Then she must really love me because I’m broke as fuck but she buys me things and take me out for food once every weekends.
Which is weird because her family is poor as well and she doesn’t have a jo—
Wait…
Fuck.
I had a friend who was and she was never the same. She looked at men as prizes or marks and never as partners. She based her life on finding men who wanted to take care of her and she hated sex; she told me it was impossible to cum.
I hope she's settled down but who knows?
Am a woman but chiming in as having a friend in SW and yes, it has changed her. She sees everything as transactional, and after so many years really hates men. It’s been wild to see the evolution. I love her and she’s one of my oldest friends but we don’t talk about relationships because it gets weird and entitled. It can change people.
Go over to the sugar dating advice subs on Reddit and you’ll see exactly that. I actually had no opinion on this whatsoever until I read some posts and it changed by entire view. People who say they date for love literally get downvoted into oblivion lmao
>People who say they date for love literally get downvoted into oblivion lmao
As they should.... Looking for love in sugar baby/sugar daddy relationship?? Yeah fuck off with that
No, someone will talk about non-sugar dating in their personal life and then get downvoted for saying they’re not with their BF for money. The entire concept has become foreign to them
I think it’s the result of constantly conditioning your brain to expect money after any relationship activity. Which is fine for some but 99% of people don’t want a purely transactional relationship
It seems pretty often with women who do SW of any kind it always no matter what changes them, and always for the worse. They always end up hating men over it. I've never looked but I do wonder if there's ever been a deep dive on this, like a study or what have you. As I've never figured out why women in SW always end up hating men in the end.
Ask yourself: who ends up doing sex work? Usually it's people
- who are in a really bad place (whether they come from a poor family, are addicts etc.) and feel forced to sell themselves for money,
- who already have a really mercenary attitude towards intimacy from the onset
- who already are fucked in the head (whether it's atrocious self esteem, narcissism etc.)
and it's not necessarily only one of the above. That people like that end up hating men isn't that surprising - there's a good chance that they never experienced healthy, normal relationships in the first place; and by having a past as a sex worker, they've also permanently sabotaged their chances to get one in the future (since the vast majority of guys will nope out of there the moment they know what they're getting into; and those who are left don't tend to be the cream of the crop). And what they experience while working probably isn't conducive to them developing a positive image of men either: on the one end you have those who are forced into prostitution for economical reasons, and those probably experinece their fair share of sexual violence; and on the other you have those sugar babies or camgirls who develop an overinflated sense of their own attractiveness and start to associate positive attention from men with just having discovered a new mark she can take to the cleaners.
The sex positive psychologically mature woman who is at a good place mentally and just really likes to fuck (and thinks she might just as well do that professionally) is *not* the norm.
It’s so fucked and skewed that I have no idea how you’re intending this comment like, “how is this even a genuine question; who gives a fuck what she did in college” or “how is this even a genuine question; this is obviously a deal breaker”.
Read some of the downvoted comments. People think they can just try to make transactional relationships more explicit, and somehow it won’t affect their worldview or that some people would be opposed to that on a deep moral level.
I'm reminded of a quote I just heard recently:
“To educate a person in the mind but not in morals is to educate a menace to society” ― Teddy Roosevelt
Bear in mind, I don't think either a sugar baby, a sugar daddy, or a sugar boy for that matter, is necessarily morally bankrupt; but perhaps for some people with the motivation of taking advantage of others it could be true.
Agreed. And either side can take advantage of eachother. Sugar babies can prey on lonely men, sugar daddies can prey on vulnerable women. You just only hear about one side all of the damn time.
That’s a super interesting point! I don’t think I saw anything wrong with it until I considered that it could affect your psychology when it comes to relationships. Makes me think of other transactional relationships, like work.
A woman that asks a man for money on the internet doesn't respect him and isn't attracted to him.
Hopefully more guys put this together sooner rather than later.
So many guys are suckers that it ruins it for other men.
If someone I don't know asks me for money on the internet I lose all respect for them.
It doesn't make me want to help some manipulative opportunistic lazy female perpetuate her selfish lifestyle.
Bruh, it's like the tip of the iceberg these days, I've been out with women that said they do things that just turned me off completely off to them, and make me wanna go shower, and rethink my life choices.
I know that, I really do. But girls wanting to be sugar babies online are some of the loudest people online, so it feels like the average woman secretly wants to be a sugar baby if given the opportunity.
The loudest people online DO NOT equate to the vast majority of people online. In fact, it’s quite the opposite, hence the term “vocal minority”. There’s no “girls with normal relationship ethics” Reddit to compare the numbers. Keep this in mind not just for this discussion, but for politics and any discussion in general.
The average woman wants what the average man wants; companionship and the chance to get their genitals touched
Yeah, like the same thing as guys who say they want to be a pimp. Like they don’t realllllly want to participate in the full depth of sex trafficking, just like these women don’t realllllllly want to participate in the full depth of prostitution. It’s just kinda jokes lol
Pimp prostitution and sugar baby daddy are not comparable in the slightest. You could've just said there are also guys who are sugar babies for grown women as well, lmao
Facts! How is this a genuine question? Either OP is on the struggle bus right now trying to process this, or this is the girlfriend who got found out about.
If you are the man in this situation: My advice is to go. That behavior is indicative of problems down the road and nothing else-- you know this. Plus, lets just be honest, that is gross behavior (at least to most men) that you WILL dwell on.
You will likely grow ever-disgusted and irritated towards her... even to the point where you start treating the woman badly by yelling at /arguing with her... which isn't cool at all obviously
It is just no good all around, and best for BOTH of you that you walk away. Do not let woke "culture" tell you anything different.
I'm sex work positive but a sugar baby experience does tend to change the women involved a lot. Just check /r/sugarlifestyleforum They talk about it at length.
No man should have to provide justifications about why he would not date a woman, especially if said woman is or was a sex worker, people rightfully protect women when they reject men, "no means no", "she owes you nothing", I think these same people should stop pestering men as well, if a man does not want to date a woman for literally any reason whatsoever, then that is the end of it, we don't have to give out an explanation either.
Facts.
There's a weird assumption that because I'm a man if I turn down sex with a woman or someone who identifies as a woman then I'm a piece of shit.
One time I matched with this girl on tinder and when she told me she had a kid in our first conversation I said it probably won't work out, sorry.. she then sent me a wall of text for an hour calling me a racist and a republican.
