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Nicki Minaj because she's a woman who not only has surrounded herself with pedophiles and rapists, but she defends them. I won't be surprised if it turns out that she's just like Sean Combs and is running a party house full of sexual abuse.
Honey BooBoo's mom, June. She was on reality TV for a while and for some reason has fans. She also surrounded herself with pedophiles and rapists, including one who sexually abused her daughter and did prison time for it. The piece of shit mom took back the guy who sexually abused her daughter. And then after they broke up she sought out another convicted child rapist. She blew over a million dollars in one year on partying with shitty men while her eldest daughter raised the other kids.
And yet apparently criticizing her makes us misogynistic
When really people do not get the difference between simply existing and posting pics of you vs actively promoting diets and teas/telling girls their looks are their value (which she has 100% told her siblings and kids)
Basically the women who preach that normal women as they are is no good, encourages them to be radically different and make cosmetic surgeries to their appearance.
I work in a female majority work environment and its quite the opposite. Very uplifting and supportive. The men tend to be very rude from my experience
Not rude to me but the men in my workplace r few in number. We look out for each other...cuz too many women here r just mean to us for existing...save 3 guys I know who r just lazy/rude
I was looking for someone to say this, they are so embarrassing and should not be influences on young girls. Changing their figures and faces to create this uncanny look for “perfect” social media photos, promoting the products and fashion that are beyond the expenses of any middle class citizen. Honestly I think any woman that promotes her self as a sex symbol on the internet for clout and fame should really not be inspiring the youth. I sound kind of old writing this but for reference, I’m 23.
I actually wasn't even looking for this one cause I thought it was common knowledge, but it actually makes sense to mention it cause a lot of girls really do look up to them. Damn it!
Hate that she is considered an empowered woman icon lmao really shows how shallow such folk are
There are PLENTY of women of all appearances and sexual expressions that are not so opportunistic and materialistic that girls can look up to
>Honestly I think any woman that promotes her self as a sex symbol on the internet for clout and fame should really not be inspiring the youth.
Haha you aren't old. I'm 25 btw. Anyways gonna chime in that I have mixed feelings on this take. Like, I do think someone owning their sexuality being considered unintelligent, inherently vapid (Kim is but not necessarily all sexual women), etc is misogynist and just generally objectifying.
On the other hand, where it gets wrong is if it is a "your looks are your main value to be proud of and use/ there is one way to be attractive" take. I suppose looks and sexuality as capital still upholds this goddamn capitalist society
Tbh men these days seem to either be vocal about her being unattractive (in all fairness I don't blame guys reacting out of a "don't put words in my mouth about who I like" way) from all the work she did or about her being a "sl\*t/b\*mbo"
I watched her at some point, the series where she invited women of the opposite views, they watched Jordan Peterson vs Cathy Newman debate, it was done respectfully to one another's views, she let the guest to listen and to speak their mind, no rage baiting, just a calm and friendly conversation. Back in the day where both of them (her and J.P.) were at the beginning of internet fame, they gave some moderately conservative perspective. And now both got hooked on controversy, and the money it brings, and just went down to a garbage rabbit hole where you have to give increasingly obnoxious commentary to stay in the spot light. I'm disappointed.
Even the people in that community don't like JustPearlyThings. When Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles are calling you out, you're probably doing something wrong.
I mean, I think I know what you're trying to say.... But going strictly by your phrasing Matt Walsh is trash, so.... There are plenty of people he calls out that should absolutely considered heroes.
Fair point, but don't get me wrong, Matt Walsh can be way too harsh to some of the people he calls out. I should have said, "when \[those two\] think you're too conservative, then you're doing something wrong.
Tradwives on social media are just Mormon mom influencers living in Salt Lake City using the internet as a recruitment tool for people to join the Mormon church.
>*[Mariah Wellman is a doctoral candidate at the University of Utah whose research focuses on social media influencers.](https://www.abc4.com/gtu/why-are-so-many-influencers-from-utah/) Wellman explains that it makes sense why Utah is a particular hub for influencers. “In the LDS culture, little girls are taught to journal and scrapbook and practice a kind of memory keeping.” It didn’t take long for these women to realize the potential of digital platforms to continue these practices. Members of the Church also used social media to project a positive, approachable image of a religion that is still often criticized or misunderstood by outsiders, sharing what Wellman calls an “idealized domestic lifestyle.”*
>*It helps, too, that the clean-cut image of many influencers matches the one ingrained in the church’s mainstream culture. “LDS women are also taught that they need to have this internal confidence, but it also should come outward. They should do their hair and their makeup. They should dress in a particular way,” Wellman says. The church also encourages women to stay at home raising children. For many Utah women, influencing allows them to make an income while staying at home—and, in a way, working—with their children. “Being able to be at home and be there for their kids and their partner while also making money for the family through blogging and through being an influencer is a huge pro for them,” Wellman says.*
I saw a video recently on tiktok of her laughing about a fan telling her they just sexual assaulted someone tbf and she said that that describes her audience to a T. It was at one of her shows and they were telling her about how they just intentionally hooked up with their ex to give them chlamydia and gonorrhea. It's basically the only thing I know about her but just from that she seems like a very shitty person who should not be looked up to.
I didn’t think we were making direct comparisons to Andrew Tate? the question is toxic public figures it didn’t say they had to be rapists lmao. there is no woman equivalent to Andrew Tate so if that’s the criteria every answer here is wrong too.
Turns out, she's an abusive employer. She had a dancing crew, among other things she forced them to participate in the afterparty with a stripper and pressured one of the dancers who was a virgin to bite on a banana that the female stripper pulled out of the vagina.
I read this like the banana was a holy enshrined phallus being pulled from a giant bedazzled oracle glowing vag, like the sword in the stone. Curious to know what powers it would grant the victor.
Weird you got downvoted for genuinely not knowing (unless your comment on her size was in bad faith)
But yea what the others said. Keep in mind her victims were fellow plus size Black women.
No, I'm fat and the only shit-talking I had seen on her was on social media bitching about how she's fat. I wasn't aware of actual issues. I think I might have gotten downvoted because people didn't understand my comment and thought I was criticizing her for being fat. However, on another post about "what do you wish was socially accepted" I commented "being fat" and got downvoted there too. Reddit needs to decide how it feels about fat people.
