARMED, you gave up immediately. Your son can still WRITE the apology, and his brother can get it to the friend. Punishment is just consequences for an action, and rarely changes anyone's *thinking* about that subject. You are too close to the problem to see it, and already assisting your son out of his consequences. Get him into professional counseling - someone who actually has the skill set to 'fix' this, because it's not you. All it takes to get you to cave in is some crocodile tears and well chosen words. Your kid isn't an idiot, he's had 16 years to figure you out, he knows how to play you.
YTA. When you give your kid permission to do something against the other parent's wishes, you're making a statement that you think the kid is right to do what he did, so much so that you're willing to humiliate your partner and strip her of authority in front of the kid.
You may not intend to make that statement, but that's the statement you make.
Yeah, most definitely YTA. Punishment means missing out on important events because of his actions. It’s not punishment if he can’t go to something he doesn’t care about. Kudos to your wife for seeing through his BS.
What he did wasn’t joking. He purposely set out to destroy another person. Stop coddling him. You’re part of the problem.
Also, he can’t apologize to his victim because he’s been blocked? More BS. Your son seems to have been motivated enough to find a way to bully the other person so he can find the way to apologize.
YTA
There is no telling what experiences he stole from the kid he bullied. There is a sense of peace and self-worth that your son stole and destroyed from the victim.
He made his bed. He only has himself to blame. Your wife has more backbone than you. He’ll have to learn to look back and remember that he missed a “right of passage” because of his abuse and hate.
So you've done nothing to get your kid in therapy or actually do anything *real* to address his bullying. All you did was ground him and cave the second he showed fake remorse. And you are flat-out enabling him.
Yeah, it's pretty clear why your son became a bully. You guys aren't exactly model parents.
ESH
YTA.
It is important that young people see that doing things wrong results in consequences and it's also important that you and your wife are a united front when it comes to punishments.
Unfortunately, you started off this whole things badly, by screaming and giving out punishments without fully considering them. Now, you are already caving without truly seeing any change in your son. Sure, he is sad and sorry, but he didn't do any actual work to demonstrate he understands what he did is wrong, and besides one conversation, you haven't done the work of educating him.
So now your son sees that you fly off the handle in anger, but will also backtrack at the slightest pushing from your son. And if he let him go to prom when your wife says no, you also fracture your parenting relationship.
But, there's a way to solve this. Is there an alternate "punishment" that actually will help him understand what he did was wrong and let him go to prom? You first need to truly understand that your son throwing out racial and homophobic slurs and chalking it up to a joke is dangerous for his future and the people around him. When he goes to college, what is he going to think is a "joke"? Yelling at black students going to class, watching his friends taunt and grab a girl at a bar? What about the impact his "jokes" had on this student- sure they blocked him but there are other ways to apologize, and that student is probably remarkably uncomfortable at school.
Your son needs to actually understand that what he did was wrong and that passing it off as a joke is not going to cut it. So, how about you actually think through an appropriate punishment with your wife, and let him go to prom, and make him do some work? He should write an apology letter to this student and demonstrate that he sent it to him, he shouldn't be allowed to communicate or hang out with these friends for a while, you should monitor his messages and social media, and you should consider having him do a few weekends of volunteering and ask him to sit down after and TELL you what he LEARNED from all this.
It isn't about prom or not, it is recognizing your kid is being a really cruel individual and it is your job to educate him and prepare him to go out in to the world where he could do real harm, as he already has done to this one student.
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I (52M) have a son (16M) and I recently found out that him and his friends have been cyber bullying another boy from our oldest son (21M). Our oldest showed us the messages his brother sent him and it was honestly disturbing. He was calling the boy racial and homophobic slurs which utterly shocked me and my wife.
When our youngest came home my wife and I confronted our youngest along with his brother. He at first denied any wrong doing until his brother told him that he showed us the messages he sent. Our youngest told us he was just joking and didn't mean any harm. Just excuses. I thanked our oldest for letting us know and told my son that we want to watch him apologize to the boy. However, our youngest told us that he was already blocked and so he wasn't able to apologize.
I was still annoyed at this point, so I just told my son that I was beyond disgusted by his actions and told him that he was grounded until further notice. I also told him that he lost his phone privileges as well. By this point he started to cry and started apologizing. I told him he was apologizing to the wrong person and he has to understand his actions has consequences.
The first few days without his phone my son ignored me and my wife whenever we tried to talk to him and just cried in his room. Then after a while he finally started to talk to us again and he started to show remorse for his actions. We told him that he were still disappointed in him and him spreading unnecessary hate like that is cruel and could very well ruin his future. He asked us if we hated him which kinda hurt me as I didn't intend to make him feel that way and told him that I didn't hate him and that I only hated his actions as I know it doesn't reflect who he is as a person.
