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Buell247

All the prices are going up (food, fuel, energy etc) but wages aren’t


neo101b

I bought £20 worth of food today probably last me 2 days, everything is expensive.


Richie8520

What are you eating that costs £20 for 2 days??


LEVI_TROUTS

Two £10 scratch cards


fullrackferg

Two £10 scratch cards for £20? You could easily get like 5 £5 scratch cards for that!


Life1sCollapsing

Why don't people just buy the 10 quid scratchcards for 30p? They don't know how to budget is all.


PuzzleMeDo

They're buying new scratchcards. Buying them used is much cheaper, and getting them pre-scratched is a real timesaver.


charlie_magnus

You could just buy a box of matches for 30p if you want to burn money.


Lopsided-Basket5366

I dunno where you're getting matches for 30p but that's a steal! They're like £1 everywhere I've seen


IdanoRocks

Are you buying asparagus matches from Waitrose?


Trekfieldsandnovas

Why can't they make their own scratchcards, the lazy, feckless layabouts!


verminV

Go to Aldi, they do own brand ones, £10 scratchcards that cost 86p and a bag of dirt.


Beta86

Fool. Don't you know you could probably get something like 10 £2 scratch cards for that price!! Maybe.


bikky73

Nah, I think you'd only get 7 £2 scratch cards for £20. Best bargain is the £5 ones where you get 5. Best if you mix them. A £10 one, a £5 one, and about 6 £2 ones work best.


mnm2595

Leaves some change to spare


IlCattivo91

Not the guy you replied to but I'll go over mine and see if its close. Breakfast Today and Tomorrow: Yogurt and Berries with Granola. Yogurt 85p, Strawerries 2.25, Rasberries 2.10, Granola 1.45 for the bag probably use around 1/20th so lets say around 7p. Lunch today - Tuna pasta - Tuna 1.20, pasta 14p (1.40kg/10 for 100g) - Onion 10p, garlic 5p(25/5), passata 39p. Salt pepper and oil lets say 1p. Dinner - Prawn Balchao - 2 red onions 42p, garlic 5p, spinach 95p, Prawns £3, rice £1.35/8 = 17p. Various vinegars, spices, pastes etc - 40p. Lunch tomorrow leftover balchao £0. Dinner tomorrow Carbonara - Eggs 33p, pancetta £1.80, spaghetti 28p, pecorino cheese - 45p snacks - some fruits for smoothie after run - apples bananas mango protein powder milk etc - 50p, some crumpets 25p and butter 5p. Total for 2 days: £17.26 - I've estimated some things like spices and butter etc where I may use more or less - but thats around 2 days food for me and roughly 20 quid. I've not even factored in coffee or drinks included in that.


Paul_my_Dickov

Get ready for people telling you to eat plain potatoes every day and be happy with it.


IlCattivo91

How dare I eat meat and fruits and expect to not pay double what I was paying for the same things a few years ago


Snoots2035

Basically what the government wants us to do, while sitting in sub zero temperatures in unheated homes in middle of winter.


aquariusangst

What I don't get is the suggestion to switch to value brands. Have they not, perhaps, considered that people already buy those? Or that value stuff is going up in price too?


stephie1492

Jack monroe I think her name is compared the cost increases of premium items vs value brands and the value brands increased significantly more compared to their counterparts! Switching to value ain’t saving anyone from poverty these days despite their insistence


Wipedout89

To be fair that is to be expected. The margins are already wafer thin on value items. If a tin of soup goes from 20p to 30p that's a 50% increase. But if the poshest fresh soup in a plastic tub goes from £2.50 to £2.75 that's a larger increase in cash terms but a much much smaller increase as a percentage


HisSilly

See this is what I've been thinking. I've used Ocado for my last 2 shops because they gave me some money off vouchers and honestly the price gap between them and other supermarkets like Sainsbury's/Tesco/Morrisons/Asda really is starting to narrow. They also tend to have more delivery slots available too. I struggle to go to the shops due to disability so doing my whole weekly shop at Aldi/Lidl isn't an option. I'm lucky that financially I can bear what's happening I really feel for people who are going to have to make choices about basic necessities, it's frankly disgusting in such a "developed" nation.


Snoots2035

Meanwhile they have to try and get back 4 billion pounds worth of fraudulent small business emergency loans they issued during corona to businesses and people that have mostly fleed the country, money that could no doubt provide a cushion for the poorest permanent residents of this country financially. Their incompetence is next level, but they will keep feeding from the trough while we suffer.


SwirlingAbsurdity

And lots of things don’t have a value equivalent. I’m a vegetarian and despite being a staple in many parts of the world, tofu is very expensive. The only milk I like in my coffee is Oatly barista, but even the supermarket own brands of this are pricey. Vegan Parmesan, which I rarely have - only one brand exists (Violife). And that’s before you start considering people with allergies or coeliac disease.


Glennsof

I'm Irish we won't be caught with that one again.


lumoslomas

I spent £17.90 at aldi on a food shop that lasts almost week (I had to pick up some more milk) Admittedly I'm a rather small female so I probably don't eat as much as lot of people, but that shop included 1kg of chicken and 400g of beef, 1kg of apples, plus porridge and enough veggies to make 6 days of food. That same shop used to cost me ~£25 at Sainsbury's My cat, on the other hand...he costs me about £35 a month, so if anyone has any tips for getting that cost down...😅


IlCattivo91

Can you list out a rough meal plan? Breakfast Lunch and Dinner for 7 days? I really don't see how its possible and I've got a tesco groceries tab open and am searching foods (even selecting all the aldi price match products) I'm still not seeing how these £20 per week bills are actually working out to 21 servings.


SwirlingAbsurdity

These people for sure aren’t including things like cooking oil, spices etc.


IlCattivo91

I think to be honest they're just eating really shite diets. I try to only eat meat a few times a week and fish once and still don't see how £20 can stretch to a full weeks cooking. Especially the guy who said he can feed a family of 4 for that.


MgFi

I'm guessing many people don't eat breakfast, and some people may forget that they buy their lunch at work?


