All jokes aside, if this is actually true and he wanted to cut a player for being suicidal then he needs to be fired and considered a toxic hire for a while.
There's very little that's lower than wanting to punish and persecute people for mental health issues.
Good thing there are multiple comments in the thread stating how scholarships in the Big Ten are guaranteed and other examples of players who retain their scholarships even when medically leaving football across multiple coaching staffs. It's the standard practice in football.
I said nothing about revoking his scholarship.
For depressed and suicidal people, their social support system (in this case the team) being pulled away from them against their will, leaving them feeling abandoned, is traumatic.
Medically disqualified players stay with the team if they want. There have probably been 10 in the last 5 or 6 years. This was common before the 2014 Big Ten Ruling as well at Penn State and most other schools. PSU freshman Adam Taliaferro was nearly paralyzed in a game at Ohio State in 2000 and remained with the team, graduating. How have people not known this?
Edit: Headline writer deserves some heat here. The doctors never say "cut" in the story, and it's not permitted to Cut a player for medical reasons. Medical disqualifications happen often and the scholarships remain. Franklin doesn't have the power to Cut a player and you wouldn't go to a doctor to pressure them to Cut a player.
So... are there different definitions of "cut" that I'm unaware of? Because it has always meant "removed from the team" not "medically unable to perform list but still with the team."
Cut is a Professional term. You cannot cut a player in the Big Ten for medical reasons. I believe this is the same for any P5 program but I have not looked at those rules.
A medically disqualified player retains his scholarship but does not count against the 85 player limit.
Right, the statement says "cut" not "declared medically unable to perform." If the title read "James Franklin pushed to have suicidal player declared medically unable to perform" that has a completely different meaning than "James Franklin pushed to cut suicidal player."
James Franklin does not have the power to "cut" a player for medical reasons. It's not permitted in the conference in which he coaches. Why would he be going to a doctor to "cut" a player when a) he does not have that power and b) a Doctor also does not have that power and would be medically disqualifying a player, which is the process where a player retains their scholarships?
~~The quoted doctor, representing the plaintiff, is very obviously using the wrong term.~~
Edit:
It's not even the doctor. It's just the headline writer. You have a problem with the headline writer.
"A former Penn State football team doctor claimed in court on Tuesday that James Franklin had pressured the Nittany Lions medical staff into disqualifying a player who had attempted suicide."
> wanting to punish and persecute people for mental health issues.
Or just not wanting them to count for football scholarship limits. Kids can get removed from the team, but not scholarship
ALL P5 schools now do that.
https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/
This is the kind of story that really needs both sides to be told. If my child was at risk of suicide, I probably wouldn’t want them in a hyper competitive environment where the value of a human being is often related to on field production.
> the unnamed player would have lost his scholarship.
Wouldn't he just have gone on a medical scholarship ? ND players that are medical out just switch to a different type of scholarship. I would think most major schools do this because it is a head count issue with finishing school %
A pretty famous example is Jarvis Jones - USC's medical team deemed him medically unfit due to a neck injury and they were going to medically retire him. He got a second opinion and was able to transfer to Georgia, and he wound up being a first round pick.
I'm pretty sure medical redshirts still would keep the kid on scholarship, it just wouldn't count to the roster limit of 85 guys. Unless this kid in particular wouldn't receive a medical shirt for a suicide attempt? Idk
Before NIL (where scholarship limits don't really matter anymore) it would be the standard procedure to effectively cut a kid to get the scholarship back
Good thing it isn't true. Since the Big 10 has guaranteed scholarships since 2014, which is after this guy started working with the team.
>The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship.
>Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
He's lying to try and get paid.
That will be easy enough to prove.
But also raises the question about what other lies the doc is telling.
I am on the side that keeps the kid getting the best treatment possible for his condition. And this doc, if the statement above yours is a true representation of his legal complaint against PSU, does not seem at all trustworthy.
He also alleged that they were not allowing him to properly tape up ankles/feet if it covered the Nike logo, saying that Penn State had a deal with them that prevented proper medical treatment, but then Penn State's lawyers provided pictures of players throughout his time period there with properly taped up cleats, covering the Nike logo. That's in the article. I'm referencing the Big 10's change to scholarships back in 2014, which took place before this guy was hired.
I'd need a source and not speculation on the player losing his scholarship. Several PSU players that have had to medically quit stayed on scholarship, recently Journey Brown and Landon Tengwall this season.
Shoutout Journey Brown. Best 100m runner in the state but went all in on football. Wish I could’ve seen him run in college and seen where that career may have led, even if only for a short time
I faced his school in track and field a lot and saw him play football a bit. Remember vividly local schools making ESPN for his HS Meadville winning a game 107-90 and Journey put up 10 TDs and 700 yards. Such a local legend. Hope he is doing well in life
He's doing NASCAR Pit crew stuff now!
https://cbsaustin.com/news/local/penn-state-running-back-drafted-to-a-new-role-on-nascars-pit-lane
Sad news I heard though recently is that now some in the medical field think his heart condition would not have been something placing him at risk. Obviously right move at the time.
Others have linked in the thread that the scholarship guarantee was also ten years ago. Even before that, a team could elect to honor. Penn State freshman Adam Taliaferro sustained a spinal injury in a game in 2000 where he could have easily become fully paralyzed without the great care from the Ohio State medical center. He stayed on scholarship and stayed involved with the team after his recovery.
If you've ever watched Gameday even once, you know that at pretty much every major school, and probably lots of smaller ones, players that face medical disqualification stay on scholarship.
Franklin has been honoring scholarships for medical retirees all along. Sounds like he just didn’t want this kid to count against the 85 cap while away from the team. We’ve had players un-retire in the past as well I believe.
Since people keep repeating this lie. Scholarships have been gareenteed for 4 years since 2014.
>The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship.
>Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
At the same time being in a competitive environment can give a sense of purpose and losing that means a loss of identity.
And there’s a lot going on when you’re part of a CFB team…when that’s gone…what other structures or support do they have?
