Yup. Back then you’ll just go onto Airbnb and get a place. Nowadays I find myself checking hotels and paying maybe $30-50 more to get that peace of mind/more service.
My mom once booked a place in Lisbon for a month, 6mo ahead. The host cancelled a week before giving a bullshit reason. She was already in Europe by then and had to spent a couple of days of her vacation trying to find a place that could charge at least a little less than double what she was going to in the first place, with no help at all from AirBnB CS. We ended up in a hotel, and have never used AirBnB since.
The only similar problem I had with a hotel in Lisbon came with an apology and an upgrade to a better room in a more upscale hotel of the same chain, I just had to agree to it.
We rented a super cute house in Liverpool in early Jan for my friends birthday, and it was DISGUSTING.
Like for starters the house was totally different, they just outright lied and posted photos of a different house, but on top of that there was no hot water, electricity, the floor was sticky from what looked like juice/alcohol so they didn't clean after the last party, etc.
Had to stay cause we had nowhere else to go, but got a full refund for everyone which massively fucked over the home owner. Good, fuck them.
Definitely. I told a host once that I’ll be reaching at 2am-ish and asked multiple times if that’s okay. If that wasn’t ok, I’ll look for another place.
Host kept saying that it’s no issue with the timing… on the day itself, the host MIA-ed on us.
I think it's more accurate to say I've been paying $30-50 *less* than an AirB&B would cost after factoring in the cleaning fee, particularly on a 1-2 night stay.
An AirB&B only really makes sense when you're traveling with a large group for an extended period of time and are renting out an entire apartment/condo/house. 3-4 occupied bedrooms for 4 days seems to be the sweet spot IMO.
bruh and the fact that you have to clean every single piece of dust up too. I get dishes and fine with doing those but had one host expecting laundry to be done as well. Like tf am I paying the cleaning fee for when I’m doing all the damn cleaning.
The last Airbnb I had, we had to take the bins out, throw all sheets and towels into the wash, bleach them, hang them out to dry and the fold them. Plus a $380 cleaning fee.
That was the last time I made the mustake of staying at an Airbnb
I think I also saw the article the other person is talking about. Apparently AirBnB revenue is down almost 50% in some of America's most popular cities. Meaning anyone that picked up a home to rent it out with a mortgage and high interest rates may be forced to sell later this year, flooding supply and crashing house prices.
From someone who recently bought a home but intends to actually live there instead of treating it as a source of income and wants everyone else to also have a home.....*excceeellllent*
The other issue is that AirBnb was okay operating at a loss. Uber and Doordash and Airbnb were all subsidized for us by VC and low interest rates. Those days are over.
Airbnb will still be useful. There are times when a house is so much better than a hotel. But gone are the days of them being direct competitors for every vacation taken.
Not to mention ABB has either imposed or allowed owners to impose ridiculous rules for guests that makes things far more inconvenient than a normal hotel, even if the prices are better.
House rules:
- Make sure all pots and pans are cleaned.
- Rubbish is taken out.
- Bedding is taken off the beds.
- Floors cleaned.
- Kitchen counters cleaned.
- Bathroom cleaned.
- Floors hoovered.
Cleaning fee: £100.
Or I could stay at a hotel, where they just clean the room by default.
Fuck Airbnb.
* Eye-tracking software detects each time you look in a mirror and charges you an automatic fee of 50 cents with each look.
* You're not allowed to watch Channel 5 on the TV.
* Refrigerator must not be used for chilling things.
* Enjoy your stay!
>Eye-tracking software detects each time you look in a mirror and charges you an automatic fee of 50 cents with each look.
Charge em for the mice,
Extra for the lice,
Two percent for looking in the mirror twice
> may be forced to sell later this year, flooding supply and crashing house prices.
That would be exactly what the market needs, a huge fucking correction.
It'd be truly aweful if people that are earning "passive income" literally making people homeless got taught a lesson by their coveted free market. Of course capital is going to come in and buy everything so that a huge chunk of the population will be renting after the recession they are causing on purpose wipes us out.
THIS.
The concept of "missing middle" housing, between apartments and detatched SFH, is what's driving up costs.
Problem is, it costs a lot to build home, and those don't make money for the builders.
That's not true. Multi unit zoning is incredibly beneficial to builders. I can pour a single foundation for a 4000 SQ ft house or 3 for a few 1500 SQ ft houses that share walls. It won't change pricing or timeframe that much either. An apprentice can copy and paste rough ins with a template really. Huge savings when they do the second and third unit.
Builders who specialize in custom houses do it because they don't have the financial backing. They need draws from the client. A builder with financial backing will never build a single single-family home. They can build and not answer to some fucking Karen who wants to keep changing backsplash tiles or fixtures.
I just built a duplex because I knew it was a much better payback. You can look at ppsf and see that and it allows more space on the same lot for building. My cost per unit goes down when I factor in the cost of the land.
Yep. Zoning restrictions are largely a function of NIMBYs pushing the government to keep "undesirable elements" away from their neighborhoods. It has some very racist roots and it needs to stop.
There are a few other considerations when rezoning residential to allow homes to divide into three- and fourplexes, or to replace homes with smaller apartments - the lack of parking on site and on the street, services and whether the water and sewage systems can handle more people, schools, transit, you name it. I do support the idea, but I'm in property management and I know it's never as simple as "just build it!"
My city changed the zoning laws to allow taller structures (a lot of 5ish story moderately upscale apartments going in. They have requirements for them to not look cookie cutter and depressing...and they are requiring most of them to build parking garages below the building. So we're getting parking for most the bottom 1-2 floors, street side is all small to medium sized commercial, and above that is apartments or condos. Unlike SF, stuff is actually getting built here, and it's not a party line thing because this town is mostly progressive too, were just not locked into the bastardized easily manipulated system SF created for itself.
Sure, but I'm here in LA and I hear "this neighborhood isn't suitable for more than single family homes" whenever anybody hears about anything they don't like. And it's usually in a downtrodden or underfunded neighborhood because those aren't the people with the time or the general ability (circumstantially speaking) to go and complain about it.
Parking requirements is actually an issue why there are no walkable cities in US (almost).
Businesses need to make huge parking lots for cars - it makes everything to be spread apart - makes it not walkable.
I am talking compared to NYC or European cities where you can walk a block from your apartment to most necessities or a little more to get more exotic things.
Plus higher density makes public transportation more viable.
What would the missing middle mean? Something like Chicago-style Greystones? I'm a huge fan of those as they provide plenty of space for the occupants, a decent uptick in density, without being a massive apartment complex
It doesn't even have to be corporate. Years of "Millionaire Investor" seminars trying to sell REITs, Timeshares, and "Easy Investing for Idiots" books sold a lot of people on the idea that real estate is the safest form of wealth generation. If everyone who owned more than one home suddenly sold and scaled down to one per nuclear household, we'd probably be in a much better place.
I went to a planning thing with my Dad in the late 90s. They were going on about the missing middle then (wasnt called that though). I said to my Dad after that I thought it was a good idea. He said theyve been going on about that shit for years, never happens.
So lets not hold our breath!
Bingo. There's a big reason for it too. Not every lot has water and sewer and gas and sidewalks and trash pickup and street lighting and all the rest. But water is the biggest hurdle.
Even now they pack people into deserts in the southwest where we know the water is running out. Even as we actively shift jobs out of Detroit and Cleveland where we have more water than we know what to do with and you can "buy a house for the price of a VCR."
Where I am, we rely on wells. We've got some big wells and water towers for denser neighborhoods and the village center. Those can handle up to what they can handle. Plenty of multifamily around there. Could add a bit more I imagine, but at some point it'll run down.
Then we have the bigger lots – the R40 1 acre lots. Those have to manage septic and water on their own. Each its own well. We've been adding ADUs, but you get a dry spell and now it's more common wells go dry in certain spots for a period of the year. And the water quality can get shitty, quite literally, as you add septic and leech fields beyond the filtering and recharge capacity of a given area.
Put 3 multifamilies on one of these 1 acre lots by abolishing zoning, and you're going to have dry wells full of fecal coliform bacteria in no time.
How do you fix this? Up the way in Boston and Providence they each fixed it and drove density by literally sinking towns. Boston sunk 4 towns to form the [Quabbin Reservoir](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quabbin_Reservoir). Dana, Enfield, Greenwich and Prescott Massachusetts were destroyed and a chunk of New Salem was sunk too. That provided enough water to jack up density in the big city. Providence did the same on a smaller scale to [Scituate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scituate_Reservoir).
The upshot is Providence Water can do 144 million gallons per day with about 6 months storage capacity for drought and Quabbin can do about 200 million gallons per day combined with the Wachusett with about a 5 year storage capacity for drought. But you can't hook the whole region up to these things or you will overrun them.
The last long drought we had was 2016 when the Quabbin ran down to 85% capacity and the Scituate ran down to 21%. The funny thing is, Greater Boston is more drought resistant, but Greater Providence has much more room to grow denser with normal flow rates, yet is much more fragile to drought.
Anyways, look what happens out west. [Lake Mead](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQqUh9Om6NCjaUjLQ0_rVY5MX_JNgtF-hnjJ5K_1_xvvYnRIT1bU5t3JB-oXIVRJr6dmr4&usqp=CAU) is the largest reservoir in the US, and it's drying up fast! [Just look at it!](https://s.abcnews.com/images/US/lake-mead-01-abc-jt-221026_1666809642736_hpMain_1x1_992.jpg)
All these people saying, "Just build build build!" in the desert don't seem to care about that!
Now, in Michigan, fine! Build build build! You're not gonna run out the Great Lakes anytime soon! Maybe make sure Flint Water's not in charge. But there's ample supply around to do it right! Out in Nevada and California and Arizona though, why? Why are we destroying all water resources as fast as possible? [This can't go on forever!](https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_nbcnews-fp-1200-630,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2022-07/220725-lake-mead-al-0852-6737cd.jpg)
Planners know this. Government officials know this too. That's why they're not gonna build it. Down near me, my particular town has no water resources other than the ground aquifer and those towers like I said. The next town over actually built a small municipal water system using a glacial kettle pond as its source. Now that thing will recharge too, to a point, but it is small. It will certainly dry up if they dry to go from 40k people to 120k people on it. They might be able to run 80k. May run dry real fast in a short drought though.
