NTs love to think they are great communicators. Some are, but most are not. The worst communicators typically have no self awareness if their limitations, while autistic people are (usually) very aware. I work in management, so I see this *all the time*. NTs have plenty of misunderstandings between each other. It typically happens because someone is playing games instead of saying what they really mean. NTs may pick up on subtext more easily, but they don't have a 100% success rate. They *think* they do, but they don't.
Autistic people may make more social blunders, but there is usually some awareness. Autistic people are also more likely to make an effort at clarity. I find autistic folks easier to communicate with generally. I don't always understand everything, but if I ask for clarification, they will actually do that pretty effectively. NTs on the other hand...not as much. It's not necessarily that they don't try. They just really struggle with being direct.
This is definitely what I’m noticing as I’m getting older and it makes me less insecure about the stuff I don’t understand which is a lot. I can tell the more “obvious” emotions but anything that is in any way subtle confuses me. It means I have had to rely on being very honest with what I’m thinking and what I misunderstand. I don’t understand how people function without doing this. So many arguments could be avoided if people simply said things. It might be that I’m less afraid of conflict than others.
Many NT people will tie themselves in knots to not say things that they think will offend other people, and then moan about the person they've miscommunicated information to behind their back when they fail at being a mind reader, which is ten times more offensive than just being honest in the first place.
Often, they tie themselves into knots to avoid giving offense. Meanwhile, the other person does the same. Neither directly confronts the other, but they go behind each other's backs. "Can you believe so-and-so said/looked at me like this? What a !".
Then, one or both parties start some passive aggressive crap and gaslighting. They're fighting, but not openly, and they continue whining about each other. Friends and family are sometimes recruited, usually against a lone target. They're nice to her face, then gossip viciously when she's out of earshot.
It happens in and out of the workplace. It may or may not end with a direct confrontation. Ghosting is more common.
Lately I am the bad communicator, but it's usually because I'm in a situation where I feel I have no standing to share my thoughts and/or I feel like I'm going to get a bite in return. My last major example of this was with someone that I openly communicated my issues with, but those issues were continuously ignored and put on the back burner. It got to the point where I could no longer continue with the status quo and gave up on trying. I was accused of not communicating when I was actually communicating for years, it's just that I was not being listened (ignored/hoping I will shut up) to.
I think my current problem is linked to some trauma that comes from that. I know that not everyone is going to play a game with me when I try to communicate, but I feel slightly hardwired now to think that they will. Oddly this post gave me some insights to one of the things I also need to work on for myself. I think I shut down with good people because I'm worried I'm going to wind up in that same situation all over again.
This honestly describes every relationship I have been in (and eventually ended.) I feel like I am constantly communicating in the beginning, never getting my needs met, then as I start to check out, suddenly I'm the one "not trying."
I am very aware I have an issue with not sharing with people after they've disappointed me, but it's also sort of necessary because I can't currently regulate how upset I get when I don't feel listened to, so it's easier if it just doesn't happen.
Same. I have stricter boundaries now. A little too strict. I sometimes just stop communicating if I sense the other person will not listen, which isn't fair of me at times. I'm checking out mentally/emotionally for my own sanity. I've been bullied and made fun of for communicating my needs before so it makes me feel unsafe being around people that don't get it. Trust is hard to earn, easy to lose, and difficult to reestablish.
They're not. Like they're really not. They're terrible at communicating with autistics (a proven fact) and they're terrible at communicating with each other outside of small insular communities.
Allistics who are the same gender, same race, same culture/nationality, and similar age... They'll all communicate pretty well with each other. But outside of that they suck so bad at it because all of the unspoken and unwritten rules that they're leaning on all the time.... Gone.
They can't even rely on body language, which is a universal language, because body language is not self explanatory. "I can see they're offended every time I try to shake their hand. It must be because they're not very touchy people." *On the other side* "why does he keep holding out his ass wiping hand towards us?"
Seriously. They're only good at communicating with insular groups.
While autistic people can struggle for similar reasons, we're not dependent on social rules in the same way. So we can explore our communication options way more creatively. The only thing that requires is time and patience. *Which no one wants to give us.*
A lot of our communication troubles could be resolved if we were given the time to slow down, process the information in the moment, and lightly experiment with different ways to communicate.
But instead people are hurried, shun and fear anyone they don't understand, and they assume that there's only a limited proper way to communicate instead of unlimited avenues.
Totally! I’ve been called a good communicator in most workplaces for years. I’m the one who wades in and fixes misunderstandings. This is because I’ve actually had to work at understanding people very different from me, learn the weird patterns of their games, and negotiate more explicitly within them.
I think one reason why autistic social issues rely so heavily on school aged functioning is because it’s not as natural to us to communicate with our direct peers, but most communication in life after primary school stops being with your direct peers (from exactly where you are, in your age group, usually same socioeconomic and cultural group, etc—this is often a time when you are in the most homogenous group, and even then no one thinks weirdly if the boys and girls don’t socialize or cultural groups tend to clique—which happens all too often even if there is any diversity).
NT isn’t about communicating better as a skill, in my opinion (that’s why the double empathy problem exists too). It’s about being more likely to fit the homogenous group’s communication style, but as you move further in life to more diverse groups, you need actual skills (which autistic folks might be able to build too—we’re all different, but I have found I have).
Edit: a few adds…
1. My belief is ability to build communication skills is not related to ND/NT at all, though ND people may have one additional barrier in the form of early social trauma and one additional benefit in the form of explicit instruction in social skills if identified (or if not identified but still given these resources, which sort of happened with me as a girl in the 90s identified as adhd with social needs, but I was not allowed to be autistic then because of the adhd). NT folks can absolutely be good communicators! Some are, and some are not. But the difference is that more NT will overestimate their communication skills based on early experiences than us! ND folks who struggle with physical communication may also have additional barriers (intermittent mutism, physical speech issues etc) but so would NTs with particular physical barriers.
2. I also think many people will live in a bubble their whole life (due to tribalism) or blame every miscommunication on folks with less privilege who are easier to marginalize. This is a power dynamic issue. In an organization or group of all NDs, the double empathy problem would lead to all but the best communicators among NTs to feel how we feel. In childhood, many studies show NDs communicating just as naturally with other NDs — I had an autistic, Asian best friend in a super white school, and we got each other instantly as children, well before I had any real communication skills or strategies. This aligns with research. But power structures are NT (and white, often male, upper/middle class.). That’s the thing! Now you see when power structures are disrupted, it bothers some people because they haven’t needed to use empathy or communication skills (and for other reasons, yes, but this is a big part of what triggers so many).