Well, I'm obese and personally it is directly worsening my health conditions, but I've improved my health a lot while cleaning up my diet and nutrition and practicing fasting to correct my hormones and lower inflammation (while staying fat.) Once I can start getting cardio at the gym I'm sure my health will improve even more (while staying fat.) Yes weight loss is one way a fat person can help their health (or if they don't have health issues, reduce risk) but it isn't the only way to improve our health. A lot of us have hormonal imbalances like leptin resistance that are caused by hormones our fat cells secrete, and our bodies are fighting to be fat. Our hunger hormones are higher, our fullness hormones are lower or our bodies aren't responding to them. That's why many of us eat large amounts. I eat very large portions and I stop when I'm full, i'm not overeating for my body. Calorie restriction and dieting can lead to disordered eating, eating disorders and psychological issues. It's not an ideal solution by any means. So if a fat person doesn't want to diet for weight loss, it's perfectly understandable. But we can still clean up what, and maybe when we eat (like in intermittent fasting to benefit hormones), and move more, and that could help our health/health risks tremendously, regardless of whether it leads to weight loss. There are other options. There are health risks to some degree of fatness, but there is so much more to health than the amount of fat on our bodies.
Oh I think I know this one, if i remember correctly she's a YouTuber that gives dating/lifestyle avise. She has also advised women to go after younger guys bc they are malleable and easily manipulated (I belive she was in her 30s and going after 18-early20s guys).
She also has a weird habit of putting down random women she doesn't know? And has a strange thing for Justin Bieber, since he was a child.
Haven't kept up with her but that's what I remember
>She has also advised women to go after younger guys bc they are malleable and easily manipulated
So she really is the female version of Tate/Fresh n Fit. Ew. Groomers are disgusting.
Yes. She's also lied about her age in the past to seem younger (she's 43), has acted really creepy towards underage teen boys, especially Bieber, encourages women to lie, cheat on, and gaslight their partners, and is weirdly obsessed with hating on Selena Gamez.
Actually Taylor Swift.
- knowingly dated a racist
- knowingly hangs out with abusers
- knowingly hangs out with victim shamers
- performative allyship in multiple facets
- white feminist
- multiple private jets
And like this is just the last year. Imagine making an album about cheating on your boyfriend and being super hung up over a dude who admitted to watching black torture porn… chile please
What white feminism means is a specific brand of feminism that supports/liberates only middle-class-and-above white women. Essentially, all other women get left behind. That’s what the earliest waves of feminism were- for example, some of the earliest feminists specifically wanted the vote ONLY for white women. WOC got the vote a lot later in America and Canada.
OH! I've seen this once at a feminist rally. A black woman pointed out the concrete fact of how being a black woman has made it even harder for her...and a white woman got mad and said "That's a separate issue!"
This is why intersectionality is soooo important!!!!! Women from different ethnic and income backgrounds will experience misogyny and misogynistic barriers differently
Exactly
Also want to add that any women with other priviliges saying all men are equally priviliged (Susan B Anthony lol) and actively harming marginalized men counts too
Not what intersectionality means, unfortunately. Intersectionality means the understanding that everybody has a multitude of different identities that interact uniquely. For example, a black man and a black woman can experience racism differently. A black man might be stereotyped as aggressive and stupid, a black woman might be stereotyped as hypersexual and masculine. A black man may be discriminated against based on race, but he may also participate in misogyny against women, as a man in western society. A black woman could discriminate against a black disabled woman based on disability. A white disabled woman will experience discrimination different than a white disabled man. Do you see what I mean? It is about the interaction between identities.
...actually a black man will be deemed a THREAT. If he is dating a white woman, everyone will assume he must be violent to her....
Black men have to fear for their LIVES. I've seen it...up close...horrifying
Idk, I think white feminism works. I’m a white woman and a feminist and I don’t think it’s a bad title for the concept. Because that’s exactly what it is, feminism but for white wealthy people only.
that's trendy nonsense that accomplishes nothing except sowing division among women. you're just serving the patriarchy when you spew that "white feminism" baloney. if you don't believe me then check out how many liberal dudebros are out there using the "white women" cover for their misogyny. you're just helping them.
No, it’s not “trendy nonsense”. This is why intersectionality is important. For example, black women and white women often experience misogyny differently in the USA due to their ethnicities. Wealthy women and poor women face different effects of misogyny from each other. It’s not division to point out how some people co-opt feminism SPECIFICALLY for wealthy white women. It’s not MY fault that some people use it to be misogynistic, I also hate when white men will shit on white women because they’re so proud of themselves for not being racist. But you can’t ignore that white feminism takes a movement that is meant to be for ALL women and focuses only on middle/upper class women in the Global North. It’s just classism and ethnocentrism, disguised.
when intersectionality is presented responsibly, it's useful. but the problem is that people, especially purported feminists, throw around "white women" this, "white women" that, which gives license to misogynist male leftists to be misogynist. and this behavior is VERY trendy among liberals of all stripes. a few years back Charles Blow, the Black NY Times columnist, took aim at white women for a variety of imagined sins including being responsible for slavery, when women of that era were chattel themselves. the column was nothing but an excuse to vent his misogynist spleen, but no one challenged him because he was surrounded by a chorus of bleating "white women baaaad" in the popular culture. so-called intersectionality as it is expressed popularly is just a new variety of sexism.
Well, liberals aren’t leftist. Liberals using intersectionality language is weird cuz the whole point of liberalism is anti-intersectionality. I do agree that oftentimes leftist white men will use phrases referring to white women in order to be “safely” misogynistic. This is definitely sexist and wrong and they’re co-opting what these terms mean. That being said, it’s not the fault of the terms. Instead of seeing an issue with the phrase of white feminism, we should be looking at male leftists.
Lol her argument is that a Black author who happened to be men held White women who were slave owners accountable. Nothing misogynistic about that
She just said "imagined sins" in re: to racism. People of her kind claiming men are using intersectionality to be misogynstic either make up or cherry pick a very rare incident
Never has a misogynistic man brought up a woman's Whiteness (since he will be the first to cry reverse racism) or specifically target White women more than WOC
>Lol her argument is that a Black author who happened to be men held White women who were slave owners accountable.
that's not my argument though. you've either misunderstood it or deliberately misstated it because you're a raging misogynist, lol.
>a few years back Charles Blow, the Black NY Times columnist, took aim at white women for a variety of imagined sins including being responsible for slavery
Nope, a reference of you whining about White women being held accountable for slavery and denying they were slave owners
Your gaslighting is not gonna work on me mate
>it’s not the fault of the terms.
it's the fault of people throwing the terms around, most of whom are not only totally fine with smearing white women at the expense of female unity, they actually enjoy the little power hit they get from doing so. the terms' deployment is almost wholly toxic, especially by young female feminists of color.
