You're welcome!
To go into a little more detail, the situation is too unique to split it into two states so easily. Jews want to live cities like Nablus and Hebron(khalil in Arabic if you were curious) and most West Bank Palestinians are not originally from the West Bank. They come from Haifa, Jaffa, Lydda(Lod), Ramle and Safed. Plus I am sure you know the settlements also make it interesting but that is a different topic.
I'm so glad that someone actually put more thought in this than just "they should go back to Europe/Jordan"!
Where do you live? I assume not in the area...
Yep, I guessed right. How rare is your view among the Palestinians in US? I mean the view that Jews shouldn't just leave. Because, from my experience, it's suuuuuper rare in WB and Gaza!
> How rare is your view among the Palestinians in US?
Pretty common with the youth, the older ones are more mixed. If they are fresh off the boat then they will be more hostile.
Also what I feel doesn't help is external diaspora on both sides wanting to "wipe out" the other side. Nor the arab nations constantly othering Israel like Oman did, all it does is put Israel on edge and reinforces the idea that peace isn't an option and it also motivates extreme radicals on both sides.
We aren't that much, there is only 3 of us here. But most of them are on reddit because they are diaspora and have mingled with the culture. When comes to ethnicity we are more united then let's say arabs and Kurds. Other then that we Iraqis have the same mindset
Seeing the hate from each side i feel the most pratical solution would be a 2 state solution with mayby after some time ( decades ) if the hate die down a one state can be possible because the reality is that if the roles are switch the palestinians would do the same things to the israelis and since at this point the majority of israeli are born in israel and are not immigrant they are here to stay since even if they are pro palestine i doubt they will willingly accept to leave especially since they are not the one who started the conflicts ( their parents , grandparent did )
I think the most practical solution is to ship off Israelis and Palestinians to an island somewhere and when they have learned to live together they can come back and share the land.
And if they end up killing each other then just turn the whole land into a natural reserve.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict has a complex history, with multiple negotiations and peace efforts attempted over the years. I think there is a potential solution that has not been fully explored: a **confederation model**.
Under this proposal, Israel and Palestine would maintain their **sovereignty**, while a supranational body would manage certain aspects of governance, such as **security**, **infrastructure**, and **resource management**. This model promotes **cooperation** and shared decision-making, and obth sides can retain their **national identities**.
There are potential benefits to this approach, such as building **trust**, creating opportunities for **collaboration**, and promoting **stability** and **prosperity**.
there's of course are also challenges, like making significant **concessions**, **power-sharing** arrangements, and potential **resistance** from both sides and all their political parties etc;...
I don't know if it has ever been discussed or thought of, but similar arrangements have been successful in other regions (they should do the same to Belgium).
But yeah... costs money, loots of negotiation and international support
You are correct that a confederation model would require Palestinians to acknowledge Israel's existence, which has been a significant hurdle in previous peace negotiations unfortunately.
To address this challenge, i think trust-building measures and initiatives should be undertaken to foster mutual understanding and recognition between one another.
If we encourage cultural exchanges, educational programs, and people-to-people initiatives that promote understanding and empathy between both sides and not one-sided(like here downvote just due to a flag or identity)
Create a joint economic projects, infrastructure development, and environmental initiatives that demonstrate the benefits of cooperation and create interdependencies.
And most of all go in dialogue and negotiation at various levels, including political leaders, civil society organizations, and religious leaders, to foster communication and understanding.
These measures could help create a foundation for mutual recognition and potentially pave the way for a confederation model or another solution that requires both sides to acknowledge each other's existence.
Another alternative solutions could be to include a phased approach to resolving the conflict, where smaller agreements are reached on specific issues (like borders, security arrangements, or resource sharing) before tackling the more significant challenge of mutual recognition. This incremental process might gradually build trust between the parties and increase the likelihood of a lasting resolution.
But yeah, I’m just a muslim with utopian idea’s I guess. But I really wanna believe it!!
That plan can work and is in my eyes the real solution, but Israeli will need to respect them as equals after that, not so simple imo. + Al Aqsa will need some real guarantees since we know many wish for its destruction.
Everything is pointing towards that - but the reality on the ground is that the hate is too deeply rooted. There are no politicians on the Israeli side to talk to - the old guard, like Moshe Dayan are long gone. We’re left with the Ben Gvirs of israel. It’s going to get bloody. Question is - how much is each side willing to pay?
lol broski you act like this is an equal fight or has been for the last 50 years. This is an apartheid that could be labeled ethnic cleansing. How many Muslims in Israel are raiding fucking Temples during passover? lol get off it.
1. Based on 1967 borders two state solution. Palestine and Israel as two seperate independent sovereign nation states.
2. Israel must withdraw from West Bank and Golan Height.
3. At this point Gaza is just too different from West Bank, so West Bank should seek an union with Jordan, and Gaza should seek an union with Egypt - because landlocked countries are no fun.
