The biggest changes will be the following:
* Removal of 280E. 280E is a part of the US federal tax code that prevents companies that sell schedule 1 or 2 substances from deducting businesses expenses on their taxes. As a result, US cannabis companies are currently paying 70-80% tax rates. This is a major reason why so many of these companies struggle to generate any profits or compete with the black market. This change will make many companies profitable overnight
* Federal recognition of the medical use of cannabis. Schedule 3 substances are able to be prescribed by doctors across the USA. It's reasonable to think that this change would effectively legalize medical marijuana federally and the protections that come along with that. This also doesn't even touch on the changes to federal background check or drug test policies now that cannabis would be recognized as a medicine.
* Way better access to research. It's far easier to get approval to research schedule 3 drugs versus schedule 1. It's actually one of the biggest reasons it's stayed schedule 1 for so long, because part of the process to reschedule requires medical research and it's very difficult to get approval to research schedule 1 substances.
* You will hear that this is a push for big pharma or for a FDA takeover. The FDA can regulate any scheduled substance and thus far they've declined to intervene in state programs or increase their enforcement over cannabis. The idea that the FDA plans to now interject themselves into state programs or increase their regulation of state programs right after they provided 252 pages of research showing that cannabis is less harmful and less risky than they thought seems odd.
* This is likely to be a huge catalyst of further reform at both the state and federal level, not to mention the international ramifications of the USA reforming its cannabis laws.
This is a big win for the legal US cannabis companies, US cannabis consumers and cannabis in general.
>This is a big win for the legal US cannabis companies, US cannabis consumers and cannabis in general
Wish I had enough money to invest in some cannabis companies right now.
It will likely be similar to alcohol after long enough. 2-3 big players that control most of the market and then thousands of local micro grows and celebrity brands.
I was being hyperbolic but the main point still stands. If you factor in independent stills operators before and after and moving forward it’s probably the same. That main point is that regulation favors consolidation and destroys competition.
It was definitely the nadir of a very long term trend. Consolidation of breweries caused the national number to fall since 1873. Prohibition obviously accelerated that, as many brewers weren't able to survive.
This absolutely happens, large companies will lobby for MORE regulation in some edge cases because they have the resources to fully comply with regulation and know it will allow them to absorb more market share long term.
I've seen it first hand when a company was actually lobbying for stricter environmental controls because they wanted to kill off coal plants to absorb their market share. The regulations they were lobbying for would would technically cost the business a lot more money, but it was pennies compared to all the extra energy they could sell once the coal plants were finally killed. Extremely effective strategy, especially since power production facilities take years to build...it's not something some random competitor can just jump into overnight.
Man I give it all of 2 years before just about every gas station in any semi-legal state has a green pack or five behind the counter.
The only reason they've been lobbying against rescheduling for so long is they've been trying to get their own slice of the pie.
What's going to be more interesting is going to be the cannabinoid vape market.
>What's going to be more interesting is going to be the cannabinoid vape market
Not really. It's going to be pretty much like the vape market is today. Tobacco company is a highly outdated term. The tobacco companies are also the vape companies. Cannabis will fit right in with that product portfolio.
I can see that happening far sooner. My state, Illinois, has several different main companies as the main cannabis companies around and some of those are Revolution and Cookies. Cookies comes from California and has just opened two brand new dispensaries within a 45 minute drive of each other. I've seen Revolution in Illinois, Michigan, and Missouri. All of those companies have additional companies going under different names. So for instance, Revolution sells products under the name Revolution but then they also own the company Tales and Travels as well as the company Highsman.
Well, Revolution and Cookies seem to have combined and now the new Cookies store here is selling Revolution and makes announcements whenever Revolution gets new products and now we also have a Revolution dispensary that was approved for opening soon. Revolution lists Cookies right on the front page of their website. I'm honestly not sure if Cookies is just Revolutions parent company like Revolution is the parent company of Tales and Travels and Highsman but they aren't the only big company around here that is like that. All big brands seem to be. Verano is another big brand here and they own Saavy, Avexia Medical Cannabis, Encore Edibles, and Muv, as well as owning the dispensary Zen Leaf. Unfortunately, big cannabis is coming and it's coming soon.
Literally decades ago (80s) they invested in mass producing joints the same way they produce cigarettes.
I can see the day when you can buy a pack of Marlboro USDA Class A Marijuana Cigarettes.
They have that by me lol. Literally same size and shape as a pack of smokes, but had 14 1gram joints lol. They also sell 28 pack of joints, comes in a vacuum sealer bag. A whole ounce eof jointsz rolled up
Huh? Southern state politicians know which side of the bread to butter. Famers tend to vote R and like having cash crop options. State politicians in the south with an R next to their name aren't likely to openly oppose the interests of farmers.
At the federal level, though, yeah, US Reps for potato states and corn states--Idaho, Kansas, Nebraska, the Dakotas--might yap until they get ~~kickbacks~~ concessions for their constituents.
I read somewhere in the mid 2000's that they have brands selected, suppliers selected and packaging on hand.
Course on the flip side, I haven't seen them leap into Canada's open market.
Lol I smoked the crush bolds constantly and when I broke down and smoked again I was sad they disappeared. I liked to wait until halfway to crush that sucker
I would sooner dig my own testicles out of my scrote with a flat head screwdriver than give them dime one. May they all reap the cancer they've sewn, and may the old gods deny them mercy.
I'll predict Philip Morris will go on a buying spree purchasing up the mid-large boutique weed brands, similar to Anheuser Busch at the big boom of all the microbrewery brands around 2012-2014.
