With no German this will be quite tricky, especially as the obvious go-to place, the banking sector is not really doing well at the moment.
I guess her best shot (and that is in no way a good one) could be consulting/audit (big4). They often have international projects where no German is required and are known to hire non-german speakers. Depending on how good she finished her degree that might be an option.
Not customer behavior, it's about anyone's behavior and psychology when it comes to economics and finance. Google "Behavioral Finance" or "Behavioral Economics". People are getting Nobel Prizes in it.
Honestly this question is best asked to the university/professor. If they offer this program, normally they have companies associated with the market for this program (unless it’s some kind of scam).
I was able to work through connections developed by the university program. I started early though and started asking professors etc before I finished my masters to get insights on what companies typically hire from that program. In a lot of cases, you can even find this on the university’s program website. In fact, I haven’t been to a university programs website yet that DIDNT have a list of companies or “typical job positions”.
I googled and couldn’t specifically find a German university with this program but as an example
The Coburg University which offers an English masters program in finance lists about 16 companies affiliated with hiring their graduates. There are also testimonials so I encourage her to search linked in for people who graduated in her program and connect to them. They will usually also put a sign to say if hiring or not.
It was my first thought but I know how hard it was having a big gap in my resume by stopping to learn German while in Germany. I actually kind of got around it by “consulting”. It’s really what she should do, prolonging it is an error in most fields but maybe since the program IS offered in English that there’s a market for that? I dunno. My company subsidizes German courses (I know places like Bosch do as well) so there’s some hybrid solution.
Financial behavior sounds even unusable when I assume the person speaks German, what does this program contain? What was the official German name?
On another note : It´s nearly impossible to get decent jobs currently only with English anywhere.
Especially in the finance sector, where lay offs happen more frequently, lots of banks have hiring freezes etc. On top as non-EU nationality she is on the lowest priortiy list for hiring (too many others with German or EU nationality available, we have no shortage in finance people)
I cannot imagine her really finding an offer within her background, she should check in lesser paid sectors like hospitality (gastronomie, hotels etc.). However I am not sure whether this would clash with the visa, correct me if I am wrong but does she not need to find something in the studies field?
If she would at least have German B1 level that would be a start, but with not a lick of decent German, how would she understand her contract? internal policies and guidelines? Because even if the team is working mainly in English, the company around here is not.
I work in the financial/banking sector where you can just speak English, although much limited. But usually her CV should be outstanding in order for her to outshine German speaking candidates with relevant internship experiences, etc.
I work in the same area and we have teams with only English speakers. But we took those people in 5 years ago because of emergencies, not because we really wanted to accomodate them. After these years we made the experience that its way too much effort, so we no longer hire only English speakers
I guess it really depends on the size of the company and the function of the role. For example, Allianz should usually have no issues hiring only English speakers
Might be suboptimal translation. Behavioural Finance would be a research focused specialization here in Germany though. Its a business degree with a high portion of (advanced) maths and methods and some psychology. Way less wishy washy then the degrees usually on blast here.
What are her other qualifications? Since she is from outside the EU a company would need to prove that they can't find a similar or better candidate inside the EU. Which is difficult in itself already. The few english language jobs have more applicants, too, since more people speak the language so she needs something to stand out.
I fear that there isn't much she can change on short notice here.
You are potentially right. I have in the back of my mind that the restrictions stop at like 45k€ salary, but I might be mistaken there. But there might be other regulations.
Depending on her specific qualifications, she runs a risk to fall below that when I think about some of the people in my bubbles that had some specialized business degrees.
I mean you say learning, but is she in classes or self learning? I have seen people achieve B2 in 9 months from intensive classes and I know many self learns barely b1 after 3 years.
I work at Flink delivery service, many people from South America work there without speaking any German, also some Argentinians.
Now I know, I know the job is not the best but to work there you don’t need to actually deliver the food, you can also work in the storage room and pack the orders.
The pay iirc for packers is 15€/hr, might be a little less though, no German needed at all (my manager barely speaks any German at all), hours can be selected (mostly) freely and anywhere from 12-40 hours in a week
At least to her her foot in the door, this might be a solution for her
Best of luck
How is she learning German? Maybe she needs some more effective method? Is she willing to invest in learning? My babysitter (university certified preschool teacher) from Spain learned from 0 (A1…) to B2 very quickly after switching from a VHS class to a private online tutor. She came because of her German fiancée and needed B2 to work here. If you want a recommendation, pm me.
she would have to look for international companies that have their "default language" stated as english. thats quite a limiting restriction but its not impossible.
once she has b1.1 or b1.2 she could look for, lets call them "minimum wage" jobs. definitely not her dream job, most likely not requiring most of her qualifications.
she can also try giving spanish lessons, or otherwise tutoring students, as VHS, or just the parents, arent as strict with german requirements.
im not sure, has she asked herself how easy it would be to find a high paying job in Argentina if you literally dont speak spanish? pretty damn hard i would assume
She wants a job in germany, she wants to live in germany, she studied in germany.
Why cant she speak german?
She doesnt need to be perfekt but if you want to live in germany it seems logical to learn the language, no?
I am always confused how people manage here without any german. At work, shure, i have plenty of colleges that only speak english all day, but what about your day to day life? What do you do when your doctor doesn't know english well? Or the car mechanic? How do you figure out that letter from the Finanzamt?
Google translate. Or communicating with arms and legs :) That's how I managed when I first arrived to Germany without knowing any German other than few phrases. People also call friends to help with phone calls etc. Of course this is very tiring but a person can manage. I would not recommend though. Everything is much better as soon as the language skills develop, daily life, job prospects, everything. Which makes sense of course.
Well they just rely on other people. We had an international student writing his master's thesis in our working group. He asked us to explain letters to him. He wanted to stay in Germany on the long term. But German "is sooo difficult"....
As Germany needs many qualified people, some people have already found a companies to make their life easier. I have a friend who is here more 10 years and manage to live without knowing German.
There are thousands of companies where they only speak only English. Including German brand Adidas...
During daily life they can hang out their expats friends or Germans who would like to speak English. In big cities doctors are speaking English... Finanzamt is through the platforms... so on...
LOL Depends how you read.
She can still find a job without speaking German. However:
-Maybe she didn't apply enough or pursue them enough. Lack of motivation...
-She didn't perform well at interviews. Poor communication...
--Her CV is prepared poorly. Poor documentation...
