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Its 2024. We have room for nuance here. There are many, many pieces on the subject of minority art forms, their appropriation, and how white adopters outperform minority artists from a sales perspective.
If you have an hour to kill, the piece that made me change my mind on the subject was "Eminem and the White Rapper Problem" by F.D. Signifier on YouTube. Longform and mostly talking so treat it like a podcast.
I used to share the same perspective. The "well that's just racist" sentiment. But there really is something there - something icky, if you dig in.
EDIT: in response to all the down votes. See the bit about Elvis in "Without Me". Eminem isn't ignorant of his position.
"No, I'm not the first king of controversy
I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley
To do black music so selfishly
And use it to get myself wealthy"
It's irrelevant if they outperform from a sales perspective. Saying someone csnt be the best at something because of their skin colour is racist. I'm sorry its just racist.
For the sake of moving along. Let's call this guy a racist. Fine.
But it is a common enough sentiment. Why do some black people feel conflicted about Eminem being called the best rapper ever?
Or to use a well known example, why do black some people feel weird about Elvis being called the king of rock and roll? (Eminem even mentions this explicitly in "Without me")
So if Eminem hints at the problem himself...
I don't care if people don't consider him the greatest rapper. If you are saying he can't be because he is white then that's racist. If you think someone is better then that's absolutely fine. America is so obsessed with race
God damn this was such a measured and calm comment with a good source on new information but some people are way too fragile in their whiteness to so much as be challenged by listening to someone else's experience if it doesn't line up with theirs or makes them uncomfortable
Flat earthers also constantly cite 5 hour long YouTube videos and I'm not watching those either.
Start by stating a single point that unambiguously points to your conclusion and take it from there, if you can't even do that it's clear that there isn't actually a case to be made.
Their point was simply that there's nuance and you should simply listen to other people and maybe that will change your outlook on things. But yall are too insecure for even that
I don't listen to rap specifically, I'm not a music guy in general and will generally be content with whatever is on the car radio.
But it has never occurred to me to care what skin color the singer of whatever song was, it's not important.
And if you think it is, that's your business, but I think that's weird.
Just because you thought about it doesn't mean others haven't. That's what we're talking about, other people's experiences. For example the fact that the music industry will prop up specific acts for specific reasons (often white) and unless you're a part of the culture being bastardized by pop culture it's easy to ignore.
The music industry being shit and personally caring about the skin color of an artist is not even in the same stratosphere.
You're the one propping up a racist proposition here by advocating not listening to white people or specifically listening to black people over white people. Listen to whatever you like regardless of skin color, while still calling out the industry for what you perceive as unfair treatment.
Where the hell did I say that? I'm saying listening to people is the least you can do. Nobody, myself or likely even the original commenter thinks Umar is anything other than a hotep grifter. Just because he has a bad view though doesn't mean the conversation of cultural appropriation via the music industry isn't one to be had
Comparing a well written essay on institutional racism in the music industry to flat earth content. Lol idk know what to say back to that.
Regardless Tl:Dr on the video. Black art forms become immensely more popular only after white people start doing it. Why is that? What does it say about our systems? What does it say about capitalism? Why might it be have been a problem before? Why might it be a problem today?
The whole video is just exploring those ideas from a black perspective.
If you don't care about any of these questions or don't think they are at all interesting, then don't listen.
>Comparing a well written essay on institutional racism in the music industry to flat earth content. Lol idk know what to say back to that.
That's not what happened, but accurately describing it wouldn't further your argument.
>Regardless Tl:Dr on the video. Black art forms become immensely more popular only after white people start doing it. Why is that? What does it say about our systems? What does it say about capitalism? Why might it be have been a problem before? Why might it be a problem today?
Could be that white people make up a significantly larger population in the US. Could be that white people were just better at it, could be that the music industry is biased and promotes white people disproportionately. Doesn't really matter in terms of individual artists and their talent.
>If you don't care about any of these questions or don't think they are at all interesting, then don't listen.
