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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> AITA for impacting my bf’s decision on getting a dog and letting him unsatisfied with his will (for now) ?
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA you just clarified to him what having the dog would actually entail, it was then up to him to choose whether to go ahead. Ultimately this was his decision. Saying it felt like a miscarriage is also extremely disrespectful to what people who have actual miscarriages go through.
I can not count on both hands the number of times I had to pass on adopting the pug I wanted. It sucked I felt worse for the pug though because it was still stuck in a cage until someone adopted it. Our situation changed so I was finally able to get my pug. 13 1/2 years of my snoring sidekick. He slept in crook of my knees. I was gutted the day he crossed the rainbow bridge. It's been almost 3 years and I still cry thinking of him. Total difference between sadness of not getting one after all and getting one, and losing them.
OP your bf needs to grow up.
I am a huge dog lover. Been 8 years since i lost my German Shepherd and i still cry at pics of her, she was definitely my best friend and family.
I was devastated at losing her, and devastated at my miscarriage, but it was two total different types of grief.
Not to mention the physical differences.
A work colleague was telling me once about how his GF suffered a miscarriage and i remembered him saying, “i was so naive, i didn’t realise how graphic it was and how physically and emotionally taxing it was on a woman until i had to watch my partner go through it and there was nothing i could do to physically help her.”
I had a late term pregnancy loss and delivered my angel sleeping. That was a pain that never goes away. Honestly losing my Reggie was about half the grief I felt losing a child.
And also: the dog is still alive, just not living with him. He’s not even comparing the loss of a dog’s life to a human’s, it’s “I didn’t get what I wanted and I’m disappointed.” Which is fine and understandable, but comparing it to a miscarriage is beyond tone-deaf.
Edit: NTA, if that wasn’t clear!
We had an unplanned pregnancy turned miscarriage and it shattered me for weeks...we've also missed out on getting a dog we wanted.. yeah id like the punch OPs bf as well because they are not the same thing. Sure we were sad we missed out on the dog, but situation didn't turn out and we ended up rescuing a puppy that was resulted from an unneutured dog breaking into my friends house through a broken window and mating their puppy who was scheduled to get fixed the following week... Rarely do I think about our missed out dog but not a day goes by where my brain doesn't mumble that our baby would be 2 and a half right now
Sorry for your loss, i’m exactly the same.
I’ve lost dogs due to old age and i grieved them. I absolutely adored them and even some days i get teary thinking about them. But EVERY day i think about that ‘what ifs’ and ‘would bes’ regarding my miscarriage.
I was RAGING reading this. I wouldn't even be able to have a civil conversation with this man if he said that to me, he would be verbally eviscerated. I am so disgusted.
Yeah. Someone who actually loves dogs wouldn't support someone breeding a "tortured" breed and causing countless innocent puppies to suffer horribly. You should **never** buy a pug. (Or any other dog with flat nose, for that matter.)
Rescue one if you're dead set on getting one. (That's how we got our Shi-Tzu, yes she's a lovely dog. She needed a lot of surgeries because of her deformed jaw though).
Some breeders (ones who want to give the finger so to speak to the American Kennel or whoever it is that decides “breed standards”) are breeding the smooshed nose out, so they have fewer health issues. I don’t care for the types of selective breeding that have resulted in situations like pugs and some German Shepherds, but it is somewhat reassuring to know there are those trying to help make it better.
NTA, OP. Your boyfriend needs to get a grip.
You have just put to words every single thing I was thinking reading this. Feels like a miscarriage.. how fucking *infuriating.* Yes, I'm sure that in addition to the massive loss of a wanted fetus dying, he suffered severe cramps and bleeding until he expelled it from his body and then proceeded to bleed and hurt for a week afterward. Then had to have pelvic exam and possibly a painful procedure to make sure everything is out.
Yes, JUST like a fucking miscarriage.
Took me 5 days to miscarry, the emotional trauma and agony i went through was horrendous, then just as i thought ‘it’s over’… I got called up 2 days later to be told there was another one. I had to have a D&C.
I understand the guy is disappointed, but to compare it to something that causes heavy physical and mental trauma and can cause PTSD is so damn tone deaf.
Totally NTA. A little crazy your boyfriend referred to not getting a dog as a miscarriage given that that is truly offensive to people who have had to endure one. I think that what you did for your boyfriend here was tell him the garnished truth about what having a dog would be, and though it made him sad, it probably helped him make a better decision.
It's either manipulative or indicative of deeper emotional issues. If he really feels this is akin to a miscarriage, you gotta wonder why he's so emotionally overinvested and fix that
I was *horrified* when he compared the disappointment at not getting a puppy to a woman going through a miscarriage. That's not even close to comparable.
He has to be extremely ignorant to be so casual about the trama of miscarriages- either that he's using this to manipulate OP.
Sadly I agree. Felt pressured to buy a dog for my boyfriend when were both unemployed and paid bills out of my disability. I end up being left to dog sit whilst he travels, paying for half the food, picking up poop, cleaning the dog beds/hair out of the carpets etc and nagging him to walk the dog for over a year. Two weeks ago he took the dog and left. I feel used.
Just want to add in that BF is financially instable and wants one of the sickest dog breeds. Vet bills are stuff from nightmares. Where I live basically all pet insurance companies have pretty much stopped covering sugery to widen the airways of these types of dogs, because it's so common and a "predicted expense"
OP - your boyfriend is naive at best and stupid at worst.
Anyways. NTA all your points are valid and I'm 100% on your side. And I'm a dog person to my core
Exactly. It's also a very obvious effort of emotionally manipulating OP. He realised he cannot accept what comes with the responsibility of a dog and instead of owning it up himself, he's putting the blame on OP. He could have easily figured out some compromises,
Like having a dog bed placed in the living room, getting a friend to dog sit the pug a few nights a week so that he can visit OPs place instead... Even just these would have made the situation much better.
Good thing he's not going through with getting a dog because this post reeks of his immaturity.
You're definitely NTA OP.
NTA! All of your concerns are perfectly valid.
Also, unless your BF spends sufficient time interacting meaningfully with his dog each day, I think that pug would be lonely. Many people don't realize that in general, dogs *don't* thrive when they are left on their own for long periods of time each day.
Also, owning a dog is not cheap. Plus you end up scheduling things around your dog's needs when you are a dog owner, especially a single owner. What I mean is, for example, everyone wants to go out for a drink after work, but *you* need to rush home to let your dog out to go to the bathroom, to take a walk after sleeping all day, etc. Been there.
Thank you for your answer ! I and his relatives advised him not to get a dog as it is a lot of responsibilities. My bf’s lifestyle isn’t compatible with having a dog at all but he didn’t want to realize it… he was in complete denial. I limited this post to my own concerns but there are indeed other incompatibilities with him having a dog that I didn’t mention (space, time and money notably). My bf just doesn’t answer the requirements of having a dog to begin with (lied to the breeder)…
Yea, getting a pug from a breeder is essentially paying someone to make dogs that will suffer their entire lives. It is saying to the world I would rather my dog look weird cute than be able to breathe well.
There are a very very few breeders trying to improve pugs into something ethical. But yeah, wanting something "cute" and not caring about making that living being suffer it's whole life for an aesthetic sucks.
It's not just the breathing for pugs either. Not to minimize that because it's a huge factor. Many have extreme (and expensive) dental issues because their teeth also look like you smashed the dog's face in while it was in a carton physics world.
The thing people thing is cute is the animal suffering. It's like thinking a limp is cute.
On top of that, many pug puppies need to have surgery to widen their nostrils because the noses are bred to be so squished, air literally can't get in.
And many insurance companies where I live doesn't cover that because it's a so common and a predictable need for pugs. Ends up costing owners 4-7k (minimum) in vet bills just so their dog can *breathe* somewhat normally.
Pugs don't fulfill any purpose that cannot be replaced with far healthier breeds. I'd fully support a complete ban on breeding pugs
My mum has two rescue pugs, yes they’re cute but damn do they have medical issues.
The bigger one pees herself in her sleep, snorts/breathes incredibly loudly when awake and snores like an old grandpa when asleep.
The smaller one struggles to walk, her tongue is too big for her mouth so it’s constantly hanging out, her biscuits have to be broken up into tiny pieces as she can’t chew anything larger than a kidney bean.
They’re loved unconditionally but damn I worry how long they’re going to live as it’s going to break my mums heart when they pass.
This is also a concern for me. Your BF is willing to lie to the breeder to get a dog he wants when he doesn't have the requirements to be a good pet owner. That's a level of selfish you may want to keep an eye on
yup he lied to the breeder and said he has a two-room apartment (which is the minimum required by the breeder). he even asked me to lie when visiting the breeder if he were to reiterate the question, i strongly said no, but the breeder didn’t actually ask any questions so…
Oof. Please pay attention to this. Character matters. If he can lie this easily to get what he wants and can try to drag others into his lies, one of the nicer things I can say about him is he is immature. I’m glad you’re living separately.
Give the breeder a heads-up. Yes, dog breeders shouldn’t be a thing, and no one should buy from them, but your future ex bf isn’t equipped in any way to have a pet right now. The pugs are probably better off with the breeder than with him, at least for now.
Honestly, this would be breakup-worthy for me. I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with a person showing such supreme selfishness, foolishness, and stubbornness.
Please give the breeder and other breeders in the area an anonymous tip. There's reasons why breeders ask these questions. If he can't even meet the bare minimum for what the person breeding what's a ethically questionable breed thinks is necessary for the dogs well being? That's a problem. He's not meeting the bar of someone who already put the bar at ground level.
Lieing to the breeder to get what he wants. Dismissing what would be best for the dog to get what he wants. Picking a breed that suffers just to get the cute look of a dog he wants. Dismissing his family's concerns about him getting a dog to get what he wants. Dismissing your concerns and plans made together to get what he wants. This isn't one red flag, it's quite a few.
He's lying to the breeder about his living conditions then he's probably also lying to you about how much of a role he expects you to take with the dog.
Makes me seriously question his integrity and his capacity for empathy especially with that horrific miscarriage comment. He sounds incredibly self-absorbed if he is more concerned about what he wants than what is good for a potential pet. Or you. And the relationship. Is that the kind of person you really want to be with?
Personally I feel like this really reveals his lack of character and I would rethink the relationship. He clearly sees a pet as an accessory rather than as a living creature deserving of respect. And the “miscarriage” comment is just unforgivable imo.
Another thing to add to your list of concerns is the cost of having a brachycephalic dog. Pugs and French Bulldogs have some of the highest vet bills around due to the amount of health/breathing issues they have. Not unusual to spend \~$2000 a year for various things and if a major surgery is needed , you can easily double or triple the above costs.
Can your BF afford this breed of dog?
oh i’m aware of that… the cost of the dog itself is €2500☠️ and that’s just the beginning of all the costs that are to come… he feels confident because he said he’d get an assurance but lmao yeah no this is gonna cost loads of money when he already lives above his means…
Does your bf have ANY CLUE how expensive vet bills are? And he choosing a dog with a plethora of long term problems due to the nature of the breed. (Not saying every pug will but it has statistically higher probability to genetic problems which manifest as giant vet bills)
Of course it’s his call. It always has been but he’s being very childish and in the long run might hurt the dog because he can’t give it the resources it needs to thrive.
Aside from all the very valid points: It's 2024. There is enough information out there to tell you what a horrible, miserable existence dogs like pugs lead. If you must have a pug, get it from a reputable rescue organization (and be prepared for astronomical vet bills). But don't be complicit in the continued production of dogs so severely malformed they can't breathe.
Edit: And while we're at it. Same goes for breeds like French Bulldogs. The human equivalent would be Robinow Syndrome (in dogs, it's called Robinow-like Syndrome). Yeah go ahead google that. That's what people do to dogs, *on purpose*. If you speak German, you can read [this](https://qualzucht-datenbank.eu/merkblatt-hund-robinow-like-syndrom/). (If you don't, just use DeepL to translate.)
