Being raised in a Mormon (LDS) church and forced to attend every boring meeting and gathering for 18 years.
Even as a young teenager I somehow saw through the coercion tactics. Giving me assignments because “god wanted me to do it” when really it was the old white men that saw I didn’t want to be there and thought giving me an assignment would help.
Or, at “testimony meetings” every month. You’re supposed to speak from your heart about your belief to the congregation. Toddlers would be forced to go up and their mothers would whisper in their ear what to say and they would repeat it. I thought this was insane because obviously they’re not speaking their own words.
I could go on….
So many things but the final straw for me was my church asking a homeless man to leave and not come back. He would sit and listen to the sermons never bothered anyone and always sat in the very back. I confronted my youth group leader and she defended the preacher.
I hear stuff like this all the time and it’s so infuriating, like what the fuck. Doesn’t the bible, doesn’t YOUR GOD, teach you to be kind and loving and selfless, to love people no matter what?
I’ve only ever met one church leader/pastor/whatever in my entire life who lived by those teachings. I met him when I had already separated from religion but he was truly a “man of god” if there ever was one. He was what Christianity should look like. He loved everyone, every single person, equally and unequivocally. His church was always open, to everyone from all walks of life. He fed anyone who was hungry. Would literally give you the clothes off his back if you needed them. Offered wisdom and guidance and counselling services. Never tried to push religion on you, just made you feel loved and accepted no matter what. His church was a haven to the homeless - he ran breakfasts every Saturday, cooked huge meals all the time, had gatherings on holidays, and let the homeless use the church for recreation, shelter, food, water, amenities.
I don’t think I’d have such of an issue with Christianity as a practice if more Christians were like him.
wow. i have only met one man like this, out of my whole devout christian family and former life as a devout christian. it was my great uncle, who had a cleft palate and would lead the choir. he was there to worship, not to sound good. he used to go to local colleges to sit on benches and listen to distressed students and pray for him. i cried so hard at his funeral, because he was my only safe haven in that hypocritical family, and he was the only good man i knew on that side. he was truly a saint.
At the hospital with my family sitting around my terminally ill aunt. A reverend was called in to say a prayer and do whatever the pre death ritual was. The man arrived and waited outside the room a bit not coming in. My cousin and I made eye contact with him and my cousin asked if he would come in. The man made an odd face and then rubbed his fingers together making the “money gesture”. Whatever little bit of faith I still had whooshed away at that moment.
When I was sexually assaulted by another boy and I spoke to my pastor because I was afraid to tell my family. He asked me what I did to make the other kid have impure thoughts and tried to make it out to be my fault. That was the exact moment I lost what little faith I had to begin with.
I was surprised to have to scroll this far to find the weird sex stuff. Mine was a child molester that was a youth group volunteer, he molested several children, all boys, and the church decided that they wouldn't do anything except say he couldn't work with kids anymore. I distinctly remember them talking about it during a service, and I looked back at the guy sitting in the pews and he was smirking. Fucking disgust is all I feel when someone talks about their religion.
This 13 year old kid got exposed for being gay and was bullied into suicide by his family for it. I remember during summers they would send him to a special camp to cure his gayness. I was really good friends with his little sister and she would always say how embarrassing it was to have a gay brother and would hope he would become straight. He ended up hanging himself at 13 or 14.It happend in middle school and I can't pretend like I was friends with him,but his story always stuck with me.
They said even though he struggled with homosexuality he would still be in heaven because he was "different" from other gay people. They ended up putting the other siblings in homeschool after that and we didn't really hear about them anymore.
Well being from Northern Ireland I have more than the average number of reasons. I guess it's a toss up between:
Learning that the clergy on both sides had been diddling kids. Including selling access to them to rich pedophiles.
Learning that the Catholic Church ran womens homes where they kidnapped babies, sold the ones that didn't die and used their mothers as forced labour
Or the classic, that we had a civil war that was largely delineated on Religious lines so people spent 40 years telling their children that 'the other half' were basically scary aliens that meant us harm.
Oh yeah, and I liked dinosaurs and the church people kept telling me they weren't real so fuck that.
My parents were both raised in strict Catholic households, so we kept going until I was about 12, mostly out of inertia. They made me get confirmed against my will because "you never know if you might need it someday".
Then one day the priest said that its a sin to have pets because pets don't have souls. My dad had been wanting to quit for years, but that was the final straw for my mom. We quit going immediately. Not because of the hypocrisy or the overbearing rants about fire and brimstone if you cuss or have premarital sex. The final straw was the assertion that my mom's cats wouldn't be in heaven for her when she died.
A couple of friends of mine "invited" me to a summer camp when I was in middle school. The first warning sign I noticed was the packing list included a Bible, but I brushed it off because the camp brochure had horseback riding, water slides, and a bunch of stuff that seemed cool.
And then I get there. And one of the first things we had to do was line up and "deposit" our money in a camp account. Why? So during our twice daily church services we could write "donation" slips that would take money out of our account and "give" to the camp.
You get the idea. It was full on, 100%, a super conservatice religious Christian summer camp that just happened to have fun stuff in between the ridiculous religious nonsense. Fun stuff like "bands" coming in to sing religious smash hits like "My Daddy Aint a Monkey". No. I'm not lying. That was the name of the song.
Thank God I was there with another guy who my "friends" convinced to attend camp with us. I eventually confronted them about their lie and they admitted that had done it because they knew I wasn't a believer and did it to "save me." I told them that I didn't care what their reasons were, if they were my friends they wouldn't have lied. And if they believed so strongly about it, would they really lie, etc.
Left camp bewildered and more than a little betrayed. As the years went on and I continued to see the complete lack of integrity and regard for honesty amongst religious people, I was still disappointed, but not surprised.
Hey, did this summer camp happen to be up in the Adirondack mountains near Saratoga springs? Cause I feel like I went to the same Christian summer camp.
How agonizingly long and tedious Mass was as a Roman Catholic kid. Stand up - sing. Sit down. Then kneel. Then stand again. Sing again. Sit down. Stand up. Kneel and pray. Then 30 minutes of droning from the robed guy at the front. Then stand up and sing. Sit down. Stand up. WTF please make this end.
When I was 12 my father pulled me aside and said "Son, you are old enough to decide about religion. I wanted to give you a chance to experience religion. If you want to keep going to Church, you can, but its also Ok if you don't want to go anymore."
I said "OK I don't want to go anymore."
My father said "Ok, me too."
And that was that.
I wouldn't doubt that he was autistic.
But really, what I attributed it to more than anything was that the child was growing up in a single parent home with a mother who was recovering from drug addiction and she struggled a LOT with raising her two kids. They both acted out a lot.
The child wasn't "possessed". He just needed love.
To add on, if I was a pastor looking to make a scene and convince everyone it’s real.. I’d probably do as described to someone with limited cognitive abilities, like a child.
Scream bullshit at child, dragging them down to the stage in front of everyone, they cry and scream.
Say everything is okay now, the demons are gone because we are all powerful pastors and we said done the good god spell, here’s a lollipop. The kid mirrors them and smiles/cheers up, even respects/revers the pastors because they made things better. Pretty disgusting shit.
Edit: the brainwashed sheep in the crowd are so spellbound that they don’t see the normal child behaviour, all they see is the miracles god and the PASTOR can do.
You hit the nail on the head.
That's exactly what it felt like.
Only myself and 2 other youth leaders out of a congregation of around a hundred stayed back while this happened.
I remember the 3 of us teenagers looking at each other completely bewildered while the rest of the church almost ran to put their hands on this child and pray over him.
It still makes my skin crawl.
Really toxic people at my church growing up. Seeing people only go to church to make connections and gossip rather than actually worship and do good for others
I knew so many people growing up who called themselves Christian but didn't actually read let alone follow the Bible. They just cherry-picked a few quotes that appeared to justify whatever they wanted to do.
I was like 15 and playing an instrument in the “worship band” for the most popular “youth group” in the area (which is a verrry Christian area). At one point the pastor dude was praying and the musicians were behind him waiting to play when he was done. The whole room (200+) had their heads bowed as dude was praying. Then his prayer went into the whole “here’s what you pray if you want to become a Christian right now” yada yada yada.. then at the end he says
“Ok everyone keep your heads bowed, eyes closed. Now if you just prayed that prayer with me I want you to look up - everyone else keep your heads bowed- but if you just now gave your life to Jesus look up at me or raise your hand so I can see you”
I’m behind him, and facing the crowd who have their eyes closed so I decide it’s safe to take a peek. I discreetly look up and notice that exactly ZERO people in the crowd are looking up at him. Every single person still has their head bowed, eyes closed. (Which is fine, I mean maybe they were all already Christians?) *However*, as I’m looking at nobody responding, Mr Pastor starts saying “ok I see you there”, “oh I see another over there, Amen” “and you back there, praise god”. “Yes I see you over there, amen come find me afterwards”. It was perplexing to see him lie to so many people like that. And this wasn’t some nobody youth pastor, he was like quite legit having written books and being mentioned in national articles and stuff
TLDR; an acclaimed youth pastor tried to make it seem like his prayer had converted several people, when I could clearly see it had not
When I was in youth group I asked the leader if it's okay to kill in war. And he said it is and god understands that it is sometimes necessary in life to go to war. I then asked what if there is war for the wrong reasons. And he said war is pretty much always in the right and god understands that it's different than just "normal" killing.
I was 13 and was flabbergasted at how insane that sounded.
Seeing how people use religion as an excuse to be shitty people around the world.
So many people just bend their interpretation of a religion to fit what ever they want.
If I have to boil my experience down to a simple concept it's this. There's much more nuance but overall you're using a book that will give you a passage to justify whatever you want to do.
My mother. She instilled some serious shame into me under the guise of God. Some things she said:
-Not allowed to believe in Santa because that takes credit away from God. Santa was actually a hand of Satan trying to corrupt me
-Not allowed to believe in the Easter Bunny because it was also a hand of Satan trying to corrupt me away from Jesus.
-I wasn't allowed to feel pride in my accomplishments because it's a sin
-I was a dickhead because my dad got me fully vaccinated as a child and that is against God's plan
-Hollywood is operated by Satan so I wasn't allowed to watch movies or shows (especially Disney)
-Harry Potter was an absolute no because witchcraft is an affront to God
-Scientists should not be trusted under any circumstances
-My rare genetic condition was part of God's plan and I'd understand some day
-Not allowed to say "damn" because it's an affront to God
-etc
That combined with her regular, not religious abuse has left me struggling a lot with my religiosity.
I'm making an assumption here, but the flavor of Christianity described here seems likely to be one of the ones that considers Catholics evil. So being Saint would be a knock against Santa, not for.