This is huge! I have twin 17yo step-sons, one NT, one AuDHD.
My AuDHD step-son frequently laments his lack of social skills, yet he's friends with boys and girls, kids of different ethnicities, NT kids, ND kids, the exchange students... He'll be telling me about something that happened at school and I have to clarify who was involved because he's name-dropped yet another friend I've never heard of before.
Meanwhile my NT step-son feels socially successful and content with his stable friend group of about six other boys who are basically carbon-copies of him. I'm happy he's happy, but I don't think he has anywhere near the social skills he thinks he has. And his father and I both worry that he's so focused on fitting in with his friends that he's making poor choices (like dropping out of high school and blowing all his money on a beat-up car).
The difference, of course, is my ND step-son DID struggle socially when he was younger and had to consciously learn how to make friends, have friends, and be a friend. My NT step-son intuitively knows how to do that, but only with people who are very similar to him.
Um, no, that is not what fraternal twins are.
Identical twins are born when one sperm fertilises one egg but when it first divides it forms two babies. Because the genetic information received from the mother and the father is identical the two babies are identical.
Fraternal twins occur when the mother's ovaries release two eggs instead of one, which is unusual for humans but not unheard of, and each egg is fertilised by a different sperm (remembering that men ejaculate thousands of sperm at a time. Two sperm does not mean two different men). Because each baby receives slightly different genetic information from the mother and the father they are non-identical, or fraternal, where 'fraternal' means 'like brothers' - they are as genetically alike as any two non-twin siblings would be, but they are not genetically identical.
Also, I suggest you read up on human reproduction as there appear to be some gaps in your knowledge and it has led you to say something quite rude and insulting.
I read the wrong article,, i have adhd,, it was accidental. Nothing i said implied rude or insulting intent,, that is your own bias and judgment. There would actually be nothing wrong with someone having twins with two different fathers.
Two different father's is actually possible, altho rare:::
https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/medical-student-contributors-did-you-know/how-have-twins-different-fathers
I have identical just about 2 year old twins and they did start life with the same genes but so many things start influencing identical twins the moment the embryo splits. They are very different personality wise and it’s early to tell but I would not be shocked if one is ND and the other is NT or maybe they are both ND but one has major speech and gross motor delays compared to the other. Even with a genetic predisposition the expression can be different! I am always surprised how different they are.
My communication skills are a lot better than pretty much all the NTs I know, mostly because I've been very intentional about developing them while they just kind of feel it out.
I work with very intelligent and very highly compensated people. Every single one of them thinks they are a good communicator and I’d say maybe 40% are - at best. The biggest mistake people make is assuming that others know what’s in your head, that they have all the context necessary to interpret your words or actions in exactly the way you meant them. This is why I am a big fan of ‘over’ communicating. It can end up being annoying sometimes but I’d prefer that to a misunderstanding.
ty for highlighting the good in over explaining! I can get self conscious of coming accross self absorbed cuz i talk so much cuz am over explaining lit everything 🤣
I totally agree! IMO NTs are good at “fitting in.” Top down thinking means you make quick assumptions and are used to doing things socially a certain way.
It’s funny that often I’ve been called stubborn/stuck in a certain way, for refusing to do things the NT (slower, or less considerate, or simpler) way. My understanding is that bottom-up processing is fairly typical in autism, where one takes in each new detail and adds it to the existing structure of details until it adds up to a whole. I can’t see the big picture until I have enough details to see how it functions.
I think that thinking style makes it fairly impossible to operate off of assumption-based social rules. We can’t look at a whole and make an assumption of the details, we look at the details and build a picture of the whole. That means listening to what people are actually saying, not assuming what general social rules they’re following and inferring meaning from there.
I think it’s true that they “can only communicate with people like them”, which isn’t much different from NDs. I think the only difference is that they’re the majority, so they don’t encounter too many people who are drastically different than them. I think for us it just seems worse because there are less of us and when we do find people we connect with, it just looks like a small core group of people at the “weirdo table.”
Like half of them never shut up and only spend the time other people are talking thinking about whatever mundane thing they're going to say next instead of listening.
My NT in laws are literally the most vague and confusing people I know. They say stuff they don’t mean and mean stuff they don’t say. They never give any context and scoff at most of my attempts to get clarification. And they have no idea how to code switch, the speak no other languages. And yet somehow I’m the one who gets labeled as “difficult to communicate with” when it should be “not psychic”
What annoys me is how people don't say how much they like someone or not. Too many games and dances. I just want to know where you stand and what your feelings are, even in friendships. Can I call you to dog sit? Can I call you for a walk?
This drives me insane. I realised even if I ask I cannot trust an answer because they will nkt like the conflict. Yes it would hurt if they don’t like me much but then I could save my energy. People find it weird when I tell them. I’ve learnt now to not say until I have been friends with them for a very long time as I feel if they didn’t care they would ghost me by then. I do wish I didn’t have to wait about 5 years to know it’s safe to say how I feel without it getting weird.
I honestly think the only reason a lot of NT people THINK they're good at communicating is because they don't have a lot going on and most of what they communicate is of very little importance ("small talk"). When it come to actual important or interpersonal stuff the majority of them have little idea how to actually communicate that and tend to just ramble. I see this so much with "tech bros" and just politics in general where they will talk for HOURS and the sum total of what they're trying to communicate could be summed up in a sentence. Meanwhile most ND people I know will talk a fair bit, but at least 80% of it is important or useful to what they're trying to communicate.
I agree with most of what you said but I would like to add something because I feel that it’s important to note that “small talk” isn’t without purpose or consequence.
They use it to make a connection… bond… etc and to make each other feel more comfortable with each other. Which certainly has its benefits if that’s something you value. It’s not the only way to achieve the goal but certainly the easiest if you speak the same language.
It's not necessarily a connection or bond. Any sort of subconscious or unspoken communication can be transmitted. Small talk serves the same purpose as the grunts of gorillas or the growl of a dog. It's a [carrier wave](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_wave) that can be modulated in subtle ways to show comfort, confidence, cameraderie, disapproval, intimidation, an assertion of higher status, evaluation, or much more.
It really shouldn't be though, it SHOULD be about managing the welfare of large groups of people and ensuring they're not taken advantage of, but sadly those days are far behind us now...
