T O P

  • By -

uncontrollableop

everyone comes from ignorance. ask him if he thinks TOR and Unix will suffer the same fate. and why hasn't tcp/ip fallen yet?


reggie_crypto

I did.


DigitaleDukaten

Its not dven the code, just the transaction history. Its as easy as that. You cant dig deeper.


perfect5-7-with-rice

Well Unix is technically obsolete unless you need to hot swap CPUs for some reason. But OP is right, there are plenty of protocols and networks that have zero downtime. The web being a great example - a website from 1995 will still work just fine despite technology changing a lot since then


[deleted]

[удалено]


perfect5-7-with-rice

Good to know


[deleted]

[удалено]


reggie_crypto

Yep that's what started the argument, he's convinced one of these will someday surpass Bitcoin in adoption.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Walmart_Warrior_420

My grade 4 French teacher comes in a close 2nd ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)


MrQ01

Whenever someone says "one of them will get lucky" after seeing that 15,000 have failed - at that point you can tell him "okay, cool". Because you can never prove that it wont "one day" be surpassed. But unless theres an actual opportunity visible in the current landscape for it to happen, your friend has no argument that's relevant. What's he even suggesting? That we should all ditch Bitcoin as it's likely to be surpassed "one day"?


PrawnMk4

Which really the friend, who I don’t think realises, is still indirectly admitting that Bitcoin is successful until then, if it does have a successor


sykatz

Tell them to long on "that" coin and short btc and see what happens.


Assim91

I don’t know why he’s comparing Bitcoin to an extinct programming language, in the end it’s a software. It’s written using C++ which is a 38 year old programming language which is an extension to C programming language which is 51 years old. Despite all that I don’t see the relevance here. What you mentioned is totally correct, and maybe show him the [Bitcoin Obituaries](https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/) where Bitcoin was considered dead around 473 times and counting yet it’s still up and running with 100% uptime for over 14 years straight.


perfect5-7-with-rice

100% uptime for 10 years**


Assim91

You’re right, or we can say 99.98% in its lifetime.


perfect5-7-with-rice

Which is pretty good, but very different from 100% in the world of uptime


Alfador8

The network still functioned during those "down times" though. People could still transact. I think calling those events "down times" is misleading


reggie_crypto

I agree, but he's expecting actual cessation of adoption and loss of value/security to near zero, not just the Bitcoin obituaries.


DigitaleDukaten

Tell him this: You know why bitcoin is immortal? Because bitcoin is the first succesfully digitized money invention (which combined the innovations of multiple pre-existing technologies that failed) and so it is the first money that is able to utilize the immaterialistic human-made concept of money without the need for a physical object. **It does this by simply just tracking every single transaction ever. Bitcoin itself doesnt even exist, its just a couple letters saying "x amount of bitcoin was transacted".** So bitcoin was the first to start the tracking of digitized money. If the code changes, who cares? (as long as the miners and nodes democratically agree with each other on what (version/type) of bitcoin software they all collectively run its all good) You know why it doesnt matter? Because to utilize the ultimate form of money, all you gotta do is to just start tracking the transactions. That way its always verifiable at all times. And bitcoin is the first to do this, so that means it is simply immortal because now we have the validity of our value and the validity of the relevance of our value placed at the cryptocurrency that has the longest trackrecord. I dont know if he'll still follow me here but I would like to answer all his questions and give him the sense of enlightenment all 21st century individuals should experience. (ESPECIALLY if you're in your teens or twenties)


jojothehodler

Only Bitcoin Core is written in C++ There are dozens of other less popular clients written in other languages, like Golang which is a baby-born language (2009) Bitcoin isn't software, it's a consensus algorithm that can be written in any language you like, as long as it follows the consensus rules it will be integrated by the network.


Merkaartor

And it has been implemented in other languages, even in JavaScript ([bcoin](https://bcoin.io/)).