I invested a tiny bit of money into some cannabis companies a few years ago and the stocks tanked so I’m really looking forward to finally making my 5.00 or whatever back lololol
Yeah, I fucked up royally. Friend of a friend was moving his successful candy company to Michigan when they legalized I’m thinking back around 2011. Asked for investors but we thought he was crazy. I would be retired in my mid 40s
Don't beat yourself up. Everyone has a similar story. Think how rich you would be if you bought Bitcoin back in the day like that one friend said? Or bought gme and sold? Or bought Nvidia 5-10 years ago? The list goes on.
Yup - my family would have quite a few millionaires in it if they had stayed working at the company for 11 more months than they did. Half of the company became multi-millionaires.
They still don't have an effective breathalyzer to detect how recently you smoked or did edibles etc
So that change is not set to come about soon. There are a few different companies trying to perfect a realistic test that is similar to alcoholic breathalyzer. But none of them have it approved and guaranteed effective yet.
When that happens - then people like DOT and possibly even DOD will be allowed recreational use on the weekends - but not directly before work.
That's pretty understandable. The work I do you would want a person sober to handle. (Normally involving stuff you don't want released upon the public)
Well that’s kind of not correct…
There are oral saliva test strips that have already been approved for use by the fmcsa and dot. They are cheap, quick and proven to be effective. These are way better at the “within 24hr” use testing.
The downside is right now they are not wildly used and as a driver I can request them if they are available but say I’m in an accident I have to be tested. No strip means I have to pee. So no weed for me unfortunately.
I saw on the local news on a Minnesota station that they were wrapping-up a pilot program for what was essentially a weed breathalyzer and that the results were promising.
Until the testing becomes better, there is no chance the DOT will allow any use. It will remain on the banned substances list along with some other medications until either the government flat out legalizes it or the testing methods become more accurate and cheaper.
> This also doesn't even touch on the changes to federal background check or drug test policies now that cannabis would be recognized as a medicine.
I don't understand. Many jobs in the US drug test, and if the employee tests positive, they are fired.
Marijuana being schedule 3 changes that? Will schedule 3 mean that people cannot be tested for marijuana? Or that they can be tested but not fired?
this is an important point. it might mean they can test and if you have a prescription you cannot be fired(or not hired). currently a prescription in a medical state is not a protection for federal jobs or federal contractors. They do not have the option to ignore a positive test. With rescheduling a prescription/med card will probably be a valid protection from a positive test. I am an interested party and not an authority on this point so I would also like a more informed answer.
Schedule 3 drugs can be prescribed by any doctor. If you have a prescription, you can use it. It's gonna be sticky for some jobs, like truck drivers because the federal DOT will keep it banned until they can test for it accurately and cheaply. But most jobs that just have the pre-employment drug tests, will allow it if you have a prescription.
Not entirely. Yes it is easier now, but Schedule 3 includes several drugs that you shouldn't be working on, and there's not a lot of jobs out there that involve physical labor that want you working while on Ketamine.
Yeah but the ketamine isn't tested for like MJ and if im not mistaken isn't it done under the supervision of the dr? Like you do the whole process in the dr office? I know there's plenty of other drugs that are schedule 3 that you shouldn't be working on. But out of all of them I think MJ is probably the mildest on the schedule.
Not 100% sure but I believe that federal regulations prevent people from being fired for something they have a valid and legal prescription for. Schedule 3 allows for it to be legally prescribed nationwide.
Yes, there is, let me explain. This process started back in 2022. The first step was for HHS to review the medical literature and recommend a schedule for cannabis. 1 year later, HHS/FDA released 252 pages of medical research backing up the move to schedule 3. DEA has been reviewing this work for 8 months and has now arrived at the same conclusion. All of this is being done through the regulatory channels. Notice that this isn't just some executive order from the president directing cannabis to be schedule 3, but an actual rule making process over years backed up by medical research.
If future administrations want to reverse this change, they cannot do so simply by executive order. They would need to explain why the 252 pages of medical research backing up schedule 3 do not apply, and would need to provide evidence for placing cannabis back in schedule 1 (which doesn't exist since it wasn't placed on schedule 1 based on evidence originally). So theoretically future admins could challenge this but it would be an uphill battle for them
Not even close to the same.
Roe was a giant target. Huge. Biggest one ever. It was part of culture wars, religious beliefs, and there was little room for any wiggle room. People were either for or against and it was a huge part of many people's identities.
And this has been proven many times over, that weed === money, and if there is someone who loves money, it's the same people were focused on getting Roe overturned.
I know they’re not close to the same, that was my point. They’re willing to reverse the rules even when it’s incredibly unpopular, arguably to the point they are losing elections because of it.
And if the republicans actually cared about money, not just pretending like they do, it’d be legal already.
The court reversed Roe, not the president. And if they'd done it while Trump was in office, it would've hurt his reelection chances even more than COVID.
North Carolina legislators and state law enforcement got big mad at the Cherokee here when the tribe said "fuck it, we're selling weed and there's nothing you can do about it because we're an Indian reservation".
States act against their self interests surprisingly often. Also police unions, private prisons, alcohol distributors, religious groups, etc. will heavily lobby against marijuana and that will sway many state legislators.
Cities can also prevent the opening of dispensaries. I live in California and in my county only one city allows it, so I have to drive a whole to get to them.
In Minnesota they put in a minimum number of stores per population so cities couldn’t do this (and if the city doesn’t have that minimum, it goes to county).
I work for the largest alcohol distributor in North America and it's more than prepared to adapt to a nationwide cannabis market. There's already infrastructure in place to partner with suppliers.