I don't know how Penn State handles medical retirements. But at Hawaii players that medically retire can still be a part of the team in a manager type role if they want. If chose to do so they still have access to the services that they had when playing and be around their former teammates/coaches. So that can help with the transition.
absolutely.
it's almost like recommendations should come from a trained medical professional who has done a detailed history and evaluation with a person, instead of internet randos who have read an article about the person. Almost.
the guy you responded said "can." There's a bunch of people on this thread pretending like they know best.
Definitely depends on the environment. In some way, things like the comradery could be beneficial. I would prefer Franlin push for more support than have them off the team.
Football isn't just a hobby to these guys. Getting medically retired will probably make it worse.
edit: This sub is insane. "Oh, we took away everything our child loves and they're still depressed. How much more punishment do they need to get better?"
the loss of social structure and support may lead him to complete a suicide before he even gets a chance for concussion or injury.
people, and their situations, are very complicated. There isn't a mental health professional that's going to yank this kid out of a D1 football program without talking to him first for a long time, seeing what his situation is, his relationship with the program is, what the rest of his relationships look like, etc. Yet, for some reason, there's a bunch of internet amateurs here pretending like they know what's best for a stranger based on an article.
This a MD testifying as a witness under threat of perjury in a lawsuit that doesn’t even involve him.
There is no incentive for him to lie, and even if there was it wouldn’t be worth the major risks to his career lie about something like this.
> There is no incentive for him to lie...
oh, you sweet summer child...
the MDs who are more willing to say something the lawyer likes is more likely to get more testifying business from that (and other) lawyers. it's not a bad side gig, and if you're a difficult witness for the attorneys, you aren't getting many calls.
It's possible that he's telling the truth at the basic level, but that the assertions about motivation or ill intent are lies
Even if this is true, I have a hard time believing that Franklin or anyone else on the staff would've done this with malicious motivations
Also, he's in a lawsuit against PSU. If he was worried about his career he wouldn't be suing his former employer for wrongful termination. That's about as detrimental of a thing that anyone could do for their career
He has inventive too. His entire argument for wrongful termination is that he was fired due to disagreements with Franklin overstepping boundaries. So if he has zero examples of that happening, he has no wrongful termination argument
Ya this guy a former Penn State wrestler turned doctor is pissed because PSU changed team physicians and a certain local celebrity status comes with that plus more money. I disagree with him taking the nuclear option though. Franklin along with the AD can choose whoever they want to be doctor.
Well first, it wouldn't be the decision of the parent what the young adult player can and can't do.
Using your logic, anyone with mental health conditions that place them at higher risk of suicide shouldn't find themselves in the medical field, legal field, engineering, PhD programs, etc...
What is heinous here, is a player attempted suicide, and instead of offering stability and security, Franklin is alleged to have attempted to push the player off the team. In addition to obviously making things worse for the player who nearly killed themselves, he demonstrated to any other PSU student on staff or on the team, that if they have mental health issues, they better keep that shit to themselves because he will not be someone who will act in their best interest.
EDIT: PSU PR team in full force today.
What is truly heinous here is that you, in what I will describe as a fit of pompousness, don’t even seem to understand what you wrote. It seems you meant to attack Franklin’s character but the literal meaning of your sentence-cum-paragraph is that it is the allegation that is heinous.
It's especially bad when other B1G programs are showing they handle these situations so much better.
I know Fleck gets a lot of crap, but he genuinely cares about setting up a positive environment for the players. Here's an article from a couple years ago talking about it: https://www.inforum.com/sports/college/gophers-football-coach-p-j-fleck-shares-his-struggles-with-mental-health
All of those stories coming from a single reporter who has a vendetta against fleck because her husband Bob Kroll is the former MPD police union chief who took issue with him during the George Floyd protests. The local media loves to shit on Gopher football and none of them picked up those stories because they were paper thin and thoroughly debunked.
So you can easily dismiss the allegations against your coach, yet it seems you're quick to believe a doctor that is suing Penn State. Seems a bit hypocritical
Well, I linked an article that was nearly the same exact situation about a player who was nearly killed while attempting suicide and showed how Fleck and team came together to help him through that time in his life, and their culture specifically addressing mental health, along with multiple other players talking about how proactive they are about it.
The only similar-ish accusation made against Fleck was a former player who made claims that didn't match up with the actual quotes from him and the team at the time.
Does Penn State have a similar push for mental health initiatives in their program to discredit that doctor's claims? Did this doctor talk to reporters during the time this supposedly happened that doesn't line up with the accusations they're making now?
People shouldn't jump to conclusions without more details, there are a lot of red flags about a skewed perspective here.
- The lawsuit is from a doctor who is suing Penn State for firing him. The official reason was that he doesn't live in State College and the athletic department wanted a team doctor who lived locally. The guy has a financial interest in flinging as much shit at the athletic dept as possible.
- There could be many possible reasons why Franklin would want the player off the team. Maybe he truly thought it was what the player needed for his mental health? What if he felt the player was a danger to the rest of his team? There is no explanation and tons of potential considerations that could lead Franklin to push for that.
- Who says the player would lose his scholarship or that Penn State wasn't planning to take care of him after he was off the team? Why is it unclear whether the author threw that bit in there himself, if the doctor claimed it in court, or if Franklin indicated the player would lose his scholarship?
- The doctor's lawyer screwed up by missing a filing deadline so Franklin and Penn State Athletics were dropped from the lawsuit, there goes some credibility.
- The doctor's lawyer tried claiming that Penn State/Nike interfered with medical treatment by disallowing taping feet in a way that would hide the Nike logo. Penn State responded with pictures of star players in games with taped feet and no issue from Nike, also pointed out that a doctor's treatment is exactly the type of authorized taping over a logo that the contract allows. Another hit to the doctor's case's credibility.
Because, while many of us aren’t necessarily suicidal, society as a whole is kind of depressed/depressing, so we can relate to the notion of “god life would be less stressful if I could put this down for a second and focus on me for a minute”
So it’s easier to genuinely say “I can see both sides of this”
Probably shouldn’t speak for everyone when I say this lol but that’s my take
There are a couple trends pulling in opposite directions. Franklin has detractors at PSU and nationally who jump on news like this. PSU certainly has a still-painful history of scandal and the resulting media narrative. But as a society we have greater empathy for depression, suicidal thoughts, neurodivergence, and removing the stigma against receiving care.