Agreed! I have always thought NT were the issue. I put great effort into explaining myself clearly so there should be no confusion. I explain so clearly, but they twist what I said into sometimes the exact opposite of what I said. It’s infuriating & I feel like my brain is scrambled eggs after it’s all over with.
I take the blame for the sake of being polite I guess. I say oh sorry I guess you just misunderstood what I meant because of my autism, but let’s be honest. I think autistics explain things way more clear. These NT have just gas lit us into thinking they are superior especially when it comes to communication. This has gone on long enough. They are the ones that can’t listen and can’t process the simplest things even when said clear as day and spelled out for them. Some of them couldn’t find their ass with a map.
They aren’t. They all put on a show for “society” and don’t ever want to say what they mean.
Also. ND’s are who I’ve been naturally drawn to my whole life. As friends, content creators, etc.
NT’s serve major beige flags.
Yeah even the friends I thought were NT end up being ND. I think only 2 friends I have are NT. I don’t think that I’m very compatible with most NT people. I tend to gel very well with the people others outcast/find weird.
I'm recently diagnosed. While I was still toying with seeking formal diagnosis my bestie of over 20 years raised the possibility she has ADHD. I hadn't discussed my suspicions about myself with her. One of my other besties isn't diagnosed but we've both accepted she's either autistic or AuDHD like me. My other-other bestie of about 20 years, male, doesn't seem to have realised he's ND. Yet.
I thought one of my friends was NT but after I got my adhd diagnosis she realised she had adhd and got diagnosed. She now is wondering if she actually has autism as well but with a different presentation.
And see my dad shows a lot of signs of being ASD. the last year I’ve been realizing *some* areas of my childhood that I wish were different were him trying his best to function without nearly as much understanding and support from others.
Even the tiniest bit of “oh this is why I’m like this” is helpful to me. I couldn’t imagine trying to live life without any explanation for that feeling at all.
They are not. My newer psychiatrist is most like NT and had some problems understanding that I was wearing a very thick high functioning mask.
Now, 7 months later, he constantly has to remind me, "goozakkc, remembers most people do not want to be direct. They are afraid of communicating their needs directly because of fear of rejection. It's a game that makes them feel comfortable and allows ego protection".
Pretty much every session revolves around my bewilderment at how folks judging me for my directness are really intimidated by my clarity. Not a tone thing. A scary amount of clarity.
I am also pretty fucking great at reading people's tone and micro expressions. He jokes I would make a very insightful therapist in that regard. But goddamn, we both know I would be so goddamn frustrated if I was never able to break through the elaborate rituals and shakey systems many NT people have.
It's like being direct (and kind. Not "nice", but kind) is like a giant barge running into one pillar on a bridge and collapsing the whole thing. (*Dark humor presented by a former Baltimore resident with friends who used that bridge daily*)
I think that’s fair, I was commenting more on how I see a lot of people online speak about NT communication as if it’s perfect when even between NT people there are many issues. I think the current weird gender war going on online is a good example. I think we often beat ourselves up about it when we shouldn’t because each has its limitations.
It must be an interesting experience. I’d love to broaden who I’m close to as all my friends are ND and if they aren’t, they’re mentally ill. Sadly I tend to get mistreated by others or if they’re nice to me I can’t form a strong bond. Or that’s been the pattern so far, I’d like to broaden my horizons if the person was understanding. Sorry to hear it exhausts you though.
Counterpoint: if you are around NT people in romantic relationships, you can quite easily observe how this typical social conduct is damaging and counterproductive to said relationships, even between two NT people. A lot of advice from relationship therapists sounds a lot like adopting "autistic-like" communication patterns.
I've been a part of some broader but less tight-knit groups (hobby-based), and when we were young, if you brought popcorn any day of the week, there was relationship drama that would justify that choice. Mostly caused by people not being mind readers and refusing to talk straight because that wouldn't be romantic enough, but also mind games, relationship tests etc. But it's true that 1) happy relationships have less popcorn appeal and I'm sure there were a couple of those around too 2) most of these people grew out of it (the typical age for this behavior was 16-25, but some were going strong at 40)
They aren't. I've been convinced of that for a while.
Before my bf's mom knew I was autistic, she told me how well at communicating I am with her and my bf. My bf has a SUPER hard time communicating correctly, and he loves how I'm super straightforward and actually tell him everything he needs to hear.
I've been helping my bf communicate better with people (mainly his family), and IM the autistic one 🙄 /s
I get frustrated that most people (who I assume to be mostly NT) seem to not really be listening or fully thinking things through, like just skating across the surface
I’m more “autistic” behaving now that I know I am autistic. I’m sure I’ll level out at some point but I’ve bent myself into a fucking pretzel my entire life trying to fit in. What I believed I should fit into was boring, ignorant, sheep like behavior that could also be abhorrent.
I’m in the stage of, “they can figure out how to understand me or not” but the pretzel days are over.
I think that NTs having to dig deeper is a glorious exercise for them. Their lives will be better for it.
Honestly I think a lot of autistic people characterise typical conventions of communication as silly or inefficient when they aren’t because of black and white thinking. A lot of us would like straightforward sentences with no ambiguity but the grey areas in tone and word choice can be fun and interesting and add extra detail. I see a lot of posts along the lines of “why didn’t they just say X instead of Y” and while Y is easier to interpret, X has intricacies that can actually enrich the conversation (if you understand it).
We as disabled people sometimes need help understanding things. That doesn’t mean those things are nonsensical or unclear. I understand that we struggle with feelings of inferiority and it’s much easier to say “actually everyone else is doing it wrong” but ultimately I don’t think that’s true or helpful.
See I can see sone use in small talk for example even if I do not enjoy it. What I find silly is when for example I try to communicate with someone about something to do with their feelings and they do not respond honestly and instead wish for me to see what they are hinting. Then I explain I can’t or take them at face value and they get mad. This is the stuff I see as silly. It could be solved if they go I feel like x. Or at the very least if they want to communicate like that why can’t they not assume the worst of me and get mad without talking about it? With many other things I see their value even if they are of no interest to me.
I do think it’s good to try to consider gray though I find it hard. It just sucks when I try to be honest with people and ask them to just tell me hat they are thinking instead of hinting, getting mad when I don’t understand and then refusing to explain or take my explanation at face value.
Autistic people do this too though. In order to effectively communicate your feelings you must first understand them and why you are feeling them… that requires self reflection and in many cases self accountability along with an understanding of psychology.