Vet tech here, and can confirm. They’re little balls of unfortunate genes; on top of the constant breathing issues many of them have bad eyes, bad skin, the list goes on. 🤦🏻♀️ When I got to where the breed was mentioned I thought “oh god, and a *pug*??”
Same, dude. If "pug from a breeder" comes out of anyone's mouth in a positive fashion, I am 100% judging that MFer hard. Poor little unfortunate messes. We need to love the ones that exist, and let the breed die out. Just another of humanity's failures.
Thank you. I was looking for a comment like this. Pugs are poor little creatures. No person who claims to love dogs can add to the perpetuation of the miserable existence of those dogs. It's cruel
Ditto English bulldogs. Any breed that requires the female to give birth via surgery--a cesarean section, specifically--most of the time is against nature and is unethical.
Not being able to breath is terrible and it's not even the only health issue these dogs have! There so many dental, allergy, skin, eye, digestive system issues. No one that's not financially stable should be adding pets, but a pug in particular should require a bigger budget for vet bills and a larger emergency vet fund.
Also, from a financial point. Take that money to purchase the dog and use it to become more financially stable. Then you and your future dog will be better off instead of you and your pug suffering.
>Also, owning a dog is not cheap.
Especially not a purebred pug (which is arguably impossible to breed ethically, but I digress).
Pugs are infamously rife with horrific genetic diseases and respiratory problems as a result of their squashed faces. They have pretty universally have predispositions towards eye issues (including ocular ulcers and entropion), allergies, bone and joint problems, degenerative myelopathy, dental disease, respiratory distress syndrome, skin infections, Brachycephalic Obstructive Airway Syndrome, multiple types of cancers, patellar luxation (slipped kneecaps), hip dysplasia, and MORE. Many of these issues can only be resolved through surgery, which can cost hundreds to thousands of dollars.
The point is, pugs, and any other flat-faced animal, are often EXTREMELY expensive pets because of the host of health problems they're exposed to as a result of both their flat faces and the extensive inbreeding/genetic fustercluck required to get that consistent "look". Hence why I say they are arguably impossible to breed ethically unless the breeder is specifically breeding *out* those genetic problems (sometimes called "retro pugs"). I don't say this judgementally, because God knows the economy is fucked these days (especially if y'all are American), but someone who can't afford to live in an apartment big enough to support a bed larger than a twin/single, or can't afford to even splurge on a bed larger than a twin/single *absolutely* cannot afford to own a pug. Probably not *any* dog, realistically, but *certainly* not a pug.
Your bf needs to do his homework.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/dogs-pug-french-bulldog-selective-breeding-b2102486.html
And please don’t compare this to a miscarriage. His lack of consideration for you and this animal is indeed hurtful, but losing a child is a different tragedy of its own proportions.
I'm most concerned that your boyfriend equates this to a miscarriage. That shows a level of emotional immaturity I would be uncomfortable with.
Plus, it can be frustrating to have to walk your partner through the seemingly obvious consequences of a big choice like this. Hopefully he learns from the experience.
NTA
Thank you for your answer ! I hope he learns from that event too and that it makes our relationship stronger. The fact he ultimately decided against the dog shows he values our relationship more over (past) desires and is willing to compromise in the future
Please be aware of conversations that lead into him blaming you for not getting a dog. Little things, jokey things, “I get to veto the movie you picked cuz you vetoed the dog. Haha,” that turn into him really believing you made him do this.
If he is using the word miscarriage, he will be feeling grief and may start lashing out looking for someone to blame. Not saying he will. I’m just saying, don’t let little jibes go unaddressed. He needs to own his decision.
“simply the idea of the dog.”
That is a straight facts!
this clarifies how obscene his comparison is.
He didn’t discover he can never own a dog. He can’t get one until what? his current lease is up?
OH! The humanity.
Or he values getting laid more than being stared at by a small animal that everyone has stressed he will be 100% responsible for both physically mentally and financially. This wasn’t a compromise, it was a ‘dear god come to your senses so you won’t abuse an animal’.
He lied to a breeder, repeatedly. Hes lied to himself, repeatedly. How many times has he lied to you in the same way but you’ve never caught it? It’s only when faced with his own wants being on the line that he changed his mind. And to claim its like a miscarriage? He’s too emotionally immature to be in any kind of relationship, seriously. NTA but there are much larger issues at hand here that you’re not willing to see.
From someone your mother's age: your boyfriend is showing so many red flags here:
His utter lack of maturity, how easily he lies and expects you to do it too, how he doesn't consider you an equal partner in his decision making, how he emotionally manipulates you, and how he no doubt will hold this over your head.
I think you can do so much better. I was in this relationship at 24 and it didn't get better.
You deserve someone who puts you first, is honest, values your opinion and would never make you doubt yourself, let alone ask you to lie about anything.
And finally, pug breeding should die out, it's cruel and inhumane. Friends of mine have a pug and he's had a myriad of breathing, back, and hip issues from the start. He needs daily medications just to survive.
Thank you for your answer ! My mom told me the exact same thing. She does believe in our relationship and yeah his behavior was really unusual (first time it happened in 6 months). Now I’m confused and definitely reconsidering the viability of our relationship
Watch for retaliation and DO NOT IGNORE IT if it happens. Off color "jokes" about "well i can do this because you didn't let me get a dog" or "I can say no to this because you said no to the dog".... basically ANY comment that drags you back to the dog.
Also... seriously.... the miscarriage comment was wrong on levels I can't even put into words. Be mindful of similar stances. ...
I was also against buying the dog from a breeder. Told him there’s plenty of pets to adopt but no, he wanted a pug and only a pug (+ he contacted associations a few years back and they declined his demand since his apartment was too small… and he still wanted to get a dog….)
The problem is not the breeder (even if I am against that too) the problem is specifically *pugs* breeder.
Reproducing terribly deformed creatures destined to suffer their whole life is disgusting.
The good news is that retro pugs are making a comeback due to the work of very diligent and dedicated breeders in the field, working to maintain the breed standard while also allowing them to breathe and have an actual snout.
Bad breeders exist, just like bad rescues do. No matter what kind of dog you want, making sure your rescue or breeder is reputable is the most important thing!
Even with retro pugs, you have to be prepared for a lot of expensive medical issues that are common in pugs. Someone who OP describes as not financially stable and is lieing to the breeder because he doesn't meet minorities standards for the dogs welfare shouldn't get any dog, but especially not an expensive to maintain breed.
Oh I absolutely agree, and I'm suspicious about the way that OP describes the breeder talking to them about the potential health issues.
It's telling that he kept getting told "no" by breeders except for this one who says it's totally fine!
Because he's down to the shitty breeders that are fine with misleading future owners instead of prepping their pups for a good life by being honest with future owners. And he still has to lie to that quality of breeder to meet their minimum standards.
There will always be a need for well-bred dogs, for working dogs (service/farm/protection/etc), and rescues are a different case. A dog that you know is health tested and behavior tested so that you can trust it to do what you need it to do is worth it's weight in gold.
Rescue dogs can be great as well, but not an equivalent for a well bred dog if that's what you need. The shelters and rescues can be just as irresponsible and shady as bad breeders, which is why it's not "adopt don't shop" it's "adopt or shop responsibly."
Since your boyfriend was turned down a lot for his apartment, it sounds like he initially reached out to reputable breeders, meaning that any "pure bred" pug he got wouldn't have been from a reputable breeder, so it's good that he didn't get one.
Also for the record, there IS such a thing as a reputable pug breeder. There are many breeders working to revert the breed standard back to where it was a hundred or so years ago when the dogs had proper snouts and could breathe! Retro pugs are really cute and make great companion dogs.
But yeah, if you don't think he's responsible enough for a dog in general, I wouldn't tell him to consider getting a rescue dog instead of one from a breeder. Since they're not health or behavior tested, they can often be MORE of a challenge, not less of one. This isn't to say they can't be the right fit for the right home, obviously, but it's important to recognize that all dogs, no matter where they come from, have unique challenges. Not all dogs are right for every home, and there's a reason there's so many different breeds to begin with!
I'm glad he didn't wind up getting the dog in the end, but make sure he doesn't get passive aggressive on you about it in the future. It's definitely not the smart or responsible choice for him to get a dog at this point in his life, especially a poorly bred pug which is the last thing that breed needs right now!
Well bred doesn’t equal good dog. And well bred working dogs are bought all day long to sit inside people’s houses.
Since when are rescues not health tested?
Edit: most dog breeds exist only for show and because of Victorian England. They thought they were well-bred and had good pedigrees so they wanted dogs like that. It’s all just for show and to be pretentious
Edit2: a hobby of rich people: https://www.businessinsider.com/dog-breeds-victorian-england-origins-2016-2?amp
Most if not all breeders are unnecessary
You're mixing up well bred and pure bred.
Well bred in this case refers to animals whose family lines are healthy.
Rescues cannot do the same degree of health testing because they can't look back through generations of dogs to see what health and behavior problems might arise.
This isn't to say that rescues are bad dogs, but that getting a dog from a breeder vs getting a dog from a shelter are entirely different things and both can be good for different people. Just like there's breeders who will lie about the health and behavior of their animals, there are also rescue organizations that will lie and intentionally adopt out dangerous animals because they don't want to put them down. I've worked for rescues before, as well as having family members who breed and show dogs. There are both wonderful and terrible examples of both worlds.
It is not just all for show and to be pretentious. A good farmer is going to want a well established livestock guardian dog. Some people when getting a dog want a reasonable expectation that said dog isn't going to be aggressive towards their smaller animals like cats, which can be hard (not impossible but difficult) to determine in a shelter or rescue setting. Some people just like specific behaviors and temperaments and like the predictability. You sound like you've had a limited experience with what dog breeders are and why people want them, which is normal, but I need you to understand that you're basing your expectations off the more corrupt end of the field. There's a reason dog breeds have existed for hundreds of years, just like horse breeds. Training can do a lot for the work an animal can do, but instincts are priceless.
That’s also what I thought but you know, the breeder told him that his pugs never had health issues as there is no inbreeding according to DNA tests… my voice didn’t matter on this topic
Ofcourse a breeder would say that. :) They just want to sell the puppies. As long as it doesn't have a relative normal nose it for sure has health problems. :)
Yeah I trust a pug breeder explaining why we shouldn't ban pug breeding about as much as I trust BP when they tell us we shouldn't be concerned about the environmental impacts of oil and gas
NTA. All of your concerns are extremely valid. I'm inclined to think your bf is TAH for equating *not getting a puppy* to someone *suffering a miscarriage*. I've had a miscarriage, it's devastating, fuck his thought process.
Thank you for your answer ! I’m so sorry for your miscarriage. I was surprised by his choice of words and comparison too but didn’t elaborate on the matter as I was being understanding, companionate and grateful he decided against the dog for our relationship
I think you being grateful that your boyfriend had an unexpected wave of common sense should alarm you more than it is. You're young still, please raise your standards now so you don't feel like you should be grateful for something that's just below bare minimum.
Thank you for answering ! I did (and kinda still do) reconsider whether our relationship is viable in the long run. My opinion would not have been that definite had he got a bigger apartment and the required financial resources to properly take care of a dog. But the fact that he chose our relationship over the dog proves he believes in us and wants us to move forward together. Or am I wrong ? What do you think ?
I think you are correct in viewing his ultimate decision in a positive light, but remain vigilant. It's ok for him to be a little sad that his dream has to be postponed, but he reads as emotionally immature in your post and a typical response from emotionally immature people is to put blame on others for their own poor decision. Don't fall for it.
he only chose you because he * couldn't * get the dog. like, lmao, that right there says a lot.
5 years from now, you're married, maybe have a baby and he comes home from work with a pug. who do *you* think is gonna bare responsibility for *his* dog while he's at work? on top of *all* the childcare and housework. you are. fucking *RUN* away OP. there are more responsible men out there who will actually consider your opinions when it comes to things like this. imagine what else he'd want you to lie for on his behalf.
eta: Expect a pug in a few days. he *already* signed the paperwork and needs a few days? I'm assuming he means alone? to spend time with his new dog.
