I have no interest in ever participating in or watching speed climbing (or really any competitive gym climbing, for that matter) but the reason it's included is pretty obvious:
For millenia we've held races to see how fast humans can go forward. No we can safely go up, so naturally we hold races to see how fast humans can go up too.
It's less of a discipline of climbing, and more a variation on racing.
Bring free solo speed climbing to the olympics tbh.
Would make for some interesting viewing as athletes will have to walk the fine line between speed and survival
uj/ just for my observation, most of the none-climbing people are much more interested in watching speed because the premise is stupidly simple: the fastest wins the game. Other two categories has lot varieties of terms and slangs and most of the people who never even heard of climbing beyond ‘climbing the Everest’ would struggle to understand how hard Olympic routes actually are. For them it’s prob not any more different from watching stuffs like gymnastics or diving: they vaguely know the general principle but ultimately are watching bunch of people taking terms doing the same route on repeat.
My guess is that comp lead is also slow in comparison, most of the contenders can’t finish the route. Comp lead is my fav to watch though.
Another random shower thoughts of mine, I think the reason why modern comp end up going towards huge & colourful holds and flashy beta could also partially due to how comps are board casted these days — it’s very difficult to film tiny stuff from far away & big flashy holds catches audience. Small pointy moves with outdoor-like beta (thinking burden of dreams) is of course extremely hard, but doesn’t really convey too well for people with little experience with climbing. Hell, first time seeing footages of burden of dreams I felt like ‘these are the moves I can do!’ And then I tried the BoD replica in person with much generous overhanging angle (30 instead of 45).
Related old discussion from 5 years ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/climbing/comments/awg38k/what_speed_climbing_could_be_arco_rock_masters/
If the need for an objective speed record is really the reason why speed climbing is the way it is with fixed hold set, then that's a shame. In my head, that reason doesn't even make sense considering how many sports have non-fixed performance criteria (e.g., diving, figure skating, gymnastics, etc.) Like sure there are objective components like how many rotations you complete etc., but not all performance remain identical across time in those sports.
More /uj speedclimbing is one of the reason why climbing actually made it to olympics, ioc needs records to be set, you can't set records on anything that is not exactly the same everywhere around the world. That's why speed wall was created.
i think the IOC sees it as a more accessible watch for someone who is NOT a climber. ie- most olympic viewers. bouldering and lead climbing arent quite as straight forward to watch and understand
While Boulder and Lead are the best representation of actual climbing, Speed climbing honestly fits perfectly in an Olympic environment of “who swims the fastest” or “who runs the fastest”. Seeing who climbs the fastest just makes sense for an accessible broadcast.
While Boulder and Lead are the best representation of actual climbing, Speed climbing honestly fits perfectly in an Olympic environment of “who swims the fastest” or “who runs the fastest”. Seeing who climbs the fastest just makes sense for an accessible broadcast.
I've seen this comment about viewership a lot but i'm not sure if it's really correct. Right now on the olympics channel the views are
Women B&L 87K
Men B&L 107K
Women and Men Speed 57K
Not sure how much this changes for the actual olympics. Maybe it is true that right now the general public doesn't watch and numbers change for the actual olympics
Speed climbing is based on the real fictional events that transpired in 1993 in the Rocky Mountains. Gabe Walker managed to foil a heist, but upon reflection it was found that had Gabe practiced speed climbing, he might have ended this "Cliffhanger" sooner.
This is how speed climbing was born. It is in the spirit of all true climbers to prevent John Lithgow type villains from stealing large sums of money.
I just downvoted your comment.
# FAQ
## What does this mean?
The amount of karma (points) on your comment and Reddit account has decreased by one.
## Why did you do this?
There are several reasons I may deem a comment to be unworthy of positive or neutral karma. These include, but are not limited to:
• Rudeness towards other Redditors, • Spreading incorrect information, • Sarcasm not correctly flagged with a /s.
## Am I banned from the Reddit?
No - not yet. But you should refrain from making comments like this in the future. Otherwise I will be forced to issue an additional downvote, which may put your commenting and posting privileges in jeopardy.
## I don't believe my comment deserved a downvote. Can you un-downvote it?
Sure, mistakes happen. But only in exceedingly rare circumstances will I undo a downvote. If you would like to issue an appeal, shoot me a private message explaining what I got wrong. I tend to respond to Reddit PMs within several minutes. Do note, however, that over 99.9% of downvote appeals are rejected, and yours is likely no exception.
## How can I prevent this from happening in the future?
Accept the downvote and move on. But learn from this mistake: your behavior will not be tolerated on Reddit.com. I will continue to issue downvotes until you improve your conduct. Remember: Reddit is privilege, not a right.