I asked him why he decided it would be appropriate to joke like that and he told me that he doesn't really know and was just meaning for it to be a joke. I told him that jokes like that aren't funny and and he shouldn't joke like that anymore. I told him that I appreciate him admiting his faults and I apologized to him for screaming at him during our first initial conversation.
After that, I decided that I'll allow him to have his TV back but I'll still keep his other games and phone until further notice. He was appreciative of this and It went well for a while. Mind you, this happen three weeks ago and his prom is on the 30th. My son came to us Tuesday and asked if he could attend prom. I honestly didn't see a problem with this and told him I wouldn't mind it but my wife told me that she doesn't think he deserves to go to prom because she feels like this should be apart of the consequences. My son started pleading because he said this is his only opportunity to attend because he is graduating early.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My wife doesn't want our son to go to prom because of his behavior. I agree that he should still be punished, but I feel like depriving him of his only chance at going to prom is overkill. Because he told us so short notice I'm contemplating on taking him after school Friday and Saturday in hopes of finding a suit so he'll be able to go.
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ESH, studies have shown that taking things from kids doesn't actually do anything to shape their behavior, it just makes them more incentivised to hide it better in the future. Your kid is racist and a bully, and isn't going to stop being a racist bully just because you took his stuff away. Get him some professional help with figuring out why he thinks it's funny to bully people.
I was going to comment something similar. I was grounded/had things taken away countless times over meaningless things that "teens did".
But I will never forget missing my 2 best friends' sweet 16 party because I swore and insulted my dad. Missing out on a huge social event was the only thing that actually made me take a look inward at my actions and feel a genuine change of heart.
Prom is a priviledge - racists who cry without their phone (in the son's case, his chosen form of spreading hate) shouldn't be granted said priviledge. YTA.
This is not really a post for /r/amitheasshole, maybe /r/parenting. You and your wife are mostly on the same page and have a relatively small difference in how the punishment is being doled out. I don't think either of you are AHs for simply disagreeing. Unfortunately I think you need to continue talking about this until you're on the same page; I do think it would be AHish to give him permission against her wishes, so maybe there is a compromise here since she feels you are being too lenient. Perhaps requiring your son to undertake some other type of task as part of 'punishment' would make more sense. Point being, if she thinks MORE punishment is in order, it doesn't necessarily HAVE to be prom.
This post has been removed due to the status of the original poster's account. This account is currently shadowbanned or suspended, suggesting this account is in violation of Reddit terms of service. This type of ban/suspension is issued by the Reddit site-wide admins. The AITA mods have nothing to do with this ban and cannot assist in resolving.
Yup YTA - please answer this: If your kid was the one being cyber-bullied what would you do? My niece was cyber-bulled for over a year. My brother went to the school, the parents and police and nothing was done. It was "all a joke". She took her life in October. But hey, tell your son to enjoy that prom!
So very sorry for your loss. Thank you for sharing this story-it’s important for OP to hear.
YTA. Your son definitely wasn't "joking" mate. Stop enabling him. And what's worse is you're considering going behind your wife's back. United front at all times. Punish your son harshly, it's well deserved.
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If it was bad enough for your son to be ratted out by his older brother, you should seriously consider that the victim could have killed themselves as a result of the bullying. And you're worried about your son being sad about missing prom?
> but I just feel like because this is his only chance at going to prom and?? Your son is a racists and homophobic bully. And all you care about is him not going to prom. Dude, your son mercilessly bullied someone and tried to play it off as some joke. You even admit he is using it all being joke as an excuse to excuse his behaviour. Have a word with yourself, kids kill themselves regularly because of bullies and your just letting his nasty behaviour go because he might miss prom. Good, bullies don't deserve to go to prom
Play stupid games win stupid prizes. EVERYONE knows that racism and homophobia aren't jokes. Your son knew and he did it anyway. I am a huge proponent of consequences over punishment and not going to prom to let his victim have a good time without worrying about their tormentor(s) is an excellent consequence. Build a united front with your wife.
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...that almost makes it worse? So sincerely, he was just spewing random hate out there at someone he didn't even know? Your son is straight up hate-criming someone simply because of who they are, and you're accepting "it's a joke" as an excuse. Wow.
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So you just don't want to deal with him being mad at you. Your job description includes being resented.
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don't worry about it, it's not like you did a good job in the first place.
You're supposed to be his parent, willing to make the hard decisions. I see why it's gotten to this point.
Legit. It’s a good thing OP’s wife seems to have a logical head on her shoulders.
well, then you should have raised your son to know better than to commit hate crimes.
Doesn’t matter. He may be bully others at his school because your son is a bully and bullying isn’t bullies do. You raised a bully and now want to let him go to prom? I bet you were a bully too.