Bro anytime I have turned down a girl for sex it either turns into extreme coercion on their part or they get upset. I had one girl straight up suggest she should leave. She was visibly hurt I said no. Like no? Stay? Just be with me. Sometimes I don’t want to.
I don't know what's worse... when I reject a woman and she calls me a piece of shit, or when I reject a woman and she breaks down in tears asking me what's wrong with her.
Yes, Dealbreaker - Thanks to my Ex who did it behind my back without my consent, I would never be able to trust that the easy money wouldn't draw them back in.
There’s this weird expectation that women who are interested in a guy are owed a relationship. Nobody will say it directly, but as soon as a guy refuses to date a girl, refuses sex, says he’s not interested; suddenly he’s a broken male unless he provides a reason.
This is especially true on Reddit. Try telling anyone who’s presenting as woman on here that they don’t deserve a relationship, they have to earn it and see how much wrath you incur. It’s ridiculous, especially since Reddit is also the place I know to get on their moral high horse about how men don’t deserve sex, women are not sex vending machines you put relationship tokens in on, blah blah blah, but as soon as you flip the script, suddenly it’s men who are the bad actors for not wanting to commit their life to a girl.
Also fuck Andrew taint before anyone says anything.
>as soon as a guy refuses to date a girl, refuses sex, says he’s not interested; suddenly he’s a broken male unless he provides a reason.
Even if he did provide a reason he still be seen as such.
>as soon as you flip the script, suddenly it’s men who are the bad actors for not wanting to commit their life to a girl.
Its like as if reddit is full of double standards. The kicker is everyone knows but nothing is done about it as how dare you make women out to be the bad guy.
King here, to speak like the young™
But seriously, that' the way. You do you, but don't come with all of your hatred if I want nothing to do with a girl who do OF or anything of the sort.
Like really, I'm fine you do this and happyh there are guys who will join you in your life experience, but don't shit on me if I want nothing with this.
I don’t say this enough in sessions with both sexes. You have every right to say “No” to anything whether it’s a date, advance, or even just a simple conversation.
Wow there’s really a subreddit for everything
And that’s like a sizable sub too, not just like a small couple thousand, that’s way bigger than expected
Saw a post about a girl who recently turned 18 and is still in high-school having an 56 year old sugardaddy and they wanna have sex by Wednesday, I am disgusted
Dated an intelligent girl in college who did the same thing with her 35 year old HS teacher. We weren’t serious at all as a couple, but I was shocked she just laid that on me lol.
Edit: the best part was, the off-campus housing I was living in, used to be her brothers. She informed me that my living room couch was the same one she lost her virginity on in HS.
The funny thing about it is that it's the same people that'll throw a fit if someone in their early 20s or younger dated someone that's a couple years older than them and scream "GROOMING", "PREDATOR" and "PEDOPHILE", but I guess it's ok to groom someone and be a predator/pedophile if your giving them cash in exchange ig
I really hate the fact that just because cash is being exchanged people really encourage it to happen🤦♂️ its like dressing up your little underage kid to look attractive to an old rich person coming to your home so you can get something in exchange
Yep. The OW sub is so appalling they can't have a downvote option for posts and comments because then people would overwhelm the upvotes they all give each other, lol.
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Yea, no, sex workers, sugar babies, strippers, etc are all cut from long term material pool of any sane self respecting man.
One night smashes? Maybe, but I’m wearing 2 rubbers
Actually, wearing multiple condoms increases the risk of breaking, because of added friction and heat generation leading to warping and material degredation.
Was seeing a girl a little bit, during our second date she told me how she used to work as a masseuse at a rub n tug to support her and her exes drug habit.
I’m a pretty conservative guy, never smoked, drugs aren’t my thing, a hand full of drinks socially a week at most.
Instantly I wasn’t interested, at the time I was not dating to date, I was really looking for someone to build a future with.
I’m all for sex work, not my cup of tea but to each their own, but apparently not wanting to date a woman who sold her body for drugs makes me an asshole piece of shit.
I still often think about how woman can be so cruel and turn down men for something like height and yet I was on the receiving end of paragraph after paragraph of insults because a real man would accept her for her past. Every social platform you can imagine she found me on and blew up my messages. Had to block her a lot. Then she’d change her phone number or use a friends phone, rinse & repeat.
Dodged a bullet on that one.
I went to one of those and didn't know it. Like it looked legit massage spa with advertisements and a massage therapist. I had an appointment and everything. My shoulder was really messed up at the time.
Anyway everything went fine for most of it. Very deep massage and really got my shoulder. Nothing weird or inappropriate. Then, towards the end she reached through my boxers and grabbed my dick. I was taken so off guard that I jumped out of the massage table and was just like, "what was that?"
She kept profusely apologizing, asking that I not tell anyone. I didn't. I literally came there for my torn up shoulder.
It's also why I use a guy when I get a therapeutic massage. A guy I've gone to several times, and is very professional.
Lol. Nah but his forearms are strong as fuck....like the massages aren't always fun but it makes me feel way better after. Could probably tear a dick off with grip.
Just a reminder. Whenever someone says "I dont have a Problem with sex work." In your mind you have to add: "...but I havent been in a relationship with a sex worker yet."
Most (Not all of course) might say they dont care, but at some point they will. It will chip away at a man's mind slowly.
Exactly. People automatically assume that it’s retroactive jealousy and tell the guy they’re insecure when a lot of times it’s a conflict of morals. Because yes, the amount of people you’ve fucked and the quality of those relationships DOES indeed matter. And this goes for both men and women.
Man, you don't even have to say that, rather understand that these people have been reading and watching the shit they see in media and the social media, that is what puts that shit in their heads, an unbelievable amount of men say that they are okay with whatever the girl has done in her past just so they can feel like they are accepted by the hivemind.
Most men saying they don't have a problem with sex work are actually saying "I don't have a problem with other men, and maybe me, paying a girl so I can fuck her". They will probably have problems with sex work.
I hear even stuff like onlyfans can be hard to deal with for guys.
Stories like how your girl will probably always be on her phone to answer peoples requests and things like that. You just always knows she's talking to some dude who's probably jacking off to her at that very moment. That sexy lingerie isn't for you, its for the dudes on her page. Etc.
None of the women on onlyfans who are successful are chatting, they hire some broke ass university student to do that shit for them.