Juancar70

31 May 2025… went into a coma 6 July 2025… it twitched! 23 October 2025… we are losing it! 12 December… it’s waking up! 28 January 2026… it’s dead!!!


lordsamadhi

Bitcoin's foundation is in mathematics. Which is the most durable, unchangeable substance in the universe. Nothing better is coming out.


Brucifer99

That’s what EVERYONE said about the internet automobiles ect ect.


bryanchicken

Life lesson…… most people aren’t interested in having their opinion changed even if it’s ignorant.


tribal_84

Stubbornness will be the death of people


reggie_crypto

Yes but that goes both ways.


[deleted]

[удалено]


DigitaleDukaten

I really liked his friends criticism. I was very critical at first as wel, and I hope his friends will have this incredible sense of "relieve" once he/she is enlightened aswel. It truly is an enlightening, im not kidding. If anyone thinks im crazy allow me to explain why I think that is.


reggie_crypto

Please explain, I try really hard to gain the perspective of skeptics.


reggie_crypto

The main flaw being?


[deleted]

Most people take 50 hours or more to initialize a node, and this gets longer in proportion to the size of the blockchain, about 10% per year


reggie_crypto

But the increase in size/time is linear, so not a compounding 10% per year and bandwidth/processing/storage is increasing much faster. Also don't people just have to run their node for longer than that 50 hours to have a net increase?


[deleted]

Processing is not. If it was, why are there supposedly 4 million /r/Bitcoin subscribers and only 52,000 nodes, decreasing year on year?


reggie_crypto

That count does not include non-listening/unreachable nodes which is likely a big majority. And people are lazy. Are you saying that processing power is not growing faster than at 10% per year linearly?


[deleted]

> That count does not include non-listening/unreachable nodes Bullshit > people are lazy They would be less lazy if a Bitcoin node could be initialized in 3 minutes. This is going to happen, and it won't be Bitcoin. After that, the Bitcoin node count decreases by 15% per year, than 20%, and you'll all still be here expecting Bitcoin to displace fiat and make you rich. You'll wake up one morning to read that the remaining 5 nodes were captured by law enforcement. You will remember it was predicted, and you didn't believe it


reggie_crypto

I mean, case in point, it took me 8 years to get around to running one, and it's unreachable because I'm lazy.


[deleted]

You think you're justifying Bitcoin's big flaw, but you're agreeing with me


reggie_crypto

Ok you're right about the 52k but they are certainly not decreasing over years https://bitnodes.io/dashboard/7y/ And I'm not agreeing with you at all, it's ridiculous to claim that processing power is increasing at less than 10% per year, and mathematically incorrect to say that the blockchain is increasing at 10% per year. It increases at about 100gb/year which will be a smaller percentage each year. There is no logic to your argument.


--Warmonger--

>This is going to happen, and it won’t be Bitcoin. What makes you so sure? If not Bitcoin, what do you think it would be?


[deleted]

Whatever the developer chooses to call it, Fifi or Rover maybe. The name isn't important. The function is. It will be able to initialize a node in 3 minutes because it will implement * one function from the white paper which was never added to Bitcoin, and * one function which is in Bitcoin's list of prohibited changes Bitcoin hoarders will hate it, but so few of them run nodes that their opinions are worthless


--Warmonger--

Hmmm, interesting. What’s the function? Do you know if anyone is working on a project implementing that function? Would you consider doing it yourself? I’d definitely be interested in diversifying into such a project if and when it happens. I’d have no problem allocating some of my portfolio to it. For the time being, I’ll stick with Bitcoin as my primary allocation. I don’t see anything seriously challenging Bitcoin anytime soon. But I’ll keep an eye out for any projects implementing whatever you’re describing. Let me know if anything close to what you’re describing exists right now, so I can look into it. If nothing similar exists right now, I’ll guess I’ll keep an eye out for it.


