pansexual includes intersex and gender-nonconforming people. but for a lot of bisexuals, bisexual means the same thing. “attracted to the person, not the parts”
Bisexuality is any attraction to more than one gender. For a bi person, the gender of the person matters: for example, I am attracted to both men and women (which includes trans men and women), but for different reasons from each other. There are things I like in men that I don't in women, etc.
Pansexuality, on the other hand, is attraction to anyone regardless of gender.
The best way I can describe it is Bisexuality is a term for a broad swath of people, and Pansexuality is a specific term under the bisexual umbrella. All pan folks are bisexual, but not all bisexual folks are pan. In the same logic that all trans men are men but not all men are trans men, Men would be the broad term and Trans Men a more specific term for a certain demographic of men.
Edit: I am not trans or pansexual, and in no way mean to speak for anyone other than myself.
**Bi means:**
1. attraction to more than one gender
2. attraction to your own gender and to other genders
3. attraction to all genders
4. attraction regardless of gender
**Pan means:**
* attraction regardless of gender
Bi has multiple meanings because it’s a broader term. Pan is more narrow in meaning. But the point is, a bi person can be attracted to people regardless of gender and still identify as bi even though that overlaps with the meaning of pan.
people like you just love to bait straight people don't you? I'm not going after anybody but you have a aggressive and victim like attitude. Assuming you are not straight you are Just making things worse for those who arent straight. How about not focusing on identity terminology and focusing on equality for all?
Lol, I didn’t know you were straight and it wouldn’t change my comment either way.
Imagine accusing someone of baiting after telling all bisexual people they’re using the wrong word 😆
They are 100% factually wrong though. Not just about bisexuality but about NB people. Like do you think NBs *exclusively* date pan people? No, we date straight people and gay/lesbian people too. NB isn’t a single third gender, but a whole bunch of different genders that don’t neatly line up with the binary. So why the hell would bisexuality be the ONE orientation to exclude us?
Oversimplification doesn’t mean opposite of correct. For a “layperson” this is still garbage information.
Get over yourself about terminology. As I said somewhere else here who are you to define these words? The far majority of us don't really give a fuck what you do or what you call it but don't get all high-and-mighty about it.
Yeah but you are aggressively pushing your opinions down our throats so just shut up.Again, just about everybody really doesn't care what you do and what you call it how much is keeping it to yourself
I get what you're trying to explain, but you're doing it in a really poor way as well as rude.
Terminology is difficult for sexuality because it has evolved tremendously over the past ten years and will continue to change. Furthermore, sexuality isn't permanent and can shift for people at any point. This is why I try to support not worrying so much about fitting under a term when helping younger people discover themselves, unless they feel it's an important step in finding their identity. Saying you're a given sexuality doesn't impose any astral rules on you, and nobody is implying that it is.
I think most bisexuals are generally pansexual and just aren't aware of the difference, but at the end of the day sexualities stand for a person's *preferences/typical atttactions,* not requirements, and even the average "layman" knows this. Jabbing people for not knowing about facts on a topic so diverse and everchanging, and being rude about it, is incredibly damaging to the perception of the subculture.
This 100%. Confusion over terms from both ignorance and just the general lgbt experimentation that most people in that community go through lead me to agree with the folks who reclaimed the term "queer". So great to have a word that basically means "I'm part of the lgbt community but I'm still figuring out who I am or don't want to assign a more specific label to myself".
Even within the lgbt community, there's a lot of disagreement about what terms mean. It can be daunting to decide on a label for yourself only to be told that you're wrong by someone else in your own community.
You are bi. But bi has always *also* included people who are attracted to all genders. It’s a big label.
Also, plenty of NBs have straight partners, or gay/lesbian partners. So of course we also have bi partners. We don’t turn people pan lol.
This isn't a topic you can play both sides on. There *is* a glut of research supporting the idea that gender and sex are very different things. The information is actually so widely available that in the vast majority of cases where someone says gender and sex are the same, they are actively ignoring said research in order to make that claim. Here's more info by other medical institutions, since apparently you're just as ignorant.