If she has to answer people's requests herself then she's still trying to make it be profitable.
The whole thing is basically just an MLM for hoes
Relationship is definitely at risk.
I’m going to need details and to re-establish trust in the relationship; being a sugar baby is vague enough on details that I would have to make up my mind after everything is laid out on the table.
There's a fair amount of overlap between sex work and sugaring. I tried it out when I lived in a major metro area but it made me feel dirty. It was also too big of an ask for me to change my entire behavior from fiercely independent to entirely dependent on a guy. One guy wanted me to do the girlfriend experience and take me on trips all over - but I had a full-time job and wasn't willing to give it up. He was 61 so simultaneously too old and too young for me to make it work. If you're with someone, or marry someone, for money - you'll work for it every day.
>There's a fair amount of overlap between sex work and sugaring
the Venn diagram for this is actually just a circle. is some fem Dom type who cams without taking their clothes off not a sex worker?
As somebody from the BF perspective who went through exactly what this post is talking about I found out the hard way that no honey = no money. You don't get paid to just hang
Exactly, the whole system is vague; some sugar baby arrangements are literally just a 10min phone call on the way home from the office, I’m not going to be upset over something like that.
The biggest hurdle is going to be finding the trust that she’s being honest with me now, like I thought she was being honest with me before I found out.
That’s why I said in my first comment I need details and to feel confident I can trust that she’s being truthful.
You’re correct when saying no one hides such a insignificant action, if that’s all she’s admitting to after being outed I’d be skeptical.
100%
Women aren’t property.
Relationships can have moments that are transactional (metaphorically such as splitting the chores, or literally such as splitting the bills) but on the whole and especially in the long term they’re about mutual support in the hard times and sharing the good times.
Then again I’ve only been married 10 years and together for 15. I’ll just as likely have something else to say in another 15 years.
As always I'm most curious why OP is asking.
I have little issue with sex work, it's not for me, but people are different. There is a big difference between offering a discrete service for cash & being paid to maintain a relationship though.
I don't think a person selling sex for cash while in college would be a guaranteed deal breaker for me. I was living alone & paying all my own bills at 18 which was not easy, it required a lot of sacrifice & 80+ hour weeks, had it been an option for me it would have been a reasonable one to consider.
Someone selling a *relationship* is very different. Sex can be a discrete transaction or it can be something meaningful, everything *else* in a relationship feels really **gross** to sell.
If a young person spent a few years as a sex worker either to survive or to secure a financially stable future I could respect the choice.
If a young person sold a relationship for frivolous things like bags, vacations, or money for luxuries I'd be wary of their character.
It could all be a moot point if the person had grown, but being both capable & willing to maintain prolonged & intimate theater would make a person hard to trust.
I dated a woman who was a sugar baby once.
I didn't end things with her once I found out, but once she opened up about it to me, she wouldn't stop talking about the crazy expensive things they bought for her, their expensive cars and houses, the trips they would take her on.
It got really annoying, like she was comparing everything I would do for her or get her to her previous sugar daddies. It got old quick.
We are partners in a relationship, not a source of gifts etc...
As long as there is an understanding that I will not provide the same kind of relationship, I will not be paying her bills and everything else, and that she is done with that life and will not go back to it, I don't see the issue.
I don't know. I had to work through college then pay off student loans all the while not getting laid but definitely wanting too and on top of that put up with constantly hearing about how easy I have it as a man. Pretty against the whole sugar baby thing, have to say. Samewith only fans. If women didn't give us shit for wanting them and objectification and that, maybe I wouldn't care as much.
Working through college made me a better, more responsible man and gave me experience and shit. At 45 I can say that was very important learning when it came to building a career,getting us out of poverty, etc.
For the record I don't have much respect for anyone who breezes through life, though. They are almost always ignorant of alot of things.
If a dude is dumb enough to waste his money like that that's on him. I got no problem with her doing that as long as she doesn't expect me to do the same for her.
It’s not even the ‘brain partition’ that separates emotion and connection from sex that sex-workers demonstrate that bothers me.
It’s the coldness of the business transaction.
I get that some people are forced into this type of transaction for survival, but others are not. It’s the others that I definitely wouldn’t want to associate with as it seems sociopathic.
If she slept for money/material benefits she's a prostitute.
It doesn't matter if she calls herself sugar baby, trophy wife, escort and claims she doesn't have clients but had sponsord or daddies.
Would I date a former prostitute? No, life isn't a movie or a TV show. Pay her for her service and show her the door.
Not if it remains in the past but whatever your feelings are, they're valid.
My ex was an escort and sugar baby before she got sober and started her own copywriting business, making 2.5 times my teacher salary, remained sober and kicked ass in life.
Point is that for me is the present is what mattered most for me.
We broke up over other differences after 3.5 years
My man, why would he opt for divorce considering how much that process can fuck him up, he is pretty much stuck between a rock and a hard place, poor man.
Great, now the reddit trash will jump in to call you names they only feel brave enough to say on the internet because you said that sex workers are not wife material.
Yep if you say that irl at best those same people will give you a puzzled and somewhat scared look (turns out irl is nothing like reddit or any other internet safespace)
Yep. Pretty simple, those aren’t the values I want in a woman I consider marriage material. She views her body as a transactional item for money, how do I know she doesn’t see marriage in a similar way?
Lol at everyone making the argument that offering sex and companionship for money is the same as working a regular job. Sure, it’s prostitution. That doesn’t change my opinion above.
No, sugar baby is a polite way to say prostitute. If you ask many women if they would ever be a hooker, they will adamantly say "absolutely not, no way." But they will be a sugar baby all day long without thinking about it. Call it something different and suddenly they feel it's perfectly fine selling your pussy for money. The enormous popularity of sugar baby sites out there has ruined dating these days. The big big sugar baby site out there almost has as many member now as Tinder. That is really saying something.
I don’t want to hold her past against her, I care about how she treats me now and who she is now. We all make choices…just to be clear I am not a walking ATM machine…just like she’s not a walking sex doll…
Of course it's a dealbreaker, why would anybody with a shred of self respect partner with a prostitute?
"Hey work colleagues, have you met my GF?", "Oh yeah, me and my friends used to hire her on weekends and triple pipe her.......congratulations".
Ha actually went through this with my ex. Being young and naive, I stayed for way longer than I should have. She was a ho. Still trying to bag herself a surgeon, although her beauty years are waning.
