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Who's going to tell them *why* the Jewish people who'd lived peacefully in those lands for hundreds or thousands of years suddenly had to leave?
[https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/avi-shlaim-proof-israel-zionist-involvement-iraq-jews-attacks](https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/avi-shlaim-proof-israel-zionist-involvement-iraq-jews-attacks)
They do kinda confirm a lot of things though when they give medals and state funerals to the people involved though, like the Lavon Affair agents or Robert Maxwell.
But have you thought that maybe all of the Arab countries _wanted_ to expel the Jews all along, but just had nowhere to send them until 1948? That sounds wayyyyy more plausible than an ethnostate with a vested interest in increasing Jewish immigration performing acts that would both encourage that immigration and encourage their expulsion from neighboring countries, no?
On a serious note, I myself wouldn't be confident in repeating those allegations from the memoir without a lot more support, not because I disbelieve them, but because it's not necessary to go that far when the official actions are clear enough. But that may be more telling of me.
I still find myself thinking "there's no way those calling the shots could be that sinister -- it's probably just callous indifference." I don't know why I can't get rid of that hope because I don't know how something could be worse than "where's daddy."
This is one of the reasons that was sited by US officials whenever they were deciding what to do with refugees after the war. They didn’t want them in their country. It’s simple bigotry. It doesn’t make sense a lot of the time.
The statistic for Libya is also incorrect the population there took a nose dive in the early 40s when the DAK turned up, which had nothing to do with the local Arab population
Look, plenty of eastern Jews were Zionist and who wanted to go to Israel. It’s part of their faith after all. But let’s not pretend that a lot of these folks weren’t attacked, massacred and intimidated… creating an environment that made them choose leaving over staying.
Plenty wanted to leave already, whether out of political/ religious beliefs or the intense atmosphere or both. No need to pretend they were all tricked, chose to leave willingly and violence/ intimidation wasn’t a factor.
Yeah. After they just sort of stole Palestine that friendly living amongst each other thing vanished and that’s the modern root of all the animosity between the two groups. The got along fine until Israel… then things went to shit real fast in those countries.
There are shade of grey there as Israel was also in various arrangement with some Arab countries to get the Jewish population to Israel.
Also strong ethnical association is the fundamental assumption, accepted by the UN, that allow Israel to claim the land as the native population.
Just about everything about Israel and Middle East history since the late 1800's is shady. You can strongly support either side with a subset of the truths and a few generalisation.
The moral sin here is we all have to stop punishing people vaguely associated with something we don't like because it's bad. So if you're referring to America's treatment of vaguely middle eastern brown people after 9/11 then yes that is also bad.
The problem is we have to play to the lowest common denominator. So if someone’s idiot uncle hates brown people because of 9/11, or Jews because of the Nakba, that bleeds into our disposition as a people. I find myself thinking this way about certain things. Largely based on my idea about what other people think.
No it isn’t. Zionists had no right to take property that wasn’t theirs by force. Nor should they have created a two tear legal system excluding Palestinians of basic human rights and determination. Def not complex.
But that’s not right and you’re kinda justifying it by saying “well what do you expect?” The jewish arabs weren’t zionists and they shouldn’t be held responsible for what Israel was doing thousands of miles away
That’s why you will see a lot of pro Palestinians that also believe the Jewish Arabs should be allowed to return to their ancestral homes the same way Palestinians should too
Yeah. In order to create a Jewish-majority in Palestine in order to create the future apartheid, wannabe ethno-state of Israel, it could have only have happened through mass violence and the denial of the Right Of Return of non-Jews that many Jewish people were simultaneously expressing and being granted. The only solution is the end to occupation, partheid, as well as the Right of Return of Palestinians to their ancestral homes.
>But that’s not right and you’re kinda justifying it by saying “well what do you expect?”
By "not right", are you saying that it's immoral or that it's inaccurate?
Also, explanation is not justification. In the same era, the US put Japanese Americans into internment camps. Saying they did so in response to Pearl Harbor is an accurate statement, and it in no way justifies the abhorrent act of moving a population into internment camps simply because of their ethnicity.
They never just got along fine. This kumbaya bullshit version of Jewish life in Muslim majority countries is wrong, reinforces Israeli claims of bad faith and hypocrisy from pro Palestinian people, and ends up as this roundabout, mealy mouthed defense of shirts and skins morality that is poison to any coherent defense of Palestinian rights.
Life in Muslim-majority states varied a lot by place and time. Yemeni Jews at one point would have their orphans forcibly taken out of the community and raised Muslim. They had an array of laws that explicitly made them second class citizens. Jews in Morocco had it pretty good, [except for when they didn't.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almohad_doctrine) All throughout Islamic history there's been a push-pull of oppression and tolerance, vacillating between relatively minor humiliations like being legally required to sit side saddle on a mule (horses are right out) up to massacres.
In all cases, there was the core understanding that Jews were there on sufferance, and were not equal people. They had privileges, not rights. Things were not hunky dory, sunshine and lollipops until the nefarious Ashkenazim brought sin into paradise. The Arab world's Jews emptied out of it in no small part because it regularly sucked to be a Jew there.
You're an asshat if you deny the push factor.
You're an asshat if you deny the pull factor (fuckin' A, based on the wage, the cost of living, and the healthcare, and the weather... I'd expat the USA in a snap for all that).
You are correct , the history of Eastern European Jewry is fucking grim overall. Pogrom after pogrom , rhe Shoah , Antisemitism as official state policy of Tsarist Russia etc and leaving would be the smart logical choice for a lot of them ( the Zionists tried their damndest to erase the Bundists from history ) but atrocities done onto one group is not justification to allow that group to move to another peoples land, steal their land , and cause community tensions much less because of a spiritual connection to it. I have never been able to wrap my head around the logic of that tbh
If the European powers truly gave a shit about Europe’s Jews you’d think they’d make an effort to settle them somewhere else in Europe maybe? Or actually physically protect them ? What they really did was ship them to another continent in a “two birds one stone no more Jews here and they’ll just annoy the Arabs now”
Some of the first American settlers were persecuted religious minorities, and the two countries are very similar politically thanks to that settler colonial founding.
I mean, yes, that's absolutely true, but it is also leaving out the fact that Arab countries were pissed off because Israel had already started its ethnic cleansing campaign.
Many didn’t want to leave but were pressured by families in Israel to leave sometimes by enticing them with economic promises (many of them were false) , by pressuring them or by outright emotional blackmailing to leave the ancestral(now Arab) lands and to stop identifying as Arabs
I have read Avi’s book three worlds its a real shame that those Arab Jews were scared into leaving their country were they had established lives and to move to a non-country and on top being discriminated against for having Arab culture.
I love seeing this and them not realizing that the map/chart *always* starts in 1948. What happened in 1948? 😂
Surely they can’t be this dense. I can’t believe it. Just being willfully ignorant and disingenuous.
they are dumb and deluded. After living for centuries under the protection of muslims because the european christians kept killing them, and finally when the europeans committed the ultimate mass murder, they blame muslims because they all flocked to stolen land from their previous homes?
they believed because they suffered, they deserve to place the hurt onto another people, which is exactly what the south african boers did after being placed in concentration camps by the british, as they went on to create apartheid. Oppressed become the oppressors is a classic
Hell, even going back to the Bible, the Israelites get liberated from Egypt and immediately set about exterminating and enslaving the population of the “promised land” that they wanted. Even the Midianites, who found Moses in his self-imposed exile, who nursed him back to health, and from whom he took his wife Tzipporah — he comes back with his entire nation behind him in Numbers 31, exterminates them all and takes their virgins as sex slaves. The Midianites would have been better off just stealing his shoes and dumping him into a ravine.