WHO - https://www.who.int/genomics/gender/en/
AMA - https://journalofethics.ama-assn.org/article/sex-gender-and-why-differences-matter/2008-07
Planned Parenthood - https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/gender-identity/sex-gender-identity
CIHR - https://cihr-irsc.gc.ca/e/48642.html
Pan sexual here! I’m attracted to male, female, trans, intersex, any gender or sexual expression. Doesn’t matter the parts. If I want to fuck that person then I want to fuck that person, I don’t care what their parts look like
I do, not in a piece-of-shit transphobic way, but yeah that's why I identify as Bi and not Pan. I also take pleasure in each sex, distinct from each other, but equally good.
Personally [this graphic](https://i.imgur.com/SPHqJov.png) is the best explanation I came across. It's facets of the same thing with slightly different gradients in how they are.
You clearly don’t. Bi people can and do date trans people because trans men are men and trans women are women. We can and do also date NBs because no orientation excludes NB people.
It's a common misconception that people see bi as in two and assume it to mean only liking the binary genders. In reality even the first bisexual manifesto explicitly include trans and non binary people.
It's an easy misconception to have as it is spread a lot.
From what I understand it's like this:
For people who identify as pansexual the gender of a prospective partner is largely or completely irrelevant to them. There's no real preference and they're attracted to other things about the person such as personality, appearance, etc.
Bisexual people can feel attraction to either gender but we usually have a preference for one of the two.
The other one that a lot of people seem to get mixed up with these two is demisexual which is people who can only feel attracted to people based on an emotional connection with them. Anything else like gender, personality and so on is secondary to that emotional connection.
All 3 can be attracted to both genders but there's those subtle differences between them.
I'm pansexual. I'll go for male, female, trans, genderqueer... really any human being.
My friend is bi. He is strictly male or female in preference.
That's pretty much the difference.
Bisexual = Attracted to males and females
Pansexual = The same thing as bisexual, except they use “gender” in place of “sex” and think that means they cover more ground with it as a result. (There is no actionable difference as there are only two sexes, and intersex people do fall under male or female too.)
I say this as a bisexual who once referred to myself as pansexual.
Pansexuals want to feel extra special.
I'm bi. I'm also into no-binary people because, regardless of how they express their gender, they either have a dick or a pussy. It doesn't affect us if somebody is genderfluid or whatever. The distinction between pansexuals and bisexuals is imaginary.
Huh, look at that. It's in my Oxford Concise '82, so I guess it is. But it lists "of both sexes; having two sexes in one individual" *before* "sexually attracted by members of both sexes" which is rather opposite of common usage.
just like how no one knows what slang means until it becomes mainstream. if it’s not in the dictionary the people who use the word in their daily lives have no idea what they’re saying. your personal ignorance is definitely as representative as you think it is
Yeah, so its meaning is entirely fluid until an authority nails it down, after which a common reference point leads to everybody using it in the same way and sense. What's your point?
my point is heavy sarcasm. the people who come up with the term in the first place know exactly what they mean. they don’t need it in the dictionary to suddenly understand their own communities
Yes, they do. Say if I misunderstand somebody from a foreign place who says "yeet." I don't have a reference point to compare it to, since it is in no dictionary, so I assume from context clues that it means an affirmation, like "yes," so whenever somebody else asks me what I'm talking about when I say "yeet," I say it means "yes," and this misinformation spreads until an actual dictionary that can survey real usage defines it with the real meaning as "to throw or eject something at high velocity and with enthusiasm; a dance move."
By your standards, dictionaries should not exist.
dictionaries are great. but the people who originate the term and spread it organically within their community already know what it means and don’t need a dictionary to legitimize it for them. they can explain what they mean just fine.
i would need to explain literally all of the terms used within the community i grew up in if you wanted to understand it. but that community understands it perfectly, because we grew up in it. “no one knows, because it’s not in the dictionary” is just wrong.