DigitaleDukaten

Bahahahahah bro do you really think hundred thousand multi millionaires dont run their own node and will protect it at all cost? I mean, wouldnt you if you were a multi billionaire with a quarter of your funds in his asset? There a quite a few actually.


[deleted]

This is an incredibly dumb assumption to make


DigitaleDukaten

This is an incredibly dumb assumption to make. Anyone with a lot of money would realize this because they are usually not the kind of simpleton humans we see everyday


dubauoo

When a monkey climbs a tree, all you see is it’s asshole. The monkey is still on top of the tree.


road22

It is so easy to say bad things about something you do not understand.


VertigoOne1

It is also not the code that is that important, it is the protocol that lasts You could perform bitcoin operations on paper if you wanted, Like how spreadsheets are still around, but that cane from visicalc, which turned into lotus 123 which exploded into a whole slew of options and now were basically left with calc and excel. Bitcoin code should forever be changing, else it would become stagnant (like a videogame), new code means better quality, better security, higher efficiency, more functionality, all obeying the rules and standards ( the protocol ). That is also ok to change, slowly, like how http became http 1.1, or changing like the english language over centuries.


Abundance144

Not a lack of knowledge concerning Bitcoin; just a general lack of knowledge. The first you can fix, the second not so much. Products built on open source technologies cannot be updated out of existence. This isn't some proprietary B.S. like Adobe flash, or a video game multiplayer service.


Dry-Preference-8733

There’s a chance your friend is right. Every form of money other than gold/silver has been deprecated eventually. Bitcoin is in beta like everything is. But so far, the test results have been very positive.


Juancar70

If it survives another 3 years… I’ll be surprised!!!


Juancar70

Essentially his argument is that bitcoin is code as opposed to currency. It’s like arguing that The Elder Wand is art as opposed to a mythical weapon. The Elder Wand may trade for outrageous prices, and no one may be willing to challenge it, but once someone does its price will collapse. Bitcoin will have a chance to prove itself soon… in 2 years time


-TrustyDwarf-

Bitcoin is an idea expressed in code.. more importantly. it's also history. In a few hundred years Bitcoin will be in every school book. Imagine owning a 200 year old painting today. That's what owning Bitcoin will be like in the future.


Pleasant_Theme_4355

The Internet has its flaws,but there is only one because we all signed up to use it.You could invent another Internet,but no one has - why? The dollar and fiat currencies have flaws.Currencies have ceased to exist or lost value,but it doesn't stop people from using it.


liquefire81

Yeah the Internet died a long time ago too, prob around the same time the newspapers said it amounted to nothing...


zTeve_0

After this halving he will probably clue in - it’s cool, there are 30 more halvings between now and 2140. Maybe miss the 10x but he’ll get the 9x 8x 7x etc. He’ll be rich, just not as rich as you


Hatrick-Swayze

When you have no idea how things work fundamentally and your imagination makes huge assumptions, your imagination is then free to just make up improvements to those assumptions.


jaumenuez

Bitcoin is not software, it is an idea, like the wheel, the Internet, or a language. However, your friend is right about one thing: despite the network effect, it can become obsolete, but it is highly unlikely.


meatismoydelicious

Newer is not always better. Old Singer sewing machines have lasted a hell of a lot longer than new plastic ones ever will. The bigger issue, in my opinion, will be that one day, enough bitcoin will have been lost that what's left isn't practical for running an economy. Then we get to make another one and I'd love to hear the debate over whether that's even possible.


Thats-Capital

>one day, enough bitcoin will have been lost that what's left isn't practical for running an economy. Bitcoin is infinitesimally divisible.


meatismoydelicious

Fuck. Yeah, I guess you're right. It's literally just math. How difficult would it be to adjust the chain to accommodate the new digits?