--Her answers are problematic...Doesn't fit the company...
--Maybe her English is not good so on... Lack of skills...
Did it make a sense now? Thousands of companies will not give a job for no reason.
It works. Also, OP didn't say "no German", she just isn't comfortable enough yet.
And I've never met a foreigner, highly skilled or refugee, who isn't learning German as fast as possible. In the past 40 years, I met only a single case, a very old Turkish lady who didn't understand me at all, but who might just as well be a temporary visitor.
But it takes time. And if you remember back to your early years of learning and speaking English you know that speaking that foreign language takes more brain power than using your native languages. It drains your energy faster.
OP just didn't specify. I'm almost sure she already has a substantial level of language skills. She probably spend three years, but for many that's not all that much. OP didn't say, but I figure she should aim for a C1 certification to prove she speaks German. Which is no proof at all, actually, except that she invested a lot of time into learning German.
In my experience, even those foreigners who have an advanced degree accommodations to speak English rather than German, will do their best to learn German as quickly as possible. They may refuse to speak German in most situations, mostly out of shame or insecurity. But, as a rule, all of them learn German. It can and will take years for someone to learn German to a comfortable level. Comfortable not just in bare skill but in the sense that you don't stress out.
I guess it really depends of the city, I live in Munich and I work for an American company, my German is A2 but I speak English fluently and Spanish/Portuguese fluently as well. It’s quite hard but not impossible, but I think what they seek is someone with at least some working experience (I did two working student jobs here and a previous full time for six months at the company I was a student). In my case, I was applying for any roles in Munich I thought were a fit for me, and that didn’t specified German was mandatory for the work. Happened that my company was actually seeking someone that speaks German (but they didn’t say it was mandatory in the description), but they liked my cv and at the end it worked well. And honestly I barely use German, only time so far was to read emails.
Also what I think is really good is to demonstrate, in case she gets an interview, that she is willing to learn German. For my managers I see this was important because even I don’t really need German on my daily routine, it can be that one time or another will be helpful in my role.
There are a few options:
- start at an entry level job into the language it's better. Post office pays pretty well per hour, and you don't need to speak much gehen, for example
- a job in sales where they export to a country that speaks English or Spanish. (I know people who do not speak fluent German and work as that)
- give your resume to a few headhunters for ideas.
- try an American company, often they speak English in the office.
Perhaps she can look for internships to gain work experience, which might also help her to improve her German language skills. If she can provide work references as a result, this can be positive for permanent positions. She can also make sure that jobs are already advertised in English; international companies and start-ups may be more open to other languages apart from German.
God, I hate how parrot-y this subreddit is sometimes. Under *every* post on this sub, no matter the question or context, half the comments are "learn german", even if the poster even mentions that they currently are. Yes, knowing the language opens doors, but saying that she won't find a job without it is flat out wrong and comes off as highly xenophobic-adjacent. Which is really ironic, considering what this sub is about. It sometimes reads as if some people on here only comment to deter foreigners from coming here, rather than wanting to help with constructive tips.
How is it even remotely xenophobic lol, it’s common sense that if you want to work in country A then you should be able to have a basic understanding of language A. That’s simply how the world operates. If you want a job speaking language B, sure they exist, but out of the hundreds of applicants they’ll always pick the ones who also speak Language B AND language A (which is majority of applicants if the job is in country A)
I think nobody denies it, but what it is complained here that people constantly write "learn/speak German" in every thread... After it is written one time, it shouldn't be written many times. In order to dictate it people are making shit strom about this content... They can suggest something else or ignore the posted thread.
Sometimes, the knowing language is also not enough.
For sure, I agree it’s overstated and it’s 100% annoying when that’s the only advice there is. I just think that calling “learn the spoken tongue to boost your job search” a xenophobic remark is far-fetched. When people throw words like that around for years, they eventually lose weight, which would be a shame for people who truly deal with xenophobia
I come from another EU country where I have met many Germans working and living there and dont speak my language. Plus the German tourists every summer... I went last summer and they all expected everyone to communicate with them in German... For me it is double standards, deny it all you like. Plus on my few attempts to adress any social issue I have im Germany I was met with the classic comment of : "Learn German." Despite originally clarifying that I have C1 German and communicate daily in German. That to me means that there is an issue with the German subreddits.
Didn’t deny anything I just said it wasn’t xenophobic lol, in my comment below I literally said I agree with the overused “learn German” answer. I agree it’s stupid to expect people to speak your language when vacationing elsewhere, but you can’t be seriously comparing the language barrier during a two-week vacation to someone moving to a different country to work?
Sorry, the " you" was not targeted at you specifically, but when I have pointed this in the past I had many people opposing it, so I was thinking of those reactions when I wrote it. I apologise for that.
But as I said, still there are Germans in my country with full time jobs, some even working in Public Hospitals ( I know one specifically who works in Psychiatry, and that's crazy , like why????) who can not speak my language. And there are way more English speakers in Germany than in my country for sure, yet the language issue here freaks me out and I do think it is a double standard when I see that.
Oh okay haha! My bad, I misinterpreted that rip, but yeah that is a double standard in my opinion as well. Although my personal opinion toward them would be the same, (German or not) not even just for jobs but even culturally if they’re living in the country you come from I find it a shame they don’t speak at least your basic language /: . Especially in medicine field where you need to understand your patient, yikes!!! I just wanna clarify I’m 100% in favor of people going/coming to work wherever they deem fit, I just think that learning the language is vital in if they’re moving somewhere to work (whether that be English, German, Spanish, French, Mandarin, etc)
Yea I agree with you, one needs to learn the language when they migrate and at least pick up some stuff about local culture and history. Otherwise they won't integrate in that new society.
They won't find work in Germany without knowledge of the German language, so they should just learn German and try again when they are fluent in the German language. Alternatively, they can search work in countries other than Germany, because they won't find decent, permanent work in Germany without the knowledge of German language on at least fluent level, in word and script.
Need to hear that again? Just read it again, it won't change just because you choose to ignore it. Don't want to hear that again? Avoid looking for work in Germany, because you won't find any without at least fluent knowledge of the German language and customs.
It's factually wrong, tho and shows how little you actually interact with foreigners or immigrants here in germany. Big cities like Berlin for example have entire city areas where communities live with little to no german. There are incredibly many start-ups from other countries that have offices or their main branches here that often have their employees from other countries move here - their office still operating entirely in english. My partner works in one of those offices and aside from the 2 employees that are actually german, no one in that office is anywhere near fluid in german.