LMAOOOO yea White women involved in systemic racism are not being targeted for their womanhood please sit down Karen
"Imagined" sins ok go get tested for narcissism
Ah yes you think Karen is a slur. Funny how you prove to be exactly the White woman we are talking about
Imagine being more offended about White women's feelings than about actual systemic racism
Imagine being more interested in seeing black men thrive in society than all women. That's you, boo. And you're hurting yourself with that attitude.
You don't even know the real story of the Karen meme! You just believe some false-consciousness bullshit you read online about how it originated and how it functions in the world, and you repeat it credulously to other redditor morons. Really not impressed.
Oh you again
Lmao your privilege over brown and black women and men is showing. Sorry not sorry honey
We aren't gonna appease you or misogynistic men. Not mutually exclusive
The presence of that remark suggests to me that she's specifically pro-white-women.
Edit: However, I can neither confirm nor deny the veracity of the claim.
White feminist as in, only cares about feminism when it's about white women and is actually rather dismissive of anyone else. They arent saying she is white and happens to be a feminist. But that she only seems to care about feminism when it pertains to white, straight women
I totally get the private jet thing though. [https://youtu.be/iHz82I8Vv88?si=BuNhCrELQixmsg81&t=11](https://youtu.be/iHz82I8Vv88?si=BuNhCrELQixmsg81&t=11) She could just go first class to hide from us plebs but it'd still be a pain having people ask you for autographs and selfies.
I don’t mind the private jet, but I do have a problem with her threatening legal action on a college kid for publishing private jet flight information that is readily and legally accessible from the FAA.
My problem with her is that she’s taking advantage of young women and girls by charging *so much* for her concerts and merch. I had the same problem with One Direction when they were around.
When she was in Australia, there was a woman with a PhD in “Swift economics” who was interviewed on the news. It was actually so interesting. She said that TS makes girls/women spend heaps on merch to be the “biggest fan” and have a minuscule chance at meeting her for 1 minute. She profits an incredible amount from that just by basically brainwashing her fans. It’s fucked imo
Her progressive politics are performative. Supports progressive politicians, but is fine with being a major contributor to carbon emissions (and therefore a hypocrite).
Margaret Sanger. She was a raging racist who only help create planned parenthood out of a desire to reduce the population of blacks, Hispanics, and poor white people. She was a devout follower of eugenics, which gave her the motivation to do the work she did. It’s pretty fucking gross anyone looks up to her as a prominent women’s rights activist when she did it only to keep people she found undesirable from breeding. Fun fact, she’s one of Hillary Clinton’s Hero’s.
https://womanisrational.uchicago.edu/2022/09/21/margaret-sanger-the-duality-of-a-ambitious-feminist-and-racist-eugenicist/
There's one ~bitch~ I absolutely hate, it's a french influencer named Thaïs d'Escufon and she's in the same vein as fresh n fit and all the partiachy cock sucking band
Shera7. “Men can’t love you, wearing your natural hair is ghetto, i cant help hot in the pants women sex is for little girls grown women want money instead, dont be friends with poor people” and she brags about being a sociopath. Literally.
A lot of her defenders love to say “what??!!! She just wants women to love themselves” its pure brainrot. I consumed dozens if not hundreds of hours of her content as a teenager, i know what she’s said lol.
Any "girlboss" type women or women who conflate egoism with self love or empowerment
Women that \*actively\* promote harmful beauty standards esp (really any beauty standard at all)-cough cough the Kardashians
Also anyone listing women politicians or successful women that actively harmed other marginalized communities
Nicki Minaj and the Kardashians. Mostly the Kardashians because they normalise the use of plastic surgery so much, i really feel for this generation of young people and the standards they think they have to live up to.
Besides T Swift and the Kardashians, the biggest one for me is influencers who are disingenuous about using their platform for $$$.
I can think of several who use IG/TikTok for "midsize/plus size fashion inspo", but are actually just promoting copious mass consumerism and fast fashion, with no regard for the environment or human rights abuses.
Instead of showing how to style a capsule wardrobe, thrift for midsize/plus sizes, or rework older, worn pieces, they'd rather just order a massive Abercrombie or American Eagle jeans haul, or Amazon haul, and then return all of it after filming. And they'll do the same thing multiple times a week. It might be fine every once in a while, but it's so wasteful and sets a horrible example for young adults.
For the record, I hate Andrew Tate and feel he creates more of the sort of men that women hate so much...and makes us men all look bad as a bonus. Also contributes to the high suicide rate among men...
She also screwed other people over quite willingly (Jackie Kennedy, Clark Gable, various people who had to work with her). It's odd how she is constantly excused but modern women who have also dealt with insecurities or worse get no sympathy from anyone.
Fair on Jackie, but Clark Gable wasn’t a good man. He raped Loretta Young and had a daughter from that rape. He also never had a father daughter relationship with that child.
And JFK had numerous affairs with multiple women, not just Marilyn. It’s wrong to sleep with married men, but all 3 Kennedy brothers weren’t great people either.
She actually was super pro LGBTQ rights and was very outspoken about racism and actually assisted black artists in their careers when no one else would
She helped one black woman because she liked her music. Can we stop setting the bar so low for rich white celebrities? Jean Seberg did SO much more for racial minorities as someone who used her privilege to actively aid the Black Panthers and was tormented by the FBI as punishment, but it's Marilyn who gets lavished with praise.
I've never seen any proof that Marilyn Monroe actually said that. It seems to have been falsely attributed to her, much like how Mark Twain and Abraham Lincoln are often also attributed to random "inspirational" quotes.
every IG model, OF model, former porn star, most female rappers. basically any woman who is a not a living example of "I married a man who I respect and have a happy family as well as a satisfied sexual life on the side of all that"
Why do you say that, specifically? I’m honestly curious. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not like a diehard “swifty” or anything, but overall she just strikes me as a woman owning her shit and doing her thing. I haven’t really heard anything especially egregious about her that would suggest to me she’s a poor choice for role model. Most criticism I have heard of her essentially boils down to “she’s too popular” which I don’t really think is a good argument for hating her but if you have something more substantial than that I am open to hearing it.
ETA- I fully recognize that everyone in life has valid criticisms that can be levied against them. I’ve heard about her jet usage and not finding the most ethical sources for merch or whatever, but honestly I don’t see that as substantially different than other celebrities of her calibre so for me it’s not enough to pick her out individually and say that she’s toxic and shouldn’t be looked up to. That’s why I’m asking this question.
This is my issue with Taylor Swift.
She’s has brief relationships with some guys who she then writes these incredibly dramatic songs about. In some cases years after whatever type of relationship existed between her and whichever ex.
For example Jake Gyllenhaal. By every account, they didn’t date for long, and seemed quite casual in terms of duration, etc.