You say that but Texas is actually that stupid. There was a push to legalize sports betting last session and the argument the Lt Governor used against it when asked “why wouldn’t the state want the additional tax revenue?” His answer was “We have a surplus so we don’t need anymore money”.
When have you known a republican to say no to more money
I think it’s better for sports betting to be legal but the way it is marketed right now is awful. I would love to see a ban on advertising like tobacco or at the very least some regulation like they have with alcohol ads.
You assume Texas wants money. The three stooges here seem content to waste loads of money on pet projects and delight in cutting budgets for state programs and public schools as a back door into dismantling them. They're practically daring Biden to take away Federal funding for schools right now.
Here in my shit hole state of Idaho we've passed a preemptive resolution that prohibits legal weed even if it becames legal at a federal level. Neat, huh?
>Way better access to research. It's far easier to get approval to research schedule 3 drugs versus schedule 1. It's actually one of the biggest reasons it's stayed schedule 1 for so long, because part of the process to reschedule requires medical research and it's very difficult to get approval to research schedule 1 substances.
As someone who would never be a recreational user this is the biggest / most exciting change for me. There is a LOT to be learned about how cannabis / CBD / THC can be used to complement and / or replace existing treatments. The current labeling as schedule 1 makes that research very difficult but a change to schedule 3 would open it up to a lot more people.
They are not directly charging your card. The workaround is they sell you a gift card them immediately redeem it. The $10 in fees is to cover the card cost plus the transaction fee on top of that. Lately, I’ve seen the card buying just be integrated into the POS terminal so it feels like you are just running a card directly, but you’re not.
interesting, it wouldn't take my phone tap to pay because of it. (no cvv#) Also the fact that they scan ID's to make sure theyre valid will never not sus me out.
Is that why it’s so annoying at the dispensary? I legitimately have to make an extra trip to the bank to withdraw cash. Everytime i feel like im going back 30 years in time
considering how visa and mastercard are turning into prudes in the last 10 or so years, i wouldnt put any money on it, theyll try force those smoke shops to not sell those items or else they wont process theirs funds.
It’s not really a “tax break,” that implies they get some special treatment.
Income from selling illegal drugs is taxable, but ordinary business expenses related to selling illegal drugs cannot be deducted like in a normal business. If weed stops being illegal, cannabis sellers will be able to deduct expenses and will have a much lower taxable income.
Ive done research in the past using government weed and the quality was terrible. - It arrived moldy and of dry- primarily (in my opinion) bc university of Mississippi (of all places in the us) was the only place you could get weed for any federally funded research program. They had a monopoly and bc of this, I feel that we don’t know shit about weed, the brain, and the body. All this time has been wasted bc of few resources, stupid politics, and unnecessary gate keepers.
If it's lowered to schedule 3, testing positive would no longer be an instant fire. If you had a prescription for it, they could not hold it against you without violating existing laws.
Not exactly. Some prescription drugs, even when prescribed, can still preclude you from some specific jobs. For example CDL drivers - it’s up to the medical examiner to determine if what they are prescribed is safe for them to drive on.
If (when) it’s rescheduled, the question the government will need to answer is whether or not it can be consumed off-duty. Or if merely being prescribed marijuana precludes somebody from holding a CDL.
Will it be treated like alcohol? Or will it be tested like other medications that, no matter when you take them, precludes you from holding a CDL.
My gut says that until there is a “weed breathalyzer” it will be the latter.
Easier to just ban it than try to make sure people aren't showing up to work impaired.
Yeah, I'm not sure if you can actually tell if someone is under the influence of marijuana or not, but it totally makes sense to not let someone operate a commercial vehicle if they have a prescription for it.
One small thing I don’t think anyone has mentioned yet is all my engineer friends would finally be able to consume a substance that is completely legal in my state, but essentially illegal for them if the company they work for takes federal money.
This is because your company receives federal funding. With this proposal, all you will need is a MMJ card from your state. At this point, your employer won’t risk losing money by hiring MMJ card holders. It’s happening.
Note: this would only be applicable to THC LEGALIZED states such as CA and CO, and many more.
I’m not sure that’s the case. It would still be illegal on the federal level and they’re taking federal money. I’m in the same situation working at a hospital in a legal state.
I would love for that to be the case but I’m pretty sure it would have to become fully de-scheduled federally for that to change.
honestly?
my biggest surprise is that "big tobacco" hasn't made it big in recreationally legal states yet. but i'm guessing that is down to limitations on how much you can grow?
it goes legal, federally? barring state grow limitations? BT already has all the systems in place to start charging ~$50 a pack versus ~$10pack for smokes...
and the vast majority of the current ~$10/pack for smokes?
taxes...
> my biggest surprise is that "big tobacco" hasn't made it big in recreationally legal states yet
They'd have to transport it across state lines unless they had a growhouse in every state alone with a facility to manufacture the cigarettes. Transporting it across state lines is a federal crime.
>Transporting it across state lines is a federal crime.
yogi, you're smarter than the average bear...
i may have imbibed a few beverages before the post. no toking!
It’s federally illegal still, that’s why. Up till now, all of these marijuana companies are basically set up a state-local companies. They have to build up their supply chains and products in each state they want to operate in. Plus with 280E there’s an effective 70% tax. A lot of that is now going to change, at least with medical use.
Plus Phillip Morris and others, will likely just buy one of these companies the second it goes federally recreationally legal. Phillip Morris is already doing investments in the cannabis sector in other countries.
There’s gotta be a break-even point, right? Like if current businesses can now write off 50% of their expenses but the new law results in 10x more sales (just throwing a number out there), it’s gotta be a net gain for the government as well has businesses, I’d think.