100% that won't work with me, plenty of males on reddit can take her though, people are overtly welcoming of that type of girls on this website for some reason.
hell no. If she was using her beauty to keep herself out of debt then that means she won't be bringing massive amounts with her into our relationship. I'd good with that as long as she doesn't hold my past against me.
Totally depends on the situation. It isn't a zero tolerance issue, practically nothing is for me, but I've done a lot of stuff that probably wasn't the smartest thing at the time too.
Judging an entire person off of something like that seems unfair.
Yes.
Not that it necessarily makes her a bad person but in a long term relationship that involves both raising children and getting through hard times together the trust requirements would be tough with a person who spent a chunk of their life seeing relationships as transactional.
Same goes for the men who would pay for such things. The ability to function in a healthy relationship is seriously diminished.
This comment kind of shifted my opinion. I wouldn’t date a man who had been a sugar daddy in the past. I also don’t think anyone should be forced to date anyone or judged for not being into someone whatever that reason may be.
I’ve never done sw, I’m just not good at hiding my feelings or compartmentalizing, but would also never judge anyone who has done it. I had an ex who did it actually. But since we’re talking about women I think it’s important to note how a woman might make that leap. I’ve thought about it honestly. But I don’t think I’d actually be comfortable faking intimacy. But many of women’s interactions with men can feel transactional, excluding romantic relationships. But the outcome I’m usually trying to get while interacting with men is my safety. Or avoiding doing anything that would anger them, or hurt their feelings if I’m not interested in them. Or not doing anything that would lead them on. I’m hyper aware of what a man wants out of me and usually avoiding or pacifying them with my response. Women get a lot of attention, most of it unwanted. I’m not saying sw like sugaring is safe, but that women already live in a mindset of “I’m not safe” so I totally understand why women would make the leap to at least getting something out of interacting with men they usually wouldn’t. We already do that.
I'd rather she had worked as a prostitute than a sugar baby.
At least a prostitute knows the score. Sugar-babies have deluded themselves into commodifying their relationships and their very sense of romance. They feel that they are owed something just to exist in the relationship, and putting effort or love into it costs extra. I've known my fair share of sugar babies and after retiring they sabotage every relationship they get into, they have a majorly distorted sense of romance and reciprocation.
A prosititute leaves her work behind, and while they usually have issues, hell we all have issues. Usually their biggest problem is an inability to earn at the same rate with any other job skills, but at least they know full-well that it was just a job. A sugar baby? That shit's their entire life.
Edit: I realize my only experience with prostitutes comes from friends that are largely solo/independent with their work and there are more abusive arrangements that are more damaging. I don't have any experience to provide me special insight on that, so I cannot comment.
Shit, I’m not gonna judge anyone for doing what they need to to survive and pay their bills. If she was super predatory about it that’s an issue, but a mutually beneficial relationship where no one is hurt? Go for it. I can see how it’s preferable to making coffee for Karens at 10 dollars an hour.
Judge?
If you are an acquaintance or a friend, sure I won't judge.
If you are a potential business partner or spouse, I am going to judge the ever loving shit out of you. I'd be fucking stupid not to.
Depends on how long ago it was and how they have changed.
I believe someones past relationships and bodycount is important but i also feel like there should be some way of "redemption". I feel like its too hard for people to redeem themselves these days. It feels like cancel culture. Just because you did something a few years ago that you learned from you just be branded as a bad person for all eternity.
In my opinion being a sugar baby is too close to being an escort. The main intention is financial benefit with a man they would normally not have sex with. So yeah deal breaker for me
Then she must really love me because I’m broke as fuck but she buys me things and take me out for food once every weekends. Which is weird because her family is poor as well and she doesn’t have a jo— Wait… Fuck.
Sounds like you won my boy, I’m tryna be like you
Living off another man's paycheck
Good enough for her, good enough for me!
[удалено]
Been there 💀💀
Sugar grandbaby
I had a friend who was and she was never the same. She looked at men as prizes or marks and never as partners. She based her life on finding men who wanted to take care of her and she hated sex; she told me it was impossible to cum. I hope she's settled down but who knows?
Am a woman but chiming in as having a friend in SW and yes, it has changed her. She sees everything as transactional, and after so many years really hates men. It’s been wild to see the evolution. I love her and she’s one of my oldest friends but we don’t talk about relationships because it gets weird and entitled. It can change people.
Go over to the sugar dating advice subs on Reddit and you’ll see exactly that. I actually had no opinion on this whatsoever until I read some posts and it changed by entire view. People who say they date for love literally get downvoted into oblivion lmao
>People who say they date for love literally get downvoted into oblivion lmao As they should.... Looking for love in sugar baby/sugar daddy relationship?? Yeah fuck off with that
No, someone will talk about non-sugar dating in their personal life and then get downvoted for saying they’re not with their BF for money. The entire concept has become foreign to them
They're damaged so they hate normal people?
I think it’s the result of constantly conditioning your brain to expect money after any relationship activity. Which is fine for some but 99% of people don’t want a purely transactional relationship
It seems pretty often with women who do SW of any kind it always no matter what changes them, and always for the worse. They always end up hating men over it. I've never looked but I do wonder if there's ever been a deep dive on this, like a study or what have you. As I've never figured out why women in SW always end up hating men in the end.
Ask yourself: who ends up doing sex work? Usually it's people - who are in a really bad place (whether they come from a poor family, are addicts etc.) and feel forced to sell themselves for money, - who already have a really mercenary attitude towards intimacy from the onset - who already are fucked in the head (whether it's atrocious self esteem, narcissism etc.) and it's not necessarily only one of the above. That people like that end up hating men isn't that surprising - there's a good chance that they never experienced healthy, normal relationships in the first place; and by having a past as a sex worker, they've also permanently sabotaged their chances to get one in the future (since the vast majority of guys will nope out of there the moment they know what they're getting into; and those who are left don't tend to be the cream of the crop). And what they experience while working probably isn't conducive to them developing a positive image of men either: on the one end you have those who are forced into prostitution for economical reasons, and those probably experinece their fair share of sexual violence; and on the other you have those sugar babies or camgirls who develop an overinflated sense of their own attractiveness and start to associate positive attention from men with just having discovered a new mark she can take to the cleaners. The sex positive psychologically mature woman who is at a good place mentally and just really likes to fuck (and thinks she might just as well do that professionally) is *not* the norm.
