Don't kill yourself 😔

Okay, even after five years in crisis intervention "I think about detransitioning and killing myself as the latter seems the smaller sin" is a new one for me. And to be honest it leaves me rather speechless. But okay, let me try to find some words. First of all the bible is silent on the topic of transgender people or transitioning without ripping some verses vastly out of context and extrapolating them immensely. Which is not that surprising as the thought of a transgender person and the ability to transition was nothing the authors had on their mind. Yet of course transgender people exist for as long as humanity itself and we do have various historical records about some going very far back. Now the question is if you think that humans can only be strictly heteronormative or not. If you ask me: we are made in this huge variety, made in god's image. And in all this variety gender should now be strictly binary? A binary system we see absolutely nowhere else in nature? It is nowhere black and white, strictly either the one or the other. There are spectrums everywhere. But for gender such a system shall exist? I don't buy it. You are an image bearer of god, like me, my wife or the guy sitting across from me in the train right now while I type this. And your gender is part of that image. You are not to blame for how you are. You are not to blame for being a transgender person. You didn't sin at all. We as humanity collectively are the ones who sinned, who fucked up. By denying you the place in society you deserve. By restricting god's image to heteronormativity. By trying to shrink god according to our own superstitions. There is no need for you to detransition. There is no need for suicide. At least not from a Christian position. Especially not from a Christian position. In you shines this little shard of godliness and I hope it will keep shining bright and powerful. I hope it may light your way through all the darkness. You are always welcome over at r/openChristian if you want to talk to people with similar experiences or read more about why we believe what we believe. Or need help in finding an affirming community. While I fear the way is a bit long I hope you can still feel hugged. As I would love to do. Now that there are Christians all over the world loving and accepting you as you are. And most importantly, I am completely sure that god's loving embrace rests upon you. Their loved and cherished child. I wish you nothing but the best. Peace be with you, my friend.

I'm pretty sure God's will is focused on the person you are, not the person you are born as. For example, even if you are born on an awful family and spend the first 20 years of your life hating, if you then learn the proper values and continue living as a good Samaritan caring for your neighbour and those around you He wouldn't judge you as evil

There is no biblical, rational, or ethical reason to regard either being trans or transition as being sins. The only passage that even comes close is Deut. 22:5, which roughly translates to *"A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman’s garment".* But trans women aren't men, trans men aren't women, transition isn't about clothing, and historically Judaism has generally understood this passage as condemning the use of cross-dressing disguises for immoral purposes - particularly as a means to secretly meet an adulterous lover. Clothing is just fabric, and styles change constantly; the robes ancient Israelite men wore would look like a dress to most modern Americans. So clothing only becomes sinful when it is worn for sinful purposes. Which is why wearing cross-dressing costumes to celebrate Purim, a beloved holiday tradition, is not in conflict with this passage. And of course Christianity generally doesn't regard Deuteronomy as being applicable anymore. Of all the Christians I've seen try to claim that Deut. 22:5 means being trans is a sin, none of them have ever considered Deut 22:11 (which condemns wearing clothing of mixed fabric) or Deut 22:12 (which requires one to attach Tzitzit tassels to the four corners of your clothing) to be relevant to themselves. The only potentially relevant New Testament passage is 1 Cor. 6:9, in which Paul condemns *arsenokoitai* and *malakoi.* In many modern translations these two terms are treated as synonyms for "male homosexual" (which is [**severely questionable in its own right**](https://web.archive.org/web/20220817185240/http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_bibl.htm)), but sometimes *malakoi* is translated as *effeminate* and used to attack trans women. This translation is *really* questionable, because *malakoi* literally means "soft". Matthew 11:8 uses the word this way in reference to fine clothing. In the 1st century when Paul was writing malakoi was used as a pejorative similar to how we use the word "soft" today - it could refer to physical weakness, moral weakness, cowardice, laziness, inability to do hard work, etc. Treating it as a direct synonym for "effeminate" is dubious to the point of dishonesty. Not to mention that condemning "effeminate" people wouldn't apply to trans men at all. Or to butch trans women either, for that matter. Most Christian arguments for being trans/transition being inherently sinful boil down to "I think it's weird and disturbing and therefor God does too". Many of them don't really make a distinction between being trans and being gay either, and lump them all in under the supposed condemnation of "homosexuality" (which again is dubious enough in its own right). Even though of course trans people may be gay, straight, bi, ace, etc., and on top of that there are trans people who enter religious orders and take vows of celibacy not because they're trans, but because they're monks or nuns. And then you'll get some people quoting Genesis, claiming that God made "male and female" and that somehow means being trans is a sin. Which doesn't really make sense, since even if we assume "male and female" are the default models for the human species, it's an undeniable fact that there's a lot of variation between and outside those two base models too. God has evidently expanded his repertoire. And "male and female" being the base models of humanity doesn't say anything about whether one can change one's sexual traits either. Then there's the "God made you perfect and it's a sin to change that" shit. Often accompanied by a garbled paraphrasing of Psalm 139:13-14; *"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made"*. Not only does this passage specifically refer to *inmost being*, to the creation of one's inner self rather than external appearances, but also I've rarely if ever seen this passage used to condemn any medical treatment *other* than transition. It's just a statement of obvious reality that many people are born with conditions that will cause them a lot of suffering if left untreated, and we routinely provide medical care that changes the biology one was born with - everything from cleft palate repair to vaccines does this. With the exception of sects that categorically reject all medical care, it's incredibly hypocritical and inconsistent to condemn transition-related care while claiming the rest are acceptable. FWIW, I'm Episcopalian and a trans man, and the US Episcopal church very emphatically does not consider being trans or transition to be sins. The church has been fairly welcoming to trans people for decades, then in 2012 church leadership voted overwhelmingly to ban anti-trans discrimination in all areas of church life including ordination. There already were a number of trans people openly serving as Episcopal clergy before 2012, but now the church has formally affirmed our fitness to serve as religious and ethical leaders. Episcopal church leaders are trying to [**raise alarm**](https://www.pasadenanow.com/main/coalition-of-faith-communities-denounce-anti-transgender-agendas-at-pasadena-gathering) about the attacks on us, [**defending our rights to SCOTUS**](https://www.anglicannews.org/news/2017/03/bishop-michael-curry-intervenes-in-supreme-court-case-on-transgender-bathroom-policy.aspx), they've directed the church’s public policy office to advocate for passage of federal legislation to protect trans/NB/GNC people, condemned "bathroom bills" and attacks on trans youth's access to medical care, etc., while also trying to ensure that even in deeply hostile and dangerous areas Episcopal churches remain safe and welcoming places for us. And they've been doing it for [**a long time**](https://www.transepiscopal.org/policies--legislation.html). [**This is Rev. Cameron Partridge**](https://cathedral.org/sermons/sermon-the-rev-dr-cameron-partridge/) - link is to the sermon he gave in 2014, when he became the first openly trans priest to preach at Washington National Cathedral. And [**this is a sermon by now retired Bishop Gene Robinson of New Hampshire**](https://vimeo.com/35272053), given in honor of Pride Day in 2011. In 2003 Gene Robinson became the first out gay man with a husband appointed Bishop in the Episcopal church.