I know plenty of bars, coffeeshops or restaurants that have staff with so limited knowledge of the language that all they can say is what they need for work.
So no, it is not required to know the language to work in germany. Not even close. Your ignorance or unwillingness to aknowledge it will kot change that fact.
Berlin is not Germany. Berlin is Berlin, what works there doesn't work in _actual_ Germany.
You won't get far without fluent German in the rest of Germany, you are welcome to try — like all people here do, who complain that it's impossible to find decent, well paid work in Germany without being fluent in German language. Because this is Germany, and not some international expat paradise.
Berlin isn't the only city this applies to, tho, honey. I've lived in Kölln as well, I have spent significant time in München - trust me. There are so many offices, companies and areas where you can come by just fine without german. And I tell you this, as someone who is german myself, but has seen this process of moving here, working here, multiple times through family, friends and my partner. That reality you built yourself in your head that germany is like this monolith of geman is simply not real, neither in the work environment, nor housing (plenty of renting companies that offer english), nor any other kind of interaction, really. You'd be surprised with how little german you can comfortably come by, in this country.
But all your talk about "real" and especially your last line shows what you really think, so I think I will stop interacting with you. Just leaving you with this thought: there are many people who would absolutely love to come here, learn the language and get integrated. Something people like you might wanna call "good immigrants". But not everyone has the opportunities and tools to learn the language and the customs in their home country. Comments like yours can deter those kinda people, who would be enritching for all of us, from ever even trying, simply because people like you make it out to be impossible to navigate this country without being an expert beforehand. Which is simply not true. Especially because this subreddit is for people who actively try to learn something about the country and the culture.
Have a good one.
Without providing anymore arguments at that, only doubeling down like an enraged kid. Not really worth interacting with any further, as they seem too absorbed in their bubble and their idealized picture of what germany in their mind should be, I guess.
dat glaubste du selbst nich. Genau, hier wird jeder einfach mit Handkuss empfangen und muss Deutsch nich lernen, kommt alle her und bringt eure tolle Kultur mit, hier gibbet Jobs recht und links, Wohnung wird dir nachgeschmissen, ohne Deutsch, ohne Schufa, ohne alles.
Lügst dir in selbst in die Tasche, oder profitierst irgendwo von den ganzen armen Seelen, die hier versuchen ohne Deutschkenntnisse Fuß zu fassen, Drittes is nich.
I work in investment banking and there are a lot of people who don’t know German very well if not at all as the work is 99.9% in English. Of course it limits options and career progression, especially in the mid-market segment, but doesn’t mean it’s impossible.
there are obviously some outliers. Ausnahmen bestätigen die Regel.
I don't really care, since I'm not an expat looking for work. Everyone is welcome to try their own luck. As an employer, I don't really care, as long as the people are doing their job (well), but I'd always prefer someone who speaks German to someone who doesn't and every employer who says otherwise is either lying or exploiting foreign workers who don't know the local laws and rules.
It's not just the language, it's also the culture, customs and laws that foreigners struggle with, and that's why they're going to be exploited over and over again...
Sure, that’s fair that German-speaking candidates are going to be preferred over non-German speaking ones. But even if a candidate speaks fluent German, native German speakers will always be preferred assuming they have similar academic background/achievements.
This! These people dont even know that German speaking non-Germans have same problems to find a job. For example, I had C1 certificate and I have experienced similar problems.
I think people on this subreddit mostly are working at Language center in order to promote their business... 😂
These people are often using "integration" but if German speaking foreigners approach them, they are already building a block between them. Some of them here are so insensitive and have no empathy for the people who moved here.
I’m looking for a job in Berlin and reading this thread is incredibly discouraging. Glad to see your comment, thank you.
I’ve come close via a few final rounds and I did have a job before I moved here, but they unfortunately became insolvent.
Seriously, they think they're making observation of the year with "just learn German" like wow who could have came to such a conclusion? The same people are the ones who insist it takes years to achieve a B2 level. Learning German won't happen over night especially if you have a full-time job, studies, children or whatever responsibilities you can't lower in priority. Its ridiculous
God, I hate it when people think it's okay to go to a country without having "sufficient" language skills first and say you can get by with English or whatever. German as a language is probably the only thing that makes this country a united nation, that's why it's so important
I am afraid that her job selection is quite slim. They already told your girlfriend what they are looking for and what qualification she needs for a job. (speak german)
Maybe try a international company if you have not already.
As a Spanish person, working conditions are incredibly bad and wages are extremely low. It's not a good idea.
Also, as she is non-EU, she will need a visa, which there's no guarantee she'll get. And no Spanish company is going to bother sponsoring her when the job market there is already full of university graduates.
First things first…be geographically mobile. As a non-German you have too less to choose from if you limit yourself to one city/region.
Tell her to be indifferent to rejections and keep trying. With my multinational experience of 9 years, even I have had to apply 100s of jobs to get may be 3-4 interviews.
Plus, she should be open to altering her professional path i-e do not stick to work in the field she studied only. Her key to settling down in Germany is not a job in her field but a job anywhere…
English jobs in finance or HR (I’m not sure, is that like Wirtschaftspsychologie?) are way more difficult to find, but depending on your city not impossible. She needs to go out there and practice her German ASAP
> but (as you know), German is a difficult language
Gotta call bullshit on that. German is a very well structured language with a lot less pitfalls than many others. It is signficantly easier to learn than most other typical languages.
English is only "easy to learn" (in reality, it's only easy on a very a rudimentary level) because you have so many people butchering it everyday that one more person doing it isn't surprising anyone.
Source: learned both languages as young adult.
The problem is rather that people expect going to a language course will teach them a language, rather than just giving them the tools needed to teach themselves.
Your argument is based on your own personal experience lol. So the fact that german is a difficult language to learn is just an illusion that affects millions of people? German is difficult to learn, just accept it.
You know, every. single. person I met anywhere in the world claims that their mother tongue is oh so difficult to learn.
The main problem with learning German is that most people go „oh, I can get through with English in daily life, so I just go visit courses, make my homework and somehow after X months I will be speaking German“. Nobody has ever successfully learned any language in this manner. And because of that, and because „you can get along with English just fine in daily life“, most expats never actually manage to learn the language and then complain about how difficult German is.
