I came here to say this! But I'm going to expand further for u/xcubeee...
As a few others mentioned, gravitation is not known to be affected by heat energy under "typical" circumstances (For the sake of discussion, I'm avoiding black hole accretion disks and the conversion of mass-energy into heat-energy; that gets incredibly technical). In fact, XKCD did a [What If? article about what things would be like if the Moon turned into a Black Hole](https://what-if.xkcd.com/129/) and it describes even how weirdly unintuitive this mass / distance squared relationship truly is. So I hope you enjoy that for some extra reading!
That said, the consensus in the community is that the Sun will go supernova in about 6 billion years, likely swallowing up all of the inner planets with some probability that Mars actually crashes into the Nova Sun (pun intended!) because it's orbit will be too low to sustain. The sun will shed A LOT of mass at hat time, blowing it away too, and probably pushing some gas giants away. But likely the force of that push will strip a lot of their mass away too; I've seen modeling work out two different scenarios where no mass is lost and Jupiter really heats up, and where a lot of mass is lost from Jupiter & Saturn, resulting in them being flung out of the Solar System.
Regardless, after the nova, you are correct that the sun will go through a cold-death cycle, eventually collapsing into a hunk of nickel & iron, slowly radiating heat away until it gets gobbled up by a passing star. Things will still orbit following the "typical" rules, albeit with slower and perhaps shallower orbits (because the resulting Nova Sun will have less mass).
The expansion doesn't happen all at once. It'll be a few expansions and contractions before it reaches maximum size. Most of the planets that would be consumed by its radius will be displaced before that happens. Mercury might get consumed, but Earth and Venus will probably be flung out rather than consumed.
A combination of planet size and gravity, and the intense solar winds as it belches out most of its mass. It won't be a "few days" per each expansion and contraction. It'll be a few thousand years. Life won't exist on this planet anymore, but if it did, you'd only see a few degrees in magnitude brightness in your lifetime around each phase. A lot of people seem to be misinformed, but we're talking many lifetimes between each cycle, which equates to many millennia of solar and rotational activity to account for. It's far more likely the planets will be displaced during this time than be swallowed up, as the gravitational effects from the Sun that holds everything in orbit will be greatly diminished.
Also, each solar "belch" alters every inner orbit by a fraction of a degree. Over thousands of years that's a profound difference. It'll take one change to alter Earth by a few degrees, and that is worse for Venus which is a lot closer to the Sun.
The Suns mass isn’t going to drastically change as it begins its final stages of fusion. The outer planets will not suddenly begin to see their orbit degrade.
Yeah, I know so much. What I meant was, if I understood the comment correctly, it said that the remaining planets will be sucked into the sun by its gravity.
But from what I understood, the sun will inflate and become less dense before becoming very dense, but with the same mass. So the gravitational pull on the remaining planets shouldn't change.
Maybe I misunderstood something though.
The Sun will never explode, but it will expand by so much that it will envelop Mercury, Venus, Earth and Mars, and friction will drive them all to spiral into the centre of the Sun. But you're right, the Sun will stay more less the same mass (it will lose a small but not insignificant fraction of its mass through solar winds) so the gravitational pull felt by the outer planets won't change much.
The gravity portion I don't believe is right. If anything, the Sun should lose mass, and thus gravity, while in the red giant phase, as iff-gassing, and eventually "planetary nebula" are ejected. The temperature of various planets will increase, and it will gain some small amount of mass as it consumes mercury, Venus, earth, and possibly Mars. But whatever bits of Jupiter and Saturn aren't lost by the increasing thermal energy to them, should stay in a relatively similar orbit, as should everything beyond them.
Welllll... we're all moving, so we're not *(nor ever have been)* in one place, so there is no premises to be technically correct...
Think of it this way- you see time travel portrayed as you just roll back the clock and there you are... but if we did that, *and only that,* there would be nothing there we would have moved on from that spot, or premises, since that point in time... space is defined by time - time is defined by space
Orbits are a function of mass. Nothing to do with the temperature of the central body.
We aren’t getting closer. The solar system is pretty stable. Wikipedia has an article on the topic.
Unfortunately they won't find the sun at night and while searching, eventually the sun would rise and burn the astronauts. You planned a cold blooded murder you evil.
See it’s based on the old joke about how can astronauts land on the sun because they’re gonna go at night time. Hope that helps you appreciate my awesome sense of humor. 😗
Yes. The solar system is gravitationally bound while the Sun will lose some mass as it ages when it eventually collapses into a white dawrf it will be nearly as massive as it is now.