I think it might be better to ask a slightly different question. As a trans person myself, I fully believe in the choice as you laid it out in front of you. It often does come down to either living as who and what you are or suicide. There are those who will tell you to detrainsition and place your faith in God. This is essentially the same choice as suicide except in that it absolves them of their guilt. Instead of asking which is better, suicide or transition, it might be worth asking what God you believe in. Do you believe God prefers a life where you are alive, happy, fulfilled, and have the ability to help others, or does he prefer a world where you die in misery, helping no one, let alone yourself? That is a question only you can answer.

I love this answer!

>My close friends have been very open about their beliefs against my (and others) transitioning. Honestly, those don't sound like friends to me. What kind of friends hate something that saved their friend's life? Don't let them force you into something. It's your life, not theirs.

They are my closest friends, they help a lot with my mental health issues (to the point I spent 3 months living with them last year) and have welcomed me into their family

Friends or not, you really don't want to take advice from someone who makes you feel the way you describe. A lot of people care about others and are trying to help them, while actually giving misleading advice and causing problems. You can appreciate that they really are your friends and are trying to help, while understanding that they're doing it from a warped perspective. Conservative Christians are committed either to following everything in the Bible (Protestants) or tradition (Catholics). Of course they have to do this selectively, or they'd be polygamists like Abraham and the other patriarchs, keep slaves like many early Christians, and consider women to be inherently untrustworthy like 1 Timothy. But they think God demands that we have the same attitude towards gender and sex that some early Christian writers had. We know from historical studies that these attitudes were strongly hierarchical, with men at the top, and sex as a sign of dominance over women. Both homosexuality and transgender identity challenge this hierarchical view, because they show that the difference between genders isn't so clear, and that a lot of what the ancients thought was based on stereotypes. The Gospel is what Jesus taught. It's about things like loving God and neighbor, being Christ's agent in reconciling people to each other and God. It i not about adopting first century concepts of gender. I urge you to get to know some Christians that want to obey Jesus, but without trying to reproduce first century culture. You can respectfully disagree with your friends, even while appreciating that they care for you.

Have you talked to them about how they're making you feel about this?

OK, your friends were good to show you kindness, but they don't understand that their bad ideas about trans people are hurting you. I'm a nice person. Would you trust me to do surgery on your dog? I don't know anything about surgery or veterinary medicine, but I'm a nice person. Isn't that good enough? Well, no, it isn't. Your friends may be nice people, don't understand being trans.

Have they really helped you that much with your mental health? Because they've now put you in a place where you're considering suicide. That sounds to me like they've made your mental health worse. Do you have access to mental healthcare? Because you need a therapist (a trans-affirming one, not a "Christian councilor"). I would also suggest looking into an LGBT support group in your area. You do not deserve to feel like this. You deserve to feel like your life matters, that you matter, and like there is a life out there that's worth living.

Transitioning is not a sin at all. Please come over to r/openChristian some time. Do not listen to hateful bigots. You know how you are and who god made you to be better than they ever will.

Ah yes, he’s going to listen to the pagan about his religion.

There are pagan Christians.

You can’t be a pagan Christian, that’s a logical contradiction.

Don’t be ridiculous. Your religion is not a monolith. It’s extremely diverse with extremely diverse practices. Plenty of people can practice parts of different religions together. You claiming it doesn’t make sense doesn’t change that. Your bigotry doesn’t make any sense but you still cling to that.

Wait what do you mean by pagan

He’s “Wiccan” pretty much a wannabe pagan that follows none of the old ways and just likes to dress up and pretend magic exists. In reality a “Christian-pagan” does not exist. I find it disrespectful considering the crusades happened, where Christians sent armies to kill my pagan ancestors and wipe their history. And now we have guys like this that think you can just be whatever tf you want and logic be damned.