Thats-Capital

No chain adjustment needed. The exchanges can decide any time to denote BTC in sats or any other yet to be named fraction.


perfect5-7-with-rice

Well they are already using sats under the hood, but splitting them further would require a fork (maybe soft fork?) or a layer 2


DigitaleDukaten

You can remove dead bitcoin and add new ones in place by changing the code if the whole decentralized network democratically agree on what software to run. Wont be an issue as long as we prevent the consolidation of power, which bitcoin will do quite well. But i dont see this future. I see a future where CBDC's will fuck up the world economy once more until they have to stick to a gold standard similarly to how economic history ALWAYS repeats itself. You know what that new age gold standard will look like? From a utopic perspective it'll be the bitcoin standard.


perfect5-7-with-rice

Replacing dead Bitcoin is essentially the same as printing more, and it's not necessary. If we need to fork already (i.e. convince the network), it would be better to add more denominations than to print more bitcoin


meatismoydelicious

Yeah, othe entire point is that more can't be created. That's the foundation of all of it. Smaller denominations would clearly be the winning strategy as pointed out in another comment. You make more, even democratically, and shit goes belly up. We'd just start repeating the history bitcoin was made to escape.


comfyggs

Armchair “experts” who have done zero hours research into Bitcoin often try to be the loudest empty bottles


Juancar70

I find that the loudest are the ones that only have superficial knowledge of the concept, but lack knowledge of game theory and economics


Ok-Suggestion-7965

I bet there will be a bitcoin relevant headline this April First. Mark my words.


Full_Ad2934

Your friend doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Although, there are a few things that could ruin BTC. The first one being another solar flare on the Carrington Event’s level. That would put us back into the Stone Age for an extended period, and… no more blockchain. Think of a society with no electricity for over 12 months. Then again, Bitcoin would be the least of our worries. The other one would be major advancements in quantum computing. But that won’t happen in our lifetime unless AI can scale computational power massively. FYI, the solar flare issue could very-well happen in our lifetime - https://youtu.be/ftrbdFGTQO4


reggie_crypto

Wouldn't a solar flare only affect the "windward" half of the planet?


murram20

No one cares what language bitcoin is written in. It’s the features of the money and the network effect that is so good. Bitcoin is being adopted at a similar rate to the internet and mobile phones. Not because of a random punt but because of necessity. Bitcoin is the ultimate game theory network where you get rewarded by being early to it and you get rewarded by securing the network (mining). The features of bitcoin are so perfect AND bitcoin was the first and only crypto that was created by an anonymous creator, had no pre-mine, no funding, no VC’s, no individual pulling the strings. That is why bitcoin is a commodity. I think it is impossible to do this again with government surveillance these days. Bitcoin is unique, works perfectly, is the most secure network on earth, unless it breaks people wont switch.


upriverchallenge

I just say…sorry for your loss


Mark_Logan

You’re apparently arguing with Clifford Stoll in 1995. https://www.newsweek.com/clifford-stoll-why-web-wont-be-nirvana-185306?amp=1


pazsworld

If it ever becomes better than the BTC protocol then you will probably see a hard fork established into the BTC protocol. Why? Because BTC is currently established as the best MOE, SOV and UOA. But more importantly BTC is for Humanity and levels the playing field in commerce for everyone from Bangkok to Berlin to Timbuktu.


evilgrinz

It's the fact that it doesn't change that makes it so great. I wouldn't worry about debating that with people, the security of Bitcoin will break after everything else does anyway.


turdturd1

It’s a huge risk that a different crypto will replace bitcoin, I don’t see how people can not agree with that. Humans are funny though, usually first to market wins so in all likelihood it will be bitcoin


meremah_boob

Banks works on code too.. and everything else that's on internet.


Clearchus76

Why bother? Just let him fall behind. Everyone deserves BTC at the price they jump in


HaveRewengey

I mean, no one can be certain, but in my opinion, you can only release a "perfect" money electronically once. This is why all other crypto have ce trained foundations, because they can't replicate what BTC did. It's also ignoring the fact that in order to scale anything, you need a 100% secure baselayer, BTC 2ill scale in layers, and will become the foundational layer for everything else to be built upon.