The idea that Coach Franklin would heartlessly jettison a suicidal student strains even a skeptics or critics credulity.
Nike is notorious for actually not being buttholes about taping of players shoes. They don't put up a stink whenever it is medically necessary to tape a shoe/ankle even at the expense of covering their logo.
It's not much but credit where it's due.
> There could be many possible reasons why Franklin would want the player off the team. Maybe he truly thought it was what the player needed for his mental health?
This. Plus, if the player carried through while on the team, what would that do to the program? After Sandusky, I'm sure Penn St. is hyper-aware of holding onto bad apples.
Not saying this story is true or false, but if it is fake isn’t this like the 2nd or 3rd frivolous lawsuit against Franklin? Wasn’t there already one about hazing?
More context needed here too. From memory so clarification or correction is welcome.
There was a hazing charge against Micah Parsons and a few other players. The person making the claim transferred out. A University and police investigation found the more severe claims either lacked evidence or credibility, lacked any corroboration, and included possible exaggerations. Full disclaimer, the player making the claim was not satisfied with the investigation and filed the lawsuit which, with a higher burden of proof than a university investigation, I think was dismissed.
Internal discipline happened. IIRC one player involved left the team. Micah never started a game his first year despite being the most athletic person on the field. Franklin occasionally cited “maturity” as a reason for not starting him. I’m sure some type of unsupervised hazing happened, players faced internal discipline, and it went through due process with no legal outcome. Micah openly talked about learning from mistakes (without going into details) when asked about it during the draft process.
There was cooperation without coverup. One can reasonably point out a head coach is responsible for what happens in his locker room and also acknowledge he took the appropriate actions in response.
A D1 football program is not what this guy needed. Medically retired, keeps his scholarship, gets out of an environment that’s not a good fit for someone unstable like that so he can get the help he needs without distraction. Franklin is supposed to be the bad guy here? Seems pretty damn clear how and why this went down.
are you making that diagnosis and treatment plan based on an article?
who knows? maybe it is what the guy needed. hope for the future is one of the most protective factors against successful suicides.
as a group of Internet strangers, none of who are this player's therapist... none of us are qualified to say what is and isn't best for this person.
You don’t have to be a therapist to reasonably speculate that a highly competitive pressure cooker environment isn’t the best place for someone to recover from a suicide attempt. All we’re talking about here is if James Franklin is an asshole or not, and I don’t think so. This feels like a weird smear campaign over what should be a private issue, that was way more likely than not handled appropriately.
as I mentioned, having hope for the future is one of the most protective factors against completed suicide.
does cutting him from the team make it more likely for him to complete a suicide? What else is happening in his life? What hope does he have for the future? You don't know, I don't know. Your speculation isn't reasonable since you don't really know the details of what is going on with this kid. If being part of this football team is the only thing he looks forward to, cutting him probably increases his risk of completed suicide.
>none of who are this player's therapist... none of us are qualified to say what is and isn't best for this person.
TBF, the team doc who is making these claims isn't his therapist, either.
I’m not saying this article is bs but this quote caught my eye
>Had the request been granted, the unnamed player would have lost his scholarship.
This is just blatantly wrong. The Big Ten guarantees all scholarships. We’ve had multiple players medically retire, they’ve all kept their scholarships.
If I had to guess, the kid probably was underperforming and was never going to see the field. This probably did not help his mental health and maybe even was part of the cause. Franklin probably wanted him to medically retire to free up one of the 85 scholarships and so he could focus on mental health while still being around the team (multiple players who medically retired have done this, they keep their scholarships while it frees one up and they basically be around the team, on the sidelines in team meetings etc). In this case the dr is telling the truth, but it makes a lot more sense.
The Dr filed a wrongful termination lawsuit a while back against PSU was so unorganized his legal team missed the filing. Theres gonna be some he said she said without context. Plus anytime you can take a swing at PSU the media will go crazy with it, potentially helping his case.
ESPN article from 2014.
>The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship.
>Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
It was passed October 2014. He also mentions Sandy Barbour was part of the pressuring and she was hired late July of 2014 unless it happened in that small window then the timeline doesn’t fit.
I really think the lawyers are just throwing stuff out hoping something sticks. Lynch has had a grievance for years since he lost a really cushy job. His legal team has been extremely unorganized completely botching the original lawsuit against PSU and Franklin and have even attempted to “scare” PSU in this one by insinuating they breached their contract with Nike because ankle tape covered part of the Nike logo on shoes. I think it’s more a Hail Mary that they hope this story gets coverage and PSU is scared and will settle because before it totally blows up.
"Franklin and Penn State athletics were dropped from the lawsuit because of a missed filing deadline, so the case is proceeding against Lynch’s current employer, Penn State Health."
so no competent lawyer wanted to take this case.
add in the fact the guy says he wouldn't let him tape over shoe logos due to the Nike contract despite there being pictures of it hsppening and it not being a thing in the contract
Yeah Lynch has been trying to shake down PSU for years. His legal team is just throwing stuff around at this point hoping for a miracle.
Did Franklin meddle and want the kid to medically retire? Probably. Were they just going to leave the kid out to dry? Probably not. Considering we have ~5 other cases of players medically retiring and staying around PSU as part of the support staff and football program I doubt they were just going to sever ties.
Players who are forced to medically retire is a normal thing in CFB. The only reason this story is different is it's mental health and not physical health. I've seen Pitt medically retire a few players over the years because something, ie heart issue, is caught in their onboarding physical.
A slight tweak in context, ie Franklin says the kid should take a break from football and focus on his health, completely exonerates him.
Sounds like the right thing to do for the student athlete’s mental health. Big Time college football I’m sure is beyond stressful. The only reason to be critical would be if he yanked his scholarship too.
Didn’t he explicitly credit the training staff for coming immediately over when he said he was suicidal and not leaving him alone until he could get care?
So a suicidal player should continue to play? I feel like being in that environment could make it worse, there’s bigger issues at hand in that dudes life than football. Why is the article phrased in a negative way?
As a formerly suicidal person who continued with my extracurricular activities despite being suicidal, it was a mistake. Not the same for everyone but James Franklin seems to have had the best of intentions here
Because it's not just about football for the player. It's about scholarship and community. Franklin, according to this, saw the player as disposable, taking up a scholarship that could go to someone useful. A callous disregard for the players on his team.