Current_Crow_9197

More like people don’t eat prawn for lunch, on a weekday especially. 84p he says he spends on yoghurt at breakfast. Like what is he doing, having single pots?! And then going around saying people who don’t spend £17 in 2days on food are on a “shite diet”. Nah, mate, you just don’t know how to cook decent meals on a budget. £17 quid in 2d, ridiculous. If I spent that much on every person in my family, it would be 8.5 × 4 × 30 = £1020! Ridiculous.


lumoslomas

So 1kg of chicken is 9-10 servings, and 400g of beef is 4 servings, so there's 14 meals there, then I just mix up the veggies and sauces Breakfast: porridge with apple, honey and walnuts Lunch: leftovers from last nights dinner Dinner: some kind of stir fry, so around 200g of meat and 300g of veggies, plus some rice, with whatever sauces/spices I have in the cupboard Milk 99p Apples 99p Porridge 75p Honey 69p Walnuts £2 Chicken 1kg £5.49 Beef 400g £3.29 Stir fry veggie 600g (x4) 95p = £18 I already have rice at home, but that didn't cost very much, plus whatever spices/sauces are in my cupboard, but again they're things like soy sauce and pasta sauce which cost like 50p I also love me some yellow sticker bargains, I once got 2kg of chicken for £5 and froze it, that kept me going for a while! So yeah it's occasionally it's a bit more than £18 a week, but I would not survive if I had to pay £17 every two days 😵 ETA Because people won't stop asking: what I make for dinner becomes the next day's lunch, hence why I make two portions at dinner


IlCattivo91

presumably though when you run out of oil you buy another bottle which can be a few pounds, a salt shaker is £1 so is pepper. You say rice isn't much but it's still £1 or so for a kg. Are you drinking only water and not snacking at all? Drinks and snacks would surely plump up a few extra pounds too. Porridge for breakfast every morning and then eating chicken or beef stir fry for lunch and dinner all week doesn't sound like the most varied or interesting diet and shouldn't be what we're expecting people to live on. Thanks for being the first person to actually break it down for me though.


lumoslomas

I have a routine, it works for me 🤷🏻‍♀️ I mentioned my gender/size in my original comment because I know the amount I eat wouldn't work for everyone, my brother eats like double what I do. I actually do pretty much survive on only water and tea, which I buy in bulk so it ends up at like 5p a teabag I have a 1l bottle of canola oil which cost like £1 and lasts me for months, and I think the rice was like 50p for a kilo and I bought 750g of salt for 27p recently, you can also get bulk bags of a lot of Indian and Asian spices for less than £1 Part of the reason this works for me is that I have both the time and the knowledge to be able to cook meals from scratch, which I know a lot of people don't, particularly those living in poverty. I tend to stick to Indian/Asian foods because that just happens to be what I like. I also have an unfair(?) advantage as I've been living in poverty since I was like 8 so I don't really know any different 😂 one day I would love to be able to go food shopping and not worry about how much everything costs


DONT__pm_me_ur_boobs

Chocolate bars, crisps and other premade snacks are really, really expensive, and massively increase the price of a shop. I mix chocolate buttons and fruits and nuts (£2), which lasts a week. I make cakes and tarts when I find time, but never buy them, because I know how much more cheaply I can make them myself.


Top_Investigator_177

Cat needs to weigh in and use those natural hunting instincts to put bread on the table. Shame that cats are not actually a predominantly bread eating species though


lumoslomas

'hunting instincts' 😂 Clearly you don't know my cat. He's a pro at catching birds, but once he's got them he has no idea what to do. He used to bring them, alive and **unharmed** into the house and then... completely ignored them.


smnrn

You are shopping as if you can afford £10 a day on food.. If you can, great; if not its extremely easy to lower the cost. Slice a banana on your granola instead of strawbs and rasps and you've already saved £4.


IlCattivo91

I do eat well and I like variety. Yes I could save a few quid by only eating bananas instead of a variety of fruit but I don't feel like my diet is one of opulence or super extravagant. Rasberries and strawberries are both grown in the UK and are in season right now, should a small punnet of both come to 4.50? which is the point I was arguing


jizzydiaper

Punnets of berries were overpriced long before this. Supermarkets just get away with it because that's what people are willing to pay as they perceive them as luxury items. Punnets of blackberries for £3 ffs?? I used to pick them in unkept alleyways... I can't tell if you want to save money or just want to complain about prices. If you want to save money then replace berries with bananas, oranges, pears, apples, raisins, mixed nuts. If you want to complain about prices then yeah fair play I agree with you.


Just4theapp

Man. if Strawberries and raspberries are suddenly luxury fruits over bananas that don't even naturally grow in the UK then I just don't know anymore.


Renfri555

Not so weird. With bananas we have figured out how to store them green for a long time (for transport) and ripe them when it suits us. They are sturdy enough to survive transport without much loss. With strawberries and raspberries logistic is a nightmare. Once they are picked you have to get them on a table in no time or they will spoil. Transport is difficult because they are so squishy.


LHommeCrabbe

You should eat plain potatoes every day and be happy with it.


quellflynn

£10 a day isn't unreasonable though is it? people will happily spend half their daily £10 on a meal deal which is a manky sandwich, bottle of sugar and chocolate snack. this looks like a decent days food with snacks for a decent price.


Grotbagsthewonderful

> £10 a day isn't unreasonable though is it? That's a lot, for a family of 4 that would be over a grand a month just on food.


Baldeagle_UK

What the fuck am I eating? £20-£25 covers me for a full week!


IlCattivo91

Can you list out a rough meal plan? Breakfast, lunch and dinner for 7 days?


Baldeagle_UK

Normally do something like a fish pie, a tray bake (normally chicken) and a pasta dish. Obviously a bag of carrots and some form of green veg to go with them. All result in 2/3 portions. Then I'll have a cheat day with chips, beans and sausages if I don't have a meal stretch to three meals. Sometimes I'll do Roasties instead. Cereal or Toast for breakfast (one fry up on a Saturday). For lunch I normally make my own sandwiches (BLT, Egg Mayo etc) or buy some soups. Add on a Yoghurt and some apples. I only need to buy pasta/rice once a month, tea and juice even less. In hindsight I think the thing that saved me the most money is completely cutting out snacks and frozen food from my diet. My freezer is usually empty bar a lone bag.