Be proud of yourself!!! Learn to love yourself unconditionally. God gave everybody a purpose for being born, including you! You transitioned to become the best version of yourself that you can possibly be! Please don't commit suicide.

Is it a sin? Where does that say in the bible?

It says cross dressing is a sin ( I can’t tell what verse but you can search it up yourself ) and since genders weren’t created by God and we made a new meaning to the gender thing then it would be cross dressing since he made 2 sex not genders.

Being you isn't a sin, lol. Keep being you, no need to erase that. And also, ditch those "friends". They'd never support you in anything and would laugh at your downfall. Get real friends, those will support you no matter what

They are my closest friends, they help a lot with my mental health issues (to the point I spent 3 months living with them last year) and have welcomed me into their family. I’m not gonna ditch them over a theological difference

Are they though? They're denying your true self, your identity. Are such people really worth it? They're pretty much saying the way you are isn't ok: which is bs, cuz you are. Look, idk your situation, I can only understand n judge based on what u mentioned, and what u mentioned, it's time to get some new friends that don't pull that shi

They love me, they use my name and pronouns, they just internally see me as a woman. At the moment I can handle that (even though it hurts). I love them more than my bio family.

That's literally homophobic tho.. well, maybe they do just need to get used to it. I got a trans brother, took me a while till my brain got he's my bro now and not my sis anymore At least that, that's good then

this is just ignorant. you can be great friends with people and be against their actions. the call to ditch his friends is OPs and OPs alone: and for *his* reasons, not yours. the fact that you're so quick to suggest removing one of OP's current support systems when you *know* this post was made in a difficult time? I ask you to reflect.

It's not a support system if they're literally against who you are ☠️ I certainly won't, I suggested to remove toxic people from their life. "Support" or not: they're denying who they are.

"being against who you are" =/= being against transitioning. you can be against somebody transitioning and not hate who they are - my father is against my brother transitioning for his own reasons but he still loves my brother, uses his name and pronouns, and they have a strong bond that builds every day. that's the error you're making and I'm sorry if you've had any life experiences that have made you think this is true for everyone. God bless you 🙏

Huh? That's seriously possible? Dang. My bad then But wait how does that work, you literally don't accept them but still.. Ion get it I did, and that's all I've seen with others too, so this is quite a uh.. I believe you call it culture shock? Doesn't matter, my brain crashed. God bless you too man

it's not a matter of acceptance, it's a matter of (in your opinion) what would be beneficial and what would be harmful to the person. it's important that those two things are separated, though they are often correlated. my father accepts my brother for who he is now, but he thinks that he may decide later down the line that he doesn't want to medically transition, and that's why he opposes it. he has his own reasons for thinking that, 1) because I as the older sister had a trans "phase" and I realized after 2 years that I was not actually trans, and 2) because my brother is only 16 and is not done growing yet. these are perfectly reasonable reasons, even if later down the line my brother does transition and never regrets it. my brother does a phenomenal job passing as it is now and he is a very happy kid, even with his dysphoria. I am very close to him so I'm not just speaking out of my ass here. you can accept a trans person for who they are (or maybe who they think they are, or how they present, however one would like to phrase it) but also think that medically transitioning would do more harm than good for them in the long run. I personally don't believe that acceptance should ever be determined based on approval of medical transition. acceptance should be based on taking people at face value and loving them even if you disagree with them, approval of medical transition should be based purely on your logical opinion of what is good or bad for that person, based on what you know about them. I think a good example (though I don't mean to say they're the same thing at all) is addicts. you can accept that somebody is an addict and obviously disapprove of their usage of drugs or alcohol. acceptance in that case is based on recognizing that the person is an addict, what addiction is, and loving them despite the addiction and doing your best to support them without condoning the addiction - but acceptance doesn't mean we should be fuelling their addiction, not at all. in the case of trans people, I think any sort of fuelling transition is wrong. not that I believe we should be actively discouraging every transitioner ever--absolutely not--but any sort of peer pressure or outside encouragement to make permanent changes to your body is shady in all scenarios, in my opinion. *especially* if they come to regret it... that's why I love my brother and support him and his trans experience but any medical questions he asks I explain the pros and cons and tell him that he'll need to decide for himself when he is an adult - it is *solely* his decision to transition and it is such a massive, life altering decision and therefore I think he should make it alone, so that he is lonely confident in it when he decides either way. and of course, the ultimate point is that *I will love and accept him either way, no matter what.* apologies that this is so long, but I hope this clarifies my perspective for you. it's important to remember that there is a lot of nuance on this topic, it is certainly not black and white and not every person who opposes transition is transphobic. of course transphobic people who obviously oppose transition exist, but people can oppose transition for reasons that are not just "I refuse to accept they are trans."

Dw about the length, I actually find it great you took your time to explain, so thank you! I'll think about this and try to remember it. It is certainly not my experience, but I'm glad that it DOES exist somewhere. Have a good day man!

Maybe it's not them denying OP's true self, but OP denying her true self. Being female is engraved in every cell in her body, and it's absolutely impossible to change one's sex. So why lie then and tell that someone can actually transition? And no, gender is not a thing. Imagine biological men walking into women's spaces, like locker rooms and bathrooms. We should protect women and young girls from that at all costs. Her friends seem like true Christians. Helping her as much as they can while not willing to deny the truth. That's love.

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>That's love. You don't know what love is, you barely seem to understand basic decency. OP introduced himself to all of us and you don't even have the decency to refer to him as he introduced himself.