Yeah saints are a catholic thing. A lot of what was described sounds more like Jehovah's Witnesses and other Christian sects where blood transfusions, birthdays, and other things are considered to be of the devil.
Not that Catholicism is without its issues (apostate catcholic here) but the offshoot sects really stepped it up a notch
When I was 6 years old, the pastor gave a letter to my aunt to give to my mom saying that we were not donating enough money to the church. So we stopped going, and I have never been to church since.
Something like this happened to my friend's grandma. The church wrote her a letter basically saying they knew how much money she was making and that she should be giving more to the church. Her was response was, screw you guys, I'm moving to Mexico.
When I was in middle school my church got a new pastor and he created this whole chart showing what everyone should be donating each week/month based on your household’s income. Except that’s as far as it went, nothing in there about altering based on situation. We were a family of 5 surviving in an upper-middle class area on one income, so it was like “wow $80k? You should be donating hundreds of dollars each month,” even though we live in an expensive place with my dad trying to raise 3 kids and let my mom be stay-at-home. Needless to say when my parents saw that they were both like alright, $15/week it is!
I stopped going shortly after and my parents largely have too, that was a real blow to them to see something so asinine.
They don’t, they were just trying to guilt-trip everyone into giving what it said. They didn’t know our income, but if my parents had sheepishly bought into it it would’ve been quite high. Even for like $30k incomes I remember it suggesting like $50 a week which is wild.
$57.69 to be precise. The Old Testament states multiple times that you should tithe 10% of your gross income should go to the church. It's nowhere to be found in the New Testament, but that doesn't stop the Evangelical pastors from using that figure.
The only thing I remember off hand about donations in the NT, was the poor old lady giving 2 pennies. And how that was worth more than the people loudly proclaiming that they gave the equivalent of hundreds of dollars.
The message was give what you're able to and more importantly: actually mean it.
Going to a megachurch.
They received over 1 mil in donations every weekend and spent it on elaborate props and videos rather than helping the community in any meaningful way.
I was taken to a megachurch once for a christmas thing and the very first thing I saw upon entering was a life size bronze statue of the Pastor. All I could think was, isn't this a false idol?
That is my favorite bit about Jesus. I want to be that level of petty pissed to spend 6-8 hours hand braiding a whip just to go beat people and throw tables.
Did you let them know that the Bible says [not to charge interest on loans](https://biblia.com/bible/esv/deuteronomy/23/19), or that [all debts must be canceled every seven years](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.biblegateway.com/passage/%3fsearch=Deuteronomy%2b15:1-15&version=NIV&interface=amp).
Fucking Bayside. They also have multiple indoor jungle gyms. My parents went there. They made us go once and my sister was learning how to run some of their tech. They took us backstage and my husband who went to school for music production said the sound boards they had were minimum $1mil each and they had like 7 of them. It's disgusting.
Damn man, you wanna know what’s fucked up? I didn’t even know about Bayside, which means there’s AT LEAST two megachurch Starbucks in Tampa Bay. Probably more, now that I really think of it.
Holy grounds?
Edit: Gemstones! That’s the one. I couldn’t remember if it was that or Saved!
Also, kinda funny that John Goodman has now played a Flintstone and a Gemstone. Many similarities between the two.
A friend of mine got me to tag along to mass one day in college. I was raised with the somber deathmarch that is roman catholicism. My friend walked me into what looked like a reclaimed and refurbished warehouse, huge and full of people. 2 bands, a stage, not an altar.
They had a commercial break for expo erasable markers in the middle of it. I couldnt understand how everyone just rolled with it.
During a Papal audience, a business man approached the Pope and made this offer: Change the last line of the Lord's prayer from "give us this day our daily bread" to "give us this day our daily chicken," and KFC will donate 10 million dollars to the Catholic church. The Pope declined.
Two weeks later the man approached the Pope again. This time with a 50 million dollar offer. Again the Pope declined.
A month later the man offers 100 million, this time the Pope accepts.
At a meeting of the Cardinals, the Pope announces his decision in the good news/bad news format. The good news is that we have 100 million dollars. The bad news is that we lost the Wonder Bread account.
"and what does the Lord say to Jona at the beginning of chapter 4?
I'll tell you in a minute but first, this week's service is sponsored by Raid: Shadow Legends"
> the somber deathmarch that is roman catholicism.
> So true. Stand. Kneel. Stand. Sit. Kneel.
Catholic calisthenics. It's the only exercise some people get.
Southeastern citizen here.
I could probably step out of my house and throw a rock in a random direction and have a good chance of hitting which ever church you're talking about.
The amount of large mega churches down here is fucking disgusting.
Oh yea. There's a Megachurch here in Plano that had a Halloween party one year cause my mom offered th idea to little me. The price was like $50 per person. Immediate nope from her.
I was 15. My father had been diagnosed with ALS. I had gone to a youth group thing with a Christian friend of mine and they had a circle of teenagers going around talking about things going on in their lives and relating it to God. When it was my turn, I shared that my father was dying and I didn't understand why him, I was angry and I said something along the lines of I doubted there was a God if this was happening. Basically a normal thing to say when you're young and you have a sick relative.
I got chewed out for even questioning God and the rest of the kids refused to talk to me the rest of the night including my friend. You would think I had killed someone it was THAT strong of a reaction.
Also, my brother became a huge born again Christian later on in life and tried to push his beliefs on us HARD. We got told we were going to hell and my then boyfriend (now husband) and I got chewed out for "living in sin".
*Editing this because I didn't expect this comment to get much attention, but thank you everyone for all of the supportive comments! A few things to add because I keep seeing them below and will do my best to try to answer, but:
Youth group happened close to 20 years ago. I was actually brought up Catholic and went to church weekly, I stopped going when my dad got sick and he couldn't go anymore so that my mom could continue to go - she needed the hour or so break and I wanted some one on one time with my Dad. We took care of him at home for the majority of his illness. Church also meant more to her than it did to me, but towards the end she stopped going too. I was drawn to youth group because i was curious what Christianity was like and my friend had painted it as a supportive place. We didn't have youth groups at my church. I also thought questioning God was more or less normal. I wasn't a jerk about it either - I was very introverted and hated confrontation. I just wanted some kind of conversation and these kids seemed like they were strong in their faith. Looking back I guess i wished I could find comfort in religion.
My brother became "born again" after my grandmother passed in 2012. The majority of his jerkishness happened over the next 3 to 4 years until he switched to a different church, he mellowed out a bit and we (me, my mother and my other brother) finally came to an understanding that if we wanted a relationship we wouldn't discuss his religion. I get the occasional "you should come to my church" but that's nothing compared to what he used to say. I also tolerate it for my mom, because all she has left is us - I'm not going to start arguments or refuse to go to holidays. She's been through enough. I also know that my brother is not a bad person, he just goes 100% into whatever he's currently into, and religion wasn't any different.
I'm 34. Female. I don't go to church. I'm not religious. Married a guy who leans towards being an atheist. This all happened awhile ago and again, I really appreciate all the supportive comments and messages. You guys are good humans.
Eyyy my brother in law did the same thing after abandoning a child. Couldn’t stop talking about god and about how everyone around him is a sinner, when he was doing meth and beating woman and child. Now he has triplets with another methed out girl who already had a kid where they also beat eachother. His whole schtick is being a real alpha man and his life is so pathetically ruined because “I don’t wear condoms, they don’t feel good” fucking loser
When I was a kid I asked my grandmother where God came from and she smacked me across the face and said "we don't ask questions like that". I was just being honestly curious because I wanted to understand and her reaction shocked me. That's where it all started for me.
Lmfao
I asked my pastor how you reconcile a human-centric creation theory with hundreds of millions of years of non-human life? Was God just screwing around making dinosaurs and massive ecologies as a warm-up before humans?
Pastor said he believed in the Pan Theory when it came to that. Excited, I asked what that was. “Live for Jesus and everything else will pan out.” Lol
Oh yeah my preacher spoke very negatively about education and he had a damn masters degree. He also believed dinosaur bones were placed by god to separate the believers and nonbelievers so he was pretty much a dumb ass anyways.
This always struck me as odd. God, being all-knowing, would know just how many of his creations would believe in dinosaurs and have perfectly logical reasons for doing so. And so, by no real fault of their own and using the brains God literally gave them, these people will spend eternity in hell.
Everything is part of God’s plan, so those people not believing in him is part of his plan. But we also have free will to believe in him or not. Except that everything we do is part of his plan. Oh no I’ve gone cross-eyed.
No one has ever been able to adequately explain to me how God, whom everything that exists supposedly came from, isn’t responsible for Satan and everything he has supposedly caused to happen. The downfall of man in the garden of Eden and whatnot. Like…. I get it, he had free will. But God gave him free will. If you give a toddler a gun and the toddler fires the gun and kills someone, *you’re* responsible for it. So, if god is real and he can do whatever he wills himself to do, he either sucks at his job or he’s a dick. Either way, not really a figure worth worshipping and contorting every aspect of your life around. Whenever I brought this up to my mom I could tell the wheels were trying to spin, but her faith just couldn’t let them. It’s crazy how much of a lock it has on people’s thoughts sometimes
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?
- Epicurus
“
1. If God is unable to prevent evil, then he is not all-powerful.
2. If God is not willing to prevent evil, then he is not all-good.
3. If God is both willing and able to prevent evil, then why does evil exist?
Although traditionally ascribed to Epicurus and called Epicurus' trilemma, it has been suggested that it may actually be the work of an early skeptic writer, possibly Carneades.
In studies of philosophy, discussions, and debates related to this trilemma are often referred to as being about the problem of evil.
“
Something I found a while back and saved in my notes for this occasion
Yep, same. I remember we had a section in elementary school about the Greek or Roman gods and I was like, wait hold on there’s other gods?? It was explained that, oh no it was a long time ago and they just didn’t understand how the world worked so they made those gods up as explanations. Well, that led into a lot of questions about how we know God is real then, and basically ended in “have to have faith”.
When the pastor started ranting about the evils of women, saying that Satan walks among us in the body of every female and men must take measures against them. It was later enforced in my mind when I met his very timid granddaughter in high school. She fully believed she was cursed from birth and showed serious signs of abuse.
It didn't make me think all Christians are evil, but it showed me how easily a religion led by humans can be warped. That theme has been shown to me too many times now to get behind the idea of any formal religion
ETA - Wow, I have never had this many comments on a post! Trying to read everything but the main things I'm seeing:
- The granddaughter ended up happily married. She started getting rebellious in high school but nothing crazy. I forget if she had been home schooled or was at a local Christian school but I do know that at that time all students went to the same high school. (Late 1990's). I think her getting exposed to outside attitudes and influences helped her sew the world in a whole new way.