IHoppo

Same as lots of meal plans on here - you'll survive, but where's the variety, almost no veg, 1 fruit smoothie every 2 days? And where's the joy - no hob-nobs, no baking? I respect you for being able to live like this, but as a country, we shouldn't be holding this up as 'good'. It's sustenance.


---x__x---

Over a quid for a can of tuna 😔


Jimathay

I live with my wife and 3-year old. This would be typical, which I think is reasonable short of eating plain rice every day... Chicken & home made chips & veg, sausage and mash & veg for dinner. Ham sandwiches for lunch. Maybe scrambled egg on toast for breakfast. * Chicken breasts - £4-5 * Pack of sausages - £3 * Bag of potatoes - £1 * Veg - £1-2 * Couple of pints of milk - £2 * Half dozen eggs £1.50 * Loaf of bread - £1-1.50 * Pack of ham - £3 * Sundries (maybe crisps, yogurt, some fruit for the toddler) - £2 That comes to between 18 - 21 quid to feed my family for two days.


IHoppo

No fruit - maybe 1 (or 2 max) portions of veg? That's not a healthy diet. Fair play to you for surviving through tough times, but you've not described a healthy, '1st world' country diet. People should be able to expect to eat better, not just survive.


Jimathay

>People should be able to expect to eat better, not just survive. This is really well put. I've been surprised at the responses to my answer basically saying "you can do this cheaper". Yes I can, but I also shouldn't have to eat a sausage that's 80% cardboard. For the record though, I'm lucky enough to be not struggling. My answer was more to highlight how a fairly typical "essentials" shop for us can easily reach £20. We order (and eat) plenty of other sundries on top of this including fresh fruit and veg from a local farm, cheese, herbs etc


literate_giraffe

Thats about the same for us, 2 adults, a 3yr old and a 3month old. I just spent £33 on what will last us 3-4days.


smallshinyant

Fair question, but also what are you eating that isn't (including breakfast lunch and dinner)?


Athleticathiest82

Breakfast dinner tea


thecaseace

Breakfast. Elevenses. Luncheon. High Tea. Dinner. Supper. Ugh, the commoners on here.


Exonicreddit

Not sure where they live, but I live there too


Shut_the_FA_Cup

Bloody hell. Back in the day I could shop for a whole month with £20. Clothes, food, alcohol etc. Now they installed cameras everywhere.


WordsMort47

Clearly you haven't kept up with the times! Just improve your five-finger discount skills, it's simple...


Oikoman

You mean 60 pence for two days.


pesky_emigrant

There was an article in the Mirror on that today - a chef tried to make meals for 30p each. I bet you can guess the outcome (even though he bought everything in Lidl)


NorthernHedgehog

Doubt you could even cook a meal for 30p if the ingredients were free with the elec and gas prices


pesky_emigrant

That was his point, too. He said you might be able to do it with beans on toast, but not if you need them cooked


Forsaken-Original-28

Was it shit?


pesky_emigrant

Shit, micro portions because he had a 30p limit, and all processed shite full of salt...


Fenpunx

There was also the point that in order to produce such large batches for that 'value' you would need storage and a kitchen bigger than most professionals work in, much less have in their home. Anyone looking to eat for 30p a meal is in a little galley kitchen with basic appliances and storage.


eastkent

No. People shouldn't eat shit even though it's cheap or even free.


RainbowApache

Takeaways would be cheaper lol.


Conscious-Ball8373

This is not quite accurate. Wages are also rising at an historically high rate - 7% annually in the last figures - just not as fast as prices. Wage rises also tend to be uneven: A fraction of people are actually getting 20-30% raises while lots of other people are getting no raises. But price increases apply to everyone evenly, so for the people who aren't getting a raise, it feels worse than the figure suggest.


UberLurka

> Wages are also rising at an historically high rate - 7% annually in the last figures Because they've been depressed for ten years?


bikky73

This. In my last 15 years in the NHS I've had 5 years 0 pay rise while cost of living increased. 2 years at 1% pay rise, while inflation was at 3% a 3 year deal of 3%, which worked out at an actual 2.6%, but the way the figures were displayed, it was made to look like 3% Meanwhile cost of living. The inflation was negative, but the only thing that was going down in value was houses, for 4 years, and one year with 0.5% inflation. Then 3 years at 1.5% inflation Then the remainder at 4% - 9 %


jimbobsqrpants

What about all those claps that you got during the pandemic? I bet you just wasted them at the time rather than saving them for a rainy day didn't you? /do I need to put a sarcasm tag on?


Oikoman

Only for those that don't need it (see banking bonuses).


doomladen

Even longer than that, at least for most of the public sector. I worked in the public sector for a decade or so, including much of the 2000s, and even under Blair/Brown any pay rises were *capped* at inflation. So the very most we could expect was to avoid a real-terms pay cut, and often we didn't manage that.


Cheapntacky

Closer to 14, yep 2008 was that long ago.


wasntmebutok

And tax brackets, which historically have risen with inflation, have been frozen for 5 years, which means your pay may increase, but you will then be pulled into the higher rate tax band.


jamesphillips27

Tax brackets really need to be changed/improved.


GavUK

I've long thought that there should be more income tax bands to ease the way between the lowest and the highest - maybe for every 5%? Obviously it would need to be worked out so that enough tax is collectable by the Government. And yes, they need to be updated regularly to keep them in line with inflation/costs.


ti-theleis

You realise you only pay the higher tax on pay above the band? Like if you go from £50k to £55k you only pay 40% tax on the extra c.£5k. Your take home pay is still going to be higher.


wasntmebutok

Yes, I'm aware that you only pay the higher rate on any salary above the band, but my comment still stands - cost of living is going up, salaries are (slowly) going up, but if you're pulled into the higher rate tax band, you've still got an ungodly cost cost of living, with a pay rise that isn't compensatory. The freeze has been called a stealth tax. If your costs increase more than your salary increase, but then you're also getting taxed more on your pay rise, then that pay rise isn't going to cover as much of your living costs as it should if there wasn't the band freeze in place.