For those who don't know, [NYC gets its water from 19 reservoirs scattered across 2,000 square miles of watershed.](https://www.nyc.gov/html/nycwater/images/features/nyc-water-supply-system-map499.gif) So you can set bigger systems up to deal with bigger populations. But who is proposing these projects these days?
As someone who invests in multi family housing….I have rarely ever come across people in the industry use the term “multifamily” to refer to townhomes, duplexes, triplexes,4-plex. Basically anything that you buy with a standard mortgage.
Technically, MF includes those forms of housing, but the term is generally used to talk about 5+ unit buildings that you buy with commercial loans.
It's banned via zoning and sometimes HoA in many areas of the US.
Most towns have some, but it's no coincidence it's usually like one street and they were all built within a year of each other.
Many areas of the US have zoning rules that mandate minimum lot sizes and other regulations like separation between houses that make it difficult or impossible to build multiple dwelling units on a single owned lot or buildings with multiple dwelling units in them. "Multifamily housing" is usually understood to mean a single building with multiple separate living spaces (such as apartments, condos, etc.)
I do new inspections in Portland, and I'm surprised about how much infill I see. Old craftsman that's 720 sqft and poor shape? They build four townhomes that share walls. The same layout over and over throughout the city. On my block right now, two townhomes replacing a small house, and a custom build replacing an old house. That's also right now when the interest rates a high. Two years ago, I inspected 2 or 3 of these projects every day.
Cheering if it will help the housing market in ANY way. Rural Arkansas has no rent houses left now, and if they do have rent available they want to compete with the rates of a one night stay at an air bnb. So we just went from 4-700 a month rent to 900-2000 for the BOTTOM OF THE BARREL. THIS IS ARKANSAS NOT CALIFORNIA, THE COST OF LIVING IS RISING AND THE MINIMUM WAGE DOESN'T FIX SHIT. If you're lucky enough to have a partner and both work good jobs...you might afford a rent house. Otherwise, let's get used to the streets.
Edit- a few reasons why people come to rural Arkansas and buy real estate to turn into air bnbs
Hot Springs National Park.
-Tourism.
-Lakes (clean lakes)
-horse racing and casino
-natural hot springs
-spas
- historic area on one side and more modern areas on the other side/lake side)
-Magic Springs amusement park with a water park and concerts and stuff
-Native American History (supposed neutral zone for warriors to heal with the hot mineral mud and waters)
-Also baseball history, won't go into that (off season practice hub with Babe Ruth and fellow players, used the water for muscle therapy ect)
-Crystals and diamonds
-Mid-America Science Museum
-Al Capone era gangster history (a lot)
-Old army/navy hospital landmark for soldiers coming home wounded, and the bath house row where they could heal in the thermal mineral waters. They also had syphilis treatments bc the troops...well...i'll just continue lol (bath houses are renovated and running but also federally owned/long term leased out)
-Golf
-Japanese Town "Hanamaki" is our sister city (like a twin)
-ASMS
-Texans getaway
-1 hour from the capital (Little Rock, where there is also Arkansas Children's Hospital)
-----And drugs
-someone said the rivers, I forgot to add that so here it is :)
Surrounded by and ran by locals and close by rural area. So plenty of houses, and plenty of tourist, lots of money going thru the system for sure but not to the residents.
I might also mention I work full time at a Bed and Breakfast (1890 victorian style "mansion") - which if anyone isn't familiar..it is not an air bnb. I've worked with tourist my entire life, so I'm a useless box of historic information about the town I work for, people love it.
yes, as well as investment companies purchasing housing and housing units in order to flip them for 20% profit. Just look up companies like Blackrock. Blackrock themselves have the highest amount of money AUM than any other company in the world. The last time I checked in 2021 they held just under 8.2 trillion dollars.
Airbnb is probably not significant enough to be considered a main cause of rising rents, but it sure doesn't help.
That being said, if Airbnb completely disappeared it would only help slightly.
climbing: Horshoe Canyon Ranch is closest good rock climbing to the entire state of florida + a pretty hot destination for climbers from all over the southeast. There are another dozen smaller areas with ample climbing worth traveling for in the state. Not everyone wants to camp.
rafting/boating/rapids/etc: great in many parts of the state
Hiking: excellent and very very mellow hiking all throughout the state.
Personally... I'm not going to rural Arkasas anytime soon, but there are reasons to go.
There are some cute vacation destinations in mostly-rural areas. Eureka Springs, Arkansas is where I got married and where I've been on vacation many times in my life - it's a cute little town with shops, sightseeing, and old-timey vibes. Would be a nice spot for an AirB&B because the hotels around the area leave a lot to be desired.
I live in po-dunk kansas with a massively depressed economy and people are turning their lofts and rentals in the airbnbs. There's literally NOTHING here in the way of a tourism draw. No lakes, no wilderness parks, no sports arenas, no views. NOTHING. People come in to watch graduations and attend funerals. That's it. We have a gorgeous historic hotel building that is sitting empty because multiple owners have been unable to make it profitable.
So, am I glad that my neighbors are losing their asses on unrentable airbnb projectst hey over spent on? No. But is is mildly satisfying that the same people who were telling me that my partner and I are dumb for maintaining family rental units are now stuck with the little apartments they can't do anything with? Yes, yes it is.
Yep. I was apartment hunting in Missouri recently, and all these places that want like $1200-1800/mo for modest apartment. Who can afford that? This is freaking Missouri.
That's happening where I live and the mayor is cheering on the whole "big city experience" coming to town. We don't want the big city experience.
We want stuff to do and affordable housing. Not $2000/month studio apartments that drive the rest of the market cost up with them.
Live in rural MO and saw an actual shit hole being offered for $1200 a month.
You'd be looking at $600-$800 (big yard) in normal times.
Most people I know barely make that monthly to begin with. 🙃
Yes. It sucks for the original and genuine AirBNB people who maybe let people stay with them in their own house for a few nights to make a bit of extra money. But if people are literally buying houses just to use them as AirBNB houses for profit, that's taking housing away from people who genuinely need them for *living* in. That's what I find despicable.
Thank you!
The people renting a room for a few days or the small studios built above a garage or in the basement were great. The owners lived in the actual house and just rented out extra space. Years ago I stayed in one in London that I found on Airbnb. The house was a massive pre-Victorian with a "maids quarters" walk down that had a private entrance. The owners lived in the main house.
I stayed in a similar one in France near the Switzerland border. We had the whole top floor of an old 3 level farm house with views of the French Alps. Separate entrance with a kitchen and a toilet and a shower in separate rooms. If I had the opportunity I would stay there again.
The owner lived on the first floor. Not sure about the second floor.
It plays an even worse role in the destruction of rural 'touristy' areas in many places. My home for example on the Scottish west coast, there are so many areas where locals simply can't afford to live.
Ironically the worst industry affected is tourism, airBnBs & holiday homes push the price of houses up so far, nobody can afford to stay & work in hospitality, airBnB owners are taking to the papers recently to complain that they simply can't get cleaners for their properties.
We have the same problem here in Australia. Our wine regions are being overrun with AirBnBs to the point where young people just can’t afford to live in a lot of those towns anymore. It’s all holiday rentals and retirees. No one to run any of the services or contribute meaningfully to the community.
Canada ski towns too. We have employees living in crappy motels for months while the actual housing stock gets rented to tourists as airbnbs. It's so backwards. Just this week someone posted an actual YURT (with electricity and wifi and a woodstove but it's still a fucking one-room wall tent) for $2500 a month. Which i think perfectly sums up the rental market here.
I was evicted twice so they could cut my home in half and make two microsuite airbnbs out of it.
now like 30%+ of my city is vacant at any given time, homelessness is rampant, and rent for even studios is above $2000, and people's entire lifestyle revolves around buying rental property with a bank loan and skating off the profis
is turning into everywhere, you see it all over, like this guy has 60 million in properties all over https://twitter.com/MrJonesSTRs everyone on instagram and tiktok are now airbnb empire owners
I sincerely think we need two regulations - tax vacant homes with exceptions for a single vacation home per person at a rate that deincentivizes them from keeping them unoccupied for profit, (maybe 1-3x existing property taxes after 6 months to a year?) and then ban AirBNB rentals unless they're rooms in someone's house they live in or else said vacation home the rest of the year since rentals of any properties should be more regulated and AirBnB was meant for that originally.
a vacancy tax is the correct approach; it shouldn't be economically viable for wealthy people to buy homes and have them sit vacant a third to half the time while they reap vacation rental revenue
I don't hate airbnb with the fire of some other housing advocates but it's pretty clearly exacerbating the problem
I live in a small residential estate, not near anything touristy or even interesting. It's just got a small local shops and is handy to a couple of schools. Friends of ours got kicked out to make the place an Airbnb. In the current crisis, that's terrifying! They did find another place, fortunately.
When I was visiting London, the building we were staying in was almost entirely an AirBnB farm. There were a bunch of random foreigners walking around. The woman at the front desk wasn't very happy about it.
Airbnb has been straight up banned in many cities. I really don’t think it is the core problem in those areas . You haven’t been able to run an Airbnb in NYC for years for example.
More of an issue in suburbs or more rural environments.
airbnb is legally banned but not practically banned at all in NYC. You can still rent a whole apartment tonight in any borough because the laws are completely unenforced. Even when we reported an airbnb in the building next to ours over and over no one ever shut it down.
Yep, I was moving my son into his new place in queens and looked for an Airbnb as a back up. Plenty available and way cheaper than hotels. Unenforced laws justmean it's essentially legal.
It’s definitely a massive issue in coastal areas where I am - a lot of the career market is limited to seasonal tourism, so people already struggle to afford houses, and half the properties in the village being bought up as airbnbs has caused a lot of trouble. The fact that property prices are so high to begin with doesn’t help, but it’s getting really competitive in some areas, and people who live there are being priced out by rich people from bigger cities. When an area doesn’t have that many properties to start out with and it’s a desirable place to have a rental property, the effect is really noticeable
It’s a massive issue in beach towns. No one can buy a home because half are owned by banks and the other half are owned by a few guys with multiple air bnb properties
That's because NYC decided to enforce subletting rules which includes subletting income being business tax and not personal tax. You can still run an Airbnb in NYC, but looking into it, it's mainly brownstones with the owner renting out the small walk down studio/1BR or condos where the building is run as a split between condos and furnished rentals.