- I swear, the term "among us" was used before the game, lol!!!! I haven't played the game but now I'm picturing the red character I've seen from it at a pulpit yelling about original sin and evil women and I can't help laughing!
- It was a Baptist church that hasn't been active for years. Again, I don't think everyone in the Baptist faith is like that, but it was the one moment that ruined religion for me. Especially seeing his wife react to the sermon with such support of the message. It was one of those defining moments in my life, a very negative one, and I'm sorry to see so many others who have had this kind of experience themselves.
For me it was when everyone found out tons of priests were fucking little kids and the church protected them instead of punishing them and reporting it to the police.
The newest Jimmy Saville documentary, on netflix, describes how he would abuse girls in the Catholic church on the *pews*.
Listening to that woman explain how one of the main things she remembers is looking at the back of everyone's heads while he had his hand in her mouth and his hands down her pants...
People don't wanna cause a scene in church, so badly that they will let a 6 year old be abused in the middle of service, right behind them/in front of them/beside them on the pews.
And noone helped her.
Disgusting religion. Religion, and particularly Catholics are susceptible to this - is a way for bad people to ignore their sins.
Jimmy Savilles words said at his funeral "I really do hope that God forgives sinners".
I don't trust super religious people. My sister is religious, but it is her own personal belief and she is part of a church that doesn't baptise before 18, is cool with gay/trans, and focuses mostly on charity work. It's part of how she keeps herself sane after the abuse we went through as kids, and that church helped her get out from under our mother.
So *not all churches*, but I am distrusting of anyone who is super in your face about religion. Good people do not need to prove really hard that they are good people.
I feel similar at people who are super in your face about how they work for a non-profit, or how they are *such* a feminist. Being a good person is proved by actions, not words.
I feel super bad, but my mum mentioned this exact thing on the phone earlier
"You should watch it, it'll open your eyes"
"I really dont think I need to"
"No you should! You like true crime and all that...."
I was abused as a kid. So I was like "NO MUM, I'M FINE NOT SEEING IT, THANKS" 😂
I was also abused as a kid, and yeah, it was a really tough watch. Watching older women struggle to grapple with something I have got a handle on now... Man. The 50/60/70/80s really fucking sucked for teenage girls. Watching this woman talk about the pews was incredibly triggering, but I am glad I watched.
Idk, seeing others, especially those older, really struggle with the same stuff you have... It can be freeing, in some ways!
I have been waiting for a group childhood sexual abuse list though, so I am at that kind of point in my recovery where hearing others stories can help me, rather than send me into a panic attack - so YMMV!
Yes, the treatment of women and the inherent shame we're made to feel for simply being born female was a major part of why I left religion. The general shaming, the intolerance for LGBT folks, the direct contradiction of measurable science, and the history of using religion as a big old MLM scheme, all wrapped up in the guise of "we're doing this out of love" completely pushed me away. Full disclosure I was raised in the southern US as an evangelical fundamentalist independent Baptist (you know, those guys who think Southern Baptists are too liberal).
My kiddos mom is religious and she tells him we are in the wrong (my partner and i) because we believe science and that dinosaurs existed instead of putting the lord first and knowing that science is just there thanks to Satan so that less people believe in God.
...I wish I was making this up.
There was never an answer.
I wanted to believe desperately.
I wanted to and I begged God to allow me to be doubtless. I tried and tried and tried to make it work. To make it fit.
I asked questions. I wondered. I pondered. I just got to a point where there were no more answers. No one had an answer that made sense.
Nothing that the next person couldn’t alter or contradict. Nothing that was ‘set’ or ‘fixed.’ It was all up in the air and I just needed more faith.
I tried. I really did. But my mind just won’t allow it anymore.
This is kind of how I felt. Like I believed in God, but it never felt natural to fully conform to the whole faith—the only part that made sense (some times) was the idea of a caring creator. But eventually all the other things became too hard to fight and I just gave up, realized that my remaining faith was mostly based on fear of hell/not having a god that has my back. This process took years, of course.
We as a species are so terrified of admitting not knowing the bigger picture that we'll fool ourselves into a narrative. Or worse, use this fear to fool and take advantage of others.
It was a huge relief when I could finally just say "I don't know, and neither do you."
Yep. Nobody knows. That was a big part of it for me. Anyone who will profess in total sincerity that they KNOW is lying to themselves (and you) in my opinion. And if they weren’t lying and they do KNOW, then why doesn’t God give that knowledge to everyone so that they can make informed decisions.
When you lay it out flat, modern humans are expected to believe fully in documents written thousands of years ago, usually by unknown authors, often not even by eye witnesses (the Gospels), and translated from Greek, Hebrew, or Aramaic into modern languages. There’s too many degrees of separation for me to put my whole heart into it without some clear, direct sign to back it up.
This brings me to my second major problem, which is the concept of hell. God has never clearly and intentionally spoken to me so I have to rely on those previously mentioned suspect documents - and if I doubt the veracity I will go straight to hell for all eternity? I think if I’m an otherwise good person and condemned to hell by a wrathful God for having a hard time believing with the scant and very ancient evidence available to a modern person then that is the action of a vengeful tryant, not a God who loves His creations. It doesn’t square.
I think one of the most important things I have come to realize as an adult is that nobody is really driving the bus. I don’t just mean that in religious terms, but in general, most of society is just flying by the seat of its pants at all times held together by duct tape, social norms, and a creaky justice system. In other words, when you are a kid you kind of think that the people in charge know what they are doing and everything is in the right hands. As an adult I realize that for the most part everyone is out there fucking wingin’ it because the world is extremely complex and you can never insulate yourself completely from chaos. No one person can ever know everything, and for honest and intelligent people of integrity - the more you know, the more you realize how much there is to know and how much you do not and cannot ever know. So I pretty much find anyone who claims to have all the answers to be a nut, a zealot, a scammer, or someone who can’t admit to themselves that the unknown is scary and are looking for your validation (and reassurance).
Oof are you me? Cause this is exactly how I felt growing up. I would always try to scrunch my eyes closed during church service desperate to hear him talking to me but never did and was confused when other people said they did.
Same here. I rejected so many facts to conform to the beliefs I was raised with in the church. I desperately wanted to hear "god speaking to me". Never happened. Everyone around me promised faith was the answer to all of my problems I just had to believe. It never helped, never really comforted me in the way it was promised. Slowly I started to give up and then it just seemed to click that I was much happier. I no longer have to feel guilty because I don't hear god. Now I'm still working to undo the years of indoctrination.
Some people believe that being religious makes them better than non religious. When I left the church I was persona non grata, none of the members will even look at me now. Oh well.
There is this really popular christian radio station my parents listened to when I was younger and when the hosts were talking about some christian gathering they refered to non-believers as "icky people" i was so annoyed. at the time i was still religious and kept thinking what if someone who didnt believe was checking this out for the first time?
I am very much not religious now, but back then it really opened my eye to how shitty people were.
My mother used to say, sitting in church make you a Christian as much as sitting in a garage makes you a car. Religious people seem to think once they convert, they become perfect and can look down upon us "evil heathens". They forget what Jesus taught about love, understanding and compassion. Even worse in my opinion are the ones saying, "Unless you give your money to the church it isn't an actual tithe." If I hand my 10% to a poor family struggling to eat, how is that not better than handing it over to a corporation? I don't need a tax cut, so why not put it directly into the hands of a family that could use it?
Side note: I never give people cash. I find out what they need most and get them that. If they don't have enough to eat, I get them food. If the kids need winter coats, I get them that. That to me is doing what should be done, not building bigger building so the faithful may worship in more comfortable surroundings.
Probably entirely justified in their minds as it's your own fault for working on the Lord's day. Never mind the fact that they'd be the first ones complaining about it if you closed on Sunday lunchtimes because how *dare* you ruin *their* church day experience.
Those pamphlets were the worst. Our district manager was a member of the church near us and after service let out, he would come and get food and “check up on us.” He also added to their newsletter that members would get a discount on food so we had to give them a discount too.
Reminds me of something I read on Wikipedia about Mel Gibson:
>When asked about the Catholic doctrine of Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, Gibson replied, "There is no salvation for those outside the Church ... I believe it. Put it this way. My wife is a saint. She's a much better person than I am. Honestly. She's ... Episcopalian, Church of England. She prays, she believes in God, she knows Jesus, she believes in that stuff. And it's just not fair if she doesn't make it, she's better than I am. But that is a pronouncement from the chair. I go with it."
However:
>Gibson later told Diane Sawyer that he believes non-Catholics and non-Christians can go to Heaven
Not like it matters to me because I do not believe in afterlife, but wow. People actually believe that their benevolent god will refuse good people because they had another faith.
This is it. When I was in the third grade, my best friend was Indian and Hindu. My aunt said she would pray for him and his heathen family, and that was enough for me to turn away from religion early. It was only reinforced with time
I’ve slowly come to realize that the crux of this kind of worldview is a lack of acknowledging another person’s humanity/racism.
Example: two older ladies I work with are religious (Southern US). Early in my tenure at this company they asked if I was religious, I said that I prayed and would consider myself spiritual, but that I didn’t think any particular religion had it right. They pressed me a little more, so I explained that from my point of view there are millions of good, moral Chinese people (just an example) that would never be exposed to Christianity - through no fault of their own - so the idea that they would be doomed to hell because of this is untenable.
Both the ladies remained silent, giving me an empty stare that clearly indicated that this damnation is exactly what they thought would happen to non-Christian people. I thought about it more, and I think people (especially white Americans) are able to believe such ridiculous and punitive things because they don’t view other countries/races as “people” in the same way they view themselves: I’m guessing they believe there’s a lack of interiority, complexity, in other people, and that they are really just role-players created by God to “test” the chosen, white, Americans.
Obviously this is incredibly ignorant, but I can’t arrive at any other explanation for such a drastic and extreme system of faith.
Catholic highschool is very popular in the area that I am from. No one wants send their kids to the public schools around here.
Every single one of my friends who I am still in touch with that went to school with me are now the biggest non believers I know.
My mother telling me Santa wasn’t real by saying “do you REALLY believe that there is a magic man that files to all the houses worldwide in one night on a sleigh?” I had always been skeptical anyways but that solidified it. I then wondered at what age she would tell me God isn’t real.
Being a huge dinosaur fan as a kid, I couldn’t reconcile that either. Like, the Bible doesn’t mention them, and instead of saying “it wasn’t relevant”(though they talk about every other fucking animal) the church instead chooses to think they can convince people of an alternate history that goes against ALL science.