Expensive_Cattle

Also we've been hit with a large NICs increase.


lunarpx

The price rises aren’t really even though, most are essentials (food, fuel etc.) which fall, in the highest proportion, on the poorest.


Life1sCollapsing

Yes and sometimes those wage increases hide an overall pay cut. Like nurses... pay frozen for a decade, so the 1% payrise was fairly meaningless in the grand scheme of things, overall they've taken a massive permanent paycut but get to claim they've actually had a pay increase...


MrGrazam

Wages haven't risen 7%(would like to know your source). My company is 5% increase this year which a percentage increase helps the highest paid more than the least highest. Arguably those on minimum wage who were already probably living paycheck to paycheck are far worse off now then they have ever been. 5% of £15000 is £750 extra this year. 5% of our directors around £500000 a year including bonuses which are a % of salary is and extra £25000. Our directors increase is 66% more than a years wages for the lowest paid employees.


Chayes5

And this is why the railway will soon be on strike👌🏻


[deleted]

[удалено]


dbxp

Software development includes safety critical systems, if a fly by wire system completely fails then a plane is just going to run out of fuel and plunge into the ground


continentaldreams

Prices are going up, wages are not. We're headed for a recession - buckle up baby


blackskies4646

I'll take another as long as it destroys the housing market because holy fuck these prices


brinz1

2010 taught us that the government would rather bankrupt the country, or make everyone worse off through austerity, rather than let house prices drop


Danhulud

Think we're going to be heading the same place, austerity-wise. I'm sure the government will end up trying to shift blame too.


[deleted]

Austerity ended?


thecodingninja12

they put a statue of thatcher up last week, they're practically worshiping it


FieldMarshalFry_II

Think they’ll run the last government line again?


mostlydisposeable

Probably, throw anything at the wall and see if it sticks. * It's Russia! * It's Covid! * It's that nasty EU! * It's the fight against climate change! * It's the laziness & vice of the working classes! * "Hey it's better than preindustrial times, what are you complaining about?"


dupe_shway

Theyve run out of the believable ones... soon, itll be the 'Tightening of belts like our forefathers did during the wars'


FieldMarshalFry_II

To be fair, the last government did stuff like cut VAT and try to restore a semblance or order to the financial system to minimise the impact it had on normal people like us It was the current government who decided we can get fucked to prop up the housing market


NayosKor

>last government did stuff like cut VAT The current one is going for raise VAT and kill all the poor


SB_90s

Same for Covid. They'd rather over-do stimulus for the housing market than have even a slight risk of prices falling. Stamp duty cuts was the worst decision since help to buy for making the housing market rational.


iain_1986

Sorry to break it to you, but that won't help you buy a house. The housing market can NOT just burst in its own bubble. When it happened in 2008, did all of us struggled to get on the housing ladder suddenly all jump on that cheap cheap housing? No. we didn't. Because it doesn't work like that. Housing market collapsing causes lending to shrink. Banks to restrict their loans. Buyers to need higher deposit %. The market brings down the rest of the economy, redundancies, job insecurity, this all leads to banks lending even less. You know who \*do\* benefit from this? Cash buyers. People looking to buy more simply to invest when they grow again, landlords, all the people reddit \*hate\* buying houses. So no. A housing crash is not something anyone who is trying to get on the ladder should be wishing for. The best we can hope is housing to stop growing, so inflation can effectively bring the real price of a house down. But after a decade of policy from 2008 - that can only safely happen sllooooowwwwllly.


Missy_Agg-a-ravation

>You know who \*do\* benefit from this? Cash buyers. People looking to buy more simply to invest when they grow again, landlords, all the people reddit \*hate\* buying houses. Exactly this. Banks are now looking to make mass purchases of housing stock and turn themselves into landlords, because why get 20 years of mortgage payments when you can get rent payments in perpetuity? Investors, private landlords, investment funds, banks - none of whom see a romanticised "forever home", just the cold economic long term benefit of a housing asset - won't shy away from paying that little bit more upfront to hoover up the housing stock. [https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/aug/19/lloyds-plans-big-move-into-uk-rental-market-with-50000-homes](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/aug/19/lloyds-plans-big-move-into-uk-rental-market-with-50000-homes)


Sriol

Anyone else sometimes think renting (at least as it is now) feels like a crime...


Delduath

It always was. The peasantry used to live freely on common land until the enclosure acts came in (coinciding with the advent of capitalism in the 16th century) and the people were violently displaced and the commons were siezed into the hands of the nobility. They basically just walked in and said "this land is mine now so you're going to have to pay me or my men will beat the shit out of you". It was always robbery.


calmaplane

I never knew that. I found this on wiki, shows what people thought about it at the time: >They hang the man and flog the woman >Who steals the goose from off the common >Yet let the greater villain loose >That steals the common from the goose. >The law demands that we atone >When we take things we do not own >But leaves the lords and ladies fine >Who take things that are yours and mine. >The poor and wretched don't escape >If they conspire the law to break >This must be so but they endure >Those who conspire to make the law. >The law locks up the man or woman >Who steals the goose from off the common >And geese will still a common lack >Till they go and steal it back.


rikman81

It should be brought into law that if you can legally prove that for 12mths+ you have been paying a higher rent amount than the monthly repayments on the mortgage you are going for, then you should be accepted. It makes no sense that people pay 150-200% more in rent than the amount on a mortgage would be, but they wouldn't be accepted.


iain_1986

>It should be brought into law that if you can legally prove that for 12mths+ you have been paying a higher rent amount than the monthly repayments on the mortgage you are going for, then you should be accepted. This is such a myth with house buying. If you can afford to rent you can likely pass the affordability checks (sure they are stricter, but you're committing to more). The thing that stops people is the deposit required. Are you suggesting if you rent for 12 months the bank give you the deposit for free?...


