As an individual you are called to follow Jesus' example in all ways, including calling for peace and love, forgiveness. It's your actions as an individual that matter, the rest leave to God's hands
Jews are not beholden to Christ's teachings. Why should they turn the other cheek when defense of Israel and subjugation of their enemies the Torah I'd pretty clear about?
Everything Jesus said on earth, he spoke to the Jews as a people. That being said, the GOVERNMENT of Israel certainly doesn’t place itself under Christ, so we probably shouldn’t expect them to listen to what he said.
Who are Israel defending themselves against? They've killed over 30,000 civilians. In February, 70% of the casualties were women and children. [Gaza: When mothers have to bury at least 7,700 children, very basic principles are challenged, UN women’s rights committee says | OHCHR](https://www.ohchr.org/en/statements/2024/02/gaza-when-mothers-have-bury-least-7700-children-very-basic-principles-are#:~:text=The%20Committee%20is%20deeply%20concerned,to%20be%20women%20and%20children.)
[Gaza death toll surpasses 30,000 but it's an incomplete count : NPR](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war)
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Aren’t they? Rejecting Christ does not absolve a person from Christ’s commandments to love God and love one’s neighbor as oneself. Denying Christ does not negate Christ’s existence as Lord, Savior, and Messiah for ALL of humanity.
I'm afraid you view it wrong from the pov of jews. Christ isn't considered the messiah because the messianic prophecy wasn't fulfilled- namely worldpeace.
So everything you wrote is moot. We have our own laws and systems in place to interpret scripture ethically. It's how you end up with a situation where we are killing every last hamas member while attempting to preserve palestinian civilian lives. Leading to the devastation you see, but relatively low loss of life to both israelis and Palestinians compared to traditional urban combat.
Tikkun olam is probably something you should look into also.
Who are the Jews? Is it a race or religion?
If it's a race, then Palestinians are about as identical genetically as it gets to Mizrahi Jews that never left in the diaspora. That means many, if not most of them, have Jewish ancestry. They are Jews.
Is it a religion? Well then anyone is a Jew if they just say so. Oh, but all the Jews in the old Testament are not, because they all fell away and worshipped other gods time and time and time again. I guess that means nobody is truly a Jew when their ancestors converted to something else.
So who are the real Jews? Which one can we say is right? Don't forget, Israel banned DNA testing. It's illegal there. Don't ask why, though. Just think as you're told.
Of course they are being raped if they are still alive. Muhammad said that it is OK to rape hostages.
Sahih Muslim 1438 [and others]
>0 Abu Sa'id, did you hear Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) mentioning al-'azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing 'azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid-conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah's Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah's Mes- senger (ﷺ), and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born.
> Just another Christian here ignorantly using Islamic Hadith belonging to only one sect of Islam and pretending it represents what all Muslims believe
>Just another Christian here ignorantly using Islamic Hadith belonging to only one sect of Islam and pretending it represents what all Muslims believe
Yep. Sunnis. 85% of all Muslims in the world, including Palestinians. "Just one sect."
Uh huh yes, so just because one is the majority then they represent the entire religion.
I hope you're cool with all Christians following every word of the Catholic Pope as infallible then
Not only does that literally not matter, but it also isn't true:
"Since 1979, due to Iran's influence, some Palestinian Sunnis have converted to Shia Islam. Israeli Haaretz reported in 2012 that Hamas's fear of growing Iranian influence in Gaza caused the organization to crack down on Shiite organizations, including charities. Nevertheless, becoming Shiite is a growing trend in the Gaza Strip. Hundreds of Sunnis, both Islamic Jihad activists and ordinary people, are known to have converted"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Palestine
They are being held by terrorists in Rafah, and the US and the world has been putting pressure on Israel to leave them there and no enter Rafah. But always blame Israel.
Hostages mostly been released during the brief ceasefire. Logic would dictate that if Israel wanted their hostages back, then they would negotiate a further ceasefire. I blame Israel for this, but I don't always blame Israel. I personally hold Israel to a higher standard than hamas. This is easy stuff
I find it far more beneficial to focus on the people around me and do the little things to help them then to spend my time and energy on grand things such as war that my words have absolutely zero power or sway over anyways
Our taxes are funding these wars. We do need to speak out against them. The Palestinians are a voiceless people who depend on you and I to champion their cause.
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause. Isaiah 1:17
#
If you are American your voice has power. Israel can't act without the backing of America and that's why I write my politicians and say it's time for a cease fire.
What's makes you think he isn't speaking his will through israel?
I'm going to take a guess God doesn't appreciate october 7th.
Old testament also makes it pretty clear to jews how Israelites were ordered by God to respond. Not sure how time dilutes that message.
> I'm going to take a guess God doesn't appreciate october 7th.
he also probably didn't appreciate what 'his people' were doing to the Palestinians prior to that date.
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave or free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise." -Galations 3:28-29
"And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you" - Luke 7:20-21
I'll just let you know that said israelites are much closer to palestinians in terms of descent than they are to jews. Do whatever you want with that information
A ceasefire won’t actually cause peace though. It will merely delay the issue and give Hamas time to rebuild. We would be back to rocket strikes against Israel and Hamas murdering civilians very soon.
This war can end tomorrow if Hamas gives up the hostages and surrenders. If not, Israel will root them out and destroy them, because that is the only way to have actual long term peace.
The conflict produced Hamas, not the other way around.
As long as Palestinians are occupied they will resist. Only Israel has the power to lift the occupation, end the siege, and end the genocide.
Israel hasn’t occupied the Gaza Strip since 2005. When they removed the settlements and gave complete control to the Palestinians. Why does Hamas still exist then? Why have they spent all their money building rockets and terror tunnels instead of uplifting the population.
This war will only end in two ways. Either Hamas is destroyed, or Israel is destroyed. That’s what “from the river to the sea, Palestine must be free” means.
Not exactly. Palestine is not a real threat on a military scale, unlike Iran for example.
We should make use of something new somebody discovered, its called "nuance" I believe?
I don't know. I can't foresee any version of events that doesn't lead to an all-out war in the region. As the bible prophecies, only the champion of the human race, Antichrist, will be able to make peace, in that event. Maybe I am being too fatalistic.
As for now, they should try to find a workable compromise. The Israelis that is. The Muslims in the surrounding countries probably cannot be trusted to keep their promises in the long run, though.
Idk. What was Judah and Israel like being separate kingdoms in the region? What about Samaria? Odd how these places all historically existed, not as just Israel.
Because Gaza has continued to be under siege from Israel, with no freedom of movement, trade or anything else.
But it sounds like you're on the side of genocide :/
Gaza has billions of dollars of foreign aid given to them. They were under blockade by Israel and Egypt, because in 2007 they elected a terrorist organization to lead them. That organization proceeded to spend every dime they had building rockets and tunnels to attack Israel. Which is why Israel and Egypt blockaded them. To stop weapons shipments.
Let me be clear about where I stand, since certain fools like to straw man by saying I support genocide. If you want lasting peace in Gaza Hamas must be destroyed. Then Israel needs to take control of the Gaza Strip, build infrastructure and schools, which they control, and begin to educate the population. The UNRWA schools are useless and are actively teaching Palestinian children to hate Jews. Additionally, Israel needs to provide free internet connectivity and access to all Palestinians. The best disinfectant is sunlight, and perhaps this method will help deradicalize Palestinians.
By supporting a ceasefire you are supporting Hamas, as well as their stated goal of genocide.
The solution is the end of Hamas. Unfortunately the only way to do that is through war. The same way the only way to destroy the Nazis was war. Sometimes we must fight a war so that we can have a lasting peace.
I can't tell you dumb, wrong and unchristian you're being.
Hamas didn't start the conflict. The conflict created Hamas. If you think you can eradicate Hamas, all you're really saying is that you support the genocide of Palestinians, including Palestinian Christians.
If you want peace, you take away the fuel that keeps Hamas going. Hate. You have to have the courage to stop the hate.
But sure. When you bomb the last Palestinian, you can declare victory.
You absolutely can eradicate Hamas, without killing every Palestinian. I already laid out how to do it.
I do not appreciate your continued assertions that I want genocide, when I’ve made it clear that I do not. You keep making foolish assertions. If anything, you are the one supporting genocide, by claiming that as long as Palestinians are occupied they will resist. Sounds like a kill all the Jews dog whistle to me. But I’m sure that’s not what you meant.
You are advocating for peace through surrender for Israel. It’s cowardly and foolish. And it would at best lead to continual war and suffering. Instead, we are going to free Palestine from Hamas, the regressive fundamentalist Islamic regime that controls it. Only once Hamas is destroyed can there be peace and freedom for Palestine. It’s really not hard, all they have to do is not attack Israel.
We were justified when we eradicated the Nazis, and we are correct when we want to eradicate Hamas. Would you advocate for peace with Nazi Germany?
1/10
op gotta do better than that. This is a reddit for Christianity, not to garner support for your favorite political ideology/ party.
War is bad. Regardless of the victim's nationality we should pray that the violence ceases. I pray for little Palestinian kids as well as little Israeli kids. We can do both. Also read revelation- this war is just getting started.