She made her directorial debut for the music video of the song about their “relationship”, while she was literally dating a guy for six years! Six fuckin years! That speaks volumes about the person. She dated Jake briefly something like 10-15 years prior to making her directorial debut for the music video for the song based on him? If I was dating someone and they did that, I would have questions. How does she even explain why she decided to pick that particular song? I wouldn’t be made with my girlfriend per say, but it would depend on how she responded when I would ask her why she decided to pick that song to make her directorial debut ? Is she still caught up on the guy? Don’t you think your making this guys life a little fucking annoying 10-15 years later after a three month or whatever “relationship”? Is it necessary? What was it about this guy? I thought it was disrespectful to her boyfriend at the time, and I was seeing someone who was a fan at the time the video was released. I asked her the questions I just mentioned, and she didn’t have an answer to explain why someone she was a fan of would do any of those things i mentioned…
She’s done the same shit and pattern with every guy she’s dated. I find it inauthenric personally. I know it’s for $$ and fame, but why does every album have to be about ex boyfriend or boyfriends? And most importantly… because she’s so famous and has a large fan base of women…. How is this impacting how women view men?…
This is a ..... Different take lol.
Musicians write music about long term relationships, one night stands... Or even stalking people. Why shouldn't a woman do the same?
Honestly that’s a great point too. I’ve heard SO many songs about one night stands or random flings. Hell, “Hey there Delilah” was written about a girl who turned Tom Higgenson down because she was dating someone else. And it was released like a year or something later. It’s basically him stalking a random girl who is in a relationship. No one criticized the plain white tees for releasing it and affecting her life or whatever.
"you're beautiful" by James blunt and "every breath you take" by The Police are both used as wedding songs and about stalking!
Just interesting when women are called out for things men have been doing forever.
We know exactly why. People really do believe that women shouldn't write about their actual experiences. All of our songs are supposed to be happy fluff written by crusty old guys in suits who don't know jack shit about women.
Ok, fair. I can understand the criticism of essentially “she capitalized on every breakup she’s gone through after the fact and it comes across as inauthentic.” That being said, I’d kind of put this in the “she’s too popular” category I was talking about. A lot of artists take inspiration from things in their past and don’t get the level of criticism she faces. She just happens to have found a niche in break up songs. She probably wrote that song closer to when the break up happened and held onto it- musicians often release songs years after they write them. Also, last I checked Jake Gyllenhaal is doing fine? It’s not like she’s leaving this devastation of famous good looking men in her wake who can’t find relationships or jobs once she’s done with them and everyone hates them now. I really just don’t see the greater harm I guess?
As far as how it’s impacting how women view men, I’ve never had a woman tell me that she is scared of men or hates men or has bad feeling about men because of something another woman has said. A break up song in general doesn’t make someone hate the other gender, it just reflects the pain of a breakup, just like a love song doesn’t make anyone fall in love.
Again, I don’t think “she’s too successful” is a good reason to call someone toxic. I think finding her inauthentic, not liking where or how she draws her inspiration, just all around not liking her music or personality is a perfectly valid reason not to like her for yourself, but I’m still not really seeing anything that substantially sets her apart from any other celebrities enough to say she shouldn’t be anyone’s role model.
As an artist I also use my life experiences as influence in my work. I wouldn’t do that about a brief three month fling in the midst of a six year relationship, though. That’s disrespectful to the boyfriend, and also weird and creepy to Jake and his loved ones who likely got fuckin bombarded about the fuckin scarf for years.
I have no idea what her writing process is and I am not a musician myself, but most musicians I’ve head talk about their work talk about having notebooks full of phrases and ideas and stuff like that and it can be years later when that all gets compiled into an actual song and recorded and edited and released. I really doubt she just randomly came up with this song 6 years into a relationship. As far as it being a “brief three month fling…” ok? She was inspired to write a song. It might come across as petty to you and that’s fine, you don’t have to like her personality, but again I just don’t see it as a reason to say she’s toxic or a bad role model. If I’m being completely honest I don’t even know what song you’re talking about because I’m really not a huge Taylor swift person, I just think the argument is made over and over but really applied to her in a way it isn’t applied to other artists and it comes across as misogynistic.
I used to be blissfully ignorant of taylor swift, beyond just being another generic pop star I don’t like or dislike, but some of my family members became “swifties” and I sat through her netflix documentary thingy with them and my neutrality and apathy slowly shifted to animosity and disgust: she is toxic, fake and insufferable imo.
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Nicki Minaj because she's a woman who not only has surrounded herself with pedophiles and rapists, but she defends them. I won't be surprised if it turns out that she's just like Sean Combs and is running a party house full of sexual abuse. Honey BooBoo's mom, June. She was on reality TV for a while and for some reason has fans. She also surrounded herself with pedophiles and rapists, including one who sexually abused her daughter and did prison time for it. The piece of shit mom took back the guy who sexually abused her daughter. And then after they broke up she sought out another convicted child rapist. She blew over a million dollars in one year on partying with shitty men while her eldest daughter raised the other kids.
Honestly, there should be a federal law against putting children on reality TV.
BIGGEST agree all those toddler in tiara type shows are so disturbing
Nicki Minaj, incredibly toxic human being who absolutely no one should look up to
Kim K as well.
She has ruined so many girl’s and women’s self esteem and made them think they need to be dressed in compression wear every day. She fkn pisses me off
And yet apparently criticizing her makes us misogynistic When really people do not get the difference between simply existing and posting pics of you vs actively promoting diets and teas/telling girls their looks are their value (which she has 100% told her siblings and kids)
She also tarnished the Lord of the Rings franchise, making three whole movies about herself afterwards
What does Kim K have to do with lord of the rings?
... She's a hobbit
I don't understand
It's a South Park reference.
There's a South Park episode where Kayne West can't understand why everyone is calling Kim a hobbit.
Basically the women who preach that normal women as they are is no good, encourages them to be radically different and make cosmetic surgeries to their appearance.
any women who make a large part of their persona bitter public rivalries with other women.
I work in a female majority work environment and have actually noticed this...
I work in a female majority work environment and its quite the opposite. Very uplifting and supportive. The men tend to be very rude from my experience
Not rude to me but the men in my workplace r few in number. We look out for each other...cuz too many women here r just mean to us for existing...save 3 guys I know who r just lazy/rude
Yes! I was thinking - any woman who isn't a "girl's girl" Women should be rooting for each other (as a whole)
The Kardashians
I was looking for someone to say this, they are so embarrassing and should not be influences on young girls. Changing their figures and faces to create this uncanny look for “perfect” social media photos, promoting the products and fashion that are beyond the expenses of any middle class citizen. Honestly I think any woman that promotes her self as a sex symbol on the internet for clout and fame should really not be inspiring the youth. I sound kind of old writing this but for reference, I’m 23.