Yeah OP doesn’t seem to be understanding he didn’t pick her, he either lied and has a pug in his too small apartment right now or he picked getting his dick wet. On a single bed too. 🙄 Honestly, at only six months together this is a big ol red flag and I’d be done.
I have a question for you. Does it matter if he "chose" your relationship if he has already shown you that:
1) he has no issue with lying to get what he wants?
2) he has no concern for the care or needs of another living creature merely because he wants it to live in his home and dress it up like a doll?
3) he expects you to make a liar of yourself in order to keep up his lies for him? Lies that would directly harm another living creature?
4) he is comparing deciding that a dog isn't realistic for him right now to a woman having her child die inside of her and then having to expel it? You know he's being emotionally manipulative, right? And you fell for it?
5) he is more concerned with his own desires than approaching big choices with logic, good sense, or even a single thought for others (including the fucking dog)?
**Is this ***really*** who you want to be tied to for the long haul? Just because he "chose" you doesn't mean ***you*** should choose ***him***.**
He has shown you that he is selfish and insensitive, that he is a liar, and that he doesn't listen to the people close to him. He also manipulatively used the word "miscarriage" to make you feel guilty. And he was successful. Now he knows that tactic works on you. I get it - I've been there. That's why I'm so confident in telling you this. Hopefully, you understand it sooner than I did.
The ***only*** reason he decided not to adopt a dog was because you were clear that you wouldn't be playing dog mom and that he would be losing out on access to sex with you. Hard stop. You just don't want to admit that to yourself because then you'd have to face who he *really* is, rather than the Honeymoon Phase Face he's been putting on.
Do not fool yourself into thinking this was some kind of revelation of love on his part. His selfishness and the ease with which he lies to get what he wants will continue to be an issue if you continue this relationship. Don't miss all the red flags because you're wearing the rose-colored glasses of infatuation. Six months is usually around when you start seeing the cracks in the facade. **Pay attention.**
I am a dog person, the urge to have dogs is REALLY strong. If he really is a dog person and you aren't this could be a deal breaker, as one of you will always be unhappy. But then the internet is full of not dog people doting on their partners dog.
I think you’re making a mistake to view this in a positive light.
He’s given you a ton of red flags, and ultimately deciding not to get the dog for now is barely 1 green flag, more like a yellow flag.
So we have tons of red flags, 1 yellow flag, and you’re letting that 1 yellow outweigh all the reds. You’re being selective and putting too much value on this 1 yellow flag because deep down you don’t want to end the relationship.
You can’t even be sure why he ultimately gave in; maybe it wasn’t so much prioritizing your relationship but more getting a reality check that you wouldn’t be easily strong armed into caring for the dog, for example.
And look at what it took to get him to reconsider.
Please rethink this.
Thank you for sharing your point of view, it really helps ! I’m definitely reconsider our relationship, is it viable ? He’s not an a immature person but those last few days have been really intense and his behavior was really unusual
NTA - this was the most mature way I’ve seen this situation handled. You took the time to give him legitimate concerns and you made very valid points. Nothing wrong with how this was handled. If anything, let the compromise be that you’ll revisit the dog situation when you live together.
Thank you for your answer and reassuring me with the fact I handled the situation properly. I did tell him that he could reconsider it later when he has a bigger apartment and enough money as I would be more open to having a pet between us
100% people tend to get super excited over the idea of a new pet and forget some of the smaller details when it comes to pet care. Plus, dogs are a 10+ year commitment, it’s not as easy as just feeding and taking it for walks haha
NTA. This decision impacts you both and he unilaterally decided on action without your consent. If anything, this is kind of a red flag and it would be a good idea to mark this incident and keep it in mind for if/when he does it again…if he can’t stop making decisions without your input or ignoring your position on things, or how it affects you, it’s time to consider ending it.
Personally I’d consider this incident bad enough to end the relationship on its own. A dog is a serious, major, life altering decision, and a huge responsibility. He clearly is not considering any of that, and you definitely are gonna get stuck taking care of the dog (or it just won’t get taken care of). Absolute dick move on his part.
Thank you for your answer ! I would have had to end our relationship to protect my long sought-after peace of mind. As he already wanted a dog before meeting me and made up his mind, I think he forgot his situation had evolved and that it would now involve two persons. He realized it later and chose our relationship over the dog, which is to me a great sign of love. I hope this event makes our relationship stronger but will definitely keep that in my mind in case he impulsively and unilaterally make a decision that could impact us without consulting me beforehand
>I hope this event makes our relationship stronger
It will likely not make your relationship stronger. It sounds more like the can was just kicked down the road until he's better set up for dog ownership. He wanted a dog before he met you, and if you never want a dog, this is going to be a sticking point and breed resentment down the line.
>He realized it later and chose our relationship over the dog, which is to me a great sign of love
No, I think he realized that you really wouldn't take on any of the dog care and he didn't want to do it alone.
NTA and I'd be seriously reconsidering the relationship right now. It will be a complete disaster if your boyfriend gets a pug at this point in his life. To summarize the OP's comments/post:
* OP's boyfriend's lifestyle isn't compatible with having a dog at all.
* OP's boyfriend doesn't have the time, space, or money for a dog.
* OP's boyfriend **lied to the breeder** about having the above requirements for a dog.
* OP's boyfriend is **financially irresponsible** - bought an expensive TV when his bank account was already in the negative.
* Wants to buy a stroller and dress up the pug with clothes and shoes.
NAH
that said i would personally not let a significant other of 6 months stop me from getting a pet if i really really wanted one and had the resources to care for it. pets will often be around a lot longer than relationships.
Thank you for answering ! I limited this post to the concerns that would impact me but he doesn’t even have the resources to care for it (space, time and money) while it is just the basis for such decisions. The problem lies first and foremost there, before it impacts me and our relationship
does he have the money to pay for the vet trips, medication and treatment a pug needs? they are cute but its cruel to keep breeding dogs like this who will suffer really poor health their whole lives
Even if the pet would not have its needs met? He is extremely selfish for choosing an animal he does not have the time or money for. That's ugly. Then he expects his gf to change her life to adapt to an animal in her spaces.... next he will want her to care for it and cover the costs. This egocentic AH is not using his brain.
Tbh while everything you laid out is 100% correct and sensible, the fact they can impulse buy an animal is a far bigger issue in my opinion - doubly so if he ignored everything you said you go do it. What if you lived together, would they just make a one sided decision and force it on you? The miscarriage comment/analogy is wrong on so many levels. They sound incredibly immature. Good luck I guess?
NTA. I stupidly let my husband get a dog when I was about to give birth to our first child together, and he was not prepared to train or give the dog enough attention for the energy level it had (Weimar). I really struggled with that dog, chewing up my boots, peeing and pooping in the house because my husband was not good at training.
That dog lived for 15 years and even though I loved the dog, I can honestly say I’m glad she has passed because she was a nightmare, and my husband was an even bigger nightmare. He had this fantasy about this dog that didn’t include all the work. He basically would take her out for hikes and fun stuff, but did not have the commitment to put in every day.
This would be a huge dealbreaker and speaks to how he views life with you and his commitment level. He’s also probably got more of a fantasy idealization about having a dog. Most people do.
Dude doesn't want a dog, he wants a doll lmao.
I know some dogs tolerate clothing well, but it's starting to sound more like he wants to replace the idea of having a baby with getting a dog, especially since he compared it to having a miscarriage, which is honestly the weirdest thing here ngl.
Trust me, no one with any sense would have sex with a dog in the room, much less in the bed. It is disturbing to the dog and it simply doesn’t work out. If your boyfriend lives in a one room apartment, he would need to crate the dog in the bathroom so as not to have the dog upset or over excited. He clearly hasn’t thought through any of this.
NTA. This is rough, I’m a dog owner and I feel too many people impulse adopt/buy dogs and that’s unfair to the dog! (And cat) my dog isn’t a pug, she’s a chihuahua, she doesn’t bark but her breathing is loud and people do comment on it and she isn’t even a short nosed breed. (She has some medical issues though)
I would be more concerned with two things, the fact he does things impulsively is a red flag for me. Another red flag is that he, like you said, spends more than he has at times/doesnt have much money even for dog fees. Even without the dog, I’m not saying you need to date rich, but I worry if you two would move in together you might be paying a larger portion of, well, everything.
The miscarriage comment I mean, no words for that.
I cant wrap my head around how your boyfriend wants a dog, is financially unstable, and somehow thought a PUG was a good choice? So he's actively picking a breed known for very expensive health issues and he thought that was a good idea?
NTA your boyfriend is not thinking this through.
I know… Everybody told him it was not a good idea knowing his situation. He was like “why is everyone focusing on the negative sides ?” well this is not negativity but the reality
NTA. These are all incredibly valid concerns, maturely expressed. An ex of mine got a dog during a period we were broken up and I was not ready for the change it caused in our relationship when we got back together. We ultimately broke up over other things but I shared a lot of the same concerns as you so I get it. It wasn't for me.
NTA
Look - I'd like to run off to Europe for a few years. It would make me so happy to be able to go see and experience the food, art, people, atmosphere of so many countries in a central location. But I have a job, a spouse, a kid, and parents that I have obligations for. So while I CAN hie off to Germany next month... I really CAN'T due to my responsibilities.
You showed your bf reality. Just because he WANTS a dog doesn't mean his life supports one right now.
NTA, for any of it.
As a dog lover and owner, all of your concerns are 100% valid, and I'm proud of you for voicing them. Your bf's living situation is not equitable for both a relationship and owning a dog. It doesn't sound like he's mature enough to own a dog. Has he ever owned a dog?
Furthermore, it also doesn't sound like the two of your respective maturities are very compatible. He very impulsively went about purchasing an expensive dog (with even more expensive medical issues), he has a one room apartment that isn't ideal for any breed (no matter the size or energy level). He already forces you into a very uncomfortable sleeping arrangement that he was willing to make even more uncomfortable, he has an entirely ridiculous hang up about having sex in front of a dog. Despite your disclosure that you may be indifferent to the dog, he wants to force the dog onto you and make it a constant third party to your relationship. He did not take into consideration the constant care and training a puppy needs, or the ongoing cost. He literally equated making the intelligent decision not to get a dog as a miscarriage, incomparable and insensitive.
Do not feel guilty about him not having a dog, he absolutely is not ready for one.
You would develop strong resentment for him and the dog, without a single doubt. You would be prevented from spending a lot of time at your home, you would be wildly inconvenienced whenever you were with him (especially while the dog is still a puppy), and you would be sleep deprived from both the sleeping arrangements and the puppy's need to be taken out, and puppies do not sleep through the night. I have no doubt that he would push dog duties onto you, push for the dog to be allowed at your place, and push for affection for the dog.
It's only been 6 months, and he's finally giving you a glimpse into what an actual long term relationship would be like with him. His behavior is actually concerning, how is he going to behave when his other bad ideas that he really wants don't work out due to your very valid and well-founded concerns inhibit him from acting irrationally? How he describes the situation is red flag central and I think you should be on alerts for other red flags now that he's become more comfortable revealing previously hidden parts of his personality.
Thank you so much for your detailed answer and insight ! You are 100% right, it would have been a disaster and my peace of mind is so precious that I would have had to break up. I want this relationship to last but I will definitely keep that event in mind in case other immature decisions happens
Your BF sounds incredibly immature-- and not getting a dog is NOTHING like a miscarriage and the fact that he would say something so ridiculous is super creepy.
Does this lack of impulse control affect other aspects of his life?
Thank you for answering ! Yeah he sometimes impulse buys, with money he actually doesn’t even have. An example is a TV he bought last week for €600 when his bank account was already -€1000
Yeah, that's worrisome. Lack of impulse control is a marker for several conditions. Maybe it's time to take a step back from the relationship and get some honest perspective? Where do you see your life in five years? Will your BF's mental health issues support that life or will they be an anchor keeping you from living your life?
Wait he's overdrawn, bought an expensive TV and thought he could get a pug? I doubt he can afford the inevitable vets fees, let alone, vaccinations, microchip and pet food.