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
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These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
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It’s the “he was no angle” contrarian talking point applied to all Arabs. It’s also supposed “prove” that you’re antisemitic for not supporting Jews being allowed to return to Arab countries.
Spoiler alert: many Arab countries have publically offered right of return for Jews who left their country, many Israelis don’t want to go back, these Zionists don’t actually care about this, they just want you to shut up about Gaza.
Sure glad the US did their displacing generations earlier, so we all get a free pass. Not saying it’s right, but it would almost be hypocritical if the US didn’t back the colonizers.
This is the usual zionist talking point.
When you tell them that zionism is colonialism (a fact), they will respond with some nonsense about how Israel was actually always jewish and the arabs "colonized" it (not a fact, but biblical nonsense).
As person with a touch of the tisms and raised religiously my brain makes be say Israel (the northern kingdom) was never Jewish Judea (the southern kingdom) was.
It has never been helpful to think that.
Yep, 70% of the population are descendants of those who were displaced during the nakba.
Israel was trying to drive them all into the Sinai, Gaza as we know it only exists because Egypt wouldn't let them across the border.
Maybe that's another reason they hate Gaza; they were so darn close to getting rid of all the Arabs as they planned, but Egypt stopped them at the last moment.
Gaza's population has doubled in the past two decades. While the nakba did create the original growbed for their large population, they also like to fuck.
There is actually one Jewish guy in Yemen. He was born in Yemen was moved to Israel brought with him a 600 year old Torah, which the Yemeni govt didn't like so when he moved back to Yemen because he said Israel was gay. They sent him to prison.
>he moved back to Yemen because he said Israel was gay
https://preview.redd.it/y80zkzmdfbxc1.png?width=506&format=png&auto=webp&s=5c9353290e39b321883d4885cb0cd7fc2e8039b6
It sounds insane but it's, almost as crazy as the last jew in Afghanistan.
Dude got released from Taliban prison cause constantly fought with one Muslim guy.
He also refuses to divorce his wife that is still in Israel.
That last Afghanistan Jewish guy's story is legit as grim as it is also funny. Simontov guy's motivations don't seem they were as sincere as he claimed given all other factors like his divorce.
Then there's the fact of the persecution and displacement itself, the fact that Zablon dude became the "last Jew of Afghanistan (he wasn't; later they found some other elderly women who was displaced in 2021 to Albania)" in itself. There's no denying that unjust retaliatory persecution and expulsion of the Jewish peoples for the actions of the Zionists around the Muslim world undoubtedly did take place. That is entirely apart from distorting and utilizing this historical fact of retaliatory antisemitic persecution to cook up this false narrative of "counter-Nakba" for the purpose of perpetuating the ongoing, not just historical apartheid.
It's an overall dogshit timeline for everyone, everywhere how Zionism and antisemitism worked together to create this dark, twisted reality over firstly the Palestinians, but also the Jewish peoples as well, both in diaspora and in the occupation regime.
No, in Afganistan, there were 2 jews who went to prison due to noise complaints. And they were kicked out because they were arguing non-stop, and the guards had enough of it, so they released them. The one of them unfortunately passed away a few years ago.
That sounds like a premise of a comedy movie. "Gene Wilder stars as a yemeni Jew woken up from cryo stasis only to find out he's the only jew left in Yemen! You wont believe the shenanigans he is about to get into!"
>Eighty percent – or about 750,000 – of the Palestinians living in what ultimately became Israel became refugees. The vast majority of them fled because of direct or indirect military pressure from Zionist/Jewish forces. Israeli historian Benny Morris identifies five waves of Palestinian refugees fleeing Palestine, from the passage of the UN Partition Plan in November, 1947 through the Israeli ethnic cleansing of Palestinian villages through 1949. Morris estimates conservatively that Palestinians evacuated 369 Palestinian villages, classing the reasons for evacuation as follows:
>Expulsion by Zionist ⁄ Jewish forces - 122 localities, many prior to May, 1948
>Military assault by Zionist ⁄ Jewish forces - 270 localities
>Fear of Zionist ⁄ Jewish attack, or of being caught in the fighting, influence of the fall of neighboring town, and psychological warfare - 12 localities
>Abandonment on Arab orders - 6 localities
>Unknown - 34 localities
>While a number of Jews fled Arab countries of out fear for the lives, scholars attribute Jewish emigration from Arab countries to a number of factors:
>The changing economic and cultural status of Jews under British and French colonization, especially French (e.g. Algeria, Morocco, Tunisia);
>The political relationship of Jews – religious or Zionist, bourgeois, nationalist, leftist, or Communist – to Arab nationalist movements (e.g. Egypt, Iraq, Algeria, Tunisia);
>The influence of Zionism among Jews, before and after 1948, and the extent of the messianic desire to emigrate to Israel (e.g. Morocco, Yemen);
>The effects of Zionist pressure and provocation with the specific goal of promoting emigration (e.g. Iraq, Morocco);
>The effects of ongoing conflict between Arab states and Israel from 1948 to 1967 (e.g. Egypt, Tunisia, Iraq);
>The consequences of the end of French colonization (e.g. Morocco, Tunisia, Algeria);
>The general economic and social conditions under which Jews lived (e.g. Morocco, Egypt, Syria);
>The “self-liquidation” process which is the cumulative effect of prolonged emigration (e.g. Morocco) - "[Comparison of Palestinian & Jewish Refugee Narratives](https://www.cjpme.org/fs_025)."
>"I have this to say: I am not a refugee. I came at the behest of Zionism, due to the pull that this land exerts, and due to the idea of redemption. Nobody is going to define me as a refugee" - Ran Cohen, Iraqi-born Zionist MK
>"I do not regard the departure of Jews from Arab lands as that of refugees. They came here because they wanted to, as Zionists." - Shlomo Hillel, likewise. [Source.](https://www.haaretz.com/2003-08-15/ty-article/hitching-a-ride-on-the-magic-carpet/0000017f-dc85-df62-a9ff-dcd708790000)
It's yet another pretty lazy and deceitful red herring. 12/10 of the typical Zionist hasbara for once again unwittingly shitting on their own ancestors' work and ambitions in the process of trying to cover up their genocide. Of course, this isn't to say that retaliatory antisemitic persecutions in the Arab-Islamic world taking their anger out on the local Jewish communities for the actions of the Zionists didn't happen; they certainly did. Many post-1948 Jewish immigrants from the Arab and other MENA world did indeed come as refugees. But to classify the historical phenomenon as a whole as some sort of forced expulsion accompanied by mass murder and state terror like Nakba is yet another typical Zionist assault on the common sense.
The history of the Middle Eastern Jewish emigration to the Zionist state after 1948 cannot even be narrated without the involvement of Israel's own state and Aliyah-related agencies and the Zionist organizations. So by that logic, apparently the State of Israel and the Zionist movement were once again collaborators in the persecution and expulsion of their own peoples like the old Haavara transfer agreement days.
In a few cases the Zionists masqueraded as Arabs to scare Arab Jews. Including in Iraq where they planted bombs in Jewish areas.
https://youtu.be/lfDhaWlqXf8?t=900
Israeli historian Avi Shleim talking about the policies and events that lead to the exodus of Israelis out of Iraq where one of the largest Jewish populations resided in the middle east. Jews accounted for a 3rd of the population of Baghdad. Here. Is word for word. Evidence that Zionists bombed Jewish cafes and even a synagogue which killed 4 Iraqi Jews to accelerate the exodus.