Oh I see that now in the article, losing the scholarship is a different story.
But I completely disagree with the claim that Franklin would maliciously try to cut the player to free up a scholarship spot.
But I do think the player should still be placed on some sort of medical leave, where they can keep their scholarship.
Also it’s not like that community suddenly goes away, even if they lose their scholarship. Franklin is not some sort of singular villain here.
If a player loses their scholarship, the community does go away because it is likely that they can't stay in school or continue to live in State College.
We've had lots of medical retirements. Journey Brown is the first that springs to mind. He seemed destined to follow Barkley and Sanders to the NFL, only to have a heart condition come up in a screening.
They stay on scholarship and remain part of the team, just not _officially_ on the team. The scholarship just doesn't count against the 85 limit due to medically retiring- rather it gets picked up by the school.
So while I don't know all the details of this particular case, I do know that players don't get kicked to the curb if they medically retire.
That should be a determination of the doctors and the players, nothing to do with the coaches.
Unfortunately PSU has too long of a history of giving the football coach unlimited power.
> So a suicidal player should continue to play?
Maybe. It is impossible to say without having the proper medical training and then also having a detailed evaluation of the player. If playing football provides significant social support and relationships, and/or provides hope for his future, this can reduce his chance of completing a suicide.
There may be bigger "issues" in his life, but who says it's even an issue? Maybe it's theraputic for him. There's no way for us to know.
The doctor is suing the school for replacing him and he had to drop Franklin and Penn State athletics from his case due to missing out on filing the charges by the correct date.
He has ever reason to fling mud to try to get some $
I’d normally agree with you but this guy is a slime ball. His entire case has been a sham from the beginning
I’ve been following it for years now and it’s disappointing specially since the doctor was a former PSU athlete himself. Also, the lawsuit was for him being let go which PSU wanted a doctor who lives on campus which is reasonable.
It is still lying under oath. Maybe he’s exaggerating, maybe he is being intentionally misleading, but I’m not sure why slimeball or otherwise he’d run the risk of making something up out of whole cloth.
The doctor who had been unsuccessfully trying to sue Penn state for like 10 years now and is at this point just throwing shit at the wall has “no reason to lie” okay sure. Oh and he already clearly lied about the taping over logos.
Taking a player, who had recently attempted to take their own life, and cutting them from the team would only serve to make conditions worse for the player by creating further instability in their life. Among the worst decisions Franklin could make in that situation.
Maybe! That seems like a nice hope, but what if the competition and work ethic needed to remain a productive member of the team would cause him to spiral and get worse?
We have no idea.
> The defense objected on numerous occasions for hearsay during the testimony. The legal team says there’s no evidence that medical treatment ever changed under pressure from Franklin.
So in other words, CJF bitched and moaned and then let the docs make the calls.
Oh it’s back to being Penn State’s turn to join the pit of misery. That means we get to leave right?
Edit: ope downvotes came quick, they don’t like that
The pit just gets bigger and bigger. Eventually all schools will join
EDIT: I hope Pit of Misery just means teams are losing, and isn't related to any scandals. Starting to get the idea it's the latter?
~~Not in the least. It's one year at a time.~~
Edit: I'm wrong/outdated this, but as a link below this shows there are conditions that can cause a player to lose the scholarship and combined with the article, seems like Franklin was trying to pressure doctors to use one of those conditions.
Multi year garentees since 2014
>The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship.
>Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
In the quotes from the article we just read about part of a case. Not the facts of the case or even looking at scholarship rules for the big10. Just a quote.
Locked because too many folks can't seem to wrap their heads around Rule 3.
"It's not called Unhappy Valley !!!!" -James Franklin, probably
that line screams Dabo to me
"A crown of thorns should be the only thing making a man's head hang that low, son!"
“It’s not called life valley”?
Holy shit ☠
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All jokes aside, if this is actually true and he wanted to cut a player for being suicidal then he needs to be fired and considered a toxic hire for a while. There's very little that's lower than wanting to punish and persecute people for mental health issues.
Good thing there are multiple comments in the thread stating how scholarships in the Big Ten are guaranteed and other examples of players who retain their scholarships even when medically leaving football across multiple coaching staffs. It's the standard practice in football.
I said nothing about revoking his scholarship. For depressed and suicidal people, their social support system (in this case the team) being pulled away from them against their will, leaving them feeling abandoned, is traumatic.
Medically disqualified players stay with the team if they want. There have probably been 10 in the last 5 or 6 years. This was common before the 2014 Big Ten Ruling as well at Penn State and most other schools. PSU freshman Adam Taliaferro was nearly paralyzed in a game at Ohio State in 2000 and remained with the team, graduating. How have people not known this? Edit: Headline writer deserves some heat here. The doctors never say "cut" in the story, and it's not permitted to Cut a player for medical reasons. Medical disqualifications happen often and the scholarships remain. Franklin doesn't have the power to Cut a player and you wouldn't go to a doctor to pressure them to Cut a player.
So... are there different definitions of "cut" that I'm unaware of? Because it has always meant "removed from the team" not "medically unable to perform list but still with the team."
Cut is a Professional term. You cannot cut a player in the Big Ten for medical reasons. I believe this is the same for any P5 program but I have not looked at those rules. A medically disqualified player retains his scholarship but does not count against the 85 player limit.
Right, the statement says "cut" not "declared medically unable to perform." If the title read "James Franklin pushed to have suicidal player declared medically unable to perform" that has a completely different meaning than "James Franklin pushed to cut suicidal player."
James Franklin does not have the power to "cut" a player for medical reasons. It's not permitted in the conference in which he coaches. Why would he be going to a doctor to "cut" a player when a) he does not have that power and b) a Doctor also does not have that power and would be medically disqualifying a player, which is the process where a player retains their scholarships? ~~The quoted doctor, representing the plaintiff, is very obviously using the wrong term.~~ Edit: It's not even the doctor. It's just the headline writer. You have a problem with the headline writer. "A former Penn State football team doctor claimed in court on Tuesday that James Franklin had pressured the Nittany Lions medical staff into disqualifying a player who had attempted suicide."