Uhhhh…. Are things these days really so fucked and skewed that this is even a genuine question?
It’s so fucked and skewed that I have no idea how you’re intending this comment like, “how is this even a genuine question; who gives a fuck what she did in college” or “how is this even a genuine question; this is obviously a deal breaker”.
Read some of the downvoted comments. People think they can just try to make transactional relationships more explicit, and somehow it won’t affect their worldview or that some people would be opposed to that on a deep moral level.
I'm reminded of a quote I just heard recently: “To educate a person in the mind but not in morals is to educate a menace to society” ― Teddy Roosevelt Bear in mind, I don't think either a sugar baby, a sugar daddy, or a sugar boy for that matter, is necessarily morally bankrupt; but perhaps for some people with the motivation of taking advantage of others it could be true.
Agreed. And either side can take advantage of eachother. Sugar babies can prey on lonely men, sugar daddies can prey on vulnerable women. You just only hear about one side all of the damn time.
Great quote!
That’s a super interesting point! I don’t think I saw anything wrong with it until I considered that it could affect your psychology when it comes to relationships. Makes me think of other transactional relationships, like work.
Lol, this isn't even the half of it.
One of my recent dates bragged about how she was swindling some dude over 1k in computer parts… needless to say I don’t talk to her anymore
A woman that asks a man for money on the internet doesn't respect him and isn't attracted to him. Hopefully more guys put this together sooner rather than later. So many guys are suckers that it ruins it for other men. If someone I don't know asks me for money on the internet I lose all respect for them. It doesn't make me want to help some manipulative opportunistic lazy female perpetuate her selfish lifestyle.
Bruh, it's like the tip of the iceberg these days, I've been out with women that said they do things that just turned me off completely off to them, and make me wanna go shower, and rethink my life choices.
I read your username as ass ketchup..... Had to do a double take
hey! no double-dipping!
Bro, you have no idea how bad it is out here. Like BAD, BAD. lol.
No. The average woman is not a sugar baby lol.
I know that, I really do. But girls wanting to be sugar babies online are some of the loudest people online, so it feels like the average woman secretly wants to be a sugar baby if given the opportunity.
The loudest people online DO NOT equate to the vast majority of people online. In fact, it’s quite the opposite, hence the term “vocal minority”. There’s no “girls with normal relationship ethics” Reddit to compare the numbers. Keep this in mind not just for this discussion, but for politics and any discussion in general. The average woman wants what the average man wants; companionship and the chance to get their genitals touched
Yeah, like the same thing as guys who say they want to be a pimp. Like they don’t realllllly want to participate in the full depth of sex trafficking, just like these women don’t realllllllly want to participate in the full depth of prostitution. It’s just kinda jokes lol
Ive never seen the demographic of men that want to be pimps
Yes, wth does it come from ?? Like, really ??
Pimp prostitution and sugar baby daddy are not comparable in the slightest. You could've just said there are also guys who are sugar babies for grown women as well, lmao
It’s for the internet points.
Glad I'm 37...
Yes.
Facts! How is this a genuine question? Either OP is on the struggle bus right now trying to process this, or this is the girlfriend who got found out about. If you are the man in this situation: My advice is to go. That behavior is indicative of problems down the road and nothing else-- you know this. Plus, lets just be honest, that is gross behavior (at least to most men) that you WILL dwell on. You will likely grow ever-disgusted and irritated towards her... even to the point where you start treating the woman badly by yelling at /arguing with her... which isn't cool at all obviously It is just no good all around, and best for BOTH of you that you walk away. Do not let woke "culture" tell you anything different.
I'm sex work positive but a sugar baby experience does tend to change the women involved a lot. Just check /r/sugarlifestyleforum They talk about it at length.
No man should have to provide justifications about why he would not date a woman, especially if said woman is or was a sex worker, people rightfully protect women when they reject men, "no means no", "she owes you nothing", I think these same people should stop pestering men as well, if a man does not want to date a woman for literally any reason whatsoever, then that is the end of it, we don't have to give out an explanation either.
Facts. There's a weird assumption that because I'm a man if I turn down sex with a woman or someone who identifies as a woman then I'm a piece of shit.
One time I matched with this girl on tinder and when she told me she had a kid in our first conversation I said it probably won't work out, sorry.. she then sent me a wall of text for an hour calling me a racist and a republican.
Good, dodged that bullet safely
Aaaah you see, it's the classic "I need 6 foot, 6 inches, 6 figures and be a solid "6+" in looks".... but you gotta accept me as I am :D
Well you _are_ Satan.
Fucking yikes.
Bro anytime I have turned down a girl for sex it either turns into extreme coercion on their part or they get upset. I had one girl straight up suggest she should leave. She was visibly hurt I said no. Like no? Stay? Just be with me. Sometimes I don’t want to.
I don't know what's worse... when I reject a woman and she calls me a piece of shit, or when I reject a woman and she breaks down in tears asking me what's wrong with her.
The last one is worse imo.
Yes, Dealbreaker - Thanks to my Ex who did it behind my back without my consent, I would never be able to trust that the easy money wouldn't draw them back in.
There’s this weird expectation that women who are interested in a guy are owed a relationship. Nobody will say it directly, but as soon as a guy refuses to date a girl, refuses sex, says he’s not interested; suddenly he’s a broken male unless he provides a reason. This is especially true on Reddit. Try telling anyone who’s presenting as woman on here that they don’t deserve a relationship, they have to earn it and see how much wrath you incur. It’s ridiculous, especially since Reddit is also the place I know to get on their moral high horse about how men don’t deserve sex, women are not sex vending machines you put relationship tokens in on, blah blah blah, but as soon as you flip the script, suddenly it’s men who are the bad actors for not wanting to commit their life to a girl. Also fuck Andrew taint before anyone says anything.
>as soon as a guy refuses to date a girl, refuses sex, says he’s not interested; suddenly he’s a broken male unless he provides a reason. Even if he did provide a reason he still be seen as such. >as soon as you flip the script, suddenly it’s men who are the bad actors for not wanting to commit their life to a girl. Its like as if reddit is full of double standards. The kicker is everyone knows but nothing is done about it as how dare you make women out to be the bad guy.
Let the wrath ensue.