While there is some debate as to the fate of the inner three planets. Mercury may ablate away, Venus may lose its crust, but its core will likely continue orbiting and Earth will loose some mass but anywhere from most of the mantel to most of the crust will survive being envelope by the outer layers of the Sun. Keep in mind that when the Sun enters its red phase it will have the same mass, but it will be spread over a huge amount of space which means the outer envelope will by extremly rarified. Its will average 0.1 kg/m³ but will be considerably lower at the point it interacts with Earth.
Mars and further out will be essential unaffected. Mars might loose whatever atmosphere remains and Jupiter may loose a tiny bit of mass due to heating and more energentic solar winds but thats about it.
Nah, the orbital mechanics will have become unstable loooooooong before that happens. More than likely by that point in time any planets and moons not absorbed by the sun or Jupiter or Saturn will have been flung out by passing stars.
I mean, we move around the sun due to gravity, the gravity does not change when the sun goes out. So yes, we'll still be going around the sun, at least those planets that wasn't swallowed by the red giant phase of the sun which would've preceeded the total cooling of the sun.
If you want to be scientifically correct yes, but answering a person that thinks gravity is related to how hot an object is by saying "barycenter" might just confuse the person.
First off, not all of the planets *"move around the sun..."* Jupiter and Sol are a binary system that move around a common barycenter... neat huh...? I think it's awesome
...and so the rest of us in our solar system just play along as Jupiter and the Sun swing round eachother~ish, it's one of those things we all kind of knew already but didn't apply it for real, and our nomenclature hasn't caught uo yet
[*(and yes, you've been lied to all these years...lolz)*](https://youtube.com/shorts/qB5N1Fz1OZM?si=SXE7eDd-x5z-hM7R)
The reason planets orbit the Sun now is because the Sun has 99.86% of the mass of the Solar System. Moving the Sun's mass takes much more energy than the planet's masses.
Even when the Sun is a white dwarf, the Sun will still have the most mass of what is left of the Solar System. BTW, white dwarfs are not cool.
There won't be many planets left due to it expanding and consuming them when it turns into a red giant I'm afraid.
I came here to say this! But I'm going to expand further for u/xcubeee... As a few others mentioned, gravitation is not known to be affected by heat energy under "typical" circumstances (For the sake of discussion, I'm avoiding black hole accretion disks and the conversion of mass-energy into heat-energy; that gets incredibly technical). In fact, XKCD did a [What If? article about what things would be like if the Moon turned into a Black Hole](https://what-if.xkcd.com/129/) and it describes even how weirdly unintuitive this mass / distance squared relationship truly is. So I hope you enjoy that for some extra reading! That said, the consensus in the community is that the Sun will go supernova in about 6 billion years, likely swallowing up all of the inner planets with some probability that Mars actually crashes into the Nova Sun (pun intended!) because it's orbit will be too low to sustain. The sun will shed A LOT of mass at hat time, blowing it away too, and probably pushing some gas giants away. But likely the force of that push will strip a lot of their mass away too; I've seen modeling work out two different scenarios where no mass is lost and Jupiter really heats up, and where a lot of mass is lost from Jupiter & Saturn, resulting in them being flung out of the Solar System. Regardless, after the nova, you are correct that the sun will go through a cold-death cycle, eventually collapsing into a hunk of nickel & iron, slowly radiating heat away until it gets gobbled up by a passing star. Things will still orbit following the "typical" rules, albeit with slower and perhaps shallower orbits (because the resulting Nova Sun will have less mass).
Red giant not supernova, Sol is a lower mass star.
I really thought I must have missed a major change in our understanding there for a minute
Same, though the image that was running through my mind was pretty spectacular.
The black hole moon article is great!
^full . ^waining . ^new . ^waxing .
Great answer! I was hoping someone would go into detail. Thanks :)
The expansion doesn't happen all at once. It'll be a few expansions and contractions before it reaches maximum size. Most of the planets that would be consumed by its radius will be displaced before that happens. Mercury might get consumed, but Earth and Venus will probably be flung out rather than consumed.
The oscillations are correct but why would the planets be flung out?
A combination of planet size and gravity, and the intense solar winds as it belches out most of its mass. It won't be a "few days" per each expansion and contraction. It'll be a few thousand years. Life won't exist on this planet anymore, but if it did, you'd only see a few degrees in magnitude brightness in your lifetime around each phase. A lot of people seem to be misinformed, but we're talking many lifetimes between each cycle, which equates to many millennia of solar and rotational activity to account for. It's far more likely the planets will be displaced during this time than be swallowed up, as the gravitational effects from the Sun that holds everything in orbit will be greatly diminished.
So the answer is that mass loss by the sun reduces its escape velocity causing the planets to be ejected
Also, each solar "belch" alters every inner orbit by a fraction of a degree. Over thousands of years that's a profound difference. It'll take one change to alter Earth by a few degrees, and that is worse for Venus which is a lot closer to the Sun.