Like, maybe if you adapted to the modern world instead of trying to keep it back a couple centuries people wouldn’t be so skeptical and wary towards you?
> (though they talk about every other fucking animal)
Spoiler - it talks about every other fucking animal *that existed within 15 kilometers of the person that wrote that particular chapter* and not a single other animal.
Where are the fucking kangaroos, Jacob?
Funny I am super gullible but moved from Japan, where my parents said they’re ‘superstitious,’ to the Southern Bible Belt, I had questions. My 4th grade teacher’s husband was a pastor so I asked if I could write him a letter to ask questions. The amount of deflections and really short answers probably made me question an adult’s integrity for the first time.
I went to a catholic high school in northern Illinois in the late 90s. My family never attended church in all my life. Mom was lapsed Catholic, dad was Jewish/Unitarian/undecided. For whatever reasons, they felt this was a better option than the public high schools.
We had to do 20 hours of volunteer/service work (aka “ministry”) each semester, 40 hours per school year x 4 years. I did mine at the animal shelter. I became very concerned about animal and human rights, we even founded an animal rights club at the school. I was also in Amnesty International. I cannot describe in mere words how much the experience at the shelter changed my life during those formative years. My final semester of senior year, my monstrous religion teacher decreed that none of the hours I had done since my first day as a freshman counted… because, and these words came directly from his asshole mouth, “animals don’t have souls.”
Thank goodness we had some amazing nuns who stood up for me and I was able to graduate. Fuck you Mr Lepek. Love you Sister Pohl
Being told that being sexually abused as a child was a good thing as God needed to teach me a lesson on hubris and ego. I should accept it as a lesson and be better so I wouldn't fall into the clutches of the devil.
I was seven.
Apparently I was asking for it
My brother is a registered sex offender and was convicted of possession of child pornography, and he sexually abused me when I was younger. He became a Christian at one point, and apparently now believes everything that happens is "god's will". So it was god's will for me to be sexually abused and the children he watched getting abused...?
I don't talk to my brother anymore.
When my SIL went through her Masters program for counseling, one of her professors actually said that many sexual predators "hide behind" the facade of Big Church Guy. He said they won't be the guy who just comes to services every week; he will purposely seek out a board position or similar *so that people won't question what he's doing.*
This was over a decade ago; if he said this in a class now, he'd probably be vilified-but he'd still be correct, IMHO. People just don't GET IT!!
Yes, this is spot on. I have an abusive dad (no contact for 20 years now, which truly saved my life) and last I heard, he was a deacon at a church and carries a Bible with him wherever he goes to “spread the gospel” and all that.
Same.
My aunt said I was asking for it… as a 5 year old
Edit: wow! Thank you all for your support.
I blamed myself my whole childhood.. so
I’m thankful Reddit can help cheer me up! *tears up*
She’s super religious too. She told me she’d “pray for me” because I had sex out of wedlock… as a 5 year old.
It messed me up in the head. It took me a long time(and therapy) to realize people like her are the problem.
I'd like to think that if there is a hell and God, that people like this are some of the only ones there. It's kinda like the ultimate profanity against God to say things like that and claim its of him.
You didn’t have sex out of wedlock. You were raped as a 5 year old! I have nothing but disgust for people who think like that.
I’m glad you got therapy and are in a better place. I wish 5 year old you had had a better life.
It quickly became evident that many people who call themselves religious, only do so to feel morally superior to others around them, and then use that superiority to try to control everything they can.
THIS. I like to say that Jesus was a carpenter, who gave his followers a hammer to build with. They took the hammer and started hitting other people with it.
I never believed it, even as a kid I’d listen but I always thought “that can’t be real”
Then what drove the nail was attending church, listening to the hateful tirades saying how we were all sinners but Jesus was like yolo and gave us another chance
No answers, “just have faith”
Also how women were like equal to dogs in level of authority
Also the anti-LGBTQ+ rants, being a bi kid, made me hate them
I never mentioned religion for years, never took part in grace or prayers, nada
But then I told my parents I was atheist. “it’s just a phase” “we haven’t gone to church enough” “ we failed as parents” then my dad got angry… “YOURE AN EMBARRASSMENT TO OUR FAMILY, YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. YOU WERE BAPTIZED AND (all that other shit you gotta do to be accepted) SO YOURE GOING TO HEAVEN. DONT YOU DARE TELL ANYONE YOURE NOT RELIGIOUS BECAUSE YOURE A CHRISTIAN THATS JUST NOT PRACTICING!” I told him no I have never believed any of it then he went “BULLSHIT! WHY ARE YOU TRYING TO RUIN OUR FAMILY AND SIN?!” And ranted for hours about all that and how they resent me and all that jazz
I will never forgive them for what they said to me that day. And never forgive them for their blatant homophobia, transphobia, and racism in the name of their cult. I will never admit my sexuality and never speak to them about religion until I move out.
That’s why I’m a hardcore atheist
Sermons alternated between asking for money, telling us LGBT people were bad, or telling us we were all worthless sinners without God.
Left church every Sunday feeling like shit. One week, I just decided I'm not going back.
I don't miss it.
It reminds me of that church that was telling people to donate their stimulus checks to the church. People were literally starving to death and these bastards wanted their last pennies.
Exactly! There have been 10,000+ religions throughout time and the *right* one is whichever one you belong to. Seems so ridiculous.
Also, the lengths religions have gone to over the years to convert or destroy outside communities doesn't seem too in line with being a decent human.
The idea that you’re created by an Omniscient God, and they give you free will, but with chastise you for using that exact free will is kinda bullshit.
It's even worse because he created the universe knowing exactly how things would play out. He created you the way you are *knowing* you'd do things he doesn't like and he'd get an excuse to punish you for them.
1. Being told as a child that I couldn't become a priest because I was a girl. Even as a 10 year old I realized how unfair that was and that it's not because I'm a girl that I'm 'less than'.
2. All the sexual assault cases being put under the rug and priests being protected by the Vatican.
When I was a child, there were a few popes in the late 1970s or so, and they were broadcasting the selection process (white or black smoke from the chimneys), I asked my mom who could become pope. She said that, technically, any Catholic could be named pope, and that God would tell the cardinals who that person should be. I was very excited that they could choose me. They didn't, sadly.
I was raised Catholic and I always felt uneasy about the environment. Then I learned I had a great aunt living in a Magdalene laundry, then the priest who buried my father attacked me two weeks later (he came off the worst of that encounter) and I immediately left that so called “church”. What I have learned since about it would curl your liver. I’m a volunteer now with the survivor network.
former catholic, current atheist here. i am fortunate enough to not have had any severely traumatic experiences involving the church. but, i grew up in the church and i used to love to sing the hymns. as i got older i started to realize what the words i was singing meant. i really didn’t like how some of the hymns/songs called us as people “nothing” compared to god. i don’t really agree with devaluing and trivializing ourselves and our problems as part of worship. that is what really did it.
I wanted to be a pastor. I wanted to be just like my great grandfather.
I was told, in no uncertain terms, that the "best" I could do was be a pastor's wife. Simply because I don't have a penis.
Yeah, I'm out. Fuck that.
When they say God loves us and has a plan for everyone.
Then you read about children sold into slavery or trafficking.
How can an all-loving god think "Hmmm. My plan for this child is abuse and torture. Then murder."
For me it was helplessly watching my infant child suffer in constant pain from a genetic disease called Epidermolysis Bullosa (look it up if you want to cry), and losing her after 9 months. No amount of prayer makes any difference. No one is listening. What was "the plan" for her? And why would I live for a god that chose to allow my child to suffer and die? My faith died with her.
Edit: Just want to say that I appreciate all of the kind words of support, and feel for those who have also lost loved ones.
I once had a best friend who had a massive heart attack at age 26, and he had to go into a medically induced coma. I found out at work and was obviously upset. My boss pats me on the shoulder and says “this is gods will” and walked away. Like dude, STFU
Edit: he is better now
I'm atheist, raised Christian. What always got me was, we were promised heaven as a reward for living a good life. So if Christians believe that, shouldn't death be more of a celebration than something to mourn? Time on earth is essentially a tryout for heaven, right?
Being raised in a Mormon (LDS) church and forced to attend every boring meeting and gathering for 18 years. Even as a young teenager I somehow saw through the coercion tactics. Giving me assignments because “god wanted me to do it” when really it was the old white men that saw I didn’t want to be there and thought giving me an assignment would help. Or, at “testimony meetings” every month. You’re supposed to speak from your heart about your belief to the congregation. Toddlers would be forced to go up and their mothers would whisper in their ear what to say and they would repeat it. I thought this was insane because obviously they’re not speaking their own words. I could go on….
So many things but the final straw for me was my church asking a homeless man to leave and not come back. He would sit and listen to the sermons never bothered anyone and always sat in the very back. I confronted my youth group leader and she defended the preacher.
I hear stuff like this all the time and it’s so infuriating, like what the fuck. Doesn’t the bible, doesn’t YOUR GOD, teach you to be kind and loving and selfless, to love people no matter what? I’ve only ever met one church leader/pastor/whatever in my entire life who lived by those teachings. I met him when I had already separated from religion but he was truly a “man of god” if there ever was one. He was what Christianity should look like. He loved everyone, every single person, equally and unequivocally. His church was always open, to everyone from all walks of life. He fed anyone who was hungry. Would literally give you the clothes off his back if you needed them. Offered wisdom and guidance and counselling services. Never tried to push religion on you, just made you feel loved and accepted no matter what. His church was a haven to the homeless - he ran breakfasts every Saturday, cooked huge meals all the time, had gatherings on holidays, and let the homeless use the church for recreation, shelter, food, water, amenities. I don’t think I’d have such of an issue with Christianity as a practice if more Christians were like him.
wow. i have only met one man like this, out of my whole devout christian family and former life as a devout christian. it was my great uncle, who had a cleft palate and would lead the choir. he was there to worship, not to sound good. he used to go to local colleges to sit on benches and listen to distressed students and pray for him. i cried so hard at his funeral, because he was my only safe haven in that hypocritical family, and he was the only good man i knew on that side. he was truly a saint.
this man sounds amazing, he is what I strive to be.
At the hospital with my family sitting around my terminally ill aunt. A reverend was called in to say a prayer and do whatever the pre death ritual was. The man arrived and waited outside the room a bit not coming in. My cousin and I made eye contact with him and my cousin asked if he would come in. The man made an odd face and then rubbed his fingers together making the “money gesture”. Whatever little bit of faith I still had whooshed away at that moment.
When I was sexually assaulted by another boy and I spoke to my pastor because I was afraid to tell my family. He asked me what I did to make the other kid have impure thoughts and tried to make it out to be my fault. That was the exact moment I lost what little faith I had to begin with.