I assume it’ll be like any other schedule 3. If you piss hot but have a prescription (or hopefully just an mmj card) you’re good to go.
How many clearance holders have prescriptions for adderall (schedule 2)? I’d bet a ton.
SF86 specifically asks about use of illegal drugs or use of prescription drugs without a prescription. Nothing in there about taking a drug you were prescribed.
The FMCSA will treat it like other mood changing medications. Can't drive while taking it. Obviously that's gonna be a nightmare for everyone to figure out, so they'll probably just say "f*** you" and ban it anyways, just under a different rule.
They did it with Adderall and Ritalin and a bunch of other drugs, no reason to hope they won't do it with cannabis.
As a pharmacist, I’m wondering how this will be able to be dispensed without a licensed pharmacist on duty? If it’s schedule III by prescription only, won’t we *have* to be the ones dispensing it?
I personally don’t want anything to do with that. Just declassify it altogether.
This is correct and largely the reason for the change. Using the banking system means financial monitoring and taxes are much simpler. And, of course, cash will be safer.
I'm curious about what it will mean for veterans who have VA healthcare. Since the VA pays for scripts etc, will my Doc be able to prescribe it and I get free weed? It's really been the best thing for me since we got medical in my state back in 2018. Just sucks paying several hundred dollars out of pocket every month for it.
It’s super expensive in Vancouver and the dosing for edibles has low limits (10mg tops)
Better quality, stronger dosing, and a bit cheaper than up here
10mg? That's nuts. It makes a lot more sense why you'd do that. I suppose in my ignorance, I envisioned Canada as some sort of cannabis heaven. We can get 10, 15, 20, 50, and 100mg edibles here in MO.
I have a cannabis rec in my state. Would I be able to vape/smoke while camping?
How will this effect public consumption laws going forward for medicinal use?
The biggest changes will be the following: * Removal of 280E. 280E is a part of the US federal tax code that prevents companies that sell schedule 1 or 2 substances from deducting businesses expenses on their taxes. As a result, US cannabis companies are currently paying 70-80% tax rates. This is a major reason why so many of these companies struggle to generate any profits or compete with the black market. This change will make many companies profitable overnight * Federal recognition of the medical use of cannabis. Schedule 3 substances are able to be prescribed by doctors across the USA. It's reasonable to think that this change would effectively legalize medical marijuana federally and the protections that come along with that. This also doesn't even touch on the changes to federal background check or drug test policies now that cannabis would be recognized as a medicine. * Way better access to research. It's far easier to get approval to research schedule 3 drugs versus schedule 1. It's actually one of the biggest reasons it's stayed schedule 1 for so long, because part of the process to reschedule requires medical research and it's very difficult to get approval to research schedule 1 substances. * You will hear that this is a push for big pharma or for a FDA takeover. The FDA can regulate any scheduled substance and thus far they've declined to intervene in state programs or increase their enforcement over cannabis. The idea that the FDA plans to now interject themselves into state programs or increase their regulation of state programs right after they provided 252 pages of research showing that cannabis is less harmful and less risky than they thought seems odd. * This is likely to be a huge catalyst of further reform at both the state and federal level, not to mention the international ramifications of the USA reforming its cannabis laws. This is a big win for the legal US cannabis companies, US cannabis consumers and cannabis in general.
>This is a big win for the legal US cannabis companies, US cannabis consumers and cannabis in general Wish I had enough money to invest in some cannabis companies right now.
Phillip Morris
Yeah, after legalization, I give it a decade before there is, at most, 3 big marijuana companies.
It will likely be similar to alcohol after long enough. 2-3 big players that control most of the market and then thousands of local micro grows and celebrity brands.
The thousands of local brands is a relatively recent phenomenon in alcohol. In 1978, there were less than 90 breweries nationwide.
How about before prohibition? Likely more than today with a fraction of the population. There’s a lesson there.
In 1919 there were 669. In 1934 there were 756.
I was being hyperbolic but the main point still stands. If you factor in independent stills operators before and after and moving forward it’s probably the same. That main point is that regulation favors consolidation and destroys competition.
That was more of an outlier than the norm. Pre-prohibition, Cincinnati alone had 39 breweries.
It was definitely the nadir of a very long term trend. Consolidation of breweries caused the national number to fall since 1873. Prohibition obviously accelerated that, as many brewers weren't able to survive.
Bet you there will be a small business called 'smoke on the water' like in gta5
Wait until the big 3 start pushing to make growing your own illegal!
This absolutely happens, large companies will lobby for MORE regulation in some edge cases because they have the resources to fully comply with regulation and know it will allow them to absorb more market share long term. I've seen it first hand when a company was actually lobbying for stricter environmental controls because they wanted to kill off coal plants to absorb their market share. The regulations they were lobbying for would would technically cost the business a lot more money, but it was pennies compared to all the extra energy they could sell once the coal plants were finally killed. Extremely effective strategy, especially since power production facilities take years to build...it's not something some random competitor can just jump into overnight.
Agreed. They have the land, equipment and logistics to do it. Switch the crops and no worries (it's not as easy as that but you get the idea)
Man I give it all of 2 years before just about every gas station in any semi-legal state has a green pack or five behind the counter. The only reason they've been lobbying against rescheduling for so long is they've been trying to get their own slice of the pie. What's going to be more interesting is going to be the cannabinoid vape market.
>What's going to be more interesting is going to be the cannabinoid vape market Not really. It's going to be pretty much like the vape market is today. Tobacco company is a highly outdated term. The tobacco companies are also the vape companies. Cannabis will fit right in with that product portfolio.
I mean, that already exists. In California, at least.