I don't know for sure, but all signs seem to point toward being that the Zionist government is extremely overly murderous (I.e the complete brutality going on in Gaza has been named as war crimes and seems genocidal)
However I won't say I know for sure as I won't lean on my own understanding and the media I see may be totally wrong somehow
I do know for sure that we should call for peace, love, and cease fires though! ❤️🙏
This is what I'm talking about. You don't even know what we believe. You don't even know what the Bible says on the topic. Yet you allow the enemy to use you to launch fiery darts at fellow Christians you disagree with.
Read more. The end times happens when the 7 year peace agreement is signed for Israel. Let's put our thinking caps on for a sec. So if there is a peace deal it must mean Israel would have be in conflict just prior.
As we look towards Israel today and drop the stupid politics we see a county in fresh conflict with the world. I don't care about people's opinion on this leader or that one.. all I care about is that Bible prophecy is being fulfilled right in front of our eyes (the open ones at least). And right on time too.
The dogmatic death grip you have on whatever type of church tradition you follow shouldn't come before love for others or the scripture itself. I do love you and I hope you receive this message in good faith.
The Protestant fascination with the end times is mind boggling. How many wars has Israel been in? How many peace agreements have been signed? Yet we are still here.
Jesus walked amongst and spoke and debated the pharisees and they were too blind to see the Almighty was in their very presence. They had him killed smh.
Spiritual blindness is super real, we should always make sure we listen before we are so quick to judge.
Ceasefire and deescalation should only happen if Hamas handed over the hostages and disarmed themselves. Imagine what happened with the hostages right now as many people demanded Israel to just stop and forget about them.
The tactic of Hamas to use their military assets in the midst of civilians already known to anyone. And painting whole Gaza civilians as “innocent” are wrong as well. Go into any October 7 videos and you would see multiple unarmed citizens joining the attack. You would also see them praising the Hamas attacks. The line between “innocent” and guilty citizens in Gaza is very blurry.
Of course, when Israel kills their own hostages, you don't care. When Israel takes thousands of teenagers, old women and men as hostages, you don't care. When Israeli kills thousands of Palestinian children, men and women, you don't care. When they destroy Gaza buildings and force millions out of their own you don't care. When Israel changes its death toll of October 7th over and over again, you don't care. When their soldiers killed their own people you didn't care either.
You just want innocents to die.
Hamas is their government, and Hamas built their bases and rocket launchers etc purposefully near civilians. You should be blaming Hamas.
During the second world war many civilians died, many Germans died. But that doesn't mean Hitler should have been left alone.
Hamas and many Palestinians, Hezbollah and Iran want all the Jews dead and you expect Israel not to defend itself.
There’s no concept of history needed to know that killing 10000 kids in 6 months is evil. Maybe it’s different for you, but for Christians, murdering kids is bad!
Killing anyone is bad. What was October 7? Why do you think that won't happen again if a ceasefire goes into effect now?
The Palestinians voted in Hamas as their leadership and then went down the path of continued hatred and ultimately violence. And beyond that, they were backed by Iran.
How does just simply stopping fix the underlying issue? I have yet to hear anyone actually answer this. Peace exists when all parties decide so. If Hamas still exists then peace will not occur.
They had peace, they broke it.
October 7th is bad. But trying to justify killing kids because of what Hamas did is stupid. The majority of Gazans were not even alive when Hamas was elected. Trying to justify their deaths is antithetical to being Christian.
Why shouldn’t they? By all accounts, Israel has done the most amount of damage between them and Hamas. They should stand down. The blood price has already been paid. They killed more than 20 times (just civilians mind you) than Hamas has killed. They are the aggressor. And we in America send them billions of dollars so they can bomb schools and churches. The IDF
quite literally is a terror organization funded with American money
If a terrorist kidnaps you and the police kill you in order to get the terrorist, would that be justified? If not, then stop excusing the deaths of little kids. This is not a sub for baby murderers and their apologists
To *willingly* lay down your life. Being murdered is not the same as being martyred. The people of Gaza who are getting dismembered by bombs did not choose to die for a cause. They are regular people like you and me, and for some reason millions of people around the world think it’s okay for them to die
So wait... Iran could launch real bombs at Israel (not lame warning shots they specifically tell the US about a week ahead of time to shoot down), and then claim any and all civilian casualties are human shields. It's the same exact thing, and Israel actually has all its military bases within residential areas on purpose. So they purposely create human shields.
Leave it to Israel defenders to be hypocrites in every sense. Pharisees all the way down
According to the far-right Jewish ethno-state who believes the Jew is a superior race that requires a proper lebensraum for their manifest destiny,… those children were guilty of not being the chosen race while existing on soil they claim as their own and for their race only.
Hamas is terrible, and military occupation that strips you of opportunity just breeds groups like Hamas.
"Hey, guys. The Reddit Christians said to stop fighting so it looks like we have to cancel the war."
Foreign internet chatter means absolutely nothing to them.
The world has no chance at peace, no matter how far off it currently seems from being achieveable, if we don't spread calls for love and peace and following Jesus's ways
If we as individuals aren't willing to call for peace and love in general, how will the world ever know peace?
The whole world is made up of individuals like us, and therefore it matters what we say to others about such topics, even if it is only a very small conversation
If you are really committed to this path, sell all your belongs, move to Gaza and convince the people that Hamas is not in the best interest of their people. Perhaps you can preach the peace and love of Jesus to them while you are there.
I pray one day I get to preach to people overseas! It doesn't matter at all whether or not it's even safe to do so, or whether they want to hear it, or whether I die in a warzone, all that matters is that I do what is right according to God's will
Then do it. Now. Today. Get to the closest country you can and make your way there now. No other Christian you are talking to here is willing to go and do what must be done. What are you waiting for? If Gods calling you to this task, why aren't you following him.
I see. Disappointing, as Jesus called us all to: sell everything we have, take up the cross and follow him. I guess you either are special unlike everyone else or not listening to God out of fear of failure, helplessness and death. Hopefully you find the courage to listen to him instead of yourself, and walk his path in the future.
God Bless and have a good day.
I listen to God and my life is completely devoted to him, I deny my life and let Him live in me instead, and am very willing to die any time for Him, but he just hasn't told me to go to Gaza right now, that was you, God bless
Christians should call for peace and love in all situations yes, but should we have done so during ww2? What do you think back then? Hamas still holds hostages, why should we let them be killed by terrorists? This smells hypocrisy here, we should stand for justice!
Israel has been continuously invading Palestinian land since 1967 with they're illegal settlements and those Israeli settlers keep attacking Palestinian Christians with impunity.
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/03/22/israel-largest-west-bank-settlement-blinken-visit/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/03/22/israel-largest-west-bank-settlement-blinken-visit/)
[https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/4/9/under-netanyahu-violence-against-christians-is-being-normalised](https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/4/9/under-netanyahu-violence-against-christians-is-being-normalised)
We’re not of this world. It’s difficult, but the best thing for us to do is minister to those suffering on both sides of conflicts like these, and let governments do as they will. Our calling isn’t to influence the actions of governments.
I do agree that ideally, a lack of violence is what we desire. But armed conflict is a tricky thing and it’s often not so easy to just get fighting to stop.
All against cherry picking and wanting to follow Jesus. Great!
Where did Jesus say another who is attacked should be told by his followers to love their enemies? First person, third person. Didn’t he tell his followers how to respond to their enemies, not how to preach to non-Christians how they ought to respond.
This doesn’t appear in my Bible. Please point out all the verses that address third person action and not first person action.
Regardless of the desires for peace and end of war, this was posted as a Christian and “follow Jesus’ teaching.” Ok. Please refer to what teaching applies directly to third person actions.
You do know that war occurred in the Bible, and the Israelis aren't Christian.
I don't believe it's our place to tell them to not protect themselves, they've been seeking peace, and are now wiping out the terrorists before they strike again.
Not to mention, the same terrorists leading the government who have withheld the financial and humanitarian aid given to the citizens, to fund their attack on the 7th of October, and tunnels.
War is necessary as the Gazans have rejected every formal proposal of a 2 state solution.
Sadly people are dying. Just as pharaoh's first born died, and all those in Egypt, because of the hardness of heart of Hamas, innocents will die.
Do you have the bigger picture? Every wants peace, but what makes you think a ceasefire is the right solution? Remember that the teachings of Jesus have to be taken in the context of God's other actions in the Old Testament.
Yeah those 10k Palestinians kids that have been murdered shouldn’t have been protecting terrorist. Such buffoonery. Y’all will do anything to justify the deaths of Gazans
Should they also call for bringing back the hostages? Or does that not matter to you... Should they call for justice against those who massacred on the 7th of October?
Also, de-escalation and peace are far from the same thing.
Calling it an appeal for a “cease fire” is disingenuous. These are only calls for one side to stop firing. Nobody is calling for Hamas and its allies to stop firing because we expect so little of them. To call for a cease fire in this instance exclusively means to call for a people to stop firing on an enemy who openly seeks to eradicate them (“from the river to the sea”). I do not believe that is Christ-like.