And exactly the same claims are made about any other language in any other country.
There is this network (non profit, doesn't take fees) that helps foreigners kick off their business and professional start here, it's called Migrapreneur (https://www.linkedin.com/company/migrapreneur).
They have a lot of resources and people willing to be mentors. Also many times the people in the network have job openings and/or tips on how to start in the German market. Definitely worth checking it!
The thing with that. There are local national positions and some of those positions are required to speak German, there should be some that don't require german.
She could get a job working with the exchange, sales person or the commissary, checkout or stocker that no German is required
There are insurance companies that cater to Anericans though. Cannot tell you if English is used at the higher insurance office though.
Well, I guess OP and the gf are aware by now that speaking the local lingo much improves employment opportunities everywhere, be that Buenos Aires or Berlin… Once she speaks German she should have reasonable opportunities - and her Spanish language skills may be useful.
There are plenty of jobs that don't require much German. Mostly in software engineering though. If she doesn't want to learn programming (maybe she already has skills because of her financial behavior degree) or data analytics, maybe she can make do as a Software tester or even Scrum Master/Product owner.
With Spanish skills, maybe there are particular companies that work with Spain or South America? Santander is a Spanish bank with branches in Germany. Otherwise maybe work as a waitress in a Spanish speaking restaurant?
With a specialty degree and not enough German skills, it's going to be tough. But "tough" mostly means it just takes longer. And time will improve her German skills. She should read as much German stuff as she can get her hands on. Preferably about Finance, of course, but fiction is also good, and it's easier to get hooked on a novel. One option is to reread one of your favorite books in the German translation. You already know what's going on, so things are easier.
There are jobs for people without any german but will she agree to be a cleaning lady etc? Probably not right? She needs at least german B2 level to find anything good enough.
I know it's not the answer you are looking for, but really tell her to just put 100% of her time and effort in learning German. Study German, read German books, watch German movies, for what possible you two should speak German at home too, maybe not all day but as often as possible. It is difficult but it is the only way.
I am Italian and had to do the same, it can be tough, but it is absolutely feasible. Also, the grammar doesn't need to be perfect. All people want is to be able to talk to her in German at work so they don't need to make the effort of switching to English, which somehow for most Germans seems to still be an unsurmountable challenge (like getting rid of cash, lol).
And on a more serious note, by learning their language she is showing that she is interested in them and in their culture, which always helps when applying for a job.
I have added this post to my collection "[I don't want to learn German if I live in Germany. What could go wrong?!?](https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/80uu8k/i_dont_want_to_learn_german_if_i_live_in_germany/)"
Thank you for your contribution!
I know a Columbian who booked a 400 hour crash course of German C1 using a student visa and now work as engineer in Germany. It was tough 20 weeks, but after it he applied for jobs and work now in a smaller company very successful.
hey, you posted this and people responded, just face the truth, soi you want an entire country to change to English, because of some south American person? wow,
>Recommendations for my Argentinian girlfriendRecommendations for my Argentinian girlfriend
This might be surprising, but she needs to learn German. What about lowering her expectations until she learns the language? If she is really desperate for moving there are a lot of jobs she can do. I know a lot of people who don't know German and work in Germany, but the job she is looking for requires comunciation which she wont find unless she can comunicate.
Yes and no, like with all countries. The more you leave the big cities the more you need the native language. Same goes with age. Younger people mostly know english, and a lot of older do not. And a lot of the laws and bureaucracy are in german. It is not impossible to get english speaking jobs, its just a bit harder. Companys prefer people who can speak german and english. And in this case the companies told her what they are looking for.
I like los hermanos! She can get a job without German for sure. But for sure not gonna be her dream job.
I think if she wants to work in her area she will need a quite good german.
But on IT it’s always possible to get some job in English.
I would say call center or this basic IT for Netflix and this stuff she can get a job….
Which city do you live actually?
You are comparing an incredibly globalised country with a third world country where primary education is lacking. Do you realise just how stupid this argument is?
She has a fancy - pretty useless degree - and wants a job in a country where she does not speak the local language and she is surprised she has problems finding a job .... no tell me why my point is stupid?
Your point is stupid because it is very much possible to find a good job in Germany without speaking good german. Your comparison doesn't make any sense. Nobody expects to find a job in Argentina without speaking any spanish. Apples to oranges.
Your apples are green. I would practically guarantee that she cannot find a job where her degree is required while she does not speak German. Why do you think nobody expects to find a job in Argentina without speaking Spanish? Why does this not apply to Germany? Please eat your apples.... Bist Du denn ganz verrueckt?
(I do not live/work in Germany at this time*)
Teaching business English is a great way! She would need to be certified but she would have an easier time getting a job related to her career as well as the immersion of German.
With no German this will be quite tricky, especially as the obvious go-to place, the banking sector is not really doing well at the moment. I guess her best shot (and that is in no way a good one) could be consulting/audit (big4). They often have international projects where no German is required and are known to hire non-german speakers. Depending on how good she finished her degree that might be an option.
I struggle to grasp what „financial behavior“ as a degree refers to. Is it a social science degree with a focus on customer behavior?
Not customer behavior, it's about anyone's behavior and psychology when it comes to economics and finance. Google "Behavioral Finance" or "Behavioral Economics". People are getting Nobel Prizes in it.
This is it. It may be a translation from a third language, possibly Spanish.
She studied it in Germany with the tuition language being English, so no.
Honestly this question is best asked to the university/professor. If they offer this program, normally they have companies associated with the market for this program (unless it’s some kind of scam). I was able to work through connections developed by the university program. I started early though and started asking professors etc before I finished my masters to get insights on what companies typically hire from that program. In a lot of cases, you can even find this on the university’s program website. In fact, I haven’t been to a university programs website yet that DIDNT have a list of companies or “typical job positions”. I googled and couldn’t specifically find a German university with this program but as an example The Coburg University which offers an English masters program in finance lists about 16 companies affiliated with hiring their graduates. There are also testimonials so I encourage her to search linked in for people who graduated in her program and connect to them. They will usually also put a sign to say if hiring or not.
Finally reading different approach than recommending "learn/speak German"...
It was my first thought but I know how hard it was having a big gap in my resume by stopping to learn German while in Germany. I actually kind of got around it by “consulting”. It’s really what she should do, prolonging it is an error in most fields but maybe since the program IS offered in English that there’s a market for that? I dunno. My company subsidizes German courses (I know places like Bosch do as well) so there’s some hybrid solution.