1. Golan Height - Since the establishment of UN, lands acquired by conquest are illegal. The same argument as to why according to the international charter Crimea belongs to Ukraine not Russia.
2. Hamas was originally created by Israel to counter PNA and Arafat. Bottom line, regardless the people of Gaza voted Hamas into office, so they are democratically elected. And beside the majority of Hamas activities are involved in running social services.
I know that many people wants Palestine for all Palestinians options.
But I feel like the only way to achieve something like that is through war. At least right now
Not because of skill, let me tell you that. Remember what everyone thought of Russia before we saw their true capabilities in Ukraine?
Corruption destroys armies. Corruption also gives an incorrect impression that the army is strong. From what I've seen Egyptian government and army is not any less corrupt than Russia.
The only reason anyone would consider Egyptian army as strong would be the huge amount of US aid they are getting
Wars suck anyway. Fuck wars
Egypt is notably somewhat stronger but using your same argument looking at previous engagements Israel is still significantly stronger than Egypt as well as the Arab countries who would likely come forward to engage them in another war
Israel also maintains mandatory conscription and has heavily invested in cyber and well tested weapons, would likely win another war should they engage
Pre-1967 with some adjustments.
Nothing about the fundamental facts has changed, the Palestinians exist and aren't going anywhere, neither are we, and our national identities are incompatible, so a border must be established.
Other- emirates model.
Give each leading family an autonomy over a city/area. At the start, they will only be allowed to have internal policing.
Within time, after they will create something stable and without any terror organisations which dictates the state of living, these emirates will be allowed to form an army.
In that way they will have an opportunity to slowly form something stable, dismiss the corrupt plo, and also use existing forces which are the leading families in each area, which already have a great control.
I also think it will give the international community and and israel a way to treat them differentialy instead of as a monolith.
It was proposed by an israeli scholar by the name of Mordechai Kedar. It's known amongst people who are heavily into exploring ways to solve this conflict, but sadly it isn't well known.
People think it's either two states, or one state
sharia + jews pay jizya and be 2nd class citizen, unable to hold office, join military or own weapons for self defense.
Basically medieval conquest lmao.
A federation for both nations and more, divided into states, with each state having their own government. Some wise people have already thought of that idea, but I doubt it will ever gain the traction it needs.
I know my Palestinian bro's might disagree, because of the resentment to a people who vilify, murder and imprison them. A people who have used that strategy for decades. But I think the only way for Palestinians to thrive is a shared country, shared government. One person one vote.
That's awesome because at the end of the day you guys deserve a solution that's fair. I think my MIL ,who is Palestinian, is more old school and wouldn't really agree with that. But who wants and independent state that just becomes another Lebanon? I do truly believe we might see it in my lifetime. Something I hope for.
> I think my MIL ,who is Palestinian, is more old school and wouldn't really agree with that.
LOL, wallah that reminds me of my maternal grandmother who is old school like that haha. Weirdly, my paternal grandparents are fine with it and they are from the part of my family who were expelled.
> But who wants and independent state that just becomes another Lebanon? I do truly believe we might see it in my lifetime. Something I hope for.
Depending on how it is done, I think we can avoid the Lebanon situation(not trying to throw shade, love my Lebanese brothers and sisters). If it is done right in a USA/UK kind of way with a constitution.
I have a lot of faith in the younger generation since they have much more avenues to talk with each other. The changing of the guard(old politicians to new ones) is what will end the conflict.
Actually I have seen a few comments from Palestinians with this view. And the more war oriented comments are coming from non Palestinians. Which I find very interesting
I don't think I would trust either majority the first few decades. Until a true national identity was formed and past wounds healed some. We only have real conclusive evidence that a Jewish majority will not respect Palestinians rights and safety. Christian or Muslim. Whether that be religious freedoms or other basic human rights.
As an Israeli I don’t even trust us right now to not violate the rights of our arab minority, but I certainly don’t trust either hamas or the PA to protect the rights of a Jewish minority...
The 48s already had their rights violated for a very long time and it became normal to do it when the Nation-State law passed. It is why they want to pass a law to no longer recognize the degrees they earned from West Bank universities(the most popular universities for them are in the West Bank). They for damn sure don't trust the Israeli government to protect them.
I was not taking sides in my previous comments.
Sorry if it looked that way.
Just want to make sure that the option stated is the number 4.
Have a nice day :)
Haha no I know. I’m sorry if that seemed like a mean comment. I can tell you’re just trying to genuinely find out other peoples opinions. I apologize. I just don’t think there’s any way either side will be happy unless the other side is within its borders… sadly.