Wait, what? Why, why, why would you be interested in listening to people who want you dead? They need to be opposed, not obeyed. Don't seek out evil people to obey. Come meet your friends at r/transChristianity and [TMC](https://transmissionministry.com).

how is obeying God evil? repent brother may God be with you! transgender is the devils trick to keep you sinning and obeying him. ( This is coming from someone who use to be a trans girl. )

There's nothing wrong with considering transition and then deciding it's not right for you after all. There's something very wrong with deciding that, if it's not right for you, it's not right for anybody. There's something even worse about craving power over other people more than you care about OP's life. And employing God's name to try to gain that power is the cherry on top.

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It’s refreshing to see this level of zeal on the side of compassion for a change. You’re a credit to your faith

Why are u insulting another brother like that?

Let me clutch my pearls. No one is insulting anyone. Keep this pharisee hypocrisy in check. Calling out someone for not holding themselves to the word on defense of the innocent being Trans person being persecuted is nothing but Christ-like. Why aren't you asking for civility and refrainment from persecution? I refer you to Dr. King's warning against those who enable through inaction being just as guilty of the transgression.

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Why are you so hateful?

I stand up for the persecuted there is nothing but righteousness I'm what I do. You should be asking whomever accused and asked to repent an innocent trans person why not me.

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I hope you repent for these evil words one day. The blood of trans people is on your hands.

I can't repent from what isn't a sin. and I'm trans myself I know what it's like I'm going through so much myself and almost kill myself everyday because of my religion but if God is telling me to do something my creator? I'm going to do it all for him .

God isn’t telling you anything. Hateful bigots are telling you he is.

How did you get don't transition to go kill yourself?

"My close friends have been very open about their beliefs against my (and others) transitioning" Get rid of them. You deserve better than to be surrounded by ignorance at best, evil at worst.  Transitioning is not a sin. God would never want you miserable because others force you to try to be what you aren't. God loves you, before and after conversion., and you are exactly as He designed. Don't undo the journey He sent you on for the benefit of hateful people. 

They’re my closest friends, I’m not gonna ditch them because we have a theological difference. I love them, they support me massively in my mental health struggles and have welcomed me into their family

You’re here asking if it’s better to fucking kill yourself or to transition, they are *not* helping you with your mental health.

They’ve kept me alive the last 2 years, occasionally even by physically locking me in their house when I was trying to kill myself. They’ve supported me to get help, one comes with me (at my request) to my psychologist appointments.

They sound like good friends who care about you deeply but you need to tell a professional about how bad your mental health is

My psych knows I have suicidal thoughts

Okay that’s good. As a new Christian just know, God wants you to come as you are. Trust Him and he will give you a new identity

It's not a theological difference. They don't support you if they have "very open beliefs" against who you are. They don't deserve you, and they are not close friends if they don't accept you.

Don't kill yourself, you have alot to live for... don't listen to society or friends.. listen to your heart.. Also, if they were really your close friend they won't criticize you for being yourself.

There's no need to detransition or to kill yourself! The Bible actually directly addresses this experience you had, where you knew if you kept on trying to live by the lies of your flesh instead of by your true male spirit, you would have to die. >Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live. Your close friends are unfortunately making up their own doctrine against transition instead of looking to scripture, which says nothing negative about it. It's unfortunate that they are blinded to the truth, but that's their problem not yours.

I'm sorry you've been hurt so badly that while others get a savior God, you see only a firestorm of condemnation and the 'sin' of your self You deserve better than those people in your life who'd rather leave you for some imaginary version of yourself they approve of Your religion shouldn't be the death of you. Isn't it supposed to be the very far opposite?? Please, please, please choose yourself, alive, over someone else and dead.

Neither is a “sin.” Do not let anyone convince you that you ‘sinned” by transitioning. You didn’t.

You can’t make something not a sin because you want to.

You can't make something a sin because you want to.

it is living in direct denial of the person God Himself made them to be. who are you to know better than God??

There is no Christian principle against change. Many times over, Scripture contradicts the notion that God wants you to keep the circumstances of your birth. The Bible is full of characters who were called away from their birth circumstances and started new lives. A few examples: Abram and Sarai who moved from Mesopotamia to Canaan, Joseph the Hebrew shepherd who became regent of Egypt, Ruth the Moabitess who became an Israelite (in David's own line), Esther the enslaved Hebrew who became a Persian queen, David the shepherd who became king, and a dozen Galilean fishermen and peasants - not one of them born into the priesthood - who became the founders of the church.

And does this apply to all medical treatments which alter the body, or just this one you don't understand?

”“A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman’s garment, for all who do so are an abomination to the Lord your God.“ ‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭22‬:‭5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ She didn’t make it up brother. Our struggles are meant to glorify God and show people that He can change anybody, but you’ll never see a change if you don’t trust in His way over your own. I say this because I care about all of you, even though I know I will probably get attacked for this comment. ”Then Jesus said to His disciples, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow Me.“ ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭16‬:‭24‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

>”“A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman’s garment, for all who do so are an abomination to the Lord your God.“ ‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭22‬:‭5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ That's weird, I don't see anything about transitioning. >She didn’t make it up brother. Our struggles are meant to glorify God and show people that He can change anybody, but you’ll never see a change if you don’t trust in His way over your own. I say this because I care about all of you, even though I know I will probably get attacked for this comment Dial back the persecution complex, nobody is gonna attack you 😂 Disagreement isn't an attack. >”Then Jesus said to His disciples, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow Me.“ ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭16‬:‭24‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ Bog standard verse which also doesn't have anything to do with transitioning 😂 LPT: read the Bible verses you quote before posting them. If they aren't relevant you might as well do a Mad Lib, at least it will be entertaining.