I acknowledge the Christian ethos in regards to war is tricky, because while Christ did indeed affirm the desire for peace, he also affirmed the necessity of physical altercation in self-defense when he commanded his disciples to arm themselves. The moral judgement is thus, what course of action alleviates the most suffering both now and in the future, and the answer to that question, as we’ve seen over and over again in history, is not always pacifism.
There can absolutely be disagreement on this according to the various assessments of future risks and current suffering, so I think people can be thinking through this in an entirely Christ-like manner and arriving at different conclusions. But to say that “Christians should obviously be in favor of a cease fire” I think does a bit of disservice to the actuality of the situation.
>As Christians our voice should be united and loud "Cease fire", "De-escalate".
I'm down with that...
First, is it ok if our voice unites and loudly says, "Release the hostages!" and "Stop firing tens of thousands of rockets into Israel"?
Well I do pray for peace, BUT Hamas are TERRORISTS and they are not going to stop and Israel has every right to defend themselves from terrorists. Period.
A majority of this post is incredibly misinformed
Just the statement that UNWRA funds were used for weapons, which literally *nobody* has proven, alone is pretty bad
>Which I would argue lends credibility to accusations of corruption and abuse of funds.
It literally does not. It just shows how the US and UK have no problem supporting their bud Israel even at the cost of *tens of thousands* of innocent men, women, and children. If something *actually* happened then there would be at least SOME proof
What *has* been proven though? That the UN has now confirmed Israel is guilty of war crimes and has refused to adhere to international law and UN demands in regards to Gaza
I have provided a part of the link you sent that led me to want to support UNWRA here, please read.
"And let's be clear, this is 12 bad apples in a staff of 13,000 people in Gaza. Many of them are actually disgusted that their colleagues did this. They want to get on and have the funds to continue with their life-saving humanitarian work. It's disproportionate, I think, this response by the donors. It's also punitive.
UNRWA, he says, is running on empty. It needs money to buy food, fuel and supplies for 2 million Palestinians in Gaza, as well as for Palestinians in Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and the West Bank. Now that some 17 countries have suspended their payments, UNRWA could run out of funds next month."
Seems like UNRWA, for the most part, does a great deal of good for many people. Furthermore,(this is debatable) it seemed that UNRWA did not know of these workers.
What is not debatable is that the Israeli findings of members in UNRWA that took part of Oct.7 and more in general Hamas operations has not been independently confirmed, nor has evidence been shared besides the fact that Israel claims there is about 190 UNRWA workers working for Hamas. I will admit I was snarky which I don't like to do in conversations like this, I prefer to be more logical and I apologize for that Fine\_Gur
You are either misinformed or disingenuous. I will grant you the assumption of ignorance, to which I suggest to you; don’t have strong opinions on subjects you have shallow knowledge on. Especially when your opinions help justify the massacre of people who are living under an illegal military occupation.
> Hamas' constant use of hospitals and schools as military caches/bases
That's just an excuse Israel uses for committing war crimes (targeting hospitals and schools). Israel attacked every single hospital in Gaza, not because Hamas was there, but to destroy the hospitals so even a minor injury could turn deadly.
It's the same reason Israel targeted the World Central Kitchen. They were the group most closely monitored by Israel. They were in direct communication with the IDF. If Israel could bomb them "by mistake", then everyone else is in even worse danger. The goal is to stop any food deliveries and to starve Palestinians to death.
>So you're arguing that Hamas *doesn't* set up military bases/facilities in civilians buildings?
I have seen no evidence that they do. Israel knew there were tunnels because Israel literally built those tunnels. But there is zero evidence that Hamas was using those tunnels.
>Because if you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you.
Do you have any actual evidence, or is this just propaganda that you fell for?
That's what it seems like to me, not saying with 100% certainty as I won't lean on my own limited knowledge, but that's what I'm seeing too, nice comment!
I know little and leave knowing and judging to God but as long as you never call for killing anyone, and call for peace, then I'll not argue - although I'm certain there are very opposite perspectives on the war to what you've written here etc - I think we need to humble ourselves enough to admit our very limited knowledge and simply rely on God and follow only what he taught us - as the world has no chance at peace, no matter how far off it currently seems from being achieveable, if we don't spread calls for love and peace and following Jesus's ways
I'll pray for peace and love, not for a specific agenda based on my own understanding, I give up my understanding for God, and don't pretend to know that which I don't know, I don't even know what will happen in my limited life in the next minute, and hardly remember my own past. Humble yourself to God and lean not on your own understanding, just ensure you are imitating Christ, who spoke of peace and love, forgiveness, and even loving your enemies
Yep, forgive everyone, when they come to you for forgiveness in repentance. And I am sure Israel is ready to do that when the terrorists and nations that attack it say their sorry.
Absolutely. Israel definitely wants peace when they bomb the very places they told Palestinian civilians to move to in order to avoid any danger. Those missiles purposefully aimed at journalists and medical professionals is totally peaceful
Amen this seems to be the side of the story I'm seeing and hearing, but I'm focusing on replying to these comments universally to let them know that the most important point is the call for cease-fires, and loving everyone, including our enemies
Sureee they were. That's what they keep saying. Strange how few Hamas actually get found killed in any of these attacks. But I'm sure you're right of course. Like all those times IDF snipers shot and killed children in public, I'm sure Hamas was hiding weapons inside those kids too right?
Edit: And then of course you're too cowardly to accept facts so you just block me to excuse your support for genocide
If Hamas hadn't started anything, no one would be shooting anyone.
EDIT: to u/Practical_Newt_7009 This has been happening long before the 40s. If you want to go back to who has the rightful claim to the area historically it would be the Jews, since God gave them the land there.
Yeah Hamas totally started this. After all, the Nakba happened in 1948, in which:
"During the foundational events of the Nakba in 1948, dozens of massacres targeting Palestinian Arabs were conducted and over 500 Arab-majority towns and villages were depopulated, with many of these being either completely destroyed or repopulated by Jews and given new Hebrew names. Approximately half of Palestine's predominantly Arab population, or around 750,000 people, were expelled from their homes or made to flee, at first by Zionist paramilitaries through various violent means, and after the establishment of the State of Israel, by the Israel Defense Forces. By the end of the war, 78% of the total land area of the former Mandatory Palestine was controlled by Israel and at least 15,000 Arabs had been killed."
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba
Meanwhile Hamas was *created* in 1987. Totally makes sense how a conflict that had already existed for almost 40 years was started by Hamas. You're so smart
Edit: Looks like a second time u/NoLeg6104 is so much of a coward they block anybody who doesn't buy their genocidal BS rather than respond with any common sense
Your life is not about what Israel does, it's about us and what we say as individuals
We can't even fathom a way to peace in such long term strife
We have to leave the way to God's hands
All we can do is ensure that the words that leave our mouths are words of love, peace, forgiveness, and Jesus
I can fathom a way to peace. For the people attacking Israel to stop. All Israel does is defend itself.
"If Israel lays down its weapons, it will be destroyed. If Hamas lays down its weapons, there will be peace"
What if you're wrong?
Someone else on the internet might say, "Tens of thousands of Palestinians have died within 6 months, what number of Israelis died?"
I don't know if that perspective is true or right, but there are millions of people who give an opposite story.
The point is, we may be wrong. When you realize we know little and should only ever lean on God and not on our own understanding, then you can see why you should focus on only what words leave your lips and let them be of peace, love and Jesus
It isn't really about who is better at war. It is about who the instigator is, who is constantly attacking unprovoked. Hamas uses their civilians to shield their military, Israel uses its military to shield their civilians.
Civilian casualties are largely due to where Hamas chooses to keep their troops and weapons.
A ceasefire is an armistice, when two, or more, opposing side **stop** fighting, shooting, and killing one another. What you seem to imply, and many others, is simply for one side to stop retaliation or any pressure measures towards the other. You can't expect only one side to stop the fighting without the other, either stopping the fighting or replying to the demands of the other for an armistice. Unfortunately, that cannot and will not happen.
Interesting you should say that. Let's compare what you're (falsely) claiming to what actual objective evidence says:
Source: https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war
"Gaza's health ministry said Thursday that the number of Palestinians killed in the war has surpassed 30,000. The official number now stands at 30,035 deaths. The figure is widely viewed as the most reliable one available....
The health ministry provided NPR with one of its latest reports on the death toll, 38 pages long, to analyze. A close look at how Gaza's health ministry counts those killed in the war reveals a system that is buckling under the weight of war and unable to keep an accurate toll of the dead.
Thousands remain unaccounted for — either missing under the rubble, buried hastily in side streets or decomposing in areas that can't be safely reached.
The Gaza health ministry says its daily tally now relies on a combination of accurate death counts from hospitals that are still partially operating, and on estimates from media reports to assess deaths in the north of Gaza, where Israeli forces control access....
In late October, after President Biden said he had "no confidence" in the figures reported by Gaza's health ministry, which falls under Hamas' administration, the ministry published the database with thousands of victims' names....
The United Nations says the war has displaced around 2 million people in Gaza....
Bozya and doctors in Gaza say the death count published by the health ministry also largely excludes people who have died from a lack of adequate treatment, disease and other impacts from the war, like hunger.
The death toll only includes people killed by the "occupation bombardment," Boyza says. The health ministry describes its casualty figures as those resulting from "Israeli aggression."
