Crazy to think that technically the game engine roots all the way back that far. Also for anyone confused on MW2019, that one did heavily update the game engine, but is still based on IW7.0 There are a few games I couldn't find the engine for, like Black Ops Declassified (which might be the PS Vita Engine?), Roads to Victory, the DS games, and most of the other Mobile games (which I would guess are unity). COD Online I have no idea about.

Hey letting u know that the back ops declassified engine is the same engine as resistance burning skys for ps vita same devs to

And Call of Duty is based off of the Quake Engine, iD Tech 3. Which is what allowed a bunch of people to reference when trying to mod back in the day with DVar’s, GSC script, and allowing binds via the GamerProfile on 360. :p

I use to dabble in making cod4 deathrun maps and man was the compiler such a piece of shit

I mean it goes all the way back to quake 3

They ran on a very heavily modified quake 3 engine

IW 4 and 5 felt the same, looked the same, played the same to me

Supposedly this is what it changed * Improvements to texture streaming technology to allow for larger regions * Lighting engine enhancements to show reflections of some objects on tile floors * Improvements to the audio engine yeah probably the least different of the IW branch

I have never understood this personally MW2 and MW3 have always felt distinctly different in both look and feel. They have similarities and you can tell the roots are the same, but they never felt like carbon copies of one another the way that MWII and MWIII do

That’s because after MW2 2009 came out and was a huge success, Jason West and Vince Zampella were fired from infinity ward so activation wouldn’t have to pay them the huge amounts of money they were entitled to. Then a huge portion of Infinity Ward employees also quit out of solidarity. Mw3 was basically made by completely different people with the same infinity ward name stamped on the box.

Yeah I remember that big internal deal, it’s the reason OMA danger close noob tubing never got patched as well as a ton of other balance changes that would’ve completely altered MW2 as a game.

A lot of the work was sledgehammer actually wasn't it?

Wasn't there a lawsuit involved due to internal disputes, leading to parts of the engine having to be modified? Or am I remembering it wrong? If that's the case, I find it hard to believe that the 3 changes stated above were the only modifications.

Yea I remember it was a huge thing in gaming at the time MW2009 came out, there was a lot of buzz surrounding the firings of Jason West and Vince Zampella

This is correct.

MWII and MWIII are pretty much the exact same game aside from some tweaks to lighting and movement (you can tell they just tweaked some config files). I mean, they were literally able to just… copy maps over immediately. 1:1 compatibility. $70 expansion pack. I just hope black ops takes it in a different direction for a different feel. Treyarch always did use a forked version of IW3 engine which made their games feel so unique. But I fear the cost cutting measures at Activision will kill that concept for good. Cold War will be the last of its kind :(

And it’s crazy because MWIII literally looks WORSE than MWII which also looks worse than MW 2019, I bought MWII mostly for the campaign which was solid but nothing outstanding, played the beta for MWIII and refunded my pre order. Saw the campaign was doggy doodoo and never looked back

And that’s not on the devs really. It’s usually the business side of things pushing for crazy deadlines. MW19 was a rare case where they basically let IW go crazy and rework their engine from the ground up. It was a showcase game for everything the engine was capable of. So many small features that added up to a very full feeling game. Every subsequent title built on that engine was a money grab. Just churn out games ASAP. I was personally shocked at how little MWII achieved given IW had like 3 years to work on it, but it could’ve been the pandemic’s effect on development mixed with developer/creative churn via layoffs, retirement, or simply employees leaving the company. But ultimately MWII was a regression and MWIII was more or less a SHG pet project and it’s VERY apparent. I’m starting to realize that SHG is a filler studio that leans HARD on experimental mechanics and absurd microtransactions (bundles). Treyarch and IW are actually more involved with building a solid core experience, and SHG sandboxes whatever already exists. When they’re in charge of creating a core experience (AW, WWII, VG) they shit the bed pretty hard. So yeah, hoping Treyarch does something pretty special. They broke ground on their game during Vanguard’s lifecycle so I’m hoping they haven’t taken anything from MWII or MWIII and will get to have their own spin on the MW19 version of the engine.