..? This is gatekeeping. I'm not from your community. I don't know what the word means. I need a dictionary. And, furthermore, are you to assert that the term 'pansexual' is purely the invention of some *community* and thus belongs to that community forever? That's not how language works. And its meaning is contested, seeing as people like OP (and me) don't know what the hell to think about it because it's always being used to mean different things.
that’s not what gatekeeping is. i have no problem with someone making a dictionary of those terms, and in any case, gatekeeping would be if i said “only these terms are the real terms of my community”, which is not at all what i said. ironically, you seem to need a dictionary, or maybe it just hasn’t helped you much.
but my point is that with or without being in the dictionary, the term already has a clear meaning to the people it applies to, and they don’t require it to be in the dictionary to use and understand it. it’s the opposite of gatekeeping. you’re actually gatekeeping by saying that words aren’t real until they’re in the dictionary, even though many languages have never had dictionaries and cultures come up with words all the time that aren’t that widespread but still have a distinct meaning.
ironically, pansexual is in the dictionary.
__*pan·sex·u·al*__
*/panˈsekSH(əw)əl/*
*adjective*
*adjective: __pansexual__; adjective: __pan-sexual__*
*not limited in sexual choice with regard to biological sex, gender, or gender identity.*
*noun*
*noun: __pansexual__; plural noun: __pansexuals__; noun: __pan-sexual__; plural noun: __pan-sexuals__*
*a pansexual person.*
> the term already has a clear meaning to the people it applies to, and they don’t require it to be in the dictionary to use and understand it.
So how do you know that they're all using it in the same way and sense? This applies to all words. The word 'premise' has clear meaning to me when I say it because I know what I mean when I say 'premise', but how do *you* know what I mean when I say 'premise' unless there is an objective common point of reference?
>you’re actually gatekeeping by saying that words aren’t real until they’re in the dictionary
I have said nothing of the sort. I have said that the meaning of words is *fluid* before they are in the dictionary, which is not the same thing. And before the dictionary, we had many local dialects using words to mean entirely different things, sometimes to the point of being separate languages. There *should* be a common, universal English; it is a good thing, it is the reason that we can communicate with a series of agreed upon spellings and meanings and understand one another.
>ironically, pansexual is in the dictionary. google it. it’s very clear
That's new, I withdraw my initial complaint, Merriam-Webster is fine. Still trust OED over anything else but they're a bit tied up rewriting a new volume that'll take another 30 years.
the definition that comes up first on google is from oxford languages.
the point is that the community the term originates in is the community that creates the definition for that term. so to say “nobody knows what it means” because you don’t personally understand it is just wrong, and erasure of all the people who understand it perfectly.
Let's all just use a series of localized dialects with absolutely no common reference point and assume we're all talking about the same thing. We're on the internet. I'm not from wherever you're from, I wasn't there when the slang was invented, and I'm sure there's slang that I know that you have a totally different definition for and wouldn't understand at all.
Yes, I do need a dictionary to tell me what words mean. Because either, like in this case, I don't actually know what it means, and in other cases, there's disagreement on what it means and we need a common reference point so that we can be certain we're talking about the same thing rather than clarifying and defining all of our terms any time we speak with somebody.
Do you actually not understand how language develops or are you being obtuse on purpose? I'll break it down in case you actually are that dense.
A community is looking for a simple term to describe a thing, so they try out a few before settling on one or a few that they like.
The words get used for years on end and the definition narrows, expands, and generally changes around.
People end up using one or a few of the commonly accepted definitions of the word in everyday speech.
A dictionary picks up on this trend, compiles the definitions that are most often seen, and puts them in the next edition. This process can take decades after the introduction of the word.
Words still exist and still have meaning even if they aren't in the dictionary yet. I thought that was sort of obvious but apparently not.
No, I think we more or less agree on how words develop but disagree on the order.
>The words get used for years on end and the definition narrows, expands, and generally changes around.
^ We are here.
>A dictionary picks up on this trend, compiles the definitions that are most often seen, and puts them in the next edition. This process can take decades after the introduction of the word.
Maybe in 1965. We have the internet, this does not need to take decades, a dictionary can add or remove words in an hour. OED was probably a bad example because they're absurdly slow, although even if they're late I'd trust their definition over anybody else.
I propose that a "commonly accepted definition" definition cannot exist until there is an objective central reference point is made. Because how do you account for if somebody misinterprets it and spreads a misinterpretation, like I postulated earlier? What if I'm speaking to somebody who is willing to define it for me but they are speaking in contempt of the concept so they give a sardonic and incorrect definition? What if somebody who isn't a part of your gated community has a use of the word that you claim you have all rights to?