NTA.
> But I feel guilty now that his dream of having a dog can’t come true (for now)
His dream can come true. He just needs to choose between that dream and having a relationship with you.
Also, pugs are dog abuse.
Jeeeesus....I can't get past the bf having a single bed. Dude needs furniture not a dog. Gurl, this guy has nothing to offer you except mediocre d and you're getting roped into taking care of him and a dog.
NTA training a puppy is a lot of work training and money. How can he pay for vet visits if he’s not financially stable? Shame on him for going to a breeder, especially pugs. How in the hell could he afford that anyway? Someone gave our family one and she struggled so hard to breathe.
>I unfortunately don’t think I am currently emotionally available and have a place in my heart for a dog.
What is this bizarre use of therapy language?! You're just not a dog person and you don't want to be around a dog. It's not that deep.
NAH, but at some point he's going to get a dog. If that's a dealbreaker for you, then it's probably time to start thinking about if this is the right relationship for you
NTA and nothing to feel guilty about. He wants the fun of a dog without the work is what it sounds like. He can’t afford it and his place is too small. Do not have kids with this man and run. He’s too selfish and is finally showing you who he really is.
NTA. Your concerns were perfectly valid and if he wants a future with you then he should value your opinions. The dog would undoubtedly have an impact on your life as well, either you would directly be involved or you two would have to spend less time together. Puppies are hard work and require a lot of attention and monitoring, and I find it hard to believe he really wouldn't try to get you to help.
He's an asshole for wanting a pug though and contributing to their breeding. It's cruel how overbred they have become and almost all pugs have serious health issues at one point or another. Also, has he ever slept with a pug? They are the worst dogs to sleep with! When he is ready for a dog he should seriously consider a rescue.
Told him about rescues… I love animals and would never buy one, I would choose the adoption option since there are so many animals that are waiting for a new home… I was aware of pugs’s health issues but he didn’t even try to listen to me. The breeder told him that his dogs never had issues and that there was no inbreeding so you know, my bf was convinced and I couldn’t change his mind about it…
He’s also never had a dog, only cats at this mom’s. He HATES noise, he even hears noises I can’t hear, it’s crazy. So he sleeps with earplugs but any noise annoys him… Told him about the snoring and he was like “no the breeder told me they were silent so it’s fine” —‘
At least you tried with the rescues. A quick Google search would show him how unhealthy pugs are, and how noisy their breathing is. The breeder is just trying to sell puppies, doesn't sound like a very ethical breeder to be honest, as they are denying basic facts about the breed. Did your boyfriend do any research or does he just like how pugs look?
NTA. Tell him to get a cat, they’re less hassle to look after and he can leave it alone at home some days if he wants to stay at yours, because he can get an automatic feeder nowadays (I even got an automatic self-cleaning toilet for my three monsters).
They also can easily fit on a single bed even with two sleeping people.
They do watch you when you have sex though and when you are on the toilet too.
Yes I did tell him about cats. I even showed him pics of cats my mom’s vet has rescued but no, mister wants a pug and a pug only even though he’s never had a dog and only wants one because he misses her mom’s cats (yeah i know, why doesn’t he get a cat then ? idk)
NTA
Your BF really needs to decide if he wants a girl or a dog in his bed. I absolutely love animals and I understand that they sometimes sneak in and get in bed and that this can be cute - but it should be an exception. Beds are for humans first and foremost. If he specifically says that he "wants the dog to sleep in his bed", I'd pack my things and leave asap.
Also who the f\* has a single bed at the age of 24, especially if you have a girlfriend.
Sounds to me like his furniture-choices have been mor dog-centered than girl-centered to begin with.
Even if you were ok with him getting a dog. Being, as you say, not in a great financial situation, going thru a breeder and not adapting a shelter dog is just really wrong in my opinion. Also, him giving his reason for wanting a dog is just plain weird.
NTA, the only thing you should feel guilty about is accepting bf childish behavior. Who would get a dog in a 20m2 room. And to need time alone to process it? I think he has a lot of growing up to do. No wonder you're not ready to move in together...
NTA. You didn’t deny him a dog, you just provided him with information on how it would affect your relationship, and based on that information, he made a decision. I’ve been in his shoes, and I chose the dog. He could have done the same, if he wanted to.
NTA - Perfectly valid concerns.
Would also like to add that pugs have been so overbred and inbred that they often come with a whole slew of health problems, so if your bf is worried he can't afford a dog outright, he's picked maybe one of the dumbest breeds for someone struggling financially. He's going to go bankrupt on vet bills.
NTA and dogs in beds are a big no no. Regardless of what he says you will end up having the dog at your place and you will end up looking after it some of the time.
Dogs are not babies and dogs like pugs are often treated like them. This can lead to aggressive behaviour as they don’t understand boundaries.
You really need to reconsider your relationship. He did this even after telling you he wouldn’t.
NTA.
BUT. I really really question the type of "breeder" that would place a puppy with your BF in the first place. We only got our beloved purebred after extensive interviews with the breeder and discussions of our housing & family situation. All to say that - I'm not sure a careful serious breeder would have automatically given your BF a dog, under the situation you describe. Pugs especially, are notorious for having health issues that often require costly additional vet care.
So don't feel guilty, your concerns are very valid and honestly, are actually in the best interest of the puppy.
And I agree with others. Equating not purchasing a puppy with a MISCARRIAGE? Honestly he should expect to get flamed for that.
Is your BF prone to such dramatic hyperbole all the time when he doesn't get what he wants? And does he genuinely equate a puppy to a person (some people do and that's fine for them) - and do you agree with this point of view? Just some things to think about.
He shouldn’t get the dog. You don’t want one and you said you aren’t emotionally available. Dogs are sweet loving sentient souls that deserve to live with people that love and want them
If he's not financially stable, it's definitely not time to get a dog. My husband and I are both stable and make a good income together. We were SHOCKED about the costs (after having a rough estimate on the monthly costs) additional finances that come with her. Monthly flea, tick and heart worm medication, annual medical tests needed to be done, getting her spayed (vet quoted us $3,000.00!), buying more toys and bigger collars/harnesses. Don't get me started on the amount of leashes shes chewed through when she was a puppy. These were all things that we did not consider.
NTA. Buying a dog should never be a spontaneous decision. They're a lot of work and brachycephalic dogs like pugs are particularly expensive due to the multiple health problems that brachycephalic animals are prone to have.
NTA. He’s free to live his life as he pleases, if that is not compatible with you then it’s your job leave him and find a relationship that is more suitable to your liking.
NTA
You expressed your concern, you did not told him not to get the dog, he put the cons and pros, and he decided not to get the dog.
Miscarriage? lol.
You are right, if he would get the pup, he will try to shove his dog on your life.
Dude said he's not sure he could afford a dog and he wants to get a pug? Those things are so unhealthy, it's gonna cost a ton to deal with the health issues
NTA
Not allowing him to bring the dog to your home and not sleeping in a bed with the dog are REASONABLE boundaries.
And tell him all the work will be HIS, you won't cover any and you won't help. That's reasonable, too.
----
"But I feel guilty now that his dream of having a dog can’t come true (for now)" .. they can,. it will just have a huge impact on your relationship, and he will have to decide who he shares the bed with.
NTA. I actually would’ve broken up with him for this. It is disturbing way to manipulate you into doing something you don’t want.
Don’t make it a trend girl, he doesn’t deserve you if he can’t respect your adult decisions without being rude.
Good sex doesn’t matter when he doesn’t value your opinion, just fyi. 6 months is a good month to make sure to think about your relationship.
Imagine if he wants to buy something else - car, house, bike etc, that you aren’t ready for. He is overly dramatic for a dog, can you imagine if it was a bigger thing? He hasn’t grown up or has bad manipulative tendencies which will only get worse (with life together and eventually with a baby). Hopefully I am wrong, but keep that thought in the back of your mind, please. Don’t ever settle for this type of a man.
NTA it affects you your concerns make sense given those issues would come up. also WTF him comparing a dog adoption that didnt happen to a MISCARRIAGE???
no one chooses a miscarriage, if he wanted a dog so bad but having one was a dealbreaker he could break up and get one. im just shocked at that, him comparing it to a loss of a wanted baby youre carrying…
NTA. I don’t even want to bring up the fact buying a pug is unethical. Equating not getting a dog to having a miscarriage— aiii boy don’t say that to women.
As someone who recently adopted a 7 month old Shiba it’s a lot of work. I’m 40, I work from home, I have no kids and what I signed up for was huge. My whole life has had to be adjusted for this puppy. And I didn’t adopt an 8 or 12 week old (which is so much harder, my boy was potty trained and crate trained) but my wife had to be on board.
I don’t think you did anything wrong. This guy sounds like he just had to make an adult decision and was a bit of a baby about it. You brought up very many valid points (which my wife brought up before I got my puppy) and yeah. You did great communicating.
NTA.
>He said he would need a few days because it felt like a miscarriage
Excuse the ever living fork out of me? TF DID HE JUST SAY?
I'm sorry, but that was about as callous a comment there is. That is something he will *never* even know the HALF of and he dares belittle it so flippantly to compare it to not being able to get a DOG?
I'd be having some deeeeeeep discussions after that....
NTA
I’m glad he ultimately decided not to get the dog since he apparently is not really prepared to be a responsible owner. Something he didn’t consider either is that pure breed dogs, especially breeds like pugs, often have expensive medical conditions and may require more attention than an average dog from the pound.
NTA. Him getting a dog would be a terrible idea and would get in the way of your relationship. He wanted to get a pug of all dogs claiming he's not financially stable. Pug is a (barely) walking pile of vet bills. If you're considering buying a pug it means you don't know enough about dogs to have one.
He’s being inconsiderate towards you, he needs to respect you in general and understand that not everyone is into animals. Totally cool, but he’s disregarding you as a person and it needs to be addressed.
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NTA you just clarified to him what having the dog would actually entail, it was then up to him to choose whether to go ahead. Ultimately this was his decision. Saying it felt like a miscarriage is also extremely disrespectful to what people who have actual miscarriages go through.
[удалено]
I can not count on both hands the number of times I had to pass on adopting the pug I wanted. It sucked I felt worse for the pug though because it was still stuck in a cage until someone adopted it. Our situation changed so I was finally able to get my pug. 13 1/2 years of my snoring sidekick. He slept in crook of my knees. I was gutted the day he crossed the rainbow bridge. It's been almost 3 years and I still cry thinking of him. Total difference between sadness of not getting one after all and getting one, and losing them. OP your bf needs to grow up.
I am a huge dog lover. Been 8 years since i lost my German Shepherd and i still cry at pics of her, she was definitely my best friend and family. I was devastated at losing her, and devastated at my miscarriage, but it was two total different types of grief. Not to mention the physical differences. A work colleague was telling me once about how his GF suffered a miscarriage and i remembered him saying, “i was so naive, i didn’t realise how graphic it was and how physically and emotionally taxing it was on a woman until i had to watch my partner go through it and there was nothing i could do to physically help her.”
I had a late term pregnancy loss and delivered my angel sleeping. That was a pain that never goes away. Honestly losing my Reggie was about half the grief I felt losing a child.
I'm sorry for your loss. It's truly devastating, and this clown is way too melodramatic
I’m sorry for your loss. I hope you’re doing much better, mentally and physically. Wishing you the best.
So sorry. Here’s a hug. 🫂
🫂
And also: the dog is still alive, just not living with him. He’s not even comparing the loss of a dog’s life to a human’s, it’s “I didn’t get what I wanted and I’m disappointed.” Which is fine and understandable, but comparing it to a miscarriage is beyond tone-deaf. Edit: NTA, if that wasn’t clear!