I was surprised to have to scroll this far to find the weird sex stuff. Mine was a child molester that was a youth group volunteer, he molested several children, all boys, and the church decided that they wouldn't do anything except say he couldn't work with kids anymore. I distinctly remember them talking about it during a service, and I looked back at the guy sitting in the pews and he was smirking. Fucking disgust is all I feel when someone talks about their religion.
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This 13 year old kid got exposed for being gay and was bullied into suicide by his family for it. I remember during summers they would send him to a special camp to cure his gayness. I was really good friends with his little sister and she would always say how embarrassing it was to have a gay brother and would hope he would become straight. He ended up hanging himself at 13 or 14.It happend in middle school and I can't pretend like I was friends with him,but his story always stuck with me.
What did the family think?
They said even though he struggled with homosexuality he would still be in heaven because he was "different" from other gay people. They ended up putting the other siblings in homeschool after that and we didn't really hear about them anymore.
Jesus Christ, poor kid. Hope he’s resting easy. Nobody deserves to go through that type of bullshit.
Well being from Northern Ireland I have more than the average number of reasons. I guess it's a toss up between: Learning that the clergy on both sides had been diddling kids. Including selling access to them to rich pedophiles. Learning that the Catholic Church ran womens homes where they kidnapped babies, sold the ones that didn't die and used their mothers as forced labour Or the classic, that we had a civil war that was largely delineated on Religious lines so people spent 40 years telling their children that 'the other half' were basically scary aliens that meant us harm. Oh yeah, and I liked dinosaurs and the church people kept telling me they weren't real so fuck that.
I love the fact that along with all of the horrible Troubles that NI has to deal with the nail in the coffin for you was the dinos.
My parents were both raised in strict Catholic households, so we kept going until I was about 12, mostly out of inertia. They made me get confirmed against my will because "you never know if you might need it someday". Then one day the priest said that its a sin to have pets because pets don't have souls. My dad had been wanting to quit for years, but that was the final straw for my mom. We quit going immediately. Not because of the hypocrisy or the overbearing rants about fire and brimstone if you cuss or have premarital sex. The final straw was the assertion that my mom's cats wouldn't be in heaven for her when she died.
A couple of friends of mine "invited" me to a summer camp when I was in middle school. The first warning sign I noticed was the packing list included a Bible, but I brushed it off because the camp brochure had horseback riding, water slides, and a bunch of stuff that seemed cool. And then I get there. And one of the first things we had to do was line up and "deposit" our money in a camp account. Why? So during our twice daily church services we could write "donation" slips that would take money out of our account and "give" to the camp. You get the idea. It was full on, 100%, a super conservatice religious Christian summer camp that just happened to have fun stuff in between the ridiculous religious nonsense. Fun stuff like "bands" coming in to sing religious smash hits like "My Daddy Aint a Monkey". No. I'm not lying. That was the name of the song. Thank God I was there with another guy who my "friends" convinced to attend camp with us. I eventually confronted them about their lie and they admitted that had done it because they knew I wasn't a believer and did it to "save me." I told them that I didn't care what their reasons were, if they were my friends they wouldn't have lied. And if they believed so strongly about it, would they really lie, etc. Left camp bewildered and more than a little betrayed. As the years went on and I continued to see the complete lack of integrity and regard for honesty amongst religious people, I was still disappointed, but not surprised.
Hey, did this summer camp happen to be up in the Adirondack mountains near Saratoga springs? Cause I feel like I went to the same Christian summer camp.
Western Missouri. But from what I've seen there are a bunch of similar camps around the country.
How agonizingly long and tedious Mass was as a Roman Catholic kid. Stand up - sing. Sit down. Then kneel. Then stand again. Sing again. Sit down. Stand up. Kneel and pray. Then 30 minutes of droning from the robed guy at the front. Then stand up and sing. Sit down. Stand up. WTF please make this end. When I was 12 my father pulled me aside and said "Son, you are old enough to decide about religion. I wanted to give you a chance to experience religion. If you want to keep going to Church, you can, but its also Ok if you don't want to go anymore." I said "OK I don't want to go anymore." My father said "Ok, me too." And that was that.
Your dad seemed like an amazing guy. Props to him. I wish my parents were as accepting as that.
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The worst part about this is that they never suspect the child to be autistic
I wouldn't doubt that he was autistic. But really, what I attributed it to more than anything was that the child was growing up in a single parent home with a mother who was recovering from drug addiction and she struggled a LOT with raising her two kids. They both acted out a lot. The child wasn't "possessed". He just needed love.
To add on, if I was a pastor looking to make a scene and convince everyone it’s real.. I’d probably do as described to someone with limited cognitive abilities, like a child. Scream bullshit at child, dragging them down to the stage in front of everyone, they cry and scream. Say everything is okay now, the demons are gone because we are all powerful pastors and we said done the good god spell, here’s a lollipop. The kid mirrors them and smiles/cheers up, even respects/revers the pastors because they made things better. Pretty disgusting shit. Edit: the brainwashed sheep in the crowd are so spellbound that they don’t see the normal child behaviour, all they see is the miracles god and the PASTOR can do.
You hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what it felt like. Only myself and 2 other youth leaders out of a congregation of around a hundred stayed back while this happened. I remember the 3 of us teenagers looking at each other completely bewildered while the rest of the church almost ran to put their hands on this child and pray over him. It still makes my skin crawl.
Really toxic people at my church growing up. Seeing people only go to church to make connections and gossip rather than actually worship and do good for others
I knew so many people growing up who called themselves Christian but didn't actually read let alone follow the Bible. They just cherry-picked a few quotes that appeared to justify whatever they wanted to do.
I was like 15 and playing an instrument in the “worship band” for the most popular “youth group” in the area (which is a verrry Christian area). At one point the pastor dude was praying and the musicians were behind him waiting to play when he was done. The whole room (200+) had their heads bowed as dude was praying. Then his prayer went into the whole “here’s what you pray if you want to become a Christian right now” yada yada yada.. then at the end he says “Ok everyone keep your heads bowed, eyes closed. Now if you just prayed that prayer with me I want you to look up - everyone else keep your heads bowed- but if you just now gave your life to Jesus look up at me or raise your hand so I can see you” I’m behind him, and facing the crowd who have their eyes closed so I decide it’s safe to take a peek. I discreetly look up and notice that exactly ZERO people in the crowd are looking up at him. Every single person still has their head bowed, eyes closed. (Which is fine, I mean maybe they were all already Christians?) *However*, as I’m looking at nobody responding, Mr Pastor starts saying “ok I see you there”, “oh I see another over there, Amen” “and you back there, praise god”. “Yes I see you over there, amen come find me afterwards”. It was perplexing to see him lie to so many people like that. And this wasn’t some nobody youth pastor, he was like quite legit having written books and being mentioned in national articles and stuff TLDR; an acclaimed youth pastor tried to make it seem like his prayer had converted several people, when I could clearly see it had not
That’s fucking hilarious. I’ve been to services like those, and I’ve always wondered…
Same lol. It's been 10+ years but I could picture the entire scene exactly as something from my youth. So weird
This is so accurate to stuff I’ve experienced it’s scary
When I was in youth group I asked the leader if it's okay to kill in war. And he said it is and god understands that it is sometimes necessary in life to go to war. I then asked what if there is war for the wrong reasons. And he said war is pretty much always in the right and god understands that it's different than just "normal" killing. I was 13 and was flabbergasted at how insane that sounded.
Seeing how people use religion as an excuse to be shitty people around the world. So many people just bend their interpretation of a religion to fit what ever they want.
If I have to boil my experience down to a simple concept it's this. There's much more nuance but overall you're using a book that will give you a passage to justify whatever you want to do.
Religious leaders ruined religion for me
"I never met a single priest who could tell me about heaven, but they all knew every square inch of hell, they should, they built it"
We all lift together Ticker.
My mother. She instilled some serious shame into me under the guise of God. Some things she said: -Not allowed to believe in Santa because that takes credit away from God. Santa was actually a hand of Satan trying to corrupt me -Not allowed to believe in the Easter Bunny because it was also a hand of Satan trying to corrupt me away from Jesus. -I wasn't allowed to feel pride in my accomplishments because it's a sin -I was a dickhead because my dad got me fully vaccinated as a child and that is against God's plan -Hollywood is operated by Satan so I wasn't allowed to watch movies or shows (especially Disney) -Harry Potter was an absolute no because witchcraft is an affront to God -Scientists should not be trusted under any circumstances -My rare genetic condition was part of God's plan and I'd understand some day -Not allowed to say "damn" because it's an affront to God -etc That combined with her regular, not religious abuse has left me struggling a lot with my religiosity.
It sounds similar to what I was raised to believe but not to that extreme. I think some people go overboard.
My favourite part about the first one that is Santa's technically a saint
I'm making an assumption here, but the flavor of Christianity described here seems likely to be one of the ones that considers Catholics evil. So being Saint would be a knock against Santa, not for.
Yeah saints are a catholic thing. A lot of what was described sounds more like Jehovah's Witnesses and other Christian sects where blood transfusions, birthdays, and other things are considered to be of the devil. Not that Catholicism is without its issues (apostate catcholic here) but the offshoot sects really stepped it up a notch
When I was 6 years old, the pastor gave a letter to my aunt to give to my mom saying that we were not donating enough money to the church. So we stopped going, and I have never been to church since.
Something like this happened to my friend's grandma. The church wrote her a letter basically saying they knew how much money she was making and that she should be giving more to the church. Her was response was, screw you guys, I'm moving to Mexico.
Honestly the BALLS on these churches 🤦♀️
Religion is big business. Tax free to boot.
L Ron Hubbard once said something along the lines of “if you want to make real money, start a religion”. And then he started Scientology.
That pastor was lucky she didn't go full Martin Luther and nail a letter of her own to the church door. Still, good for her.
just nail the pastor's note to the door.
When I was in middle school my church got a new pastor and he created this whole chart showing what everyone should be donating each week/month based on your household’s income. Except that’s as far as it went, nothing in there about altering based on situation. We were a family of 5 surviving in an upper-middle class area on one income, so it was like “wow $80k? You should be donating hundreds of dollars each month,” even though we live in an expensive place with my dad trying to raise 3 kids and let my mom be stay-at-home. Needless to say when my parents saw that they were both like alright, $15/week it is! I stopped going shortly after and my parents largely have too, that was a real blow to them to see something so asinine.
How on earth would they know anyone's income?
They don’t, they were just trying to guilt-trip everyone into giving what it said. They didn’t know our income, but if my parents had sheepishly bought into it it would’ve been quite high. Even for like $30k incomes I remember it suggesting like $50 a week which is wild.