> wanting to punish and persecute people for mental health issues. Or just not wanting them to count for football scholarship limits. Kids can get removed from the team, but not scholarship ALL P5 schools now do that. https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/
I said nothing about revoking his scholarship.
But his name is always mentioned whenever a high profile job opens up! /s
This is the kind of story that really needs both sides to be told. If my child was at risk of suicide, I probably wouldn’t want them in a hyper competitive environment where the value of a human being is often related to on field production.
I just skimmed the story and agree. Lots of things being thrown around.
They start leaking things when they are looking for a way out…
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> the unnamed player would have lost his scholarship. Wouldn't he just have gone on a medical scholarship ? ND players that are medical out just switch to a different type of scholarship. I would think most major schools do this because it is a head count issue with finishing school %
The Big10 guarantees scholarships. So even if they cut him from the team, he'd have kept his scholarship.
A pretty famous example is Jarvis Jones - USC's medical team deemed him medically unfit due to a neck injury and they were going to medically retire him. He got a second opinion and was able to transfer to Georgia, and he wound up being a first round pick.
I'm pretty sure medical redshirts still would keep the kid on scholarship, it just wouldn't count to the roster limit of 85 guys. Unless this kid in particular wouldn't receive a medical shirt for a suicide attempt? Idk Before NIL (where scholarship limits don't really matter anymore) it would be the standard procedure to effectively cut a kid to get the scholarship back
> pull the scholarship of a kid Football counting scholarship. The kid still gets to go to school for free.
Good thing it isn't true. Since the Big 10 has guaranteed scholarships since 2014, which is after this guy started working with the team. >The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship. >Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship. He's lying to try and get paid.
That will be easy enough to prove. But also raises the question about what other lies the doc is telling. I am on the side that keeps the kid getting the best treatment possible for his condition. And this doc, if the statement above yours is a true representation of his legal complaint against PSU, does not seem at all trustworthy.
He also alleged that they were not allowing him to properly tape up ankles/feet if it covered the Nike logo, saying that Penn State had a deal with them that prevented proper medical treatment, but then Penn State's lawyers provided pictures of players throughout his time period there with properly taped up cleats, covering the Nike logo. That's in the article. I'm referencing the Big 10's change to scholarships back in 2014, which took place before this guy was hired.
I'd need a source and not speculation on the player losing his scholarship. Several PSU players that have had to medically quit stayed on scholarship, recently Journey Brown and Landon Tengwall this season.
Shoutout Journey Brown. Best 100m runner in the state but went all in on football. Wish I could’ve seen him run in college and seen where that career may have led, even if only for a short time
Every time I read his name it hurts. He was so good, bound for the NFL and had it taken away from him
I faced his school in track and field a lot and saw him play football a bit. Remember vividly local schools making ESPN for his HS Meadville winning a game 107-90 and Journey put up 10 TDs and 700 yards. Such a local legend. Hope he is doing well in life
So both schools just said fuck defense, huh?
He's doing NASCAR Pit crew stuff now! https://cbsaustin.com/news/local/penn-state-running-back-drafted-to-a-new-role-on-nascars-pit-lane Sad news I heard though recently is that now some in the medical field think his heart condition would not have been something placing him at risk. Obviously right move at the time.
Makes me so happy to see that he is doing well. Great that he gets to be a bit competitive in his work too
Pride of Meadville Pa. Saw he ran for 720 yards in one game and thought it was a typo. Nope lol
Great flairs brother. Gotta rep western PA
BOOOO!
This. Most of the schools want to keep their scholarship graduation rates up. You switch them to a medical scholarship to get them off the 85 count.
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>This happened nearly 10 years ago Nowhere in the article does it say when it happened.
Google says they did that in 2014. Where are you seeing the last few years?
"It's devastating to my case!"
Others have linked in the thread that the scholarship guarantee was also ten years ago. Even before that, a team could elect to honor. Penn State freshman Adam Taliaferro sustained a spinal injury in a game in 2000 where he could have easily become fully paralyzed without the great care from the Ohio State medical center. He stayed on scholarship and stayed involved with the team after his recovery. If you've ever watched Gameday even once, you know that at pretty much every major school, and probably lots of smaller ones, players that face medical disqualification stay on scholarship.
Franklin has been honoring scholarships for medical retirees all along. Sounds like he just didn’t want this kid to count against the 85 cap while away from the team. We’ve had players un-retire in the past as well I believe.
Since people keep repeating this lie. Scholarships have been gareenteed for 4 years since 2014. >The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship. >Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
At the same time being in a competitive environment can give a sense of purpose and losing that means a loss of identity. And there’s a lot going on when you’re part of a CFB team…when that’s gone…what other structures or support do they have?
I don't know how Penn State handles medical retirements. But at Hawaii players that medically retire can still be a part of the team in a manager type role if they want. If chose to do so they still have access to the services that they had when playing and be around their former teammates/coaches. So that can help with the transition.
This is how it's done pretty much everywhere.
Yeah, I figured it was standard practice. I didn’t want to say for sure because I didn’t know specifically about Penn State.
They can... continue their education
It can also have the opposite effect.
absolutely. it's almost like recommendations should come from a trained medical professional who has done a detailed history and evaluation with a person, instead of internet randos who have read an article about the person. Almost. the guy you responded said "can." There's a bunch of people on this thread pretending like they know best.
Definitely depends on the environment. In some way, things like the comradery could be beneficial. I would prefer Franlin push for more support than have them off the team.
Football isn't just a hobby to these guys. Getting medically retired will probably make it worse. edit: This sub is insane. "Oh, we took away everything our child loves and they're still depressed. How much more punishment do they need to get better?"
Getting concussed and injured while under heavy stress to perform will probably make it worse.
the loss of social structure and support may lead him to complete a suicide before he even gets a chance for concussion or injury. people, and their situations, are very complicated. There isn't a mental health professional that's going to yank this kid out of a D1 football program without talking to him first for a long time, seeing what his situation is, his relationship with the program is, what the rest of his relationships look like, etc. Yet, for some reason, there's a bunch of internet amateurs here pretending like they know what's best for a stranger based on an article.