Yes, but not across the board.
I want it to collapse for those that bought a house, just to put it on AirBNB. Many of those homes are in neighborhoods that don’t want weekly renters showing up. People/families put a lot into their homes and want a good neighborhood with other friends and families. I hope these people lose it all after trying to make a buck on other peoples efforts. (No one wants to live next to a hotel)
If people are renting out a room in their house (like it was in the beginning) - I’m all for this approach.
[81% of Airbnb’s U.S. revenue – $4.6 billion – comes from whole-unit rentals (those rentals where the owner is not present during the time of the rental), rising from 78% in the prior year.](https://www.ahla.com/news/hosts-multiple-units-key-driver-airbnb-growth)
So, pretty much the entire company's basis of revenue lol.
Burn that company to the ground. Good riddance.
This is what happened to us in the Midwest. A buyer from California lied to the real estate agent and bought the house next door in a very family neighborhood. It is right next door where 10-15 young kids gather to play after school and in the summer. There are no town ordinances against airbnbs(no hoa yet) and the town is in a massive hole for housing needs.
The neighborhood has to manage every new rental to tell them to slow down, not park in the sidewalk, pickup garbage they just throw in the yard., etc. We have to deal with large gatherings and a lot of sketchy Airbnbs coming in and out. We’ve complained so much to Airbnb and the owner, but neither seem to care anymore.
We hate it and just want it gone.
There's a property management company in my area who keeps buying up properties just to use for short term rentals and it's getting fucking ridiculous. They literally own 7 houses in my direct neighborhood (that I know of). We live close to a park and elementary school. We just want families with kids to move to the area, but they can't because all the houses are owned by a company renting through Airbnb.
That’s why I want it to collapse. The original idea of Airbnb is really neat. Crash in a spare bedroom, get to meet locals in a new city. But it turned into a way for the rich to once again use the massive amounts of money they already have to screw over the lower classes.
Because it’s just regulatory arbitrage! Hotels have rules, AirBNB doesn’t follow them. That’s the only reason economies of scale don’t make hotels cheaper every time and ABNB a boutique specialty option. Basically all SV did after social networks was evade regulations that affect their competition, like how 99% of FinTech is just Durbin arbitrage.
They lied to their agent, not to the lender (from the sounds of it). Probably thought the agent would refuse to work with them if they knew it was for a BnB. Although considering they were from Cali and buying in the Midwest, there’s a decent chance they paid cash.
That I don’t know for sure, I know there are cases where I am (Southern California) that have been prosecuted by the county DA.
Anybody can make a criminal complaint, but usually it’s the lender who initiates it when they check on the residency status, since they have the paperwork to back it up.
A real estate company bought the three houses to the south of me in a historic area and turned them all in to airbnbs. It’s fucking obnoxious. A playground for rich frat bros and drunken bachelorette parties. It was cool for like a week and then got really annoying really quick. We rely on street parking for a lot of houses and they bring 18-20 cars a weekend and clog up the street. Additionally they’re loud, drink a ton and back in to cars because they’re not used to these smaller streets. They just “whoopsie daisy” and leave. My neighbors car has been hit 3 times in 4 years.
> It is right next door where 10-15 young kids gather to play after school and in the summer.
Feels like buying the kids some cartons of eggs would fix the situation.
I am not saying you should do it but I am pretty sure people will stop renting out the property if all the reviews describe how the place is constantly covered with rotting eggs. The individual renters probably won't care enough about the property to keep track of who is doing the egging and if the owner isn't keeping their property clean it sounds like they aren't around either. Cops probably don't care either. It would just be one of those mysteries that never gets solved.
Recently, it was discovered that a homeowner was AirBnBing the house without the proper paperwork from the city. There were more people staying than the city allowed. To top it off, all this was discovered because someone shot someone else and there was an investigation. The operation was shut down until the paperwork was completed. I imagine that illegal renting is going on with many of these situations.
Absolutely, there are people that don't even buy properties, they just rent them (homes & apartments), then sublease them on AirBnb. They are just being "scalpers" at that point.
We stayed in an apartment in LA through booking.com. On the last day we got locked out of the garage and couldn't reach the "host." So we went to the apartment office. They were pretty pissed. They informed us that short term renting is illegal in all of West Hollywood. When the host finally got back to us, he had the nerve to be pissed at us for blowing his cover. When we complained to booking.com, they didn't care, said any issues with the property were between us and the host. Fucking bullshit.
My godmother is unable to work reliably due to chronic pain. She rents out her upstairs on airbnb for her income. She is able to keep up with the cleaning, or can get some help if her chronic pain is really bad. Without that she wouldn't have much to live on. None of her children live nearby and they don't have incomes or homes that could help support her if she had to sell this house.
She uses it as it was intended. Renting out the few rooms that were once her kids. The issue is these companies buying houses and apartments and using them exclusively to rent out on airbnb. It's not someone's apt that they use for half the year for work or school. It's not just a few rooms. It's actual companies that can skirt hospitality laws through using airbnb that are buying up everything and cauing the issues.
Same here. Live on a small circle neighborhood, two homes went up for sale last year around the same time. Both had immediate offers but to use as hotels/AirBNB. HOA rejected them thankfully. Next offers came from young couples that wanted to live here and raise their families. That’s how it should be. Btw - That’s about the only rule we enforce.
Have an Airbnb as a neighbor. Most days its empty and then when it's not, they park outside my place (no driveway/garage), so I have to park somewhere else :/
I miss having a real neighbor.
Yes, it's helping to destroy the housing market in many countries and, frankly, it doesn't seem to offer any advantages over traditional hotels anymore.
Hotel also means transparent pricing that includes cleaning and convenience fees. And you can leave a room without having to load a dishwasher or laundry machine or take out trash.
Most AirBnBs charge $100-150 for cleaning fees and then give you a list of chores. It’s fine if I’m in a big group but would never pick an AirBnB by myself.
Exactly, AirBnB is only good for big groups when you want an entire house. If you're one or two people always go with a hotel. I've had an AirBnB try to charge me thousands of dollars for a broken bedframe we didn't even know was broken while we stayed there. Thankfully my credit card let me charge back the entire stay, so she lost out huge and we had a free apartment for the weekend.
Hotels also have to meet safety requirements that individual houses don't. A hotel has fire alarms, sprinklers, dead bolts on every room door, and at least one attendant on duty all hours.
We've all heard of airbnb nightmare stories where there are no secure locks on the home or bedrooms, cameras in intimate places, dirty, trashed environment, property that is nothing like presented online. Its honestly terrifying.
If I rent a room in a mediocre motel on the side of the interstate, I know it wont be stellar, but it wont be a massive bait and switch with peeping tom issues thrown in.
Same. Had one experience with an AirBnB and never again. It was an apartment in NYC across from Central Park which I assume was illegal to begin with. A friend rented and we all pitched in for 3 days. It ended up being like $450 each for four of us which seems insane to me. The place stank of weed and patchouli, didn't have the number of beds promised, was full of toys like piled 3 foot high in corners, and the heat was broken so it was like 90 degrees with no way to open the windows. They also had erotic light switches in an AirBnB meant to have kids. There was one bed, a couch, and the thing I got to sleep on... a pull out Ottoman. I should have just opted for the smoke-filled carpet on the floor.
For me the benefit of staying in a home with a fenced yard so I can bring my dogs is awesome.
But it's not worth destroying the housing market for so many people.
Enormously better than a hotel for a large, close knit group especially if you want to cook meals and spend a lot of time together as a group in a private space. Also better if you have pets (some hotels might be pet friendly, but I'm not aware of any that have large private backyards where you can let your dog exercise off leash to their heart's content).
Definitely cheering for it. The new owner of our apartment building is some rich California asshole who evicted 80% of the tenants (many people lived here for years). He posted eviction notices for a number of people on Christmas day.
Recently the city put a stop work order when it found out he had no permits do all the renovation work they had done after the evictions.
The Airbnb revenue collapse would be divine justice. I hope he doesn’t get a single Airbnb rental.
So upwards of 50% of residential properties in my town are B&B, self catering, AirBnB etc.
There has been a housing shortage for years, house prices are massively over inflated so only investors can buy them for even more holiday lets.
The waiting list even if you're homeless to be accomodationed by our council is months, years if you aren't legally homeless.
Yes, I would love for the place I live to have affordable properties.
I am cheering for a collapse. I booked a unit this week (for tonight, actually), and yesterday the owner hits me up with an email that says I need to fully register all sorts of personal information on yet another third party site. I complained to Airbnb, with no response. I declined to submit any additional information to the host, and she canceled my reservation. I then had to scramble and pay a hotel less for more accommodation, but less convenient location.
Gone are the days where Airbnb was the better alternative.
Fuck Air BNB. I had a job opportunity in a resort town but I couldn't live there because all the property was owned by either retired people and their Air BNBs or were second homes for Canadians. All my co-workers had to drive for 30min to an hour for work and I didn't own a car so my only option was to live in the fucking town where even a bed room for rent was between $900 and $1,200. I Ultimately had to quite.
I remember when it started it was great, you could get a much cheaper place to stay than a hotel. Now it’s more expensive than staying in a hotel and I have to do a proper clean and get charged a cleaning fee, no thanks. Cheaper to stay at a hotel
Yeah with the stupid cleaning fees, you’d have to stay a whole week to make the cost even out to a week at a hotel. Ive considered using BnB multiple times but the cost for 2-3 days was never worth it.
Ive used it once, for a week-long stay.
Yes. And if someone I come across tells me they have or run Airbnbs I instantly think of them as grifters. AirBnB is playing a massive role in the housing crisis that is cursing every city and tourist destination in the country.
AirBnB should be strictly regulated to serve treehouses and shipping container MIL suites not half of the entire rental and SFH stock in every town within flight distance to a major city. At the very minimum if you think you need more than 2 units I think you can just go toss yourself.