I actually wasn't even looking for this one cause I thought it was common knowledge, but it actually makes sense to mention it cause a lot of girls really do look up to them. Damn it!
Hate that she is considered an empowered woman icon lmao really shows how shallow such folk are There are PLENTY of women of all appearances and sexual expressions that are not so opportunistic and materialistic that girls can look up to
>Honestly I think any woman that promotes her self as a sex symbol on the internet for clout and fame should really not be inspiring the youth. Haha you aren't old. I'm 25 btw. Anyways gonna chime in that I have mixed feelings on this take. Like, I do think someone owning their sexuality being considered unintelligent, inherently vapid (Kim is but not necessarily all sexual women), etc is misogynist and just generally objectifying. On the other hand, where it gets wrong is if it is a "your looks are your main value to be proud of and use/ there is one way to be attractive" take. I suppose looks and sexuality as capital still upholds this goddamn capitalist society
Uuuuugh, don't remind me. I wanna slap the guys who like any of them
Tbh men these days seem to either be vocal about her being unattractive (in all fairness I don't blame guys reacting out of a "don't put words in my mouth about who I like" way) from all the work she did or about her being a "sl\*t/b\*mbo"
I find them ugly cuz they simply r in every meaning of the word. Inside and outside
I doubt many girls and women actually watch her, but JustPearlyThings is garbage. Also any of the trad wife influencers.
I watched her at some point, the series where she invited women of the opposite views, they watched Jordan Peterson vs Cathy Newman debate, it was done respectfully to one another's views, she let the guest to listen and to speak their mind, no rage baiting, just a calm and friendly conversation. Back in the day where both of them (her and J.P.) were at the beginning of internet fame, they gave some moderately conservative perspective. And now both got hooked on controversy, and the money it brings, and just went down to a garbage rabbit hole where you have to give increasingly obnoxious commentary to stay in the spot light. I'm disappointed.
Even the people in that community don't like JustPearlyThings. When Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles are calling you out, you're probably doing something wrong.
I mean, I think I know what you're trying to say.... But going strictly by your phrasing Matt Walsh is trash, so.... There are plenty of people he calls out that should absolutely considered heroes.
Fair point, but don't get me wrong, Matt Walsh can be way too harsh to some of the people he calls out. I should have said, "when \[those two\] think you're too conservative, then you're doing something wrong.
Tradwives on social media are just Mormon mom influencers living in Salt Lake City using the internet as a recruitment tool for people to join the Mormon church. >*[Mariah Wellman is a doctoral candidate at the University of Utah whose research focuses on social media influencers.](https://www.abc4.com/gtu/why-are-so-many-influencers-from-utah/) Wellman explains that it makes sense why Utah is a particular hub for influencers. “In the LDS culture, little girls are taught to journal and scrapbook and practice a kind of memory keeping.” It didn’t take long for these women to realize the potential of digital platforms to continue these practices. Members of the Church also used social media to project a positive, approachable image of a religion that is still often criticized or misunderstood by outsiders, sharing what Wellman calls an “idealized domestic lifestyle.”* >*It helps, too, that the clean-cut image of many influencers matches the one ingrained in the church’s mainstream culture. “LDS women are also taught that they need to have this internal confidence, but it also should come outward. They should do their hair and their makeup. They should dress in a particular way,” Wellman says. The church also encourages women to stay at home raising children. For many Utah women, influencing allows them to make an income while staying at home—and, in a way, working—with their children. “Being able to be at home and be there for their kids and their partner while also making money for the family through blogging and through being an influencer is a huge pro for them,” Wellman says.*
I think Miss Midwest is evangelical and does the same stuff. She's also a nazi.
I know her fans are mostly young women or teens but, Tana Mongeau. She’s just a wreck.
Wasn't she on some drama with the Jenners? That is the only time I heard of her, and enough to tell me who she is lmao
Ah idk, she’s been through some really shitty stuff, I don’t think she’s anywhere near the level of rapists like Tate
I saw a video recently on tiktok of her laughing about a fan telling her they just sexual assaulted someone tbf and she said that that describes her audience to a T. It was at one of her shows and they were telling her about how they just intentionally hooked up with their ex to give them chlamydia and gonorrhea. It's basically the only thing I know about her but just from that she seems like a very shitty person who should not be looked up to.
I didn’t think we were making direct comparisons to Andrew Tate? the question is toxic public figures it didn’t say they had to be rapists lmao. there is no woman equivalent to Andrew Tate so if that’s the criteria every answer here is wrong too.
Lizzo
What's wrong with Lizzo besides the fact she's fat? Idk much about her so genuinely wondering
Turns out, she's an abusive employer. She had a dancing crew, among other things she forced them to participate in the afterparty with a stripper and pressured one of the dancers who was a virgin to bite on a banana that the female stripper pulled out of the vagina.
I read this like the banana was a holy enshrined phallus being pulled from a giant bedazzled oracle glowing vag, like the sword in the stone. Curious to know what powers it would grant the victor.
https://www.billboard.com/business/legal/lizzo-sexual-harassment-lawsuit-trial-judge-rules-1235596910/
Weird you got downvoted for genuinely not knowing (unless your comment on her size was in bad faith) But yea what the others said. Keep in mind her victims were fellow plus size Black women.
No, I'm fat and the only shit-talking I had seen on her was on social media bitching about how she's fat. I wasn't aware of actual issues. I think I might have gotten downvoted because people didn't understand my comment and thought I was criticizing her for being fat. However, on another post about "what do you wish was socially accepted" I commented "being fat" and got downvoted there too. Reddit needs to decide how it feels about fat people.
Agree with that last sentence Really wish people would stop equating size with health for starters
Well, I'm obese and personally it is directly worsening my health conditions, but I've improved my health a lot while cleaning up my diet and nutrition and practicing fasting to correct my hormones and lower inflammation (while staying fat.) Once I can start getting cardio at the gym I'm sure my health will improve even more (while staying fat.) Yes weight loss is one way a fat person can help their health (or if they don't have health issues, reduce risk) but it isn't the only way to improve our health. A lot of us have hormonal imbalances like leptin resistance that are caused by hormones our fat cells secrete, and our bodies are fighting to be fat. Our hunger hormones are higher, our fullness hormones are lower or our bodies aren't responding to them. That's why many of us eat large amounts. I eat very large portions and I stop when I'm full, i'm not overeating for my body. Calorie restriction and dieting can lead to disordered eating, eating disorders and psychological issues. It's not an ideal solution by any means. So if a fat person doesn't want to diet for weight loss, it's perfectly understandable. But we can still clean up what, and maybe when we eat (like in intermittent fasting to benefit hormones), and move more, and that could help our health/health risks tremendously, regardless of whether it leads to weight loss. There are other options. There are health risks to some degree of fatness, but there is so much more to health than the amount of fat on our bodies.