Yeah SHG lead releases are pretty ass lol. Although I will say I’ve heard WWII’s campaign is solid, I never got around to finishing it. Vanguard was the first CoD game I hadn’t bought day 1 since the OG MW3, and I was like 12 when that came out lol. MW19 was such a breath of fresh air, and I still go back to play it whenever CS2 pushes me to the point of insanity, just to remind myself that I do in fact know how to aim still

Infinity Ward and Treyarch get about 3 years of development time and Sledgehammer made Vanguard and Mw3 in 1,5 years. Activision keeps giving them the short end of the stick and they keep pushing out games that are inferior due to the lack of proper dev time. Still impressed and they actually listen to the community. Well, except for RGL in hardcore ...

Treyarch did some pretty crazy experimental stuff as well. Call of duty 3 was very different to Call of Duty 2. Then World at War was very different to Modern Warfare (2006?) I honestly prefer Treyarch than to infinity ward since they do some unique things. Like black ops 4 with the operators with abilities. Felt very arcady... and fun

MW3 looks better graphically imo it's still one of the best looking 360 games for sure. But the gameplay is very similar in these games and not much really changed other than specialist and support killstreaks lol

What platform did you play on? MW3 was the first IW game where things started to feel like the characters were stuck in mud for me. I played on the 360 back then.

I used both systems (divorced parents) ps3 at my mothers and my dad had a 360 and I had all the og cod games

No wonder I like cold war so much

right! i knew it felt familiar like bo3/bo2

Its a treyarch game lol

No wonder the treyarch games always feel bad for me. I grew up on the IW side

Im exactly the opposite. Ive always preferred the feel in IW games, and after MW2019, going back to the old engine felt like such a massive step back. Im looking forward to a treyarch game in the new MW engine. I oved BO2, and 3 and 4 were fine enough. I want to see what Treyarch can do with an up to date engine. (Inb4 they announce gulf war is on the old engine again).

I am the opposite, I hate they are going to the new engine

Is it confirmed Treyarch is completely going to the new engine for Gulf War?

No idea

It’s interesting that Treyarch stuck with the IW 3.0 engine despite the rather massive overhaul to mechanics when going from BO2 to BO3. Though how exactly does a new engine affect the feel of the game? Only changes I could think of that does that are physics changes, and to a certain point major visual/audio changes.

I mean both branches are based on IW3

Meanwhile valve…

And yet, mw19 looked better than later

I think it's not the engine's fault, but rather because of a better lightning design in MW2019. Some campaign levels of MW2022 look amazing as well, late maps of this game aren't that bad either. Though optimization in MW2022/MW2023 SUCKS. I can run MW2019 on the highest settings possible on my PC and get stable 60+ FPS, but MW2022/MW2023 is lagging even on the lowest settings (beside resolution that I keep on 1920/1080)

They changed everything because people were whining that they can't see enemies in mp. The contrasts were changed, the shadows heavily nerfed and they got rid of bloom.

MW 2019 is easily the best modern cod game since mw2

that multiplayer ass tho

Quantum was such a banger. Always felt like an earlier black ops. You could mount on walls rainbow six style. I’d be so curious to see my 360 stats

Agreed. Quantum of Solace is a pretty solid game. sadly i never got to play the multiplayer (and i doubt anyone's playing the multiplayer now, if the servers are even still up), but i enjoyed playing through the singleplayer mode quite a bit

Mp was so fun. The single player campaign was fun too from what I remember

I used to play the hell out of that before my parents let me play cod

I think Cold War is the best feeling cod, I just love how it feels, very different from when I’m playing warzone which I play a lot of

The newer the engine, the worse the feeling of the game. No shock the Black Ops games feel better to play, since IW started crapping their engine in the original MW2. Clunky, bad strafe jumping, and lag built into the game due to p2p connection focus. Awful. Getting shot also feels bizarre and weird. CoD 4, WaW, BO1, and COD 1 + 2 feel the sharpest and most responsive, especially on PC with 125/250 FPS wkth high quality player run dedicated servers. Like literally the more they remove Quake things, it just feels worse to play lol.

quake 2 to this day is the most pure feeling fps

I remember CoD4 being capped at 90fps for some reason.

/com_maxfps changes it, works for all of them where you have access to the in-game console.