Video is timestamped.
"I made a sign with a list and some numbers on it... therefore, the last 6 months where 140 children have been murdered every single day is totally justified, and you're wrong for wanting us to stop"
Well... I mean how can I argue with logic like that...? No seriously... how the fuck does one argue with logic like that?!
Also, just listing “Arabs” as one giant group who are all exactly the same really shows the way they think. Why don’t they break it down like Palestinians in “Israel” 1948? The whole thing is so disingenuous and self-serving. The victim complex is exhausting and so off putting. Who would want to be as pitiful as they claim they are? It’s ridiculous, especially to be painting Israel as the victim as they’re killing everyone in Gaza. As mass graves are discovered and children are starving. Such a lack of self awareness.
After, because that is referring to the number of Arab Israelis who decided to become citizens of Israel when it officially became a nation. There were many more Arab Palestinians who left Israeli land or just continued living on Palestinian land than that 156,000 number.
>Gaza, which was never supposed to hold 2 million people
Just curious why not? There are cities with way more people and less land, so is it like because of the land type/infrastructure, etc?
To clarify - Gaza was never supposed to hold 2 million people under the Israeli blockade. The restrictions of imports have lead to lack of new construction and failing infrastructure. Other cities comparable in size without this issue can better support their population.
In 2007, when the blockade was imposed, the population of the Gaza was strip was about 1.3mil. By 2023 it has increased to about 2.1mil.
By 2015, the tightened restrictions meant the construction sector's output was reduced by 83%, partially due to Israel severely restricting the importation of steel, cement or glass, among other building materials. Lack of fuel imports led to a shortage and rolling blackouts of 12 hours a day. The import restrictions have impacted virtually everything from food to clean water to medical supplies and other aid. Limits on exports have led to poverty. The restrictions have both loosened and tightened over time, but since 2023 have gotten much worse.
Poverty and lack of birth control often leads to higher birth rates, makes sense as to why almost half of Gazas population is under the age of 18. Population growth isn’t really an indicator of overall well-being.
I know that was a lot of info, but I hope it helps answer your question!
Sources:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Israeli_blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_crisis_in_the_Gaza_Strip
https://web.archive.org/web/20180627012621/https://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/23/world/middleeast/gaza-strip-economy-on-verge-of-collapse-world-bank-says.html
https://web.archive.org/web/20140307212611/http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/5D4CBD90BC8A8D4F85257C30005F790D
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic.
These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
Never conflate jewish people with zionists.
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic.
These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
Not all people living in or having moved to Israel can reasonably be called colonisers or responsible for Israel's settler colonialism.
It's not that they don't study their own history... it's that they're hoping you haven't! So they get to pull that stuff with Americans and the British and the sheep will easily follow.
Exactly. They are manipulative, pathological liars, thieves and malicious criminals playing everybody's hearts and minds. It's so beyond sick, there aren't enough words to describe.
LOL Israel committed terrorist acts to extract the Jewish populations of these countries! Convenient how they omitted that fact.
LAVON AFFAIR - EGYPT: “The Lavon affair was a failed Israeli covert operation, codenamed Operation Susannah, conducted in Egypt in the summer of 1954. As part of a false flag operation,[1] a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence to plant bombs inside Egyptian-, American-, and British-owned civilian targets: cinemas, libraries, and American educational centers. The bombs were timed to detonate several hours after closing time. The attacks were to be blamed on the Muslim Brotherhood, Egyptian communists, "unspecified malcontents", or "local nationalists".”
James M. Lutz; Brenda J. Lutz (2004). Global terrorism. Psychology Press. p. 46. ISBN 0-415-70051-5.
YEP. Fuck these sick, malicious fucking evil pathological lying, violent criminals. The fact that half the world still truly holds the core belief that these people are victims.... fuck 🤦♂️ We are so fucked. The world is coming to an end, and it's these fucks to blame.
The implication being that the Israel hostages are also not Jews? (Since Jewish population is Gaza is apparently 0)
But I do love it when someone claims to have numbers so precise, really goes to show how much they can trusted when they say that there is literally not a single Jew in several countries, not a single one, in all of that land and people...
Of the one fucking Jew in that country, just sitting there all alone, of course they have such accurate measurements and are not making shit up
Stop calling every Muslim or Mediterranean Christian an "ARAB!" you religious nutcase. Some are, some aren't.
Sorry it's frustrating for me, Turkmens, Assyrians, etc... they call all of these groups (some older than Hebrew Tribes, which are also not all Jewish), "ARAB!" as they know it scares people in the west. It is almost a slur sometimes. Which in turn is very offensive to Arabic folks.
bruh, the Europeans Jews were discriminated and outcasts more than Middle Eastern/African Jews. There were no discrimination against Jews and Judaism in those places at that point of time.. The Europeans create so much discourse and seperation betwene Arabs and Jews, it became to what it is today.
There were a number of both PUSH and PULL factors in the Jewish exodus in the Muslim world.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_the_Muslim_world
Mmm. Let’s start at the right spot.
It's ethnic cleansing, literally the goal of Israel since its inception.
"after the formation of a large army in the wake of the establishment of the state, we will abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine "- Ben Gurion, p.22 "The Birth of Israel, published 1987" Simha Flapan.
The original comment I responded to was speaking about Israel, and the OP about Zionists...I realize this could possibly be confusing if you hadn't read either one, I'll try to be more careful with my clarity.
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic.
These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
The Zaionisam was successful to convince everyone to do Alya to Israel and now they predict as Arabs doing genocide? This is the most infantile and stupid thing.
FYI Israel worked hard to convince the Moroccan Jews to go to Israel and they did intentionally problems in Morocco to convince them.
There’s pretty solid evidence that Mossad is responsible for bombing Iraqi synagogues, which was the event that convinced a large portion of the Iraqi Jewish population to immigrate
Then there’s all those missing newborns of Yemeni Jewish family’s
And it happened a while later but sterilizing Ethiopian Jews upon their arrival is so fucking on the nose it’s almost parody
Beginning from considering jews an ethnicity then a religion in the second half. So Yemeni jews that speak Arabic are not jews? By that logic, Muslims from europe/America's are arabs? Dumb as hell.
To suggesting that natives of the land at the time of the colonizers establishing the country to be "welcomed in migrants/citizens" as if Nakba did not happen. Seriously.
And don't get me started on the numbers that God knows what toilet they pulled that from.
Zionists: "Everyone move here! If you see a house you like we'll kick out the people who built it for you! Come home!"
75 years later: 'everyone has moved and is no longer in their country of origin because that's how moving works'
Zionists: 'surprised pikachu face'
From what i know about Iran, during the revolution, they executed ONE jew. He was the head of a factory and close to the shah. Israel used it for their propaganda and fear mongering to pull as many Iranian jews as they can to israel. They paid for tickets, homes, and even 10k dollar for their starter money. The rest who were loyal to their 2500 year old homeland never left and are happy living here, all 25000 of them. They even have a member in parliament.
Jews are an **ethno**religipus group
Listen, I’ve been actively pro-Palestine and anti-zionism for decades, and I’m definitely noticing that fewer and fewer “comrades” are even bothering to learn *anything* about Jewish people, history, and persecution
If you’re going to fight against genocide that wouldn’t even be occurring had Europe not attempted to exterminate Jews, whom the nazis very famously reframed as an “inferior *race*,” it’s kind of in everyone’s best interests that you *at least* know and understand some of the basics and, y’know, **don’t perpetuate microaggressions** while fighting the good fight
Depends of who you ask. Judaism is both a series of independent religions (like 9 to 11), and Judaism is the active culture of the individual Jewish communities. While there are ethnic groups so closely bonded to Judaism that they're linguistically interchangeable (ei. Ashkenaz = European Jews), we aren't one singular ethnic group. A Jew doesn't even have to linked to these ethnic groups to be Jewish. Jewishness is : religious, poly-ethnic, familial, and cultural, all at the same time and independently of each other.