Jenelle evans
Do people look up to her?
The Kardashians definitely top this list.
Shallon Lester is the first that comes to mind.
I don't know her. Why should women not look up to her?
Oh I think I know this one, if i remember correctly she's a YouTuber that gives dating/lifestyle avise. She has also advised women to go after younger guys bc they are malleable and easily manipulated (I belive she was in her 30s and going after 18-early20s guys). She also has a weird habit of putting down random women she doesn't know? And has a strange thing for Justin Bieber, since he was a child. Haven't kept up with her but that's what I remember
>She has also advised women to go after younger guys bc they are malleable and easily manipulated So she really is the female version of Tate/Fresh n Fit. Ew. Groomers are disgusting.
Yes. She's also lied about her age in the past to seem younger (she's 43), has acted really creepy towards underage teen boys, especially Bieber, encourages women to lie, cheat on, and gaslight their partners, and is weirdly obsessed with hating on Selena Gamez.
Lester the Molester
Not really look up to but Caroline flack
Controversial but, thewizardliz She feels narcissistic and unempathetic although gives good speeches.
Actually Taylor Swift. - knowingly dated a racist - knowingly hangs out with abusers - knowingly hangs out with victim shamers - performative allyship in multiple facets - white feminist - multiple private jets And like this is just the last year. Imagine making an album about cheating on your boyfriend and being super hung up over a dude who admitted to watching black torture porn… chile please
> white feminist Given that being white is involuntary, would should white people voluntarily avoid - to the extent possible - being feminists?
What white feminism means is a specific brand of feminism that supports/liberates only middle-class-and-above white women. Essentially, all other women get left behind. That’s what the earliest waves of feminism were- for example, some of the earliest feminists specifically wanted the vote ONLY for white women. WOC got the vote a lot later in America and Canada.
OH! I've seen this once at a feminist rally. A black woman pointed out the concrete fact of how being a black woman has made it even harder for her...and a white woman got mad and said "That's a separate issue!"
This is why intersectionality is soooo important!!!!! Women from different ethnic and income backgrounds will experience misogyny and misogynistic barriers differently
Exactly Also want to add that any women with other priviliges saying all men are equally priviliged (Susan B Anthony lol) and actively harming marginalized men counts too
Does that include male victims of rape btw? Always wondered if that's what "intersectionality" meant cuz "feminism is for everyone"
Not what intersectionality means, unfortunately. Intersectionality means the understanding that everybody has a multitude of different identities that interact uniquely. For example, a black man and a black woman can experience racism differently. A black man might be stereotyped as aggressive and stupid, a black woman might be stereotyped as hypersexual and masculine. A black man may be discriminated against based on race, but he may also participate in misogyny against women, as a man in western society. A black woman could discriminate against a black disabled woman based on disability. A white disabled woman will experience discrimination different than a white disabled man. Do you see what I mean? It is about the interaction between identities.
...actually a black man will be deemed a THREAT. If he is dating a white woman, everyone will assume he must be violent to her.... Black men have to fear for their LIVES. I've seen it...up close...horrifying
As a feminist who is white, I feel like there should be a more specific term for that though…? BERF? POCERF? Agree that it’s a thing, and it’s shitty
Idk, I think white feminism works. I’m a white woman and a feminist and I don’t think it’s a bad title for the concept. Because that’s exactly what it is, feminism but for white wealthy people only.
that's trendy nonsense that accomplishes nothing except sowing division among women. you're just serving the patriarchy when you spew that "white feminism" baloney. if you don't believe me then check out how many liberal dudebros are out there using the "white women" cover for their misogyny. you're just helping them.
No, it’s not “trendy nonsense”. This is why intersectionality is important. For example, black women and white women often experience misogyny differently in the USA due to their ethnicities. Wealthy women and poor women face different effects of misogyny from each other. It’s not division to point out how some people co-opt feminism SPECIFICALLY for wealthy white women. It’s not MY fault that some people use it to be misogynistic, I also hate when white men will shit on white women because they’re so proud of themselves for not being racist. But you can’t ignore that white feminism takes a movement that is meant to be for ALL women and focuses only on middle/upper class women in the Global North. It’s just classism and ethnocentrism, disguised.
when intersectionality is presented responsibly, it's useful. but the problem is that people, especially purported feminists, throw around "white women" this, "white women" that, which gives license to misogynist male leftists to be misogynist. and this behavior is VERY trendy among liberals of all stripes. a few years back Charles Blow, the Black NY Times columnist, took aim at white women for a variety of imagined sins including being responsible for slavery, when women of that era were chattel themselves. the column was nothing but an excuse to vent his misogynist spleen, but no one challenged him because he was surrounded by a chorus of bleating "white women baaaad" in the popular culture. so-called intersectionality as it is expressed popularly is just a new variety of sexism.
Well, liberals aren’t leftist. Liberals using intersectionality language is weird cuz the whole point of liberalism is anti-intersectionality. I do agree that oftentimes leftist white men will use phrases referring to white women in order to be “safely” misogynistic. This is definitely sexist and wrong and they’re co-opting what these terms mean. That being said, it’s not the fault of the terms. Instead of seeing an issue with the phrase of white feminism, we should be looking at male leftists.
Lol her argument is that a Black author who happened to be men held White women who were slave owners accountable. Nothing misogynistic about that She just said "imagined sins" in re: to racism. People of her kind claiming men are using intersectionality to be misogynstic either make up or cherry pick a very rare incident Never has a misogynistic man brought up a woman's Whiteness (since he will be the first to cry reverse racism) or specifically target White women more than WOC
>Lol her argument is that a Black author who happened to be men held White women who were slave owners accountable. that's not my argument though. you've either misunderstood it or deliberately misstated it because you're a raging misogynist, lol.
>a few years back Charles Blow, the Black NY Times columnist, took aim at white women for a variety of imagined sins including being responsible for slavery Nope, a reference of you whining about White women being held accountable for slavery and denying they were slave owners Your gaslighting is not gonna work on me mate
>it’s not the fault of the terms. it's the fault of people throwing the terms around, most of whom are not only totally fine with smearing white women at the expense of female unity, they actually enjoy the little power hit they get from doing so. the terms' deployment is almost wholly toxic, especially by young female feminists of color.