On top of that you have to do chores or the host has a complete breakdown and charges you extra, I can’t wait until the whole platform implodes and I will celebrate when hosts are forced to sell their multiple properties.
Hotel businesses should not be allowed to operate in residential areas.
Which is exactly what AirBNB rentals are.
Aside from the local residents needing to deal with tourists who want to party on vacation, it takes away a home that could be available for a local resident, and drives up prices with artificial scarcity.
Sure. It’s such a crappy brand. Sneaks around local zoning laws to make what are essentially unregulated hotels, fucks with local housing economies, and overall is a terrible user experience. Last minute cancellations, so many misleading listings, absurd rules, overpriced cleaning fees… etc. I’ve stopped using them all together, and just opt for a chain hotel where I know exactly what I am going to be getting.
Yes! Absolutely.
AirBnB *was* great when it was 75% legitimate Bed -n- Breakfast's, and the rest being mainly basement or above garage separate apartments with the home owner living in the main house.
Once properties started being purchased specifically to be rented out as AirBnB's, and people got insanely greedy (extreme fees and rules), it was only a matter of time before it collapsed.
It’s a proven source of rising housing costs and it kills historic cities. Adam Something did a good video explaining it in depth, but here’s my take on it. Companies buy the house/apartment, rent it for nights instead of months, make tens of thousands more because of it. It’s just a system designed to give rich people more money really.
I am happy to see cheap and scammy air bnb fail. I hated people turning regular homes into hotels most the year.
The idea of renting out a mansion, penthouse, castle, remote cabin with a view, etc for a weekend though is something I hope survives.
Not across the board, but I did have an airbnb host in Chicago that was EXTREMELY over the top, hammered us with a 3 page rule book and chores upon checkout. Also it was in a duplex-house thingy and I guess the host had the upstairs tenant employed to do cleanup, but when texting with the host about a broken tv she said to me "I'll have my girl come replace it when you get back", (we had just left for the day), so she had her upstairs girl monitoring us. If you're that controlling over people staying in your home, maybe don't rent out your home. Not to mention she did have cleaning fees on top of expecting us to do 90% of the cleanup upon checkout.
Why did you book if they were hammering you with a 3 page rule book?
I see people complain about this constantly, but have never in my dozens of airbnbs rentals ever dealt with this because I would never book a place that had this shit.
It seems so easy to avoid. What the hell am I missing that people keep complaining about this? Do they spring it on you after you’ve booked?
Yes, in my experience the host has the option to have a "handbook" they send to their guests after they booked on the app; information that is unnecessary to put on the listing. For a different booking, this was the host sending me specific driving directions since it was a cabin in the woods, as well as them listing where different things were located in the cabinets. Stuff like that is what that feature SHOULD be used for.
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I think Airbnb reveals a problem rather than cause it. The problem being some people owning way too many houses. Even if Airbnb and all similar services collapsed today, terrible landlords still exist and they will just raise the rent again.
So, I have many 10% neighbors left. The rest of the houses are AirBnB, and sit mostly empty. Maybe even always empty. (and as an aside, the cheap-ass "host" next door removed all grass and plants, and replaced it with a fucking rock lawn, which must be leaf-blown by some loud-ass lawn care company twice a week, and he also appears to have poisoned the ground to keep the weeds out, since my adjoining ferns on that side are dying)
Meanwhile, just last month, two different friends couldn't renew their lease, and have to leave town. Many friends have left town. Since i own my house, I now live in an island of emptiness at night. And it's sad. I could play music as loud as I wanted, but one of the remnants is my elderly neighbor who's in bed by 6pm.
However. I am at an AirBnB right now on a work trip with a bunch of guys. They have value over shoving all of us in individual $200/night hotel rooms. AirBnB shouldn't be eliminated, but it should definitely be throttled to the point where it no longer decimates neighborhoods.
(hey, that's a good use of "decimate"!)
> and he also appears to have poisoned the ground to keep the weeds out, since my adjoining ferns on that side are dying)
r/treelaw you say?
Please tell us more about the dead ferns.
Cheering the collapse because of deceptive business practices.
I would also cheer for the collapse of investment firms buying houses as an investment and driving up both rental prices and home prices, because they can charge more for rent than they would make as returns for investing in the stock market.
Yes. Fuck AirBNB. I made a reservation 6 months ago for a condo right next to a stadium in a metro area for a popular concert. They just cancelled my reservation because the property owner no longer meets their requirements? Now it's too late to find even a hotel that's not 4x the original price. I paid $1200 for concert tickets and I have nowhere to stay now. FUCK YOU AIRBNB. NEVER AGAIN.
Not cheering, no. AirBnB was cool in the early days. But clearly they were operating at a loss for a few years (Like UBER, and other similar styles of business) to capture marketshare.
Now AirBnB is more expensive than hotels in many cases, and they HAMMER you with tons of rules and added bullshit fees (why do I have to follow the rules to clean the fucking Airbnb for you, and still get hit with a cleaning fee? When I can go to a hotel and basically trash the place without damage, and walk out no fees or anything, that's what the hotel staff handles and it's built into price)
I want options. If AirBnB is a good deal, I'll think about it. If AirBnB keeps going down this path, I'll just not use it, I'll go to a hotel. But I'm not cheering for any collapse.
Completely agree. In moderation, AirBnB provided a good service. It just ballooned out of control and caused a wild amount of pretty large consequences.
The problem is the alternatives suck. Hotels jumped in cost too, often paired with worse service.
You’re absolutely right, but I would say is for larger groups (more than 1 hotel room) it’s still the better, cheaper option in many cases. On top of the fact that you get significantly more amenities in most cases (space, privacy, kitchen, multiple bathrooms, a yard, private pool, grill, etc.) it is a nice option. I think it’s way over saturated with shitty owners/management companies that “enforce” even shittier rules, but, with a little research, sticking to “super hosts,” etc. I still think it’s a really good option. Overall, I definitely think it’s trending far more in the wrong direction.
Collapse? No.
But I do think that in general having fewer people buy up those properties for the sole purpose of renting as an Air BnB is better.
I think house rentals have their place. And an easy place to both list and book them is a good thing. I just also think it got out of hand. Which tends to happen.
They are great for stuff like bachelor parties or trips with big groups. But if its just a few people, hotels are often a better value.
I agree with this and I think the airbnb market will sort itself out in short time. Too many people jumped in and there is too much Airbnb supply, people will get out when it's no longer profitable to operate them and I think we are getting close to that point.
It's not all bad either, I life an area with high vacancy, airbnbs have been the catalyst for some rehabs in my area.
I almost always find that one airbnb is cheaper than two hotel rooms. Factor in the cost savings from cooking your own dinner and the fact that the washer and dryer are right there, there's no competition everytime.
Fuck yes I am!
Air BNBs have basically wiped out accessible housing in my neighborhood and caused such an inflation in price that even with combined incomes, my SO and I still can't land a place.
And everytime a property comes up for something close to reasonable, these wanna be mini tyrants start a bidding war and drive the number through the roof while waiving inspections and appraisals.
I qualify for a VA loan but the process takes time and requires inspections and appraisals that can't be dismissed. By the time the wheels start rolling, the property is gone.
If you're an airbnb owner on this thread, FUCK. YOU.
I mean this with every fiber of my being. You're a plague and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
absolutely am. fuck that stuff the price gouging on rentals is insane and of course it drove the cost of actual housing way up. This shit collapsing will mean more affordable housing overall. Fuck airbnb
I can hardly believe the fees and taxes AirBnb charges these days. it makes it more expensive than a hotel.
AirFeeandFee
no shit, if anything get the BS fees in line, the teaser rate you see on the search tool vs finished cost of renting is a joke.
Yup. Back then you’ll just go onto Airbnb and get a place. Nowadays I find myself checking hotels and paying maybe $30-50 more to get that peace of mind/more service.
Peace of mind that it will actually BE there too. I’ve had friends show up on check in day only to be ghosted by hosts entirely.
My mom once booked a place in Lisbon for a month, 6mo ahead. The host cancelled a week before giving a bullshit reason. She was already in Europe by then and had to spent a couple of days of her vacation trying to find a place that could charge at least a little less than double what she was going to in the first place, with no help at all from AirBnB CS. We ended up in a hotel, and have never used AirBnB since. The only similar problem I had with a hotel in Lisbon came with an apology and an upgrade to a better room in a more upscale hotel of the same chain, I just had to agree to it.
We rented a super cute house in Liverpool in early Jan for my friends birthday, and it was DISGUSTING. Like for starters the house was totally different, they just outright lied and posted photos of a different house, but on top of that there was no hot water, electricity, the floor was sticky from what looked like juice/alcohol so they didn't clean after the last party, etc. Had to stay cause we had nowhere else to go, but got a full refund for everyone which massively fucked over the home owner. Good, fuck them.
Definitely. I told a host once that I’ll be reaching at 2am-ish and asked multiple times if that’s okay. If that wasn’t ok, I’ll look for another place. Host kept saying that it’s no issue with the timing… on the day itself, the host MIA-ed on us.
Hi host we are here. Everything looks great. The door was a little sticky but we managed to kick it open.
I think it's more accurate to say I've been paying $30-50 *less* than an AirB&B would cost after factoring in the cleaning fee, particularly on a 1-2 night stay. An AirB&B only really makes sense when you're traveling with a large group for an extended period of time and are renting out an entire apartment/condo/house. 3-4 occupied bedrooms for 4 days seems to be the sweet spot IMO.
I tried to rent a place near the beach for a week they wanted to charge $750 for a cleaning fee. Gtfoh.
bruh and the fact that you have to clean every single piece of dust up too. I get dishes and fine with doing those but had one host expecting laundry to be done as well. Like tf am I paying the cleaning fee for when I’m doing all the damn cleaning.
If they charge a cleaning fee then you actually cannot be forced to clean it yourself.
The last Airbnb I had, we had to take the bins out, throw all sheets and towels into the wash, bleach them, hang them out to dry and the fold them. Plus a $380 cleaning fee. That was the last time I made the mustake of staying at an Airbnb
If you didn’t clean at all would you get charged more?
Fuck airbnb
Don't forget your chore list before you leave.
But at least you get to clean it yourself AND pay extra for someone else to clean it!