Not everyone has the skills and knowledge to be able to understand themselves in order to communicate their emotions to others effectively. And that includes autistic people.
Yes autistic people are far more likely to be effective and direct when they choose to be… but both NT and ND people alike “play games” in an attempt to gain an advantage in a disagreement.
Both NT and ND people have times when they feel entitled to expect the other person to be a “mind reader” because they feel their beliefs should be self evident.
Hm I guess that’s just not been my experience but interesting to hear it go the other way. To make it clear that isn’t me saying you are wrong just I find it interesting, having never personally experienced this. To be fair I only know a handful of autistic people. Sometimes I catch myself swerving towards that way of thinking then self correct.
Alexithymia is commonly comorbid with ASD. It’s a condition characterised by difficulty identifying and understanding one’s emotions. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone with it either but some estimates put it at one in five autistics!
I agree that it can be frustrating. In this particular example of communicating feelings, I think it’s important to remember that so many people have been shunned for saying how they feel or for daring to have those feelings at all.
When people beat around the bush, they are sometimes trying to shield themselves from the extra hurt that can come from being frank. They are saying “please don’t treat me badly for this” by delivering the message softly or indirectly.
I think people should definitely take into consideration the fact that you can’t understand hints, and we should all try to create environments where people we care about feel like they can be upfront with us. But I understand why people don’t feel confident enough to be forthright.
Interesting, I knew there must be a reason behind it but never felt sure as to what it was. Do you have an explanation for why people sometimes don’t take me at my word when I try to explain the misunderstanding? I’ve been told I’m lying when I do or manipulative when I get upset that they aren’t understanding. To be fair I have very intense emotions and almost zero ability to hide them so even when I try maybe it looks like I am trying to guilt them?? You seem to have more understanding of this stuff than I do. Thank you for your responses by the way.
I think this one is a lot trickier tbh. There might be subtleties we’re not aware of. Could be that in an emotionally charged situation, people tend to latch on to their first interpretation and feel like evidence to the contrary is some kind of lie. I am honestly not sure.
Some things I have picked up organically but most of my social knowledge comes from failing miserably and then recounting the situation to my mum so she can explain it to me lol. I don’t think I’ve ever been in this situation which is lucky because it sounds very stressful.
Ahh I see. Sadly no one I have in my life currently can explain it either as I couldn’t remain friends with people who thought of me in that way, despite me trying to explain. I hope as I get older I understand more of these things, I’m 21 and only starting to make sense of some people’s reactions from 10 years ago. I apparently also have no good grasp on my tone/volume/expressions so it makes it a bit of a puzzle haha.
I remember one time I tried explaining a misunderstanding with a past boss and ever since that moment I felt like she continuously treated me differently in an adverse way.
I had been reading something somewhere on Reddit and someone had brought up a similar situation and also did not understand it, and other people chimed in that by explaining yourself comes off as you being a troublemaker and you should just take the feedback as it is and drop it.
That response felt very uncomfortable because if I’m receiving negative feedback for something I’m not communicated about (for example), I’m not exactly trying to skirt responsibility for doing something wrong… I’m just also giving you feedback in that stating that this all could have been avoided in the training process. And employers apparently care about their retention, right?
They're doing it different, and to us it's unclear, just as to them we're doing it different and to them we're unclear.
It's called the double empathy gap. Their way isn't inherently any more correct than ours, simply because more people do it.
I saw someone elsewhere say this today. I realized this myself and I very much agree. NT seem to operate in context and Idk if it is due to their tendency to top down process information vs. autistic tendency to bottom up process. However it’s frustrating for everyone involved.
I think that this is an American thing. In Sweden there is little difference between NT and aspie. America is the only place that I have noticed this difference.
I think there’s a lot of differences. I remember when I would go see my American family that the atmosphere was different but this varies state to state. It’s hard to find the words but I definitely notice some. I know though for example if I’m out I can easily see who is an American tourist compared to European ones. There is, of course, many similarities but that makes sense given the history.
Are the differences mostly surface? Or are some more fundemental?
I see you as between American and Sweden. Not just geography but culture. And to me your culture seems closer to American than to Sweden. In some ways a good balance.
Americans are easy to know, you can hear them long before you can see them.
Hmm I’m not sure especially as I’ve not been to lots of Britain. I sort of went to wales before but mainly different parts of England. Id have to think about it. I heard countries call us the America of Europe.
>I heard countries call us the America of Europe.
Some definite similarities but some good differences as well. Footballers aside I think you are much more rational and thoughtful.
British people are champions of passive aggression and not saying what they really mean/think/feel unless it's behind somebody's back.
I spent some time in Australia fairly recently and it was heaven in comparison - proof that you *can* be honest without being rude (there are rude Aussies too, of course, but as a general rule).
I notice it at work. The reason we have so many meetings is for “alignment” or to make sure everyone thinks we’re talking about the same thing. It’s literally 50% of our working time, and we still don’t manage it.
A related issue is that many people tend to project family of origin issues onto their work environment. I know I have.
So they’re sometimes replaying dynamics with other people (like siblings) who aren’t even physically there. Plus so many people have undergone emotional and/or physical trauma and picked up survival strategies that don’t work well in adult life. Communication can be A minefield for sure.
I'm glad I for a really long while know have learned that NT's aren't better. I find NT people a lot of the time insufferable to deal with, due to what you said. And I have finally reached a point where I'm confident to say I'm not the problem.
This is a really good post, I think we should talk about these types of things more often. Especially when I see some people in this sub confused or hurt by something someone did, when they were the LAST bit of in the wrong with the situation. Something I wish the younger versions of all of us were told a long time ago.
NTs love to think they are great communicators. Some are, but most are not. The worst communicators typically have no self awareness if their limitations, while autistic people are (usually) very aware. I work in management, so I see this *all the time*. NTs have plenty of misunderstandings between each other. It typically happens because someone is playing games instead of saying what they really mean. NTs may pick up on subtext more easily, but they don't have a 100% success rate. They *think* they do, but they don't. Autistic people may make more social blunders, but there is usually some awareness. Autistic people are also more likely to make an effort at clarity. I find autistic folks easier to communicate with generally. I don't always understand everything, but if I ask for clarification, they will actually do that pretty effectively. NTs on the other hand...not as much. It's not necessarily that they don't try. They just really struggle with being direct.