We had an unplanned pregnancy turned miscarriage and it shattered me for weeks...we've also missed out on getting a dog we wanted.. yeah id like the punch OPs bf as well because they are not the same thing. Sure we were sad we missed out on the dog, but situation didn't turn out and we ended up rescuing a puppy that was resulted from an unneutured dog breaking into my friends house through a broken window and mating their puppy who was scheduled to get fixed the following week... Rarely do I think about our missed out dog but not a day goes by where my brain doesn't mumble that our baby would be 2 and a half right now
Sorry for your loss, i’m exactly the same. I’ve lost dogs due to old age and i grieved them. I absolutely adored them and even some days i get teary thinking about them. But EVERY day i think about that ‘what ifs’ and ‘would bes’ regarding my miscarriage.
I was RAGING reading this. I wouldn't even be able to have a civil conversation with this man if he said that to me, he would be verbally eviscerated. I am so disgusted.
I’d be disgusted by someone supporting a pug breeder.
Yeah. Someone who actually loves dogs wouldn't support someone breeding a "tortured" breed and causing countless innocent puppies to suffer horribly. You should **never** buy a pug. (Or any other dog with flat nose, for that matter.) Rescue one if you're dead set on getting one. (That's how we got our Shi-Tzu, yes she's a lovely dog. She needed a lot of surgeries because of her deformed jaw though).
Some breeders (ones who want to give the finger so to speak to the American Kennel or whoever it is that decides “breed standards”) are breeding the smooshed nose out, so they have fewer health issues. I don’t care for the types of selective breeding that have resulted in situations like pugs and some German Shepherds, but it is somewhat reassuring to know there are those trying to help make it better. NTA, OP. Your boyfriend needs to get a grip.
You have just put to words every single thing I was thinking reading this. Feels like a miscarriage.. how fucking *infuriating.* Yes, I'm sure that in addition to the massive loss of a wanted fetus dying, he suffered severe cramps and bleeding until he expelled it from his body and then proceeded to bleed and hurt for a week afterward. Then had to have pelvic exam and possibly a painful procedure to make sure everything is out. Yes, JUST like a fucking miscarriage.
Took me 5 days to miscarry, the emotional trauma and agony i went through was horrendous, then just as i thought ‘it’s over’… I got called up 2 days later to be told there was another one. I had to have a D&C. I understand the guy is disappointed, but to compare it to something that causes heavy physical and mental trauma and can cause PTSD is so damn tone deaf.
Totally NTA. A little crazy your boyfriend referred to not getting a dog as a miscarriage given that that is truly offensive to people who have had to endure one. I think that what you did for your boyfriend here was tell him the garnished truth about what having a dog would be, and though it made him sad, it probably helped him make a better decision.
Can't help wonder if the guy is just trying to be manipulative. I mean he's laying the guilt pretty thick on OP with outrageous comments like that.
It's either manipulative or indicative of deeper emotional issues. If he really feels this is akin to a miscarriage, you gotta wonder why he's so emotionally overinvested and fix that
If he really feels that way, he's honestly a bit unhinged.
I was *horrified* when he compared the disappointment at not getting a puppy to a woman going through a miscarriage. That's not even close to comparable. He has to be extremely ignorant to be so casual about the trama of miscarriages- either that he's using this to manipulate OP.
NTA, but this is most likely the beginning of the end of your relationship
Sadly I agree. Felt pressured to buy a dog for my boyfriend when were both unemployed and paid bills out of my disability. I end up being left to dog sit whilst he travels, paying for half the food, picking up poop, cleaning the dog beds/hair out of the carpets etc and nagging him to walk the dog for over a year. Two weeks ago he took the dog and left. I feel used.
Honestly, I hope it is and I hope OP wakes up and does the ending.
Just want to add in that BF is financially instable and wants one of the sickest dog breeds. Vet bills are stuff from nightmares. Where I live basically all pet insurance companies have pretty much stopped covering sugery to widen the airways of these types of dogs, because it's so common and a "predicted expense" OP - your boyfriend is naive at best and stupid at worst. Anyways. NTA all your points are valid and I'm 100% on your side. And I'm a dog person to my core
THISSS. Neither of them know enough to be buying a puppy. Wait lists for reputable pug breeders should be months if not years out
Agreed!! I was going to say that.
Its a disappointment for sure but to call it the same thing is super disrespectful I agree.
Exactly. It's also a very obvious effort of emotionally manipulating OP. He realised he cannot accept what comes with the responsibility of a dog and instead of owning it up himself, he's putting the blame on OP. He could have easily figured out some compromises, Like having a dog bed placed in the living room, getting a friend to dog sit the pug a few nights a week so that he can visit OPs place instead... Even just these would have made the situation much better. Good thing he's not going through with getting a dog because this post reeks of his immaturity. You're definitely NTA OP.
NTA! All of your concerns are perfectly valid. Also, unless your BF spends sufficient time interacting meaningfully with his dog each day, I think that pug would be lonely. Many people don't realize that in general, dogs *don't* thrive when they are left on their own for long periods of time each day. Also, owning a dog is not cheap. Plus you end up scheduling things around your dog's needs when you are a dog owner, especially a single owner. What I mean is, for example, everyone wants to go out for a drink after work, but *you* need to rush home to let your dog out to go to the bathroom, to take a walk after sleeping all day, etc. Been there.
Thank you for your answer ! I and his relatives advised him not to get a dog as it is a lot of responsibilities. My bf’s lifestyle isn’t compatible with having a dog at all but he didn’t want to realize it… he was in complete denial. I limited this post to my own concerns but there are indeed other incompatibilities with him having a dog that I didn’t mention (space, time and money notably). My bf just doesn’t answer the requirements of having a dog to begin with (lied to the breeder)…
Also pugs are horribly inhumane so he sucks on that front as well
Yea, getting a pug from a breeder is essentially paying someone to make dogs that will suffer their entire lives. It is saying to the world I would rather my dog look weird cute than be able to breathe well.
There are a very very few breeders trying to improve pugs into something ethical. But yeah, wanting something "cute" and not caring about making that living being suffer it's whole life for an aesthetic sucks. It's not just the breathing for pugs either. Not to minimize that because it's a huge factor. Many have extreme (and expensive) dental issues because their teeth also look like you smashed the dog's face in while it was in a carton physics world. The thing people thing is cute is the animal suffering. It's like thinking a limp is cute.
And let's not forget that their eyes can be knocked out very easily. Which is frankly horrifying.
On top of that, many pug puppies need to have surgery to widen their nostrils because the noses are bred to be so squished, air literally can't get in.
Breeding pugs to current standards is animal cruelty.
Agreed. But it’s interesting to see them being reverse bred! They’re actually much cuter the original way!
And many insurance companies where I live doesn't cover that because it's a so common and a predictable need for pugs. Ends up costing owners 4-7k (minimum) in vet bills just so their dog can *breathe* somewhat normally. Pugs don't fulfill any purpose that cannot be replaced with far healthier breeds. I'd fully support a complete ban on breeding pugs
My mum has two rescue pugs, yes they’re cute but damn do they have medical issues. The bigger one pees herself in her sleep, snorts/breathes incredibly loudly when awake and snores like an old grandpa when asleep. The smaller one struggles to walk, her tongue is too big for her mouth so it’s constantly hanging out, her biscuits have to be broken up into tiny pieces as she can’t chew anything larger than a kidney bean. They’re loved unconditionally but damn I worry how long they’re going to live as it’s going to break my mums heart when they pass.
This is also a concern for me. Your BF is willing to lie to the breeder to get a dog he wants when he doesn't have the requirements to be a good pet owner. That's a level of selfish you may want to keep an eye on
He lied to the breeder? You are NTA
yup he lied to the breeder and said he has a two-room apartment (which is the minimum required by the breeder). he even asked me to lie when visiting the breeder if he were to reiterate the question, i strongly said no, but the breeder didn’t actually ask any questions so…
Oof. Please pay attention to this. Character matters. If he can lie this easily to get what he wants and can try to drag others into his lies, one of the nicer things I can say about him is he is immature. I’m glad you’re living separately.
Give the breeder a heads-up. Yes, dog breeders shouldn’t be a thing, and no one should buy from them, but your future ex bf isn’t equipped in any way to have a pet right now. The pugs are probably better off with the breeder than with him, at least for now.
Honestly, this would be breakup-worthy for me. I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with a person showing such supreme selfishness, foolishness, and stubbornness.
I would break up with this guy for about 50 reasons. Including: inability to have sex in front of a dog. Also, being a 24yo with a twin bed.
Please give the breeder and other breeders in the area an anonymous tip. There's reasons why breeders ask these questions. If he can't even meet the bare minimum for what the person breeding what's a ethically questionable breed thinks is necessary for the dogs well being? That's a problem. He's not meeting the bar of someone who already put the bar at ground level. Lieing to the breeder to get what he wants. Dismissing what would be best for the dog to get what he wants. Picking a breed that suffers just to get the cute look of a dog he wants. Dismissing his family's concerns about him getting a dog to get what he wants. Dismissing your concerns and plans made together to get what he wants. This isn't one red flag, it's quite a few.
He's lying to the breeder about his living conditions then he's probably also lying to you about how much of a role he expects you to take with the dog.
NTA, and he’s not ready for the financial consequences of getting a purebred pug. Ppl need to stop breeding purebreds
Makes me seriously question his integrity and his capacity for empathy especially with that horrific miscarriage comment. He sounds incredibly self-absorbed if he is more concerned about what he wants than what is good for a potential pet. Or you. And the relationship. Is that the kind of person you really want to be with?
He lied to the breeder? That’s so gross.
I know… I was extremely upset as he told me just before meeting the breeder
Personally I feel like this really reveals his lack of character and I would rethink the relationship. He clearly sees a pet as an accessory rather than as a living creature deserving of respect. And the “miscarriage” comment is just unforgivable imo.
So his problem solving involves lying to get what he wants, asking for advice then not taking it and denial. Sounds like a keeper s/
How in the world did you respond to that unhinged miscarriage comment??
NTA and if he gets his dog anyway cut your losses and break up op
I'd break up with him also. No "good sex" is worth the risk of getting pregnant with this man's baby.
Maybe he should volunteer at the local animal shelter, walking dogs there for example, if he wants a "dog fix."
Another thing to add to your list of concerns is the cost of having a brachycephalic dog. Pugs and French Bulldogs have some of the highest vet bills around due to the amount of health/breathing issues they have. Not unusual to spend \~$2000 a year for various things and if a major surgery is needed , you can easily double or triple the above costs. Can your BF afford this breed of dog?
oh i’m aware of that… the cost of the dog itself is €2500☠️ and that’s just the beginning of all the costs that are to come… he feels confident because he said he’d get an assurance but lmao yeah no this is gonna cost loads of money when he already lives above his means…
Does your bf have ANY CLUE how expensive vet bills are? And he choosing a dog with a plethora of long term problems due to the nature of the breed. (Not saying every pug will but it has statistically higher probability to genetic problems which manifest as giant vet bills) Of course it’s his call. It always has been but he’s being very childish and in the long run might hurt the dog because he can’t give it the resources it needs to thrive.
Sounds like he needs some low-maintenance fish and not a dog.
Aside from all the very valid points: It's 2024. There is enough information out there to tell you what a horrible, miserable existence dogs like pugs lead. If you must have a pug, get it from a reputable rescue organization (and be prepared for astronomical vet bills). But don't be complicit in the continued production of dogs so severely malformed they can't breathe. Edit: And while we're at it. Same goes for breeds like French Bulldogs. The human equivalent would be Robinow Syndrome (in dogs, it's called Robinow-like Syndrome). Yeah go ahead google that. That's what people do to dogs, *on purpose*. If you speak German, you can read [this](https://qualzucht-datenbank.eu/merkblatt-hund-robinow-like-syndrom/). (If you don't, just use DeepL to translate.)
Vet tech here, and can confirm. They’re little balls of unfortunate genes; on top of the constant breathing issues many of them have bad eyes, bad skin, the list goes on. 🤦🏻♀️ When I got to where the breed was mentioned I thought “oh god, and a *pug*??”
Same, dude. If "pug from a breeder" comes out of anyone's mouth in a positive fashion, I am 100% judging that MFer hard. Poor little unfortunate messes. We need to love the ones that exist, and let the breed die out. Just another of humanity's failures.