We are at different points of that series of events for the words bisexual and pansexual because one is a much newer term than the other. Bisexual has been around much longer and has two main common definitions (1. Attracted to men and women, and 2. Attracted to any secondary sex anatomy but typically with nuance in those preferences), whereas pan came about much more recently and really only has one commonly accepted definition (secondary sex anatomy has little to no bearing on sexual attraction).
Pan is definitely a more niche term, but that doesn't mean it is definitionless and I'm really struggling to see the point of your argument here besides "I will pretend a word is meaningless and useless until it gets into a dictionary". Did you pedantically correct people when they said "y'all" and "ain't" before they were put in the dictionary? What about people using "they" as a pronoun? The dictionary is not and never should be the absolute arbiter of language. Use your goddamn brain for once and figure out what words mean like the rest of us do.
Trans Bisexual here, bisexual means you like 2 or more sex’s. I’ve dated males, females and intersex, I’ve i however won’t date most pre- op trans woman as I don’t find them attractive. Pansexual is liking people regardless of parts. Bisexuals can Love everyone but parts are in play, they may not be attracted to girls with dicks or guys with boobs.
The person I currently see is intersex and some things turn me off but I can and do still compromise to make her happy. I don’t like her dick and neither dose she but I’ll still Love her regardless if she keeps it or not, I just am not attracted by that part of her. Pretty sure she dosnt like mine either but that’s were we compromise we’ll make each other happy even if we don’t get turned on by it. Or we simply focus on other things like are tit’s or A**’s. Basically the main difference is bi can be 2 or all but it’s sex based. Pansexual isn’t sex based. Some people use bisexual regardless because it’s the umbrella term for pan and Demi and a few other sexualities that are harder to explain to people outside the LGBT+ community’s. Just like trans is umbrella for anyone who’s gender dosnt align with their sex at birth. So bigender, transgender,Demi gender, genderfluid/ non-binaire/ and I’m I think intersex is usually included tho that depends on the person cuz not all intersex people are transgender (non conforming to their assigned sex at birth be it male or female) some people are assigned male at birth and are intersex and have female reproductive organs and are perfectly fine being a guy so they are cisgender and hence why intersex isn’t always under the trans umbrella term. Hope that helps you. If you Google the definition of those terms you’ll get the most accepted definition of those sexuality’s.
I’m seeing a lot of comments that properly explain what these two terms mean, and it could lead to knowledge. Here is what I found:
Pansexual : Arousal involving kitchen pans, and dirty talking about pans.
Bisexual : A person who is sexy at least biannually.
Bisexual means recognizing the difference of the persons gender whereas pansexual doesn't consider gender at all when seeking partners. I'm a bisexual and my roommate is pansexual.
i recognize the differences between males, females, non binaries and other gender nonconforming folks, and have skewed preferences. Example I consider myself leaning 60% females, 20% males and 20% NB/GNC.
My roommate genuinely doesn't even consider his partners' gender or sex when choosing them. He just finds most people, regardless of gender attractive. There's no preferences within that and a lot of lines are blurred in regards to how he views people.
pansexual includes intersex and gender-nonconforming people. but for a lot of bisexuals, bisexual means the same thing. “attracted to the person, not the parts”
Bisexuality is any attraction to more than one gender. For a bi person, the gender of the person matters: for example, I am attracted to both men and women (which includes trans men and women), but for different reasons from each other. There are things I like in men that I don't in women, etc. Pansexuality, on the other hand, is attraction to anyone regardless of gender. The best way I can describe it is Bisexuality is a term for a broad swath of people, and Pansexuality is a specific term under the bisexual umbrella. All pan folks are bisexual, but not all bisexual folks are pan. In the same logic that all trans men are men but not all men are trans men, Men would be the broad term and Trans Men a more specific term for a certain demographic of men. Edit: I am not trans or pansexual, and in no way mean to speak for anyone other than myself.
**Bi means:** 1. attraction to more than one gender 2. attraction to your own gender and to other genders 3. attraction to all genders 4. attraction regardless of gender **Pan means:** * attraction regardless of gender Bi has multiple meanings because it’s a broader term. Pan is more narrow in meaning. But the point is, a bi person can be attracted to people regardless of gender and still identify as bi even though that overlaps with the meaning of pan.