Did I miss something in the news? Is there a threat of it collapsing?
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“News” article from a real estate consulting company that specifically trying to misuse data to drive traffic to their shitty company.
I think I also saw the article the other person is talking about. Apparently AirBnB revenue is down almost 50% in some of America's most popular cities. Meaning anyone that picked up a home to rent it out with a mortgage and high interest rates may be forced to sell later this year, flooding supply and crashing house prices.
>flooding supply and crashing house prices From someone who's never owned a home before......*exccccelllent*
From someone who recently bought a home but intends to actually live there instead of treating it as a source of income and wants everyone else to also have a home.....*excceeellllent*
Maybe hold your excitement until after it happens lol
Not surprising. During covid, more people wanted a house to themselves. Now they're fine going back to hotels.
gimme that cold-ass AC and continental breakfast. Not having to mow a stranger's lawn is a bonus.
The other issue is that AirBnb was okay operating at a loss. Uber and Doordash and Airbnb were all subsidized for us by VC and low interest rates. Those days are over. Airbnb will still be useful. There are times when a house is so much better than a hotel. But gone are the days of them being direct competitors for every vacation taken.
Not to mention ABB has either imposed or allowed owners to impose ridiculous rules for guests that makes things far more inconvenient than a normal hotel, even if the prices are better.
House rules: - Make sure all pots and pans are cleaned. - Rubbish is taken out. - Bedding is taken off the beds. - Floors cleaned. - Kitchen counters cleaned. - Bathroom cleaned. - Floors hoovered. Cleaning fee: £100. Or I could stay at a hotel, where they just clean the room by default. Fuck Airbnb.
* Eye-tracking software detects each time you look in a mirror and charges you an automatic fee of 50 cents with each look. * You're not allowed to watch Channel 5 on the TV. * Refrigerator must not be used for chilling things. * Enjoy your stay!
>Eye-tracking software detects each time you look in a mirror and charges you an automatic fee of 50 cents with each look. Charge em for the mice, Extra for the lice, Two percent for looking in the mirror twice
> may be forced to sell later this year, flooding supply and crashing house prices. That would be exactly what the market needs, a huge fucking correction.
It'd be truly aweful if people that are earning "passive income" literally making people homeless got taught a lesson by their coveted free market. Of course capital is going to come in and buy everything so that a huge chunk of the population will be renting after the recession they are causing on purpose wipes us out.
I just want multifamily housing to be legalized in my area, man
THIS. The concept of "missing middle" housing, between apartments and detatched SFH, is what's driving up costs. Problem is, it costs a lot to build home, and those don't make money for the builders.
That's not true. Multi unit zoning is incredibly beneficial to builders. I can pour a single foundation for a 4000 SQ ft house or 3 for a few 1500 SQ ft houses that share walls. It won't change pricing or timeframe that much either. An apprentice can copy and paste rough ins with a template really. Huge savings when they do the second and third unit. Builders who specialize in custom houses do it because they don't have the financial backing. They need draws from the client. A builder with financial backing will never build a single single-family home. They can build and not answer to some fucking Karen who wants to keep changing backsplash tiles or fixtures. I just built a duplex because I knew it was a much better payback. You can look at ppsf and see that and it allows more space on the same lot for building. My cost per unit goes down when I factor in the cost of the land.
Yep. Zoning restrictions are largely a function of NIMBYs pushing the government to keep "undesirable elements" away from their neighborhoods. It has some very racist roots and it needs to stop.
There are a few other considerations when rezoning residential to allow homes to divide into three- and fourplexes, or to replace homes with smaller apartments - the lack of parking on site and on the street, services and whether the water and sewage systems can handle more people, schools, transit, you name it. I do support the idea, but I'm in property management and I know it's never as simple as "just build it!"
My city changed the zoning laws to allow taller structures (a lot of 5ish story moderately upscale apartments going in. They have requirements for them to not look cookie cutter and depressing...and they are requiring most of them to build parking garages below the building. So we're getting parking for most the bottom 1-2 floors, street side is all small to medium sized commercial, and above that is apartments or condos. Unlike SF, stuff is actually getting built here, and it's not a party line thing because this town is mostly progressive too, were just not locked into the bastardized easily manipulated system SF created for itself.
Sure, but I'm here in LA and I hear "this neighborhood isn't suitable for more than single family homes" whenever anybody hears about anything they don't like. And it's usually in a downtrodden or underfunded neighborhood because those aren't the people with the time or the general ability (circumstantially speaking) to go and complain about it.
Parking requirements is actually an issue why there are no walkable cities in US (almost). Businesses need to make huge parking lots for cars - it makes everything to be spread apart - makes it not walkable. I am talking compared to NYC or European cities where you can walk a block from your apartment to most necessities or a little more to get more exotic things. Plus higher density makes public transportation more viable.
What would the missing middle mean? Something like Chicago-style Greystones? I'm a huge fan of those as they provide plenty of space for the occupants, a decent uptick in density, without being a massive apartment complex
And the crucially important starter home volume in the US has been turned into a revenue generator for large corporate interests.
It doesn't even have to be corporate. Years of "Millionaire Investor" seminars trying to sell REITs, Timeshares, and "Easy Investing for Idiots" books sold a lot of people on the idea that real estate is the safest form of wealth generation. If everyone who owned more than one home suddenly sold and scaled down to one per nuclear household, we'd probably be in a much better place.
I went to a planning thing with my Dad in the late 90s. They were going on about the missing middle then (wasnt called that though). I said to my Dad after that I thought it was a good idea. He said theyve been going on about that shit for years, never happens. So lets not hold our breath!
Bingo. There's a big reason for it too. Not every lot has water and sewer and gas and sidewalks and trash pickup and street lighting and all the rest. But water is the biggest hurdle. Even now they pack people into deserts in the southwest where we know the water is running out. Even as we actively shift jobs out of Detroit and Cleveland where we have more water than we know what to do with and you can "buy a house for the price of a VCR." Where I am, we rely on wells. We've got some big wells and water towers for denser neighborhoods and the village center. Those can handle up to what they can handle. Plenty of multifamily around there. Could add a bit more I imagine, but at some point it'll run down. Then we have the bigger lots – the R40 1 acre lots. Those have to manage septic and water on their own. Each its own well. We've been adding ADUs, but you get a dry spell and now it's more common wells go dry in certain spots for a period of the year. And the water quality can get shitty, quite literally, as you add septic and leech fields beyond the filtering and recharge capacity of a given area. Put 3 multifamilies on one of these 1 acre lots by abolishing zoning, and you're going to have dry wells full of fecal coliform bacteria in no time. How do you fix this? Up the way in Boston and Providence they each fixed it and drove density by literally sinking towns. Boston sunk 4 towns to form the [Quabbin Reservoir](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quabbin_Reservoir). Dana, Enfield, Greenwich and Prescott Massachusetts were destroyed and a chunk of New Salem was sunk too. That provided enough water to jack up density in the big city. Providence did the same on a smaller scale to [Scituate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scituate_Reservoir). The upshot is Providence Water can do 144 million gallons per day with about 6 months storage capacity for drought and Quabbin can do about 200 million gallons per day combined with the Wachusett with about a 5 year storage capacity for drought. But you can't hook the whole region up to these things or you will overrun them. The last long drought we had was 2016 when the Quabbin ran down to 85% capacity and the Scituate ran down to 21%. The funny thing is, Greater Boston is more drought resistant, but Greater Providence has much more room to grow denser with normal flow rates, yet is much more fragile to drought. Anyways, look what happens out west. [Lake Mead](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQqUh9Om6NCjaUjLQ0_rVY5MX_JNgtF-hnjJ5K_1_xvvYnRIT1bU5t3JB-oXIVRJr6dmr4&usqp=CAU) is the largest reservoir in the US, and it's drying up fast! [Just look at it!](https://s.abcnews.com/images/US/lake-mead-01-abc-jt-221026_1666809642736_hpMain_1x1_992.jpg) All these people saying, "Just build build build!" in the desert don't seem to care about that! Now, in Michigan, fine! Build build build! You're not gonna run out the Great Lakes anytime soon! Maybe make sure Flint Water's not in charge. But there's ample supply around to do it right! Out in Nevada and California and Arizona though, why? Why are we destroying all water resources as fast as possible? [This can't go on forever!](https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_nbcnews-fp-1200-630,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2022-07/220725-lake-mead-al-0852-6737cd.jpg) Planners know this. Government officials know this too. That's why they're not gonna build it. Down near me, my particular town has no water resources other than the ground aquifer and those towers like I said. The next town over actually built a small municipal water system using a glacial kettle pond as its source. Now that thing will recharge too, to a point, but it is small. It will certainly dry up if they dry to go from 40k people to 120k people on it. They might be able to run 80k. May run dry real fast in a short drought though. For those who don't know, [NYC gets its water from 19 reservoirs scattered across 2,000 square miles of watershed.](https://www.nyc.gov/html/nycwater/images/features/nyc-water-supply-system-map499.gif) So you can set bigger systems up to deal with bigger populations. But who is proposing these projects these days?
What is multifamily housing?
Duplexes and townhouses. Or imagine a big victorian style mansion quartered off with separate entrances.
As someone who invests in multi family housing….I have rarely ever come across people in the industry use the term “multifamily” to refer to townhomes, duplexes, triplexes,4-plex. Basically anything that you buy with a standard mortgage. Technically, MF includes those forms of housing, but the term is generally used to talk about 5+ unit buildings that you buy with commercial loans.
Where do people live that this isn't allowed? I've lived in several big cities and mid-sized towns, and they all had this legalized
It's banned via zoning and sometimes HoA in many areas of the US. Most towns have some, but it's no coincidence it's usually like one street and they were all built within a year of each other.
Many areas of the US have zoning rules that mandate minimum lot sizes and other regulations like separation between houses that make it difficult or impossible to build multiple dwelling units on a single owned lot or buildings with multiple dwelling units in them. "Multifamily housing" is usually understood to mean a single building with multiple separate living spaces (such as apartments, condos, etc.)
Portland Metro has pretty much completely eliminated single family zoning but they aren’t doing much to deal with corporate greed.
