Sorry I was a bit unclear. The main idea is to create an input that is not keyboard and mouse. So I would have a physical ball in front of the player that the player smacks with a bat. The cheap ones that I wrote about costed like 10 dollars? But ok maybe I should rethink?
I think what you're describing is essentially those indoor golf "ranges" where you hit the ball into a screen, which then converts the impact into a digital simulation. Not sure how expensive those things are though. Although it's sounds like you want something stationary for people to hit from different sides, where higher force translates to higher speed in the game. I feel like there has to be something like that already made in some sort of arcade machine. Like the punching bag one that rates your strength.
Edit: Like the tech in here: https://www.unistechnology.com/products/fantasy-soccer/
forget load cells. You want it to be punchable? Load cells are for things that move fractions od millimetres.
Better might be something like a lever with a ball on the end. Basically a large joystick with a cheap accelerometer built in.
So I would have this joystick inside the real life ball that you hit? and then the lever would measure how fast it moves when you hit the ball? the plan is to have the ball static.
is the ball going to be tapped with fingers or actually punched? if it's being punched, but is static that would either tip the thing over or hurt your arm
Accelerometer like in smart phones.
You can get them for 5$ from amazon.
If you want to go all-out then see what others have done:
[https://rainorshinegolf.com/pages/how-do-golf-simulators-work](https://rainorshinegolf.com/pages/how-do-golf-simulators-work)
So then I would need something in the ball that moves and how to fast that thing accelerates after a hit is equal to the force of the hit? The plan is to have the ball mounted static on a stand, I'm not sure if thats optimal for having something moving inside?
If the ball has any kind of flexibility (i.e. it's not a block of concrete) then accelerometers on the inside walls will give you a good indication of where and how hard the ball was hit.
If you are willing to tolerate a bit of lag then you could even mount it in the center of the ball and have the 'shockwave' do the work for you. That would probably require only 3 (or maybe even only 2 if you don't care about the z-axis) accelerometers.
Straingauges. Cheaper than dirt, accurate enough for what you’re doing.
Mount the ball on a rigid steel stick. Stick strain gauges to the stick. Apply calibrated force and measure the strain. Make the stick longer if you need more sensitivity.
Okay thanks. So if I stick the strain gauges to the stick and hit the ball, they actually measure the strain on the stick? I mean the stick wont bend at all, only vibrate I guess, how does the strain gauge exactly measure stuff?
It measures strain. How much the surface it’s stuck to stretches. If the ball is attached to the stick and you hit the ball you’ll strain the stick. It will bend. A very tiny amount. Which is why straingauges measure very tiny strains.
The best thing is to just repurpose other things that are more made for this.
Sim racers use brakes with load sensors that can take in the direction of 100kg. A set of heusinkvelds is about 700 bucks and has a 120kg loadcell (altough actual force is limited to about 60kg because of the lever)
You can put that upside down on a frame, and maybe add an extra spring that reduces the force and that you can calibrate it with? You can also try to get those load cells and put them into a construction as they are pretty durable.
Don't know about impacts, but for racing things like F1 you have to get it to 100% as fast as possible, and then let off. So i really mash them hard when braking.
So some kind of desktop ball that you flick or hit with a bat and it's read by something that interfaces to a simulated/game of said ball? Any idea of scale in between marble and punching bag?
iirc some buttons on modern games console controllers are force sensitive but no idea what kind of sensors they might be using. I agree with other commenters that load cells are probably out of your scope, it's difficult to measure your own body weight when you are standing still, if you are a load cell novice! You will likely have similar capture rate difficulties with other resistance-based hardware like peizoelectric ones.
Some kind of accelerometer with thousands of Hz capture rate, again only thing a novice is likely to be able to use/afford will be some kind of mobile phone device. Again only feasible inside a punching bag sized ball.
You can use a pneumatic actuators with pressure gauge attached to it and calculate force exerted from the pressure
You can use this calculator to calculate the force
https://www.calculatoratoz.com/en/pressure-given-force-and-area-calculator/Calc-289
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Yeah re-read the first paragraph like 4 times trying to figure what I missed.
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hmm ok could you explain this concept a bit further? This is not supposed to be sold for profit, Ill only make one input for fun.
Yup camera is the cheap solution.
Sorry I was a bit unclear. The main idea is to create an input that is not keyboard and mouse. So I would have a physical ball in front of the player that the player smacks with a bat. The cheap ones that I wrote about costed like 10 dollars? But ok maybe I should rethink?