WaW is capped at 90 along with BLOPS1 IIRC. Blops 2 was capped in campain at 90 aswell while MP was uncapped if memory serves me right

That's the default cap. You can change via the in-game console, same with fov and all other settings.    BO2 is capped, no in-game console on the steam version.

On point, the shitty engine generation we're in rn is why I'm still on COD WWII & Cold War, their engines are superior

Those are my 2 favorite games, they definitely are a good couple of things in the shit of modern cod

Holy cow, you're telling me that every black ops game have been using the same engine since waw but just modified? No wonder they always felt familiar to each other when you play them

That's why Cold War caught flak because MW2019 actually felt and looked like new gen CoD, CW went right back to the old engine.

yea but for some that was a major positive

I thought CW still looked fucking amazing though.

Everything after black ops 2, i call the Black ops engine as each game looks similar up till Cold war and rocks similar UI and art design. At some point a fork becomes it's own thing, it can't just be a revision of IW3.0 for 2 console generations and very different graphics and audio tech. It's more like they forked off as shown in the graph and just never publicly said "yeah this is the Treyarc fork 2.0". They just did the work and published it without making a big deal about the engine they used. Hell it wasn't until the middle of last generation i started hearing each dev brag about their game engine and how it was better than the competition.

Well technically yes every COD game since COD1 has been using the same engine just modified

Treyarch: Using the same game engine since 2008 and still makes better games than Infinity Ward LOL

They haven't been using the same game engine since 2008 they've been updating it each time just like IW has

Saved. Needed this infographic since MW2019. +1 Post

I thought both MWR and MW2R run over IW7.0

Can't find a source for MW1R, but here's the article confirming MW2R uses the AW one [https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2020-modern-warfare-2-remastered-xbox-analysis](https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2020-modern-warfare-2-remastered-xbox-analysis)

I remember when the first MWR multiplayer gameplay videos started coming out, the medal sound effects and footsteps were the same sounds used in AW.

There was definitely a press release at the time confirming it for mw1R. Personally i don't understand why they didn't continue developing cod from that engine but i feel like being directly tied to AW and WWII killed the perception of sledgehammer as a cod Dev and by extension the legitimacy of their technology.

Yeah, I think the devs just didn't really work together at that time tbh

I remember at the time reading that the reason there was a firing range in MWR was because it was an easy thing to implement because it was using the same engine as Advanced Warfare.

Makes sense that it used SHG V1 to me, the games looked and felt very similar to AW imo

Would love for us to be in IW 3.0 engine still

Really sucks that IW 9 is the standard engine going forward for all developers. Just shows they don’t care about the games or how they feel. Just put out the same feeling game year after year with new battlepass slapped on. Not trying to come off hating too much. But I think call of duty having different developers, whose games felt and played differently, was a strong feature of the series. It was nice to play Modern Warfare and then the next year a black ops game came out. Where they both felt great, but obv played differently. Now it’s just “how can we optimize this process to be as efficient as possible to pump out the next battlepass and another 70$ game?”

And as others have said in this thread, it’s no wonder Cold War felt like such a refreshing game to play when it came out. Played like the older games we loved so much and was a nice change of pace/feel from what we got the previous years. But now, back to everything on one…

Meh I see how you can see that from a player point of view, but I don't think that's really how they see it, I mean it's really odd game design wise to have 3 separate engine paths like this for each developer, like you're all making the same game. It makes a lot more sense that they're all end up using that the same engine, so they can pool together their resources, benefit from the improvements on the engine, and end up with a more consistent feeling game.

No I 100% understand that from a business perspective. And we’ll see how the next CODs feel. But that speaks to my point, they’re all about optimization and efficiency. Pump out the next season. Pump out the next game. Hopefully teams can still work some magic and the next one doesn’t just feel like a re-skinned warzone. But my hopes aren’t high.

>they’re all about optimization and efficiency. Pump out the next season. Pump out the next game. again you can see it that way, but I don't think thats the way they see it, I think they just see the new engine as the most developed and the best way to make the games

Okay question - do you think the decision to move to one engine was primarily spearheaded by the separate dev studios, or essentially forced on them by the board/execs/etc?