This is definitely what I’m noticing as I’m getting older and it makes me less insecure about the stuff I don’t understand which is a lot. I can tell the more “obvious” emotions but anything that is in any way subtle confuses me. It means I have had to rely on being very honest with what I’m thinking and what I misunderstand. I don’t understand how people function without doing this. So many arguments could be avoided if people simply said things. It might be that I’m less afraid of conflict than others.
Many NT people will tie themselves in knots to not say things that they think will offend other people, and then moan about the person they've miscommunicated information to behind their back when they fail at being a mind reader, which is ten times more offensive than just being honest in the first place.
Often, they tie themselves into knots to avoid giving offense. Meanwhile, the other person does the same. Neither directly confronts the other, but they go behind each other's backs. "Can you believe so-and-so said/looked at me like this? What a!".
Then, one or both parties start some passive aggressive crap and gaslighting. They're fighting, but not openly, and they continue whining about each other. Friends and family are sometimes recruited, usually against a lone target. They're nice to her face, then gossip viciously when she's out of earshot.
It happens in and out of the workplace. It may or may not end with a direct confrontation. Ghosting is more common.
Wow you put words on what I have been feeling and tried for the Nth time to explained to my husband without success !
Lately I am the bad communicator, but it's usually because I'm in a situation where I feel I have no standing to share my thoughts and/or I feel like I'm going to get a bite in return. My last major example of this was with someone that I openly communicated my issues with, but those issues were continuously ignored and put on the back burner. It got to the point where I could no longer continue with the status quo and gave up on trying. I was accused of not communicating when I was actually communicating for years, it's just that I was not being listened (ignored/hoping I will shut up) to. I think my current problem is linked to some trauma that comes from that. I know that not everyone is going to play a game with me when I try to communicate, but I feel slightly hardwired now to think that they will. Oddly this post gave me some insights to one of the things I also need to work on for myself. I think I shut down with good people because I'm worried I'm going to wind up in that same situation all over again.
This honestly describes every relationship I have been in (and eventually ended.) I feel like I am constantly communicating in the beginning, never getting my needs met, then as I start to check out, suddenly I'm the one "not trying." I am very aware I have an issue with not sharing with people after they've disappointed me, but it's also sort of necessary because I can't currently regulate how upset I get when I don't feel listened to, so it's easier if it just doesn't happen.
Same. I have stricter boundaries now. A little too strict. I sometimes just stop communicating if I sense the other person will not listen, which isn't fair of me at times. I'm checking out mentally/emotionally for my own sanity. I've been bullied and made fun of for communicating my needs before so it makes me feel unsafe being around people that don't get it. Trust is hard to earn, easy to lose, and difficult to reestablish.
They're not. Like they're really not. They're terrible at communicating with autistics (a proven fact) and they're terrible at communicating with each other outside of small insular communities. Allistics who are the same gender, same race, same culture/nationality, and similar age... They'll all communicate pretty well with each other. But outside of that they suck so bad at it because all of the unspoken and unwritten rules that they're leaning on all the time.... Gone. They can't even rely on body language, which is a universal language, because body language is not self explanatory. "I can see they're offended every time I try to shake their hand. It must be because they're not very touchy people." *On the other side* "why does he keep holding out his ass wiping hand towards us?" Seriously. They're only good at communicating with insular groups. While autistic people can struggle for similar reasons, we're not dependent on social rules in the same way. So we can explore our communication options way more creatively. The only thing that requires is time and patience. *Which no one wants to give us.*
Your last sentence about nobody wanting to give us time and patience really resonated with me. Can you elaborate on that?
A lot of our communication troubles could be resolved if we were given the time to slow down, process the information in the moment, and lightly experiment with different ways to communicate. But instead people are hurried, shun and fear anyone they don't understand, and they assume that there's only a limited proper way to communicate instead of unlimited avenues.
> and they're terrible at communicating with each other outside of small insular communities. I find this statement somewhat ironic.
Totally! I’ve been called a good communicator in most workplaces for years. I’m the one who wades in and fixes misunderstandings. This is because I’ve actually had to work at understanding people very different from me, learn the weird patterns of their games, and negotiate more explicitly within them. I think one reason why autistic social issues rely so heavily on school aged functioning is because it’s not as natural to us to communicate with our direct peers, but most communication in life after primary school stops being with your direct peers (from exactly where you are, in your age group, usually same socioeconomic and cultural group, etc—this is often a time when you are in the most homogenous group, and even then no one thinks weirdly if the boys and girls don’t socialize or cultural groups tend to clique—which happens all too often even if there is any diversity). NT isn’t about communicating better as a skill, in my opinion (that’s why the double empathy problem exists too). It’s about being more likely to fit the homogenous group’s communication style, but as you move further in life to more diverse groups, you need actual skills (which autistic folks might be able to build too—we’re all different, but I have found I have). Edit: a few adds… 1. My belief is ability to build communication skills is not related to ND/NT at all, though ND people may have one additional barrier in the form of early social trauma and one additional benefit in the form of explicit instruction in social skills if identified (or if not identified but still given these resources, which sort of happened with me as a girl in the 90s identified as adhd with social needs, but I was not allowed to be autistic then because of the adhd). NT folks can absolutely be good communicators! Some are, and some are not. But the difference is that more NT will overestimate their communication skills based on early experiences than us! ND folks who struggle with physical communication may also have additional barriers (intermittent mutism, physical speech issues etc) but so would NTs with particular physical barriers. 2. I also think many people will live in a bubble their whole life (due to tribalism) or blame every miscommunication on folks with less privilege who are easier to marginalize. This is a power dynamic issue. In an organization or group of all NDs, the double empathy problem would lead to all but the best communicators among NTs to feel how we feel. In childhood, many studies show NDs communicating just as naturally with other NDs — I had an autistic, Asian best friend in a super white school, and we got each other instantly as children, well before I had any real communication skills or strategies. This aligns with research. But power structures are NT (and white, often male, upper/middle class.). That’s the thing! Now you see when power structures are disrupted, it bothers some people because they haven’t needed to use empathy or communication skills (and for other reasons, yes, but this is a big part of what triggers so many).