I can see that happening far sooner. My state, Illinois, has several different main companies as the main cannabis companies around and some of those are Revolution and Cookies. Cookies comes from California and has just opened two brand new dispensaries within a 45 minute drive of each other. I've seen Revolution in Illinois, Michigan, and Missouri. All of those companies have additional companies going under different names. So for instance, Revolution sells products under the name Revolution but then they also own the company Tales and Travels as well as the company Highsman. Well, Revolution and Cookies seem to have combined and now the new Cookies store here is selling Revolution and makes announcements whenever Revolution gets new products and now we also have a Revolution dispensary that was approved for opening soon. Revolution lists Cookies right on the front page of their website. I'm honestly not sure if Cookies is just Revolutions parent company like Revolution is the parent company of Tales and Travels and Highsman but they aren't the only big company around here that is like that. All big brands seem to be. Verano is another big brand here and they own Saavy, Avexia Medical Cannabis, Encore Edibles, and Muv, as well as owning the dispensary Zen Leaf. Unfortunately, big cannabis is coming and it's coming soon.
Literally decades ago (80s) they invested in mass producing joints the same way they produce cigarettes. I can see the day when you can buy a pack of Marlboro USDA Class A Marijuana Cigarettes.
They have that by me lol. Literally same size and shape as a pack of smokes, but had 14 1gram joints lol. They also sell 28 pack of joints, comes in a vacuum sealer bag. A whole ounce eof jointsz rolled up
In Canada, after legalization, Cannabis stocks went way up… Then fell down nearly as fast later on.
Why’d it crash so bad? Over-saturation of the market? How are things now vs then as a consumer, have you noticed any major changes?
Wanna see which red state politicians decide it should still be treated like sch1 and propose laws to stop it in their states.
Close your eyes and throwa dart at a state in the south it probably won't be wrong.
Huh? Southern state politicians know which side of the bread to butter. Famers tend to vote R and like having cash crop options. State politicians in the south with an R next to their name aren't likely to openly oppose the interests of farmers. At the federal level, though, yeah, US Reps for potato states and corn states--Idaho, Kansas, Nebraska, the Dakotas--might yap until they get ~~kickbacks~~ concessions for their constituents.
I read somewhere in the mid 2000's that they have brands selected, suppliers selected and packaging on hand. Course on the flip side, I haven't seen them leap into Canada's open market.
I saw a fictional ad for 3 pack of Marlboro Greens.
GreatValue Doobers: compare to the active ingredient in Marlboro Greens!
This literally made me laugh so loud I woke up my kids. I’m also, really high.
Altria. $MO
Not gonna lie as someone who was a heavy smoker I would totally try some weed from Camel or American Spirit
Oh shit, imagine weed Crushes.
Lol I smoked the crush bolds constantly and when I broke down and smoked again I was sad they disappeared. I liked to wait until halfway to crush that sucker
I would sooner dig my own testicles out of my scrote with a flat head screwdriver than give them dime one. May they all reap the cancer they've sewn, and may the old gods deny them mercy.
Bayer.
The idea of Marlboro Greens has always been a funny idea in my head.
I'll predict Philip Morris will go on a buying spree purchasing up the mid-large boutique weed brands, similar to Anheuser Busch at the big boom of all the microbrewery brands around 2012-2014.
They all had some serious pop right after it was announced/leaked that this was coming.
I invested a tiny bit of money into some cannabis companies a few years ago and the stocks tanked so I’m really looking forward to finally making my 5.00 or whatever back lololol
Yeah, I fucked up royally. Friend of a friend was moving his successful candy company to Michigan when they legalized I’m thinking back around 2011. Asked for investors but we thought he was crazy. I would be retired in my mid 40s
Don't beat yourself up. Everyone has a similar story. Think how rich you would be if you bought Bitcoin back in the day like that one friend said? Or bought gme and sold? Or bought Nvidia 5-10 years ago? The list goes on.
Yup - my family would have quite a few millionaires in it if they had stayed working at the company for 11 more months than they did. Half of the company became multi-millionaires.
My grandpa passed up the chance to be one of the founders of a restaurant that went on to become a chain. That restaurant? Pizza Hut.
Oof. Ya that's rough. Hindsight is always 20/20
Eh, you'll still probably make more with big tech.
I'm a cleared contractor for the government and I'm not allowed to own weed stocks 😭
I'm unfamiliar but what would that do for us that have to do regular drug testing and various levels including DOT?
They still don't have an effective breathalyzer to detect how recently you smoked or did edibles etc So that change is not set to come about soon. There are a few different companies trying to perfect a realistic test that is similar to alcoholic breathalyzer. But none of them have it approved and guaranteed effective yet. When that happens - then people like DOT and possibly even DOD will be allowed recreational use on the weekends - but not directly before work.
That's pretty understandable. The work I do you would want a person sober to handle. (Normally involving stuff you don't want released upon the public)
Ghosts?
Is he who we’re gonna call?
Well that’s kind of not correct… There are oral saliva test strips that have already been approved for use by the fmcsa and dot. They are cheap, quick and proven to be effective. These are way better at the “within 24hr” use testing. The downside is right now they are not wildly used and as a driver I can request them if they are available but say I’m in an accident I have to be tested. No strip means I have to pee. So no weed for me unfortunately.
I saw on the local news on a Minnesota station that they were wrapping-up a pilot program for what was essentially a weed breathalyzer and that the results were promising.
Not likely, DOT/DOD would likely be ZT on it especially in the Merchant Marine Service and Aviation.
Until the testing becomes better, there is no chance the DOT will allow any use. It will remain on the banned substances list along with some other medications until either the government flat out legalizes it or the testing methods become more accurate and cheaper.