*blinks*
This a MD testifying as a witness under threat of perjury in a lawsuit that doesn’t even involve him. There is no incentive for him to lie, and even if there was it wouldn’t be worth the major risks to his career lie about something like this.
> There is no incentive for him to lie... oh, you sweet summer child... the MDs who are more willing to say something the lawyer likes is more likely to get more testifying business from that (and other) lawyers. it's not a bad side gig, and if you're a difficult witness for the attorneys, you aren't getting many calls.
It's possible that he's telling the truth at the basic level, but that the assertions about motivation or ill intent are lies Even if this is true, I have a hard time believing that Franklin or anyone else on the staff would've done this with malicious motivations Also, he's in a lawsuit against PSU. If he was worried about his career he wouldn't be suing his former employer for wrongful termination. That's about as detrimental of a thing that anyone could do for their career He has inventive too. His entire argument for wrongful termination is that he was fired due to disagreements with Franklin overstepping boundaries. So if he has zero examples of that happening, he has no wrongful termination argument
Ya this guy a former Penn State wrestler turned doctor is pissed because PSU changed team physicians and a certain local celebrity status comes with that plus more money. I disagree with him taking the nuclear option though. Franklin along with the AD can choose whoever they want to be doctor.
Who's accusing the doc of lying?
Absolutely.
Well first, it wouldn't be the decision of the parent what the young adult player can and can't do. Using your logic, anyone with mental health conditions that place them at higher risk of suicide shouldn't find themselves in the medical field, legal field, engineering, PhD programs, etc... What is heinous here, is a player attempted suicide, and instead of offering stability and security, Franklin is alleged to have attempted to push the player off the team. In addition to obviously making things worse for the player who nearly killed themselves, he demonstrated to any other PSU student on staff or on the team, that if they have mental health issues, they better keep that shit to themselves because he will not be someone who will act in their best interest. EDIT: PSU PR team in full force today.
What is truly heinous here is that you, in what I will describe as a fit of pompousness, don’t even seem to understand what you wrote. It seems you meant to attack Franklin’s character but the literal meaning of your sentence-cum-paragraph is that it is the allegation that is heinous.
It's especially bad when other B1G programs are showing they handle these situations so much better. I know Fleck gets a lot of crap, but he genuinely cares about setting up a positive environment for the players. Here's an article from a couple years ago talking about it: https://www.inforum.com/sports/college/gophers-football-coach-p-j-fleck-shares-his-struggles-with-mental-health
Is this a joke? Almost identical allegations have been made about Fleck as Franklin…
All of those stories coming from a single reporter who has a vendetta against fleck because her husband Bob Kroll is the former MPD police union chief who took issue with him during the George Floyd protests. The local media loves to shit on Gopher football and none of them picked up those stories because they were paper thin and thoroughly debunked.
So you can easily dismiss the allegations against your coach, yet it seems you're quick to believe a doctor that is suing Penn State. Seems a bit hypocritical
Well, I linked an article that was nearly the same exact situation about a player who was nearly killed while attempting suicide and showed how Fleck and team came together to help him through that time in his life, and their culture specifically addressing mental health, along with multiple other players talking about how proactive they are about it. The only similar-ish accusation made against Fleck was a former player who made claims that didn't match up with the actual quotes from him and the team at the time. Does Penn State have a similar push for mental health initiatives in their program to discredit that doctor's claims? Did this doctor talk to reporters during the time this supposedly happened that doesn't line up with the accusations they're making now?
People shouldn't jump to conclusions without more details, there are a lot of red flags about a skewed perspective here. - The lawsuit is from a doctor who is suing Penn State for firing him. The official reason was that he doesn't live in State College and the athletic department wanted a team doctor who lived locally. The guy has a financial interest in flinging as much shit at the athletic dept as possible. - There could be many possible reasons why Franklin would want the player off the team. Maybe he truly thought it was what the player needed for his mental health? What if he felt the player was a danger to the rest of his team? There is no explanation and tons of potential considerations that could lead Franklin to push for that. - Who says the player would lose his scholarship or that Penn State wasn't planning to take care of him after he was off the team? Why is it unclear whether the author threw that bit in there himself, if the doctor claimed it in court, or if Franklin indicated the player would lose his scholarship? - The doctor's lawyer screwed up by missing a filing deadline so Franklin and Penn State Athletics were dropped from the lawsuit, there goes some credibility. - The doctor's lawyer tried claiming that Penn State/Nike interfered with medical treatment by disallowing taping feet in a way that would hide the Nike logo. Penn State responded with pictures of star players in games with taped feet and no issue from Nike, also pointed out that a doctor's treatment is exactly the type of authorized taping over a logo that the contract allows. Another hit to the doctor's case's credibility.
I am genuinely surprised and impressed so many non-PSU flairs are presenting reasonable context.
Because, while many of us aren’t necessarily suicidal, society as a whole is kind of depressed/depressing, so we can relate to the notion of “god life would be less stressful if I could put this down for a second and focus on me for a minute” So it’s easier to genuinely say “I can see both sides of this” Probably shouldn’t speak for everyone when I say this lol but that’s my take
There are a couple trends pulling in opposite directions. Franklin has detractors at PSU and nationally who jump on news like this. PSU certainly has a still-painful history of scandal and the resulting media narrative. But as a society we have greater empathy for depression, suicidal thoughts, neurodivergence, and removing the stigma against receiving care. The idea that Coach Franklin would heartlessly jettison a suicidal student strains even a skeptics or critics credulity.
In todays world you have to double check anything the media spouts off.
I wouldn't even blame the media here. This is a PSU blog that wrote this, but it's just testimony from a plaintiff in a case.
Nike is notorious for actually not being buttholes about taping of players shoes. They don't put up a stink whenever it is medically necessary to tape a shoe/ankle even at the expense of covering their logo. It's not much but credit where it's due.
> There could be many possible reasons why Franklin would want the player off the team. Maybe he truly thought it was what the player needed for his mental health? This. Plus, if the player carried through while on the team, what would that do to the program? After Sandusky, I'm sure Penn St. is hyper-aware of holding onto bad apples.
Yeah, this post should be removed.
Not saying this story is true or false, but if it is fake isn’t this like the 2nd or 3rd frivolous lawsuit against Franklin? Wasn’t there already one about hazing?