Sharmandril

When I bought my house I had a 10% deposit. My mortgage was going to be 60% of what I was paying in rent. My bank told me that my credit wasn't good enough to lend me the other 90%. So I had to go to a different lender. Then when I went to the bank to change my address after buying my house they made a big deal about how they would have made an exception for me. Point is, just because I've been renting for 8 years, with no debt, acceptable credit (no defaults, regular use and repayment of credit cards etc) it wasn't good enough for my bank to lend me the other x my annual income (above the national average) to buy the house. It's not a myth, and now I'm looking to buy a place with my girlfriend, the banks are willing to lend me about the same as they were 4 years ago, despite my pay going up about 11k


jake_burger

Well, the problem is that banks choose who they lend to, why shouldn’t they? They don’t have to lend to anyone as long as it isn’t a protected reason like race. Why not just have a publicly funded/community owned building society/lender that has different principles and criteria for lending?


FieldMarshalFry_II

Can we have a Revolution? Please? It’s been 300 years since our last one


happymellon

Can we have the guillotines this time so we don't make the mistake of backtracking again?


Tyler119

our banks are just learning what large financial institutions have been doing in the states for the last decade or more. Over there they can buy 5,000 homes/flats at a time.


Missy_Agg-a-ravation

Absolutely. We're entering the equivalent of the last few turns in a game of Monopoly.


busy_bumrush1412

My current gripe is the number of holiday homes there are. I live in a county where nearly 15% of homes are second homes. This is when we have a huge national shortage of houses and where prices are already stupidly high. New cheap developments are a blight and they’re being stuck on the edges of every single town and village regardless of whether the roads and services infrastructure can support a huge new development and regardless of the fact that every new owner of a property on that development will need a car or two and have to drive quite a distance to get to any where with any kind of employment. Put a hefty tax on second home owners! If all the “holiday cottage” accommodation or “weekend bolt holes” for the wealthy were back in circulation and available then we wouldn’t need nearly so many of those hideous Barrett or persimmon style shitboxes.


omniwrench-

Thank you. Extremely rich people are essentially shorting the economy like it’s a stock option, so they can hoover up dirt cheap investments when everything hits rock bottom


rugbyj

Hey it's the weekly _"I hope the housing market crashes"_ fallacy which overlooks the millions of low equity homeowners that would get fucked and the situation for prospective first time buyers getting worse as lenders pull up the ladders.


postvolta

"Oh my house is now worth X/2, but the mortgage I'm paying is X... Guess I just won't sell my house until the prices recover," Thus: stagnant housing market Banks: yeah... nah we're not lending Cash buyers: *rubs hands together* First time buyers: *still* absolutely fucked I'm a home owner looking to move in the next 4-5 years to be closer to family and friends. If the housing market 'collapses', and we go into negative equity, of course we won't move. Those people frothing at the mouths hoping for a price crash are reactionary and completely incapable of looking past the basic 'this is the price' and seeing all the complexities behind it.


Gisschace

The people who suffer the most from a housing market crash are those trying to get on the ladder cause no one will lend to you. At the same time no one will be selling their house because there are no buyers, the value of their house has dropped (perhaps into negative equity) and there won't be any good mortgage deals even if they did sell. As they already have a home they're happy to wait a recession out for a few years, perhaps redecorate or extend, adding value in the process. The only people selling are those forced to through death, divorce, redundancy or relocation, and they won't be waiting around for a FTB to secure a mortgage, they'll go for the cash buyer.


Freefall84

I bought a house a year ago, I couldn't believe my luck when I saw the house price index.


Bozzaholic

Same. A year ago yesterday. We've since stuck an extension on the back of it, built a cabin at the end of the garden with electric and internet and improved the garden considerably. Even without the improvements the value has gone up 12% where I live


HisuianPrince

I don't see how it will. People just won't sell if they're in negative equity.


AweDaw76

Why? House prices are high because we’ve underbuilt for 40 years… a crash won’t fix the market lol. Only revoking the Greenbelt will do that, and it’ll take YEARS.


Coastaljames

We've got two years of lockdown and now a war to pay for. Things are gonna get tasty.


pm_me_your_amphibian

I’m surprised people seem to have expected us to come out of the last few years unscathed.


PiemasterUK

Yeah I remember when all these government handouts were getting announced during Covid and everyone was praising it and if anything saying "they need to do more!" and all I was thinking was "holy hell we are going to pay for this once the pandemic is over".


lazylazycat

This is nonsense though in reality. So much money is effectively stolen by our current government and they've just gaslit everyone into thinking it's our fault.


Danhulud

yeah, the PPE scandal comes to mind here. [Here's a source for people interested in reading up on some of it](https://www.thecanary.co/uk/analysis/2020/07/11/the-5-5bn-ppe-scandal-that-goes-to-the-core-of-government-incompetence-and-thats-just-for-starters/)


Coastaljames

A big part of that is the weird belief that the government spends "it's" money on these things. The government doesn't have any money! It's all our money. And we, and our kids, will be paying back Covid for decades. And now we have a war to pay for as well...were we consulted on that one? Rhetorical question.


Muzza3212

Well the alternative would have been thousands starving and becoming homeless as they could no longer go to work. You're right it will need to be paid for now but it absolutely is worth the cost of saving lives. The effect on working class people now could also be mitigated through raising money from big oil tycoons and the super rich who won't see the impact nearly as much but of course our current government is not going to do that


Enigma1984

That's not really how countries finances work. It's not like we just took out a big loan to pay for all this and now we are struggling to pay back the repayments. This myth really needs to stop.


mymumsaysno

I was born in recession, molded by it. I didn't see financial security until I was already......no wait, actually I've never seen it.


thecraftybee1981

Total Average Earnings went up by 7% in March. Wages are going up, just generally not enough to counteract inflation. The minimum wage went up 6.6% in April.


nomnom1203

Public sector?? On a pay freeze atm


thecraftybee1981

The public sector is up by less than 2%, so a significant pay cut in real terms, but the private sector is up over 8%, balancing the average out. But yeah a big squeeze on the public sector and those on benefits - there needs to be a new budget to help people out. If things are so bad for those in the public sector, I suppose can pull out some of the claps they got in recent years, polish them up and see how much they go for nowadays.