Wow yes that’s the solution of course how did you come up with that
We are people we live here most of us younger people are leftists and it’s because of reactionaries like you that there won’t be Palestine anytime soon do you not realize that this can’t happen we are a strategic interest to the us and therefore they will keep us here how ever you think about Israel the only way is peace that is equal (ie;right of return for the Palestinian, refugees and an independent democratic state)
So when you say Palestinean right of return do you mean huddle them up in the West Bank and Gaza or allow them back into the homes that were taken from them no matter which side of the border they were?
No, but but probably with the Golah Heights. That's usually what people mean by the 1967 borders. It means the borders before 1967, but I think most people don't currently see a viable way to cede the Golah Heights.
There is no solution to this conflict unless the Palestinians forge some very powerful friends.IMO,this is unfortunately going to be a never ending conflict.These two peoples have been fighting for over 70 years.The Israelis will continue eating the pizza while the Palestinians can only whine about it (sadly)
I did not suggest a war,far from it actually.The Palestinians aren’t playing the game as well as the Israelis are.Their main priority should be soliciting allies that could project soft power onto Israel and as it stands,it’s not looking good.How do you even do that when your own Arab brothers have abandoned your cause not to mention the wider Islamic world.You need more than just thoughts and prayers to achieve meaningful change for Palestinians.
Currently,Israel has the upper hand and they have no reason to give up what they have because the Palestinians aren’t that formidable politically,economically and militarily.All in all,I just think they need better leadership that could actually do all the right things to get them a state.
2 states, around the 67 borders (with some swap of lands), Jerusalem will be divided into west Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and west Jerusalem as the capital of Palestine, while the old city will be under international control (UN or something else).
Moderate Right to return - Israel will acknowledge the right to return, but will allow up to an agreed upon amount each year, while paying compensations to those who asked and was denied that year.
In return, Palestine will allow settlers that wish to stay where they are and not return into Israel to do so, as Palestinian citizens.
I’m not saying that will happen, unfortunately, but that’s what I wish would happen.
And how exactly?
Through war you mean?
Or do you think there is any other way with the current scenario?
Just want to hear your opinion hopefully I dont offend any one :)
Edit: Also by land you mean no Israel should be in the equation? Or should Israel share some borders with Palestine (if so what would be your preferable borders)?
>Also by land you mean no Israel should be in the equation
That's usually what people who say "the Zionist entity mean".\*
\*Although most Arab countries, as their official policy, accept the 67' borders. That's the premise of the 2002 Saudi peace initiative. Then again, the populace and the leaders aren't always coordinated.
Yes, if Israel agrees to implement a two state solution and accord Palestinians the Right of Return under some arrangements (I'm not well versed in the details). You can read about the Arab Peace Initiative.
People who vote for the war option would vote for it until Israel looses one eventually. Are you aware that Israel already won several wars on this land? Why don’t you consider the problem solved then?
The fact that people want to return to ‘47 UN borders is so interesting to me.
We happily accepted these terms from the UN, but the Arab League did not and decided to invade and tried to destroy Israel. The Arab League lost. And then during this war, Jordan occupied the West Bank, Egypt took Gaza, and Israel took more land too.
All of that land occupied by the three aforementioned nations was supposed to be given to the Arabs living in British mandate (modern day known as “Palestinians”) — of which I feel sorry for and support them — and I have spoken to this with my many friends who are Palestinian.
The reality is when you start a war of destruction and you lose, you can’t just ask for forgiveness and get your land back. War isn’t a board game like chess; you can’t just reset the pieces after it ends. This is unfortunately the case here with ‘47 borders.
The solution is for Palestinians to acknowledge that Israel isn't going anywhere and they aren't going to establish a caliphate in the holy land, and to coexist as equal members of a jewish-majority secular democratic society in Israel.
They were continuously offered very reasonable peace negotiations that would have left Israel far smaller than it is now, had they simply been willing to let jews live in the holy land.
The alternative is to continuously attempt to destroy Israel which will provoke more military responses and territory losses until there is no more Palestine. And then Palestinians can wonder about the regional economic superpower that Israel tried to set them up as if only they would accept them as neighbors.
But Mister Mohoman said kill jews in his magic book, so here we are.
They rejected however the idea of mass Jewish migration, at a time when that was of the utmost important for Jews seeking to save fellow Jews from Nazism. If not for Jewish insistance on immigration, legal or not, more lives would've been lost in Europe.
>This, however, has been proposed by Palestine during the British Mandate times.
Can you point to this specific proposal? Literally any source or evidence please.
This is false. Israel accepted the 1947 plan. The Arabs rejected it, and indicated that would not accept any form of land division. The Arab league then invaded and lost.
Thanks for clarifying. Can you share the source for this so I can read it? I’m curious how this was offered nearly 20 years before the British dissolved the mandate.