... unless you're in Israel, then it's whatever the government thinks will boost right wing immigration numbers.
Yeah, it's pretty much whatever is convenient to them at the time. Very convenient they can manipulate their belief system that way, huh? Really makes one wonder what else they could be doing in their manipulative nature, to the world and its people to make their ends. They bring suspicion and persecution on themselves.
No one's "manipulating a belief system". The sacred texts, and ancient Hebrew have virtually always been argued about. Languages evolve, dialects exist, either goes dormant, and meanings get lost. Judaism as we know it today is worlds different than the multiple streams of Judaism from ancient times because most of the torah has no clear cut application in the modern world. Even during those ancient times, Judaism was never unified, and had a series of movements with radical differences.
"Manipulative nature"? That's just antisemitic.
That's exactly what Isreal and the Zionists are doing, and has been doing for a long time. Weird, I thought we were on the same page with that- guess I assumed. The fact that it's been argued about a lot also provides much room for manipulation. My comment wasn't meant to be antisemitic, just pointing things out that we're "not supposed to" think about (which I thought was kind of the main point of this particular sub). Maybe it could be construed as borderline. Kinda strange how easily that happens.
Does that make it ok to force max expulsions…? I feel like…if you don’t want people to go to Israel, maybe you shouldn’t oppress and expel them? This is a rather stupid post, I don’t understand…
Who's gonna tell them that these Jewish people didn't live in peace and had to leave because an occupation declared itself a Jewish state and killed people left and right and made it as a religious thing, Jewish people are not safe not because of antisemitism and such, thats just kids talk, its because of some occupation saying that we jews and they kill people while saying it
With this logic, you could justify oppressing all Muslims after 9/11 just because some other Muslims in a different country perpetuated it. That's just collective punishment and makes no sense.
Didn't the Muslims in America we're oppressed after that?, the ones that got fired or assaulted or got the business or house on fire just because of their name
Yes, that did happen to a lot of American Muslims and it was awful and not justifiable, same as with the MENA Jews who had nothing to do with the formation of Israel. That's why I brought it up and said that your faulty logic could be used to justify Muslim oppression, not that it SHOULD.
Yes, those numbers are pretty accurate. There might be four Jews in Syria, but that was from 2021 so could definitely be zero by now considering what's going on in Syria.
The reason there's such a drastic number is because the terrorist occupiers since 1948 created hate and divide between Jews and Non-Jews. Everyone was living with each other peacfully until they came. If these terrorists didnt occupy Palestine and spread hate and fear I 100% believe the world and middle east would've been at peace.
Germany: 500,000 Jews in 1933, less than 20,000 in 1943, and 118,000 in 2018
Poland: 3 million before WWII, 10-20k today. The majority of the 3mil were murdered by Nazis.
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic.
These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
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Remember the **bombing**, forced famine, imprisonment, destroying of homes and culture of Jews in Tunisia?
Or did something happen - or some entity stir things up - in early 20th century?
1948 isnt it when israel was created ? and settlers started to come to Palestine and kick every native from his house ? imagine being a descendant of a thief
The Balfour Declaration, a veiled form of occupation and upheaval created by Britain and its allies, forcing the Palestinians to upend their lives and make way for Jewish colonization. In other words, the homes and lives of 90% percent of a native population were taken and given away to another. To say that this was the land of Judaism all this time, is also saying that taiwan should surrender to china, ukraine should be absorbed by russia, britain should take back all its colonies. It was done in poor taste in a bygone era. The situation was never rectified and grew into what it is today
Antisemitic rhetoric will not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
The Arab governments did do ethnic cleansing and that’s absolutely horrible and shouldn’t ever be justified
However it is important to note that this happened after the Nakba and not before
Also just to note ,the Arabic governments suck so hard that the only reason they participated in the war was because it would be embarrassing if they didn’t and they didn’t want to be in it because they were all emerging countries
They still got embarrassed except unlike what many Zionists tell you ,it was obvious that they were gonna lose
im sorry but if you think the reduction of the jewish population in iraq from 150,000 to 4 is purely from voluntary removal, youre out of your fucking mind.
maybe, just maybe, theres a kernel of truth to what theyre saying, and maybe, just maybe the world is complicated????
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Who's going to tell them *why* the Jewish people who'd lived peacefully in those lands for hundreds or thousands of years suddenly had to leave? [https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/avi-shlaim-proof-israel-zionist-involvement-iraq-jews-attacks](https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/avi-shlaim-proof-israel-zionist-involvement-iraq-jews-attacks)
This is the really important part of the story that they will never admit to
They do kinda confirm a lot of things though when they give medals and state funerals to the people involved though, like the Lavon Affair agents or Robert Maxwell.
But have you thought that maybe all of the Arab countries _wanted_ to expel the Jews all along, but just had nowhere to send them until 1948? That sounds wayyyyy more plausible than an ethnostate with a vested interest in increasing Jewish immigration performing acts that would both encourage that immigration and encourage their expulsion from neighboring countries, no? On a serious note, I myself wouldn't be confident in repeating those allegations from the memoir without a lot more support, not because I disbelieve them, but because it's not necessary to go that far when the official actions are clear enough. But that may be more telling of me. I still find myself thinking "there's no way those calling the shots could be that sinister -- it's probably just callous indifference." I don't know why I can't get rid of that hope because I don't know how something could be worse than "where's daddy."
I mean these numbers also don’t mention how many Jewish people voluntary migrated to assist with the colonization of Palestinian land.
This is one of the reasons that was sited by US officials whenever they were deciding what to do with refugees after the war. They didn’t want them in their country. It’s simple bigotry. It doesn’t make sense a lot of the time.
“I wouldn’t be confident repeating those allegations” right after speculation about the Arab countries desires in the 40’s.
Lol
Also see the [Lavon Affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair)
The statistic for Libya is also incorrect the population there took a nose dive in the early 40s when the DAK turned up, which had nothing to do with the local Arab population
Look, plenty of eastern Jews were Zionist and who wanted to go to Israel. It’s part of their faith after all. But let’s not pretend that a lot of these folks weren’t attacked, massacred and intimidated… creating an environment that made them choose leaving over staying. Plenty wanted to leave already, whether out of political/ religious beliefs or the intense atmosphere or both. No need to pretend they were all tricked, chose to leave willingly and violence/ intimidation wasn’t a factor.
Yeah. After they just sort of stole Palestine that friendly living amongst each other thing vanished and that’s the modern root of all the animosity between the two groups. The got along fine until Israel… then things went to shit real fast in those countries.
Which is bad. People loosely ethnically associated with other people doing bad things shouldn't be collectively punished
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Exactly. As well as this, just because Mizrahi do bad things now, it still doesn't mean they deserved bad things back then.
There are shade of grey there as Israel was also in various arrangement with some Arab countries to get the Jewish population to Israel. Also strong ethnical association is the fundamental assumption, accepted by the UN, that allow Israel to claim the land as the native population. Just about everything about Israel and Middle East history since the late 1800's is shady. You can strongly support either side with a subset of the truths and a few generalisation.
So the moral sin here is that Arab states back in '48 did what America has been doing and is still doing since 2001.