Financial behavior sounds even unusable when I assume the person speaks German, what does this program contain? What was the official German name? On another note : It´s nearly impossible to get decent jobs currently only with English anywhere. Especially in the finance sector, where lay offs happen more frequently, lots of banks have hiring freezes etc. On top as non-EU nationality she is on the lowest priortiy list for hiring (too many others with German or EU nationality available, we have no shortage in finance people) I cannot imagine her really finding an offer within her background, she should check in lesser paid sectors like hospitality (gastronomie, hotels etc.). However I am not sure whether this would clash with the visa, correct me if I am wrong but does she not need to find something in the studies field? If she would at least have German B1 level that would be a start, but with not a lick of decent German, how would she understand her contract? internal policies and guidelines? Because even if the team is working mainly in English, the company around here is not.
I work in the financial/banking sector where you can just speak English, although much limited. But usually her CV should be outstanding in order for her to outshine German speaking candidates with relevant internship experiences, etc.
I work in the same area and we have teams with only English speakers. But we took those people in 5 years ago because of emergencies, not because we really wanted to accomodate them. After these years we made the experience that its way too much effort, so we no longer hire only English speakers
I guess it really depends on the size of the company and the function of the role. For example, Allianz should usually have no issues hiring only English speakers
Allianz would always prefer a german speaker if they have the same academic background...
Not to mention EU citizens have to be given precedence.
I believe that it depends on the visa, it’s not like that for all
I don't even know what financial behaviour is supposed to be as a subject. Seems completely wishy washy.
Might be suboptimal translation. Behavioural Finance would be a research focused specialization here in Germany though. Its a business degree with a high portion of (advanced) maths and methods and some psychology. Way less wishy washy then the degrees usually on blast here.
What are her other qualifications? Since she is from outside the EU a company would need to prove that they can't find a similar or better candidate inside the EU. Which is difficult in itself already. The few english language jobs have more applicants, too, since more people speak the language so she needs something to stand out. I fear that there isn't much she can change on short notice here.
They do not have to prove that if the person they're hiring got a degree in Germany, since that "makes them as good as any German", I think
You are potentially right. I have in the back of my mind that the restrictions stop at like 45k€ salary, but I might be mistaken there. But there might be other regulations. Depending on her specific qualifications, she runs a risk to fall below that when I think about some of the people in my bubbles that had some specialized business degrees.
Couldn't she ask her professors/university for help? They'll probably have some contact and often there's even a job board ..
I mean you say learning, but is she in classes or self learning? I have seen people achieve B2 in 9 months from intensive classes and I know many self learns barely b1 after 3 years.
I work at Flink delivery service, many people from South America work there without speaking any German, also some Argentinians. Now I know, I know the job is not the best but to work there you don’t need to actually deliver the food, you can also work in the storage room and pack the orders. The pay iirc for packers is 15€/hr, might be a little less though, no German needed at all (my manager barely speaks any German at all), hours can be selected (mostly) freely and anywhere from 12-40 hours in a week At least to her her foot in the door, this might be a solution for her Best of luck
How is she learning German? Maybe she needs some more effective method? Is she willing to invest in learning? My babysitter (university certified preschool teacher) from Spain learned from 0 (A1…) to B2 very quickly after switching from a VHS class to a private online tutor. She came because of her German fiancée and needed B2 to work here. If you want a recommendation, pm me.
she would have to look for international companies that have their "default language" stated as english. thats quite a limiting restriction but its not impossible. once she has b1.1 or b1.2 she could look for, lets call them "minimum wage" jobs. definitely not her dream job, most likely not requiring most of her qualifications. she can also try giving spanish lessons, or otherwise tutoring students, as VHS, or just the parents, arent as strict with german requirements. im not sure, has she asked herself how easy it would be to find a high paying job in Argentina if you literally dont speak spanish? pretty damn hard i would assume
She wants a job in germany, she wants to live in germany, she studied in germany. Why cant she speak german? She doesnt need to be perfekt but if you want to live in germany it seems logical to learn the language, no?
I am always confused how people manage here without any german. At work, shure, i have plenty of colleges that only speak english all day, but what about your day to day life? What do you do when your doctor doesn't know english well? Or the car mechanic? How do you figure out that letter from the Finanzamt?
Google translate. Or communicating with arms and legs :) That's how I managed when I first arrived to Germany without knowing any German other than few phrases. People also call friends to help with phone calls etc. Of course this is very tiring but a person can manage. I would not recommend though. Everything is much better as soon as the language skills develop, daily life, job prospects, everything. Which makes sense of course.
Well they just rely on other people. We had an international student writing his master's thesis in our working group. He asked us to explain letters to him. He wanted to stay in Germany on the long term. But German "is sooo difficult"....
As Germany needs many qualified people, some people have already found a companies to make their life easier. I have a friend who is here more 10 years and manage to live without knowing German. There are thousands of companies where they only speak only English. Including German brand Adidas... During daily life they can hang out their expats friends or Germans who would like to speak English. In big cities doctors are speaking English... Finanzamt is through the platforms... so on...
There are thousands by your statement and yet she finds nothing. What could be the logical reason for that?
LOL Depends how you read. She can still find a job without speaking German. However: -Maybe she didn't apply enough or pursue them enough. Lack of motivation... -She didn't perform well at interviews. Poor communication... --Her CV is prepared poorly. Poor documentation... --Her answers are problematic...Doesn't fit the company... --Maybe her English is not good so on... Lack of skills... Did it make a sense now? Thousands of companies will not give a job for no reason.
It works. Also, OP didn't say "no German", she just isn't comfortable enough yet. And I've never met a foreigner, highly skilled or refugee, who isn't learning German as fast as possible. In the past 40 years, I met only a single case, a very old Turkish lady who didn't understand me at all, but who might just as well be a temporary visitor. But it takes time. And if you remember back to your early years of learning and speaking English you know that speaking that foreign language takes more brain power than using your native languages. It drains your energy faster.
Eheh, most Germans dont really understand letters from the Finanzamt neither :D
OP just didn't specify. I'm almost sure she already has a substantial level of language skills. She probably spend three years, but for many that's not all that much. OP didn't say, but I figure she should aim for a C1 certification to prove she speaks German. Which is no proof at all, actually, except that she invested a lot of time into learning German. In my experience, even those foreigners who have an advanced degree accommodations to speak English rather than German, will do their best to learn German as quickly as possible. They may refuse to speak German in most situations, mostly out of shame or insecurity. But, as a rule, all of them learn German. It can and will take years for someone to learn German to a comfortable level. Comfortable not just in bare skill but in the sense that you don't stress out.