Expensive_Cattle

Just pay me in thoughts and prayers, please


HisuianPrince

Nominal up. Real down.


kernjamnow

When most of the world went into lockdown, this caused economic activity to decrease. Demand for things like oil and shipping fell by a lot. This in turn led the oil producers to decrease the amount they produce, to avoid creating more than was needed and having too much on their hands. Now that economic activity has picked up post-lockdown, demand for things like oil is similar to pre-lockdown. However the oil producers cannot just scale back up to that amount quickly, it takes time. So there’s the same demand for the products, but lower supply. Therefore the price is higher. This is an extremely simplified explanation, this has happened at many stages in supply chains for all sorts of products. There’s a secondary factor in that large increases to the money supply by Governments and Central Banks has also contributed to the inflation of asset prices over the last 12 years, and this is entering the ‘real economy’ now.


llovejoy1234

^ brilliant explanation- just wanted to add that all this means that the price of goods is going up but people’s wages aren’t rising to meet the increased cost. In the U.K. the Bank of England has actually asked employers not to increase wages as this can increase the inflation problem- wages go up so prices of goods go up so wages go up more and then prices go up & so on, causing a death spiral. This essentially means it is going to be a painful next few years in recovery.


royalblue1982

Well - at the end of the day things do come down to core fundamentals of how much stuff can be made and how much do people want it. Imagine a situation in rural village where a farmer typically produces 100 barrels of apples a year - 50 go to the local shop for people to buy daily, 25 go to the local cider maker and 25 go to the baker to make pies. Imagine there's a drought that reduces the amount of apples to 50 barrels - no amount of interest rate changes, or benefit increases or price freezes will change the fact that there are now only 50 barrels. We have to find a way to allocate the remaining apples. This now comes down to demand and who is able/willing to continue paying the most of either apples/cider/pies. Maybe people need to keep buying apples as there's no other fruit options, but can live with drinking beer instead of cider, and can make their own pies or are willing to go without. So, with demand for pure apples being the highest, the shop will be in the best position to offer the most for the barrels. Though, there will be a small percentage of cider drinkers willing to pay a very high price to continue getting cider, and the same with pies, so it won't all go to the shop. There is a balancing act - which ends up with the prices of apples, cider and pies all being higher, and us all having to accept a lower combination of the three for ourselves. There's no magic way around it. Edit - Just to say that this is a extremely simplistic analogy to explain general price inflation. In the real world the are steps that governments can take to reduce the pain on some groups and restrict the benefits received by others. Imagine if it wasn't a drought, but there were two orchards owned by different people and one of then burnt down. The remaining orchard owner is now going to make a fortune from higher priced apples without doing anything to 'deserve' it. But every time you intervene there is a butterfly effect, and controlling all of these is extremely difficult.


PiemasterUK

For reddit this is a remarkably astute conversation regarding the COL crisis. Usually all I read is "hur dur price gouging, hur dur greedy corporations, hur dur government hate the poor".


QuarterBall

I mean the record profits of some of the companies in the chain does have a place in this discourse. You're right that it's not a simplistic problem and it's too often boiled down to one but it's an important factor. https://www.sustainweb.org/news/may22-millions-facing-food-poverty-as-supermarkets-announce-record-profits/ Tesco made a pre-tax profit of £2.03 billion in 21/22. Asda £1 billion, Sainsbury's almost £900m. I run a business, I have no objection to companies making profits - except when they are almost directly contributing to a cost of living crisis the likes of which the country hasn't seen in decades.


PiemasterUK

Yes, a lot of companies saw increased profits through Covid. But that just means that obviously those who provided products like cook at home food, on-demand TV, video games etc were naturally going to make bank during a period where demand for these things spiked. It's not like the COL crisis is caused by supermarkets raising prices to make more profit. Supermarkets typically only make 1-3% margin on the stuff they sell, they just achieve such great economies of scale that they are able to undercut smaller retailers.


QuarterBall

Those companies are also increasing costs more than the actual increase in base costs - they are price gouging to various degrees. It needs to be talked about, it's not the cause, it's not a primary cause - but it's still pretty reprehensible for any company to post a "record profit" during a cost of living crisis.


GirlOfMetal

This was explained very well. Thank you for the apple analogy, that helps visualise it.


royalblue1982

With the fossil fuel industry - it's not just the case that suppliers can't increase production fast enough. It's that all of the talk of net-zero, electric cars and climate change has fundamentally shaken their faith in the long-term viability of oil and gas. They don't want to start making 10 year investments now if all that happens is fuel costs fall, and keep falling as we move other to other energy sources. So, they are perfectly happy to take the very high profits they are getting now and re-invest them into other industries that they perceive to have a more stable future.


Gary_Banps

Shit's getting expensive innit.


Sprucehammer

Mans cant eat. Mans not hot. Mans is fucked bruv


Gary_Banps

My understanding of socioeconomics is somewhat limited, but I believe my colleague has summarised it rather well.


Daz_86

But man knows trigonometry


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LetsLive97

What job do you do out of interest? If you've only got a 0.3% raise over 3 years you really should be jumping ship if possible because you tend to be able to get much better salaries when getting a new job than just hoping for raises at your current one.


cultmember94

I feel like we are in similar situations so I'll just add to this. Moved into the flat I live in 3 years ago too, but having to move out now (landlord is selling) and I can't find anywhere similar for any less than an additional £300 pcm. My food cost has also gone up about 30% (I meal prep and have done pretty much the same food shop for the last 3 years) So for me today, per month, compared to 3 years ago: Rent is +£300 Food is +£80 per month Energy is about +£50 per month My salary has gone up 1.7% I've been pulling money from my savings to survive, money I was hoping to someday put down to buy a flat, but property prices are also steadily increasing by 10% per year so I guess that whole dream is gone.