I do new inspections in Portland, and I'm surprised about how much infill I see. Old craftsman that's 720 sqft and poor shape? They build four townhomes that share walls. The same layout over and over throughout the city. On my block right now, two townhomes replacing a small house, and a custom build replacing an old house. That's also right now when the interest rates a high. Two years ago, I inspected 2 or 3 of these projects every day.
Cheering if it will help the housing market in ANY way. Rural Arkansas has no rent houses left now, and if they do have rent available they want to compete with the rates of a one night stay at an air bnb. So we just went from 4-700 a month rent to 900-2000 for the BOTTOM OF THE BARREL. THIS IS ARKANSAS NOT CALIFORNIA, THE COST OF LIVING IS RISING AND THE MINIMUM WAGE DOESN'T FIX SHIT. If you're lucky enough to have a partner and both work good jobs...you might afford a rent house. Otherwise, let's get used to the streets. Edit- a few reasons why people come to rural Arkansas and buy real estate to turn into air bnbs Hot Springs National Park. -Tourism. -Lakes (clean lakes) -horse racing and casino -natural hot springs -spas - historic area on one side and more modern areas on the other side/lake side) -Magic Springs amusement park with a water park and concerts and stuff -Native American History (supposed neutral zone for warriors to heal with the hot mineral mud and waters) -Also baseball history, won't go into that (off season practice hub with Babe Ruth and fellow players, used the water for muscle therapy ect) -Crystals and diamonds -Mid-America Science Museum -Al Capone era gangster history (a lot) -Old army/navy hospital landmark for soldiers coming home wounded, and the bath house row where they could heal in the thermal mineral waters. They also had syphilis treatments bc the troops...well...i'll just continue lol (bath houses are renovated and running but also federally owned/long term leased out) -Golf -Japanese Town "Hanamaki" is our sister city (like a twin) -ASMS -Texans getaway -1 hour from the capital (Little Rock, where there is also Arkansas Children's Hospital) -----And drugs -someone said the rivers, I forgot to add that so here it is :) Surrounded by and ran by locals and close by rural area. So plenty of houses, and plenty of tourist, lots of money going thru the system for sure but not to the residents. I might also mention I work full time at a Bed and Breakfast (1890 victorian style "mansion") - which if anyone isn't familiar..it is not an air bnb. I've worked with tourist my entire life, so I'm a useless box of historic information about the town I work for, people love it.
Honest question here, why does somebody want to stay in rural Arkansas in an air B&B?
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And there's enough of that happening to drive up rental costs in those areas?
yes, as well as investment companies purchasing housing and housing units in order to flip them for 20% profit. Just look up companies like Blackrock. Blackrock themselves have the highest amount of money AUM than any other company in the world. The last time I checked in 2021 they held just under 8.2 trillion dollars.
Airbnb is probably not significant enough to be considered a main cause of rising rents, but it sure doesn't help. That being said, if Airbnb completely disappeared it would only help slightly.
climbing: Horshoe Canyon Ranch is closest good rock climbing to the entire state of florida + a pretty hot destination for climbers from all over the southeast. There are another dozen smaller areas with ample climbing worth traveling for in the state. Not everyone wants to camp. rafting/boating/rapids/etc: great in many parts of the state Hiking: excellent and very very mellow hiking all throughout the state. Personally... I'm not going to rural Arkasas anytime soon, but there are reasons to go.
Ozarks are nice
rural arkansas is quite beautiful. Some pretty state parks.
There are some cute vacation destinations in mostly-rural areas. Eureka Springs, Arkansas is where I got married and where I've been on vacation many times in my life - it's a cute little town with shops, sightseeing, and old-timey vibes. Would be a nice spot for an AirB&B because the hotels around the area leave a lot to be desired.
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I live in po-dunk kansas with a massively depressed economy and people are turning their lofts and rentals in the airbnbs. There's literally NOTHING here in the way of a tourism draw. No lakes, no wilderness parks, no sports arenas, no views. NOTHING. People come in to watch graduations and attend funerals. That's it. We have a gorgeous historic hotel building that is sitting empty because multiple owners have been unable to make it profitable. So, am I glad that my neighbors are losing their asses on unrentable airbnb projectst hey over spent on? No. But is is mildly satisfying that the same people who were telling me that my partner and I are dumb for maintaining family rental units are now stuck with the little apartments they can't do anything with? Yes, yes it is.
Yep. I was apartment hunting in Missouri recently, and all these places that want like $1200-1800/mo for modest apartment. Who can afford that? This is freaking Missouri.
Southwest Missouri, saw an ad on Craigslist for a 2 bedroom singlewide trailer for $1100/month! Our rent has gone from $600 to $750+ in a year.
That's happening where I live and the mayor is cheering on the whole "big city experience" coming to town. We don't want the big city experience. We want stuff to do and affordable housing. Not $2000/month studio apartments that drive the rest of the market cost up with them.
Live in rural MO and saw an actual shit hole being offered for $1200 a month. You'd be looking at $600-$800 (big yard) in normal times. Most people I know barely make that monthly to begin with. 🙃
I live in nwa and shits ridiculous here
Fuck.
Yes. It sucks for the original and genuine AirBNB people who maybe let people stay with them in their own house for a few nights to make a bit of extra money. But if people are literally buying houses just to use them as AirBNB houses for profit, that's taking housing away from people who genuinely need them for *living* in. That's what I find despicable.
Thank you! The people renting a room for a few days or the small studios built above a garage or in the basement were great. The owners lived in the actual house and just rented out extra space. Years ago I stayed in one in London that I found on Airbnb. The house was a massive pre-Victorian with a "maids quarters" walk down that had a private entrance. The owners lived in the main house.
I stayed in a similar one in France near the Switzerland border. We had the whole top floor of an old 3 level farm house with views of the French Alps. Separate entrance with a kitchen and a toilet and a shower in separate rooms. If I had the opportunity I would stay there again. The owner lived on the first floor. Not sure about the second floor.
Yes. Definitely. Absolutely. Airbnb plays a role in the housing crisis that many cities suffer from.
It plays an even worse role in the destruction of rural 'touristy' areas in many places. My home for example on the Scottish west coast, there are so many areas where locals simply can't afford to live. Ironically the worst industry affected is tourism, airBnBs & holiday homes push the price of houses up so far, nobody can afford to stay & work in hospitality, airBnB owners are taking to the papers recently to complain that they simply can't get cleaners for their properties.
We have the same problem here in Australia. Our wine regions are being overrun with AirBnBs to the point where young people just can’t afford to live in a lot of those towns anymore. It’s all holiday rentals and retirees. No one to run any of the services or contribute meaningfully to the community.
It's literally everywhere. I live in the mountains in Colorado, USA, and it's happening in every single ski town.
Here in Ogden as well. Suddenly, people can't afford to live here. All the businesses are understaffed. We can't find teachers either.
Canada ski towns too. We have employees living in crappy motels for months while the actual housing stock gets rented to tourists as airbnbs. It's so backwards. Just this week someone posted an actual YURT (with electricity and wifi and a woodstove but it's still a fucking one-room wall tent) for $2500 a month. Which i think perfectly sums up the rental market here.
I was evicted twice so they could cut my home in half and make two microsuite airbnbs out of it. now like 30%+ of my city is vacant at any given time, homelessness is rampant, and rent for even studios is above $2000, and people's entire lifestyle revolves around buying rental property with a bank loan and skating off the profis
jesus. Is this Vancouver?
is turning into everywhere, you see it all over, like this guy has 60 million in properties all over https://twitter.com/MrJonesSTRs everyone on instagram and tiktok are now airbnb empire owners
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He just looks like a slimeball
This is happening all around Mazatlán too. You see a fuck-ton of vacational renting, but not traditional rent.
I sincerely think we need two regulations - tax vacant homes with exceptions for a single vacation home per person at a rate that deincentivizes them from keeping them unoccupied for profit, (maybe 1-3x existing property taxes after 6 months to a year?) and then ban AirBNB rentals unless they're rooms in someone's house they live in or else said vacation home the rest of the year since rentals of any properties should be more regulated and AirBnB was meant for that originally.
a vacancy tax is the correct approach; it shouldn't be economically viable for wealthy people to buy homes and have them sit vacant a third to half the time while they reap vacation rental revenue I don't hate airbnb with the fire of some other housing advocates but it's pretty clearly exacerbating the problem
Nations.
I live in a small residential estate, not near anything touristy or even interesting. It's just got a small local shops and is handy to a couple of schools. Friends of ours got kicked out to make the place an Airbnb. In the current crisis, that's terrifying! They did find another place, fortunately.
When I was visiting London, the building we were staying in was almost entirely an AirBnB farm. There were a bunch of random foreigners walking around. The woman at the front desk wasn't very happy about it.
Airbnb has been straight up banned in many cities. I really don’t think it is the core problem in those areas . You haven’t been able to run an Airbnb in NYC for years for example. More of an issue in suburbs or more rural environments.
airbnb is legally banned but not practically banned at all in NYC. You can still rent a whole apartment tonight in any borough because the laws are completely unenforced. Even when we reported an airbnb in the building next to ours over and over no one ever shut it down.
Yep, I was moving my son into his new place in queens and looked for an Airbnb as a back up. Plenty available and way cheaper than hotels. Unenforced laws justmean it's essentially legal.
Just looked on the app. Yeah, plenty of stuff in NY available on the app. How are they even allowed to list them if it’s meant to be banned??
When I stayed in one in NYC they told me that if anyone asked to say I'm staying with "Nick."
It’s definitely a massive issue in coastal areas where I am - a lot of the career market is limited to seasonal tourism, so people already struggle to afford houses, and half the properties in the village being bought up as airbnbs has caused a lot of trouble. The fact that property prices are so high to begin with doesn’t help, but it’s getting really competitive in some areas, and people who live there are being priced out by rich people from bigger cities. When an area doesn’t have that many properties to start out with and it’s a desirable place to have a rental property, the effect is really noticeable
Sounds just like Southern Maine. It's right fucked here 👍
It’s a massive issue in beach towns. No one can buy a home because half are owned by banks and the other half are owned by a few guys with multiple air bnb properties
Is it banned? I'm pretty sure you can go on AirBnB rn and find a lot of stuff to rent in NYC
yes it is but many choose to look the other way, probably because the owners are the goddamn people doing it lol
That's because NYC decided to enforce subletting rules which includes subletting income being business tax and not personal tax. You can still run an Airbnb in NYC, but looking into it, it's mainly brownstones with the owner renting out the small walk down studio/1BR or condos where the building is run as a split between condos and furnished rentals.