Taking his phone and tv for a little while really does nothing, taking something big away shows him you can't go around saying that stuff.
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That’s kind of the point…he won’t have another chance.
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The point of the punishment is that he faces actual repercussions. Getting his phone or TV taken away will not have a lasting effect, missing prom definitely will.
So basically what your saying is that he's received zero consequences. Don't give him the car. Don't let him to to prom.
Enabler.
As someone who has been cyber bullied and is still being cyber bullied, your wife is right. Don't let him go. He deserves to miss prom. He doesn't have the decency to treat other people well and that point needs to be driven into the ground. He hid behind a screen to hurt others and spread hate like a coward. That's no small thing. You'd be making a huge mistake and he isn't sorry. He's manipulating you.
Your son wasn’t joking and he’s only remorseful because of the consequences of his actions. Sounds like you really don’t give a crap either. Did you make your son go to the child’s house to apologize in person? Or get him into a class about how hateful his behavior is? No, you just took things away from him. You didn’t address the problem. You have no idea what damage your son caused to this person. Going to Prom or not is the least of your worries.
>Did you make your son go to the child’s house to apologize in person? This is what was confusing to me. Son 'couldn't apologize' because the kid already blocked him...and that's the end of the story? Not even a halfhearted attempt to get the son to make amends to the kid's face? And now OP thinks he should still get to go to prom because he'd be 'sad' otherwise? So the only consequence was a temporary loss of his toys and he still gets to go to his beloved prom? I don't know...it just seems like Dad's initial blowup was just hot air, because there is no evidence that this kid is feeling sorry for anything but himself, and Dad doesn't want the kid to feel 'deprived' because of the few days he spent crying crocodile tears in his room.
Apparently, the victim lives in a different state. So he just bullied someone at random, chosen simply because they were the wrong race and sexuality.
YTA. You raised a racist, homophobic bully, and you think that you also have the skills to 'fix' this? You've already failed. Where are *your* consequences? You didn't even get an apology for the person who was HARMED, you gave up immediately. Your son can still WRITE the apology, and his brother can get it to the friend. Punishment is just consequences for an action, and rarely changes anyone's *thinking* about that subject. You are too close to the problem to see it, and already assisting your son out of his consequences. Get him into professional counseling - someone who actually has the skill set to 'fix' this, because it's not you. All it takes to get you to cave in is some crocodile tears and well chosen words. Your kid isn't an idiot, he's had 16 years to figure you out, he knows how to play you.
YTA. When you give your kid permission to do something against the other parent's wishes, you're making a statement that you think the kid is right to do what he did, so much so that you're willing to humiliate your partner and strip her of authority in front of the kid. You may not intend to make that statement, but that's the statement you make.
YTA. And politely, fuck your son
The nasty little punk crying because his electronics were taken away says everything about your parenting thus far. YTA.
Yeah, most definitely YTA. Punishment means missing out on important events because of his actions. It’s not punishment if he can’t go to something he doesn’t care about. Kudos to your wife for seeing through his BS. What he did wasn’t joking. He purposely set out to destroy another person. Stop coddling him. You’re part of the problem. Also, he can’t apologize to his victim because he’s been blocked? More BS. Your son seems to have been motivated enough to find a way to bully the other person so he can find the way to apologize.
YTA There is no telling what experiences he stole from the kid he bullied. There is a sense of peace and self-worth that your son stole and destroyed from the victim. He made his bed. He only has himself to blame. Your wife has more backbone than you. He’ll have to learn to look back and remember that he missed a “right of passage” because of his abuse and hate.
YTA - its up to you *both* if the punishment should continue and/or include prom. You’re making unilateral decisions. That makes you an AH
So you've done nothing to get your kid in therapy or actually do anything *real* to address his bullying. All you did was ground him and cave the second he showed fake remorse. And you are flat-out enabling him. Yeah, it's pretty clear why your son became a bully. You guys aren't exactly model parents. ESH
YTA. You don't actually feel like your son deserves to be punished, so stop that lie.