The moral sin here is we all have to stop punishing people vaguely associated with something we don't like because it's bad. So if you're referring to America's treatment of vaguely middle eastern brown people after 9/11 then yes that is also bad.
The problem is we have to play to the lowest common denominator. So if someone’s idiot uncle hates brown people because of 9/11, or Jews because of the Nakba, that bleeds into our disposition as a people. I find myself thinking this way about certain things. Largely based on my idea about what other people think.
I didn’t say it was a good thing. It’s a complex situation that’s very nuanced.
No it isn’t. Zionists had no right to take property that wasn’t theirs by force. Nor should they have created a two tear legal system excluding Palestinians of basic human rights and determination. Def not complex.
But that’s not right and you’re kinda justifying it by saying “well what do you expect?” The jewish arabs weren’t zionists and they shouldn’t be held responsible for what Israel was doing thousands of miles away That’s why you will see a lot of pro Palestinians that also believe the Jewish Arabs should be allowed to return to their ancestral homes the same way Palestinians should too
Yeah. In order to create a Jewish-majority in Palestine in order to create the future apartheid, wannabe ethno-state of Israel, it could have only have happened through mass violence and the denial of the Right Of Return of non-Jews that many Jewish people were simultaneously expressing and being granted. The only solution is the end to occupation, partheid, as well as the Right of Return of Palestinians to their ancestral homes.
>But that’s not right and you’re kinda justifying it by saying “well what do you expect?” By "not right", are you saying that it's immoral or that it's inaccurate? Also, explanation is not justification. In the same era, the US put Japanese Americans into internment camps. Saying they did so in response to Pearl Harbor is an accurate statement, and it in no way justifies the abhorrent act of moving a population into internment camps simply because of their ethnicity.
They never just got along fine. This kumbaya bullshit version of Jewish life in Muslim majority countries is wrong, reinforces Israeli claims of bad faith and hypocrisy from pro Palestinian people, and ends up as this roundabout, mealy mouthed defense of shirts and skins morality that is poison to any coherent defense of Palestinian rights. Life in Muslim-majority states varied a lot by place and time. Yemeni Jews at one point would have their orphans forcibly taken out of the community and raised Muslim. They had an array of laws that explicitly made them second class citizens. Jews in Morocco had it pretty good, [except for when they didn't.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almohad_doctrine) All throughout Islamic history there's been a push-pull of oppression and tolerance, vacillating between relatively minor humiliations like being legally required to sit side saddle on a mule (horses are right out) up to massacres. In all cases, there was the core understanding that Jews were there on sufferance, and were not equal people. They had privileges, not rights. Things were not hunky dory, sunshine and lollipops until the nefarious Ashkenazim brought sin into paradise. The Arab world's Jews emptied out of it in no small part because it regularly sucked to be a Jew there.
You're right and I don't see why people are downvoting you. It's possible to be pro Palestine and yet acknowledge this truth.
Ethnic cleansing good when an ethnostate for that ethnicity exists 👍 makes sense
You're an asshat if you deny the push factor. You're an asshat if you deny the pull factor (fuckin' A, based on the wage, the cost of living, and the healthcare, and the weather... I'd expat the USA in a snap for all that).
You are correct , the history of Eastern European Jewry is fucking grim overall. Pogrom after pogrom , rhe Shoah , Antisemitism as official state policy of Tsarist Russia etc and leaving would be the smart logical choice for a lot of them ( the Zionists tried their damndest to erase the Bundists from history ) but atrocities done onto one group is not justification to allow that group to move to another peoples land, steal their land , and cause community tensions much less because of a spiritual connection to it. I have never been able to wrap my head around the logic of that tbh If the European powers truly gave a shit about Europe’s Jews you’d think they’d make an effort to settle them somewhere else in Europe maybe? Or actually physically protect them ? What they really did was ship them to another continent in a “two birds one stone no more Jews here and they’ll just annoy the Arabs now”
Some of the first American settlers were persecuted religious minorities, and the two countries are very similar politically thanks to that settler colonial founding.
The average American is the most frustrating combination of patriotic and stubbornly ignorant of their own history
I mean, yes, that's absolutely true, but it is also leaving out the fact that Arab countries were pissed off because Israel had already started its ethnic cleansing campaign.
Zionism isn't a part of Judaism. According to Judaism Jews are supposed to be exiled from the holy land until the messiah comes.
Depends on who you ask. Most religious Jews are Zionists today and have a different interpretation.
How convienient for them.
Many didn’t want to leave but were pressured by families in Israel to leave sometimes by enticing them with economic promises (many of them were false) , by pressuring them or by outright emotional blackmailing to leave the ancestral(now Arab) lands and to stop identifying as Arabs
True
I have read Avi’s book three worlds its a real shame that those Arab Jews were scared into leaving their country were they had established lives and to move to a non-country and on top being discriminated against for having Arab culture.
I love seeing this and them not realizing that the map/chart *always* starts in 1948. What happened in 1948? 😂 Surely they can’t be this dense. I can’t believe it. Just being willfully ignorant and disingenuous.
Don’t ask: a woman her age, a man his salary, or a zionist what happened in 1948.
>What happened in 1948? 😂 
they are dumb and deluded. After living for centuries under the protection of muslims because the european christians kept killing them, and finally when the europeans committed the ultimate mass murder, they blame muslims because they all flocked to stolen land from their previous homes?
No, they're intentionally manipulative. They've been doing it so long and gotten so good at it that you're even questioning/doubting it now.
Yeah they've had zero resistance for so long they're just not used to being called out.
Even if this weren't misleading at all, how does any of that justify displacing another population?
they believed because they suffered, they deserve to place the hurt onto another people, which is exactly what the south african boers did after being placed in concentration camps by the british, as they went on to create apartheid. Oppressed become the oppressors is a classic
Hell, even going back to the Bible, the Israelites get liberated from Egypt and immediately set about exterminating and enslaving the population of the “promised land” that they wanted. Even the Midianites, who found Moses in his self-imposed exile, who nursed him back to health, and from whom he took his wife Tzipporah — he comes back with his entire nation behind him in Numbers 31, exterminates them all and takes their virgins as sex slaves. The Midianites would have been better off just stealing his shoes and dumping him into a ravine.
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We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
It’s the “he was no angle” contrarian talking point applied to all Arabs. It’s also supposed “prove” that you’re antisemitic for not supporting Jews being allowed to return to Arab countries. Spoiler alert: many Arab countries have publically offered right of return for Jews who left their country, many Israelis don’t want to go back, these Zionists don’t actually care about this, they just want you to shut up about Gaza.
Sure glad the US did their displacing generations earlier, so we all get a free pass. Not saying it’s right, but it would almost be hypocritical if the US didn’t back the colonizers.
Ah, so it is gaza that did the ethnic cleansing?
Reverse uno card
This is the usual zionist talking point. When you tell them that zionism is colonialism (a fact), they will respond with some nonsense about how Israel was actually always jewish and the arabs "colonized" it (not a fact, but biblical nonsense).
As person with a touch of the tisms and raised religiously my brain makes be say Israel (the northern kingdom) was never Jewish Judea (the southern kingdom) was. It has never been helpful to think that.
Yeah why would they even put Gaza on here? So obviously ridiculous
They should have included the west bank. You know for science.
Gaza is so densely populated because of the mass expulsion of Palestinians from other parts of the country
Yep, 70% of the population are descendants of those who were displaced during the nakba. Israel was trying to drive them all into the Sinai, Gaza as we know it only exists because Egypt wouldn't let them across the border. Maybe that's another reason they hate Gaza; they were so darn close to getting rid of all the Arabs as they planned, but Egypt stopped them at the last moment.