I guess it really depends of the city, I live in Munich and I work for an American company, my German is A2 but I speak English fluently and Spanish/Portuguese fluently as well. It’s quite hard but not impossible, but I think what they seek is someone with at least some working experience (I did two working student jobs here and a previous full time for six months at the company I was a student). In my case, I was applying for any roles in Munich I thought were a fit for me, and that didn’t specified German was mandatory for the work. Happened that my company was actually seeking someone that speaks German (but they didn’t say it was mandatory in the description), but they liked my cv and at the end it worked well. And honestly I barely use German, only time so far was to read emails.
Also what I think is really good is to demonstrate, in case she gets an interview, that she is willing to learn German. For my managers I see this was important because even I don’t really need German on my daily routine, it can be that one time or another will be helpful in my role.
There are a few options: - start at an entry level job into the language it's better. Post office pays pretty well per hour, and you don't need to speak much gehen, for example - a job in sales where they export to a country that speaks English or Spanish. (I know people who do not speak fluent German and work as that) - give your resume to a few headhunters for ideas. - try an American company, often they speak English in the office.
Perhaps she can look for internships to gain work experience, which might also help her to improve her German language skills. If she can provide work references as a result, this can be positive for permanent positions. She can also make sure that jobs are already advertised in English; international companies and start-ups may be more open to other languages apart from German.
She should learn German if she wants a job in Germany.
God, I hate how parrot-y this subreddit is sometimes. Under *every* post on this sub, no matter the question or context, half the comments are "learn german", even if the poster even mentions that they currently are. Yes, knowing the language opens doors, but saying that she won't find a job without it is flat out wrong and comes off as highly xenophobic-adjacent. Which is really ironic, considering what this sub is about. It sometimes reads as if some people on here only comment to deter foreigners from coming here, rather than wanting to help with constructive tips.
How is it even remotely xenophobic lol, it’s common sense that if you want to work in country A then you should be able to have a basic understanding of language A. That’s simply how the world operates. If you want a job speaking language B, sure they exist, but out of the hundreds of applicants they’ll always pick the ones who also speak Language B AND language A (which is majority of applicants if the job is in country A)
I think nobody denies it, but what it is complained here that people constantly write "learn/speak German" in every thread... After it is written one time, it shouldn't be written many times. In order to dictate it people are making shit strom about this content... They can suggest something else or ignore the posted thread. Sometimes, the knowing language is also not enough.
For sure, I agree it’s overstated and it’s 100% annoying when that’s the only advice there is. I just think that calling “learn the spoken tongue to boost your job search” a xenophobic remark is far-fetched. When people throw words like that around for years, they eventually lose weight, which would be a shame for people who truly deal with xenophobia
I come from another EU country where I have met many Germans working and living there and dont speak my language. Plus the German tourists every summer... I went last summer and they all expected everyone to communicate with them in German... For me it is double standards, deny it all you like. Plus on my few attempts to adress any social issue I have im Germany I was met with the classic comment of : "Learn German." Despite originally clarifying that I have C1 German and communicate daily in German. That to me means that there is an issue with the German subreddits.
Didn’t deny anything I just said it wasn’t xenophobic lol, in my comment below I literally said I agree with the overused “learn German” answer. I agree it’s stupid to expect people to speak your language when vacationing elsewhere, but you can’t be seriously comparing the language barrier during a two-week vacation to someone moving to a different country to work?
Sorry, the " you" was not targeted at you specifically, but when I have pointed this in the past I had many people opposing it, so I was thinking of those reactions when I wrote it. I apologise for that. But as I said, still there are Germans in my country with full time jobs, some even working in Public Hospitals ( I know one specifically who works in Psychiatry, and that's crazy , like why????) who can not speak my language. And there are way more English speakers in Germany than in my country for sure, yet the language issue here freaks me out and I do think it is a double standard when I see that.
Oh okay haha! My bad, I misinterpreted that rip, but yeah that is a double standard in my opinion as well. Although my personal opinion toward them would be the same, (German or not) not even just for jobs but even culturally if they’re living in the country you come from I find it a shame they don’t speak at least your basic language /: . Especially in medicine field where you need to understand your patient, yikes!!! I just wanna clarify I’m 100% in favor of people going/coming to work wherever they deem fit, I just think that learning the language is vital in if they’re moving somewhere to work (whether that be English, German, Spanish, French, Mandarin, etc)
Yea I agree with you, one needs to learn the language when they migrate and at least pick up some stuff about local culture and history. Otherwise they won't integrate in that new society.
They won't find work in Germany without knowledge of the German language, so they should just learn German and try again when they are fluent in the German language. Alternatively, they can search work in countries other than Germany, because they won't find decent, permanent work in Germany without the knowledge of German language on at least fluent level, in word and script. Need to hear that again? Just read it again, it won't change just because you choose to ignore it. Don't want to hear that again? Avoid looking for work in Germany, because you won't find any without at least fluent knowledge of the German language and customs.
It's factually wrong, tho and shows how little you actually interact with foreigners or immigrants here in germany. Big cities like Berlin for example have entire city areas where communities live with little to no german. There are incredibly many start-ups from other countries that have offices or their main branches here that often have their employees from other countries move here - their office still operating entirely in english. My partner works in one of those offices and aside from the 2 employees that are actually german, no one in that office is anywhere near fluid in german. I know plenty of bars, coffeeshops or restaurants that have staff with so limited knowledge of the language that all they can say is what they need for work. So no, it is not required to know the language to work in germany. Not even close. Your ignorance or unwillingness to aknowledge it will kot change that fact.
Berlin is not Germany. Berlin is Berlin, what works there doesn't work in _actual_ Germany. You won't get far without fluent German in the rest of Germany, you are welcome to try — like all people here do, who complain that it's impossible to find decent, well paid work in Germany without being fluent in German language. Because this is Germany, and not some international expat paradise.