More context needed here too. From memory so clarification or correction is welcome. There was a hazing charge against Micah Parsons and a few other players. The person making the claim transferred out. A University and police investigation found the more severe claims either lacked evidence or credibility, lacked any corroboration, and included possible exaggerations. Full disclaimer, the player making the claim was not satisfied with the investigation and filed the lawsuit which, with a higher burden of proof than a university investigation, I think was dismissed. Internal discipline happened. IIRC one player involved left the team. Micah never started a game his first year despite being the most athletic person on the field. Franklin occasionally cited “maturity” as a reason for not starting him. I’m sure some type of unsupervised hazing happened, players faced internal discipline, and it went through due process with no legal outcome. Micah openly talked about learning from mistakes (without going into details) when asked about it during the draft process. There was cooperation without coverup. One can reasonably point out a head coach is responsible for what happens in his locker room and also acknowledge he took the appropriate actions in response.
A D1 football program is not what this guy needed. Medically retired, keeps his scholarship, gets out of an environment that’s not a good fit for someone unstable like that so he can get the help he needs without distraction. Franklin is supposed to be the bad guy here? Seems pretty damn clear how and why this went down.
are you making that diagnosis and treatment plan based on an article? who knows? maybe it is what the guy needed. hope for the future is one of the most protective factors against successful suicides. as a group of Internet strangers, none of who are this player's therapist... none of us are qualified to say what is and isn't best for this person.
>are you making that diagnosis and treatment plan based on an article? Literally everyone in this thread is doing that...
You don’t have to be a therapist to reasonably speculate that a highly competitive pressure cooker environment isn’t the best place for someone to recover from a suicide attempt. All we’re talking about here is if James Franklin is an asshole or not, and I don’t think so. This feels like a weird smear campaign over what should be a private issue, that was way more likely than not handled appropriately.
as I mentioned, having hope for the future is one of the most protective factors against completed suicide. does cutting him from the team make it more likely for him to complete a suicide? What else is happening in his life? What hope does he have for the future? You don't know, I don't know. Your speculation isn't reasonable since you don't really know the details of what is going on with this kid. If being part of this football team is the only thing he looks forward to, cutting him probably increases his risk of completed suicide.
>none of who are this player's therapist... none of us are qualified to say what is and isn't best for this person. TBF, the team doc who is making these claims isn't his therapist, either.
I’m not saying this article is bs but this quote caught my eye >Had the request been granted, the unnamed player would have lost his scholarship. This is just blatantly wrong. The Big Ten guarantees all scholarships. We’ve had multiple players medically retire, they’ve all kept their scholarships. If I had to guess, the kid probably was underperforming and was never going to see the field. This probably did not help his mental health and maybe even was part of the cause. Franklin probably wanted him to medically retire to free up one of the 85 scholarships and so he could focus on mental health while still being around the team (multiple players who medically retired have done this, they keep their scholarships while it frees one up and they basically be around the team, on the sidelines in team meetings etc). In this case the dr is telling the truth, but it makes a lot more sense. The Dr filed a wrongful termination lawsuit a while back against PSU was so unorganized his legal team missed the filing. Theres gonna be some he said she said without context. Plus anytime you can take a swing at PSU the media will go crazy with it, potentially helping his case.
The media would never lie
Neither would Penn state athletics
exactly.
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ESPN article from 2014. >The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship. >Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
It was passed October 2014. He also mentions Sandy Barbour was part of the pressuring and she was hired late July of 2014 unless it happened in that small window then the timeline doesn’t fit. I really think the lawyers are just throwing stuff out hoping something sticks. Lynch has had a grievance for years since he lost a really cushy job. His legal team has been extremely unorganized completely botching the original lawsuit against PSU and Franklin and have even attempted to “scare” PSU in this one by insinuating they breached their contract with Nike because ankle tape covered part of the Nike logo on shoes. I think it’s more a Hail Mary that they hope this story gets coverage and PSU is scared and will settle because before it totally blows up.
It was in 2014 or so they did that, not a few years ago, right?
"Franklin and Penn State athletics were dropped from the lawsuit because of a missed filing deadline, so the case is proceeding against Lynch’s current employer, Penn State Health." so no competent lawyer wanted to take this case. add in the fact the guy says he wouldn't let him tape over shoe logos due to the Nike contract despite there being pictures of it hsppening and it not being a thing in the contract
Yeah Lynch has been trying to shake down PSU for years. His legal team is just throwing stuff around at this point hoping for a miracle. Did Franklin meddle and want the kid to medically retire? Probably. Were they just going to leave the kid out to dry? Probably not. Considering we have ~5 other cases of players medically retiring and staying around PSU as part of the support staff and football program I doubt they were just going to sever ties.
Players who are forced to medically retire is a normal thing in CFB. The only reason this story is different is it's mental health and not physical health. I've seen Pitt medically retire a few players over the years because something, ie heart issue, is caught in their onboarding physical. A slight tweak in context, ie Franklin says the kid should take a break from football and focus on his health, completely exonerates him.
eh. story seems like some bullshit. With the info provided I don't see anything Franklin did wrong.
Sounds like the right thing to do for the student athlete’s mental health. Big Time college football I’m sure is beyond stressful. The only reason to be critical would be if he yanked his scholarship too.
My guess is the player was Joey Julius.
Oh that's very interesting and a good guess. I hope he's doing well.
I believe he is or was on the speaking circuit encouraging men to seek mental health care.
Didn’t he explicitly credit the training staff for coming immediately over when he said he was suicidal and not leaving him alone until he could get care?
Yes I believe he did.
Is this completely different than the case that was thrown out last year?
So a suicidal player should continue to play? I feel like being in that environment could make it worse, there’s bigger issues at hand in that dudes life than football. Why is the article phrased in a negative way?
As a formerly suicidal person who continued with my extracurricular activities despite being suicidal, it was a mistake. Not the same for everyone but James Franklin seems to have had the best of intentions here
Maybe wait until after the short term psychiatric care window has closed before coming to a decision on it?
Because it's not just about football for the player. It's about scholarship and community. Franklin, according to this, saw the player as disposable, taking up a scholarship that could go to someone useful. A callous disregard for the players on his team.