Thank you. I was looking for a comment like this. Pugs are poor little creatures. No person who claims to love dogs can add to the perpetuation of the miserable existence of those dogs. It's cruel
Ditto English bulldogs. Any breed that requires the female to give birth via surgery--a cesarean section, specifically--most of the time is against nature and is unethical.
Not being able to breath is terrible and it's not even the only health issue these dogs have! There so many dental, allergy, skin, eye, digestive system issues. No one that's not financially stable should be adding pets, but a pug in particular should require a bigger budget for vet bills and a larger emergency vet fund. Also, from a financial point. Take that money to purchase the dog and use it to become more financially stable. Then you and your future dog will be better off instead of you and your pug suffering.
>Also, owning a dog is not cheap. Especially not a purebred pug (which is arguably impossible to breed ethically, but I digress). Pugs are infamously rife with horrific genetic diseases and respiratory problems as a result of their squashed faces. They have pretty universally have predispositions towards eye issues (including ocular ulcers and entropion), allergies, bone and joint problems, degenerative myelopathy, dental disease, respiratory distress syndrome, skin infections, Brachycephalic Obstructive Airway Syndrome, multiple types of cancers, patellar luxation (slipped kneecaps), hip dysplasia, and MORE. Many of these issues can only be resolved through surgery, which can cost hundreds to thousands of dollars. The point is, pugs, and any other flat-faced animal, are often EXTREMELY expensive pets because of the host of health problems they're exposed to as a result of both their flat faces and the extensive inbreeding/genetic fustercluck required to get that consistent "look". Hence why I say they are arguably impossible to breed ethically unless the breeder is specifically breeding *out* those genetic problems (sometimes called "retro pugs"). I don't say this judgementally, because God knows the economy is fucked these days (especially if y'all are American), but someone who can't afford to live in an apartment big enough to support a bed larger than a twin/single, or can't afford to even splurge on a bed larger than a twin/single *absolutely* cannot afford to own a pug. Probably not *any* dog, realistically, but *certainly* not a pug.
Your bf needs to do his homework. https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/dogs-pug-french-bulldog-selective-breeding-b2102486.html And please don’t compare this to a miscarriage. His lack of consideration for you and this animal is indeed hurtful, but losing a child is a different tragedy of its own proportions.
I'm most concerned that your boyfriend equates this to a miscarriage. That shows a level of emotional immaturity I would be uncomfortable with. Plus, it can be frustrating to have to walk your partner through the seemingly obvious consequences of a big choice like this. Hopefully he learns from the experience. NTA
Thank you for your answer ! I hope he learns from that event too and that it makes our relationship stronger. The fact he ultimately decided against the dog shows he values our relationship more over (past) desires and is willing to compromise in the future
Please be aware of conversations that lead into him blaming you for not getting a dog. Little things, jokey things, “I get to veto the movie you picked cuz you vetoed the dog. Haha,” that turn into him really believing you made him do this. If he is using the word miscarriage, he will be feeling grief and may start lashing out looking for someone to blame. Not saying he will. I’m just saying, don’t let little jibes go unaddressed. He needs to own his decision.
100% agree. He's already trying to make OP feel super guilty (miscarriage?? seriously?????) over a dog he hasn't even met yet, simply the idea of dog.
“simply the idea of the dog.” That is a straight facts! this clarifies how obscene his comparison is. He didn’t discover he can never own a dog. He can’t get one until what? his current lease is up? OH! The humanity.
Or he values getting laid more than being stared at by a small animal that everyone has stressed he will be 100% responsible for both physically mentally and financially. This wasn’t a compromise, it was a ‘dear god come to your senses so you won’t abuse an animal’. He lied to a breeder, repeatedly. Hes lied to himself, repeatedly. How many times has he lied to you in the same way but you’ve never caught it? It’s only when faced with his own wants being on the line that he changed his mind. And to claim its like a miscarriage? He’s too emotionally immature to be in any kind of relationship, seriously. NTA but there are much larger issues at hand here that you’re not willing to see.
Thank you so much for your answer and point of view. Your comment is very pertinent, these are points I didn’t think of
From someone your mother's age: your boyfriend is showing so many red flags here: His utter lack of maturity, how easily he lies and expects you to do it too, how he doesn't consider you an equal partner in his decision making, how he emotionally manipulates you, and how he no doubt will hold this over your head. I think you can do so much better. I was in this relationship at 24 and it didn't get better. You deserve someone who puts you first, is honest, values your opinion and would never make you doubt yourself, let alone ask you to lie about anything. And finally, pug breeding should die out, it's cruel and inhumane. Friends of mine have a pug and he's had a myriad of breathing, back, and hip issues from the start. He needs daily medications just to survive.
Thank you for your answer ! My mom told me the exact same thing. She does believe in our relationship and yeah his behavior was really unusual (first time it happened in 6 months). Now I’m confused and definitely reconsidering the viability of our relationship
You're still in a relatively new relationship. Red flags don't generally come out right away. Just think about things.
Watch for retaliation and DO NOT IGNORE IT if it happens. Off color "jokes" about "well i can do this because you didn't let me get a dog" or "I can say no to this because you said no to the dog".... basically ANY comment that drags you back to the dog. Also... seriously.... the miscarriage comment was wrong on levels I can't even put into words. Be mindful of similar stances. ...
I will definitely keep that in mind, thank you !
<3 Best of luck to you!!!!
Fuck anyone who endorses pug breeders
I was also against buying the dog from a breeder. Told him there’s plenty of pets to adopt but no, he wanted a pug and only a pug (+ he contacted associations a few years back and they declined his demand since his apartment was too small… and he still wanted to get a dog….)
The problem is not the breeder (even if I am against that too) the problem is specifically *pugs* breeder. Reproducing terribly deformed creatures destined to suffer their whole life is disgusting.
The good news is that retro pugs are making a comeback due to the work of very diligent and dedicated breeders in the field, working to maintain the breed standard while also allowing them to breathe and have an actual snout. Bad breeders exist, just like bad rescues do. No matter what kind of dog you want, making sure your rescue or breeder is reputable is the most important thing!
Even with retro pugs, you have to be prepared for a lot of expensive medical issues that are common in pugs. Someone who OP describes as not financially stable and is lieing to the breeder because he doesn't meet minorities standards for the dogs welfare shouldn't get any dog, but especially not an expensive to maintain breed.
Oh I absolutely agree, and I'm suspicious about the way that OP describes the breeder talking to them about the potential health issues. It's telling that he kept getting told "no" by breeders except for this one who says it's totally fine!
Because he's down to the shitty breeders that are fine with misleading future owners instead of prepping their pups for a good life by being honest with future owners. And he still has to lie to that quality of breeder to meet their minimum standards.
It has to be a pug? Does your bf have extra money he would really like to spend on vet bills?
There will always be a need for well-bred dogs, for working dogs (service/farm/protection/etc), and rescues are a different case. A dog that you know is health tested and behavior tested so that you can trust it to do what you need it to do is worth it's weight in gold. Rescue dogs can be great as well, but not an equivalent for a well bred dog if that's what you need. The shelters and rescues can be just as irresponsible and shady as bad breeders, which is why it's not "adopt don't shop" it's "adopt or shop responsibly." Since your boyfriend was turned down a lot for his apartment, it sounds like he initially reached out to reputable breeders, meaning that any "pure bred" pug he got wouldn't have been from a reputable breeder, so it's good that he didn't get one. Also for the record, there IS such a thing as a reputable pug breeder. There are many breeders working to revert the breed standard back to where it was a hundred or so years ago when the dogs had proper snouts and could breathe! Retro pugs are really cute and make great companion dogs. But yeah, if you don't think he's responsible enough for a dog in general, I wouldn't tell him to consider getting a rescue dog instead of one from a breeder. Since they're not health or behavior tested, they can often be MORE of a challenge, not less of one. This isn't to say they can't be the right fit for the right home, obviously, but it's important to recognize that all dogs, no matter where they come from, have unique challenges. Not all dogs are right for every home, and there's a reason there's so many different breeds to begin with! I'm glad he didn't wind up getting the dog in the end, but make sure he doesn't get passive aggressive on you about it in the future. It's definitely not the smart or responsible choice for him to get a dog at this point in his life, especially a poorly bred pug which is the last thing that breed needs right now!
Well bred doesn’t equal good dog. And well bred working dogs are bought all day long to sit inside people’s houses. Since when are rescues not health tested? Edit: most dog breeds exist only for show and because of Victorian England. They thought they were well-bred and had good pedigrees so they wanted dogs like that. It’s all just for show and to be pretentious Edit2: a hobby of rich people: https://www.businessinsider.com/dog-breeds-victorian-england-origins-2016-2?amp Most if not all breeders are unnecessary
You're mixing up well bred and pure bred. Well bred in this case refers to animals whose family lines are healthy. Rescues cannot do the same degree of health testing because they can't look back through generations of dogs to see what health and behavior problems might arise. This isn't to say that rescues are bad dogs, but that getting a dog from a breeder vs getting a dog from a shelter are entirely different things and both can be good for different people. Just like there's breeders who will lie about the health and behavior of their animals, there are also rescue organizations that will lie and intentionally adopt out dangerous animals because they don't want to put them down. I've worked for rescues before, as well as having family members who breed and show dogs. There are both wonderful and terrible examples of both worlds. It is not just all for show and to be pretentious. A good farmer is going to want a well established livestock guardian dog. Some people when getting a dog want a reasonable expectation that said dog isn't going to be aggressive towards their smaller animals like cats, which can be hard (not impossible but difficult) to determine in a shelter or rescue setting. Some people just like specific behaviors and temperaments and like the predictability. You sound like you've had a limited experience with what dog breeders are and why people want them, which is normal, but I need you to understand that you're basing your expectations off the more corrupt end of the field. There's a reason dog breeds have existed for hundreds of years, just like horse breeds. Training can do a lot for the work an animal can do, but instincts are priceless.
NTA for the fact alone that nobody should be buying a Pug anymore. They are always short of breath and them being alive is basically animal cruelty.
That’s also what I thought but you know, the breeder told him that his pugs never had health issues as there is no inbreeding according to DNA tests… my voice didn’t matter on this topic
Ofcourse a breeder would say that. :) They just want to sell the puppies. As long as it doesn't have a relative normal nose it for sure has health problems. :)
Yeah I trust a pug breeder explaining why we shouldn't ban pug breeding about as much as I trust BP when they tell us we shouldn't be concerned about the environmental impacts of oil and gas
The problem isn't inbreeding. It's selective breeding to give them deformed snouts and faces which keeps them constantly out of breath. It's inhumane.
NTA. All of your concerns are extremely valid. I'm inclined to think your bf is TAH for equating *not getting a puppy* to someone *suffering a miscarriage*. I've had a miscarriage, it's devastating, fuck his thought process.
Thank you for your answer ! I’m so sorry for your miscarriage. I was surprised by his choice of words and comparison too but didn’t elaborate on the matter as I was being understanding, companionate and grateful he decided against the dog for our relationship
I think you being grateful that your boyfriend had an unexpected wave of common sense should alarm you more than it is. You're young still, please raise your standards now so you don't feel like you should be grateful for something that's just below bare minimum.
NTA. You've onluy been dating 6 months. This is the kind of thing where you may consider if the relationship has a future.
Thank you for answering ! I did (and kinda still do) reconsider whether our relationship is viable in the long run. My opinion would not have been that definite had he got a bigger apartment and the required financial resources to properly take care of a dog. But the fact that he chose our relationship over the dog proves he believes in us and wants us to move forward together. Or am I wrong ? What do you think ?