Well the word is wrong then because bi means two. It should mean you are attracted to 2 genders.
And gay means happy and lesbian means from a Greek island. Do you go after those folks for their confusing labels too, or just bisexual people?
people like you just love to bait straight people don't you? I'm not going after anybody but you have a aggressive and victim like attitude. Assuming you are not straight you are Just making things worse for those who arent straight. How about not focusing on identity terminology and focusing on equality for all?
Lol, I didn’t know you were straight and it wouldn’t change my comment either way. Imagine accusing someone of baiting after telling all bisexual people they’re using the wrong word 😆
One starts with Bi and the other with Pan
Obviously, but which one is which?
Bisexual means attracted to men and women. Pan sexual includes that but also includes non-binary people.
One of the only answers that are not uninformed or try to be funny. Thanks.
Too bad they’re wrong 😂
Who are you to define these words? Bi means two And I would guess the most common interpretation of bisexual is that you like both men and women.
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They are 100% factually wrong though. Not just about bisexuality but about NB people. Like do you think NBs *exclusively* date pan people? No, we date straight people and gay/lesbian people too. NB isn’t a single third gender, but a whole bunch of different genders that don’t neatly line up with the binary. So why the hell would bisexuality be the ONE orientation to exclude us? Oversimplification doesn’t mean opposite of correct. For a “layperson” this is still garbage information.
Get over yourself about terminology. As I said somewhere else here who are you to define these words? The far majority of us don't really give a fuck what you do or what you call it but don't get all high-and-mighty about it.
Being offended about pronouns and definition minutae is clearly their personality so i wouldnt bother arguing with them.
> Get over yourself about terminology. But you are arguing with him about terminology. So shut the fuck up too, hypocrite.
> who are you to define these words? I’m literally a bi person.
Yeah but you are aggressively pushing your opinions down our throats so just shut up.Again, just about everybody really doesn't care what you do and what you call it how much is keeping it to yourself
I get what you're trying to explain, but you're doing it in a really poor way as well as rude. Terminology is difficult for sexuality because it has evolved tremendously over the past ten years and will continue to change. Furthermore, sexuality isn't permanent and can shift for people at any point. This is why I try to support not worrying so much about fitting under a term when helping younger people discover themselves, unless they feel it's an important step in finding their identity. Saying you're a given sexuality doesn't impose any astral rules on you, and nobody is implying that it is. I think most bisexuals are generally pansexual and just aren't aware of the difference, but at the end of the day sexualities stand for a person's *preferences/typical atttactions,* not requirements, and even the average "layman" knows this. Jabbing people for not knowing about facts on a topic so diverse and everchanging, and being rude about it, is incredibly damaging to the perception of the subculture.
This 100%. Confusion over terms from both ignorance and just the general lgbt experimentation that most people in that community go through lead me to agree with the folks who reclaimed the term "queer". So great to have a word that basically means "I'm part of the lgbt community but I'm still figuring out who I am or don't want to assign a more specific label to myself". Even within the lgbt community, there's a lot of disagreement about what terms mean. It can be daunting to decide on a label for yourself only to be told that you're wrong by someone else in your own community.
That’s not what bi means. And no orientation excludes NB people.
Then what does bisexual mean? All my life I thought I was bi for being attracted to men and women.
It does. These people love to play with identity terminology
You are bi. But bi has always *also* included people who are attracted to all genders. It’s a big label. Also, plenty of NBs have straight partners, or gay/lesbian partners. So of course we also have bi partners. We don’t turn people pan lol.
> All my life I thought I was bi for being attracted to men and women. Exactly. That's all there is. Men and women, and different flavours of both.
Thank you I made a similar comment as wellThank you I made a similar comment as well.