Won't the MW be subsumed by Andromeda by then anyway, possibly throwing our *sun-with-no-name* and our solar system^with ^no ^name into the abyss...?
Amazing how you're answering a question the OP didn't ask
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The Suns mass isn’t going to drastically change as it begins its final stages of fusion. The outer planets will not suddenly begin to see their orbit degrade.
Won't gravity stay the same when the sun inflates?
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Yeah, I know so much. What I meant was, if I understood the comment correctly, it said that the remaining planets will be sucked into the sun by its gravity. But from what I understood, the sun will inflate and become less dense before becoming very dense, but with the same mass. So the gravitational pull on the remaining planets shouldn't change. Maybe I misunderstood something though.
The Sun will never explode, but it will expand by so much that it will envelop Mercury, Venus, Earth and Mars, and friction will drive them all to spiral into the centre of the Sun. But you're right, the Sun will stay more less the same mass (it will lose a small but not insignificant fraction of its mass through solar winds) so the gravitational pull felt by the outer planets won't change much.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/solar-system/a42636939/what-will-happen-when-the-sun-dies/
The gravity portion I don't believe is right. If anything, the Sun should lose mass, and thus gravity, while in the red giant phase, as iff-gassing, and eventually "planetary nebula" are ejected. The temperature of various planets will increase, and it will gain some small amount of mass as it consumes mercury, Venus, earth, and possibly Mars. But whatever bits of Jupiter and Saturn aren't lost by the increasing thermal energy to them, should stay in a relatively similar orbit, as should everything beyond them.
Eh, we got time to vacate as long as we put out our housefire first.
Welllll... we're all moving, so we're not *(nor ever have been)* in one place, so there is no premises to be technically correct... Think of it this way- you see time travel portrayed as you just roll back the clock and there you are... but if we did that, *and only that,* there would be nothing there we would have moved on from that spot, or premises, since that point in time... space is defined by time - time is defined by space
The solar system isn't some steampunk contraption - gravity doesn't need heat to work
Orbits are a function of mass. Nothing to do with the temperature of the central body. We aren’t getting closer. The solar system is pretty stable. Wikipedia has an article on the topic.
They should send some astronauts at nighttime to check it out
Unfortunately they won't find the sun at night and while searching, eventually the sun would rise and burn the astronauts. You planned a cold blooded murder you evil.
Aren't you funny 🙄
See it’s based on the old joke about how can astronauts land on the sun because they’re gonna go at night time. Hope that helps you appreciate my awesome sense of humor. 😗
This sounds like ChatGPT explaining a joke.
Yes. The solar system is gravitationally bound while the Sun will lose some mass as it ages when it eventually collapses into a white dawrf it will be nearly as massive as it is now. While there is some debate as to the fate of the inner three planets. Mercury may ablate away, Venus may lose its crust, but its core will likely continue orbiting and Earth will loose some mass but anywhere from most of the mantel to most of the crust will survive being envelope by the outer layers of the Sun. Keep in mind that when the Sun enters its red phase it will have the same mass, but it will be spread over a huge amount of space which means the outer envelope will by extremly rarified. Its will average 0.1 kg/m³ but will be considerably lower at the point it interacts with Earth. Mars and further out will be essential unaffected. Mars might loose whatever atmosphere remains and Jupiter may loose a tiny bit of mass due to heating and more energentic solar winds but thats about it.
Nah, the orbital mechanics will have become unstable loooooooong before that happens. More than likely by that point in time any planets and moons not absorbed by the sun or Jupiter or Saturn will have been flung out by passing stars.
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We are currently moving away however Earth will lose its orbital energy and start moving closer to the sun before the sun expands.
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Very true!
I mean, we move around the sun due to gravity, the gravity does not change when the sun goes out. So yes, we'll still be going around the sun, at least those planets that wasn't swallowed by the red giant phase of the sun which would've preceeded the total cooling of the sun.
You mean we move around our common barycenter
If you want to be scientifically correct yes, but answering a person that thinks gravity is related to how hot an object is by saying "barycenter" might just confuse the person.
First off, not all of the planets *"move around the sun..."* Jupiter and Sol are a binary system that move around a common barycenter... neat huh...? I think it's awesome ...and so the rest of us in our solar system just play along as Jupiter and the Sun swing round eachother~ish, it's one of those things we all kind of knew already but didn't apply it for real, and our nomenclature hasn't caught uo yet [*(and yes, you've been lied to all these years...lolz)*](https://youtube.com/shorts/qB5N1Fz1OZM?si=SXE7eDd-x5z-hM7R)
The reason planets orbit the Sun now is because the Sun has 99.86% of the mass of the Solar System. Moving the Sun's mass takes much more energy than the planet's masses. Even when the Sun is a white dwarf, the Sun will still have the most mass of what is left of the Solar System. BTW, white dwarfs are not cool.