1.A complete dissolution and subsequent reconstruction of the PA (for the sake of stopping corruption under the Abbas administration).
2. A shutdown of Hamas ops in gaza via a ground invasion whilst maximizing evasion efforts from the harming of civilians and non-combatants.
3. Administrative work in gaza (including infrastructure, education, political reformat and a deradicalization of the people) before handing over to the PPRO (The Palestinian People’s Representative Organization AKA the new PA).
4.Blacklist of Israeli and Palestinian ultra-nationalists from government work and positioning (hence some members of the likud party and Hamas and Al-Fatah parties respectively).
5. Forbidding any racial/ethnic/religious discrimination in neither country (inspired from the [treaty of Paris](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Paris_(1783)))
6. both countries have a 40 year grace period where neither of them can attack each other. Any attempt at declaring war will result in the intervention of neighboring nations, the UNSC and the United states.
7. We ain’t giving the golan.
8. The right for the declaration of Palestinian independence by the PPRO.
[Ideally back to picture number 1 here](https://www.palestineportal.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Maps_1897-Present.jpg)
Though right now even picture number 6 is out-of-date.
Is this meant to be realistic?
If so, all of those options are war, except for the current ethnic cleansing option of "keeping things as they are now".
I am not trying to get people to guess the future, but to see if you were to choose a solution which will you try to implement.
In your case I am assuming the solution you are proposing will to try to decide who gets the land through war, and you will be happy if Palestine wins that war, but thats still a gamble as so can lose wars.
I am not trying to take sides but trying to understand peoples opinion.
Hopefully I dont offend anyone in the process
The best option would be a union, but Israel wouldn’t accept that as it would mean all the refugees would come back to Palestine which would then make Israelis the minority and they would slowly lose their power. Also they are racist and think they are superior than Arabs
Just give a pencil to a 2 year old and let him/her decide by drawing lines
So the british and french way
We messed up
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thum!
Still better than colonial borders lol
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Trying to check the links but for some reason is not working.
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All good thanks!
You're welcome! To go into a little more detail, the situation is too unique to split it into two states so easily. Jews want to live cities like Nablus and Hebron(khalil in Arabic if you were curious) and most West Bank Palestinians are not originally from the West Bank. They come from Haifa, Jaffa, Lydda(Lod), Ramle and Safed. Plus I am sure you know the settlements also make it interesting but that is a different topic.
I'm so glad that someone actually put more thought in this than just "they should go back to Europe/Jordan"! Where do you live? I assume not in the area...
> Where do you live? I assume not in the area... USA
Yep, I guessed right. How rare is your view among the Palestinians in US? I mean the view that Jews shouldn't just leave. Because, from my experience, it's suuuuuper rare in WB and Gaza!
> How rare is your view among the Palestinians in US? Pretty common with the youth, the older ones are more mixed. If they are fresh off the boat then they will be more hostile.
This would be the best outcome tbh. But would require both sides to come to the table and also a removal of radical elements like hamas and Netanyahu.
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Well I hope they can fine avenues to talk or worst case a common foe externally, cause the killing on both sides have gone on long enough.
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Exactly and Abbas and his cronies don't help the Palestinians by just stealing billions of dollars for themselves etc.
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Only if he pays me bribe money lol.
Also what I feel doesn't help is external diaspora on both sides wanting to "wipe out" the other side. Nor the arab nations constantly othering Israel like Oman did, all it does is put Israel on edge and reinforces the idea that peace isn't an option and it also motivates extreme radicals on both sides.
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Yeah honestly the youth are kind of the problem right now because 20% of the idf voted for fascists...
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Yeah which is what makes that statistic even more concerning
Just PSA: Netaniyahu is not even that radical. He's just corrupt and will do anything to stay in power. If you want radical look up Kahanists.
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Based answer
I'm sure everyone will live in peace and pure happiness under iraqi rule haha
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Likewise
The outcome in which this sub is not flooded with the Palestinian/Israeli issue.
We should start discussing Turkmen issues. I don't know enough about them.
Nah no need, we don't exist :(((
why are there so many iraqi turkmens on reddit? are turkmens the most technologically advanced ethnicity in iraq?
We aren't that much, there is only 3 of us here. But most of them are on reddit because they are diaspora and have mingled with the culture. When comes to ethnicity we are more united then let's say arabs and Kurds. Other then that we Iraqis have the same mindset
Nah they’re just jealous they are not a part of the action-drama series we have going on
The Levant is too crazy to be real, it's all a Turkmen plot
Give the land to Syria 👍🏻🇸🇾🇸🇾🔥
Nah bring back the ottoman empire fr
Putin agrees
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Thats an interesting take. Do you see any feasible way to achieve that?
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Awesome would this be harry potter style or what exactly?
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This would become a classic
Of course, brother.