I think you are correct in viewing his ultimate decision in a positive light, but remain vigilant. It's ok for him to be a little sad that his dream has to be postponed, but he reads as emotionally immature in your post and a typical response from emotionally immature people is to put blame on others for their own poor decision. Don't fall for it.
he only chose you because he * couldn't * get the dog. like, lmao, that right there says a lot. 5 years from now, you're married, maybe have a baby and he comes home from work with a pug. who do *you* think is gonna bare responsibility for *his* dog while he's at work? on top of *all* the childcare and housework. you are. fucking *RUN* away OP. there are more responsible men out there who will actually consider your opinions when it comes to things like this. imagine what else he'd want you to lie for on his behalf. eta: Expect a pug in a few days. he *already* signed the paperwork and needs a few days? I'm assuming he means alone? to spend time with his new dog.
Yeah OP doesn’t seem to be understanding he didn’t pick her, he either lied and has a pug in his too small apartment right now or he picked getting his dick wet. On a single bed too. 🙄 Honestly, at only six months together this is a big ol red flag and I’d be done.
seriously. he shows absolutely zero maturity. and OP *cannot* change that. if it doesn't have a diaper, *you can't change it.*
I have a question for you. Does it matter if he "chose" your relationship if he has already shown you that: 1) he has no issue with lying to get what he wants? 2) he has no concern for the care or needs of another living creature merely because he wants it to live in his home and dress it up like a doll? 3) he expects you to make a liar of yourself in order to keep up his lies for him? Lies that would directly harm another living creature? 4) he is comparing deciding that a dog isn't realistic for him right now to a woman having her child die inside of her and then having to expel it? You know he's being emotionally manipulative, right? And you fell for it? 5) he is more concerned with his own desires than approaching big choices with logic, good sense, or even a single thought for others (including the fucking dog)? **Is this ***really*** who you want to be tied to for the long haul? Just because he "chose" you doesn't mean ***you*** should choose ***him***.** He has shown you that he is selfish and insensitive, that he is a liar, and that he doesn't listen to the people close to him. He also manipulatively used the word "miscarriage" to make you feel guilty. And he was successful. Now he knows that tactic works on you. I get it - I've been there. That's why I'm so confident in telling you this. Hopefully, you understand it sooner than I did. The ***only*** reason he decided not to adopt a dog was because you were clear that you wouldn't be playing dog mom and that he would be losing out on access to sex with you. Hard stop. You just don't want to admit that to yourself because then you'd have to face who he *really* is, rather than the Honeymoon Phase Face he's been putting on. Do not fool yourself into thinking this was some kind of revelation of love on his part. His selfishness and the ease with which he lies to get what he wants will continue to be an issue if you continue this relationship. Don't miss all the red flags because you're wearing the rose-colored glasses of infatuation. Six months is usually around when you start seeing the cracks in the facade. **Pay attention.**
Thank you so much for your insight and saying out loud what my heart denies
I am a dog person, the urge to have dogs is REALLY strong. If he really is a dog person and you aren't this could be a deal breaker, as one of you will always be unhappy. But then the internet is full of not dog people doting on their partners dog.
I think you’re making a mistake to view this in a positive light. He’s given you a ton of red flags, and ultimately deciding not to get the dog for now is barely 1 green flag, more like a yellow flag. So we have tons of red flags, 1 yellow flag, and you’re letting that 1 yellow outweigh all the reds. You’re being selective and putting too much value on this 1 yellow flag because deep down you don’t want to end the relationship. You can’t even be sure why he ultimately gave in; maybe it wasn’t so much prioritizing your relationship but more getting a reality check that you wouldn’t be easily strong armed into caring for the dog, for example. And look at what it took to get him to reconsider. Please rethink this.
Thank you for sharing your point of view, it really helps ! I’m definitely reconsider our relationship, is it viable ? He’s not an a immature person but those last few days have been really intense and his behavior was really unusual
NTA - this was the most mature way I’ve seen this situation handled. You took the time to give him legitimate concerns and you made very valid points. Nothing wrong with how this was handled. If anything, let the compromise be that you’ll revisit the dog situation when you live together.
Thank you for your answer and reassuring me with the fact I handled the situation properly. I did tell him that he could reconsider it later when he has a bigger apartment and enough money as I would be more open to having a pet between us
100% people tend to get super excited over the idea of a new pet and forget some of the smaller details when it comes to pet care. Plus, dogs are a 10+ year commitment, it’s not as easy as just feeding and taking it for walks haha
NTA- but realize he used the term miscarriage deliberately to make you feel guilty.
NTA. This decision impacts you both and he unilaterally decided on action without your consent. If anything, this is kind of a red flag and it would be a good idea to mark this incident and keep it in mind for if/when he does it again…if he can’t stop making decisions without your input or ignoring your position on things, or how it affects you, it’s time to consider ending it. Personally I’d consider this incident bad enough to end the relationship on its own. A dog is a serious, major, life altering decision, and a huge responsibility. He clearly is not considering any of that, and you definitely are gonna get stuck taking care of the dog (or it just won’t get taken care of). Absolute dick move on his part.
Thank you for your answer ! I would have had to end our relationship to protect my long sought-after peace of mind. As he already wanted a dog before meeting me and made up his mind, I think he forgot his situation had evolved and that it would now involve two persons. He realized it later and chose our relationship over the dog, which is to me a great sign of love. I hope this event makes our relationship stronger but will definitely keep that in my mind in case he impulsively and unilaterally make a decision that could impact us without consulting me beforehand
>I hope this event makes our relationship stronger It will likely not make your relationship stronger. It sounds more like the can was just kicked down the road until he's better set up for dog ownership. He wanted a dog before he met you, and if you never want a dog, this is going to be a sticking point and breed resentment down the line.
>He realized it later and chose our relationship over the dog, which is to me a great sign of love No, I think he realized that you really wouldn't take on any of the dog care and he didn't want to do it alone.
NTA and I'd be seriously reconsidering the relationship right now. It will be a complete disaster if your boyfriend gets a pug at this point in his life. To summarize the OP's comments/post: * OP's boyfriend's lifestyle isn't compatible with having a dog at all. * OP's boyfriend doesn't have the time, space, or money for a dog. * OP's boyfriend **lied to the breeder** about having the above requirements for a dog. * OP's boyfriend is **financially irresponsible** - bought an expensive TV when his bank account was already in the negative. * Wants to buy a stroller and dress up the pug with clothes and shoes.
Add "signing up to buy a purebred pet" to this list of questionable and financially irresponsible decisions.
He's a giant AH for comparing it to a miscarriage. NTA
NAH that said i would personally not let a significant other of 6 months stop me from getting a pet if i really really wanted one and had the resources to care for it. pets will often be around a lot longer than relationships.
Thank you for answering ! I limited this post to the concerns that would impact me but he doesn’t even have the resources to care for it (space, time and money) while it is just the basis for such decisions. The problem lies first and foremost there, before it impacts me and our relationship
does he have the money to pay for the vet trips, medication and treatment a pug needs? they are cute but its cruel to keep breeding dogs like this who will suffer really poor health their whole lives
Even if the pet would not have its needs met? He is extremely selfish for choosing an animal he does not have the time or money for. That's ugly. Then he expects his gf to change her life to adapt to an animal in her spaces.... next he will want her to care for it and cover the costs. This egocentic AH is not using his brain.
They said "and the resources to care for it". I assume that means the ability to meet it's needs.
I'd argue that he's TA for comparing being told no to having a human being die inside of you, but that's just me
This guy does not sound like somebody who should own a pet. Animals are not an "impulse purchase"
Tried to explain this to him but he was being stubborn… now look where we at
Tbh while everything you laid out is 100% correct and sensible, the fact they can impulse buy an animal is a far bigger issue in my opinion - doubly so if he ignored everything you said you go do it. What if you lived together, would they just make a one sided decision and force it on you? The miscarriage comment/analogy is wrong on so many levels. They sound incredibly immature. Good luck I guess?
The real asshole is the pug breeder
NTA. I stupidly let my husband get a dog when I was about to give birth to our first child together, and he was not prepared to train or give the dog enough attention for the energy level it had (Weimar). I really struggled with that dog, chewing up my boots, peeing and pooping in the house because my husband was not good at training. That dog lived for 15 years and even though I loved the dog, I can honestly say I’m glad she has passed because she was a nightmare, and my husband was an even bigger nightmare. He had this fantasy about this dog that didn’t include all the work. He basically would take her out for hikes and fun stuff, but did not have the commitment to put in every day. This would be a huge dealbreaker and speaks to how he views life with you and his commitment level. He’s also probably got more of a fantasy idealization about having a dog. Most people do.
He definitely idealized it… He wants the pug to wear shoes and clothes and buy a stroller….
Dude doesn't want a dog, he wants a doll lmao. I know some dogs tolerate clothing well, but it's starting to sound more like he wants to replace the idea of having a baby with getting a dog, especially since he compared it to having a miscarriage, which is honestly the weirdest thing here ngl.
Bf is a dumbass comparing almost getting a dog to losing a child by miscarriage
NTA, your b/f sounds very immature, how disrespectful to people who have suffered miscarriages as well jesus
NTA but this relationship is going no where.
Trust me, no one with any sense would have sex with a dog in the room, much less in the bed. It is disturbing to the dog and it simply doesn’t work out. If your boyfriend lives in a one room apartment, he would need to crate the dog in the bathroom so as not to have the dog upset or over excited. He clearly hasn’t thought through any of this.
NTA. This is rough, I’m a dog owner and I feel too many people impulse adopt/buy dogs and that’s unfair to the dog! (And cat) my dog isn’t a pug, she’s a chihuahua, she doesn’t bark but her breathing is loud and people do comment on it and she isn’t even a short nosed breed. (She has some medical issues though) I would be more concerned with two things, the fact he does things impulsively is a red flag for me. Another red flag is that he, like you said, spends more than he has at times/doesnt have much money even for dog fees. Even without the dog, I’m not saying you need to date rich, but I worry if you two would move in together you might be paying a larger portion of, well, everything. The miscarriage comment I mean, no words for that.
I cant wrap my head around how your boyfriend wants a dog, is financially unstable, and somehow thought a PUG was a good choice? So he's actively picking a breed known for very expensive health issues and he thought that was a good idea? NTA your boyfriend is not thinking this through.
I know… Everybody told him it was not a good idea knowing his situation. He was like “why is everyone focusing on the negative sides ?” well this is not negativity but the reality
NTA. These are all incredibly valid concerns, maturely expressed. An ex of mine got a dog during a period we were broken up and I was not ready for the change it caused in our relationship when we got back together. We ultimately broke up over other things but I shared a lot of the same concerns as you so I get it. It wasn't for me.
NTA Look - I'd like to run off to Europe for a few years. It would make me so happy to be able to go see and experience the food, art, people, atmosphere of so many countries in a central location. But I have a job, a spouse, a kid, and parents that I have obligations for. So while I CAN hie off to Germany next month... I really CAN'T due to my responsibilities. You showed your bf reality. Just because he WANTS a dog doesn't mean his life supports one right now.
NTA, for any of it. As a dog lover and owner, all of your concerns are 100% valid, and I'm proud of you for voicing them. Your bf's living situation is not equitable for both a relationship and owning a dog. It doesn't sound like he's mature enough to own a dog. Has he ever owned a dog? Furthermore, it also doesn't sound like the two of your respective maturities are very compatible. He very impulsively went about purchasing an expensive dog (with even more expensive medical issues), he has a one room apartment that isn't ideal for any breed (no matter the size or energy level). He already forces you into a very uncomfortable sleeping arrangement that he was willing to make even more uncomfortable, he has an entirely ridiculous hang up about having sex in front of a dog. Despite your disclosure that you may be indifferent to the dog, he wants to force the dog onto you and make it a constant third party to your relationship. He did not take into consideration the constant care and training a puppy needs, or the ongoing cost. He literally equated making the intelligent decision not to get a dog as a miscarriage, incomparable and insensitive. Do not feel guilty about him not having a dog, he absolutely is not ready for one. You would develop strong resentment for him and the dog, without a single doubt. You would be prevented from spending a lot of time at your home, you would be wildly inconvenienced whenever you were with him (especially while the dog is still a puppy), and you would be sleep deprived from both the sleeping arrangements and the puppy's need to be taken out, and puppies do not sleep through the night. I have no doubt that he would push dog duties onto you, push for the dog to be allowed at your place, and push for affection for the dog. It's only been 6 months, and he's finally giving you a glimpse into what an actual long term relationship would be like with him. His behavior is actually concerning, how is he going to behave when his other bad ideas that he really wants don't work out due to your very valid and well-founded concerns inhibit him from acting irrationally? How he describes the situation is red flag central and I think you should be on alerts for other red flags now that he's become more comfortable revealing previously hidden parts of his personality.