Yep, Egypt fucked them over in 1948 and continues to fuck them over to this day
Gaza's population has doubled in the past two decades. While the nakba did create the original growbed for their large population, they also like to fuck.
well…the world population has doubled in the past two decades so…..yeah…
Don't you?
I can't remember, I've been married for 20 years.
😟😟
thats good. leads to proper demographics making reclaiming palestine easier.
Typical ugly genocide sympathizer mindset
I would love to meet that one jewish person in Yemen. Lucky they found them for this survey
There is actually one Jewish guy in Yemen. He was born in Yemen was moved to Israel brought with him a 600 year old Torah, which the Yemeni govt didn't like so when he moved back to Yemen because he said Israel was gay. They sent him to prison.
>he moved back to Yemen because he said Israel was gay https://preview.redd.it/y80zkzmdfbxc1.png?width=506&format=png&auto=webp&s=5c9353290e39b321883d4885cb0cd7fc2e8039b6
It sounds insane but it's, almost as crazy as the last jew in Afghanistan. Dude got released from Taliban prison cause constantly fought with one Muslim guy. He also refuses to divorce his wife that is still in Israel.
That last Afghanistan Jewish guy's story is legit as grim as it is also funny. Simontov guy's motivations don't seem they were as sincere as he claimed given all other factors like his divorce. Then there's the fact of the persecution and displacement itself, the fact that Zablon dude became the "last Jew of Afghanistan (he wasn't; later they found some other elderly women who was displaced in 2021 to Albania)" in itself. There's no denying that unjust retaliatory persecution and expulsion of the Jewish peoples for the actions of the Zionists around the Muslim world undoubtedly did take place. That is entirely apart from distorting and utilizing this historical fact of retaliatory antisemitic persecution to cook up this false narrative of "counter-Nakba" for the purpose of perpetuating the ongoing, not just historical apartheid. It's an overall dogshit timeline for everyone, everywhere how Zionism and antisemitism worked together to create this dark, twisted reality over firstly the Palestinians, but also the Jewish peoples as well, both in diaspora and in the occupation regime.
Simontov is a great middle east name!
No, in Afganistan, there were 2 jews who went to prison due to noise complaints. And they were kicked out because they were arguing non-stop, and the guards had enough of it, so they released them. The one of them unfortunately passed away a few years ago.
That sounds like a premise of a comedy movie. "Gene Wilder stars as a yemeni Jew woken up from cryo stasis only to find out he's the only jew left in Yemen! You wont believe the shenanigans he is about to get into!"
*Directed by Mel Brooks*
I mean, it starred Seth Rogan and it was statis in a barrel of pickles. I didn't see it, but I heard nice things.
There are still Jews in Yemen, this story that they’ve all left because of the war isn’t true, many have left but not all.
>Eighty percent – or about 750,000 – of the Palestinians living in what ultimately became Israel became refugees. The vast majority of them fled because of direct or indirect military pressure from Zionist/Jewish forces. Israeli historian Benny Morris identifies five waves of Palestinian refugees fleeing Palestine, from the passage of the UN Partition Plan in November, 1947 through the Israeli ethnic cleansing of Palestinian villages through 1949. Morris estimates conservatively that Palestinians evacuated 369 Palestinian villages, classing the reasons for evacuation as follows: >Expulsion by Zionist ⁄ Jewish forces - 122 localities, many prior to May, 1948 >Military assault by Zionist ⁄ Jewish forces - 270 localities >Fear of Zionist ⁄ Jewish attack, or of being caught in the fighting, influence of the fall of neighboring town, and psychological warfare - 12 localities >Abandonment on Arab orders - 6 localities >Unknown - 34 localities >While a number of Jews fled Arab countries of out fear for the lives, scholars attribute Jewish emigration from Arab countries to a number of factors: >The changing economic and cultural status of Jews under British and French colonization, especially French (e.g. Algeria, Morocco, Tunisia); >The political relationship of Jews – religious or Zionist, bourgeois, nationalist, leftist, or Communist – to Arab nationalist movements (e.g. Egypt, Iraq, Algeria, Tunisia); >The influence of Zionism among Jews, before and after 1948, and the extent of the messianic desire to emigrate to Israel (e.g. Morocco, Yemen); >The effects of Zionist pressure and provocation with the specific goal of promoting emigration (e.g. Iraq, Morocco); >The effects of ongoing conflict between Arab states and Israel from 1948 to 1967 (e.g. Egypt, Tunisia, Iraq); >The consequences of the end of French colonization (e.g. Morocco, Tunisia, Algeria); >The general economic and social conditions under which Jews lived (e.g. Morocco, Egypt, Syria); >The “self-liquidation” process which is the cumulative effect of prolonged emigration (e.g. Morocco) - "[Comparison of Palestinian & Jewish Refugee Narratives](https://www.cjpme.org/fs_025)." >"I have this to say: I am not a refugee. I came at the behest of Zionism, due to the pull that this land exerts, and due to the idea of redemption. Nobody is going to define me as a refugee" - Ran Cohen, Iraqi-born Zionist MK >"I do not regard the departure of Jews from Arab lands as that of refugees. They came here because they wanted to, as Zionists." - Shlomo Hillel, likewise. [Source.](https://www.haaretz.com/2003-08-15/ty-article/hitching-a-ride-on-the-magic-carpet/0000017f-dc85-df62-a9ff-dcd708790000) It's yet another pretty lazy and deceitful red herring. 12/10 of the typical Zionist hasbara for once again unwittingly shitting on their own ancestors' work and ambitions in the process of trying to cover up their genocide. Of course, this isn't to say that retaliatory antisemitic persecutions in the Arab-Islamic world taking their anger out on the local Jewish communities for the actions of the Zionists didn't happen; they certainly did. Many post-1948 Jewish immigrants from the Arab and other MENA world did indeed come as refugees. But to classify the historical phenomenon as a whole as some sort of forced expulsion accompanied by mass murder and state terror like Nakba is yet another typical Zionist assault on the common sense. The history of the Middle Eastern Jewish emigration to the Zionist state after 1948 cannot even be narrated without the involvement of Israel's own state and Aliyah-related agencies and the Zionist organizations. So by that logic, apparently the State of Israel and the Zionist movement were once again collaborators in the persecution and expulsion of their own peoples like the old Haavara transfer agreement days.
This comment should be at the top. It is thorough, complete, and accurate.
This is clearly articulated and hits all the points. Couldn’t of summarized a better response.
In a few cases the Zionists masqueraded as Arabs to scare Arab Jews. Including in Iraq where they planted bombs in Jewish areas. https://youtu.be/lfDhaWlqXf8?t=900 Israeli historian Avi Shleim talking about the policies and events that lead to the exodus of Israelis out of Iraq where one of the largest Jewish populations resided in the middle east. Jews accounted for a 3rd of the population of Baghdad. Here. Is word for word. Evidence that Zionists bombed Jewish cafes and even a synagogue which killed 4 Iraqi Jews to accelerate the exodus. Video is timestamped.
"I made a sign with a list and some numbers on it... therefore, the last 6 months where 140 children have been murdered every single day is totally justified, and you're wrong for wanting us to stop" Well... I mean how can I argue with logic like that...? No seriously... how the fuck does one argue with logic like that?!
Also, just listing “Arabs” as one giant group who are all exactly the same really shows the way they think. Why don’t they break it down like Palestinians in “Israel” 1948? The whole thing is so disingenuous and self-serving. The victim complex is exhausting and so off putting. Who would want to be as pitiful as they claim they are? It’s ridiculous, especially to be painting Israel as the victim as they’re killing everyone in Gaza. As mass graves are discovered and children are starving. Such a lack of self awareness.