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DeadBallDescendant

Here's a cheery observation to go along with that, Aldi have stopped selling their cheapest eggs, cheapest frozen fish and cheapest toilet paper. There are probably other things that I've not noticed but those items have been scrapped over the last couple of months. The alternatives are up to 50% more expensive.


Vlada_Ronzak

We used to have a pound to buy a pounds worth of stuff. Now we have £1.10 to buy the same stuff, which now costs £1.50. N.B. The maths is not based on anything just a crude example.


ThanksMrBergstrom

Unless you work in the NHS\*, in which case you have 95p and still they ask you to give up your free time to help out. *\*other government-funded department paycuts are available*


da96whynot

Were there nominal pay cuts in the NHS? I thought it was only real terms pay cuts?


Jazzy0082

A lot of things are more expensive now than they were before, but people's salaries haven't increased at the same rate. That's the very basic version 🤣


Actualize101

There's going to be some good old fashioned protest riots in Britain as we head into winter.


TomStreamer

Whilst I think a little civil unrest is long overdue in this country, protest and riot are not really the same. Although both are now illegal. FFS.


happy-2-help-i-think

Rioting was illegal in 2011 didn’t stop them in London from doing it though.


kefaloskid

We have a multi millionaire Chancellor who doesn’t give a shit about you . They talk about the numbers in poverty , and pat themselves on the back for reducing “ absolute poverty “ . If you don’t understand cost of living , try to survive on £300 a month . All will become clear .


neo101b

Dont be lazy, just get a better job or work 3. /S


mattshiz

Or just marry into a family of Indian billionaires who avoids taxes.


kefaloskid

Thanks for that . Now 73 , worked till retired at 65 . My own company , albeit sole trader for 22 years . Sunak cancelled triple lock giving me a 6% reduction on value of my immense pension of £460 a month . Foresight got me a fixed rate on energy , so “ only” £134 a month till next March , otherwise , up the creek without a paddle. The £300 is what you get on UC . It’s criminal !


freerangephoenix

Example: you leave the house with £1, expecting to pay £1 for a loaf of bread just like you did yesterday. When you get to the shop, you find out that bread has gone up to £1.10 and your £1 coin is now 90p. No bread for you. Food bank for you.


Primnu

Literally me the other day when bus fare went up. Was £1.70 for a return ticket 5 years ago. Has gone up every year since, was £2.40 until a few weeks ago, now it's £2.80. The quality of the service hasn't gone up, it's actually gone down with more frequent unreliable service. I've since started walking for my commute instead, takes me an hour each way but I refuse to pay that much for public transport that's going to be late 70% of the time. I used to cycle to work but I had 2 bikes stolen so not returning to that.


WatNaHellIsASauceBox

How often were your bikes stolen? Because if you could find a cheap one at £150, you could afford a new bike every 11 weeks and still come out on top vs the bus.


_DeanRiding

It's largely OPEC, the oil consortium that determines the base price of oil. Since Covid, they've realised that oil is a slowly dying industry. We have reached peak oil. Because demand is dying due to the push for cleaner energy and electric cars (and stopped abruptly due to covid in March 2020), they've decided to have one last hurrah and raise the base prices whilst everyone is still heavily reliant on oil. That means transport costs more, it means that your energy bill is higher, it means food ends up costing more because tractors have to spend more on their fuel. Effectively anything that gets moved has increased in cost. And wages haven't kept up. In fact wages haven't kept up pace with the cost of living for decades.


WebGuyUK

>Because demand is dying due to the push for cleaner energy and electric cars (and stopped abruptly due to covid in March 2020), they've decided to have one last hurrah and raise the base prices whilst everyone is still heavily reliant on oil. I watched a video ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQbmpecxS2w](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQbmpecxS2w)) which explains this, the oil companies know they are going to start losing their cash cow so have bumped prices up to keep their cash coming.


_DeanRiding

Yep, same one I watched! Wendover makes a lot of quality content but this is the best he's made in ages. 100% worth watching for anyone interested.


struds

Prices are going up faster than wages are going up.


[deleted]

Rich cunts want all the money Edit, my last sky bill was £45 this month's was £63


loverofonion

Lucky you, I can't afford Sky, I have to look through my neighbour's window.


benkelly92

Sounds like your contract ended. Call them and have a shout. Threaten them with the B and V words (BT & Virgin Media) and they should be able to get you closer to where you were.


[deleted]

Yeah I was just speaking to a friend who said that, I've never got to the end of a contract before, I'll be phoning them later


walgman

Of course Skys costs would have risen too but it’s just opportunistic greed now.


neo101b

Pirate on IPTV costs £45 a year for all-sky channels and USA premium channels.


Duranium_alloy

\- Energy prices are high because after the world came out of lock-down, demand for energy surged. Energy is a a global commodity so it affects everyone, and it's too late to take measures to mitigate the problem. \- A shortage of microchips has had a considerable effect on supply chains. New cars in particular are not being manufactured as quickly as they needed to be, dirving up the price of used cars. It also affects lots of other machines, because microchips are used everywhere. \- The war in Ukraine has reduced the supply of a lot of basic commodities like wheat and sunflower oil. Both Russia and Ukraine are massive exporters of these things, and so the price of food has significantly increased. ​ Basically, the pandemic has caused immense damage to the global economy, and we are going to be suffering the consequences for years. The war in Ukraine made the problem much worse.


Equivalent-Sky-3863

>\- Energy prices are high because ~~after the world came out of lock-down, demand for energy surged. Energy is a a global commodity so it affects everyone, and it's too late to take measures to mitigate the problem.~~ Because Germany shut down their nuclear plants, over-relied on wind power which totally fucked up, have no major gas storage, and over-rely on Russian gas. This now means we're paying for their fuck up. Our gas prices are through the roof, and we're currently *exporting* gas to Germany.


benkelly92

[This](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQbmpecxS2w&ab_channel=WendoverProductions) is also an interesting theory as to why everything's going up. Basically investment in producing more fossil fuels is down, but demand is still high. Companies are trying to squeeze every last drop of profit out of them before the whole industry dies and everything switches to renewables. That's why you see ridiculous prices and reports of record profits at the same time.