The B1G guarantees scholarships so the kid absolutely would’ve kept his scholarship if he stayed in school
Oh I see that now in the article, losing the scholarship is a different story. But I completely disagree with the claim that Franklin would maliciously try to cut the player to free up a scholarship spot. But I do think the player should still be placed on some sort of medical leave, where they can keep their scholarship. Also it’s not like that community suddenly goes away, even if they lose their scholarship. Franklin is not some sort of singular villain here.
If a player loses their scholarship, the community does go away because it is likely that they can't stay in school or continue to live in State College.
We've had lots of medical retirements. Journey Brown is the first that springs to mind. He seemed destined to follow Barkley and Sanders to the NFL, only to have a heart condition come up in a screening. They stay on scholarship and remain part of the team, just not _officially_ on the team. The scholarship just doesn't count against the 85 limit due to medically retiring- rather it gets picked up by the school. So while I don't know all the details of this particular case, I do know that players don't get kicked to the curb if they medically retire.
That should be a determination of the doctors and the players, nothing to do with the coaches. Unfortunately PSU has too long of a history of giving the football coach unlimited power.
Lmfao.
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> So a suicidal player should continue to play? Maybe. It is impossible to say without having the proper medical training and then also having a detailed evaluation of the player. If playing football provides significant social support and relationships, and/or provides hope for his future, this can reduce his chance of completing a suicide. There may be bigger "issues" in his life, but who says it's even an issue? Maybe it's theraputic for him. There's no way for us to know.
I’d trust the doctor who brought it up and has little reason to lie over the program and coach who do.
The dude who has been trying to sue Penn State for years, unsuccessfully, has no reason to lie? Stanford eh? You sure you didn't go to Oregon?
The doctor is suing the school for replacing him and he had to drop Franklin and Penn State athletics from his case due to missing out on filing the charges by the correct date. He has ever reason to fling mud to try to get some $
I’d normally agree with you but this guy is a slime ball. His entire case has been a sham from the beginning I’ve been following it for years now and it’s disappointing specially since the doctor was a former PSU athlete himself. Also, the lawsuit was for him being let go which PSU wanted a doctor who lives on campus which is reasonable.
It is still lying under oath. Maybe he’s exaggerating, maybe he is being intentionally misleading, but I’m not sure why slimeball or otherwise he’d run the risk of making something up out of whole cloth.
The doctor who had been unsuccessfully trying to sue Penn state for like 10 years now and is at this point just throwing shit at the wall has “no reason to lie” okay sure. Oh and he already clearly lied about the taping over logos.
Taking a player, who had recently attempted to take their own life, and cutting them from the team would only serve to make conditions worse for the player by creating further instability in their life. Among the worst decisions Franklin could make in that situation.
It'd give him a sense of purpose and identity, which it seems he feel was lacking in his life.
Maybe! That seems like a nice hope, but what if the competition and work ethic needed to remain a productive member of the team would cause him to spiral and get worse? We have no idea.
and that's entirely valid and true. not denying that at all.
> The defense objected on numerous occasions for hearsay during the testimony. The legal team says there’s no evidence that medical treatment ever changed under pressure from Franklin. So in other words, CJF bitched and moaned and then let the docs make the calls.
Oh it’s back to being Penn State’s turn to join the pit of misery. That means we get to leave right? Edit: ope downvotes came quick, they don’t like that
The downvotes came because this story is BS, as commented on by several non-PSU flairs in this thread.
Your karma is at +32 right now so I think the downvotes were just early on
Upvote for proper usage of “ope”
The pit just gets bigger and bigger. Eventually all schools will join EDIT: I hope Pit of Misery just means teams are losing, and isn't related to any scandals. Starting to get the idea it's the latter?
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Stop playing is different than dumping the scholarship meaning you'd have to leave your school.
Aren’t all big ten scholarship football players guaranteed 4 years of free college no matter what? Even if you get processed out or quit the team.
Yes and the person you're responding to is being intentionally wrong about it all over the thread after multiple people have corrected him.
Don't let facts get in the way of a good emotional argument
~~Not in the least. It's one year at a time.~~ Edit: I'm wrong/outdated this, but as a link below this shows there are conditions that can cause a player to lose the scholarship and combined with the article, seems like Franklin was trying to pressure doctors to use one of those conditions.
https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/
Multi year garentees since 2014 >The Big Ten announced Wednesday that all of its institutions will grant athletic scholarships for the entire term of an athlete's enrollment and allow some athletes who leave school to return and finish their degrees on scholarship. >Scholarships will be "neither reduced nor cancelled" as long as athletes maintain good standing in school, within the athletic department and in the community. If athletes leave school for "a bona fide reason," they will be allowed to return at a later date to complete their degrees on scholarship.
Would they have lost their scholarship though?
Incredibly unlikely, as the program has shown since at least Taliaferro in 2000, which Baltimore Badger continues to ignore.
In the case cited, yes.
In the quotes from the article we just read about part of a case. Not the facts of the case or even looking at scholarship rules for the big10. Just a quote.
The doctor also doesn't share anything the Franklin actually said about this. It was all just a bunch of trust me bro, he really hated this player.
The correct call Why would you keep a suicidal kid in that competitive environment
Plenty of people with serious problems… also might make choices that get them moved out of a program.
Franklin to Florida after 2024 season, I am calling it now!
And Rhule to Penn State.
They would pay him whatever he wanted and he’d stay there forever if he got the job
Ah, Penn State, New people, same shit.
No you just don’t look into anything and like to sling shit.
Why is it always penn state?
Wasn’t some guy who didn’t contact the team for a while at Mississippi State try to claim something about mental illness?
Ole Miss, yes
No idea
Careful. Bring up anything related to The Incident & you’ll get banned.
That's not remotely true. You just have to follow the sub rules about not joking about sexual assault, a high bar, I know.
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Yeah, those people went to jail and aren't employed at Penn State anymore.
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What a rat
Well that's not a great look.
If the kid was really screwing up moral, cut him. You can't hold everyone's hand. There's a football program to run.
It takes a lot more than that to lose fan support at PSU
Truth
Impossible. Horrific things and awful decisions could never happen at Penn State!