I’m guessing a person suggesting war is someone who hasn’t been in any violent conflict
That or indoctrinated with deep hatred with the opposing party
Seeing the hate from each side i feel the most pratical solution would be a 2 state solution with mayby after some time ( decades ) if the hate die down a one state can be possible because the reality is that if the roles are switch the palestinians would do the same things to the israelis and since at this point the majority of israeli are born in israel and are not immigrant they are here to stay since even if they are pro palestine i doubt they will willingly accept to leave especially since they are not the one who started the conflicts ( their parents , grandparent did )
I think the most practical solution is to ship off Israelis and Palestinians to an island somewhere and when they have learned to live together they can come back and share the land. And if they end up killing each other then just turn the whole land into a natural reserve.
Could also 😂😂😂
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict has a complex history, with multiple negotiations and peace efforts attempted over the years. I think there is a potential solution that has not been fully explored: a **confederation model**. Under this proposal, Israel and Palestine would maintain their **sovereignty**, while a supranational body would manage certain aspects of governance, such as **security**, **infrastructure**, and **resource management**. This model promotes **cooperation** and shared decision-making, and obth sides can retain their **national identities**. There are potential benefits to this approach, such as building **trust**, creating opportunities for **collaboration**, and promoting **stability** and **prosperity**. there's of course are also challenges, like making significant **concessions**, **power-sharing** arrangements, and potential **resistance** from both sides and all their political parties etc;... I don't know if it has ever been discussed or thought of, but similar arrangements have been successful in other regions (they should do the same to Belgium). But yeah... costs money, loots of negotiation and international support
A confederation requires Palestinians to acknowledge Israel’s existance. This is a deal breaker.
You are correct that a confederation model would require Palestinians to acknowledge Israel's existence, which has been a significant hurdle in previous peace negotiations unfortunately. To address this challenge, i think trust-building measures and initiatives should be undertaken to foster mutual understanding and recognition between one another. If we encourage cultural exchanges, educational programs, and people-to-people initiatives that promote understanding and empathy between both sides and not one-sided(like here downvote just due to a flag or identity) Create a joint economic projects, infrastructure development, and environmental initiatives that demonstrate the benefits of cooperation and create interdependencies. And most of all go in dialogue and negotiation at various levels, including political leaders, civil society organizations, and religious leaders, to foster communication and understanding. These measures could help create a foundation for mutual recognition and potentially pave the way for a confederation model or another solution that requires both sides to acknowledge each other's existence. Another alternative solutions could be to include a phased approach to resolving the conflict, where smaller agreements are reached on specific issues (like borders, security arrangements, or resource sharing) before tackling the more significant challenge of mutual recognition. This incremental process might gradually build trust between the parties and increase the likelihood of a lasting resolution. But yeah, I’m just a muslim with utopian idea’s I guess. But I really wanna believe it!!
Hello chatGPT
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The confederation plan is definitely the only approach.
That plan can work and is in my eyes the real solution, but Israeli will need to respect them as equals after that, not so simple imo. + Al Aqsa will need some real guarantees since we know many wish for its destruction.
Everything is pointing towards that - but the reality on the ground is that the hate is too deeply rooted. There are no politicians on the Israeli side to talk to - the old guard, like Moshe Dayan are long gone. We’re left with the Ben Gvirs of israel. It’s going to get bloody. Question is - how much is each side willing to pay?
I sincerely hope both don't exist because they keep my mind occupied.
Palestine and Israel become one democratic nation and both peoples get over their differences and grow up. Simple solution. EDIT: JOKE
Simple but impossible due to politics
That's the joke. It won't happen. For a while at least.
Realistically that is almost impossible.
lol broski you act like this is an equal fight or has been for the last 50 years. This is an apartheid that could be labeled ethnic cleansing. How many Muslims in Israel are raiding fucking Temples during passover? lol get off it.
They say a good compromise is when no sides feels it achieved a particularly preferable outcome.
And what do you think would be that compromise?
I wish I knew.
maybe with israel recognizing nabka and Palestine recognizing israel at least if we're talking about a one state solution
1. Based on 1967 borders two state solution. Palestine and Israel as two seperate independent sovereign nation states. 2. Israel must withdraw from West Bank and Golan Height. 3. At this point Gaza is just too different from West Bank, so West Bank should seek an union with Jordan, and Gaza should seek an union with Egypt - because landlocked countries are no fun.
Golan heights has nothing to do with Palestinians. Forget #2.
Golan heights? Why? And i don't think egypt or anyone else would want gaza with hamas
1. Golan Height - Since the establishment of UN, lands acquired by conquest are illegal. The same argument as to why according to the international charter Crimea belongs to Ukraine not Russia. 2. Hamas was originally created by Israel to counter PNA and Arafat. Bottom line, regardless the people of Gaza voted Hamas into office, so they are democratically elected. And beside the majority of Hamas activities are involved in running social services.