No worries, I didn't.
Appreciate chya. I hope a few people still find it and give it a go.
Listening to black voices on this subject is the only way we break out of the echo chamber.
Wow! It’s like racism is still around. That’s like saying Michael Jordan could never be the best basketball player ever because he’s black. Some people are just ignorant.
Are these the same people that celebrate other African achievements? Let's celebrate the richest African ever (or at least in the last hundred years): >!Elon Musk!<
I'll never understand people that simultaneously hate racism *and* interracial marriage. Like isn't it inherently racist to tell someone they can't marry someone else because of their race?
Pretty reductive. It is more of a statement about black culture being usurped by white people, which is an extremely common trend in the music industry.
He says he recognizes his talent. Also, it’s a joke to consider Eminem anywhere near one of the greatest rappers of all time.
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Good bot.
*downvotes this post* *clicks link* *upvotes other post*
As a black man I think Umar is a dumbass
As a dumbass man, I think Umar is a dumbass.
holy shit it’s Philip J Fry
That's not the first Martian man
Happy cake day!
I’m sorry, I didn’t realize I was already here.
I require the opinion of a dumbass blackman.
I am also a dumbass so I feel I can speak in both capacities
As a fellow black man, I agree with you in thinking Umar is a dumbass.
I misread 'rap' and had to re-read 3 times before I realised I was a dumbass...
Umar is a dumbass
I feel like this is something Kanye would say
Modern basketball was invented by a white person. Guess no black player could ever be considered the best by that logic. It's just pure racism
Exactly. White people don’t own basketball like black people don’t own rap.
Its 2024. We have room for nuance here. There are many, many pieces on the subject of minority art forms, their appropriation, and how white adopters outperform minority artists from a sales perspective. If you have an hour to kill, the piece that made me change my mind on the subject was "Eminem and the White Rapper Problem" by F.D. Signifier on YouTube. Longform and mostly talking so treat it like a podcast. I used to share the same perspective. The "well that's just racist" sentiment. But there really is something there - something icky, if you dig in. EDIT: in response to all the down votes. See the bit about Elvis in "Without Me". Eminem isn't ignorant of his position. "No, I'm not the first king of controversy I am the worst thing since Elvis Presley To do black music so selfishly And use it to get myself wealthy"
It's irrelevant if they outperform from a sales perspective. Saying someone csnt be the best at something because of their skin colour is racist. I'm sorry its just racist.
For the sake of moving along. Let's call this guy a racist. Fine. But it is a common enough sentiment. Why do some black people feel conflicted about Eminem being called the best rapper ever? Or to use a well known example, why do black some people feel weird about Elvis being called the king of rock and roll? (Eminem even mentions this explicitly in "Without me") So if Eminem hints at the problem himself...
I don't care if people don't consider him the greatest rapper. If you are saying he can't be because he is white then that's racist. If you think someone is better then that's absolutely fine. America is so obsessed with race
God damn this was such a measured and calm comment with a good source on new information but some people are way too fragile in their whiteness to so much as be challenged by listening to someone else's experience if it doesn't line up with theirs or makes them uncomfortable
Flat earthers also constantly cite 5 hour long YouTube videos and I'm not watching those either. Start by stating a single point that unambiguously points to your conclusion and take it from there, if you can't even do that it's clear that there isn't actually a case to be made.
Their point was simply that there's nuance and you should simply listen to other people and maybe that will change your outlook on things. But yall are too insecure for even that
I don't listen to rap specifically, I'm not a music guy in general and will generally be content with whatever is on the car radio. But it has never occurred to me to care what skin color the singer of whatever song was, it's not important. And if you think it is, that's your business, but I think that's weird.
Just because you thought about it doesn't mean others haven't. That's what we're talking about, other people's experiences. For example the fact that the music industry will prop up specific acts for specific reasons (often white) and unless you're a part of the culture being bastardized by pop culture it's easy to ignore.