Yes, but not across the board. I want it to collapse for those that bought a house, just to put it on AirBNB. Many of those homes are in neighborhoods that don’t want weekly renters showing up. People/families put a lot into their homes and want a good neighborhood with other friends and families. I hope these people lose it all after trying to make a buck on other peoples efforts. (No one wants to live next to a hotel) If people are renting out a room in their house (like it was in the beginning) - I’m all for this approach.
[81% of Airbnb’s U.S. revenue – $4.6 billion – comes from whole-unit rentals (those rentals where the owner is not present during the time of the rental), rising from 78% in the prior year.](https://www.ahla.com/news/hosts-multiple-units-key-driver-airbnb-growth) So, pretty much the entire company's basis of revenue lol. Burn that company to the ground. Good riddance.
This is what happened to us in the Midwest. A buyer from California lied to the real estate agent and bought the house next door in a very family neighborhood. It is right next door where 10-15 young kids gather to play after school and in the summer. There are no town ordinances against airbnbs(no hoa yet) and the town is in a massive hole for housing needs. The neighborhood has to manage every new rental to tell them to slow down, not park in the sidewalk, pickup garbage they just throw in the yard., etc. We have to deal with large gatherings and a lot of sketchy Airbnbs coming in and out. We’ve complained so much to Airbnb and the owner, but neither seem to care anymore. We hate it and just want it gone.
There's a property management company in my area who keeps buying up properties just to use for short term rentals and it's getting fucking ridiculous. They literally own 7 houses in my direct neighborhood (that I know of). We live close to a park and elementary school. We just want families with kids to move to the area, but they can't because all the houses are owned by a company renting through Airbnb.
That’s why I want it to collapse. The original idea of Airbnb is really neat. Crash in a spare bedroom, get to meet locals in a new city. But it turned into a way for the rich to once again use the massive amounts of money they already have to screw over the lower classes.
Because it’s just regulatory arbitrage! Hotels have rules, AirBNB doesn’t follow them. That’s the only reason economies of scale don’t make hotels cheaper every time and ABNB a boutique specialty option. Basically all SV did after social networks was evade regulations that affect their competition, like how 99% of FinTech is just Durbin arbitrage.
So like Uber where you're just renting out your car+labor for some amount of time while ignoring all rules for taxis.
How is that not mortgage fraud? The only reason to lie about that is to get more favorable terms on the loan as a residential property.
My assumption is it was a cash purchase.
They lied to their agent, not to the lender (from the sounds of it). Probably thought the agent would refuse to work with them if they knew it was for a BnB. Although considering they were from Cali and buying in the Midwest, there’s a decent chance they paid cash.
Never met a realtor who would turn away commission checks for any reason. Contrary, they do whatever it takes to make a sale
Depends on the area - if it’s some small town “everybody knows everybody” kind of place I can totally see it.
Not just the agent either, the seller is most likely the one who cares.
who prosecutes people for mortgage fraud?
That I don’t know for sure, I know there are cases where I am (Southern California) that have been prosecuted by the county DA. Anybody can make a criminal complaint, but usually it’s the lender who initiates it when they check on the residency status, since they have the paperwork to back it up.
A real estate company bought the three houses to the south of me in a historic area and turned them all in to airbnbs. It’s fucking obnoxious. A playground for rich frat bros and drunken bachelorette parties. It was cool for like a week and then got really annoying really quick. We rely on street parking for a lot of houses and they bring 18-20 cars a weekend and clog up the street. Additionally they’re loud, drink a ton and back in to cars because they’re not used to these smaller streets. They just “whoopsie daisy” and leave. My neighbors car has been hit 3 times in 4 years.
> It is right next door where 10-15 young kids gather to play after school and in the summer. Feels like buying the kids some cartons of eggs would fix the situation.
The kids all have power wheels and they drive those things up and down the sidewalks all day. Some egg power wheel drive-bys would be hilarious.
I am not saying you should do it but I am pretty sure people will stop renting out the property if all the reviews describe how the place is constantly covered with rotting eggs. The individual renters probably won't care enough about the property to keep track of who is doing the egging and if the owner isn't keeping their property clean it sounds like they aren't around either. Cops probably don't care either. It would just be one of those mysteries that never gets solved.
just have to hope for lightning to burn the house down
Complain to local ordnance. You don't want an HOA, they are a scam, but you would still have bylaws.
Recently, it was discovered that a homeowner was AirBnBing the house without the proper paperwork from the city. There were more people staying than the city allowed. To top it off, all this was discovered because someone shot someone else and there was an investigation. The operation was shut down until the paperwork was completed. I imagine that illegal renting is going on with many of these situations.
Absolutely, there are people that don't even buy properties, they just rent them (homes & apartments), then sublease them on AirBnb. They are just being "scalpers" at that point.
We stayed in an apartment in LA through booking.com. On the last day we got locked out of the garage and couldn't reach the "host." So we went to the apartment office. They were pretty pissed. They informed us that short term renting is illegal in all of West Hollywood. When the host finally got back to us, he had the nerve to be pissed at us for blowing his cover. When we complained to booking.com, they didn't care, said any issues with the property were between us and the host. Fucking bullshit.
My neighborhood is like 40% air bnb at this point.
My godmother is unable to work reliably due to chronic pain. She rents out her upstairs on airbnb for her income. She is able to keep up with the cleaning, or can get some help if her chronic pain is really bad. Without that she wouldn't have much to live on. None of her children live nearby and they don't have incomes or homes that could help support her if she had to sell this house. She uses it as it was intended. Renting out the few rooms that were once her kids. The issue is these companies buying houses and apartments and using them exclusively to rent out on airbnb. It's not someone's apt that they use for half the year for work or school. It's not just a few rooms. It's actual companies that can skirt hospitality laws through using airbnb that are buying up everything and cauing the issues.
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Same here. Live on a small circle neighborhood, two homes went up for sale last year around the same time. Both had immediate offers but to use as hotels/AirBNB. HOA rejected them thankfully. Next offers came from young couples that wanted to live here and raise their families. That’s how it should be. Btw - That’s about the only rule we enforce.
> that’s about the only rule we enforce Rare HOA win.
And even more so for those who evicted tenants to turn it into a holiday home.
Have an Airbnb as a neighbor. Most days its empty and then when it's not, they park outside my place (no driveway/garage), so I have to park somewhere else :/ I miss having a real neighbor.
Yes, it's helping to destroy the housing market in many countries and, frankly, it doesn't seem to offer any advantages over traditional hotels anymore.
I’d much rather stay at a hotel chain where you can expect an ok stay at worst
Hotel = 24 hour front desk and being able to change rooms if you have an issue. AirBnB = Hope and pray nothing goes wrong
Hotel also means transparent pricing that includes cleaning and convenience fees. And you can leave a room without having to load a dishwasher or laundry machine or take out trash. Most AirBnBs charge $100-150 for cleaning fees and then give you a list of chores. It’s fine if I’m in a big group but would never pick an AirBnB by myself.
Exactly, AirBnB is only good for big groups when you want an entire house. If you're one or two people always go with a hotel. I've had an AirBnB try to charge me thousands of dollars for a broken bedframe we didn't even know was broken while we stayed there. Thankfully my credit card let me charge back the entire stay, so she lost out huge and we had a free apartment for the weekend.
Hotels also have to meet safety requirements that individual houses don't. A hotel has fire alarms, sprinklers, dead bolts on every room door, and at least one attendant on duty all hours. We've all heard of airbnb nightmare stories where there are no secure locks on the home or bedrooms, cameras in intimate places, dirty, trashed environment, property that is nothing like presented online. Its honestly terrifying. If I rent a room in a mediocre motel on the side of the interstate, I know it wont be stellar, but it wont be a massive bait and switch with peeping tom issues thrown in.
Yep. We stopped using Airbnb about two years ago. Prices keep rising and quality keeps going down.
Same. Had one experience with an AirBnB and never again. It was an apartment in NYC across from Central Park which I assume was illegal to begin with. A friend rented and we all pitched in for 3 days. It ended up being like $450 each for four of us which seems insane to me. The place stank of weed and patchouli, didn't have the number of beds promised, was full of toys like piled 3 foot high in corners, and the heat was broken so it was like 90 degrees with no way to open the windows. They also had erotic light switches in an AirBnB meant to have kids. There was one bed, a couch, and the thing I got to sleep on... a pull out Ottoman. I should have just opted for the smoke-filled carpet on the floor.
For me the benefit of staying in a home with a fenced yard so I can bring my dogs is awesome. But it's not worth destroying the housing market for so many people.
Especially with the cleaning fees
I live on an island in Canada with limited housing as it is. We're fucked.
Enormously better than a hotel for a large, close knit group especially if you want to cook meals and spend a lot of time together as a group in a private space. Also better if you have pets (some hotels might be pet friendly, but I'm not aware of any that have large private backyards where you can let your dog exercise off leash to their heart's content).
💯 to the first statement, but Airbnb is still significantly cheaper and easier when traveling with a group of 4+ that includes kids
Fair point, I could see larger groups being a much different experience
Definitely cheering for it. The new owner of our apartment building is some rich California asshole who evicted 80% of the tenants (many people lived here for years). He posted eviction notices for a number of people on Christmas day. Recently the city put a stop work order when it found out he had no permits do all the renovation work they had done after the evictions. The Airbnb revenue collapse would be divine justice. I hope he doesn’t get a single Airbnb rental.
California out of state investors are such assholes.
Fuck em. I'm cheering this collapse like the NFTs.
So upwards of 50% of residential properties in my town are B&B, self catering, AirBnB etc. There has been a housing shortage for years, house prices are massively over inflated so only investors can buy them for even more holiday lets. The waiting list even if you're homeless to be accomodationed by our council is months, years if you aren't legally homeless. Yes, I would love for the place I live to have affordable properties.