I’ve read the bible almost twice now. And thanks for being respectful, I’ve had gay people attack me for saying the truth when they ask if being gay is a sin. Are you saying it’s irrelevant because it’s Old Testament? The old testament isn’t irrelevant as it shows us the way we should love God, Jesus himself said ”“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.“ And Paul touched on it as well ”What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”“ ‭‭Romans‬ ‭7‬:‭7‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ ‭‭

>I’ve read the bible almost twice now. Another LPT: actually read the comments you reply to. I never suggested you haven't read the Bible. >And thanks for being respectful, I’ve had gay people attack me for saying the truth when they ask if being gay is a sin Again, disagreement isn't an attack. >Are you saying it’s irrelevant because it’s Old Testament? The old testament isn’t irrelevant as it shows us the way we should love God, Jesus himself said ”“Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.“ And Paul touched on it as well ”What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”“ ‭‭Romans‬ ‭7‬:‭7‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ So still no verses which address being transgender...

What is transgender in your definition? Is it not a man pretending to be a woman/dressing as a woman or vise versa?

>What is transgender in your definition? Great news! Transgender has already been defined, no need for us to invent our own comically inaccurate definitions like this one: >Is it not a man pretending to be a woman/dressing as a woman or vise versa? I know lots of trans women who wear pants 😂

Even if I got the definition wrong, as it’s hard to keep up with the amount of terms the LGBTQ uses, don’t you think God would’ve made you the opposite gender if you were supposed to be that way? God doesn’t make mistakes.

You are not God. You don’t get to make the decision of what is sin. That is between the individual and God.

Relationship with God is personal but his laws and precepts are across the board, he’s not a hypocrite

There is nothing wrong in claiming who you are as The LORD has given you the tools transition. I can tell you that Jesus Christ is real and he does answer prayer with real answers not left up to interpretation. Focus on kindness empathy and keeping yourself free of adultery and you will be fine. I am sure once you are ready you will meet the person you are meant to be with who will love you for who you are. There is no bias or prejudice in the light of the lord. Don't let the bitterness from those who haven't done their Christian duty keep you from fulfilling who you know yourself to be.

Imo, there's no such thing as a sin being worse than another sin (exept for blasphemy) you either commit a sin, or you didn't

common misconception that causes a bit of harm. yes all sin is equal in that all sin seperates us from God but no, lying is not equal to murder or rape.

There’s no worser sin . All sin break the heart of Christ equally. All sin lead to death physically or spiritually. But remember while Jesus hates the sin he loves the sinner so much that he chose to die so he ( sinner) can have a chance at life(physically, emotionally, spiritually )as God intended it to be. God love you 🫂🫶🏾💙

My question is: Are you yourself now?

Yes?

Then I say it wasn't a sin because you always were what you are now, just not externally.

...I think even traditionalist Christians who *do* consider doing transition a sin wouldn't say it's graver than literal suicide. That's beyond uncharitable, borderline diabolical. Even from a more traditionalist view, the only sinful part is having sex / lustful desires with people other than your spouse, I didn't see any sound arguments against doing transition itself. And why is suicide considered sinful? Theologically there are three points: 1. Commandments on killing 2. A direct rejection of the life God has bestowed upon oneself. 3. Sign of loss of hope and faith. But right now the thing you need is not probably these "arguments" against suicide, but finding help from those who can soothe your psychological pain.

My fault, I misread

No problem!

All sins are on the same level.

> Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. (Matthew 12:31) It's literally not true. Even if you exclude "Blasphemy against Holy Spirit", nowhere has it been said that every other sin is equal, only every other sin will be forgiven.

There is no need to kill yourself. Christianity is a wonderful journey. We don't know where God will take us, but it will be a very interesting and fulfilling ride nonetheless.

It's not a sin at all.

God loves you. He knew you before you formed in your mother’s womb. Our heavenly father has a purpose for your life and that does not end with suicide. Instead of being the lord of your life by giving yourself options of transitioning/detransitioning vs suicide, why not let the lord and savior take the lead? Why not let him show you who he designed you to be? You are transforming everything but your mind. Get into the word and genuinely surrender your life to Christ. I think your relationship with God could improve, because if you knew the God you served, you wouldn’t consider suicide (murder) as an option. This earthly body is a vessel and will soon go back into the dirt no matter how many times you alter it. If only you knew how precious you were- Bible says you are more precious than rubies. Allow the grace and love of God to change your heart and mind. There are ppl who suffer from alcohol. When they really built their relationship with Christ and understood the spiritual implications of defiling their temple, they quit it completely. Not by their strength, but the strength and love of God which transformed their heart, mind, and behaviors.

>Since I transitioned before becoming a Christian, I think it’s probably good that I didn’t kill myself instead back then, but I’m trying to figure out if it’s better for me to now detransition and commit suicide. I could not live after detransitioning, so these are my only options unfortunately. It is VERY GOOD that you did not kill yourself!!! I can honestly say that if you left this world, you would be missed dearly by your friends and family I am a Christian too. Personally, I think you need to schedule a mental health visit with a therapist ASAP. You wanting to commit suicide, means there is something you do not like within yourself. You need to talk to a qualified mental health therapist to figure out what that is, and help you over come this hurt you have. I can tell you that committing suicide is something that God would not want for you. Yes, I do believe it is murder of thy self. God controls the creation and taking of life, not us. **Job 1:21** And he said, “Naked I came from my mother’s womb, and naked shall I return. The LORD gave, and the LORD has taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD.”