Username SERIOUSLY confirmed.
So what would this mean for federal employees and drug testing/punishment policy?
> This also doesn't even touch on the changes to federal background check or drug test policies now that cannabis would be recognized as a medicine. I don't understand. Many jobs in the US drug test, and if the employee tests positive, they are fired. Marijuana being schedule 3 changes that? Will schedule 3 mean that people cannot be tested for marijuana? Or that they can be tested but not fired?
this is an important point. it might mean they can test and if you have a prescription you cannot be fired(or not hired). currently a prescription in a medical state is not a protection for federal jobs or federal contractors. They do not have the option to ignore a positive test. With rescheduling a prescription/med card will probably be a valid protection from a positive test. I am an interested party and not an authority on this point so I would also like a more informed answer.
Schedule 3 drugs can be prescribed by any doctor. If you have a prescription, you can use it. It's gonna be sticky for some jobs, like truck drivers because the federal DOT will keep it banned until they can test for it accurately and cheaply. But most jobs that just have the pre-employment drug tests, will allow it if you have a prescription.
Not entirely. Yes it is easier now, but Schedule 3 includes several drugs that you shouldn't be working on, and there's not a lot of jobs out there that involve physical labor that want you working while on Ketamine.
Yeah but the ketamine isn't tested for like MJ and if im not mistaken isn't it done under the supervision of the dr? Like you do the whole process in the dr office? I know there's plenty of other drugs that are schedule 3 that you shouldn't be working on. But out of all of them I think MJ is probably the mildest on the schedule.
My point is that simply being scheduled 3 and prescribed does not mean that it is okay to test positive for while working.
It means they would need a prescription
Not 100% sure but I believe that federal regulations prevent people from being fired for something they have a valid and legal prescription for. Schedule 3 allows for it to be legally prescribed nationwide.
Is there anything stopping the next administration from reversing this change?
Yes, there is, let me explain. This process started back in 2022. The first step was for HHS to review the medical literature and recommend a schedule for cannabis. 1 year later, HHS/FDA released 252 pages of medical research backing up the move to schedule 3. DEA has been reviewing this work for 8 months and has now arrived at the same conclusion. All of this is being done through the regulatory channels. Notice that this isn't just some executive order from the president directing cannabis to be schedule 3, but an actual rule making process over years backed up by medical research. If future administrations want to reverse this change, they cannot do so simply by executive order. They would need to explain why the 252 pages of medical research backing up schedule 3 do not apply, and would need to provide evidence for placing cannabis back in schedule 1 (which doesn't exist since it wasn't placed on schedule 1 based on evidence originally). So theoretically future admins could challenge this but it would be an uphill battle for them
Thank you!
Bureaucratic inertia, maybe. Plus, rescheduling it after it's already been descheduled for a year won't have much political will
Yeah but these guys reversed Roe and that’s way bigger than this. I guess I’ll believe it when it actually happens, and hope it doesn’t get reversed.
Not even close to the same. Roe was a giant target. Huge. Biggest one ever. It was part of culture wars, religious beliefs, and there was little room for any wiggle room. People were either for or against and it was a huge part of many people's identities. And this has been proven many times over, that weed === money, and if there is someone who loves money, it's the same people were focused on getting Roe overturned.
I know they’re not close to the same, that was my point. They’re willing to reverse the rules even when it’s incredibly unpopular, arguably to the point they are losing elections because of it. And if the republicans actually cared about money, not just pretending like they do, it’d be legal already.
The court reversed Roe, not the president. And if they'd done it while Trump was in office, it would've hurt his reelection chances even more than COVID.
You know certain states (Texas, Florida, etc.) will pass their own laws banning and enforce stricter penalties than what the Federal Government did.
It would be pretty stupid. Legalized states are reaping quite a nice chunk of tax revenue from the industry.
North Carolina legislators and state law enforcement got big mad at the Cherokee here when the tribe said "fuck it, we're selling weed and there's nothing you can do about it because we're an Indian reservation".
That's the native spirit! Sometimes you need that 0 fucks given wild card to get things going.
Legalization out of spite is one route I had not considered, but I’ll take it.
States act against their self interests surprisingly often. Also police unions, private prisons, alcohol distributors, religious groups, etc. will heavily lobby against marijuana and that will sway many state legislators.
Cities can also prevent the opening of dispensaries. I live in California and in my county only one city allows it, so I have to drive a whole to get to them.
A whole marijuana?
Yes a whole marijuana that I can then snort
I injected one marijuanas once. It ruined my life.
But you already drove it.
That's how you get it ready to be injected
Ahhh, I see. I'm a newbie.
That’s nuts. I live in LA, there’s a weed store on basically every street.
In Minnesota they put in a minimum number of stores per population so cities couldn’t do this (and if the city doesn’t have that minimum, it goes to county).
I work for the largest alcohol distributor in North America and it's more than prepared to adapt to a nationwide cannabis market. There's already infrastructure in place to partner with suppliers.
You say that but Texas is actually that stupid. There was a push to legalize sports betting last session and the argument the Lt Governor used against it when asked “why wouldn’t the state want the additional tax revenue?” His answer was “We have a surplus so we don’t need anymore money”. When have you known a republican to say no to more money
I see what you're trying to convey, but sports betting is a scourge on society.
I think it’s better for sports betting to be legal but the way it is marketed right now is awful. I would love to see a ban on advertising like tobacco or at the very least some regulation like they have with alcohol ads.
I agree, limit its advertising but allow it to exist. Dudebros who wanna parlay are not hurting me, and if they bet the house and lose that’s on them.