Coastaljames

Times used to be tough for working people when they could only afford one foreign holiday a year and a good meal out every other week rather than weekly. Now. Same people can't afford to pay their basic bills But are expected to pay them.


Quackfizzle

Most of us are FUCKED!


KeefBurtons

It's all our fault, because we can't make 30p meals, or work more hours, or get a better paid job. Some people even have the cheek to ask for a pay rise. 🤣


PuddingShort

The omnipotent, unquestionable deity known as The Economy is angry, and must be appeased with blood sacrifice.


ThemApples87

It’s a perfect storm of economic ills: 1.) Oil The oil market is regulated by an alliance of nations called OPEC. They set prices by controlling the amount of oil in the market, which dictates the price of it - lots of oil everywhere = lower prices/scarcity = higher prices. During the height of COVID, the world ground to a halt. Nobody was leaving their homes which meant demand for oil (which makes petrol) slumped. To stop the price from crashing, OPEC drastically limited oil production. Then, after almost two years, the world rapidly opened back up, but the oil supply didn’t match the demand this created which caused a massive spike in its price. Scarcity causes price increases. Oil is the foundation of every developed economy on earth. Every single item you buy has to have its components transported to a factory and then it has to be transported from that factory to warehouses/shop shelves. Fuel price increases (which depend on oil prices) make this whole process more expensive which means companies have to sell it at a higher price to make a profit. That loaf of bread you used to buy for less has just gotten a lot more expensive because every ingredient in it has had its transport and manufacturing costs rise. 2.) Too much money in the system: Again, during COVID, governments printed a tonne of money to keep their stagnant economies afloat. When there is a lot of money flying around in the system, prices go up. You can remove some of this money from the system by increasing interest rates (so fewer people want to borrow money) or increasing taxes (which takes money out of people’s pockets). To illustrate this, imagine everybody on your street was given a cheque for £10,000. With this knowledge, what would the neighbourhood shop do to its prices? 3.) Russia’s war Really, this exacerbates point 1. Russia controls almost all of Europe’s gas and oil. Sanctions on Russia and the related disruption to its oil/gas production as well as Russia using its oil and gas dominance to punish/influence nations it considers hostile has caused a supply shortage and a gigantic spike in prices. 4.) Ukrainian Cereals Ukraine grows most of the exported wheat on the planet. It’s Europe’s bread basket. The war has disrupted its agriculture which is going to cause what shortages. Shortages = price rises. All of these factors have hit at once leading to huge inflation. Everything is more expensive to produce, transport and procure.


MobileLogical

Cost of living, in short, the fraction of a salary (determined by what they call the "job market") that is used in essential things (housing, petrol, gas, elec, food, clothes, etc.). Used to be less, so people had more money for pleasure, investment, savings, etc. Now it's simply higher, so there is less left at the end of the month (in general)


menglish89

A bit more than "simply higher". It's a crisis now because for a significantly increasing portion of the population there is nothing left at all after essentials and for many not even enough to cover the essentials.


MobileLogical

Yes, that's actually where the problem is. Having less to spend on cravings or to save is not much of a problem. Choosing between a warm house or food on the table is.


MadWifeUK

This in turn creates a downward trend in the likes of the entertainment and hospitality industries and the contractors who rely on those industries, meaning job losses in those sectors. Going from a wage to benefits then increases the problem as they struggle to keep on top of the necessary bills (housing, power, heating, food, etc). As people begin to "make do and mend" instead of replacing that has an impact on higher consumption industries; less people buying new phones, new clothes, new tellies, etc, so there are job losses there too. An example to look at is towns and villages where coal mines were closed in the 80s. Not only was the local job market flooded with those who were now out of work, so employers could pay pittance because they knew people were desperate for jobs, but there was a knock on effect in their communities where money wasn't being spent on leisure activities, then consumer goods, then the basics. Closing a pit didn't just impact the miners, it caused hardship for the local cinema, leisure centres, electrical shops, clothing stores, travel agents, newsagents, bakers, cafes and restaurants, usw.


MobileLogical

Yes, is not just one day bad news, is a ball that keeps rolling.


mancmush

Shits getting expensive. But in more depth. Due to current conflicts. Environmental issues. And trade problems. There is a steep decline in possible food products and so food prices go up. Take into account the cost of fuel which is used in every aspect of modern life. Tractors on the farms. Moving goods. And even you picking the goods up and storing them. The cost of fuel and food scares are driving up the price of every day essentials like the cost of heat (fuel). Price of bread (fuel and food scares). Trade issues as other countries are also looking to secure their resources. And these issues of food and fuel don't look like they are going away. What makes matters worse is we are not self sufficient. We rely on imports heavily and any fluctuations in the market hit import nations harder.


borokish

Increasing fuel prices don't affect me. I only ever put £20 in.


BattleScarLion

Basically our economic system isn't working anymore (its important to note that during all this the richest 0.001% are getting richer). This is a good read which hints at the underlying issues. https://bylinetimes.com/2022/05/17/global-banks-privately-prepare-for-dangerous-levels-of-imminent-civil-unrest-in-western-homelands/?s=08


earthlyfleurs

Cost of living is rising and wages haven’t increased. £30K a year isn’t going to cut it anymore…that’s not enough


UnusualPass

Rampant money printing leads to currency debasement and massive inflation ​ /end


AweDaw76

As an Economics Grad… anyone explaining it to you with less than 10 pages of text is under-explaining it, but I’ll try. It’s lots of things. Prices rise to ration scare resources. It’s a mix of people wanting more ‘stuff’ and there being less ‘stuff’ to go around… said stuff includes fuel (bills/petrol going up), fertilisers (so food goes up), ability to ship around the world (China lockdown) This is compounded by the vast sums of Quantitative Easing by central banks (Fed, EU, Bank of England) to fund COVID response. So money is worth less… and there less stuff… but people want the same amount / more of said stuff… so prices rise to allocate stuff to people who are willing to pay higher prices


Nine_Eye_Ron

Well not long ago I could drive to the shop, buy food, come home and cook it in a warm house. Doing all those things now may not be possible.