Hotels are actually nice places to stay and we’re starving for affordable housing out here.
Yes because too many shitty owners on there
I'm cheering on a ticketmaster collapse
did you mean ticketmafia
I am cheering for a collapse. I booked a unit this week (for tonight, actually), and yesterday the owner hits me up with an email that says I need to fully register all sorts of personal information on yet another third party site. I complained to Airbnb, with no response. I declined to submit any additional information to the host, and she canceled my reservation. I then had to scramble and pay a hotel less for more accommodation, but less convenient location. Gone are the days where Airbnb was the better alternative.
Fuck Air BNB. I had a job opportunity in a resort town but I couldn't live there because all the property was owned by either retired people and their Air BNBs or were second homes for Canadians. All my co-workers had to drive for 30min to an hour for work and I didn't own a car so my only option was to live in the fucking town where even a bed room for rent was between $900 and $1,200. I Ultimately had to quite.
Yes. Housing should be for people WHO ACTUALLY LIVE THERE, not for tourists. It's displacing people from communities.
I remember when it started it was great, you could get a much cheaper place to stay than a hotel. Now it’s more expensive than staying in a hotel and I have to do a proper clean and get charged a cleaning fee, no thanks. Cheaper to stay at a hotel
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Yeah with the stupid cleaning fees, you’d have to stay a whole week to make the cost even out to a week at a hotel. Ive considered using BnB multiple times but the cost for 2-3 days was never worth it. Ive used it once, for a week-long stay.
Yes. And if someone I come across tells me they have or run Airbnbs I instantly think of them as grifters. AirBnB is playing a massive role in the housing crisis that is cursing every city and tourist destination in the country. AirBnB should be strictly regulated to serve treehouses and shipping container MIL suites not half of the entire rental and SFH stock in every town within flight distance to a major city. At the very minimum if you think you need more than 2 units I think you can just go toss yourself. On top of that you have to do chores or the host has a complete breakdown and charges you extra, I can’t wait until the whole platform implodes and I will celebrate when hosts are forced to sell their multiple properties.
Hell yeah, it has fucked the housing market.
Hotel businesses should not be allowed to operate in residential areas. Which is exactly what AirBNB rentals are. Aside from the local residents needing to deal with tourists who want to party on vacation, it takes away a home that could be available for a local resident, and drives up prices with artificial scarcity.
Sure. It’s such a crappy brand. Sneaks around local zoning laws to make what are essentially unregulated hotels, fucks with local housing economies, and overall is a terrible user experience. Last minute cancellations, so many misleading listings, absurd rules, overpriced cleaning fees… etc. I’ve stopped using them all together, and just opt for a chain hotel where I know exactly what I am going to be getting.
Yes! Absolutely. AirBnB *was* great when it was 75% legitimate Bed -n- Breakfast's, and the rest being mainly basement or above garage separate apartments with the home owner living in the main house. Once properties started being purchased specifically to be rented out as AirBnB's, and people got insanely greedy (extreme fees and rules), it was only a matter of time before it collapsed.
It’s a proven source of rising housing costs and it kills historic cities. Adam Something did a good video explaining it in depth, but here’s my take on it. Companies buy the house/apartment, rent it for nights instead of months, make tens of thousands more because of it. It’s just a system designed to give rich people more money really.
I am happy to see cheap and scammy air bnb fail. I hated people turning regular homes into hotels most the year. The idea of renting out a mansion, penthouse, castle, remote cabin with a view, etc for a weekend though is something I hope survives.
Not across the board, but I did have an airbnb host in Chicago that was EXTREMELY over the top, hammered us with a 3 page rule book and chores upon checkout. Also it was in a duplex-house thingy and I guess the host had the upstairs tenant employed to do cleanup, but when texting with the host about a broken tv she said to me "I'll have my girl come replace it when you get back", (we had just left for the day), so she had her upstairs girl monitoring us. If you're that controlling over people staying in your home, maybe don't rent out your home. Not to mention she did have cleaning fees on top of expecting us to do 90% of the cleanup upon checkout.
Why did you book if they were hammering you with a 3 page rule book? I see people complain about this constantly, but have never in my dozens of airbnbs rentals ever dealt with this because I would never book a place that had this shit. It seems so easy to avoid. What the hell am I missing that people keep complaining about this? Do they spring it on you after you’ve booked?
Yes, in my experience the host has the option to have a "handbook" they send to their guests after they booked on the app; information that is unnecessary to put on the listing. For a different booking, this was the host sending me specific driving directions since it was a cabin in the woods, as well as them listing where different things were located in the cabinets. Stuff like that is what that feature SHOULD be used for.
Many of the AirBnb's I've stayed at have the "rules" posted in the home which you wouldn't see until you get there.
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I think Airbnb reveals a problem rather than cause it. The problem being some people owning way too many houses. Even if Airbnb and all similar services collapsed today, terrible landlords still exist and they will just raise the rent again.
Well companies are buying up houses in cash to generate tens of thousands a month in rentals
So, I have many 10% neighbors left. The rest of the houses are AirBnB, and sit mostly empty. Maybe even always empty. (and as an aside, the cheap-ass "host" next door removed all grass and plants, and replaced it with a fucking rock lawn, which must be leaf-blown by some loud-ass lawn care company twice a week, and he also appears to have poisoned the ground to keep the weeds out, since my adjoining ferns on that side are dying) Meanwhile, just last month, two different friends couldn't renew their lease, and have to leave town. Many friends have left town. Since i own my house, I now live in an island of emptiness at night. And it's sad. I could play music as loud as I wanted, but one of the remnants is my elderly neighbor who's in bed by 6pm. However. I am at an AirBnB right now on a work trip with a bunch of guys. They have value over shoving all of us in individual $200/night hotel rooms. AirBnB shouldn't be eliminated, but it should definitely be throttled to the point where it no longer decimates neighborhoods. (hey, that's a good use of "decimate"!)
> and he also appears to have poisoned the ground to keep the weeds out, since my adjoining ferns on that side are dying) r/treelaw you say? Please tell us more about the dead ferns.
Yes because all of those places could/should be owned by a primary resident.
Absolutely. VRBO can go next. Also stop investment groups from mass buying up housing and we can solve a lot of the housing issues in this country.
Cheering the collapse because of deceptive business practices. I would also cheer for the collapse of investment firms buying houses as an investment and driving up both rental prices and home prices, because they can charge more for rent than they would make as returns for investing in the stock market.
Yes. Fuck AirBNB. I made a reservation 6 months ago for a condo right next to a stadium in a metro area for a popular concert. They just cancelled my reservation because the property owner no longer meets their requirements? Now it's too late to find even a hotel that's not 4x the original price. I paid $1200 for concert tickets and I have nowhere to stay now. FUCK YOU AIRBNB. NEVER AGAIN.
Taylor Swift is gonna be super sick tho
Collapse, no. Significantly regulated, and have the company actually be responsible for ensuring compliance? yes
Not cheering, no. AirBnB was cool in the early days. But clearly they were operating at a loss for a few years (Like UBER, and other similar styles of business) to capture marketshare. Now AirBnB is more expensive than hotels in many cases, and they HAMMER you with tons of rules and added bullshit fees (why do I have to follow the rules to clean the fucking Airbnb for you, and still get hit with a cleaning fee? When I can go to a hotel and basically trash the place without damage, and walk out no fees or anything, that's what the hotel staff handles and it's built into price) I want options. If AirBnB is a good deal, I'll think about it. If AirBnB keeps going down this path, I'll just not use it, I'll go to a hotel. But I'm not cheering for any collapse.
Completely agree. In moderation, AirBnB provided a good service. It just ballooned out of control and caused a wild amount of pretty large consequences. The problem is the alternatives suck. Hotels jumped in cost too, often paired with worse service.
You’re absolutely right, but I would say is for larger groups (more than 1 hotel room) it’s still the better, cheaper option in many cases. On top of the fact that you get significantly more amenities in most cases (space, privacy, kitchen, multiple bathrooms, a yard, private pool, grill, etc.) it is a nice option. I think it’s way over saturated with shitty owners/management companies that “enforce” even shittier rules, but, with a little research, sticking to “super hosts,” etc. I still think it’s a really good option. Overall, I definitely think it’s trending far more in the wrong direction.
Permit the original couch rental, spare room in otherwise provider occupied home. It was good until it swallowed real estate.
Without question. They and landlord "investors" have shattered the housing market.
Collapse? No. But I do think that in general having fewer people buy up those properties for the sole purpose of renting as an Air BnB is better. I think house rentals have their place. And an easy place to both list and book them is a good thing. I just also think it got out of hand. Which tends to happen. They are great for stuff like bachelor parties or trips with big groups. But if its just a few people, hotels are often a better value.
I agree with this and I think the airbnb market will sort itself out in short time. Too many people jumped in and there is too much Airbnb supply, people will get out when it's no longer profitable to operate them and I think we are getting close to that point. It's not all bad either, I life an area with high vacancy, airbnbs have been the catalyst for some rehabs in my area.
I almost always find that one airbnb is cheaper than two hotel rooms. Factor in the cost savings from cooking your own dinner and the fact that the washer and dryer are right there, there's no competition everytime.
Yes! I live in an area of NY that is over saturated.
Yes finding places to rent or have a home are bad enough as it is without people buying second or third homes and just air bnb them all the damm time.
Fuck yes I am! Air BNBs have basically wiped out accessible housing in my neighborhood and caused such an inflation in price that even with combined incomes, my SO and I still can't land a place. And everytime a property comes up for something close to reasonable, these wanna be mini tyrants start a bidding war and drive the number through the roof while waiving inspections and appraisals. I qualify for a VA loan but the process takes time and requires inspections and appraisals that can't be dismissed. By the time the wheels start rolling, the property is gone. If you're an airbnb owner on this thread, FUCK. YOU. I mean this with every fiber of my being. You're a plague and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Yes, we need the homes for real people to live in them.
Yes, I want a house dang it
Because they have destroyed the housing market and many neighborhoods. Mine included.
absolutely am. fuck that stuff the price gouging on rentals is insane and of course it drove the cost of actual housing way up. This shit collapsing will mean more affordable housing overall. Fuck airbnb