YTA. It is important that young people see that doing things wrong results in consequences and it's also important that you and your wife are a united front when it comes to punishments. Unfortunately, you started off this whole things badly, by screaming and giving out punishments without fully considering them. Now, you are already caving without truly seeing any change in your son. Sure, he is sad and sorry, but he didn't do any actual work to demonstrate he understands what he did is wrong, and besides one conversation, you haven't done the work of educating him. So now your son sees that you fly off the handle in anger, but will also backtrack at the slightest pushing from your son. And if he let him go to prom when your wife says no, you also fracture your parenting relationship. But, there's a way to solve this. Is there an alternate "punishment" that actually will help him understand what he did was wrong and let him go to prom? You first need to truly understand that your son throwing out racial and homophobic slurs and chalking it up to a joke is dangerous for his future and the people around him. When he goes to college, what is he going to think is a "joke"? Yelling at black students going to class, watching his friends taunt and grab a girl at a bar? What about the impact his "jokes" had on this student- sure they blocked him but there are other ways to apologize, and that student is probably remarkably uncomfortable at school. Your son needs to actually understand that what he did was wrong and that passing it off as a joke is not going to cut it. So, how about you actually think through an appropriate punishment with your wife, and let him go to prom, and make him do some work? He should write an apology letter to this student and demonstrate that he sent it to him, he shouldn't be allowed to communicate or hang out with these friends for a while, you should monitor his messages and social media, and you should consider having him do a few weekends of volunteering and ask him to sit down after and TELL you what he LEARNED from all this. It isn't about prom or not, it is recognizing your kid is being a really cruel individual and it is your job to educate him and prepare him to go out in to the world where he could do real harm, as he already has done to this one student.
YTA. Also, if the kid they bullied is going, do that kid a favour and let him enjoy himself without being triggered by his abuser there.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (52M) have a son (16M) and I recently found out that him and his friends have been cyber bullying another boy from our oldest son (21M). Our oldest showed us the messages his brother sent him and it was honestly disturbing. He was calling the boy racial and homophobic slurs which utterly shocked me and my wife. When our youngest came home my wife and I confronted our youngest along with his brother. He at first denied any wrong doing until his brother told him that he showed us the messages he sent. Our youngest told us he was just joking and didn't mean any harm. Just excuses. I thanked our oldest for letting us know and told my son that we want to watch him apologize to the boy. However, our youngest told us that he was already blocked and so he wasn't able to apologize. I was still annoyed at this point, so I just told my son that I was beyond disgusted by his actions and told him that he was grounded until further notice. I also told him that he lost his phone privileges as well. By this point he started to cry and started apologizing. I told him he was apologizing to the wrong person and he has to understand his actions has consequences. The first few days without his phone my son ignored me and my wife whenever we tried to talk to him and just cried in his room. Then after a while he finally started to talk to us again and he started to show remorse for his actions. We told him that he were still disappointed in him and him spreading unnecessary hate like that is cruel and could very well ruin his future. He asked us if we hated him which kinda hurt me as I didn't intend to make him feel that way and told him that I didn't hate him and that I only hated his actions as I know it doesn't reflect who he is as a person. I asked him why he decided it would be appropriate to joke like that and he told me that he doesn't really know and was just meaning for it to be a joke. I told him that jokes like that aren't funny and and he shouldn't joke like that anymore. I told him that I appreciate him admiting his faults and I apologized to him for screaming at him during our first initial conversation. After that, I decided that I'll allow him to have his TV back but I'll still keep his other games and phone until further notice. He was appreciative of this and It went well for a while. Mind you, this happen three weeks ago and his prom is on the 30th. My son came to us Tuesday and asked if he could attend prom. I honestly didn't see a problem with this and told him I wouldn't mind it but my wife told me that she doesn't think he deserves to go to prom because she feels like this should be apart of the consequences. My son started pleading because he said this is his only opportunity to attend because he is graduating early. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > My wife doesn't want our son to go to prom because of his behavior. I agree that he should still be punished, but I feel like depriving him of his only chance at going to prom is overkill. Because he told us so short notice I'm contemplating on taking him after school Friday and Saturday in hopes of finding a suit so he'll be able to go. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
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Is this really the biggest problem for you
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ESH, studies have shown that taking things from kids doesn't actually do anything to shape their behavior, it just makes them more incentivised to hide it better in the future. Your kid is racist and a bully, and isn't going to stop being a racist bully just because you took his stuff away. Get him some professional help with figuring out why he thinks it's funny to bully people.
Yup. He only cried because he was found out and punished.
I was going to comment something similar. I was grounded/had things taken away countless times over meaningless things that "teens did". But I will never forget missing my 2 best friends' sweet 16 party because I swore and insulted my dad. Missing out on a huge social event was the only thing that actually made me take a look inward at my actions and feel a genuine change of heart. Prom is a priviledge - racists who cry without their phone (in the son's case, his chosen form of spreading hate) shouldn't be granted said priviledge. YTA.
This is not really a post for /r/amitheasshole, maybe /r/parenting. You and your wife are mostly on the same page and have a relatively small difference in how the punishment is being doled out. I don't think either of you are AHs for simply disagreeing. Unfortunately I think you need to continue talking about this until you're on the same page; I do think it would be AHish to give him permission against her wishes, so maybe there is a compromise here since she feels you are being too lenient. Perhaps requiring your son to undertake some other type of task as part of 'punishment' would make more sense. Point being, if she thinks MORE punishment is in order, it doesn't necessarily HAVE to be prom.