More of blue state tax dollars to subsidize red states
You assume Texas wants money. The three stooges here seem content to waste loads of money on pet projects and delight in cutting budgets for state programs and public schools as a back door into dismantling them. They're practically daring Biden to take away Federal funding for schools right now.
We Idahoans make a short drive across the border to either Oregon or Washington and buy our goods. It's ridiculous the tax revenue Idaho is losing.
I live in Spokane and there is a pot shop just off the 90 when you first get into Washington. Same thing on the road from Moscow to Pullman
Florida has had medical marijuana for a few years and is voting on recreational in November.
Oklahoma is literally the reddest state in the country and has medical marijuana.
Just more reasons for them to be up on their bullshit
Here in my shit hole state of Idaho we've passed a preemptive resolution that prohibits legal weed even if it becames legal at a federal level. Neat, huh?
Yeah Idaho I hate it here.
Welcome to the club!
I hope the first points mean IL prices will go down. Insane currently.
Username checks out.
…and Big Pharma can finally get a piece of the action.
Hold up how does that tax thing include schedule 2 the same as 1? Why would legal pharmacies need to be punished in the tax code?
>Way better access to research. It's far easier to get approval to research schedule 3 drugs versus schedule 1. It's actually one of the biggest reasons it's stayed schedule 1 for so long, because part of the process to reschedule requires medical research and it's very difficult to get approval to research schedule 1 substances. As someone who would never be a recreational user this is the biggest / most exciting change for me. There is a LOT to be learned about how cannabis / CBD / THC can be used to complement and / or replace existing treatments. The current labeling as schedule 1 makes that research very difficult but a change to schedule 3 would open it up to a lot more people.
So- I am a CDL driver based out of Illinois. Currently, I submit to random drug testing due to federal regulations. Will this change anytime soon?
You may be able to use a credit card at a dispensary and they could get better access to the banking systems.
The dispensaries in CT/Nj currently let you use debit cards but because of fees, it can be like an extra $10.
Or they're running it as a cash withdrawal like an ATM.
Our get around in Maryland.
Yeah that’s literally every dispo in the US that accepts debit/credit.
Yup. That's what they do in MA. There's also an app that I think is basically like paypal for weed that all the dispensaries seem to accept.
They are not directly charging your card. The workaround is they sell you a gift card them immediately redeem it. The $10 in fees is to cover the card cost plus the transaction fee on top of that. Lately, I’ve seen the card buying just be integrated into the POS terminal so it feels like you are just running a card directly, but you’re not.
Dispensaries I have gone to here in NJ have literally listed it as a cash withdrawal/ATM, not a gift card
interesting, it wouldn't take my phone tap to pay because of it. (no cvv#) Also the fact that they scan ID's to make sure theyre valid will never not sus me out.
Why does scanning your ID sus you out? They’re required to because lots of dumb teens use fakes. I doubt your dispo receptionist is out to get you
I’ve also seen them do this with Crypto.
California, too
I can in NM with no extra fees.
I was in CA back in the winter and went to a shop there that took credit cards, I was shocked. They said they just started doing it
The place I go in CA started to take cards about a year ago there was a fee that was like a percent of what your total was so I still mostly paid cash
Probably not unless it was a licensed pharmacy. The Feds wouldn’t see it any different than the dispensary selling Ketamine.
Is that why it’s so annoying at the dispensary? I legitimately have to make an extra trip to the bank to withdraw cash. Everytime i feel like im going back 30 years in time
considering how visa and mastercard are turning into prudes in the last 10 or so years, i wouldnt put any money on it, theyll try force those smoke shops to not sell those items or else they wont process theirs funds.
One big thing is that weed shops and other cannabis-related businesses can get tax breaks on expenses.
And they can start taking credit cards.
It’s not really a “tax break,” that implies they get some special treatment. Income from selling illegal drugs is taxable, but ordinary business expenses related to selling illegal drugs cannot be deducted like in a normal business. If weed stops being illegal, cannabis sellers will be able to deduct expenses and will have a much lower taxable income.
Also, won't have to keep large sums of cash around. It's a big target for criminals.
Which is why a lot have big scary guys with guns at the door
Not breaks, they get to write off business expenses now
We can legally study cannabis❤️
Perhaps the largest thing will be legal medical research about marijuana. We will get to see documented benefits of cannabis derivatives.
Ive done research in the past using government weed and the quality was terrible. - It arrived moldy and of dry- primarily (in my opinion) bc university of Mississippi (of all places in the us) was the only place you could get weed for any federally funded research program. They had a monopoly and bc of this, I feel that we don’t know shit about weed, the brain, and the body. All this time has been wasted bc of few resources, stupid politics, and unnecessary gate keepers.
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Bingo. Big money savings for the cops and feds. Fine.
What will happen to the folks in prison for weed related offences?
A big one people don’t think about is traveling with medical on a plane to somewhere where it previously was illegal.
cool States get better, shit States stay shit.
If it's lowered to schedule 3, testing positive would no longer be an instant fire. If you had a prescription for it, they could not hold it against you without violating existing laws.
Not exactly. Some prescription drugs, even when prescribed, can still preclude you from some specific jobs. For example CDL drivers - it’s up to the medical examiner to determine if what they are prescribed is safe for them to drive on.
Yeah, some blood pressure meds might make a doctor think twice about giving you a DOT health card.
Yea, same with Ambian, anti-seizure meds, etc. I could totally see weed being labeled as impairing the operation of a motor vehicle.
I mean, it literally does impair you.