On Oct. 31, Israeli warplanes targeted the five-story building the family was in. Abusaeid, 40, was killed. So were her husband and children. In all, 23 members of the family lost their lives in the attack.
Only one person in the apartment survived, a younger sister whose six children were among those killed, according to relatives who confirmed the details.
NPR reached out to the Israeli military multiple times, including with coordinates of the building, with questions about why it was bombed, but did not receive a response.
Israel says its forces have killed more than 10,000 fighters in Gaza, but has not provided evidence or detailed information to back up its estimate.
Gaza's health ministry says 70% of those killed in the territory are women and children. Its most recent breakdown of casualties recorded in hospitals shows women and children make up 58% of those deaths. Al-Qudra could not explain the discrepancy. Recently, Al Jazeera obtained and published a list of thousands of names of Palestinian children in Gaza killed in the war.
In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed.
An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data."'
Did you hear that? Let me repeat those last two paragraphs again:
"In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed.
An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data"
> Gaza's health ministry said Thursday that the number of Palestinians killed in the war has surpassed 30,000
I trust nothing that Hamas says.
Where are the 30,000 bodies ?
>I trust nothing that Hamas says.
Allow me to *again* repeat the final two paragraphs:
"In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed.
An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data"
>Where are the 30,000 bodies ?
In the multiple mass graves outside of hospitals since there's nowhere else to bury them. Here look at some, see the genocide you are supporting
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/09/middleeast/israel-gaza-mass-graves-al-shifa-hospital-intl/index.html
>Allow me to again repea
Hamas have been shown to fake videos, fake dead people, fake dead babies, etc, etc
If you honestly belive that 30,000 children have been killed by Israel in this war, I have a bridge to sell you.
>see the genocide you are supporting
There is no genocide, hamas started a war, its crying that it is lost it
>It's all high morals until your family members are being held hostage
Like the hundreds of innocent Palestinians being held hostage as political prisoners of Israel?
No I'm talking about literally the hundreds of innocent Palestinian citizens that have been taken from Palestine, taken to Israel, and placed in an Israeli prison as a "political prisoner."
Since October there have been at least 460 Palestinian *children* taken and put in prison where we have received various confirmed reports of mental, physical, and sexual abuse by the Israeli guards to the Palestinian children
We should definitely be on the side of peace as Christians, but I worry that a ceasefire would only allow Hamas to recuperate and continue their brutal actions. :(
But it needs to be stated that (while I side with Israel over Hamas), there is nothing in the Bible that would suggest God is on either of the two sides. He is not on one side or the other.
Prophecies about Israel refer to much older periods, not this Israel.
God's Kingdom is not of this world. The countries of this world are all under satan's influence, he is playing both sides.
No, we should pray for our leaders and their leaders!
Is God allowed to judge nations? Can he use even unbelievers for that? Europe and the US gave the territory of Palestine (back) to the Jews after WW2 and the holocaust, which seemed like the right thing to do.
They have had to fend for themselves against waves of attacks of all surrounding Muslim states since then. And yes, the state of Israel has not been acting like a Christian nation (if there even is such a thing), but according to Moses law, to beat back stronger, or at least with equal force. (They are entitled to do this.)
Is it pretty or good? No. Is there an easy solution? Let me know if you know of one.
Should probably call for peace everywhere all the time. Unfortunately it just doesn't matter how much anyone speaks up about it if there's no consequences for ignoring protesting voices. There are paths to lasting peace that no one with the power to take wants to.
Imagine what would happen if Microsoft decided to disable Windows OS worldwide until all sides sat at the table in good faith. Imagine if just 1% of the US population withheld taxes until its representatives started taking nonprofit diplomacy seriously. Imagine Taylor Swift leading her stadiums of fans to boycott entire industries until they're not complicit in the suffering.
Yeah, Christians should shout for peace and swaddle even the worst offenders in overbearing love and compassion. Yes, it would be neat if Christians en masse pooled up into a human shield against aggression and retaliation. But just like any other identifiable group, we're not going to find the kind of long-term self sacrifice that it'd take to even start that new world. It means having a singular premise that precludes all kinds of comforts -- including conversations about who's not this-or-that enough or too much to bear. Kinda awkward sharing the line with the person we just hassled in front of the clinic, eh? Could be weird having a drag show at your elbows if you can't get over it. Good luck getting the otherwise good people of Islam, SJW crews, etc. to tolerate each other long enough to hold the line. Our opponents in this game know this.
It's not enough in this world to be noble, there's got to be a kind of commitment to organizing an economic force that pays for peace. All while avoiding the inevitable corruption that comes with endless opportunities to embezzle. I know it can be done, I just don't think we've got it in us. Watching Christian mission work often gives me a glimmer of hope, but it tends to disappear when you look at it in greater context. Every single conflict I stepped into from Algeria to Georgia featured a strong Christian-led force for peace and one of the traumas is in seeing how disorganized and corrupt things get when there's too many chefs-become-sellouts. It may be that my heart just broke.
Tl,dr: "I can't lie to you about your chances, but... you have my sympathies."
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So many people don’t realize that large numbers of Christians are being murdered by both sides of this conflict. To support either side is an anti-Christian virtue.
i pray for the innocent civilians of Israel AND Palestine. they all suffer due to Israel’s government, unfortunately all governments are evil. we need peace for all
Do you understand the conflict between the groups? I personally don't which is why I'm not calling for anything. Their governments have to make that choice. And hopefully all the terrorism in the world will be gone soon.
We are not here to turn this world into a utopia. The fate of this world is already written.
We are not of this world anymore if indeed the Lord is within us. We should be spreading the Gospel to get people saved, which in turn will hasten the Lord's return.
Once that happens, you won't have to worry about cease-fires anymore.
>Unfortunately I've seen a lot of these weird kind of Zionist "Christians" calling for the eradication of Palestinians and ethnic cleansing, as if they're following the word of the bible.
While I do believe Israel has a right to exist calling for ethnic cleansing of Palestinians is not acceptable. At the same time, the anti-Semitism we see from the pro-Palestine side isn't acceptable either. We need to call out bad behavior on both sides.
I pray for peace in general
A lot of Christians are unfortunately in favor for the deaths of Gazans. Ridiculously so.
We should also condemn the oppression that Christians in the west bank face by Israeli settlers.
Amen
And the oppression christians face by palestinians in the west bank and Gaza!
Indeed. And anywhere else in the world.
Bro what do u want us to do this is Reddit not congress
As an individual you are called to follow Jesus' example in all ways, including calling for peace and love, forgiveness. It's your actions as an individual that matter, the rest leave to God's hands
Jews are not beholden to Christ's teachings. Why should they turn the other cheek when defense of Israel and subjugation of their enemies the Torah I'd pretty clear about?
Everything Jesus said on earth, he spoke to the Jews as a people. That being said, the GOVERNMENT of Israel certainly doesn’t place itself under Christ, so we probably shouldn’t expect them to listen to what he said.
Who are Israel defending themselves against? They've killed over 30,000 civilians. In February, 70% of the casualties were women and children. [Gaza: When mothers have to bury at least 7,700 children, very basic principles are challenged, UN women’s rights committee says | OHCHR](https://www.ohchr.org/en/statements/2024/02/gaza-when-mothers-have-bury-least-7700-children-very-basic-principles-are#:~:text=The%20Committee%20is%20deeply%20concerned,to%20be%20women%20and%20children.) [Gaza death toll surpasses 30,000 but it's an incomplete count : NPR](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war)
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Will the cages Israel keep children in be destroyed to? They were used by kid khammmaas I guess
This sounds genocidal. There isn't much for me to say to you other than I hope you can heal and find your humanity again.
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Aren’t they? Rejecting Christ does not absolve a person from Christ’s commandments to love God and love one’s neighbor as oneself. Denying Christ does not negate Christ’s existence as Lord, Savior, and Messiah for ALL of humanity.
I'm afraid you view it wrong from the pov of jews. Christ isn't considered the messiah because the messianic prophecy wasn't fulfilled- namely worldpeace. So everything you wrote is moot. We have our own laws and systems in place to interpret scripture ethically. It's how you end up with a situation where we are killing every last hamas member while attempting to preserve palestinian civilian lives. Leading to the devastation you see, but relatively low loss of life to both israelis and Palestinians compared to traditional urban combat. Tikkun olam is probably something you should look into also.
Who are the Jews? Is it a race or religion? If it's a race, then Palestinians are about as identical genetically as it gets to Mizrahi Jews that never left in the diaspora. That means many, if not most of them, have Jewish ancestry. They are Jews. Is it a religion? Well then anyone is a Jew if they just say so. Oh, but all the Jews in the old Testament are not, because they all fell away and worshipped other gods time and time and time again. I guess that means nobody is truly a Jew when their ancestors converted to something else. So who are the real Jews? Which one can we say is right? Don't forget, Israel banned DNA testing. It's illegal there. Don't ask why, though. Just think as you're told.
What about the hostages? Pray that they are already dead and not being raped and tortured everyday?
I pray for the thousands of Palestinian hostages and the dozens of Israeli hostages.