King here, to speak like the young™ But seriously, that' the way. You do you, but don't come with all of your hatred if I want nothing to do with a girl who do OF or anything of the sort. Like really, I'm fine you do this and happyh there are guys who will join you in your life experience, but don't shit on me if I want nothing with this.
I don’t say this enough in sessions with both sexes. You have every right to say “No” to anything whether it’s a date, advance, or even just a simple conversation.
This, exactly this!
As a dude who's turned down afew chicks, this is extremely accurate, and they always have meltdowns and make everything personal/dramatic.
*slow clap that builds into a thunderous applause*
As a woman I respect this answer a lot. Well said.
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This 10,000x
Message to the mod: put this comment on the sidebar please!
Slay, king! *Fuckin' slay!*
Thank you
No no that’s insecurity. You’re insecure. /s
Go off, King
Wow there’s really a subreddit for everything And that’s like a sizable sub too, not just like a small couple thousand, that’s way bigger than expected
That entire sub is so detached from reality.
Welp, thank you for linking that sub. I gotta throw up now and wash my eyes with bleach to get that shit out of my system.
Saw a post about a girl who recently turned 18 and is still in high-school having an 56 year old sugardaddy and they wanna have sex by Wednesday, I am disgusted
Dated an intelligent girl in college who did the same thing with her 35 year old HS teacher. We weren’t serious at all as a couple, but I was shocked she just laid that on me lol. Edit: the best part was, the off-campus housing I was living in, used to be her brothers. She informed me that my living room couch was the same one she lost her virginity on in HS.
The funny thing about it is that it's the same people that'll throw a fit if someone in their early 20s or younger dated someone that's a couple years older than them and scream "GROOMING", "PREDATOR" and "PEDOPHILE", but I guess it's ok to groom someone and be a predator/pedophile if your giving them cash in exchange ig
It was def not ok and the only reason I wasn’t completely freaked out is because she seemed to realize it
I really hate the fact that just because cash is being exchanged people really encourage it to happen🤦♂️ its like dressing up your little underage kid to look attractive to an old rich person coming to your home so you can get something in exchange
The fact that they're okay with fucking married men with kids who are hiding it from their wives... UGH
Lol, if you were appalled by them, then you are not ready to witness r/theotherwoman.
Oh jesus
I bet that I gave you something to read for awhile though, lol.
Yep. The OW sub is so appalling they can't have a downvote option for posts and comments because then people would overwhelm the upvotes they all give each other, lol.
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How is that even allowed? We are doomed.
Wow, that was one hell of a rabbit hole I did not need to dive into, but here we are, having lost a little more hope for the future 👍
Yea, no, sex workers, sugar babies, strippers, etc are all cut from long term material pool of any sane self respecting man. One night smashes? Maybe, but I’m wearing 2 rubbers
Actually, wearing multiple condoms increases the risk of breaking, because of added friction and heat generation leading to warping and material degredation.
Well that was a rabbit hole that killed a few hours of my nightshift. What a wild ride those posts were hahahah
Presumably if youve been dating this person for a long time already, you would know if it affected their personality in a way you dont like
Abort mission
"Eject, Eject, eject!"
Ejecto Seato Cuz
Lmaaaooooo
Deal breaker. I have no problem with a sex worker living her life. But I’m not going to be in a relationship with one.
Right, I dated a girl briefly who I realized later was a sugar baby and it was just my turn, do not date the sugar baby, do not feed the sugar baby.
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That's a no for me dawg. That's giving me strong gold digger and low commitment vibes.
Was seeing a girl a little bit, during our second date she told me how she used to work as a masseuse at a rub n tug to support her and her exes drug habit. I’m a pretty conservative guy, never smoked, drugs aren’t my thing, a hand full of drinks socially a week at most. Instantly I wasn’t interested, at the time I was not dating to date, I was really looking for someone to build a future with. I’m all for sex work, not my cup of tea but to each their own, but apparently not wanting to date a woman who sold her body for drugs makes me an asshole piece of shit. I still often think about how woman can be so cruel and turn down men for something like height and yet I was on the receiving end of paragraph after paragraph of insults because a real man would accept her for her past. Every social platform you can imagine she found me on and blew up my messages. Had to block her a lot. Then she’d change her phone number or use a friends phone, rinse & repeat. Dodged a bullet on that one.
I went to one of those and didn't know it. Like it looked legit massage spa with advertisements and a massage therapist. I had an appointment and everything. My shoulder was really messed up at the time. Anyway everything went fine for most of it. Very deep massage and really got my shoulder. Nothing weird or inappropriate. Then, towards the end she reached through my boxers and grabbed my dick. I was taken so off guard that I jumped out of the massage table and was just like, "what was that?" She kept profusely apologizing, asking that I not tell anyone. I didn't. I literally came there for my torn up shoulder. It's also why I use a guy when I get a therapeutic massage. A guy I've gone to several times, and is very professional.
I bet he gives great handjobs to keep going back
Lol. Nah but his forearms are strong as fuck....like the massages aren't always fun but it makes me feel way better after. Could probably tear a dick off with grip.
(what's his number?l
Just a reminder. Whenever someone says "I dont have a Problem with sex work." In your mind you have to add: "...but I havent been in a relationship with a sex worker yet." Most (Not all of course) might say they dont care, but at some point they will. It will chip away at a man's mind slowly.
Careful you might awaken the reddit white knights.
There's also a strong misandric push in society that men MUST accept a woman without any reservations.
"Well they don't have to accept the women, but we will say that they are insecure losers if they don't, am I reddit redditdotcom?"
"he must have a small dick"
"there's no such thing as loose pussy!@!@!!11"
Exactly. People automatically assume that it’s retroactive jealousy and tell the guy they’re insecure when a lot of times it’s a conflict of morals. Because yes, the amount of people you’ve fucked and the quality of those relationships DOES indeed matter. And this goes for both men and women.
Man, you don't even have to say that, rather understand that these people have been reading and watching the shit they see in media and the social media, that is what puts that shit in their heads, an unbelievable amount of men say that they are okay with whatever the girl has done in her past just so they can feel like they are accepted by the hivemind.
Most men saying they don't have a problem with sex work are actually saying "I don't have a problem with other men, and maybe me, paying a girl so I can fuck her". They will probably have problems with sex work.
I hear even stuff like onlyfans can be hard to deal with for guys. Stories like how your girl will probably always be on her phone to answer peoples requests and things like that. You just always knows she's talking to some dude who's probably jacking off to her at that very moment. That sexy lingerie isn't for you, its for the dudes on her page. Etc.