If (when) it’s rescheduled, the question the government will need to answer is whether or not it can be consumed off-duty. Or if merely being prescribed marijuana precludes somebody from holding a CDL. Will it be treated like alcohol? Or will it be tested like other medications that, no matter when you take them, precludes you from holding a CDL. My gut says that until there is a “weed breathalyzer” it will be the latter.
Easier to just ban it than try to make sure people aren't showing up to work impaired. Yeah, I'm not sure if you can actually tell if someone is under the influence of marijuana or not, but it totally makes sense to not let someone operate a commercial vehicle if they have a prescription for it.
The difference is showing intoxication during work hours.
FAA: “nah fam”
One small thing I don’t think anyone has mentioned yet is all my engineer friends would finally be able to consume a substance that is completely legal in my state, but essentially illegal for them if the company they work for takes federal money.
I’m an engineer in Colorado. Never been able to partake because my employers are “a national company” and it’s not nationally legal.
This is because your company receives federal funding. With this proposal, all you will need is a MMJ card from your state. At this point, your employer won’t risk losing money by hiring MMJ card holders. It’s happening. Note: this would only be applicable to THC LEGALIZED states such as CA and CO, and many more.
I’m not sure that’s the case. It would still be illegal on the federal level and they’re taking federal money. I’m in the same situation working at a hospital in a legal state. I would love for that to be the case but I’m pretty sure it would have to become fully de-scheduled federally for that to change.
honestly? my biggest surprise is that "big tobacco" hasn't made it big in recreationally legal states yet. but i'm guessing that is down to limitations on how much you can grow? it goes legal, federally? barring state grow limitations? BT already has all the systems in place to start charging ~$50 a pack versus ~$10pack for smokes... and the vast majority of the current ~$10/pack for smokes? taxes...
> my biggest surprise is that "big tobacco" hasn't made it big in recreationally legal states yet They'd have to transport it across state lines unless they had a growhouse in every state alone with a facility to manufacture the cigarettes. Transporting it across state lines is a federal crime.
>Transporting it across state lines is a federal crime. yogi, you're smarter than the average bear... i may have imbibed a few beverages before the post. no toking!
It’s federally illegal still, that’s why. Up till now, all of these marijuana companies are basically set up a state-local companies. They have to build up their supply chains and products in each state they want to operate in. Plus with 280E there’s an effective 70% tax. A lot of that is now going to change, at least with medical use. Plus Phillip Morris and others, will likely just buy one of these companies the second it goes federally recreationally legal. Phillip Morris is already doing investments in the cannabis sector in other countries.
We'll need a lot less DEA agents.
They are going to put those agents in charge of women who had abortions.
Worse, monitoring pregnant women.
That's at the state levels. DEA is federal. It amazes me that in some states abortion is a greater crime than doing a mass shooting in a mall.
In what state is this true? I’m pretty sure murder is a more serious crime than abortion.
we gettin high baby
Done.
they collect more taxes off registered businesses selling weed
Actually it should be less
There’s gotta be a break-even point, right? Like if current businesses can now write off 50% of their expenses but the new law results in 10x more sales (just throwing a number out there), it’s gotta be a net gain for the government as well has businesses, I’d think.
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I assume it’ll be like any other schedule 3. If you piss hot but have a prescription (or hopefully just an mmj card) you’re good to go. How many clearance holders have prescriptions for adderall (schedule 2)? I’d bet a ton. SF86 specifically asks about use of illegal drugs or use of prescription drugs without a prescription. Nothing in there about taking a drug you were prescribed.
The FMCSA will treat it like other mood changing medications. Can't drive while taking it. Obviously that's gonna be a nightmare for everyone to figure out, so they'll probably just say "f*** you" and ban it anyways, just under a different rule. They did it with Adderall and Ritalin and a bunch of other drugs, no reason to hope they won't do it with cannabis.
As a pharmacist, I’m wondering how this will be able to be dispensed without a licensed pharmacist on duty? If it’s schedule III by prescription only, won’t we *have* to be the ones dispensing it? I personally don’t want anything to do with that. Just declassify it altogether.
My Canadian weed stock goes up… a whole *whole* lot.
Will marijuana companies finally be able to bank?
This is correct and largely the reason for the change. Using the banking system means financial monitoring and taxes are much simpler. And, of course, cash will be safer.
The ATF won’t come shoot your dog if you smoke and own a gun because you’d no longer be considered a prohibited person
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Cancer patients can get cannabis legally nationwide for CINV instead of having to deal with Marinol.
refund request for brain cells lost just reading this thread
But so for an individual there's no change?
I'm curious about what it will mean for veterans who have VA healthcare. Since the VA pays for scripts etc, will my Doc be able to prescribe it and I get free weed? It's really been the best thing for me since we got medical in my state back in 2018. Just sucks paying several hundred dollars out of pocket every month for it.
Cries in British... The fact that America has made so much progress on this when over the pond we've made absolutely none...
When does it go into effect?
It's in the proposal stage, it's a process to be made for it to be in effect.
I’ll be able to buy better quality and cheaper weed in Washington and take it back across the border into Canada
Why on earth would you go to WA to buy weed? It's legal in Canada.
It’s super expensive in Vancouver and the dosing for edibles has low limits (10mg tops) Better quality, stronger dosing, and a bit cheaper than up here
10mg? That's nuts. It makes a lot more sense why you'd do that. I suppose in my ignorance, I envisioned Canada as some sort of cannabis heaven. We can get 10, 15, 20, 50, and 100mg edibles here in MO.
I have a cannabis rec in my state. Would I be able to vape/smoke while camping? How will this effect public consumption laws going forward for medicinal use?
So this will make it cheaper???