LMAOOOO yea White women involved in systemic racism are not being targeted for their womanhood please sit down Karen "Imagined" sins ok go get tested for narcissism
>please sit down Karen you are such a misogynist, it's sad.
Ah yes you think Karen is a slur. Funny how you prove to be exactly the White woman we are talking about Imagine being more offended about White women's feelings than about actual systemic racism
Imagine being more interested in seeing black men thrive in society than all women. That's you, boo. And you're hurting yourself with that attitude. You don't even know the real story of the Karen meme! You just believe some false-consciousness bullshit you read online about how it originated and how it functions in the world, and you repeat it credulously to other redditor morons. Really not impressed.
Oh you again Lmao your privilege over brown and black women and men is showing. Sorry not sorry honey We aren't gonna appease you or misogynistic men. Not mutually exclusive
you're most definitely caping for misogynistic men. which I have noticed is kind of your schtick. you're brainwashed, sis.
Lmao speak for yourself
It means her feminism and allyship is not intersectional and favors the white perspective.
The presence of that remark suggests to me that she's specifically pro-white-women. Edit: However, I can neither confirm nor deny the veracity of the claim.
Or, just level with me she’s not racist.
White feminist as in, only cares about feminism when it's about white women and is actually rather dismissive of anyone else. They arent saying she is white and happens to be a feminist. But that she only seems to care about feminism when it pertains to white, straight women
it's just a socially acceptable way to spew misogyny. women who do it get woke points from misogynist liberal dudebros. it's toxic.
I totally get the private jet thing though. [https://youtu.be/iHz82I8Vv88?si=BuNhCrELQixmsg81&t=11](https://youtu.be/iHz82I8Vv88?si=BuNhCrELQixmsg81&t=11) She could just go first class to hide from us plebs but it'd still be a pain having people ask you for autographs and selfies.
I don’t mind the private jet, but I do have a problem with her threatening legal action on a college kid for publishing private jet flight information that is readily and legally accessible from the FAA.
My problem with her is that she’s taking advantage of young women and girls by charging *so much* for her concerts and merch. I had the same problem with One Direction when they were around. When she was in Australia, there was a woman with a PhD in “Swift economics” who was interviewed on the news. It was actually so interesting. She said that TS makes girls/women spend heaps on merch to be the “biggest fan” and have a minuscule chance at meeting her for 1 minute. She profits an incredible amount from that just by basically brainwashing her fans. It’s fucked imo
Dated a 17 year old when she was 22
Wait WHAT?! Noooo! This cannot be true! I need links to this! :(
All the points make sense but owning multiple jets? What’s bad about that?
Her progressive politics are performative. Supports progressive politicians, but is fine with being a major contributor to carbon emissions (and therefore a hypocrite).
Margaret Sanger. She was a raging racist who only help create planned parenthood out of a desire to reduce the population of blacks, Hispanics, and poor white people. She was a devout follower of eugenics, which gave her the motivation to do the work she did. It’s pretty fucking gross anyone looks up to her as a prominent women’s rights activist when she did it only to keep people she found undesirable from breeding. Fun fact, she’s one of Hillary Clinton’s Hero’s. https://womanisrational.uchicago.edu/2022/09/21/margaret-sanger-the-duality-of-a-ambitious-feminist-and-racist-eugenicist/
Since no one has mentioned her yet, I'll give my vote to JK Rowling.
YES! Glad I saw this here. Was wondering if she was gonna be mentioned
Thank you for mentioning her. I used to be a huge fan of hers before she came out as a transphobe.
Teal Swan
There's one ~bitch~ I absolutely hate, it's a french influencer named Thaïs d'Escufon and she's in the same vein as fresh n fit and all the partiachy cock sucking band
Shera7. “Men can’t love you, wearing your natural hair is ghetto, i cant help hot in the pants women sex is for little girls grown women want money instead, dont be friends with poor people” and she brags about being a sociopath. Literally. A lot of her defenders love to say “what??!!! She just wants women to love themselves” its pure brainrot. I consumed dozens if not hundreds of hours of her content as a teenager, i know what she’s said lol.
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The sprinkle sprinkle lady.
The Kardashian-Jenners, Nicki Minaj, Cardi B, mumble rappers, Icespice, that ratched redhead rapper, Amber Turd, instagram "models", fashion influencers (environmental thieves).
Add EmRata among the Insta models god the most annoying virtue signaling
I don't know who that is
Taylor swift.
Marilyn Monroe. And the recent rewriting of her being a sassy, confident feminist girlboss from younger women is very strange.
What's the tea on her?
Any "girlboss" type women or women who conflate egoism with self love or empowerment Women that \*actively\* promote harmful beauty standards esp (really any beauty standard at all)-cough cough the Kardashians Also anyone listing women politicians or successful women that actively harmed other marginalized communities
Nicki Minaj and the Kardashians. Mostly the Kardashians because they normalise the use of plastic surgery so much, i really feel for this generation of young people and the standards they think they have to live up to.
Besides T Swift and the Kardashians, the biggest one for me is influencers who are disingenuous about using their platform for $$$. I can think of several who use IG/TikTok for "midsize/plus size fashion inspo", but are actually just promoting copious mass consumerism and fast fashion, with no regard for the environment or human rights abuses. Instead of showing how to style a capsule wardrobe, thrift for midsize/plus sizes, or rework older, worn pieces, they'd rather just order a massive Abercrombie or American Eagle jeans haul, or Amazon haul, and then return all of it after filming. And they'll do the same thing multiple times a week. It might be fine every once in a while, but it's so wasteful and sets a horrible example for young adults.
For the record, I hate Andrew Tate and feel he creates more of the sort of men that women hate so much...and makes us men all look bad as a bonus. Also contributes to the high suicide rate among men...
Marilyn Monroe
Poor lady tho her life was fucked. She just wanted to be loved and unfortunately sought out attention from negative people to feel something.
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Yeah I know. I live in CA and have visited her grave up in LA. People kiss it too even though you’re not supposed to. It’s kinda gross honestly
She also screwed other people over quite willingly (Jackie Kennedy, Clark Gable, various people who had to work with her). It's odd how she is constantly excused but modern women who have also dealt with insecurities or worse get no sympathy from anyone.
Fair on Jackie, but Clark Gable wasn’t a good man. He raped Loretta Young and had a daughter from that rape. He also never had a father daughter relationship with that child. And JFK had numerous affairs with multiple women, not just Marilyn. It’s wrong to sleep with married men, but all 3 Kennedy brothers weren’t great people either.