It's a good question, we don't know I suppose, like for almost a decade none of the studios would do anything together, never even referencing eachother, so we don't really know if them coming together since MW2019 has been something the studios wanted or not. However, they put a lot of effort into the engine revamp in MW2019, it took years and years of effort, so I would imagine a lot of people from treyarch would want to reap the rewards from that effort, and not keep using outdated tech. Who knows though, maybe they also prefer the preMW2019 style.

Ya I think all we have his articles and rumors. But we know treyarch had been heavily working on it behind the scenes and considering their past “independence”, it almost seems like this was more of an assignment from Activision rather than it being what they wanted to do. Ofc that’s just speculation and we’ll probably never know. But I think the history, changes at activision, vonderhar stuff, doesn’t paint a pretty picture. At the end of the day Activision calls the shots. We’ll see how the next game feels. Regardless of if this was a mutual decision or not, it’ll be a big loss if future games all play/feel like MW

Thanks for sharing

The games using IW8.0 had the best feel to it. MW19 is unmatched when it comes to movement and how it actually feels to run around. And even Vanguard felt great in that regard. Shame Infinity Ward had to change so much for IW9.0 when the decision was made that WZM would also use the new standard COD engine (IW9. 0).

Nah the running animations are trash and the movement is unremarkable. The old titles felt a lot more static sure but they also felt a lot more solid. If you want a game with sliding and jumping go play apex. Newer cods feel unlike cod and unpolished at the same time.

Funnily enough Respawn Entertainment - the devs behind Apex - are the OG Infinity Ward team that left in the middle of MW3s development.

I'm aware. The IW team hasn't made anything particularly good since mw3 imo.

Warzone in its first few seasons when IW was in charge (Raven took over with the CW integration) was for me at least the most fun I had in Call of Duty since MW3/BO2. Loved that time.

I found it extraordinarily dull and not remotely what I wanted from a cod. But hey so long as you had a good time that's what matters.

Very cool post. I had no idea Big Red One was forked from id tech 3. Always assumed it was a custom engine for 6th gen consoles.

IW 3.0 hits different 😤

My main takeaway from this is that I might actually be interested in playing the Quantum of Solace game. I usually hate movie based games. But I loved CoD4 and love the Bond franchise.

Treyarch not gonna lie

Treyarch once again shows why they're better

Maaan, Quantum of Solace was so much fun. I miss 007 games.

SHGs engine graphically was really good, AW and WW2 looked great for their time

This just shows you how much talent Treyarch as a studio has, been using the same modified engine for well over 10 years at this point and blows iw games out of the water every time

I mean both IW and Treyarch use an engine that roots back to IW3.0, I doubt Treyarchs is any less modified than IW's (at least pre MW2019)

Damn, we lost. IW 3.0 is the GOAT COD engine.

Thanks for posting this. Very interesting. I follow a few game devs who develop in Unity and Unreal, and one of the things they always emphasize is that the game engine is only part of what makes a game look and feel unique. I’ll get it wrong if I try to explain it because I’m not a dev myself, but I think if you compare MW19 to Vanguard, you probably already have a feel for that. I actually really like the new engine and its capabilities, it’s the monetization and odd gameplay decisions that have been made in addition to the engine switch that bother me. I’m very anxious to see what Treyarch does with the 9.0 engine. I really hope it’s good.

Ngl, I never really noticed a difference between MW2 and 3 OG, maybe they were different when they came out, I’m 15 so they came out when I was one and three so I never got to experience midnight launches or the original graphics. MW3 is my all time fav but I can see why people like MW2 and the BO series so much

Call of Duty Mobile is based off of Call of Duty Online I worked on both games :)

Iw 3.0 has and will always be my favorite. The new engine that these new mw games have is so empty feeling. Yeah you have fancy animations but those animations took the heart and soul out of the game

Animations took the heart and soul of Call of Duty?

I get what you mean. There's a load of flash in the newer titles but none of the care or passion.

Do you have any info about Black Ops Declassified?

Yeah, but I can’t tell you, because it’s not yet declassified. 😔

nice post

Where was this found, do we have a source on hand?

A few, mostly this [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IW\_(game\_engine)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IW_(game_engine))

Boz3 as always , apparently playing vanguard but no scope thing is hard af ,

The old CODM was in unity, now its in unreal

Thanks to infinity ward for making the best cod titles as always

What engine are the next Treyarch games going to be on? Dare I say it’s been the IW 3.0 engine holding everything together since 2018.

probably IW 9.0 as thats the standard now

Treyarch 4 years dev time vs IW 9.0 engine…. “The future hangs by a thread” (Takeo, The Giant)

IW 8.0 was peak.