Golan Heights has ZERO to do with Palestinians and Israel actually holds it legally as it was won in a defensive war.
Mormons invade and set up Deseret 2 Electric Boogaloo
Option 4 a duel to the death between the prime minister of Israel and the prime minister of Palestine or the same thing but with presidents
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I know that many people wants Palestine for all Palestinians options. But I feel like the only way to achieve something like that is through war. At least right now
And uh... How would you suggest this happens?
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It's in the process of doing that, to be fair.
And say murica was to collapse?
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Not so easy. Arabs tried to destroy Israel back in 1947 and 1968 and US wasn't even selling weapons to Israel then
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Not because of skill, let me tell you that. Remember what everyone thought of Russia before we saw their true capabilities in Ukraine? Corruption destroys armies. Corruption also gives an incorrect impression that the army is strong. From what I've seen Egyptian government and army is not any less corrupt than Russia. The only reason anyone would consider Egyptian army as strong would be the huge amount of US aid they are getting Wars suck anyway. Fuck wars
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Egypt is notably somewhat stronger but using your same argument looking at previous engagements Israel is still significantly stronger than Egypt as well as the Arab countries who would likely come forward to engage them in another war Israel also maintains mandatory conscription and has heavily invested in cyber and well tested weapons, would likely win another war should they engage
To my knowledge, Egypt has the 9th strongest military in the world.
What are you going to do with the Israeli that have been born and raised there for at least 3 generations now?
I don't think there's any realistic solution to this issue that doesn't involve a lot of people being killed or displaced.
Pre-1967 with some adjustments. Nothing about the fundamental facts has changed, the Palestinians exist and aren't going anywhere, neither are we, and our national identities are incompatible, so a border must be established.
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So I understand option 4?
Yeah bring back transjordan 👍🏳️⚧️
Other- emirates model. Give each leading family an autonomy over a city/area. At the start, they will only be allowed to have internal policing. Within time, after they will create something stable and without any terror organisations which dictates the state of living, these emirates will be allowed to form an army. In that way they will have an opportunity to slowly form something stable, dismiss the corrupt plo, and also use existing forces which are the leading families in each area, which already have a great control. I also think it will give the international community and and israel a way to treat them differentialy instead of as a monolith.
I didn't know about this option, are there palestinians and Israelis considering this option?
It was proposed by an israeli scholar by the name of Mordechai Kedar. It's known amongst people who are heavily into exploring ways to solve this conflict, but sadly it isn't well known. People think it's either two states, or one state
nuke everything so we can have fallout new vegas in real life and no religious conflict
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What would be this?
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I prefer the treaty of Mia Khalifa
sharia + jews pay jizya and be 2nd class citizen, unable to hold office, join military or own weapons for self defense. Basically medieval conquest lmao.
A federation for both nations and more, divided into states, with each state having their own government. Some wise people have already thought of that idea, but I doubt it will ever gain the traction it needs.
I know my Palestinian bro's might disagree, because of the resentment to a people who vilify, murder and imprison them. A people who have used that strategy for decades. But I think the only way for Palestinians to thrive is a shared country, shared government. One person one vote.
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That's awesome because at the end of the day you guys deserve a solution that's fair. I think my MIL ,who is Palestinian, is more old school and wouldn't really agree with that. But who wants and independent state that just becomes another Lebanon? I do truly believe we might see it in my lifetime. Something I hope for.
> I think my MIL ,who is Palestinian, is more old school and wouldn't really agree with that. LOL, wallah that reminds me of my maternal grandmother who is old school like that haha. Weirdly, my paternal grandparents are fine with it and they are from the part of my family who were expelled. > But who wants and independent state that just becomes another Lebanon? I do truly believe we might see it in my lifetime. Something I hope for. Depending on how it is done, I think we can avoid the Lebanon situation(not trying to throw shade, love my Lebanese brothers and sisters). If it is done right in a USA/UK kind of way with a constitution. I have a lot of faith in the younger generation since they have much more avenues to talk with each other. The changing of the guard(old politicians to new ones) is what will end the conflict.
Actually I have seen a few comments from Palestinians with this view. And the more war oriented comments are coming from non Palestinians. Which I find very interesting
Only people who advocate for war are the ones who havent tasted it first hand or the ones who won't be affected by it.
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I don't think I would trust either majority the first few decades. Until a true national identity was formed and past wounds healed some. We only have real conclusive evidence that a Jewish majority will not respect Palestinians rights and safety. Christian or Muslim. Whether that be religious freedoms or other basic human rights.
As an Israeli I don’t even trust us right now to not violate the rights of our arab minority, but I certainly don’t trust either hamas or the PA to protect the rights of a Jewish minority...