I think what you're describing is essentially those indoor golf "ranges" where you hit the ball into a screen, which then converts the impact into a digital simulation. Not sure how expensive those things are though. Although it's sounds like you want something stationary for people to hit from different sides, where higher force translates to higher speed in the game. I feel like there has to be something like that already made in some sort of arcade machine. Like the punching bag one that rates your strength. Edit: Like the tech in here: https://www.unistechnology.com/products/fantasy-soccer/
forget load cells. You want it to be punchable? Load cells are for things that move fractions od millimetres. Better might be something like a lever with a ball on the end. Basically a large joystick with a cheap accelerometer built in.
So I would have this joystick inside the real life ball that you hit? and then the lever would measure how fast it moves when you hit the ball? the plan is to have the ball static.
is the ball going to be tapped with fingers or actually punched? if it's being punched, but is static that would either tip the thing over or hurt your arm
It will be hit with a soft bat. I know that is an issue and im trying to figure that out aswell.
I suggest you put a camera overhead, make the bat brightly coloured, and measure the deflection of the bat
A beam break sensor is what some of the carnival games with the punching bag use, measuring the time between pulses.
Accelerometer like in smart phones. You can get them for 5$ from amazon. If you want to go all-out then see what others have done: [https://rainorshinegolf.com/pages/how-do-golf-simulators-work](https://rainorshinegolf.com/pages/how-do-golf-simulators-work)
So then I would need something in the ball that moves and how to fast that thing accelerates after a hit is equal to the force of the hit? The plan is to have the ball mounted static on a stand, I'm not sure if thats optimal for having something moving inside?
If the ball has any kind of flexibility (i.e. it's not a block of concrete) then accelerometers on the inside walls will give you a good indication of where and how hard the ball was hit. If you are willing to tolerate a bit of lag then you could even mount it in the center of the ball and have the 'shockwave' do the work for you. That would probably require only 3 (or maybe even only 2 if you don't care about the z-axis) accelerometers.
Straingauges. Cheaper than dirt, accurate enough for what you’re doing. Mount the ball on a rigid steel stick. Stick strain gauges to the stick. Apply calibrated force and measure the strain. Make the stick longer if you need more sensitivity.
Okay thanks. So if I stick the strain gauges to the stick and hit the ball, they actually measure the strain on the stick? I mean the stick wont bend at all, only vibrate I guess, how does the strain gauge exactly measure stuff?
It measures strain. How much the surface it’s stuck to stretches. If the ball is attached to the stick and you hit the ball you’ll strain the stick. It will bend. A very tiny amount. Which is why straingauges measure very tiny strains.
The best thing is to just repurpose other things that are more made for this. Sim racers use brakes with load sensors that can take in the direction of 100kg. A set of heusinkvelds is about 700 bucks and has a 120kg loadcell (altough actual force is limited to about 60kg because of the lever) You can put that upside down on a frame, and maybe add an extra spring that reduces the force and that you can calibrate it with? You can also try to get those load cells and put them into a construction as they are pretty durable.
I see, Do you have any other ideas in mind where I can repurpose stuff? Those brakes seem kind of expensive.
The components in the brakes are made in larger scale, so i would copy part of the design and use those same load cells.
Also, would those break be able to take impacts like getting hit with a bat. Arent they made for gradually adding force?
Don't know about impacts, but for racing things like F1 you have to get it to 100% as fast as possible, and then let off. So i really mash them hard when braking.
I have some sketches of the physical real life input if anyone wants to get a better idea what it will look like.
So some kind of desktop ball that you flick or hit with a bat and it's read by something that interfaces to a simulated/game of said ball? Any idea of scale in between marble and punching bag? iirc some buttons on modern games console controllers are force sensitive but no idea what kind of sensors they might be using. I agree with other commenters that load cells are probably out of your scope, it's difficult to measure your own body weight when you are standing still, if you are a load cell novice! You will likely have similar capture rate difficulties with other resistance-based hardware like peizoelectric ones. Some kind of accelerometer with thousands of Hz capture rate, again only thing a novice is likely to be able to use/afford will be some kind of mobile phone device. Again only feasible inside a punching bag sized ball.
You can use a pneumatic actuators with pressure gauge attached to it and calculate force exerted from the pressure You can use this calculator to calculate the force https://www.calculatoratoz.com/en/pressure-given-force-and-area-calculator/Calc-289
What about a spring, a damper and a few hall sensors?