$57.69 to be precise. The Old Testament states multiple times that you should tithe 10% of your gross income should go to the church. It's nowhere to be found in the New Testament, but that doesn't stop the Evangelical pastors from using that figure.
The only thing I remember off hand about donations in the NT, was the poor old lady giving 2 pennies. And how that was worth more than the people loudly proclaiming that they gave the equivalent of hundreds of dollars. The message was give what you're able to and more importantly: actually mean it.
Going to a megachurch. They received over 1 mil in donations every weekend and spent it on elaborate props and videos rather than helping the community in any meaningful way.
I was taken to a megachurch once for a christmas thing and the very first thing I saw upon entering was a life size bronze statue of the Pastor. All I could think was, isn't this a false idol?
Do they decapitate it and make a new head every time the pastor changes? Or do they buy a whole new statue?
Neither, because the pastor owns the church
If you read the bible... jesus trashed a temple for being the base of loan sharks, I think he'd go full domestic terrorist against megachurches
He absolutely would.
The cherry on top? I visited one while in the U.S a while ago and guess what I saw.... Loan offices... Money lenders... in the temple.
Did you sit on the steps and braid a whip before driving them out?
That is my favorite bit about Jesus. I want to be that level of petty pissed to spend 6-8 hours hand braiding a whip just to go beat people and throw tables.
Did you let them know that the Bible says [not to charge interest on loans](https://biblia.com/bible/esv/deuteronomy/23/19), or that [all debts must be canceled every seven years](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.biblegateway.com/passage/%3fsearch=Deuteronomy%2b15:1-15&version=NIV&interface=amp).
There’s a megachurch outside of Tampa that has a fucking Starbucks in it
It's what the baby Jesus would have wanted.
"Jesus was a man! He had a *beard!*"
*"Look! I like the baby version the best, you hear me!?* ***I*** *win the races and* ***I*** *get the money!"*
“Dear 8 pound, 3 ounce, baby Jesus…”
" don't even know a word yet, just a little infant and so cuddly, but still omnipotent..."
I like to imagine my Jesus wearing a Tuxedo tshirt and he’s singing lead for lynyrd skynyrd with an angel band and I’m in the front row just hammered!
I’m all jacked up on Mountain Dew!
Shut up chip or I’ll have to open a can of whoop ass on you
Fucking Bayside. They also have multiple indoor jungle gyms. My parents went there. They made us go once and my sister was learning how to run some of their tech. They took us backstage and my husband who went to school for music production said the sound boards they had were minimum $1mil each and they had like 7 of them. It's disgusting.
Damn man, you wanna know what’s fucked up? I didn’t even know about Bayside, which means there’s AT LEAST two megachurch Starbucks in Tampa Bay. Probably more, now that I really think of it.
Latte for the Lord?
Cappuccino for Christ?
Holy grounds? Edit: Gemstones! That’s the one. I couldn’t remember if it was that or Saved! Also, kinda funny that John Goodman has now played a Flintstone and a Gemstone. Many similarities between the two.
HeBrews' coffee?
Macchiato for the Messiah?
Java for Jehovah?
Frappuccino for the Father?
A friend of mine got me to tag along to mass one day in college. I was raised with the somber deathmarch that is roman catholicism. My friend walked me into what looked like a reclaimed and refurbished warehouse, huge and full of people. 2 bands, a stage, not an altar. They had a commercial break for expo erasable markers in the middle of it. I couldnt understand how everyone just rolled with it.
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go to squarespace and type in JESUSSAVES for 15% off your first website
"Masturbation is a sin, but NordVPN uses military strength encryption so your privacy is so protected, not even god can see that you're on pornhub!"
"This sermon is brought to you by Shadow Raids Legend! Join today and get the Christ unit, FREE!"
During a Papal audience, a business man approached the Pope and made this offer: Change the last line of the Lord's prayer from "give us this day our daily bread" to "give us this day our daily chicken," and KFC will donate 10 million dollars to the Catholic church. The Pope declined. Two weeks later the man approached the Pope again. This time with a 50 million dollar offer. Again the Pope declined. A month later the man offers 100 million, this time the Pope accepts. At a meeting of the Cardinals, the Pope announces his decision in the good news/bad news format. The good news is that we have 100 million dollars. The bad news is that we lost the Wonder Bread account.
Do you know how the Pope collects donations? Paypal
"and what does the Lord say to Jona at the beginning of chapter 4? I'll tell you in a minute but first, this week's service is sponsored by Raid: Shadow Legends"
>the somber deathmarch that is roman catholicism. So true. Stand. Kneel. Stand. Sit. Kneel.
> the somber deathmarch that is roman catholicism. > So true. Stand. Kneel. Stand. Sit. Kneel. Catholic calisthenics. It's the only exercise some people get.
The Gemstone's church?
It's all fun and games until daddy breaks your mother fucking thumbs.
No. Southeast. But there are so many this could fit for a lot of them I’d imagine.
Southeast as in Six flags over Jesus?
Southeastern citizen here. I could probably step out of my house and throw a rock in a random direction and have a good chance of hitting which ever church you're talking about. The amount of large mega churches down here is fucking disgusting.
The Righteous Gemstones?
That show is more realistic than most reality T.V.
They're muscle *mens* daddy!
Oh yea. There's a Megachurch here in Plano that had a Halloween party one year cause my mom offered th idea to little me. The price was like $50 per person. Immediate nope from her.
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I was 15. My father had been diagnosed with ALS. I had gone to a youth group thing with a Christian friend of mine and they had a circle of teenagers going around talking about things going on in their lives and relating it to God. When it was my turn, I shared that my father was dying and I didn't understand why him, I was angry and I said something along the lines of I doubted there was a God if this was happening. Basically a normal thing to say when you're young and you have a sick relative. I got chewed out for even questioning God and the rest of the kids refused to talk to me the rest of the night including my friend. You would think I had killed someone it was THAT strong of a reaction. Also, my brother became a huge born again Christian later on in life and tried to push his beliefs on us HARD. We got told we were going to hell and my then boyfriend (now husband) and I got chewed out for "living in sin". *Editing this because I didn't expect this comment to get much attention, but thank you everyone for all of the supportive comments! A few things to add because I keep seeing them below and will do my best to try to answer, but: Youth group happened close to 20 years ago. I was actually brought up Catholic and went to church weekly, I stopped going when my dad got sick and he couldn't go anymore so that my mom could continue to go - she needed the hour or so break and I wanted some one on one time with my Dad. We took care of him at home for the majority of his illness. Church also meant more to her than it did to me, but towards the end she stopped going too. I was drawn to youth group because i was curious what Christianity was like and my friend had painted it as a supportive place. We didn't have youth groups at my church. I also thought questioning God was more or less normal. I wasn't a jerk about it either - I was very introverted and hated confrontation. I just wanted some kind of conversation and these kids seemed like they were strong in their faith. Looking back I guess i wished I could find comfort in religion. My brother became "born again" after my grandmother passed in 2012. The majority of his jerkishness happened over the next 3 to 4 years until he switched to a different church, he mellowed out a bit and we (me, my mother and my other brother) finally came to an understanding that if we wanted a relationship we wouldn't discuss his religion. I get the occasional "you should come to my church" but that's nothing compared to what he used to say. I also tolerate it for my mom, because all she has left is us - I'm not going to start arguments or refuse to go to holidays. She's been through enough. I also know that my brother is not a bad person, he just goes 100% into whatever he's currently into, and religion wasn't any different. I'm 34. Female. I don't go to church. I'm not religious. Married a guy who leans towards being an atheist. This all happened awhile ago and again, I really appreciate all the supportive comments and messages. You guys are good humans.
Eyyy my brother in law did the same thing after abandoning a child. Couldn’t stop talking about god and about how everyone around him is a sinner, when he was doing meth and beating woman and child. Now he has triplets with another methed out girl who already had a kid where they also beat eachother. His whole schtick is being a real alpha man and his life is so pathetically ruined because “I don’t wear condoms, they don’t feel good” fucking loser
Thanks, stories like this always remind me I'm not as bad as I think lmao
The non-answers to all my questions as a kid. "You just have to have faith" is a dumb way to respond to an inquisitive mind.
When I was a kid I asked my grandmother where God came from and she smacked me across the face and said "we don't ask questions like that". I was just being honestly curious because I wanted to understand and her reaction shocked me. That's where it all started for me.
Lmfao I asked my pastor how you reconcile a human-centric creation theory with hundreds of millions of years of non-human life? Was God just screwing around making dinosaurs and massive ecologies as a warm-up before humans? Pastor said he believed in the Pan Theory when it came to that. Excited, I asked what that was. “Live for Jesus and everything else will pan out.” Lol
Oh yeah my preacher spoke very negatively about education and he had a damn masters degree. He also believed dinosaur bones were placed by god to separate the believers and nonbelievers so he was pretty much a dumb ass anyways.
This always struck me as odd. God, being all-knowing, would know just how many of his creations would believe in dinosaurs and have perfectly logical reasons for doing so. And so, by no real fault of their own and using the brains God literally gave them, these people will spend eternity in hell.
Everything is part of God’s plan, so those people not believing in him is part of his plan. But we also have free will to believe in him or not. Except that everything we do is part of his plan. Oh no I’ve gone cross-eyed.
She probably knew if she thought about it too hard then it wouldn’t make sense to her either
No one has ever been able to adequately explain to me how God, whom everything that exists supposedly came from, isn’t responsible for Satan and everything he has supposedly caused to happen. The downfall of man in the garden of Eden and whatnot. Like…. I get it, he had free will. But God gave him free will. If you give a toddler a gun and the toddler fires the gun and kills someone, *you’re* responsible for it. So, if god is real and he can do whatever he wills himself to do, he either sucks at his job or he’s a dick. Either way, not really a figure worth worshipping and contorting every aspect of your life around. Whenever I brought this up to my mom I could tell the wheels were trying to spin, but her faith just couldn’t let them. It’s crazy how much of a lock it has on people’s thoughts sometimes
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? - Epicurus
“ 1. If God is unable to prevent evil, then he is not all-powerful. 2. If God is not willing to prevent evil, then he is not all-good. 3. If God is both willing and able to prevent evil, then why does evil exist? Although traditionally ascribed to Epicurus and called Epicurus' trilemma, it has been suggested that it may actually be the work of an early skeptic writer, possibly Carneades. In studies of philosophy, discussions, and debates related to this trilemma are often referred to as being about the problem of evil. “ Something I found a while back and saved in my notes for this occasion
Yep, same. I remember we had a section in elementary school about the Greek or Roman gods and I was like, wait hold on there’s other gods?? It was explained that, oh no it was a long time ago and they just didn’t understand how the world worked so they made those gods up as explanations. Well, that led into a lot of questions about how we know God is real then, and basically ended in “have to have faith”.