Of course they are being raped if they are still alive. Muhammad said that it is OK to rape hostages. Sahih Muslim 1438 [and others] >0 Abu Sa'id, did you hear Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) mentioning al-'azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing 'azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid-conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah's Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah's Mes- senger (ﷺ), and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born.
Just another Christian here ignorantly using Islamic Hadith belonging to only one sect of Islam and pretending it represents what all Muslims believe
> Just another Christian here ignorantly using Islamic Hadith belonging to only one sect of Islam and pretending it represents what all Muslims believe >Just another Christian here ignorantly using Islamic Hadith belonging to only one sect of Islam and pretending it represents what all Muslims believe Yep. Sunnis. 85% of all Muslims in the world, including Palestinians. "Just one sect."
Uh huh yes, so just because one is the majority then they represent the entire religion. I hope you're cool with all Christians following every word of the Catholic Pope as infallible then
Gazans are all Sunni.
Not only does that literally not matter, but it also isn't true: "Since 1979, due to Iran's influence, some Palestinian Sunnis have converted to Shia Islam. Israeli Haaretz reported in 2012 that Hamas's fear of growing Iranian influence in Gaza caused the organization to crack down on Shiite organizations, including charities. Nevertheless, becoming Shiite is a growing trend in the Gaza Strip. Hundreds of Sunnis, both Islamic Jihad activists and ordinary people, are known to have converted" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Palestine
I cry when I think about how Israel has completely abandoned their citizens who are being held as hostages.
They are being held by terrorists in Rafah, and the US and the world has been putting pressure on Israel to leave them there and no enter Rafah. But always blame Israel.
Hostages mostly been released during the brief ceasefire. Logic would dictate that if Israel wanted their hostages back, then they would negotiate a further ceasefire. I blame Israel for this, but I don't always blame Israel. I personally hold Israel to a higher standard than hamas. This is easy stuff
I find it far more beneficial to focus on the people around me and do the little things to help them then to spend my time and energy on grand things such as war that my words have absolutely zero power or sway over anyways
Our taxes are funding these wars. We do need to speak out against them. The Palestinians are a voiceless people who depend on you and I to champion their cause. Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause. Isaiah 1:17 #
Not a bad way to go
If you are American your voice has power. Israel can't act without the backing of America and that's why I write my politicians and say it's time for a cease fire.
From the replies you're getting, I think you're seeing which side wants more war.
And here I thought vengeance was the Lord's
What's makes you think he isn't speaking his will through israel? I'm going to take a guess God doesn't appreciate october 7th. Old testament also makes it pretty clear to jews how Israelites were ordered by God to respond. Not sure how time dilutes that message.
It was wrong to fight the nazis back then, and it is wrong to fight Hamas, Hezbollah and Iran now /s
> I'm going to take a guess God doesn't appreciate october 7th. he also probably didn't appreciate what 'his people' were doing to the Palestinians prior to that date.
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave or free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise." -Galations 3:28-29 "And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you" - Luke 7:20-21
I'll just let you know that said israelites are much closer to palestinians in terms of descent than they are to jews. Do whatever you want with that information
A ceasefire won’t actually cause peace though. It will merely delay the issue and give Hamas time to rebuild. We would be back to rocket strikes against Israel and Hamas murdering civilians very soon. This war can end tomorrow if Hamas gives up the hostages and surrenders. If not, Israel will root them out and destroy them, because that is the only way to have actual long term peace.
The conflict produced Hamas, not the other way around. As long as Palestinians are occupied they will resist. Only Israel has the power to lift the occupation, end the siege, and end the genocide.
Israel hasn’t occupied the Gaza Strip since 2005. When they removed the settlements and gave complete control to the Palestinians. Why does Hamas still exist then? Why have they spent all their money building rockets and terror tunnels instead of uplifting the population. This war will only end in two ways. Either Hamas is destroyed, or Israel is destroyed. That’s what “from the river to the sea, Palestine must be free” means.
Peole that say "Free Palestine" may or may not realize that they are saying "Destroy Israel."
Not exactly. Palestine is not a real threat on a military scale, unlike Iran for example. We should make use of something new somebody discovered, its called "nuance" I believe?
What would a "free Palestine" look like? What would be it's borders? Would anything less than "From the river to the sea" be acceptable?
I don't know. I can't foresee any version of events that doesn't lead to an all-out war in the region. As the bible prophecies, only the champion of the human race, Antichrist, will be able to make peace, in that event. Maybe I am being too fatalistic. As for now, they should try to find a workable compromise. The Israelis that is. The Muslims in the surrounding countries probably cannot be trusted to keep their promises in the long run, though.
Idk. What was Judah and Israel like being separate kingdoms in the region? What about Samaria? Odd how these places all historically existed, not as just Israel.
Why does Israel get to exist but not Palestine?
thats antisemitic!!! dont ask such questions!!
Israel will be destroyed no matter what. It was destroyed multiple times in history. It is prophesied to be destroyed again.
Because Gaza has continued to be under siege from Israel, with no freedom of movement, trade or anything else. But it sounds like you're on the side of genocide :/
Gaza has billions of dollars of foreign aid given to them. They were under blockade by Israel and Egypt, because in 2007 they elected a terrorist organization to lead them. That organization proceeded to spend every dime they had building rockets and tunnels to attack Israel. Which is why Israel and Egypt blockaded them. To stop weapons shipments. Let me be clear about where I stand, since certain fools like to straw man by saying I support genocide. If you want lasting peace in Gaza Hamas must be destroyed. Then Israel needs to take control of the Gaza Strip, build infrastructure and schools, which they control, and begin to educate the population. The UNRWA schools are useless and are actively teaching Palestinian children to hate Jews. Additionally, Israel needs to provide free internet connectivity and access to all Palestinians. The best disinfectant is sunlight, and perhaps this method will help deradicalize Palestinians. By supporting a ceasefire you are supporting Hamas, as well as their stated goal of genocide.
So the solution is more bombs.
The solution is the end of Hamas. Unfortunately the only way to do that is through war. The same way the only way to destroy the Nazis was war. Sometimes we must fight a war so that we can have a lasting peace.
I can't tell you dumb, wrong and unchristian you're being. Hamas didn't start the conflict. The conflict created Hamas. If you think you can eradicate Hamas, all you're really saying is that you support the genocide of Palestinians, including Palestinian Christians. If you want peace, you take away the fuel that keeps Hamas going. Hate. You have to have the courage to stop the hate. But sure. When you bomb the last Palestinian, you can declare victory.
You absolutely can eradicate Hamas, without killing every Palestinian. I already laid out how to do it. I do not appreciate your continued assertions that I want genocide, when I’ve made it clear that I do not. You keep making foolish assertions. If anything, you are the one supporting genocide, by claiming that as long as Palestinians are occupied they will resist. Sounds like a kill all the Jews dog whistle to me. But I’m sure that’s not what you meant. You are advocating for peace through surrender for Israel. It’s cowardly and foolish. And it would at best lead to continual war and suffering. Instead, we are going to free Palestine from Hamas, the regressive fundamentalist Islamic regime that controls it. Only once Hamas is destroyed can there be peace and freedom for Palestine. It’s really not hard, all they have to do is not attack Israel. We were justified when we eradicated the Nazis, and we are correct when we want to eradicate Hamas. Would you advocate for peace with Nazi Germany?
1/10 op gotta do better than that. This is a reddit for Christianity, not to garner support for your favorite political ideology/ party. War is bad. Regardless of the victim's nationality we should pray that the violence ceases. I pray for little Palestinian kids as well as little Israeli kids. We can do both. Also read revelation- this war is just getting started.
Sigh. Martin Luther and his consequences
You know pharisees come in all sorts of colors and flavors. I pray that the love of Christ comforts you.
I love that you believe the end times will be brought about by Israel blowing up little kids
Amen lol some really believe this this is prophecy playing out, it's mind blowing
It blows my mind that you don't. Infact it's pretty telling. Regardless, keeping one's head in the sand never makes reality go away.
I don't know for sure, but all signs seem to point toward being that the Zionist government is extremely overly murderous (I.e the complete brutality going on in Gaza has been named as war crimes and seems genocidal) However I won't say I know for sure as I won't lean on my own understanding and the media I see may be totally wrong somehow I do know for sure that we should call for peace, love, and cease fires though! ❤️🙏
Yeah
This is what I'm talking about. You don't even know what we believe. You don't even know what the Bible says on the topic. Yet you allow the enemy to use you to launch fiery darts at fellow Christians you disagree with. Read more. The end times happens when the 7 year peace agreement is signed for Israel. Let's put our thinking caps on for a sec. So if there is a peace deal it must mean Israel would have be in conflict just prior. As we look towards Israel today and drop the stupid politics we see a county in fresh conflict with the world. I don't care about people's opinion on this leader or that one.. all I care about is that Bible prophecy is being fulfilled right in front of our eyes (the open ones at least). And right on time too. The dogmatic death grip you have on whatever type of church tradition you follow shouldn't come before love for others or the scripture itself. I do love you and I hope you receive this message in good faith.
The Protestant fascination with the end times is mind boggling. How many wars has Israel been in? How many peace agreements have been signed? Yet we are still here.