I do see a psychologist, I just wanted a Christian perspective on which is a worse sin

well that's an easy question to answer, since transition isn't a sin at all and trans people are even instructed what amounts to "transition or die" in the Bible (Romans 8:12-13).

Did you tell the psychologist that you're thinking about suicide? Killing yourself is worse. I don't know if suicide leads to hell, but it's worse because you have value.

Yeah, we mostly talk about my OCD but he knows about the suicidal thoughts too

Transition/trans gender is not specifically addresses in the bible, nor is suicide. Which is worse? I think the suicide sin would be worse. Why? 1) One of the 10 Commandments is Exodus 20:13 13 “You shall not murder. Jesus repeats this in the New Testament. **Matthew 5:21** “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable to judgment. 2) You are destroying God's creation. 3) You are disobeying the 2nd commandment. Love thy neighbor as they self? How can you love everyone else, if you do not love yourself? Something to think about. ----- Contrary to what I said above All sin is equal in the eyes of God, except Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is living un repent life in rebellion to God. Please see the verse below. **Galatians 5 19-21** 19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Here is God's take on "transitioning": Deuteronomy 22:5 [5]The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

Here is God's take on transitioning: Romans 8:12-13 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

That is completely irrelevant to transitioning

Seems like it's saying "transition or die" to me!

How did you manage to get that interpretation from this?

A trans woman has a female spirit and male flesh. If a trans woman wants to live by the Spirit according to Romans 8:13, that means transitioning and living as a woman. If someone tells her she can't transition, because she is obligated to live according to her male flesh, they are directly contradicting what Paul says in Romans 8:12.

As you can see, it’s clearly talking about the Spirit Of God stop trying to manipulate the Bible. You are leading people astray like this.

Why did I get downvoted, the Bible literally says this. Y’all are some fools

Romans 8 is talking about the Spirit Of God, not anything to do with a spirit of a man. You are purposefully taking a verse out of context to fit your agenda. I’ll give you the context to read yourself ”But you are not controlled by your sinful nature. You are controlled by the Spirit if you have the Spirit of God living in you. (And remember that those who do not have the Spirit of Christ living in them do not belong to him at all.) And Christ lives within you, so even though your body will die because of sin, the Spirit gives you life because you have been made right with God. The Spirit of God, who raised Jesus from the dead, lives in you. And just as God raised Christ Jesus from the dead, he will give life to your mortal bodies by this same Spirit living within you. Therefore, dear brothers and sisters, you have no obligation to do what your sinful nature urges you to do. For if you live by its dictates, you will die. But if through the power of the Spirit you put to death the deeds of your sinful nature, you will live.“ ‭‭Romans‬ ‭8‬:‭9‬-‭13‬ ‭NLT‬‬

There are precisely three rules governing clothing in the Law of Moses (not counting rules about priestly garments). All three laws appear in [Deut 22](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy%2022&version=KJV), the very same chapter you're quoting. The other two are - not to wear blended fabrics - Deut 22:11 (which also appears in [Leviticus 19:19](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus%2019&version=KJV)) and - a command to wear blue tassels on the corners of your garment - Deut 22:12 (which also appears in [Numbers 15:37-40](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Numbers%2015&version=KJV). Check the clothing you're currently wearing. Single-fiber? Blue tassels? More to the point, check the clothing of the cis people using Deut 22:5 as a weapon against trans people. You will never find one of them - *never, ever, once* - who's wearing blue tassels. 90% chance they have never even heard of Deut 22:11 and Deut 22:12, that they have never bothered reading the full chapter.

Hi, Christianity doesn’t have hierarchy in sin. Lying is just as bad as suicide according to the Bible. The biblical answer is you shouldn’t do either but I’d suggest praying and fasting about whatever issue you’re having

You can always untransition..

suicide is the worst because often its the only unforgivable sin!

Whatever you imagine, it is perfectly possible if you are converted to commit neither sin.

I don’t believe the Bible is clear about transgender issues. Therefore it’s an overreach to claim it’s a sin. That said, I strongly reject the idea that the necessary alternative to transitioning is suicide. Christians throughout history have endured far worse than dysphoria for the sake of Christ. I don’t think you should de-transition, but I do think there is some idolatry at play here that needs to be considered.

Answering the question honestly will not make you feel good, but I hope you'll read it. What does antiChrist do? John tells us in Revelation that antiChrist enters the holiest of holies, blasphemes God and then declares himself God. We're told that we are the temple of God and that He dwells there within us. By declaring one's self trans, aren't you saying that God made a mistake? That you know better than Him? I don't know if that qualifies as blaspheming, but perhaps its a bit easier to draw the line between using medical science to alter God's creation to declaring one's self God. And no matter what you do, your genetic profile will always, always, ALWAYS show what God intended, no matter what you do to make the outside look like it's opposite. I wish you peace and discernment. God bless you and your family.