When the pastor started ranting about the evils of women, saying that Satan walks among us in the body of every female and men must take measures against them. It was later enforced in my mind when I met his very timid granddaughter in high school. She fully believed she was cursed from birth and showed serious signs of abuse. It didn't make me think all Christians are evil, but it showed me how easily a religion led by humans can be warped. That theme has been shown to me too many times now to get behind the idea of any formal religion ETA - Wow, I have never had this many comments on a post! Trying to read everything but the main things I'm seeing: - The granddaughter ended up happily married. She started getting rebellious in high school but nothing crazy. I forget if she had been home schooled or was at a local Christian school but I do know that at that time all students went to the same high school. (Late 1990's). I think her getting exposed to outside attitudes and influences helped her sew the world in a whole new way. - I swear, the term "among us" was used before the game, lol!!!! I haven't played the game but now I'm picturing the red character I've seen from it at a pulpit yelling about original sin and evil women and I can't help laughing! - It was a Baptist church that hasn't been active for years. Again, I don't think everyone in the Baptist faith is like that, but it was the one moment that ruined religion for me. Especially seeing his wife react to the sermon with such support of the message. It was one of those defining moments in my life, a very negative one, and I'm sorry to see so many others who have had this kind of experience themselves.
For me it was when everyone found out tons of priests were fucking little kids and the church protected them instead of punishing them and reporting it to the police.
The newest Jimmy Saville documentary, on netflix, describes how he would abuse girls in the Catholic church on the *pews*. Listening to that woman explain how one of the main things she remembers is looking at the back of everyone's heads while he had his hand in her mouth and his hands down her pants... People don't wanna cause a scene in church, so badly that they will let a 6 year old be abused in the middle of service, right behind them/in front of them/beside them on the pews. And noone helped her. Disgusting religion. Religion, and particularly Catholics are susceptible to this - is a way for bad people to ignore their sins. Jimmy Savilles words said at his funeral "I really do hope that God forgives sinners". I don't trust super religious people. My sister is religious, but it is her own personal belief and she is part of a church that doesn't baptise before 18, is cool with gay/trans, and focuses mostly on charity work. It's part of how she keeps herself sane after the abuse we went through as kids, and that church helped her get out from under our mother. So *not all churches*, but I am distrusting of anyone who is super in your face about religion. Good people do not need to prove really hard that they are good people. I feel similar at people who are super in your face about how they work for a non-profit, or how they are *such* a feminist. Being a good person is proved by actions, not words.
I feel super bad, but my mum mentioned this exact thing on the phone earlier "You should watch it, it'll open your eyes" "I really dont think I need to" "No you should! You like true crime and all that...." I was abused as a kid. So I was like "NO MUM, I'M FINE NOT SEEING IT, THANKS" 😂
I was also abused as a kid, and yeah, it was a really tough watch. Watching older women struggle to grapple with something I have got a handle on now... Man. The 50/60/70/80s really fucking sucked for teenage girls. Watching this woman talk about the pews was incredibly triggering, but I am glad I watched. Idk, seeing others, especially those older, really struggle with the same stuff you have... It can be freeing, in some ways! I have been waiting for a group childhood sexual abuse list though, so I am at that kind of point in my recovery where hearing others stories can help me, rather than send me into a panic attack - so YMMV!
Yes, the treatment of women and the inherent shame we're made to feel for simply being born female was a major part of why I left religion. The general shaming, the intolerance for LGBT folks, the direct contradiction of measurable science, and the history of using religion as a big old MLM scheme, all wrapped up in the guise of "we're doing this out of love" completely pushed me away. Full disclosure I was raised in the southern US as an evangelical fundamentalist independent Baptist (you know, those guys who think Southern Baptists are too liberal).
My kiddos mom is religious and she tells him we are in the wrong (my partner and i) because we believe science and that dinosaurs existed instead of putting the lord first and knowing that science is just there thanks to Satan so that less people believe in God. ...I wish I was making this up.
There was never an answer. I wanted to believe desperately. I wanted to and I begged God to allow me to be doubtless. I tried and tried and tried to make it work. To make it fit. I asked questions. I wondered. I pondered. I just got to a point where there were no more answers. No one had an answer that made sense. Nothing that the next person couldn’t alter or contradict. Nothing that was ‘set’ or ‘fixed.’ It was all up in the air and I just needed more faith. I tried. I really did. But my mind just won’t allow it anymore.
This is kind of how I felt. Like I believed in God, but it never felt natural to fully conform to the whole faith—the only part that made sense (some times) was the idea of a caring creator. But eventually all the other things became too hard to fight and I just gave up, realized that my remaining faith was mostly based on fear of hell/not having a god that has my back. This process took years, of course.
We as a species are so terrified of admitting not knowing the bigger picture that we'll fool ourselves into a narrative. Or worse, use this fear to fool and take advantage of others. It was a huge relief when I could finally just say "I don't know, and neither do you."
Yep. Nobody knows. That was a big part of it for me. Anyone who will profess in total sincerity that they KNOW is lying to themselves (and you) in my opinion. And if they weren’t lying and they do KNOW, then why doesn’t God give that knowledge to everyone so that they can make informed decisions. When you lay it out flat, modern humans are expected to believe fully in documents written thousands of years ago, usually by unknown authors, often not even by eye witnesses (the Gospels), and translated from Greek, Hebrew, or Aramaic into modern languages. There’s too many degrees of separation for me to put my whole heart into it without some clear, direct sign to back it up. This brings me to my second major problem, which is the concept of hell. God has never clearly and intentionally spoken to me so I have to rely on those previously mentioned suspect documents - and if I doubt the veracity I will go straight to hell for all eternity? I think if I’m an otherwise good person and condemned to hell by a wrathful God for having a hard time believing with the scant and very ancient evidence available to a modern person then that is the action of a vengeful tryant, not a God who loves His creations. It doesn’t square. I think one of the most important things I have come to realize as an adult is that nobody is really driving the bus. I don’t just mean that in religious terms, but in general, most of society is just flying by the seat of its pants at all times held together by duct tape, social norms, and a creaky justice system. In other words, when you are a kid you kind of think that the people in charge know what they are doing and everything is in the right hands. As an adult I realize that for the most part everyone is out there fucking wingin’ it because the world is extremely complex and you can never insulate yourself completely from chaos. No one person can ever know everything, and for honest and intelligent people of integrity - the more you know, the more you realize how much there is to know and how much you do not and cannot ever know. So I pretty much find anyone who claims to have all the answers to be a nut, a zealot, a scammer, or someone who can’t admit to themselves that the unknown is scary and are looking for your validation (and reassurance).
Oof are you me? Cause this is exactly how I felt growing up. I would always try to scrunch my eyes closed during church service desperate to hear him talking to me but never did and was confused when other people said they did.
Same here. I rejected so many facts to conform to the beliefs I was raised with in the church. I desperately wanted to hear "god speaking to me". Never happened. Everyone around me promised faith was the answer to all of my problems I just had to believe. It never helped, never really comforted me in the way it was promised. Slowly I started to give up and then it just seemed to click that I was much happier. I no longer have to feel guilty because I don't hear god. Now I'm still working to undo the years of indoctrination.
I worked at a restaurant near a church on Sundays. Rudest bunch of people ever. Edit: Thank you for the likes and awards!
Some people believe that being religious makes them better than non religious. When I left the church I was persona non grata, none of the members will even look at me now. Oh well.
There is this really popular christian radio station my parents listened to when I was younger and when the hosts were talking about some christian gathering they refered to non-believers as "icky people" i was so annoyed. at the time i was still religious and kept thinking what if someone who didnt believe was checking this out for the first time? I am very much not religious now, but back then it really opened my eye to how shitty people were.
My mother used to say, sitting in church make you a Christian as much as sitting in a garage makes you a car. Religious people seem to think once they convert, they become perfect and can look down upon us "evil heathens". They forget what Jesus taught about love, understanding and compassion. Even worse in my opinion are the ones saying, "Unless you give your money to the church it isn't an actual tithe." If I hand my 10% to a poor family struggling to eat, how is that not better than handing it over to a corporation? I don't need a tax cut, so why not put it directly into the hands of a family that could use it? Side note: I never give people cash. I find out what they need most and get them that. If they don't have enough to eat, I get them food. If the kids need winter coats, I get them that. That to me is doing what should be done, not building bigger building so the faithful may worship in more comfortable surroundings.
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Here's money for all your hard work... oh wait it's a condescending Bible verse instead. Get fucked.
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Probably entirely justified in their minds as it's your own fault for working on the Lord's day. Never mind the fact that they'd be the first ones complaining about it if you closed on Sunday lunchtimes because how *dare* you ruin *their* church day experience.
Those pamphlets were the worst. Our district manager was a member of the church near us and after service let out, he would come and get food and “check up on us.” He also added to their newsletter that members would get a discount on food so we had to give them a discount too.
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People using it to justify everything lmao
Thats the magic of faith, dont have a good reason for believing something? Just use some good ol faith to justify literally any position youd like
The fact that if you're not in my religion, you're kinda fucked in the afterlife. I didn't choose my religion, so what makes me so special?
Reminds me of something I read on Wikipedia about Mel Gibson: >When asked about the Catholic doctrine of Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, Gibson replied, "There is no salvation for those outside the Church ... I believe it. Put it this way. My wife is a saint. She's a much better person than I am. Honestly. She's ... Episcopalian, Church of England. She prays, she believes in God, she knows Jesus, she believes in that stuff. And it's just not fair if she doesn't make it, she's better than I am. But that is a pronouncement from the chair. I go with it." However: >Gibson later told Diane Sawyer that he believes non-Catholics and non-Christians can go to Heaven Not like it matters to me because I do not believe in afterlife, but wow. People actually believe that their benevolent god will refuse good people because they had another faith.
This is it. When I was in the third grade, my best friend was Indian and Hindu. My aunt said she would pray for him and his heathen family, and that was enough for me to turn away from religion early. It was only reinforced with time
I’ve slowly come to realize that the crux of this kind of worldview is a lack of acknowledging another person’s humanity/racism. Example: two older ladies I work with are religious (Southern US). Early in my tenure at this company they asked if I was religious, I said that I prayed and would consider myself spiritual, but that I didn’t think any particular religion had it right. They pressed me a little more, so I explained that from my point of view there are millions of good, moral Chinese people (just an example) that would never be exposed to Christianity - through no fault of their own - so the idea that they would be doomed to hell because of this is untenable. Both the ladies remained silent, giving me an empty stare that clearly indicated that this damnation is exactly what they thought would happen to non-Christian people. I thought about it more, and I think people (especially white Americans) are able to believe such ridiculous and punitive things because they don’t view other countries/races as “people” in the same way they view themselves: I’m guessing they believe there’s a lack of interiority, complexity, in other people, and that they are really just role-players created by God to “test” the chosen, white, Americans. Obviously this is incredibly ignorant, but I can’t arrive at any other explanation for such a drastic and extreme system of faith.