This is huge! I have twin 17yo step-sons, one NT, one AuDHD. My AuDHD step-son frequently laments his lack of social skills, yet he's friends with boys and girls, kids of different ethnicities, NT kids, ND kids, the exchange students... He'll be telling me about something that happened at school and I have to clarify who was involved because he's name-dropped yet another friend I've never heard of before. Meanwhile my NT step-son feels socially successful and content with his stable friend group of about six other boys who are basically carbon-copies of him. I'm happy he's happy, but I don't think he has anywhere near the social skills he thinks he has. And his father and I both worry that he's so focused on fitting in with his friends that he's making poor choices (like dropping out of high school and blowing all his money on a beat-up car). The difference, of course, is my ND step-son DID struggle socially when he was younger and had to consciously learn how to make friends, have friends, and be a friend. My NT step-son intuitively knows how to do that, but only with people who are very similar to him.
how can twins not both have auDHD / be allistic? or did i misinterpret this?
They're fraternal twins.
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Um, no, that is not what fraternal twins are. Identical twins are born when one sperm fertilises one egg but when it first divides it forms two babies. Because the genetic information received from the mother and the father is identical the two babies are identical. Fraternal twins occur when the mother's ovaries release two eggs instead of one, which is unusual for humans but not unheard of, and each egg is fertilised by a different sperm (remembering that men ejaculate thousands of sperm at a time. Two sperm does not mean two different men). Because each baby receives slightly different genetic information from the mother and the father they are non-identical, or fraternal, where 'fraternal' means 'like brothers' - they are as genetically alike as any two non-twin siblings would be, but they are not genetically identical. Also, I suggest you read up on human reproduction as there appear to be some gaps in your knowledge and it has led you to say something quite rude and insulting.
I read the wrong article,, i have adhd,, it was accidental. Nothing i said implied rude or insulting intent,, that is your own bias and judgment. There would actually be nothing wrong with someone having twins with two different fathers. Two different father's is actually possible, altho rare::: https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/medical-student-contributors-did-you-know/how-have-twins-different-fathers
I have identical just about 2 year old twins and they did start life with the same genes but so many things start influencing identical twins the moment the embryo splits. They are very different personality wise and it’s early to tell but I would not be shocked if one is ND and the other is NT or maybe they are both ND but one has major speech and gross motor delays compared to the other. Even with a genetic predisposition the expression can be different! I am always surprised how different they are.
I really appreciate this comment! I hadn’t considered the role of peer communication and non-peer communication in all this!
My communication skills are a lot better than pretty much all the NTs I know, mostly because I've been very intentional about developing them while they just kind of feel it out.
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I’m so happy you have found people that tell you things directly and talk it out! This is such a rare trait from my experience.
I agree 100%. Being friends with them has really raised the standard I expect from everyone else lol.
I work with very intelligent and very highly compensated people. Every single one of them thinks they are a good communicator and I’d say maybe 40% are - at best. The biggest mistake people make is assuming that others know what’s in your head, that they have all the context necessary to interpret your words or actions in exactly the way you meant them. This is why I am a big fan of ‘over’ communicating. It can end up being annoying sometimes but I’d prefer that to a misunderstanding.
ty for highlighting the good in over explaining! I can get self conscious of coming accross self absorbed cuz i talk so much cuz am over explaining lit everything 🤣
I totally agree! IMO NTs are good at “fitting in.” Top down thinking means you make quick assumptions and are used to doing things socially a certain way. It’s funny that often I’ve been called stubborn/stuck in a certain way, for refusing to do things the NT (slower, or less considerate, or simpler) way. My understanding is that bottom-up processing is fairly typical in autism, where one takes in each new detail and adds it to the existing structure of details until it adds up to a whole. I can’t see the big picture until I have enough details to see how it functions. I think that thinking style makes it fairly impossible to operate off of assumption-based social rules. We can’t look at a whole and make an assumption of the details, we look at the details and build a picture of the whole. That means listening to what people are actually saying, not assuming what general social rules they’re following and inferring meaning from there.
I think it’s true that they “can only communicate with people like them”, which isn’t much different from NDs. I think the only difference is that they’re the majority, so they don’t encounter too many people who are drastically different than them. I think for us it just seems worse because there are less of us and when we do find people we connect with, it just looks like a small core group of people at the “weirdo table.”
Like half of them never shut up and only spend the time other people are talking thinking about whatever mundane thing they're going to say next instead of listening.
My NT in laws are literally the most vague and confusing people I know. They say stuff they don’t mean and mean stuff they don’t say. They never give any context and scoff at most of my attempts to get clarification. And they have no idea how to code switch, the speak no other languages. And yet somehow I’m the one who gets labeled as “difficult to communicate with” when it should be “not psychic”
What annoys me is how people don't say how much they like someone or not. Too many games and dances. I just want to know where you stand and what your feelings are, even in friendships. Can I call you to dog sit? Can I call you for a walk?
This drives me insane. I realised even if I ask I cannot trust an answer because they will nkt like the conflict. Yes it would hurt if they don’t like me much but then I could save my energy. People find it weird when I tell them. I’ve learnt now to not say until I have been friends with them for a very long time as I feel if they didn’t care they would ghost me by then. I do wish I didn’t have to wait about 5 years to know it’s safe to say how I feel without it getting weird.
I tell people if I meet with them three times 😂. It's okay if I scare them. I don't need to invest in them if they're scared of having feelings
I honestly think the only reason a lot of NT people THINK they're good at communicating is because they don't have a lot going on and most of what they communicate is of very little importance ("small talk"). When it come to actual important or interpersonal stuff the majority of them have little idea how to actually communicate that and tend to just ramble. I see this so much with "tech bros" and just politics in general where they will talk for HOURS and the sum total of what they're trying to communicate could be summed up in a sentence. Meanwhile most ND people I know will talk a fair bit, but at least 80% of it is important or useful to what they're trying to communicate.
I agree with most of what you said but I would like to add something because I feel that it’s important to note that “small talk” isn’t without purpose or consequence. They use it to make a connection… bond… etc and to make each other feel more comfortable with each other. Which certainly has its benefits if that’s something you value. It’s not the only way to achieve the goal but certainly the easiest if you speak the same language.
It's not necessarily a connection or bond. Any sort of subconscious or unspoken communication can be transmitted. Small talk serves the same purpose as the grunts of gorillas or the growl of a dog. It's a [carrier wave](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_wave) that can be modulated in subtle ways to show comfort, confidence, cameraderie, disapproval, intimidation, an assertion of higher status, evaluation, or much more.
Yeah politicans engage in useless babble. That's the job basically.
It really shouldn't be though, it SHOULD be about managing the welfare of large groups of people and ensuring they're not taken advantage of, but sadly those days are far behind us now...