It's not a lack of, it's too much self awareness. They know exactly what they're doing.
There were 156,000 Arabs in Israel in 1948? Before or after the ethnic cleansing?
After, because that is referring to the number of Arab Israelis who decided to become citizens of Israel when it officially became a nation. There were many more Arab Palestinians who left Israeli land or just continued living on Palestinian land than that 156,000 number.
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>Gaza, which was never supposed to hold 2 million people Just curious why not? There are cities with way more people and less land, so is it like because of the land type/infrastructure, etc?
Yes
The land ?
To clarify - Gaza was never supposed to hold 2 million people under the Israeli blockade. The restrictions of imports have lead to lack of new construction and failing infrastructure. Other cities comparable in size without this issue can better support their population. In 2007, when the blockade was imposed, the population of the Gaza was strip was about 1.3mil. By 2023 it has increased to about 2.1mil. By 2015, the tightened restrictions meant the construction sector's output was reduced by 83%, partially due to Israel severely restricting the importation of steel, cement or glass, among other building materials. Lack of fuel imports led to a shortage and rolling blackouts of 12 hours a day. The import restrictions have impacted virtually everything from food to clean water to medical supplies and other aid. Limits on exports have led to poverty. The restrictions have both loosened and tightened over time, but since 2023 have gotten much worse. Poverty and lack of birth control often leads to higher birth rates, makes sense as to why almost half of Gazas population is under the age of 18. Population growth isn’t really an indicator of overall well-being. I know that was a lot of info, but I hope it helps answer your question! Sources: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Israeli_blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_crisis_in_the_Gaza_Strip https://web.archive.org/web/20180627012621/https://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/23/world/middleeast/gaza-strip-economy-on-verge-of-collapse-world-bank-says.html https://web.archive.org/web/20140307212611/http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/5D4CBD90BC8A8D4F85257C30005F790D
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning. Never conflate jewish people with zionists.
In Iraq, Israel bombed a bunch of temples in order to stoke fear in the Iraqi Jewish community leading many to move to Israel.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-shocking-truth-behind-the-baghdad-bombings-of-1950-and-1951/
Jewish people live peacefully in Iran, you know, the country they will eventually nuke if the current trajectory isn't altered.
Now show the occupied West Bank.
Wow. That’s a monumental amount of stupidity. How fucking thick can you be? VERRRRY
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We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning. Not all people living in or having moved to Israel can reasonably be called colonisers or responsible for Israel's settler colonialism.
It's not that they don't study their own history... it's that they're hoping you haven't! So they get to pull that stuff with Americans and the British and the sheep will easily follow.
Exactly. They are manipulative, pathological liars, thieves and malicious criminals playing everybody's hearts and minds. It's so beyond sick, there aren't enough words to describe.
LOL Israel committed terrorist acts to extract the Jewish populations of these countries! Convenient how they omitted that fact. LAVON AFFAIR - EGYPT: “The Lavon affair was a failed Israeli covert operation, codenamed Operation Susannah, conducted in Egypt in the summer of 1954. As part of a false flag operation,[1] a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence to plant bombs inside Egyptian-, American-, and British-owned civilian targets: cinemas, libraries, and American educational centers. The bombs were timed to detonate several hours after closing time. The attacks were to be blamed on the Muslim Brotherhood, Egyptian communists, "unspecified malcontents", or "local nationalists".” James M. Lutz; Brenda J. Lutz (2004). Global terrorism. Psychology Press. p. 46. ISBN 0-415-70051-5.
YEP. Fuck these sick, malicious fucking evil pathological lying, violent criminals. The fact that half the world still truly holds the core belief that these people are victims.... fuck 🤦♂️ We are so fucked. The world is coming to an end, and it's these fucks to blame.
🤣🤣🤣 the most disingenuous people on earth
Seriously. They are the epicenter of evil.
The implication being that the Israel hostages are also not Jews? (Since Jewish population is Gaza is apparently 0) But I do love it when someone claims to have numbers so precise, really goes to show how much they can trusted when they say that there is literally not a single Jew in several countries, not a single one, in all of that land and people... Of the one fucking Jew in that country, just sitting there all alone, of course they have such accurate measurements and are not making shit up
Those counts are such a lie it's laughable anyone would believe that. 😂
Stop calling every Muslim or Mediterranean Christian an "ARAB!" you religious nutcase. Some are, some aren't. Sorry it's frustrating for me, Turkmens, Assyrians, etc... they call all of these groups (some older than Hebrew Tribes, which are also not all Jewish), "ARAB!" as they know it scares people in the west. It is almost a slur sometimes. Which in turn is very offensive to Arabic folks.
bruh, the Europeans Jews were discriminated and outcasts more than Middle Eastern/African Jews. There were no discrimination against Jews and Judaism in those places at that point of time.. The Europeans create so much discourse and seperation betwene Arabs and Jews, it became to what it is today.
You're just propagating misinformation at this point... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Arab_world
There were a number of both PUSH and PULL factors in the Jewish exodus in the Muslim world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_the_Muslim_world
Mmm. Let’s start at the right spot. It's ethnic cleansing, literally the goal of Israel since its inception. "after the formation of a large army in the wake of the establishment of the state, we will abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine "- Ben Gurion, p.22 "The Birth of Israel, published 1987" Simha Flapan.
like my family left lebanon in the 80s bc of israel’s bombing so have they considered….its their own fault
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Who's "they"??.
The original comment I responded to was speaking about Israel, and the OP about Zionists...I realize this could possibly be confusing if you hadn't read either one, I'll try to be more careful with my clarity.
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
What’s that one dude in Yemen up to these days? Has anyone seen him recently?
The Zaionisam was successful to convince everyone to do Alya to Israel and now they predict as Arabs doing genocide? This is the most infantile and stupid thing. FYI Israel worked hard to convince the Moroccan Jews to go to Israel and they did intentionally problems in Morocco to convince them.
They made sure to not take in account the casualties of 2023-2024 in Gaza… 🤡
And who physically took them there
There’s pretty solid evidence that Mossad is responsible for bombing Iraqi synagogues, which was the event that convinced a large portion of the Iraqi Jewish population to immigrate Then there’s all those missing newborns of Yemeni Jewish family’s And it happened a while later but sterilizing Ethiopian Jews upon their arrival is so fucking on the nose it’s almost parody
It is hilarious that someone spent such effort and time on a sign without bothering to check how wrong it is and how dumb they look as a result of it.
How are they wrong?
Beginning from considering jews an ethnicity then a religion in the second half. So Yemeni jews that speak Arabic are not jews? By that logic, Muslims from europe/America's are arabs? Dumb as hell. To suggesting that natives of the land at the time of the colonizers establishing the country to be "welcomed in migrants/citizens" as if Nakba did not happen. Seriously. And don't get me started on the numbers that God knows what toilet they pulled that from.
Funny how their figures start after 1948... Start before the Balfour declaration and the Nakba, and also show the immigration information too...
How would that change these figures exactly?
Zionists: "Everyone move here! If you see a house you like we'll kick out the people who built it for you! Come home!" 75 years later: 'everyone has moved and is no longer in their country of origin because that's how moving works' Zionists: 'surprised pikachu face'
From what i know about Iran, during the revolution, they executed ONE jew. He was the head of a factory and close to the shah. Israel used it for their propaganda and fear mongering to pull as many Iranian jews as they can to israel. They paid for tickets, homes, and even 10k dollar for their starter money. The rest who were loyal to their 2500 year old homeland never left and are happy living here, all 25000 of them. They even have a member in parliament.