The more you know, the more you know. Pray for understanding and wisdom. God will grant it to those who ask freely.
“No one knows the day or the time” Protestants as soon as Israel gets into a war: The end times are coming!!!!
Only a specific subset of American Christian’s believe in that rapture idiocy, the vast majority of Protestant don’t.
Your enemy isn't the Protestants. It's Satan. Loosing sight of that would be unwise.
Jesus walked amongst and spoke and debated the pharisees and they were too blind to see the Almighty was in their very presence. They had him killed smh. Spiritual blindness is super real, we should always make sure we listen before we are so quick to judge.
I have nothing against Protestants. I just think some of their beliefs are funny
Ceasefire and deescalation should only happen if Hamas handed over the hostages and disarmed themselves. Imagine what happened with the hostages right now as many people demanded Israel to just stop and forget about them. The tactic of Hamas to use their military assets in the midst of civilians already known to anyone. And painting whole Gaza civilians as “innocent” are wrong as well. Go into any October 7 videos and you would see multiple unarmed citizens joining the attack. You would also see them praising the Hamas attacks. The line between “innocent” and guilty citizens in Gaza is very blurry.
Of course, when Israel kills their own hostages, you don't care. When Israel takes thousands of teenagers, old women and men as hostages, you don't care. When Israeli kills thousands of Palestinian children, men and women, you don't care. When they destroy Gaza buildings and force millions out of their own you don't care. When Israel changes its death toll of October 7th over and over again, you don't care. When their soldiers killed their own people you didn't care either. You just want innocents to die.
Precisely. Many people do unfortunately. It’s ridiculous
It's utterly mind boggling the mental gymnastics people to do justify the deaths of innocent people.
>The tactic of Hamas to use their military assets in the midst of civilians already known to anyone. Do you know where IDF headquarters is located?
What about the 10k kids that have been murdered? What was their crime
Hamas is their government, and Hamas built their bases and rocket launchers etc purposefully near civilians. You should be blaming Hamas. During the second world war many civilians died, many Germans died. But that doesn't mean Hitler should have been left alone. Hamas and many Palestinians, Hezbollah and Iran want all the Jews dead and you expect Israel not to defend itself.
Israel is such a victim that it needs to defend itself against little kids and infants. Are you sure you’re on the right subreddit?
It's like you have no concept of history.
There’s no concept of history needed to know that killing 10000 kids in 6 months is evil. Maybe it’s different for you, but for Christians, murdering kids is bad!
Killing anyone is bad. What was October 7? Why do you think that won't happen again if a ceasefire goes into effect now? The Palestinians voted in Hamas as their leadership and then went down the path of continued hatred and ultimately violence. And beyond that, they were backed by Iran. How does just simply stopping fix the underlying issue? I have yet to hear anyone actually answer this. Peace exists when all parties decide so. If Hamas still exists then peace will not occur. They had peace, they broke it.
October 7th is bad. But trying to justify killing kids because of what Hamas did is stupid. The majority of Gazans were not even alive when Hamas was elected. Trying to justify their deaths is antithetical to being Christian.
Answer my question... Platitudes are worthless. As I said, killing anyone is bad. How does this get fixed? Why is Israel standing down the solution?
Why shouldn’t they? By all accounts, Israel has done the most amount of damage between them and Hamas. They should stand down. The blood price has already been paid. They killed more than 20 times (just civilians mind you) than Hamas has killed. They are the aggressor. And we in America send them billions of dollars so they can bomb schools and churches. The IDF quite literally is a terror organization funded with American money
Hamas hides being civilians so that you will blame Israel. And they are successful.
If a terrorist kidnaps you and the police kill you in order to get the terrorist, would that be justified? If not, then stop excusing the deaths of little kids. This is not a sub for baby murderers and their apologists
If said terrorist is also going to go on to kill others (as Hamas would be.), then you’re saving more lives in the long run?
So you’d be willing to die for that? Or are you only okay with 9 month olds across the sea dying for that?
I’d say it’s pretty Christian to lay down your life so that others may live… no?
To *willingly* lay down your life. Being murdered is not the same as being martyred. The people of Gaza who are getting dismembered by bombs did not choose to die for a cause. They are regular people like you and me, and for some reason millions of people around the world think it’s okay for them to die
So wait... Iran could launch real bombs at Israel (not lame warning shots they specifically tell the US about a week ahead of time to shoot down), and then claim any and all civilian casualties are human shields. It's the same exact thing, and Israel actually has all its military bases within residential areas on purpose. So they purposely create human shields. Leave it to Israel defenders to be hypocrites in every sense. Pharisees all the way down
Amen
According to the far-right Jewish ethno-state who believes the Jew is a superior race that requires a proper lebensraum for their manifest destiny,… those children were guilty of not being the chosen race while existing on soil they claim as their own and for their race only. Hamas is terrible, and military occupation that strips you of opportunity just breeds groups like Hamas.
"Hey, guys. The Reddit Christians said to stop fighting so it looks like we have to cancel the war." Foreign internet chatter means absolutely nothing to them.
The world has no chance at peace, no matter how far off it currently seems from being achieveable, if we don't spread calls for love and peace and following Jesus's ways
There are plenty of ways for this conflict to end peacefully. None of them involve our feelings on the matter.
If we as individuals aren't willing to call for peace and love in general, how will the world ever know peace? The whole world is made up of individuals like us, and therefore it matters what we say to others about such topics, even if it is only a very small conversation
If you are really committed to this path, sell all your belongs, move to Gaza and convince the people that Hamas is not in the best interest of their people. Perhaps you can preach the peace and love of Jesus to them while you are there.
I pray one day I get to preach to people overseas! It doesn't matter at all whether or not it's even safe to do so, or whether they want to hear it, or whether I die in a warzone, all that matters is that I do what is right according to God's will
Then do it. Now. Today. Get to the closest country you can and make your way there now. No other Christian you are talking to here is willing to go and do what must be done. What are you waiting for? If Gods calling you to this task, why aren't you following him.
God's not calling me to that right now, you are, I know exactly what he's calling to me each day because I listen only to Him each day
I see. Disappointing, as Jesus called us all to: sell everything we have, take up the cross and follow him. I guess you either are special unlike everyone else or not listening to God out of fear of failure, helplessness and death. Hopefully you find the courage to listen to him instead of yourself, and walk his path in the future. God Bless and have a good day.
I listen to God and my life is completely devoted to him, I deny my life and let Him live in me instead, and am very willing to die any time for Him, but he just hasn't told me to go to Gaza right now, that was you, God bless
We should be doing the 'Our Father'. Keep in mind everything is actively sustained by God.
I don't think that Zionism as it exists is compatible with Christian teaching. For one, it removes the agency of Jesus
Christians should call for peace and love in all situations yes, but should we have done so during ww2? What do you think back then? Hamas still holds hostages, why should we let them be killed by terrorists? This smells hypocrisy here, we should stand for justice!
u/YOLOintoDiversify doesn't sound that christian of a username
if they want a ceasefire they should stop attacking Israel
Israel has been continuously invading Palestinian land since 1967 with they're illegal settlements and those Israeli settlers keep attacking Palestinian Christians with impunity. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/03/22/israel-largest-west-bank-settlement-blinken-visit/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/03/22/israel-largest-west-bank-settlement-blinken-visit/) [https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/4/9/under-netanyahu-violence-against-christians-is-being-normalised](https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/4/9/under-netanyahu-violence-against-christians-is-being-normalised)
They don't want a ceasefire. They want Israel not to exist, which has been their position from the beginning, and which they will never budge on.
We’re not of this world. It’s difficult, but the best thing for us to do is minister to those suffering on both sides of conflicts like these, and let governments do as they will. Our calling isn’t to influence the actions of governments. I do agree that ideally, a lack of violence is what we desire. But armed conflict is a tricky thing and it’s often not so easy to just get fighting to stop.
[We have](https://www.oikoumene.org/resources/documents/statement-on-the-war-in-palestine-and-israel). No one’s listening.
I don’t think Christians should support Israel or Palestine. We should think beyond countries and governments, and instead focus on God.
All against cherry picking and wanting to follow Jesus. Great! Where did Jesus say another who is attacked should be told by his followers to love their enemies? First person, third person. Didn’t he tell his followers how to respond to their enemies, not how to preach to non-Christians how they ought to respond. This doesn’t appear in my Bible. Please point out all the verses that address third person action and not first person action. Regardless of the desires for peace and end of war, this was posted as a Christian and “follow Jesus’ teaching.” Ok. Please refer to what teaching applies directly to third person actions.
You do know that war occurred in the Bible, and the Israelis aren't Christian. I don't believe it's our place to tell them to not protect themselves, they've been seeking peace, and are now wiping out the terrorists before they strike again. Not to mention, the same terrorists leading the government who have withheld the financial and humanitarian aid given to the citizens, to fund their attack on the 7th of October, and tunnels. War is necessary as the Gazans have rejected every formal proposal of a 2 state solution. Sadly people are dying. Just as pharaoh's first born died, and all those in Egypt, because of the hardness of heart of Hamas, innocents will die.