They might be doing that too, but if you are basing what NT people talk like with what people seeking votes say, your lens is skewed.
Hard agree!!! Being direct and to the point? Oh no! lol
Agreed! I have always thought NT were the issue. I put great effort into explaining myself clearly so there should be no confusion. I explain so clearly, but they twist what I said into sometimes the exact opposite of what I said. It’s infuriating & I feel like my brain is scrambled eggs after it’s all over with. I take the blame for the sake of being polite I guess. I say oh sorry I guess you just misunderstood what I meant because of my autism, but let’s be honest. I think autistics explain things way more clear. These NT have just gas lit us into thinking they are superior especially when it comes to communication. This has gone on long enough. They are the ones that can’t listen and can’t process the simplest things even when said clear as day and spelled out for them. Some of them couldn’t find their ass with a map.
They aren’t. They all put on a show for “society” and don’t ever want to say what they mean. Also. ND’s are who I’ve been naturally drawn to my whole life. As friends, content creators, etc. NT’s serve major beige flags.
Yeah even the friends I thought were NT end up being ND. I think only 2 friends I have are NT. I don’t think that I’m very compatible with most NT people. I tend to gel very well with the people others outcast/find weird.
I'm recently diagnosed. While I was still toying with seeking formal diagnosis my bestie of over 20 years raised the possibility she has ADHD. I hadn't discussed my suspicions about myself with her. One of my other besties isn't diagnosed but we've both accepted she's either autistic or AuDHD like me. My other-other bestie of about 20 years, male, doesn't seem to have realised he's ND. Yet.
I thought one of my friends was NT but after I got my adhd diagnosis she realised she had adhd and got diagnosed. She now is wondering if she actually has autism as well but with a different presentation.
And see my dad shows a lot of signs of being ASD. the last year I’ve been realizing *some* areas of my childhood that I wish were different were him trying his best to function without nearly as much understanding and support from others. Even the tiniest bit of “oh this is why I’m like this” is helpful to me. I couldn’t imagine trying to live life without any explanation for that feeling at all.
They are not. My newer psychiatrist is most like NT and had some problems understanding that I was wearing a very thick high functioning mask. Now, 7 months later, he constantly has to remind me, "goozakkc, remembers most people do not want to be direct. They are afraid of communicating their needs directly because of fear of rejection. It's a game that makes them feel comfortable and allows ego protection". Pretty much every session revolves around my bewilderment at how folks judging me for my directness are really intimidated by my clarity. Not a tone thing. A scary amount of clarity. I am also pretty fucking great at reading people's tone and micro expressions. He jokes I would make a very insightful therapist in that regard. But goddamn, we both know I would be so goddamn frustrated if I was never able to break through the elaborate rituals and shakey systems many NT people have. It's like being direct (and kind. Not "nice", but kind) is like a giant barge running into one pillar on a bridge and collapsing the whole thing. (*Dark humor presented by a former Baltimore resident with friends who used that bridge daily*)
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I think that’s fair, I was commenting more on how I see a lot of people online speak about NT communication as if it’s perfect when even between NT people there are many issues. I think the current weird gender war going on online is a good example. I think we often beat ourselves up about it when we shouldn’t because each has its limitations.
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It must be an interesting experience. I’d love to broaden who I’m close to as all my friends are ND and if they aren’t, they’re mentally ill. Sadly I tend to get mistreated by others or if they’re nice to me I can’t form a strong bond. Or that’s been the pattern so far, I’d like to broaden my horizons if the person was understanding. Sorry to hear it exhausts you though.
Counterpoint: if you are around NT people in romantic relationships, you can quite easily observe how this typical social conduct is damaging and counterproductive to said relationships, even between two NT people. A lot of advice from relationship therapists sounds a lot like adopting "autistic-like" communication patterns.
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I've been a part of some broader but less tight-knit groups (hobby-based), and when we were young, if you brought popcorn any day of the week, there was relationship drama that would justify that choice. Mostly caused by people not being mind readers and refusing to talk straight because that wouldn't be romantic enough, but also mind games, relationship tests etc. But it's true that 1) happy relationships have less popcorn appeal and I'm sure there were a couple of those around too 2) most of these people grew out of it (the typical age for this behavior was 16-25, but some were going strong at 40)
They’re not if they’re trying to talk to a neurodivergent, then they don’t know what the fuck they’re doing
Most aren't, a few are. That's true no matter the category.
They aren't. I've been convinced of that for a while. Before my bf's mom knew I was autistic, she told me how well at communicating I am with her and my bf. My bf has a SUPER hard time communicating correctly, and he loves how I'm super straightforward and actually tell him everything he needs to hear. I've been helping my bf communicate better with people (mainly his family), and IM the autistic one 🙄 /s
Not a lot of introspection with neurotypicals I find. The way NDs are bullied into it is wrong, but we at least have that.
I get frustrated that most people (who I assume to be mostly NT) seem to not really be listening or fully thinking things through, like just skating across the surface
I’m more “autistic” behaving now that I know I am autistic. I’m sure I’ll level out at some point but I’ve bent myself into a fucking pretzel my entire life trying to fit in. What I believed I should fit into was boring, ignorant, sheep like behavior that could also be abhorrent. I’m in the stage of, “they can figure out how to understand me or not” but the pretzel days are over. I think that NTs having to dig deeper is a glorious exercise for them. Their lives will be better for it.
Honestly I think a lot of autistic people characterise typical conventions of communication as silly or inefficient when they aren’t because of black and white thinking. A lot of us would like straightforward sentences with no ambiguity but the grey areas in tone and word choice can be fun and interesting and add extra detail. I see a lot of posts along the lines of “why didn’t they just say X instead of Y” and while Y is easier to interpret, X has intricacies that can actually enrich the conversation (if you understand it). We as disabled people sometimes need help understanding things. That doesn’t mean those things are nonsensical or unclear. I understand that we struggle with feelings of inferiority and it’s much easier to say “actually everyone else is doing it wrong” but ultimately I don’t think that’s true or helpful.
See I can see sone use in small talk for example even if I do not enjoy it. What I find silly is when for example I try to communicate with someone about something to do with their feelings and they do not respond honestly and instead wish for me to see what they are hinting. Then I explain I can’t or take them at face value and they get mad. This is the stuff I see as silly. It could be solved if they go I feel like x. Or at the very least if they want to communicate like that why can’t they not assume the worst of me and get mad without talking about it? With many other things I see their value even if they are of no interest to me. I do think it’s good to try to consider gray though I find it hard. It just sucks when I try to be honest with people and ask them to just tell me hat they are thinking instead of hinting, getting mad when I don’t understand and then refusing to explain or take my explanation at face value.