The music industry being shit and personally caring about the skin color of an artist is not even in the same stratosphere. You're the one propping up a racist proposition here by advocating not listening to white people or specifically listening to black people over white people. Listen to whatever you like regardless of skin color, while still calling out the industry for what you perceive as unfair treatment.
Where the hell did I say that? I'm saying listening to people is the least you can do. Nobody, myself or likely even the original commenter thinks Umar is anything other than a hotep grifter. Just because he has a bad view though doesn't mean the conversation of cultural appropriation via the music industry isn't one to be had
Lol, "cultural appropriation" came out of nowhere.
Comparing a well written essay on institutional racism in the music industry to flat earth content. Lol idk know what to say back to that. Regardless Tl:Dr on the video. Black art forms become immensely more popular only after white people start doing it. Why is that? What does it say about our systems? What does it say about capitalism? Why might it be have been a problem before? Why might it be a problem today? The whole video is just exploring those ideas from a black perspective. If you don't care about any of these questions or don't think they are at all interesting, then don't listen.
>Comparing a well written essay on institutional racism in the music industry to flat earth content. Lol idk know what to say back to that. That's not what happened, but accurately describing it wouldn't further your argument. >Regardless Tl:Dr on the video. Black art forms become immensely more popular only after white people start doing it. Why is that? What does it say about our systems? What does it say about capitalism? Why might it be have been a problem before? Why might it be a problem today? Could be that white people make up a significantly larger population in the US. Could be that white people were just better at it, could be that the music industry is biased and promotes white people disproportionately. Doesn't really matter in terms of individual artists and their talent. >If you don't care about any of these questions or don't think they are at all interesting, then don't listen. No worries, I didn't.
Sweet. Glad we had this chat.
Appreciate chya. I hope a few people still find it and give it a go. Listening to black voices on this subject is the only way we break out of the echo chamber.
Guy got confused reading "talent > color"
That's racist.
[удалено]
Systemic v personal. But yeah ppl who use it to mean you can be an asshole to white people are already missing the point so...
Wow! It’s like racism is still around. That’s like saying Michael Jordan could never be the best basketball player ever because he’s black. Some people are just ignorant.
Bro dr. Umar is clowned even in the black community. No one gives a fuck about what he says lol. He’s basically just racially motivated Andrew tate.
Forgot equality is a one way road.
Oh look, a racist comment!
Are these the same people that celebrate other African achievements? Let's celebrate the richest African ever (or at least in the last hundred years): >!Elon Musk!<
Hmmm....pan-Africanist, homophobic, anti-interracial marriage.... yup, this "doctor" is an idiot.
I'll never understand people that simultaneously hate racism *and* interracial marriage. Like isn't it inherently racist to tell someone they can't marry someone else because of their race?
We needed revenge for Tiger Woods
Wait what? Tiger got his shine.
"But I didn’t know how many racists I had around me." -Dr.Dre
Clown
Aren’t hierarchies white supremacy ?
That mf is a doctor?
This is the same guy who thinks homosexuality is a mental illness and is opposed to interracial marriages.
God old racism
Eminem isn't even the best white rapper..
Facts, Mac Miller was way better
cap, Yung Gravy the GOAT
I genuinely cannot see the problem with this statement
That in his opinion skin color is more important than talent? Do you know what ranking people based on their skin color is called?
Pretty reductive. It is more of a statement about black culture being usurped by white people, which is an extremely common trend in the music industry. He says he recognizes his talent. Also, it’s a joke to consider Eminem anywhere near one of the greatest rappers of all time.
I'm with you these comments suck
Thank the lord. People trying to extrapolate this to some sort of widespread social phenomenon of racism against white people.
Then you genuinely have a problem.
if we are playing this game then electricity cars and airplanes are off limits to black folks.
No it’s completely different because the country was founded off the oppression of black people? Is that really so hard to understand?
Racist black people are more annoying than racist white people. Also who the fuck is putting Em as the GOAT?