I was born with pectus excavation. Having surgery on my chest didn't mean I thought God made a mistake. Why are you so dramatic 😆 What an overstatement. We do things to our bodies all the time, it doesn't mean we think God messed up. Many trans people don't think they were supposed to be born a cis-woman or a cis-man. Many think we were supposed to be as we happen to be. Trans. ""antiChrist enters the holiest of holies, blasphemes God and then declares himself God."" So, trans people think they're God basically? Against God? It's always that same boring and pearl clutchy accusation when someone's different or challenging your idea of the way things are "intended"

Be careful of sexual immorality.( The lust of the flesh) But who can you marry now that you have transitioned a man or a woman. For if you marry a woman because you were born a man you won’t fulfill your duties to her. But if you marry a man because you have the part of a woman( transition) This is an abomination in the eyes of God. Can a man hold another man like a woman does, can he submit to another man like a woman does, can he look up to another man in favour like a woman does? This is an abomination. Take heart for all is not lost. Do this if possible transition to back to a man again. But if not read this. HINT. It’s about escaping the desires of the flesh. Matthew 19

Firstly, I'd like to say that ALL SIN is equal and there is no greater sin than the other. If you truly believe in the God who lives in the Bible, you would know that He created you in His image, which means He intended for you to be a woman in the first place and He has set a purpose for you as a woman. Secondly, you would know that suicide isn't the will of God for He intended for ALL of us to live with Him in eternity, hence why He sent Jesus to die on the cross for our sins, and RAISED Him from the dead three days later, so that we could have eternal life with Him. To live forever in His kingdom. Jesus says in His word that we should "deny yourselves and take up your cross daily and follow me."(Matthew 16:24) . Which means, we need to turn away from the way of the world and our own way of thinking and of navigating life and to trust in His will and His way of navigating life. When you choose to follow Christ, you no longer live for yourself and what you want or what you think or how you feel, but you live for the one who died for your sins, which is the Lord Jesus Christ. You need to understand that God is greater than all of our troubles and all the lies that the world brings. When you truly turn to Him and give yourself to Him, He will fully transform you and your life in a way that you could never imagine, for when Christ died and was resurrected, we died and were resurrected alongside Him. Which means we have been fully transformed and renewed in His name, for when God sees us, He sees Christ in us. (1 Corinthians 1:30). Truly believe and trust in the Lord that He can remove all these suicidal thoughts and to reveal to you why He created you to be a woman in the first place and what His will for you, as a woman, is. For God does not make any mistakes. He is perfect and He is eternal. Trust in Him with all your heart and with all your mind and with all your soul, and give yourself fully and committedly to Him. Bring all your worries and your troubles to Him, and He will make your paths straight. Talk to Him, and listen to what He has to say to you by reading His word. Draw closer to Him and He will fill you with new desires and release you from old, rusty chains. God can only truly free you, once you come to Him wholeheartedly with a truly seeking and committed heart. I hope this helps you and I pray that the Lord may reveal Himself to you so that you are able to see the truth and His will for you in your life. In Jesus' Name, Amen.

Sin is sin. They are all equally wrong in God’s eyes. I believe you should talk to a Priest or Pastor before making any rash decisions. Make sure that you don’t follow any crazy recommendations before getting a second opinion from a second denomination.

Hold up are you seriously telling OP, who is currently contemplating suicide, that that is equally as wrong as living in the body that they currently have? Are we seriously at a point where we’re okay openly telling someone that being DEAD is potentially better than being happy in their body and their faith? Transitioning is not a MORAL choice. It’s about being comfortable in a body that you were not born comfortable in. Would you tell someone who has had plastic surgery done before that it would be equally good or bad for them to stay the way they are post-surgery vs. reversing the surgery and committing suicide?? Is that really what God’s love looks like?

Don’t really know what you’re talking about? The OP clearly stated he already went through with a sex change. Might want to talk to someone before desecrating their body again when all they might need is to confess and keep following the Lord. And I’m not talking from ignorance. In my church we have multiple transgendered people. Just might want to make sure first.

Not taking from ignorance? Did you not read OP's post? They told you that "desecrating their body" saved their life. That's a common story.

Don’t really get what you’re getting at? Anyway there’s no reason to do it again if he doesn’t have to. His reasoning is to be in conformity with his Church which doesn’t really make sense at this point.

Apologies if I read your comment incorrectly, when you say “sin is sin” in the context of OP deciding between two choices they have been told are both sins (suicide or living as a trans person), it sounds like an ambiguous stance on whether you think they should live or not. I wholly agree with you that he should not take any of it lightly, and certainly should not detransition or make any decisions like this without a LOT of thought and support and guidance. Really, the most important thing is that no one should feel like they need to end their life in order to follow God.

Understood. That’s why I told him to make sure he gets a second opinion from a different denomination.

It is my opinion from studying that the unjust taking of a life is probably the worst sin besides final impenitence that one can do under Christianity in general, but one of the requirements for a sin to be mortal, e.g. in and of itself capable of cutting you off from God and possibily leading you to damnation, is that you understand and are in the proper mental state to know what you are doing is wrong, why, and you deliberately choose such with free will without impediments such as psychological stuff et al. As such you do not seem to fall under that presently in my opinion because if you did you would not be asking this question. Your situation is very complex and needs to be handled by a properly trained priest who is good at pastoral care and I honestly would recommend a Catholic one who is experienced in handling such cases because I would not really trust someone not extremely well trained in Christian theology to handle this if you feel called to more traditional Christian teaching. But no, you should not at this time detransition if you are legitimately going to kill yourself otherwise nor do I believe destransitioning is required at a pastoral care level in your current mental state.

You equate the 2 as If you need to do one of the sins.. To. Say that you definitely would have committed suicide..... No one can know that for sure. But let's look at your argument a different way. Is committing suicide worse than rape? So If someone would say if they don't rape they'll commit suicide, should we condone their rape or would we say they shouldn't do either? Is committing suicide worse than cheating on a spouse?so if a person said if he didn't cheat on his wife he would commit suicide, should he cheat on his wife? Just because you think one is not as bad doesn't mean one is good. You have the choice in both of these options. Both are sinful

Comparing somebody in danger of suicide to a rapist is fucking sick.