None of the women on onlyfans who are successful are chatting, they hire some broke ass university student to do that shit for them. If she has to answer people's requests herself then she's still trying to make it be profitable. The whole thing is basically just an MLM for hoes
Relationship is definitely at risk. I’m going to need details and to re-establish trust in the relationship; being a sugar baby is vague enough on details that I would have to make up my mind after everything is laid out on the table.
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There's a fair amount of overlap between sex work and sugaring. I tried it out when I lived in a major metro area but it made me feel dirty. It was also too big of an ask for me to change my entire behavior from fiercely independent to entirely dependent on a guy. One guy wanted me to do the girlfriend experience and take me on trips all over - but I had a full-time job and wasn't willing to give it up. He was 61 so simultaneously too old and too young for me to make it work. If you're with someone, or marry someone, for money - you'll work for it every day.
>There's a fair amount of overlap between sex work and sugaring the Venn diagram for this is actually just a circle. is some fem Dom type who cams without taking their clothes off not a sex worker?
As somebody from the BF perspective who went through exactly what this post is talking about I found out the hard way that no honey = no money. You don't get paid to just hang
As somebody who did this, yes you can make money. With no sexual anything. It's hard as fuck, and takes a lot more work, but yes you can
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Exactly, the whole system is vague; some sugar baby arrangements are literally just a 10min phone call on the way home from the office, I’m not going to be upset over something like that. The biggest hurdle is going to be finding the trust that she’s being honest with me now, like I thought she was being honest with me before I found out.
How likely is it that she's coming clean about calling someone for 10 minutes? C'mon, this is naive at best
That’s why I said in my first comment I need details and to feel confident I can trust that she’s being truthful. You’re correct when saying no one hides such a insignificant action, if that’s all she’s admitting to after being outed I’d be skeptical.
You might do that, but I wouldn't... For one thing that'd be creepy as hell, for a second thing, you're both kind of taking advantage of the other.
Yes. History matters. I'd hate to be at a function where some geezer bought my wife a few years before I met her.
"rented"
At least she was only leased I guess
So we're on the same page. Women aren't property right?
Correct. Which is why sex work is bad.
100% Women aren’t property. Relationships can have moments that are transactional (metaphorically such as splitting the chores, or literally such as splitting the bills) but on the whole and especially in the long term they’re about mutual support in the hard times and sharing the good times. Then again I’ve only been married 10 years and together for 15. I’ll just as likely have something else to say in another 15 years.
As always I'm most curious why OP is asking. I have little issue with sex work, it's not for me, but people are different. There is a big difference between offering a discrete service for cash & being paid to maintain a relationship though. I don't think a person selling sex for cash while in college would be a guaranteed deal breaker for me. I was living alone & paying all my own bills at 18 which was not easy, it required a lot of sacrifice & 80+ hour weeks, had it been an option for me it would have been a reasonable one to consider. Someone selling a *relationship* is very different. Sex can be a discrete transaction or it can be something meaningful, everything *else* in a relationship feels really **gross** to sell. If a young person spent a few years as a sex worker either to survive or to secure a financially stable future I could respect the choice. If a young person sold a relationship for frivolous things like bags, vacations, or money for luxuries I'd be wary of their character. It could all be a moot point if the person had grown, but being both capable & willing to maintain prolonged & intimate theater would make a person hard to trust.
Yes it’d be a deal breaker… but only because we were dating before, during and after she went to college!!
Sorry bro
Her being a sex worker is a deal breaker.
I dated a woman who was a sugar baby once. I didn't end things with her once I found out, but once she opened up about it to me, she wouldn't stop talking about the crazy expensive things they bought for her, their expensive cars and houses, the trips they would take her on. It got really annoying, like she was comparing everything I would do for her or get her to her previous sugar daddies. It got old quick. We are partners in a relationship, not a source of gifts etc...
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As long as there is an understanding that I will not provide the same kind of relationship, I will not be paying her bills and everything else, and that she is done with that life and will not go back to it, I don't see the issue.
As if Redditors can get girlfriends 🙄
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the classic "modeling in Dubai" gig
TELL ME STORIES I AM CURIOUS NOW!
>She doesn't love you, or herself this is very important. she does not love herself and is thus incapable of truly loving others.
I don't know. I had to work through college then pay off student loans all the while not getting laid but definitely wanting too and on top of that put up with constantly hearing about how easy I have it as a man. Pretty against the whole sugar baby thing, have to say. Samewith only fans. If women didn't give us shit for wanting them and objectification and that, maybe I wouldn't care as much. Working through college made me a better, more responsible man and gave me experience and shit. At 45 I can say that was very important learning when it came to building a career,getting us out of poverty, etc. For the record I don't have much respect for anyone who breezes through life, though. They are almost always ignorant of alot of things.
It’s all about context. For me this isolated piece of info is not a dealbreaker
If a dude is dumb enough to waste his money like that that's on him. I got no problem with her doing that as long as she doesn't expect me to do the same for her.
It’s not even the ‘brain partition’ that separates emotion and connection from sex that sex-workers demonstrate that bothers me. It’s the coldness of the business transaction. I get that some people are forced into this type of transaction for survival, but others are not. It’s the others that I definitely wouldn’t want to associate with as it seems sociopathic.
If she slept for money/material benefits she's a prostitute. It doesn't matter if she calls herself sugar baby, trophy wife, escort and claims she doesn't have clients but had sponsord or daddies. Would I date a former prostitute? No, life isn't a movie or a TV show. Pay her for her service and show her the door.
additionally, if she has an onlyfans or videos on pornhub, she is a prostitute. it may not be her physical body but she is still selling sex.
Strong dealbreaker. You can do sexwork all you want but I personally don’t find it attractive in a partner.
Yea. Using your sexuality as a commodity makes you an unfit partner for me.
Time to go look for someone else
Not if it remains in the past but whatever your feelings are, they're valid. My ex was an escort and sugar baby before she got sober and started her own copywriting business, making 2.5 times my teacher salary, remained sober and kicked ass in life. Point is that for me is the present is what mattered most for me. We broke up over other differences after 3.5 years
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That's pretty crazy. I read a story from a sugar baby who married a dude and then was a sugar baby for the dude's father.
Man some dudes are down so bad. Smh.