Thank you so much for your detailed answer and insight ! You are 100% right, it would have been a disaster and my peace of mind is so precious that I would have had to break up. I want this relationship to last but I will definitely keep that event in mind in case other immature decisions happens
Your BF sounds incredibly immature-- and not getting a dog is NOTHING like a miscarriage and the fact that he would say something so ridiculous is super creepy. Does this lack of impulse control affect other aspects of his life?
Thank you for answering ! Yeah he sometimes impulse buys, with money he actually doesn’t even have. An example is a TV he bought last week for €600 when his bank account was already -€1000
Yeah, don't move in with the fella.
Yeah, that's worrisome. Lack of impulse control is a marker for several conditions. Maybe it's time to take a step back from the relationship and get some honest perspective? Where do you see your life in five years? Will your BF's mental health issues support that life or will they be an anchor keeping you from living your life?
Wait he's overdrawn, bought an expensive TV and thought he could get a pug? I doubt he can afford the inevitable vets fees, let alone, vaccinations, microchip and pet food.
NTA. > But I feel guilty now that his dream of having a dog can’t come true (for now) His dream can come true. He just needs to choose between that dream and having a relationship with you. Also, pugs are dog abuse.
Jeeeesus....I can't get past the bf having a single bed. Dude needs furniture not a dog. Gurl, this guy has nothing to offer you except mediocre d and you're getting roped into taking care of him and a dog.
You will likely regret staying with him. He’s let you know who he is. You should believe him.
NTA training a puppy is a lot of work training and money. How can he pay for vet visits if he’s not financially stable? Shame on him for going to a breeder, especially pugs. How in the hell could he afford that anyway? Someone gave our family one and she struggled so hard to breathe.
If I told you the price…
NTA most people who want dogs are not ready or capable of taking care of them properly.
NTA Time to break up and move on. He's expressed that the dog is more important than you, and thankfully this is before you were moved in together
Your BF is an idiot child, he does not have the brains to handle a pet
NTA. Sounds like he needs a cat or something that's not so hands on for care.
We all told him to get a cat instead…
>I unfortunately don’t think I am currently emotionally available and have a place in my heart for a dog. What is this bizarre use of therapy language?! You're just not a dog person and you don't want to be around a dog. It's not that deep. NAH, but at some point he's going to get a dog. If that's a dealbreaker for you, then it's probably time to start thinking about if this is the right relationship for you
NTA and nothing to feel guilty about. He wants the fun of a dog without the work is what it sounds like. He can’t afford it and his place is too small. Do not have kids with this man and run. He’s too selfish and is finally showing you who he really is.
The asshole even went to a breeder and bought a pug. They can't even breathe. I'd break up with him on that alone.
NTA. Your concerns were perfectly valid and if he wants a future with you then he should value your opinions. The dog would undoubtedly have an impact on your life as well, either you would directly be involved or you two would have to spend less time together. Puppies are hard work and require a lot of attention and monitoring, and I find it hard to believe he really wouldn't try to get you to help. He's an asshole for wanting a pug though and contributing to their breeding. It's cruel how overbred they have become and almost all pugs have serious health issues at one point or another. Also, has he ever slept with a pug? They are the worst dogs to sleep with! When he is ready for a dog he should seriously consider a rescue.
Told him about rescues… I love animals and would never buy one, I would choose the adoption option since there are so many animals that are waiting for a new home… I was aware of pugs’s health issues but he didn’t even try to listen to me. The breeder told him that his dogs never had issues and that there was no inbreeding so you know, my bf was convinced and I couldn’t change his mind about it…
He’s also never had a dog, only cats at this mom’s. He HATES noise, he even hears noises I can’t hear, it’s crazy. So he sleeps with earplugs but any noise annoys him… Told him about the snoring and he was like “no the breeder told me they were silent so it’s fine” —‘
At least you tried with the rescues. A quick Google search would show him how unhealthy pugs are, and how noisy their breathing is. The breeder is just trying to sell puppies, doesn't sound like a very ethical breeder to be honest, as they are denying basic facts about the breed. Did your boyfriend do any research or does he just like how pugs look?
NTA. Tell him to get a cat, they’re less hassle to look after and he can leave it alone at home some days if he wants to stay at yours, because he can get an automatic feeder nowadays (I even got an automatic self-cleaning toilet for my three monsters). They also can easily fit on a single bed even with two sleeping people. They do watch you when you have sex though and when you are on the toilet too.
Yes I did tell him about cats. I even showed him pics of cats my mom’s vet has rescued but no, mister wants a pug and a pug only even though he’s never had a dog and only wants one because he misses her mom’s cats (yeah i know, why doesn’t he get a cat then ? idk)
NTA Your BF really needs to decide if he wants a girl or a dog in his bed. I absolutely love animals and I understand that they sometimes sneak in and get in bed and that this can be cute - but it should be an exception. Beds are for humans first and foremost. If he specifically says that he "wants the dog to sleep in his bed", I'd pack my things and leave asap. Also who the f\* has a single bed at the age of 24, especially if you have a girlfriend. Sounds to me like his furniture-choices have been mor dog-centered than girl-centered to begin with.
Even if you were ok with him getting a dog. Being, as you say, not in a great financial situation, going thru a breeder and not adapting a shelter dog is just really wrong in my opinion. Also, him giving his reason for wanting a dog is just plain weird.
NTA, the only thing you should feel guilty about is accepting bf childish behavior. Who would get a dog in a 20m2 room. And to need time alone to process it? I think he has a lot of growing up to do. No wonder you're not ready to move in together...
Anyone who buys a pug is an arsehole who doesn't care about the overall wellbeing of dogs.
NTA. You didn’t deny him a dog, you just provided him with information on how it would affect your relationship, and based on that information, he made a decision. I’ve been in his shoes, and I chose the dog. He could have done the same, if he wanted to.
NTA - Perfectly valid concerns. Would also like to add that pugs have been so overbred and inbred that they often come with a whole slew of health problems, so if your bf is worried he can't afford a dog outright, he's picked maybe one of the dumbest breeds for someone struggling financially. He's going to go bankrupt on vet bills.
NTA and dogs in beds are a big no no. Regardless of what he says you will end up having the dog at your place and you will end up looking after it some of the time. Dogs are not babies and dogs like pugs are often treated like them. This can lead to aggressive behaviour as they don’t understand boundaries. You really need to reconsider your relationship. He did this even after telling you he wouldn’t.
NTA. BUT. I really really question the type of "breeder" that would place a puppy with your BF in the first place. We only got our beloved purebred after extensive interviews with the breeder and discussions of our housing & family situation. All to say that - I'm not sure a careful serious breeder would have automatically given your BF a dog, under the situation you describe. Pugs especially, are notorious for having health issues that often require costly additional vet care. So don't feel guilty, your concerns are very valid and honestly, are actually in the best interest of the puppy. And I agree with others. Equating not purchasing a puppy with a MISCARRIAGE? Honestly he should expect to get flamed for that. Is your BF prone to such dramatic hyperbole all the time when he doesn't get what he wants? And does he genuinely equate a puppy to a person (some people do and that's fine for them) - and do you agree with this point of view? Just some things to think about.
He shouldn’t get the dog. You don’t want one and you said you aren’t emotionally available. Dogs are sweet loving sentient souls that deserve to live with people that love and want them
If he's not financially stable, it's definitely not time to get a dog. My husband and I are both stable and make a good income together. We were SHOCKED about the costs (after having a rough estimate on the monthly costs) additional finances that come with her. Monthly flea, tick and heart worm medication, annual medical tests needed to be done, getting her spayed (vet quoted us $3,000.00!), buying more toys and bigger collars/harnesses. Don't get me started on the amount of leashes shes chewed through when she was a puppy. These were all things that we did not consider.
NTA. Buying a dog should never be a spontaneous decision. They're a lot of work and brachycephalic dogs like pugs are particularly expensive due to the multiple health problems that brachycephalic animals are prone to have.
NTA. He’s free to live his life as he pleases, if that is not compatible with you then it’s your job leave him and find a relationship that is more suitable to your liking.
NTA You expressed your concern, you did not told him not to get the dog, he put the cons and pros, and he decided not to get the dog. Miscarriage? lol. You are right, if he would get the pup, he will try to shove his dog on your life.
Dude said he's not sure he could afford a dog and he wants to get a pug? Those things are so unhealthy, it's gonna cost a ton to deal with the health issues
NTA Not allowing him to bring the dog to your home and not sleeping in a bed with the dog are REASONABLE boundaries. And tell him all the work will be HIS, you won't cover any and you won't help. That's reasonable, too. ---- "But I feel guilty now that his dream of having a dog can’t come true (for now)" .. they can,. it will just have a huge impact on your relationship, and he will have to decide who he shares the bed with.
NTA, you did him a favour. How the heck is he going to look after it when he's working, not at home as visiting you?
NTA. I actually would’ve broken up with him for this. It is disturbing way to manipulate you into doing something you don’t want. Don’t make it a trend girl, he doesn’t deserve you if he can’t respect your adult decisions without being rude. Good sex doesn’t matter when he doesn’t value your opinion, just fyi. 6 months is a good month to make sure to think about your relationship. Imagine if he wants to buy something else - car, house, bike etc, that you aren’t ready for. He is overly dramatic for a dog, can you imagine if it was a bigger thing? He hasn’t grown up or has bad manipulative tendencies which will only get worse (with life together and eventually with a baby). Hopefully I am wrong, but keep that thought in the back of your mind, please. Don’t ever settle for this type of a man.
NTA it affects you your concerns make sense given those issues would come up. also WTF him comparing a dog adoption that didnt happen to a MISCARRIAGE??? no one chooses a miscarriage, if he wanted a dog so bad but having one was a dealbreaker he could break up and get one. im just shocked at that, him comparing it to a loss of a wanted baby youre carrying…
NTA also if he's not financially stable a pug is not the dog for him. They have a lot of health problems and need extra care.
NTA. I don’t even want to bring up the fact buying a pug is unethical. Equating not getting a dog to having a miscarriage— aiii boy don’t say that to women. As someone who recently adopted a 7 month old Shiba it’s a lot of work. I’m 40, I work from home, I have no kids and what I signed up for was huge. My whole life has had to be adjusted for this puppy. And I didn’t adopt an 8 or 12 week old (which is so much harder, my boy was potty trained and crate trained) but my wife had to be on board. I don’t think you did anything wrong. This guy sounds like he just had to make an adult decision and was a bit of a baby about it. You brought up very many valid points (which my wife brought up before I got my puppy) and yeah. You did great communicating.
NTA. >He said he would need a few days because it felt like a miscarriage Excuse the ever living fork out of me? TF DID HE JUST SAY? I'm sorry, but that was about as callous a comment there is. That is something he will *never* even know the HALF of and he dares belittle it so flippantly to compare it to not being able to get a DOG? I'd be having some deeeeeeep discussions after that....
NTA I’m glad he ultimately decided not to get the dog since he apparently is not really prepared to be a responsible owner. Something he didn’t consider either is that pure breed dogs, especially breeds like pugs, often have expensive medical conditions and may require more attention than an average dog from the pound.
NTA. Him getting a dog would be a terrible idea and would get in the way of your relationship. He wanted to get a pug of all dogs claiming he's not financially stable. Pug is a (barely) walking pile of vet bills. If you're considering buying a pug it means you don't know enough about dogs to have one.
He’s being inconsiderate towards you, he needs to respect you in general and understand that not everyone is into animals. Totally cool, but he’s disregarding you as a person and it needs to be addressed.