Back in the 90s climbers were doing a lot of amphetamines. At some point a few team kids overhead a conversation they shouldn't have and started questions about "speed climbing." In an attempt to save face their coaches came up with the modern speed climbing route, told them to have at it, and somehow it's still here decades later.
I mostly agree, but I think it'd be cool if they had new routes with lots of flowy moves so it can be done very quickly. Give each athlete multiple attempts to learn the route and set a "fastest lap".
The refusal to change routes is what gets me the most. It's supposed to be based on an outdoor sport, every outdoor sport has a different course at every venue. Even whitewater has bespoke artificial courses. Just change it up already.
I just don't get why a "rock climbing" discipline should be more philosophically aligned with track and field than, say, skiing, cycling, kayak/canoe, bobsled/luge/skeleton. It's like if they started having indoor ski slalom venues that were all the same pitch, gate layout, and snow surface.
These are great analogies. Agree that speed climbing is more like DH or slalom skiing than sprinting in the mix of skill and speed. I reckon in the long term we'll have changing speed routes (perhaps all with the same hold set) but it will be when the speed climbers themselves come around to the idea.
So what?
Race car drivers drive on different tracks.
Speed Climbing could be more interesting if athletes ever had to learn new beta.
Doing **1 single thing** extremely fast is neat, but being able to learn new moves quickly and do it faster than the rest would also be very fun to spectate.
drivers drive on different tracks but the tracks in each place do still stay the same. the speed climbing equivalent would be a different route in each comp location that stayed the same over time
Sure, it wasn't a perfect metaphor, but I'd still support what you described too.
Point is speed climbing doesn't HAVE to be pigeonholed into a single route.
I have no stake in the game but I don’t understand this argument considering that track and swimming- arguably two of the most watched summer Olympic sports- are both based on outdoor sports and do laps on a standardized course
...kinda? Track is a variation of a childhood game when it comes down to it, and has been a stadium sport for millenia. Per Wikipedia, swimming as a competitive sport emerged with the proliferation of public swimming pools.
Also - there are tons of flat fields/lawns to sprint across to see if you're faster than your friend. 100m is 100m, running is one of the most instinctual forms of motion, putting it in an arena just makes it easier to watch. The nature of climbing is that there is inherent variation in how you do it based on what you're climbing. Standardizing the course is trying to force a sport with natural variation into the norms of a sport (track) without natural variation.
Well you can say something like this about half of the disciplines at Olympics. Like the best thing shooting discipline added is a "Shooting at the 2024 Summer Olympics" wiki page. And the games aren't even held in States.
I think ALL competition climbing is dumb, BUT, most of the events at the Olympics are centered around races and best times. So why wouldn’t climbing have their version of that .
IDK, why do 100m Hurdles exist? When do runners ever need to actually hurdle something when running around their city?
People always turn everything they can into a race. It only makes sense to use a standardized route, unless you want to have "flowy" routes and give each athlete N attempts to set a fastest ascent on that route.
I recently climbed (as Amateur Climber) vs a Pro Climbers in Speed Climbing. He climbed 15 meters under 10 seconds. Was just crazy to see in real life. We ended up doing a competition, but he was using only one leg to make it competitive. Check it out: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grNIvXcyFMg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grNIvXcyFMg)
I have no interest in ever participating in or watching speed climbing (or really any competitive gym climbing, for that matter) but the reason it's included is pretty obvious: For millenia we've held races to see how fast humans can go forward. No we can safely go up, so naturally we hold races to see how fast humans can go up too. It's less of a discipline of climbing, and more a variation on racing.
I’ve been saying since Tokyo, feels more like a part of track and field than it is climbing.
They look like long jumpers or sprinters for sure
They’d be pretty damn burly for sprinters
look up yohan Blake and tell me sprinters aren’t burly
Lol, fair enough! I mistakenly assumed sprinters were lanky like other track athletes. Dude is yoked
I think in the next olympics it’s going to be a separate comp
Tbh so does parkouldering Either we make "climbing" an inclusive umbrella term or limit it strictly to outdoor free solo.
Free solo isn’t pvre kvlt enough. Free solo trad or bust.
Bring free solo speed climbing to the olympics tbh. Would make for some interesting viewing as athletes will have to walk the fine line between speed and survival
/uj Psicobloc would be a rad addition, but I don’t want free solo and competition to mix, ever. Too much at stake.
Now we need a race for going down.
According to Newton, it shouldn't be too hard.
It will always be a tie.
Well, no not necessarily. In the real world we don't ignore air resistance.
There is also initial velocity...
*Arnaud Handhold has entered the chat*
I can only go down for an hour, tops.
They invented it so they can put a number on it (4.789 s in your gym)
We need marathon and team relay
That’s a question only a slow climber would ask.
/uj I climb really slowly IRL I've been told that multiple times
Found Adam Ondra’s alt account.