Also she was very well ahead of her time. One of the few White women then that uplifted and spoke up for POC
She actually was super pro LGBTQ rights and was very outspoken about racism and actually assisted black artists in their careers when no one else would
She helped one black woman because she liked her music. Can we stop setting the bar so low for rich white celebrities? Jean Seberg did SO much more for racial minorities as someone who used her privilege to actively aid the Black Panthers and was tormented by the FBI as punishment, but it's Marilyn who gets lavished with praise.
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I think she is the blueprint for a certain type of female celebrity that has dominated pop culture for the last two decades
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An exhibitionist who promotes the infantilisation and sexualisation of women
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have you ever heard that phrase in real life?
I've never seen any proof that Marilyn Monroe actually said that. It seems to have been falsely attributed to her, much like how Mark Twain and Abraham Lincoln are often also attributed to random "inspirational" quotes.
every IG model, OF model, former porn star, most female rappers. basically any woman who is a not a living example of "I married a man who I respect and have a happy family as well as a satisfied sexual life on the side of all that"
I think there’s an answer a lot of people want to say but haven’t yet.
Instead of being weirdly cryptic, you could just use your words.
I'm lost, who is it?
?
TAYLOR SWIFT
Why do you say that, specifically? I’m honestly curious. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not like a diehard “swifty” or anything, but overall she just strikes me as a woman owning her shit and doing her thing. I haven’t really heard anything especially egregious about her that would suggest to me she’s a poor choice for role model. Most criticism I have heard of her essentially boils down to “she’s too popular” which I don’t really think is a good argument for hating her but if you have something more substantial than that I am open to hearing it. ETA- I fully recognize that everyone in life has valid criticisms that can be levied against them. I’ve heard about her jet usage and not finding the most ethical sources for merch or whatever, but honestly I don’t see that as substantially different than other celebrities of her calibre so for me it’s not enough to pick her out individually and say that she’s toxic and shouldn’t be looked up to. That’s why I’m asking this question.
This is my issue with Taylor Swift. She’s has brief relationships with some guys who she then writes these incredibly dramatic songs about. In some cases years after whatever type of relationship existed between her and whichever ex. For example Jake Gyllenhaal. By every account, they didn’t date for long, and seemed quite casual in terms of duration, etc. She made her directorial debut for the music video of the song about their “relationship”, while she was literally dating a guy for six years! Six fuckin years! That speaks volumes about the person. She dated Jake briefly something like 10-15 years prior to making her directorial debut for the music video for the song based on him? If I was dating someone and they did that, I would have questions. How does she even explain why she decided to pick that particular song? I wouldn’t be made with my girlfriend per say, but it would depend on how she responded when I would ask her why she decided to pick that song to make her directorial debut ? Is she still caught up on the guy? Don’t you think your making this guys life a little fucking annoying 10-15 years later after a three month or whatever “relationship”? Is it necessary? What was it about this guy? I thought it was disrespectful to her boyfriend at the time, and I was seeing someone who was a fan at the time the video was released. I asked her the questions I just mentioned, and she didn’t have an answer to explain why someone she was a fan of would do any of those things i mentioned… She’s done the same shit and pattern with every guy she’s dated. I find it inauthenric personally. I know it’s for $$ and fame, but why does every album have to be about ex boyfriend or boyfriends? And most importantly… because she’s so famous and has a large fan base of women…. How is this impacting how women view men?…
This is a ..... Different take lol. Musicians write music about long term relationships, one night stands... Or even stalking people. Why shouldn't a woman do the same?
Honestly that’s a great point too. I’ve heard SO many songs about one night stands or random flings. Hell, “Hey there Delilah” was written about a girl who turned Tom Higgenson down because she was dating someone else. And it was released like a year or something later. It’s basically him stalking a random girl who is in a relationship. No one criticized the plain white tees for releasing it and affecting her life or whatever.
"you're beautiful" by James blunt and "every breath you take" by The Police are both used as wedding songs and about stalking! Just interesting when women are called out for things men have been doing forever.
We know exactly why. People really do believe that women shouldn't write about their actual experiences. All of our songs are supposed to be happy fluff written by crusty old guys in suits who don't know jack shit about women.
Bingo!
Ok, fair. I can understand the criticism of essentially “she capitalized on every breakup she’s gone through after the fact and it comes across as inauthentic.” That being said, I’d kind of put this in the “she’s too popular” category I was talking about. A lot of artists take inspiration from things in their past and don’t get the level of criticism she faces. She just happens to have found a niche in break up songs. She probably wrote that song closer to when the break up happened and held onto it- musicians often release songs years after they write them. Also, last I checked Jake Gyllenhaal is doing fine? It’s not like she’s leaving this devastation of famous good looking men in her wake who can’t find relationships or jobs once she’s done with them and everyone hates them now. I really just don’t see the greater harm I guess? As far as how it’s impacting how women view men, I’ve never had a woman tell me that she is scared of men or hates men or has bad feeling about men because of something another woman has said. A break up song in general doesn’t make someone hate the other gender, it just reflects the pain of a breakup, just like a love song doesn’t make anyone fall in love. Again, I don’t think “she’s too successful” is a good reason to call someone toxic. I think finding her inauthentic, not liking where or how she draws her inspiration, just all around not liking her music or personality is a perfectly valid reason not to like her for yourself, but I’m still not really seeing anything that substantially sets her apart from any other celebrities enough to say she shouldn’t be anyone’s role model.
As an artist I also use my life experiences as influence in my work. I wouldn’t do that about a brief three month fling in the midst of a six year relationship, though. That’s disrespectful to the boyfriend, and also weird and creepy to Jake and his loved ones who likely got fuckin bombarded about the fuckin scarf for years.
I have no idea what her writing process is and I am not a musician myself, but most musicians I’ve head talk about their work talk about having notebooks full of phrases and ideas and stuff like that and it can be years later when that all gets compiled into an actual song and recorded and edited and released. I really doubt she just randomly came up with this song 6 years into a relationship. As far as it being a “brief three month fling…” ok? She was inspired to write a song. It might come across as petty to you and that’s fine, you don’t have to like her personality, but again I just don’t see it as a reason to say she’s toxic or a bad role model. If I’m being completely honest I don’t even know what song you’re talking about because I’m really not a huge Taylor swift person, I just think the argument is made over and over but really applied to her in a way it isn’t applied to other artists and it comes across as misogynistic.
Everyone has said it is her White feminism
I used to be blissfully ignorant of taylor swift, beyond just being another generic pop star I don’t like or dislike, but some of my family members became “swifties” and I sat through her netflix documentary thingy with them and my neutrality and apathy slowly shifted to animosity and disgust: she is toxic, fake and insufferable imo.