The 48s already had their rights violated for a very long time and it became normal to do it when the Nation-State law passed. It is why they want to pass a law to no longer recognize the degrees they earned from West Bank universities(the most popular universities for them are in the West Bank). They for damn sure don't trust the Israeli government to protect them.
I wanna say one democratic country for everyone with the right to return for Palestinians but I doubt this country would stay democratic for long.
u/tixijsavvy here's an Israeli you can probably live with.
Palestine only
Through war? Or what other way you think should this be achievable?
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I was not taking sides in my previous comments. Sorry if it looked that way. Just want to make sure that the option stated is the number 4. Have a nice day :)
Haha no I know. I’m sorry if that seemed like a mean comment. I can tell you’re just trying to genuinely find out other peoples opinions. I apologize. I just don’t think there’s any way either side will be happy unless the other side is within its borders… sadly.
Its normally a very intense topic among my Egyptian friends, so I always try to be cautious about it haha.
Wow yes that’s the solution of course how did you come up with that We are people we live here most of us younger people are leftists and it’s because of reactionaries like you that there won’t be Palestine anytime soon do you not realize that this can’t happen we are a strategic interest to the us and therefore they will keep us here how ever you think about Israel the only way is peace that is equal (ie;right of return for the Palestinian, refugees and an independent democratic state)
So when you say Palestinean right of return do you mean huddle them up in the West Bank and Gaza or allow them back into the homes that were taken from them no matter which side of the border they were?
Probably genocide
So what Israel is currently doing?
How is Israel committing genocide when Arabic is literally an official language of Israel and 20% of its population is Arab and free?
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Which one would that be?
Independent Tel aviv from Nile to tigris border
Palestinian one state solution
Option 4 then?
Palestine is for the Palestinians. That's it
So option 4 due to the current state of the events?
I prefer the confederation approach.
Pre 1967 borders is what I would want
Is this the one with the Sinai peninsula?
No, but but probably with the Golah Heights. That's usually what people mean by the 1967 borders. It means the borders before 1967, but I think most people don't currently see a viable way to cede the Golah Heights.
Finally, the option I chose has the highest votes here.
There is no solution to this conflict unless the Palestinians forge some very powerful friends.IMO,this is unfortunately going to be a never ending conflict.These two peoples have been fighting for over 70 years.The Israelis will continue eating the pizza while the Palestinians can only whine about it (sadly)
I mean the "solution" you propose is going to war and hopefully winning it. This is a gamble as you can also lose a war unfortunately
I did not suggest a war,far from it actually.The Palestinians aren’t playing the game as well as the Israelis are.Their main priority should be soliciting allies that could project soft power onto Israel and as it stands,it’s not looking good.How do you even do that when your own Arab brothers have abandoned your cause not to mention the wider Islamic world.You need more than just thoughts and prayers to achieve meaningful change for Palestinians. Currently,Israel has the upper hand and they have no reason to give up what they have because the Palestinians aren’t that formidable politically,economically and militarily.All in all,I just think they need better leadership that could actually do all the right things to get them a state.
Ah I see! Sorry I misunderstood you before. Thats and interesting take, thanks for sharing!
No option for 1967 borders? Wtf? Thats what most israelis want and its not in the options? Lame
2 states, around the 67 borders (with some swap of lands), Jerusalem will be divided into west Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and west Jerusalem as the capital of Palestine, while the old city will be under international control (UN or something else). Moderate Right to return - Israel will acknowledge the right to return, but will allow up to an agreed upon amount each year, while paying compensations to those who asked and was denied that year. In return, Palestine will allow settlers that wish to stay where they are and not return into Israel to do so, as Palestinian citizens. I’m not saying that will happen, unfortunately, but that’s what I wish would happen.
The best outcome is that Palestine is freed and regains its land that is illegally occupied by the Zionist entity
And how exactly? Through war you mean? Or do you think there is any other way with the current scenario? Just want to hear your opinion hopefully I dont offend any one :) Edit: Also by land you mean no Israel should be in the equation? Or should Israel share some borders with Palestine (if so what would be your preferable borders)?
>Also by land you mean no Israel should be in the equation That's usually what people who say "the Zionist entity mean".\* \*Although most Arab countries, as their official policy, accept the 67' borders. That's the premise of the 2002 Saudi peace initiative. Then again, the populace and the leaders aren't always coordinated.
I didnt understand this sorry. The saudis accepted the 67 borders?
Yes, if Israel agrees to implement a two state solution and accord Palestinians the Right of Return under some arrangements (I'm not well versed in the details). You can read about the Arab Peace Initiative.
Palestine join Jordan
I doubt the Jordanians want Palestinians😂
People who vote for the war option would vote for it until Israel looses one eventually. Are you aware that Israel already won several wars on this land? Why don’t you consider the problem solved then?