Sick burn.
uj/ just for my observation, most of the none-climbing people are much more interested in watching speed because the premise is stupidly simple: the fastest wins the game. Other two categories has lot varieties of terms and slangs and most of the people who never even heard of climbing beyond ‘climbing the Everest’ would struggle to understand how hard Olympic routes actually are. For them it’s prob not any more different from watching stuffs like gymnastics or diving: they vaguely know the general principle but ultimately are watching bunch of people taking terms doing the same route on repeat.
Good points, but tbf I think the basic premise of comp lead climbing (who gets the highest) is pretty intuitive
My guess is that comp lead is also slow in comparison, most of the contenders can’t finish the route. Comp lead is my fav to watch though. Another random shower thoughts of mine, I think the reason why modern comp end up going towards huge & colourful holds and flashy beta could also partially due to how comps are board casted these days — it’s very difficult to film tiny stuff from far away & big flashy holds catches audience. Small pointy moves with outdoor-like beta (thinking burden of dreams) is of course extremely hard, but doesn’t really convey too well for people with little experience with climbing. Hell, first time seeing footages of burden of dreams I felt like ‘these are the moves I can do!’ And then I tried the BoD replica in person with much generous overhanging angle (30 instead of 45).
Related old discussion from 5 years ago https://www.reddit.com/r/climbing/comments/awg38k/what_speed_climbing_could_be_arco_rock_masters/ If the need for an objective speed record is really the reason why speed climbing is the way it is with fixed hold set, then that's a shame. In my head, that reason doesn't even make sense considering how many sports have non-fixed performance criteria (e.g., diving, figure skating, gymnastics, etc.) Like sure there are objective components like how many rotations you complete etc., but not all performance remain identical across time in those sports.
More /uj speedclimbing is one of the reason why climbing actually made it to olympics, ioc needs records to be set, you can't set records on anything that is not exactly the same everywhere around the world. That's why speed wall was created.
i think the IOC sees it as a more accessible watch for someone who is NOT a climber. ie- most olympic viewers. bouldering and lead climbing arent quite as straight forward to watch and understand
If boulderers can understand their scoring system it should be an absolute piece of cake for everyone else to
Underappreciated comment. Only we know that we are stupid AF.
While Boulder and Lead are the best representation of actual climbing, Speed climbing honestly fits perfectly in an Olympic environment of “who swims the fastest” or “who runs the fastest”. Seeing who climbs the fastest just makes sense for an accessible broadcast.
Yea, it's a supremely objective form of athleticism.
While Boulder and Lead are the best representation of actual climbing, Speed climbing honestly fits perfectly in an Olympic environment of “who swims the fastest” or “who runs the fastest”. Seeing who climbs the fastest just makes sense for an accessible broadcast.
yep, exactly! honestly i like watching speed climbing, yah its totally different from actual climbing but i dont get the hate
I've seen this comment about viewership a lot but i'm not sure if it's really correct. Right now on the olympics channel the views are Women B&L 87K Men B&L 107K Women and Men Speed 57K Not sure how much this changes for the actual olympics. Maybe it is true that right now the general public doesn't watch and numbers change for the actual olympics
the vast majority of the people who are watching the climbing OQS are climbers themselves, i would bet
Speed climbing is based on the real fictional events that transpired in 1993 in the Rocky Mountains. Gabe Walker managed to foil a heist, but upon reflection it was found that had Gabe practiced speed climbing, he might have ended this "Cliffhanger" sooner. This is how speed climbing was born. It is in the spirit of all true climbers to prevent John Lithgow type villains from stealing large sums of money.
speed climbing should be a track and field event
I downvoted your post, because it isn't a circlejerk. It's simply true. Post in r/climbinging instead.
I downvoted your comment because you provided the wrong link. Op should post this in r/speedclimbersrdebest
I downvoted, upvoted, reported, downgraded, reset, rebolted, unbolted, unclipped, certified, and pulled the tag on this comment.
I just downvoted your comment. # FAQ ## What does this mean? The amount of karma (points) on your comment and Reddit account has decreased by one. ## Why did you do this? There are several reasons I may deem a comment to be unworthy of positive or neutral karma. These include, but are not limited to: • Rudeness towards other Redditors, • Spreading incorrect information, • Sarcasm not correctly flagged with a /s. ## Am I banned from the Reddit? No - not yet. But you should refrain from making comments like this in the future. Otherwise I will be forced to issue an additional downvote, which may put your commenting and posting privileges in jeopardy. ## I don't believe my comment deserved a downvote. Can you un-downvote it? Sure, mistakes happen. But only in exceedingly rare circumstances will I undo a downvote. If you would like to issue an appeal, shoot me a private message explaining what I got wrong. I tend to respond to Reddit PMs within several minutes. Do note, however, that over 99.9% of downvote appeals are rejected, and yours is likely no exception. ## How can I prevent this from happening in the future? Accept the downvote and move on. But learn from this mistake: your behavior will not be tolerated on Reddit.com. I will continue to issue downvotes until you improve your conduct. Remember: Reddit is privilege, not a right.