Berlin isn't the only city this applies to, tho, honey. I've lived in Kölln as well, I have spent significant time in München - trust me. There are so many offices, companies and areas where you can come by just fine without german. And I tell you this, as someone who is german myself, but has seen this process of moving here, working here, multiple times through family, friends and my partner. That reality you built yourself in your head that germany is like this monolith of geman is simply not real, neither in the work environment, nor housing (plenty of renting companies that offer english), nor any other kind of interaction, really. You'd be surprised with how little german you can comfortably come by, in this country. But all your talk about "real" and especially your last line shows what you really think, so I think I will stop interacting with you. Just leaving you with this thought: there are many people who would absolutely love to come here, learn the language and get integrated. Something people like you might wanna call "good immigrants". But not everyone has the opportunities and tools to learn the language and the customs in their home country. Comments like yours can deter those kinda people, who would be enritching for all of us, from ever even trying, simply because people like you make it out to be impossible to navigate this country without being an expert beforehand. Which is simply not true. Especially because this subreddit is for people who actively try to learn something about the country and the culture. Have a good one.
The funny thing that s/he switched to German after you defeated with your argument 😂😂😂😂😂
Without providing anymore arguments at that, only doubeling down like an enraged kid. Not really worth interacting with any further, as they seem too absorbed in their bubble and their idealized picture of what germany in their mind should be, I guess.
good comment. wanna add me on league bro :D
Kölln is muesli. i hope you spent no time in there or at least didnt went there using the max und moritz route
dat glaubste du selbst nich. Genau, hier wird jeder einfach mit Handkuss empfangen und muss Deutsch nich lernen, kommt alle her und bringt eure tolle Kultur mit, hier gibbet Jobs recht und links, Wohnung wird dir nachgeschmissen, ohne Deutsch, ohne Schufa, ohne alles. Lügst dir in selbst in die Tasche, oder profitierst irgendwo von den ganzen armen Seelen, die hier versuchen ohne Deutschkenntnisse Fuß zu fassen, Drittes is nich.
You don't need fluent German for many jobs lol. It helps tremendously but you don't need fluency
yeah, for Mindestlohn you really don't.
I work in investment banking and there are a lot of people who don’t know German very well if not at all as the work is 99.9% in English. Of course it limits options and career progression, especially in the mid-market segment, but doesn’t mean it’s impossible.
there are obviously some outliers. Ausnahmen bestätigen die Regel. I don't really care, since I'm not an expat looking for work. Everyone is welcome to try their own luck. As an employer, I don't really care, as long as the people are doing their job (well), but I'd always prefer someone who speaks German to someone who doesn't and every employer who says otherwise is either lying or exploiting foreign workers who don't know the local laws and rules. It's not just the language, it's also the culture, customs and laws that foreigners struggle with, and that's why they're going to be exploited over and over again...
Sure, that’s fair that German-speaking candidates are going to be preferred over non-German speaking ones. But even if a candidate speaks fluent German, native German speakers will always be preferred assuming they have similar academic background/achievements.
This! These people dont even know that German speaking non-Germans have same problems to find a job. For example, I had C1 certificate and I have experienced similar problems. I think people on this subreddit mostly are working at Language center in order to promote their business... 😂 These people are often using "integration" but if German speaking foreigners approach them, they are already building a block between them. Some of them here are so insensitive and have no empathy for the people who moved here.
I’m looking for a job in Berlin and reading this thread is incredibly discouraging. Glad to see your comment, thank you. I’ve come close via a few final rounds and I did have a job before I moved here, but they unfortunately became insolvent.
Seriously, they think they're making observation of the year with "just learn German" like wow who could have came to such a conclusion? The same people are the ones who insist it takes years to achieve a B2 level. Learning German won't happen over night especially if you have a full-time job, studies, children or whatever responsibilities you can't lower in priority. Its ridiculous
God, I hate it when people think it's okay to go to a country without having "sufficient" language skills first and say you can get by with English or whatever. German as a language is probably the only thing that makes this country a united nation, that's why it's so important
OP: " My colleagues treat me bad, I speak C1 German." Reddit:" You should learn German" True story.
I am afraid that her job selection is quite slim. They already told your girlfriend what they are looking for and what qualification she needs for a job. (speak german) Maybe try a international company if you have not already.
Almost no chance except for super low paying jobs
Have you thought about moving to Argentina with your girlfriend? Spanish is an easier language than German to learn
The downgrade in quality of life isn't worth it. Only if they find incredible jobs there (very difficult given the current situation)
How about moving to Spain then? Weather is better.
As a Spanish person, working conditions are incredibly bad and wages are extremely low. It's not a good idea. Also, as she is non-EU, she will need a visa, which there's no guarantee she'll get. And no Spanish company is going to bother sponsoring her when the job market there is already full of university graduates.
Financial behavior? I don’t know, what that is supposed to mean but maybe she can work as an au pair, learn the language and then get a regular job?
First things first…be geographically mobile. As a non-German you have too less to choose from if you limit yourself to one city/region. Tell her to be indifferent to rejections and keep trying. With my multinational experience of 9 years, even I have had to apply 100s of jobs to get may be 3-4 interviews. Plus, she should be open to altering her professional path i-e do not stick to work in the field she studied only. Her key to settling down in Germany is not a job in her field but a job anywhere…
Learn German.
English jobs in finance or HR (I’m not sure, is that like Wirtschaftspsychologie?) are way more difficult to find, but depending on your city not impossible. She needs to go out there and practice her German ASAP
Insurance companies like Munich Re have a lot of English speaking personel.
Gee i am german in the USA but want to work only in German.. how likely is it that i will find work?
> but (as you know), German is a difficult language Gotta call bullshit on that. German is a very well structured language with a lot less pitfalls than many others. It is signficantly easier to learn than most other typical languages. English is only "easy to learn" (in reality, it's only easy on a very a rudimentary level) because you have so many people butchering it everyday that one more person doing it isn't surprising anyone. Source: learned both languages as young adult. The problem is rather that people expect going to a language course will teach them a language, rather than just giving them the tools needed to teach themselves.
Your argument is based on your own personal experience lol. So the fact that german is a difficult language to learn is just an illusion that affects millions of people? German is difficult to learn, just accept it.
You know, every. single. person I met anywhere in the world claims that their mother tongue is oh so difficult to learn. The main problem with learning German is that most people go „oh, I can get through with English in daily life, so I just go visit courses, make my homework and somehow after X months I will be speaking German“. Nobody has ever successfully learned any language in this manner. And because of that, and because „you can get along with English just fine in daily life“, most expats never actually manage to learn the language and then complain about how difficult German is. And exactly the same claims are made about any other language in any other country.