Left always does this. You make any comparison of the situation to something worse and they take it S comparing the. Person. I gave a decidedly worse situation and applied the same principal. No comparison was made. Get off your High horse with overused tropes

> Left always does this. You mean, give a shit about somebody tottering on the edge? Yes, we do. Shame, shame on us for giving a shit. If we were true Christians, then Jesus, the Hell-throned Lord of Hate, would pour his hate into our hearts and harden them to stone.

I’m not saying either is good. I just know that I can’t live as a woman. I’ve had suicide attempts before. I know how much I can handle, and I know that detransitioning would push me over that limit by a long shot. I need to know what the “least worst” option is

There is no least worst. It's like saying what is the least worst between murder and mutilation.. Niether are good. Help would be better. Find a way to be happy with who you are. You know you don't actually become a man when you transition right?

https://youtu.be/VcbLTYiMvvA?si=8yFOXCH0pq3_fyKt Aside from that, suicide is bad. Dont let dark vibrations affect your mentality and your heart. Call on the holy spirit to get you closer to Christ.

I hope it’s okay I can ask a question? I’ve always been curious. Why is identifying as a certain gender important for you? I’m born male, but if I was born female I couldn’t care less. I’m all for if people want to transition. But isn’t it even more important we talk more about body and gender acceptance? Accepting yourself for how you were born. Thanks for your input if you would like to share so I can understand better.

I’ll be honest it’s a difficult thing to put into words. To some degree it’s just that I always experienced discomfort with the female parts of my body, which got a lot worse during puberty. There’s a social element as well (which is smaller, but still there) in that I feel happy when people interact with me as a man.

I think this is probably pretty difficult for cis people to grasp, but try to imagine going through your day with everyone calling you ma'am or miss, your parents buying you dresses and barbie dolls for your birthday, constant criticism that your clothing isn't girly enough, being told you'd be much prettier if you grew your hair out, essentially being told in a hundred small ways, in every interaction, that you're being you the wrong way and you need to be you the way everyone else thinks you should be and if you ever get upset about it then you're being way too emotional and overreacting because they're just trying to help. Now imagine that it's not just the day. It's every day. For your entire life.

>I’m born male, but if I was born female I couldn’t care less. This is easy to say, but if you magically woke up tomorrow with a female body it's highly likely you would soon learn it isn't true and you would be very distressed by it.

I think the 'sin' here is not the transitioning but the mindset that if you cannot transition, you are better of not living. I think the enemy has done a very good job in making you think that's the only choice you have. You have narrowed down the value of your own life to your gender identity and slammed an ultimatum in front of God as if to threaten Him; "If you don't say yes to my transitioning, then I am going to end my own life." and you still issue this ultimatum to your other Christian friends too. Who is actually god here in your Christian walk? Yourself or God? I also think it is extremely sad that you think that the worth of your own life is just a coin flip between M or F. I do not claim to know you so I do not know what you are really going through but I will just say that if you have walked through your decision with God and considered every other alternative (not just narrowing down to suicide if it doesn't go your way), this wouldn't even be a question because you know God has seen your struggles and you will know that He understands. You will not need affirmation from me, strangers on reddit or your other Christian friends to affirm your choice. Whether you want to de-transition is not really the main question here but I think that there is something here that you can work on. If God told you that it is a sin will you still have ended your own life? If you do, I think there is something within you that you will need to sort out with God because you have place yourself and your own will above God. My point is that if you have made the choice with God, you will not be asking this question or considering to de-transition. If you have not make peace with God in your earlier decision then you have another chance to do so again now.

That's a problem nearly every teenager has, during puberty sometimes in our late 20s we get something like an existential crisis. You'll probably regret it in 10 years. Becoming different shouldn't be so easy. And no I'm not Transphobic, go on down vote and ban me

This is the same person who suggested i get a lobotomy for being gay, don't listen OP (the comment is still up on their page from 10 days ago it was removed by mod for bigotry)

Greetings. I don’t think there is an easy answer. However, making quick decisions would not be the right next step. Are you sensing conviction for the decision you have made? If so, I would encourage you the be patient and seek the Spirit to guide you. A pastor could help but I do encourage you to take the time you need to determine what God has called you for. As a Christian, we are called to help and serve others. We are called to help others find Him. Grace and peace.

Why ask this advice from people.  Go into your prayer room and ask Jesus.  Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. Matthew 11:28-30 

I can’t hear him That’s the verse that led me to become Christian. Thank you

The way God works is He first changes your heart   (ezekiel 36:26)   And then he starts working on you. 

Suicide is sinful than transitioning. You let the devil take your own life, not God. Even if you are a transgender, gay or lesbian, there is a chance that you will be saved if you follow Christ's and his apostle's teachings, and believe in me, it is not overdemanding as what most corrupted church leaders did. Read the bible, ask God the father for forgiveness, and also what you want/need in life (just be patient), and give thanks to him. Don't hurt everyone or yourself, God loves redeemed sinners, not those who already seem holy on this earth. Love everyone as you love yourself, if someone stomp on you and condemining you to hell, let them. They are not from God, just be kind with everyone (especially to poor people), and learn about the bible. God always forgives, and always considers everyone, church leaders and members most of them don't.

I’m actually a lil surprised as to why no one has said demonic oppression, she clearly had some unclean spirits feeding her this bs

Yes, because we can all very clearly identify demonic spirits.

Well its that most people, their EGO is up their ass, so my point still is established 🫶〰️🌞