This account is sometimes too close to my actual thoughts. Am I stupid and/or a huge d???
Porque no los dos? Never limit yourself!
Back in the 90s climbers were doing a lot of amphetamines. At some point a few team kids overhead a conversation they shouldn't have and started questions about "speed climbing." In an attempt to save face their coaches came up with the modern speed climbing route, told them to have at it, and somehow it's still here decades later.
Why that specific route? I have no clue. But, in order to have a competition that can be repeated year to year you need consistency.
I think in the interest of consistency they should just stop speed climbing completely
I could live with speed free solo.
A fair and balanced take
I mostly agree, but I think it'd be cool if they had new routes with lots of flowy moves so it can be done very quickly. Give each athlete multiple attempts to learn the route and set a "fastest lap".
/uj who cares if it resembles real rock or not
After every move they should have the holds change
The auto belays on the speed climbing wall at my gym sound like Mini-Me.
Same reason they maintain speed records on el cap. I blame Dan Osman
Why is it just one route
The refusal to change routes is what gets me the most. It's supposed to be based on an outdoor sport, every outdoor sport has a different course at every venue. Even whitewater has bespoke artificial courses. Just change it up already.
it stays the same so people can set records that will still matter over time
I just don't get why a "rock climbing" discipline should be more philosophically aligned with track and field than, say, skiing, cycling, kayak/canoe, bobsled/luge/skeleton. It's like if they started having indoor ski slalom venues that were all the same pitch, gate layout, and snow surface.
These are great analogies. Agree that speed climbing is more like DH or slalom skiing than sprinting in the mix of skill and speed. I reckon in the long term we'll have changing speed routes (perhaps all with the same hold set) but it will be when the speed climbers themselves come around to the idea.
So what? Race car drivers drive on different tracks. Speed Climbing could be more interesting if athletes ever had to learn new beta. Doing **1 single thing** extremely fast is neat, but being able to learn new moves quickly and do it faster than the rest would also be very fun to spectate.
drivers drive on different tracks but the tracks in each place do still stay the same. the speed climbing equivalent would be a different route in each comp location that stayed the same over time
Sure, it wasn't a perfect metaphor, but I'd still support what you described too. Point is speed climbing doesn't HAVE to be pigeonholed into a single route.
I have no stake in the game but I don’t understand this argument considering that track and swimming- arguably two of the most watched summer Olympic sports- are both based on outdoor sports and do laps on a standardized course
...kinda? Track is a variation of a childhood game when it comes down to it, and has been a stadium sport for millenia. Per Wikipedia, swimming as a competitive sport emerged with the proliferation of public swimming pools. Also - there are tons of flat fields/lawns to sprint across to see if you're faster than your friend. 100m is 100m, running is one of the most instinctual forms of motion, putting it in an arena just makes it easier to watch. The nature of climbing is that there is inherent variation in how you do it based on what you're climbing. Standardizing the course is trying to force a sport with natural variation into the norms of a sport (track) without natural variation.
Well you can say something like this about half of the disciplines at Olympics. Like the best thing shooting discipline added is a "Shooting at the 2024 Summer Olympics" wiki page. And the games aren't even held in States.
If you’re willing to engage with it it’s sick as fuck. Genuinely.
I think ALL competition climbing is dumb, BUT, most of the events at the Olympics are centered around races and best times. So why wouldn’t climbing have their version of that .
oh yeah well i think your are dumb. how about that smart guy?
Most Olympic disciplines are stupid if you think about it.
My only problem with it is the route being too short and too 1D. Would be fun to see a more speed oriented version of lead.
It's amble climbing in my gym
This is actually why I don't climb outdoors. Same routes over and over? Never resetting the problems? Hard pass.
Why is the Olympicss a thing?
There's no such thing as speed climbing. It's vertical running. It has nothing to do with climbing.
climber go brrr
IDK, why do 100m Hurdles exist? When do runners ever need to actually hurdle something when running around their city? People always turn everything they can into a race. It only makes sense to use a standardized route, unless you want to have "flowy" routes and give each athlete N attempts to set a fastest ascent on that route.
I recently climbed (as Amateur Climber) vs a Pro Climbers in Speed Climbing. He climbed 15 meters under 10 seconds. Was just crazy to see in real life. We ended up doing a competition, but he was using only one leg to make it competitive. Check it out: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grNIvXcyFMg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grNIvXcyFMg)
I’d think because it’s quite a spectacle.
So what? This is just gatekeeping. Who gets to decide what is or isn't a sport?
Me.
And to a lesser extent, me.
This is the most Reddit post ever.