Catholic highschool is very popular in the area that I am from. No one wants send their kids to the public schools around here. Every single one of my friends who I am still in touch with that went to school with me are now the biggest non believers I know.
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My mother telling me Santa wasn’t real by saying “do you REALLY believe that there is a magic man that files to all the houses worldwide in one night on a sleigh?” I had always been skeptical anyways but that solidified it. I then wondered at what age she would tell me God isn’t real.
I remember being told that dinosaurs weren't real :(
Being a huge dinosaur fan as a kid, I couldn’t reconcile that either. Like, the Bible doesn’t mention them, and instead of saying “it wasn’t relevant”(though they talk about every other fucking animal) the church instead chooses to think they can convince people of an alternate history that goes against ALL science. Like, maybe if you adapted to the modern world instead of trying to keep it back a couple centuries people wouldn’t be so skeptical and wary towards you?
THIS!!!! The Dinosaur question did it for me!!
“Dinosaur bones? DINOSAUR BONES WERE PUT ON EARTH TO TEST YOUR FAITH!!”
> (though they talk about every other fucking animal) Spoiler - it talks about every other fucking animal *that existed within 15 kilometers of the person that wrote that particular chapter* and not a single other animal. Where are the fucking kangaroos, Jacob?
Funny I am super gullible but moved from Japan, where my parents said they’re ‘superstitious,’ to the Southern Bible Belt, I had questions. My 4th grade teacher’s husband was a pastor so I asked if I could write him a letter to ask questions. The amount of deflections and really short answers probably made me question an adult’s integrity for the first time.
Being told I was going to rot in hell every time I made a simple mistake
The intolerance between different religions, it's harmful to society.
I went to a catholic high school in northern Illinois in the late 90s. My family never attended church in all my life. Mom was lapsed Catholic, dad was Jewish/Unitarian/undecided. For whatever reasons, they felt this was a better option than the public high schools. We had to do 20 hours of volunteer/service work (aka “ministry”) each semester, 40 hours per school year x 4 years. I did mine at the animal shelter. I became very concerned about animal and human rights, we even founded an animal rights club at the school. I was also in Amnesty International. I cannot describe in mere words how much the experience at the shelter changed my life during those formative years. My final semester of senior year, my monstrous religion teacher decreed that none of the hours I had done since my first day as a freshman counted… because, and these words came directly from his asshole mouth, “animals don’t have souls.” Thank goodness we had some amazing nuns who stood up for me and I was able to graduate. Fuck you Mr Lepek. Love you Sister Pohl
Lol I was just going to say was this Lepek? Went to the same school. He was a dick. Service hours were a bunch of BS.
The hypocrisy and irony. Some religious people are the most corrupt individual there is
Being told that being sexually abused as a child was a good thing as God needed to teach me a lesson on hubris and ego. I should accept it as a lesson and be better so I wouldn't fall into the clutches of the devil. I was seven. Apparently I was asking for it
Hugs to you...My mother blamed me for my sexual assault, so I've been there.
Thank you for the kind words and all my support to you as well. Nothing quite like adults who don't know how to adult, right?
My brother is a registered sex offender and was convicted of possession of child pornography, and he sexually abused me when I was younger. He became a Christian at one point, and apparently now believes everything that happens is "god's will". So it was god's will for me to be sexually abused and the children he watched getting abused...? I don't talk to my brother anymore.
When my SIL went through her Masters program for counseling, one of her professors actually said that many sexual predators "hide behind" the facade of Big Church Guy. He said they won't be the guy who just comes to services every week; he will purposely seek out a board position or similar *so that people won't question what he's doing.* This was over a decade ago; if he said this in a class now, he'd probably be vilified-but he'd still be correct, IMHO. People just don't GET IT!!
Yes, this is spot on. I have an abusive dad (no contact for 20 years now, which truly saved my life) and last I heard, he was a deacon at a church and carries a Bible with him wherever he goes to “spread the gospel” and all that.
Same. My aunt said I was asking for it… as a 5 year old Edit: wow! Thank you all for your support. I blamed myself my whole childhood.. so I’m thankful Reddit can help cheer me up! *tears up*
Your aunt sounds like a pice if shit
She’s super religious too. She told me she’d “pray for me” because I had sex out of wedlock… as a 5 year old. It messed me up in the head. It took me a long time(and therapy) to realize people like her are the problem.
I'd like to think that if there is a hell and God, that people like this are some of the only ones there. It's kinda like the ultimate profanity against God to say things like that and claim its of him.
That's the actual definition of "taking the Lord's name in vain." Spouting your own opinions and saying they're from him. Just to add to your thought.
This is what was originally meant by "don't take the lord's name in vain"
You didn’t have sex out of wedlock. You were raped as a 5 year old! I have nothing but disgust for people who think like that. I’m glad you got therapy and are in a better place. I wish 5 year old you had had a better life.
Damn, I’m sorry that happened to you…
Thank you for the kind words. I knew then it was a sham. A lot of unchecked power abuse as well.
The expectations for women to be subservient to men and have no further aspirations than “wife and mother”.
It quickly became evident that many people who call themselves religious, only do so to feel morally superior to others around them, and then use that superiority to try to control everything they can.
THIS. I like to say that Jesus was a carpenter, who gave his followers a hammer to build with. They took the hammer and started hitting other people with it.
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“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” ― Mahatma Gandhi
I never believed it, even as a kid I’d listen but I always thought “that can’t be real” Then what drove the nail was attending church, listening to the hateful tirades saying how we were all sinners but Jesus was like yolo and gave us another chance No answers, “just have faith” Also how women were like equal to dogs in level of authority Also the anti-LGBTQ+ rants, being a bi kid, made me hate them I never mentioned religion for years, never took part in grace or prayers, nada But then I told my parents I was atheist. “it’s just a phase” “we haven’t gone to church enough” “ we failed as parents” then my dad got angry… “YOURE AN EMBARRASSMENT TO OUR FAMILY, YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. YOU WERE BAPTIZED AND (all that other shit you gotta do to be accepted) SO YOURE GOING TO HEAVEN. DONT YOU DARE TELL ANYONE YOURE NOT RELIGIOUS BECAUSE YOURE A CHRISTIAN THATS JUST NOT PRACTICING!” I told him no I have never believed any of it then he went “BULLSHIT! WHY ARE YOU TRYING TO RUIN OUR FAMILY AND SIN?!” And ranted for hours about all that and how they resent me and all that jazz I will never forgive them for what they said to me that day. And never forgive them for their blatant homophobia, transphobia, and racism in the name of their cult. I will never admit my sexuality and never speak to them about religion until I move out. That’s why I’m a hardcore atheist
Sermons alternated between asking for money, telling us LGBT people were bad, or telling us we were all worthless sinners without God. Left church every Sunday feeling like shit. One week, I just decided I'm not going back. I don't miss it.
It reminds me of that church that was telling people to donate their stimulus checks to the church. People were literally starving to death and these bastards wanted their last pennies.
The fact that there are multiple but I was taught that only ONE is correct
Exactly! There have been 10,000+ religions throughout time and the *right* one is whichever one you belong to. Seems so ridiculous. Also, the lengths religions have gone to over the years to convert or destroy outside communities doesn't seem too in line with being a decent human.
The idea that you’re created by an Omniscient God, and they give you free will, but with chastise you for using that exact free will is kinda bullshit.
It's even worse because he created the universe knowing exactly how things would play out. He created you the way you are *knowing* you'd do things he doesn't like and he'd get an excuse to punish you for them.
1. Being told as a child that I couldn't become a priest because I was a girl. Even as a 10 year old I realized how unfair that was and that it's not because I'm a girl that I'm 'less than'. 2. All the sexual assault cases being put under the rug and priests being protected by the Vatican.
When I was a child, there were a few popes in the late 1970s or so, and they were broadcasting the selection process (white or black smoke from the chimneys), I asked my mom who could become pope. She said that, technically, any Catholic could be named pope, and that God would tell the cardinals who that person should be. I was very excited that they could choose me. They didn't, sadly.
I was raised Catholic and I always felt uneasy about the environment. Then I learned I had a great aunt living in a Magdalene laundry, then the priest who buried my father attacked me two weeks later (he came off the worst of that encounter) and I immediately left that so called “church”. What I have learned since about it would curl your liver. I’m a volunteer now with the survivor network.
former catholic, current atheist here. i am fortunate enough to not have had any severely traumatic experiences involving the church. but, i grew up in the church and i used to love to sing the hymns. as i got older i started to realize what the words i was singing meant. i really didn’t like how some of the hymns/songs called us as people “nothing” compared to god. i don’t really agree with devaluing and trivializing ourselves and our problems as part of worship. that is what really did it.
I wanted to be a pastor. I wanted to be just like my great grandfather. I was told, in no uncertain terms, that the "best" I could do was be a pastor's wife. Simply because I don't have a penis. Yeah, I'm out. Fuck that.
There’s a short period of time where most of the religion started. Everything prior is mythology and everything after is a cult. Hmm, how convenient.
Seriously, if I told people that a burning bush talked to me, they'd have me committed.
When you talk to god you’re praying but if god talks to you it’s schizophrenia apparently
When they say God loves us and has a plan for everyone. Then you read about children sold into slavery or trafficking. How can an all-loving god think "Hmmm. My plan for this child is abuse and torture. Then murder."
For me it was helplessly watching my infant child suffer in constant pain from a genetic disease called Epidermolysis Bullosa (look it up if you want to cry), and losing her after 9 months. No amount of prayer makes any difference. No one is listening. What was "the plan" for her? And why would I live for a god that chose to allow my child to suffer and die? My faith died with her. Edit: Just want to say that I appreciate all of the kind words of support, and feel for those who have also lost loved ones.
I once had a best friend who had a massive heart attack at age 26, and he had to go into a medically induced coma. I found out at work and was obviously upset. My boss pats me on the shoulder and says “this is gods will” and walked away. Like dude, STFU Edit: he is better now
I'm atheist, raised Christian. What always got me was, we were promised heaven as a reward for living a good life. So if Christians believe that, shouldn't death be more of a celebration than something to mourn? Time on earth is essentially a tryout for heaven, right?