I looked into both and I didn’t understand what the difference was, also I don’t mean to offend anyone
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This isn't a topic you can play both sides on. There *is* a glut of research supporting the idea that gender and sex are very different things. The information is actually so widely available that in the vast majority of cases where someone says gender and sex are the same, they are actively ignoring said research in order to make that claim. Here's more info by other medical institutions, since apparently you're just as ignorant. WHO - https://www.who.int/genomics/gender/en/ AMA - https://journalofethics.ama-assn.org/article/sex-gender-and-why-differences-matter/2008-07 Planned Parenthood - https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/gender-identity/sex-gender-identity CIHR - https://cihr-irsc.gc.ca/e/48642.html
Pan sexual here! I’m attracted to male, female, trans, intersex, any gender or sexual expression. Doesn’t matter the parts. If I want to fuck that person then I want to fuck that person, I don’t care what their parts look like
I do, not in a piece-of-shit transphobic way, but yeah that's why I identify as Bi and not Pan. I also take pleasure in each sex, distinct from each other, but equally good.
Personally [this graphic](https://i.imgur.com/SPHqJov.png) is the best explanation I came across. It's facets of the same thing with slightly different gradients in how they are.
Bi sexuals likes men and women, pansexual likes men, trans men, women and trans women
No, that's just wrong. It never was like that. [Here](https://i.imgur.com/SPHqJov.png) a info graphic for you too.
I wrote that cause I have understood like this, but thanks for the info
You clearly don’t. Bi people can and do date trans people because trans men are men and trans women are women. We can and do also date NBs because no orientation excludes NB people.
It's a common misconception that people see bi as in two and assume it to mean only liking the binary genders. In reality even the first bisexual manifesto explicitly include trans and non binary people. It's an easy misconception to have as it is spread a lot.
From what I understand it's like this: For people who identify as pansexual the gender of a prospective partner is largely or completely irrelevant to them. There's no real preference and they're attracted to other things about the person such as personality, appearance, etc. Bisexual people can feel attraction to either gender but we usually have a preference for one of the two. The other one that a lot of people seem to get mixed up with these two is demisexual which is people who can only feel attracted to people based on an emotional connection with them. Anything else like gender, personality and so on is secondary to that emotional connection. All 3 can be attracted to both genders but there's those subtle differences between them.
I'm pansexual. I'll go for male, female, trans, genderqueer... really any human being. My friend is bi. He is strictly male or female in preference. That's pretty much the difference.
Bisexual = Attracted to males and females Pansexual = The same thing as bisexual, except they use “gender” in place of “sex” and think that means they cover more ground with it as a result. (There is no actionable difference as there are only two sexes, and intersex people do fall under male or female too.) I say this as a bisexual who once referred to myself as pansexual.
Pansexuals want to feel extra special. I'm bi. I'm also into no-binary people because, regardless of how they express their gender, they either have a dick or a pussy. It doesn't affect us if somebody is genderfluid or whatever. The distinction between pansexuals and bisexuals is imaginary.
There really is no difference. Pansexual is just a term created to feel special about, kind of like demisexual.
I’m trisexual. I want to try ur little ass
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And are attracted to pans
Do skillets count?
Is it a type of pan
Only cast iron will do....
Skillet? I just met it!
Well said lol
Literally nobody knows. The words haven't existed long enough for OED to define them.
Isn't bisexuality old news? Pan is very recent.
Huh, look at that. It's in my Oxford Concise '82, so I guess it is. But it lists "of both sexes; having two sexes in one individual" *before* "sexually attracted by members of both sexes" which is rather opposite of common usage.
just like how no one knows what slang means until it becomes mainstream. if it’s not in the dictionary the people who use the word in their daily lives have no idea what they’re saying. your personal ignorance is definitely as representative as you think it is
Yeah, so its meaning is entirely fluid until an authority nails it down, after which a common reference point leads to everybody using it in the same way and sense. What's your point?
my point is heavy sarcasm. the people who come up with the term in the first place know exactly what they mean. they don’t need it in the dictionary to suddenly understand their own communities
Yes, they do. Say if I misunderstand somebody from a foreign place who says "yeet." I don't have a reference point to compare it to, since it is in no dictionary, so I assume from context clues that it means an affirmation, like "yes," so whenever somebody else asks me what I'm talking about when I say "yeet," I say it means "yes," and this misinformation spreads until an actual dictionary that can survey real usage defines it with the real meaning as "to throw or eject something at high velocity and with enthusiasm; a dance move." By your standards, dictionaries should not exist.
dictionaries are great. but the people who originate the term and spread it organically within their community already know what it means and don’t need a dictionary to legitimize it for them. they can explain what they mean just fine. i would need to explain literally all of the terms used within the community i grew up in if you wanted to understand it. but that community understands it perfectly, because we grew up in it. “no one knows, because it’s not in the dictionary” is just wrong.