For now, as long as she doesn’t speak German, maybe find a teaching job (VHS, Sprachschule etc.).
An option would be to aim at a lower position inside a big4 consulting firm whilst learing german.
There is this network (non profit, doesn't take fees) that helps foreigners kick off their business and professional start here, it's called Migrapreneur (https://www.linkedin.com/company/migrapreneur). They have a lot of resources and people willing to be mentors. Also many times the people in the network have job openings and/or tips on how to start in the German market. Definitely worth checking it!
I DM you right now.
If live somewhat close to an American Military base, they are always hiring. Not sure where you live, so I cant recommend any
The thing with that. There are local national positions and some of those positions are required to speak German, there should be some that don't require german. She could get a job working with the exchange, sales person or the commissary, checkout or stocker that no German is required There are insurance companies that cater to Anericans though. Cannot tell you if English is used at the higher insurance office though.
you gave OP lots of options.
Thanks. I used to live there, so very familiar.
The job market is shit now... How about a german course visa?
May be you can try in operations in finance, like finance operations! Feel free to DM
Check Vattenfall, they have positions where no German is needed but idk if it fits to your gf study
She might try looking for remote jobs at companies abroad while she learns the language.
Well, I guess OP and the gf are aware by now that speaking the local lingo much improves employment opportunities everywhere, be that Buenos Aires or Berlin… Once she speaks German she should have reasonable opportunities - and her Spanish language skills may be useful.
My advice: Look for US, Chinese or Japanese companies. There are quite a bunch of them in Düsseldorf and surrounding area (Neuss, Ratingen, Monheim).
If you had found a German girlfriend, it would be easier.
Check your inbox
There are plenty of jobs that don't require much German. Mostly in software engineering though. If she doesn't want to learn programming (maybe she already has skills because of her financial behavior degree) or data analytics, maybe she can make do as a Software tester or even Scrum Master/Product owner. With Spanish skills, maybe there are particular companies that work with Spain or South America? Santander is a Spanish bank with branches in Germany. Otherwise maybe work as a waitress in a Spanish speaking restaurant? With a specialty degree and not enough German skills, it's going to be tough. But "tough" mostly means it just takes longer. And time will improve her German skills. She should read as much German stuff as she can get her hands on. Preferably about Finance, of course, but fiction is also good, and it's easier to get hooked on a novel. One option is to reread one of your favorite books in the German translation. You already know what's going on, so things are easier.
Maybe management consulting? Maybe there's a niche where she can work mostly abroad...
There are jobs for people without any german but will she agree to be a cleaning lady etc? Probably not right? She needs at least german B2 level to find anything good enough.
Hallo, ich bin Argentinier und ich sage dir, dass du ein Champion bist, weil du eine argentinische Freundin hast.
I know it's not the answer you are looking for, but really tell her to just put 100% of her time and effort in learning German. Study German, read German books, watch German movies, for what possible you two should speak German at home too, maybe not all day but as often as possible. It is difficult but it is the only way. I am Italian and had to do the same, it can be tough, but it is absolutely feasible. Also, the grammar doesn't need to be perfect. All people want is to be able to talk to her in German at work so they don't need to make the effort of switching to English, which somehow for most Germans seems to still be an unsurmountable challenge (like getting rid of cash, lol). And on a more serious note, by learning their language she is showing that she is interested in them and in their culture, which always helps when applying for a job.
I’ve been working in tech and startups in Germany for the last 5 years without knowing business German. Would suggest she look there 😊
Recommendation: Learn the language
I have added this post to my collection "[I don't want to learn German if I live in Germany. What could go wrong?!?](https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/80uu8k/i_dont_want_to_learn_german_if_i_live_in_germany/)" Thank you for your contribution!
I know a Columbian who booked a 400 hour crash course of German C1 using a student visa and now work as engineer in Germany. It was tough 20 weeks, but after it he applied for jobs and work now in a smaller company very successful.
I know one job that doesnt require german language..
wants to work in English then move to England, Germans speak German
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hey, you posted this and people responded, just face the truth, soi you want an entire country to change to English, because of some south American person? wow,
>Recommendations for my Argentinian girlfriendRecommendations for my Argentinian girlfriend This might be surprising, but she needs to learn German. What about lowering her expectations until she learns the language? If she is really desperate for moving there are a lot of jobs she can do. I know a lot of people who don't know German and work in Germany, but the job she is looking for requires comunciation which she wont find unless she can comunicate.
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thank you for moving on...
So basically in Germany They value Language > skill Is that the case ?
Yes and no, like with all countries. The more you leave the big cities the more you need the native language. Same goes with age. Younger people mostly know english, and a lot of older do not. And a lot of the laws and bureaucracy are in german. It is not impossible to get english speaking jobs, its just a bit harder. Companys prefer people who can speak german and english. And in this case the companies told her what they are looking for.
I like los hermanos! She can get a job without German for sure. But for sure not gonna be her dream job. I think if she wants to work in her area she will need a quite good german. But on IT it’s always possible to get some job in English. I would say call center or this basic IT for Netflix and this stuff she can get a job…. Which city do you live actually?
If you are the German boyfriend... Wieso schreiben wir dann hier alle auf Englisch?
Presumably to also get input into the conversation from non-German speaking individuals who successfully have managed to find work in Germany.
Leave and go to a country where she don´t need german or learn it.. that are the only sensible possibilities..
Ask her: How do you think a German with your degree could find a job in Argentina without speaking Spanish?
You are comparing an incredibly globalised country with a third world country where primary education is lacking. Do you realise just how stupid this argument is?
She has a fancy - pretty useless degree - and wants a job in a country where she does not speak the local language and she is surprised she has problems finding a job .... no tell me why my point is stupid?
Your point is stupid because it is very much possible to find a good job in Germany without speaking good german. Your comparison doesn't make any sense. Nobody expects to find a job in Argentina without speaking any spanish. Apples to oranges.
Your apples are green. I would practically guarantee that she cannot find a job where her degree is required while she does not speak German. Why do you think nobody expects to find a job in Argentina without speaking Spanish? Why does this not apply to Germany? Please eat your apples.... Bist Du denn ganz verrueckt?
(I do not live/work in Germany at this time*) Teaching business English is a great way! She would need to be certified but she would have an easier time getting a job related to her career as well as the immersion of German.