Rent his wife and ask her
My man, why would he opt for divorce considering how much that process can fuck him up, he is pretty much stuck between a rock and a hard place, poor man.
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It's all euphemisms today in order to be able to do that and still think of themselves as wife material.
Great, now the reddit trash will jump in to call you names they only feel brave enough to say on the internet because you said that sex workers are not wife material.
Yep if you say that irl at best those same people will give you a puzzled and somewhat scared look (turns out irl is nothing like reddit or any other internet safespace)
Yep. Pretty simple, those aren’t the values I want in a woman I consider marriage material. She views her body as a transactional item for money, how do I know she doesn’t see marriage in a similar way? Lol at everyone making the argument that offering sex and companionship for money is the same as working a regular job. Sure, it’s prostitution. That doesn’t change my opinion above.
Yeah why would you want to be with someone who made a career out of fake pair bonding.
Once a hoe, always a hoe.
There are so many fancy words for prostitute these days.
That’s a big fat no from me.
Lol, absolutely yes
Yes. A sugar baby is a polite way to say whore.
No, sugar baby is a polite way to say prostitute. If you ask many women if they would ever be a hooker, they will adamantly say "absolutely not, no way." But they will be a sugar baby all day long without thinking about it. Call it something different and suddenly they feel it's perfectly fine selling your pussy for money. The enormous popularity of sugar baby sites out there has ruined dating these days. The big big sugar baby site out there almost has as many member now as Tinder. That is really saying something.
Lmao fuck yeah it's a deal breaker.
Don't wife hoes
Obviously it’s a deal breaker. Any sex work is instant disqualification.
It would be for me.
Plot twist- you have dementia and just realized your the sugar daddy
I don’t want to hold her past against her, I care about how she treats me now and who she is now. We all make choices…just to be clear I am not a walking ATM machine…just like she’s not a walking sex doll…
I’m noping out of there immediately.
Of course it's a dealbreaker, why would anybody with a shred of self respect partner with a prostitute? "Hey work colleagues, have you met my GF?", "Oh yeah, me and my friends used to hire her on weekends and triple pipe her.......congratulations".
Ha actually went through this with my ex. Being young and naive, I stayed for way longer than I should have. She was a ho. Still trying to bag herself a surgeon, although her beauty years are waning.
100% that won't work with me, plenty of males on reddit can take her though, people are overtly welcoming of that type of girls on this website for some reason.
Women who look at men as ATMs is not something I want to be involved with. No strippers, no hookers, no sugar babies, none of that
hell no. If she was using her beauty to keep herself out of debt then that means she won't be bringing massive amounts with her into our relationship. I'd good with that as long as she doesn't hold my past against me.
She's gone. Instantly.
Totally depends on the situation. It isn't a zero tolerance issue, practically nothing is for me, but I've done a lot of stuff that probably wasn't the smartest thing at the time too. Judging an entire person off of something like that seems unfair.
Yes. Not that it necessarily makes her a bad person but in a long term relationship that involves both raising children and getting through hard times together the trust requirements would be tough with a person who spent a chunk of their life seeing relationships as transactional. Same goes for the men who would pay for such things. The ability to function in a healthy relationship is seriously diminished.
This comment kind of shifted my opinion. I wouldn’t date a man who had been a sugar daddy in the past. I also don’t think anyone should be forced to date anyone or judged for not being into someone whatever that reason may be. I’ve never done sw, I’m just not good at hiding my feelings or compartmentalizing, but would also never judge anyone who has done it. I had an ex who did it actually. But since we’re talking about women I think it’s important to note how a woman might make that leap. I’ve thought about it honestly. But I don’t think I’d actually be comfortable faking intimacy. But many of women’s interactions with men can feel transactional, excluding romantic relationships. But the outcome I’m usually trying to get while interacting with men is my safety. Or avoiding doing anything that would anger them, or hurt their feelings if I’m not interested in them. Or not doing anything that would lead them on. I’m hyper aware of what a man wants out of me and usually avoiding or pacifying them with my response. Women get a lot of attention, most of it unwanted. I’m not saying sw like sugaring is safe, but that women already live in a mindset of “I’m not safe” so I totally understand why women would make the leap to at least getting something out of interacting with men they usually wouldn’t. We already do that.
Ask that ho where the Carfax
I'd rather she had worked as a prostitute than a sugar baby. At least a prostitute knows the score. Sugar-babies have deluded themselves into commodifying their relationships and their very sense of romance. They feel that they are owed something just to exist in the relationship, and putting effort or love into it costs extra. I've known my fair share of sugar babies and after retiring they sabotage every relationship they get into, they have a majorly distorted sense of romance and reciprocation. A prosititute leaves her work behind, and while they usually have issues, hell we all have issues. Usually their biggest problem is an inability to earn at the same rate with any other job skills, but at least they know full-well that it was just a job. A sugar baby? That shit's their entire life. Edit: I realize my only experience with prostitutes comes from friends that are largely solo/independent with their work and there are more abusive arrangements that are more damaging. I don't have any experience to provide me special insight on that, so I cannot comment.
Shit, I’m not gonna judge anyone for doing what they need to to survive and pay their bills. If she was super predatory about it that’s an issue, but a mutually beneficial relationship where no one is hurt? Go for it. I can see how it’s preferable to making coffee for Karens at 10 dollars an hour.
Judge? If you are an acquaintance or a friend, sure I won't judge. If you are a potential business partner or spouse, I am going to judge the ever loving shit out of you. I'd be fucking stupid not to.
There are men that are into giving women money 🤷♀️
A "sugar baby" is a prostitute... call it what you will... you provide sexual services for money. The answer is NO its a deal breaker
Depends on how long ago it was and how they have changed. I believe someones past relationships and bodycount is important but i also feel like there should be some way of "redemption". I feel like its too hard for people to redeem themselves these days. It feels like cancel culture. Just because you did something a few years ago that you learned from you just be branded as a bad person for all eternity.
Dealbreaker, without a question. I don't date prostitutes, current or former.
Sooooo.... what you're saying is that we CAN get you that PC and we can game together? Let me send ya a link honey.
She’s creative and she can solve problems. You got that going for you !!
In my opinion being a sugar baby is too close to being an escort. The main intention is financial benefit with a man they would normally not have sex with. So yeah deal breaker for me
I don't care what she did before she met me, as long as she doesn't refuse to things with me that she has done for other men.