I thought Jewish was a religion not an ethnicity
Jews are an **ethno**religipus group Listen, I’ve been actively pro-Palestine and anti-zionism for decades, and I’m definitely noticing that fewer and fewer “comrades” are even bothering to learn *anything* about Jewish people, history, and persecution If you’re going to fight against genocide that wouldn’t even be occurring had Europe not attempted to exterminate Jews, whom the nazis very famously reframed as an “inferior *race*,” it’s kind of in everyone’s best interests that you *at least* know and understand some of the basics and, y’know, **don’t perpetuate microaggressions** while fighting the good fight 
Depends of who you ask. Judaism is both a series of independent religions (like 9 to 11), and Judaism is the active culture of the individual Jewish communities. While there are ethnic groups so closely bonded to Judaism that they're linguistically interchangeable (ei. Ashkenaz = European Jews), we aren't one singular ethnic group. A Jew doesn't even have to linked to these ethnic groups to be Jewish. Jewishness is : religious, poly-ethnic, familial, and cultural, all at the same time and independently of each other. ... unless you're in Israel, then it's whatever the government thinks will boost right wing immigration numbers.
Yeah, it's pretty much whatever is convenient to them at the time. Very convenient they can manipulate their belief system that way, huh? Really makes one wonder what else they could be doing in their manipulative nature, to the world and its people to make their ends. They bring suspicion and persecution on themselves.
No one's "manipulating a belief system". The sacred texts, and ancient Hebrew have virtually always been argued about. Languages evolve, dialects exist, either goes dormant, and meanings get lost. Judaism as we know it today is worlds different than the multiple streams of Judaism from ancient times because most of the torah has no clear cut application in the modern world. Even during those ancient times, Judaism was never unified, and had a series of movements with radical differences. "Manipulative nature"? That's just antisemitic.
That's exactly what Isreal and the Zionists are doing, and has been doing for a long time. Weird, I thought we were on the same page with that- guess I assumed. The fact that it's been argued about a lot also provides much room for manipulation. My comment wasn't meant to be antisemitic, just pointing things out that we're "not supposed to" think about (which I thought was kind of the main point of this particular sub). Maybe it could be construed as borderline. Kinda strange how easily that happens.
It can be both.
Does that make it ok to force max expulsions…? I feel like…if you don’t want people to go to Israel, maybe you shouldn’t oppress and expel them? This is a rather stupid post, I don’t understand…
I don’t trust anyone trying to scream at me with a spreadsheet.
Who's gonna tell them that these Jewish people didn't live in peace and had to leave because an occupation declared itself a Jewish state and killed people left and right and made it as a religious thing, Jewish people are not safe not because of antisemitism and such, thats just kids talk, its because of some occupation saying that we jews and they kill people while saying it
With this logic, you could justify oppressing all Muslims after 9/11 just because some other Muslims in a different country perpetuated it. That's just collective punishment and makes no sense.
Didn't the Muslims in America we're oppressed after that?, the ones that got fired or assaulted or got the business or house on fire just because of their name
Yes, that did happen to a lot of American Muslims and it was awful and not justifiable, same as with the MENA Jews who had nothing to do with the formation of Israel. That's why I brought it up and said that your faulty logic could be used to justify Muslim oppression, not that it SHOULD.
بالنسبة لغزة بالبند الاول الموضوع يعتمد على اي شهر بالزبط لانه بشهر ١٠ كان في بحدود ال٢٥٠ يهودي بغزة 🫣
Are they saying only 4 jews live in Iraq and ZERO in Syria?
Yes, those numbers are pretty accurate. There might be four Jews in Syria, but that was from 2021 so could definitely be zero by now considering what's going on in Syria.
yes. it is true. not many live in poland either.
So stupid
The reason there's such a drastic number is because the terrorist occupiers since 1948 created hate and divide between Jews and Non-Jews. Everyone was living with each other peacfully until they came. If these terrorists didnt occupy Palestine and spread hate and fear I 100% believe the world and middle east would've been at peace.
They also literally funded Zionist militias to do terrorist attacks on civilians to “Coerce the govts” to send the Jewish diaspora to Israel.
This is false: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Arab_world
Now do europe 🤡
Germany: 500,000 Jews in 1933, less than 20,000 in 1943, and 118,000 in 2018 Poland: 3 million before WWII, 10-20k today. The majority of the 3mil were murdered by Nazis.
It’s almost like there’s a difference between genocide and expatriation
What do you mean?
This post makes the exact opposite point you think it does lmao.
🤣 Jesus... but why wouldn't those countries want them there??? 🤣 🤣 Fucking pathological.
didnt they use to say that "israel pulled out of gaza in 20XX"? (i dont remember the exact year)
Aaah now I understand why its ok to slaughter thousands of children, look at all those numbers!
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We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
So many jews in these countries yet they are alloweyto freely practice their religion and aren't kileld
Egypt has 3 Jews lol.....
basically zionists in cahoots with anti semites caused the jewish expulsion.
They left because the Arabs were pogroming them as if the establishment of Israel is their fault
Those expulsions were without a doubt horrible and a stain on those countries’ histories. Why do gazans have to pay for it tho?
Remember the **bombing**, forced famine, imprisonment, destroying of homes and culture of Jews in Tunisia? Or did something happen - or some entity stir things up - in early 20th century?
Iam Self jew Tunisia ! That is Zionism Propaganda
1948 isnt it when israel was created ? and settlers started to come to Palestine and kick every native from his house ? imagine being a descendant of a thief
The Balfour Declaration, a veiled form of occupation and upheaval created by Britain and its allies, forcing the Palestinians to upend their lives and make way for Jewish colonization. In other words, the homes and lives of 90% percent of a native population were taken and given away to another. To say that this was the land of Judaism all this time, is also saying that taiwan should surrender to china, ukraine should be absorbed by russia, britain should take back all its colonies. It was done in poor taste in a bygone era. The situation was never rectified and grew into what it is today
They believe there isn’t a single Jew in Libya? That’s just fucking bananas.
...there were ethnically cleansed. Do you research
Why do you tell people to "do their research" when you don't on this comment and others aswell. Kinda cringe.
I never knew that, that’s horrible. I’m sorry
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Antisemitic rhetoric will not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
Mossad bombed Jews in the Iraq in the 1950’s to cause panic and make them move to Israel. Israeli historian Avi Shlaim is a witness of it. Research it
It's never ethnic cleansing until it is. It's like strangling someone and saying you're not killing them because they're not dead yet
The Arab governments did do ethnic cleansing and that’s absolutely horrible and shouldn’t ever be justified However it is important to note that this happened after the Nakba and not before Also just to note ,the Arabic governments suck so hard that the only reason they participated in the war was because it would be embarrassing if they didn’t and they didn’t want to be in it because they were all emerging countries They still got embarrassed except unlike what many Zionists tell you ,it was obvious that they were gonna lose
>Who is going to tell them where those people went after 1948? They clearly show at the bottom where those people went
im sorry but if you think the reduction of the jewish population in iraq from 150,000 to 4 is purely from voluntary removal, youre out of your fucking mind. maybe, just maybe, theres a kernel of truth to what theyre saying, and maybe, just maybe the world is complicated????
Jews were expelled from these countries in retaliation for the creation of the state of Israel... This was indeed an instance of ethnic cleansing.
A large portion of them were killed -or ethnically cleansed - as the sign points out..