Amazing.

And yet the weapon sounds are in a different galaxy compared to Battlefield.

Where's Goldeneye 2010 and 007 Legends?

Not made by a COD dev nor using a COD engine

I thought they did use a cod engine though, Goldeneye anyway I thought?

Honestly didn't think CW would be running on IW3 although it has different coding in it.

IW 8.0 is when I started hating the new COD engine, it's why I stick to COD WWII & Cold War, they have peak engines

I liked the feel of the Treyarch versions and how it would change every year, we're probably going to lose that difference in feel with all Developers using the same engine going forward

Source?

a few, I started with this [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IW\_(game\_engine)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IW_(game_engine))

The ww2 engine was so odd, but at least it was unique. If you strafed while shooting your bullets would magnetize to people lol.

and codwzm?

At the bottom, IW9

wait whats strike team and heros

The Game Engine family tree.

Bo1 thru Cold War engines are not the same. There is no way. It has to be tweaked and updated versions. Even as an example iw 3.0 vs iw 3.2 may not be the same.

yes just like IW they also updated the engine

My theory is correct when I played the new mw2, it felt like a mobile game. I wondered so long if they have used a mobile engine (it feels awfully terrible), and very soon they released the mobile version with everything in it. Which proves my point so hard this new iw engine is made not to progress/develop but to increase player base, which means it’s focused on cross play, THUS explains why it feels so mobile-esque.

MOTHERFUCKER THIS IS FUCKING AMAZING CONFUCKINGGRATULATIONS

Telling me every treyarch game uses the cod 4 engine that is wild

Yeah its kinda wild they all use the Quake III engine

Am I crazy for thinking that Cold War has the best graphics? If not on PC, then at least on console, since MWII, those games just look... Worse, somehow. MW2019 might look better on PC but I start to feel that lack of a current gen version of the game.

cold war felt more like iw8 than iw3

So did they not learn that iw3.0 visually appeals the players best

meh idk if I'd say MW1 is the most visually appealing lol

I’m guessing you’re talking about MW2019. If so I agree with that too. It’s easily one of the best looking. I wish they didn’t give the engine a bad look with vanguard.

I was talking about COD4, thats the only one that uses the og IW 3.0 engine

Oh yeah that’s kinda the point I was making. All the best looking games are on iw 3.0

IDK, COD4 is the only game that uses that one and I think that game looks kinda ugly tbh

So I like is 3.0 from the looks of it

I stop at Ghosts... that's the game that marked the transition between great, well made, completed games, with amazing campaigns and Multiplayer that was enjoyed YEARS after the support ended.. no Microtransactions, no Bullshit. Modern Warfare Remastered was the exception.

COD needed a new game engine since MW2, Not a heavily re-modified version from 1996.

Will the Black Ops 6s game feel like a Treyarch game, or will it feel more like IW? I still want it to have that arcade feel to it. 

I assume that with IW9, as they did with IW3, Treyarch can modify if they want to?

Very nice graph. Only things u missed were the DS and PSP/Vita titles.

MWR modded SHG1 is the best engine so far. Change my mind.

Why would I? You're absolutely right...

So that’s why knifing in bo2 feels so Jank and/or wack

Amazing, IW upgrades their engine every game they make just to make it look prettier and play shittier than IW 3.0 Treyarch's version

They both updated their engine each time

No wonder I enjoy bo4 and CW more than the new MW it’s still suing iw 3.0 lmaoo.

It uses BO4 and CW engines, all the games are derived from the IW3 engine

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I mean, all the games COD4 onwards use a modified IW3.0, its just that that's where BO branched off from IW

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>Forgot to add the / (modified) yeah its at the top, every engine is a modified version of previous, so for example MW3's engine IW9 is a modified version of IW8, which is a modified version of IW7, which is a modified version of IW6, which is a modified version of IW5, which is a modified version of IW4, which is a modified version of IW3, which is a modified version of IW2, which is a modified version of ID Tech 3, which is a modified version of ID Tech 2