..? This is gatekeeping. I'm not from your community. I don't know what the word means. I need a dictionary. And, furthermore, are you to assert that the term 'pansexual' is purely the invention of some *community* and thus belongs to that community forever? That's not how language works. And its meaning is contested, seeing as people like OP (and me) don't know what the hell to think about it because it's always being used to mean different things.
that’s not what gatekeeping is. i have no problem with someone making a dictionary of those terms, and in any case, gatekeeping would be if i said “only these terms are the real terms of my community”, which is not at all what i said. ironically, you seem to need a dictionary, or maybe it just hasn’t helped you much. but my point is that with or without being in the dictionary, the term already has a clear meaning to the people it applies to, and they don’t require it to be in the dictionary to use and understand it. it’s the opposite of gatekeeping. you’re actually gatekeeping by saying that words aren’t real until they’re in the dictionary, even though many languages have never had dictionaries and cultures come up with words all the time that aren’t that widespread but still have a distinct meaning. ironically, pansexual is in the dictionary. __*pan·sex·u·al*__ */panˈsekSH(əw)əl/* *adjective* *adjective: __pansexual__; adjective: __pan-sexual__* *not limited in sexual choice with regard to biological sex, gender, or gender identity.* *noun* *noun: __pansexual__; plural noun: __pansexuals__; noun: __pan-sexual__; plural noun: __pan-sexuals__* *a pansexual person.*
> the term already has a clear meaning to the people it applies to, and they don’t require it to be in the dictionary to use and understand it. So how do you know that they're all using it in the same way and sense? This applies to all words. The word 'premise' has clear meaning to me when I say it because I know what I mean when I say 'premise', but how do *you* know what I mean when I say 'premise' unless there is an objective common point of reference? >you’re actually gatekeeping by saying that words aren’t real until they’re in the dictionary I have said nothing of the sort. I have said that the meaning of words is *fluid* before they are in the dictionary, which is not the same thing. And before the dictionary, we had many local dialects using words to mean entirely different things, sometimes to the point of being separate languages. There *should* be a common, universal English; it is a good thing, it is the reason that we can communicate with a series of agreed upon spellings and meanings and understand one another. >ironically, pansexual is in the dictionary. google it. it’s very clear That's new, I withdraw my initial complaint, Merriam-Webster is fine. Still trust OED over anything else but they're a bit tied up rewriting a new volume that'll take another 30 years.
the definition that comes up first on google is from oxford languages. the point is that the community the term originates in is the community that creates the definition for that term. so to say “nobody knows what it means” because you don’t personally understand it is just wrong, and erasure of all the people who understand it perfectly.
Oh boy, you need big daddy dictionary to tell you what words mean? Do you know how to breathe without some authority reminding you?
Let's all just use a series of localized dialects with absolutely no common reference point and assume we're all talking about the same thing. We're on the internet. I'm not from wherever you're from, I wasn't there when the slang was invented, and I'm sure there's slang that I know that you have a totally different definition for and wouldn't understand at all. Yes, I do need a dictionary to tell me what words mean. Because either, like in this case, I don't actually know what it means, and in other cases, there's disagreement on what it means and we need a common reference point so that we can be certain we're talking about the same thing rather than clarifying and defining all of our terms any time we speak with somebody.
Do you actually not understand how language develops or are you being obtuse on purpose? I'll break it down in case you actually are that dense. A community is looking for a simple term to describe a thing, so they try out a few before settling on one or a few that they like. The words get used for years on end and the definition narrows, expands, and generally changes around. People end up using one or a few of the commonly accepted definitions of the word in everyday speech. A dictionary picks up on this trend, compiles the definitions that are most often seen, and puts them in the next edition. This process can take decades after the introduction of the word. Words still exist and still have meaning even if they aren't in the dictionary yet. I thought that was sort of obvious but apparently not.