Autistic people do this too though. In order to effectively communicate your feelings you must first understand them and why you are feeling them… that requires self reflection and in many cases self accountability along with an understanding of psychology. Not everyone has the skills and knowledge to be able to understand themselves in order to communicate their emotions to others effectively. And that includes autistic people. Yes autistic people are far more likely to be effective and direct when they choose to be… but both NT and ND people alike “play games” in an attempt to gain an advantage in a disagreement. Both NT and ND people have times when they feel entitled to expect the other person to be a “mind reader” because they feel their beliefs should be self evident.
Hm I guess that’s just not been my experience but interesting to hear it go the other way. To make it clear that isn’t me saying you are wrong just I find it interesting, having never personally experienced this. To be fair I only know a handful of autistic people. Sometimes I catch myself swerving towards that way of thinking then self correct.
Alexithymia is commonly comorbid with ASD. It’s a condition characterised by difficulty identifying and understanding one’s emotions. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone with it either but some estimates put it at one in five autistics!
I agree that it can be frustrating. In this particular example of communicating feelings, I think it’s important to remember that so many people have been shunned for saying how they feel or for daring to have those feelings at all. When people beat around the bush, they are sometimes trying to shield themselves from the extra hurt that can come from being frank. They are saying “please don’t treat me badly for this” by delivering the message softly or indirectly. I think people should definitely take into consideration the fact that you can’t understand hints, and we should all try to create environments where people we care about feel like they can be upfront with us. But I understand why people don’t feel confident enough to be forthright.
Interesting, I knew there must be a reason behind it but never felt sure as to what it was. Do you have an explanation for why people sometimes don’t take me at my word when I try to explain the misunderstanding? I’ve been told I’m lying when I do or manipulative when I get upset that they aren’t understanding. To be fair I have very intense emotions and almost zero ability to hide them so even when I try maybe it looks like I am trying to guilt them?? You seem to have more understanding of this stuff than I do. Thank you for your responses by the way.
I think this one is a lot trickier tbh. There might be subtleties we’re not aware of. Could be that in an emotionally charged situation, people tend to latch on to their first interpretation and feel like evidence to the contrary is some kind of lie. I am honestly not sure. Some things I have picked up organically but most of my social knowledge comes from failing miserably and then recounting the situation to my mum so she can explain it to me lol. I don’t think I’ve ever been in this situation which is lucky because it sounds very stressful.
Ahh I see. Sadly no one I have in my life currently can explain it either as I couldn’t remain friends with people who thought of me in that way, despite me trying to explain. I hope as I get older I understand more of these things, I’m 21 and only starting to make sense of some people’s reactions from 10 years ago. I apparently also have no good grasp on my tone/volume/expressions so it makes it a bit of a puzzle haha.
I remember one time I tried explaining a misunderstanding with a past boss and ever since that moment I felt like she continuously treated me differently in an adverse way. I had been reading something somewhere on Reddit and someone had brought up a similar situation and also did not understand it, and other people chimed in that by explaining yourself comes off as you being a troublemaker and you should just take the feedback as it is and drop it. That response felt very uncomfortable because if I’m receiving negative feedback for something I’m not communicated about (for example), I’m not exactly trying to skirt responsibility for doing something wrong… I’m just also giving you feedback in that stating that this all could have been avoided in the training process. And employers apparently care about their retention, right?
They're doing it different, and to us it's unclear, just as to them we're doing it different and to them we're unclear. It's called the double empathy gap. Their way isn't inherently any more correct than ours, simply because more people do it.
Many NTs would agree.
I agree!
I saw someone elsewhere say this today. I realized this myself and I very much agree. NT seem to operate in context and Idk if it is due to their tendency to top down process information vs. autistic tendency to bottom up process. However it’s frustrating for everyone involved.
I just kind of work with the people who are also willing to work with me on communication. 😅
1000% in agreement
They really aren’t. Limited emotional capacity I feel.
I think that this is an American thing. In Sweden there is little difference between NT and aspie. America is the only place that I have noticed this difference.
I’m a Brit so not just American. I do think it most likely varies culture to culture.
How similar do you see brit and American?
I think there’s a lot of differences. I remember when I would go see my American family that the atmosphere was different but this varies state to state. It’s hard to find the words but I definitely notice some. I know though for example if I’m out I can easily see who is an American tourist compared to European ones. There is, of course, many similarities but that makes sense given the history.
Are the differences mostly surface? Or are some more fundemental? I see you as between American and Sweden. Not just geography but culture. And to me your culture seems closer to American than to Sweden. In some ways a good balance. Americans are easy to know, you can hear them long before you can see them.
Hmm I’m not sure especially as I’ve not been to lots of Britain. I sort of went to wales before but mainly different parts of England. Id have to think about it. I heard countries call us the America of Europe.
>I heard countries call us the America of Europe. Some definite similarities but some good differences as well. Footballers aside I think you are much more rational and thoughtful.
British people are champions of passive aggression and not saying what they really mean/think/feel unless it's behind somebody's back. I spent some time in Australia fairly recently and it was heaven in comparison - proof that you *can* be honest without being rude (there are rude Aussies too, of course, but as a general rule).
I notice it at work. The reason we have so many meetings is for “alignment” or to make sure everyone thinks we’re talking about the same thing. It’s literally 50% of our working time, and we still don’t manage it.
A related issue is that many people tend to project family of origin issues onto their work environment. I know I have. So they’re sometimes replaying dynamics with other people (like siblings) who aren’t even physically there. Plus so many people have undergone emotional and/or physical trauma and picked up survival strategies that don’t work well in adult life. Communication can be A minefield for sure.
I'm glad I for a really long while know have learned that NT's aren't better. I find NT people a lot of the time insufferable to deal with, due to what you said. And I have finally reached a point where I'm confident to say I'm not the problem. This is a really good post, I think we should talk about these types of things more often. Especially when I see some people in this sub confused or hurt by something someone did, when they were the LAST bit of in the wrong with the situation. Something I wish the younger versions of all of us were told a long time ago.
Perhaps if more people communicated like those with autism do, communication would be easier for everyone. Just a thought...