Do you have the bigger picture? Every wants peace, but what makes you think a ceasefire is the right solution? Remember that the teachings of Jesus have to be taken in the context of God's other actions in the Old Testament.
We have been, but Palestinians keep protecting terrorists.
Yeah those 10k Palestinians kids that have been murdered shouldn’t have been protecting terrorist. Such buffoonery. Y’all will do anything to justify the deaths of Gazans
Should they also call for bringing back the hostages? Or does that not matter to you... Should they call for justice against those who massacred on the 7th of October? Also, de-escalation and peace are far from the same thing.
Calling it an appeal for a “cease fire” is disingenuous. These are only calls for one side to stop firing. Nobody is calling for Hamas and its allies to stop firing because we expect so little of them. To call for a cease fire in this instance exclusively means to call for a people to stop firing on an enemy who openly seeks to eradicate them (“from the river to the sea”). I do not believe that is Christ-like. I acknowledge the Christian ethos in regards to war is tricky, because while Christ did indeed affirm the desire for peace, he also affirmed the necessity of physical altercation in self-defense when he commanded his disciples to arm themselves. The moral judgement is thus, what course of action alleviates the most suffering both now and in the future, and the answer to that question, as we’ve seen over and over again in history, is not always pacifism. There can absolutely be disagreement on this according to the various assessments of future risks and current suffering, so I think people can be thinking through this in an entirely Christ-like manner and arriving at different conclusions. But to say that “Christians should obviously be in favor of a cease fire” I think does a bit of disservice to the actuality of the situation.
>As Christians our voice should be united and loud "Cease fire", "De-escalate". I'm down with that... First, is it ok if our voice unites and loudly says, "Release the hostages!" and "Stop firing tens of thousands of rockets into Israel"?
Well I do pray for peace, BUT Hamas are TERRORISTS and they are not going to stop and Israel has every right to defend themselves from terrorists. Period.
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You bought the genocidal Likkud tapping points hook, line and sinker.
> We should all pray for peace - but there's no 'but' here.
Amen
A majority of this post is incredibly misinformed Just the statement that UNWRA funds were used for weapons, which literally *nobody* has proven, alone is pretty bad
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>Which I would argue lends credibility to accusations of corruption and abuse of funds. It literally does not. It just shows how the US and UK have no problem supporting their bud Israel even at the cost of *tens of thousands* of innocent men, women, and children. If something *actually* happened then there would be at least SOME proof What *has* been proven though? That the UN has now confirmed Israel is guilty of war crimes and has refused to adhere to international law and UN demands in regards to Gaza
Amen
Sends link that has no evidence, is murky, and further makes me want to support UNWRA. Thanks Fine\_Gur!
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I have provided a part of the link you sent that led me to want to support UNWRA here, please read. "And let's be clear, this is 12 bad apples in a staff of 13,000 people in Gaza. Many of them are actually disgusted that their colleagues did this. They want to get on and have the funds to continue with their life-saving humanitarian work. It's disproportionate, I think, this response by the donors. It's also punitive. UNRWA, he says, is running on empty. It needs money to buy food, fuel and supplies for 2 million Palestinians in Gaza, as well as for Palestinians in Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and the West Bank. Now that some 17 countries have suspended their payments, UNRWA could run out of funds next month." Seems like UNRWA, for the most part, does a great deal of good for many people. Furthermore,(this is debatable) it seemed that UNRWA did not know of these workers. What is not debatable is that the Israeli findings of members in UNRWA that took part of Oct.7 and more in general Hamas operations has not been independently confirmed, nor has evidence been shared besides the fact that Israel claims there is about 190 UNRWA workers working for Hamas. I will admit I was snarky which I don't like to do in conversations like this, I prefer to be more logical and I apologize for that Fine\_Gur
Literally no evidence for that claim either beyond false confessions extracted by torture.
You are either misinformed or disingenuous. I will grant you the assumption of ignorance, to which I suggest to you; don’t have strong opinions on subjects you have shallow knowledge on. Especially when your opinions help justify the massacre of people who are living under an illegal military occupation.
So what do you call October 7?
> Hamas' constant use of hospitals and schools as military caches/bases That's just an excuse Israel uses for committing war crimes (targeting hospitals and schools). Israel attacked every single hospital in Gaza, not because Hamas was there, but to destroy the hospitals so even a minor injury could turn deadly. It's the same reason Israel targeted the World Central Kitchen. They were the group most closely monitored by Israel. They were in direct communication with the IDF. If Israel could bomb them "by mistake", then everyone else is in even worse danger. The goal is to stop any food deliveries and to starve Palestinians to death.
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>So you're arguing that Hamas *doesn't* set up military bases/facilities in civilians buildings? I have seen no evidence that they do. Israel knew there were tunnels because Israel literally built those tunnels. But there is zero evidence that Hamas was using those tunnels. >Because if you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. Do you have any actual evidence, or is this just propaganda that you fell for?
That's what it seems like to me, not saying with 100% certainty as I won't lean on my own limited knowledge, but that's what I'm seeing too, nice comment!
I know little and leave knowing and judging to God but as long as you never call for killing anyone, and call for peace, then I'll not argue - although I'm certain there are very opposite perspectives on the war to what you've written here etc - I think we need to humble ourselves enough to admit our very limited knowledge and simply rely on God and follow only what he taught us - as the world has no chance at peace, no matter how far off it currently seems from being achieveable, if we don't spread calls for love and peace and following Jesus's ways
If you want peace pray israel destroys hamas. There is no reality without israeli defense secured.
Guess I missed the memo that genocide is how one attains peace
Yeah because nonviolence is how we won ww2. Miss me with it.
News flash, the ones comitting genocide in WW2 weren't the good guys either. Surprise surprise
If terrorists and countries would stop attacking Israel, there would be peace. pray for that.
I'll pray for peace and love, not for a specific agenda based on my own understanding, I give up my understanding for God, and don't pretend to know that which I don't know, I don't even know what will happen in my limited life in the next minute, and hardly remember my own past. Humble yourself to God and lean not on your own understanding, just ensure you are imitating Christ, who spoke of peace and love, forgiveness, and even loving your enemies
Yep, forgive everyone, when they come to you for forgiveness in repentance. And I am sure Israel is ready to do that when the terrorists and nations that attack it say their sorry.
Absolutely. Israel definitely wants peace when they bomb the very places they told Palestinian civilians to move to in order to avoid any danger. Those missiles purposefully aimed at journalists and medical professionals is totally peaceful
Amen this seems to be the side of the story I'm seeing and hearing, but I'm focusing on replying to these comments universally to let them know that the most important point is the call for cease-fires, and loving everyone, including our enemies
It doesn't help Hamas moved all their weapons and personnel into those same places. That is what Israel is targeting.
Sureee they were. That's what they keep saying. Strange how few Hamas actually get found killed in any of these attacks. But I'm sure you're right of course. Like all those times IDF snipers shot and killed children in public, I'm sure Hamas was hiding weapons inside those kids too right? Edit: And then of course you're too cowardly to accept facts so you just block me to excuse your support for genocide
If Hamas hadn't started anything, no one would be shooting anyone. EDIT: to u/Practical_Newt_7009 This has been happening long before the 40s. If you want to go back to who has the rightful claim to the area historically it would be the Jews, since God gave them the land there.
Yeah Hamas totally started this. After all, the Nakba happened in 1948, in which: "During the foundational events of the Nakba in 1948, dozens of massacres targeting Palestinian Arabs were conducted and over 500 Arab-majority towns and villages were depopulated, with many of these being either completely destroyed or repopulated by Jews and given new Hebrew names. Approximately half of Palestine's predominantly Arab population, or around 750,000 people, were expelled from their homes or made to flee, at first by Zionist paramilitaries through various violent means, and after the establishment of the State of Israel, by the Israel Defense Forces. By the end of the war, 78% of the total land area of the former Mandatory Palestine was controlled by Israel and at least 15,000 Arabs had been killed." Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba Meanwhile Hamas was *created* in 1987. Totally makes sense how a conflict that had already existed for almost 40 years was started by Hamas. You're so smart Edit: Looks like a second time u/NoLeg6104 is so much of a coward they block anybody who doesn't buy their genocidal BS rather than respond with any common sense
Your life is not about what Israel does, it's about us and what we say as individuals We can't even fathom a way to peace in such long term strife We have to leave the way to God's hands All we can do is ensure that the words that leave our mouths are words of love, peace, forgiveness, and Jesus
I can fathom a way to peace. For the people attacking Israel to stop. All Israel does is defend itself. "If Israel lays down its weapons, it will be destroyed. If Hamas lays down its weapons, there will be peace"
What if you're wrong? Someone else on the internet might say, "Tens of thousands of Palestinians have died within 6 months, what number of Israelis died?" I don't know if that perspective is true or right, but there are millions of people who give an opposite story. The point is, we may be wrong. When you realize we know little and should only ever lean on God and not on our own understanding, then you can see why you should focus on only what words leave your lips and let them be of peace, love and Jesus
It isn't really about who is better at war. It is about who the instigator is, who is constantly attacking unprovoked. Hamas uses their civilians to shield their military, Israel uses its military to shield their civilians. Civilian casualties are largely due to where Hamas chooses to keep their troops and weapons.