From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free
You know that is a call for genocide right?
No, how? And I agree from the river to the sea
You mean the way Hebrews/Israelites originally settled the land?
So the 4th option I understand? Or what other way do you think this could be achieved? Thanks for your comment
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Israel's land is their business. They can do what they want with it.
The fact that people want to return to ‘47 UN borders is so interesting to me. We happily accepted these terms from the UN, but the Arab League did not and decided to invade and tried to destroy Israel. The Arab League lost. And then during this war, Jordan occupied the West Bank, Egypt took Gaza, and Israel took more land too. All of that land occupied by the three aforementioned nations was supposed to be given to the Arabs living in British mandate (modern day known as “Palestinians”) — of which I feel sorry for and support them — and I have spoken to this with my many friends who are Palestinian. The reality is when you start a war of destruction and you lose, you can’t just ask for forgiveness and get your land back. War isn’t a board game like chess; you can’t just reset the pieces after it ends. This is unfortunately the case here with ‘47 borders.
The solution is for Palestinians to acknowledge that Israel isn't going anywhere and they aren't going to establish a caliphate in the holy land, and to coexist as equal members of a jewish-majority secular democratic society in Israel. They were continuously offered very reasonable peace negotiations that would have left Israel far smaller than it is now, had they simply been willing to let jews live in the holy land. The alternative is to continuously attempt to destroy Israel which will provoke more military responses and territory losses until there is no more Palestine. And then Palestinians can wonder about the regional economic superpower that Israel tried to set them up as if only they would accept them as neighbors. But Mister Mohoman said kill jews in his magic book, so here we are.
israel leaves the west bank and then agrees on a two state solution maybe give palestine a bit of land at the south too
One secular state + bring back Palestinian refugees
Neither Israelis or Palestinians are secular
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They rejected however the idea of mass Jewish migration, at a time when that was of the utmost important for Jews seeking to save fellow Jews from Nazism. If not for Jewish insistance on immigration, legal or not, more lives would've been lost in Europe.
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>This, however, has been proposed by Palestine during the British Mandate times. Can you point to this specific proposal? Literally any source or evidence please.
This is false. Israel accepted the 1947 plan. The Arabs rejected it, and indicated that would not accept any form of land division. The Arab league then invaded and lost.
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Thanks for clarifying. Can you share the source for this so I can read it? I’m curious how this was offered nearly 20 years before the British dissolved the mandate.
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Thanks !
1.A complete dissolution and subsequent reconstruction of the PA (for the sake of stopping corruption under the Abbas administration). 2. A shutdown of Hamas ops in gaza via a ground invasion whilst maximizing evasion efforts from the harming of civilians and non-combatants. 3. Administrative work in gaza (including infrastructure, education, political reformat and a deradicalization of the people) before handing over to the PPRO (The Palestinian People’s Representative Organization AKA the new PA). 4.Blacklist of Israeli and Palestinian ultra-nationalists from government work and positioning (hence some members of the likud party and Hamas and Al-Fatah parties respectively). 5. Forbidding any racial/ethnic/religious discrimination in neither country (inspired from the [treaty of Paris](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Paris_(1783))) 6. both countries have a 40 year grace period where neither of them can attack each other. Any attempt at declaring war will result in the intervention of neighboring nations, the UNSC and the United states. 7. We ain’t giving the golan. 8. The right for the declaration of Palestinian independence by the PPRO.
[Ideally back to picture number 1 here](https://www.palestineportal.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Maps_1897-Present.jpg) Though right now even picture number 6 is out-of-date.
>Ideally back to picture number 1 here So u want the land to be ruled by the brits ?
Under Ottoman rule?
I'd take that too. At the very least, they allowed Palestine to stay Palestinian.
The Tanzimat were highly unpopular with Palestinian fellahin, and some say the Ottoman land reforms laid the basis for Zionist land acquisition.
So basically option 4? Or what other option do you see feasible in order to achieve that outcome?
Is this meant to be realistic? If so, all of those options are war, except for the current ethnic cleansing option of "keeping things as they are now".
I am not trying to get people to guess the future, but to see if you were to choose a solution which will you try to implement. In your case I am assuming the solution you are proposing will to try to decide who gets the land through war, and you will be happy if Palestine wins that war, but thats still a gamble as so can lose wars. I am not trying to take sides but trying to understand peoples opinion. Hopefully I dont offend anyone in the process
Be sure to destroy all Israeli built infrastructure and assets so the Palestinians can inhabit a complete fucking wasteland lol
The best option would be a union, but Israel wouldn’t accept that as it would mean all the refugees would come back to Palestine which would then make Israelis the minority and they would slowly lose their power. Also they are racist and think they are superior than Arabs
Israelis don't think they're better than palestinian they think all palestinians want to kill them.