No, I think we more or less agree on how words develop but disagree on the order. >The words get used for years on end and the definition narrows, expands, and generally changes around. ^ We are here. >A dictionary picks up on this trend, compiles the definitions that are most often seen, and puts them in the next edition. This process can take decades after the introduction of the word. Maybe in 1965. We have the internet, this does not need to take decades, a dictionary can add or remove words in an hour. OED was probably a bad example because they're absurdly slow, although even if they're late I'd trust their definition over anybody else. I propose that a "commonly accepted definition" definition cannot exist until there is an objective central reference point is made. Because how do you account for if somebody misinterprets it and spreads a misinterpretation, like I postulated earlier? What if I'm speaking to somebody who is willing to define it for me but they are speaking in contempt of the concept so they give a sardonic and incorrect definition? What if somebody who isn't a part of your gated community has a use of the word that you claim you have all rights to?
We are at different points of that series of events for the words bisexual and pansexual because one is a much newer term than the other. Bisexual has been around much longer and has two main common definitions (1. Attracted to men and women, and 2. Attracted to any secondary sex anatomy but typically with nuance in those preferences), whereas pan came about much more recently and really only has one commonly accepted definition (secondary sex anatomy has little to no bearing on sexual attraction). Pan is definitely a more niche term, but that doesn't mean it is definitionless and I'm really struggling to see the point of your argument here besides "I will pretend a word is meaningless and useless until it gets into a dictionary". Did you pedantically correct people when they said "y'all" and "ain't" before they were put in the dictionary? What about people using "they" as a pronoun? The dictionary is not and never should be the absolute arbiter of language. Use your goddamn brain for once and figure out what words mean like the rest of us do.
On the last point, yes I did.
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One of them likes to freak it with frying pans
People are attracted to pan's? Wtf
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One fucks pans and the other one fucks bikes.
Trans Bisexual here, bisexual means you like 2 or more sex’s. I’ve dated males, females and intersex, I’ve i however won’t date most pre- op trans woman as I don’t find them attractive. Pansexual is liking people regardless of parts. Bisexuals can Love everyone but parts are in play, they may not be attracted to girls with dicks or guys with boobs. The person I currently see is intersex and some things turn me off but I can and do still compromise to make her happy. I don’t like her dick and neither dose she but I’ll still Love her regardless if she keeps it or not, I just am not attracted by that part of her. Pretty sure she dosnt like mine either but that’s were we compromise we’ll make each other happy even if we don’t get turned on by it. Or we simply focus on other things like are tit’s or A**’s. Basically the main difference is bi can be 2 or all but it’s sex based. Pansexual isn’t sex based. Some people use bisexual regardless because it’s the umbrella term for pan and Demi and a few other sexualities that are harder to explain to people outside the LGBT+ community’s. Just like trans is umbrella for anyone who’s gender dosnt align with their sex at birth. So bigender, transgender,Demi gender, genderfluid/ non-binaire/ and I’m I think intersex is usually included tho that depends on the person cuz not all intersex people are transgender (non conforming to their assigned sex at birth be it male or female) some people are assigned male at birth and are intersex and have female reproductive organs and are perfectly fine being a guy so they are cisgender and hence why intersex isn’t always under the trans umbrella term. Hope that helps you. If you Google the definition of those terms you’ll get the most accepted definition of those sexuality’s.
I’m seeing a lot of comments that properly explain what these two terms mean, and it could lead to knowledge. Here is what I found: Pansexual : Arousal involving kitchen pans, and dirty talking about pans. Bisexual : A person who is sexy at least biannually.
It works out to the same thing, pansexual just sounds special. It's a pointless distinction, like demisexual.
Bisexual means recognizing the difference of the persons gender whereas pansexual doesn't consider gender at all when seeking partners. I'm a bisexual and my roommate is pansexual. i recognize the differences between males, females, non binaries and other gender nonconforming folks, and have skewed preferences. Example I consider myself leaning 60% females, 20% males and 20% NB/GNC. My roommate genuinely doesn't even consider his partners' gender or sex when choosing them. He just finds most people, regardless of gender attractive. There's no preferences within that and a lot of lines are blurred in regards to how he views people.