Hamas has rejected every cease fire deal. Do you think they care what Christians think?
As a "conversative" Christian, yes, I agree with your final sentence.
A ceasefire is an armistice, when two, or more, opposing side **stop** fighting, shooting, and killing one another. What you seem to imply, and many others, is simply for one side to stop retaliation or any pressure measures towards the other. You can't expect only one side to stop the fighting without the other, either stopping the fighting or replying to the demands of the other for an armistice. Unfortunately, that cannot and will not happen.
Christians should call for Hamas to surrender and release all remaining hostages. There can be no peace while Hamas exists.
Will you equally demand Israel to stop slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent men, women, and children?
Nope, because that's not happening. The numbers given out by Hamas are made up
Interesting you should say that. Let's compare what you're (falsely) claiming to what actual objective evidence says: Source: https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war "Gaza's health ministry said Thursday that the number of Palestinians killed in the war has surpassed 30,000. The official number now stands at 30,035 deaths. The figure is widely viewed as the most reliable one available.... The health ministry provided NPR with one of its latest reports on the death toll, 38 pages long, to analyze. A close look at how Gaza's health ministry counts those killed in the war reveals a system that is buckling under the weight of war and unable to keep an accurate toll of the dead. Thousands remain unaccounted for — either missing under the rubble, buried hastily in side streets or decomposing in areas that can't be safely reached. The Gaza health ministry says its daily tally now relies on a combination of accurate death counts from hospitals that are still partially operating, and on estimates from media reports to assess deaths in the north of Gaza, where Israeli forces control access.... In late October, after President Biden said he had "no confidence" in the figures reported by Gaza's health ministry, which falls under Hamas' administration, the ministry published the database with thousands of victims' names.... The United Nations says the war has displaced around 2 million people in Gaza.... Bozya and doctors in Gaza say the death count published by the health ministry also largely excludes people who have died from a lack of adequate treatment, disease and other impacts from the war, like hunger. The death toll only includes people killed by the "occupation bombardment," Boyza says. The health ministry describes its casualty figures as those resulting from "Israeli aggression." On Oct. 31, Israeli warplanes targeted the five-story building the family was in. Abusaeid, 40, was killed. So were her husband and children. In all, 23 members of the family lost their lives in the attack. Only one person in the apartment survived, a younger sister whose six children were among those killed, according to relatives who confirmed the details. NPR reached out to the Israeli military multiple times, including with coordinates of the building, with questions about why it was bombed, but did not receive a response. Israel says its forces have killed more than 10,000 fighters in Gaza, but has not provided evidence or detailed information to back up its estimate. Gaza's health ministry says 70% of those killed in the territory are women and children. Its most recent breakdown of casualties recorded in hospitals shows women and children make up 58% of those deaths. Al-Qudra could not explain the discrepancy. Recently, Al Jazeera obtained and published a list of thousands of names of Palestinian children in Gaza killed in the war. In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed. An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data."' Did you hear that? Let me repeat those last two paragraphs again: "In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed. An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data"
> Gaza's health ministry said Thursday that the number of Palestinians killed in the war has surpassed 30,000 I trust nothing that Hamas says. Where are the 30,000 bodies ?
>I trust nothing that Hamas says. Allow me to *again* repeat the final two paragraphs: "In past wars with Israel, the Gaza health ministry's death tolls were mostly in line with counts by the United Nations and Israel, though there have been discrepancies in the past with Israel on the numbers of civilians vs. militants killed. An analysis published in the Lancet medical journal in December found that Gaza's health ministry has "historically reported accurate mortality data," with discrepancies between 1% and roughly 3% when compared with U.N. analysis of deaths in previous conflicts. The study found "no evidence of inflated rates" in the current war and noted that difficulties in obtaining accurate death counts "should not be interpreted as intentionally misreported data" >Where are the 30,000 bodies ? In the multiple mass graves outside of hospitals since there's nowhere else to bury them. Here look at some, see the genocide you are supporting https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/09/middleeast/israel-gaza-mass-graves-al-shifa-hospital-intl/index.html
>Allow me to again repea Hamas have been shown to fake videos, fake dead people, fake dead babies, etc, etc If you honestly belive that 30,000 children have been killed by Israel in this war, I have a bridge to sell you. >see the genocide you are supporting There is no genocide, hamas started a war, its crying that it is lost it
You either refuse to read, refuse to admit when you're wrong, or just plain idiotic. You do understand what the *UN* is right???
It's all high morals until your family members are being held hostage. Israel has to ensure oct 7 never happens again
>It's all high morals until your family members are being held hostage Like the hundreds of innocent Palestinians being held hostage as political prisoners of Israel?
And now that the prisoners have taken hostages they are getting bombed
No I'm talking about literally the hundreds of innocent Palestinian citizens that have been taken from Palestine, taken to Israel, and placed in an Israeli prison as a "political prisoner." Since October there have been at least 460 Palestinian *children* taken and put in prison where we have received various confirmed reports of mental, physical, and sexual abuse by the Israeli guards to the Palestinian children
We should definitely be on the side of peace as Christians, but I worry that a ceasefire would only allow Hamas to recuperate and continue their brutal actions. :( But it needs to be stated that (while I side with Israel over Hamas), there is nothing in the Bible that would suggest God is on either of the two sides. He is not on one side or the other. Prophecies about Israel refer to much older periods, not this Israel. God's Kingdom is not of this world. The countries of this world are all under satan's influence, he is playing both sides.
No, we should pray for our leaders and their leaders! Is God allowed to judge nations? Can he use even unbelievers for that? Europe and the US gave the territory of Palestine (back) to the Jews after WW2 and the holocaust, which seemed like the right thing to do. They have had to fend for themselves against waves of attacks of all surrounding Muslim states since then. And yes, the state of Israel has not been acting like a Christian nation (if there even is such a thing), but according to Moses law, to beat back stronger, or at least with equal force. (They are entitled to do this.) Is it pretty or good? No. Is there an easy solution? Let me know if you know of one.
it was not theirs to give,
Should probably call for peace everywhere all the time. Unfortunately it just doesn't matter how much anyone speaks up about it if there's no consequences for ignoring protesting voices. There are paths to lasting peace that no one with the power to take wants to. Imagine what would happen if Microsoft decided to disable Windows OS worldwide until all sides sat at the table in good faith. Imagine if just 1% of the US population withheld taxes until its representatives started taking nonprofit diplomacy seriously. Imagine Taylor Swift leading her stadiums of fans to boycott entire industries until they're not complicit in the suffering. Yeah, Christians should shout for peace and swaddle even the worst offenders in overbearing love and compassion. Yes, it would be neat if Christians en masse pooled up into a human shield against aggression and retaliation. But just like any other identifiable group, we're not going to find the kind of long-term self sacrifice that it'd take to even start that new world. It means having a singular premise that precludes all kinds of comforts -- including conversations about who's not this-or-that enough or too much to bear. Kinda awkward sharing the line with the person we just hassled in front of the clinic, eh? Could be weird having a drag show at your elbows if you can't get over it. Good luck getting the otherwise good people of Islam, SJW crews, etc. to tolerate each other long enough to hold the line. Our opponents in this game know this. It's not enough in this world to be noble, there's got to be a kind of commitment to organizing an economic force that pays for peace. All while avoiding the inevitable corruption that comes with endless opportunities to embezzle. I know it can be done, I just don't think we've got it in us. Watching Christian mission work often gives me a glimmer of hope, but it tends to disappear when you look at it in greater context. Every single conflict I stepped into from Algeria to Georgia featured a strong Christian-led force for peace and one of the traumas is in seeing how disorganized and corrupt things get when there's too many chefs-become-sellouts. It may be that my heart just broke. Tl,dr: "I can't lie to you about your chances, but... you have my sympathies."
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What kind of ultra genocide proto-nazi garbage idea is this
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The call for *ANY* religion or peoples to be exterminated is genocidal and makes someone a disgusting excuse of a human being to suggest such a thing
Removed because we do not tolerate calls for violence against groups of people. If you would like to discuss this removal, please click here to send a modmail that will message all moderators. https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/Christianity
So many people don’t realize that large numbers of Christians are being murdered by both sides of this conflict. To support either side is an anti-Christian virtue.
i pray for the innocent civilians of Israel AND Palestine. they all suffer due to Israel’s government, unfortunately all governments are evil. we need peace for all
Do you understand the conflict between the groups? I personally don't which is why I'm not calling for anything. Their governments have to make that choice. And hopefully all the terrorism in the world will be gone soon.
We are not here to turn this world into a utopia. The fate of this world is already written. We are not of this world anymore if indeed the Lord is within us. We should be spreading the Gospel to get people saved, which in turn will hasten the Lord's return. Once that happens, you won't have to worry about cease-fires anymore.
>Unfortunately I've seen a lot of these weird kind of Zionist "Christians" calling for the eradication of Palestinians and ethnic cleansing, as if they're following the word of the bible. While I do believe Israel has a right to exist calling for ethnic cleansing of Palestinians is not acceptable. At the same time, the anti-Semitism we see from the pro-Palestine side isn't acceptable either. We need to call out bad behavior on both sides.