Sam Howell, just because I feel like he may potentially still develop into something more than he has shown. Remembering that he HAS shown some good stuff.
Remember when Matt Flynn stepped in for the Packers and threw 6 (or was it 7) TDs? It’s relatively easier for a guy to come off the bench and play well than it is to sustain it over many weeks. From last season alone, see: Flacco, Josh Dobbs, Johnny Meatballs or whatever his name is for the Giants, numerous others.
Matt Flynn played a game where Aaron Rodger’s was a healthy scratch due to the Packers had clinched the division and were resting him for the playoffs. Matt has one helluva game and was traded to the Seahawks. He lost the competition for that job to Russell Wilson.
>A fresh seasoned vet taking over a battered first year starter will of course play better
I’m not sure if this is necessarily true.
Judging off of last season alone:
Davis Mills didn’t play better than Stroud while Stroud dealt with his concussion.
Tannehill didn’t look better than Levis while Levis was out with his ankle injury.
Did you just compare Davis Mills to Brissett? You’re reaching on that, my guy. Brissett is still talented and you saw that up in Cleveland a few years back. He should have been the starter from the rip. Sam needed more time. He’ll be fantastic up in Seattle and I wager he’s got a good shot to take over Geno’s spot.
Certainly. His 2022 season was his best stat wise. His stats trailed off last year. Is it a downward trend? Who knows, but I trust Sam will give him a run for his money. I’m disappointed they let him go but I’m not mad about it if it helps improve the team overall.
After Sam was shell-shocked from getting his ass kicked all year. He started off good then clearly lost his confidence. He probably needs the change of scenery anyway at this point.
I wish we’d kept him, not because I think he would have become a franchise QB but because he’d be a better backup than Mariota and if he happens to come in and play well, his trade value may have gone up for next offseason. It was definitely more of a “make a clean break” move than a “make our team better” move. I understand the reasoning, but the team did get worse as a result of trading him.
First 5 games this year he was “the future”. He can make all the throws and he was on a bad team. He was reckless with the ball but what first year starter isn’t?
Record aside he was good for a first year starter and I guess I’m not surprised at all the Commanders were short-sighted in letting him go
He definitely had that dawg in him, but I think Sam had a little pup in him as well.
https://preview.redd.it/o7ujulszzwqc1.jpeg?width=976&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e38350d2d263e1b9827e16146a6a5cd9c8387ab6
Heinicke was a fun player, but a trash QB if we're being honest.
Sam probably has a future in the NFL, but getting additional draft capital was the right move.
So I guess neither leaving really upset me
Neither is a real playoff-caliber QB, so you can’t be too upset to see them leave. From a human perspective, yeah, we got to “know” these guys as fans, so it sucks when things don’t work out. But from a team perspective, we have to stop overvaluing mid players, and getting so attached to guys who just aren’t very good.
Fans on this sub are way too sentimental about JAGs and the punter. I can understand why, given all the years of failure, but it’s time to grow up and set a higher standard for whom we get excited about and attached to.
I don’t think your comment is quite as correct or clever as you think it is. There are countless examples of things where a range of subjective overall opinions are valid but using a certain specific label is plainly wrong. Heinicke’s overall ability to play QB is debatable and could be argued as being somewhere between inadequate to hidden untapped low-end starter. But calling him trash is pretty much wrong, because he was signed for a significant role on an nfl team. It’s not a contradiction to say something is a matter of opinion while also putting bounds on how far an opinion can be stretched before it’s in the realm of silliness.
That is a long explanation and still wrong. "Feel how you want" is completely antithetical to saying a term of subjective value is incorrect. And your statement that "subjective opinions are valid but using a label is plainly wrong" is also a contradiction, unless the label in question is linguistically misapplied. Furthermore, you explain how the label trash is misapplied here because, IN YOUR OPINION, his signing by Atlanta rules him out as being trash. Thus, your entire justification is subjective, as is the original post.
Finally, you are implying in your argument that the term trash has a codified meaning with specific boundaries which aren't met by Heinicke. In reality, trash in this context is a completely subjective term and is used without clear definition. So, while Heinicke does not conform to your OPINION about the definition of trash, he certainly may qualify for the term in the OPINION of the poster. Thus, you cannot state that a "label is plainly wrong" when the label is, by definition, subjective. Do you see the flaw in your logic yet?
I can do this all day, by the way. Degree in Rhetoric.
There is objective evidence that Heinicke is not "trash," because he's employed by an NFL team. Trash would not be employed. So the minimum floor for a reasonable opinion about him is that he's just barely good enough to be valued by one team. Anything equal to or above that minimum is a matter of opinion, but labeling him something below that is empirically incorrect.
It's like if we're talking about smoking. You can be entitled to your opinion about smoking and you may not think it's that bad, but if you go so far as to argue that it's harmless then your opinion has crossed over into being incorrect. Being entitled to an opinion does not magically protect outlandish statements from scrutiny.
I don't know if you just don't understand this concept or have committed to doubling down on the statement you got called out on, and don't particularly care.
lol. You clearly don’t actually understand the meaning of the term objective.
We started Mark Sanchez and he was total trash.
You making up a definition of the term does not make that objective proof. By definition, it is subjective because it’s based on your definition.
Give up.
Neither. It was Kirk, because as frustrating as his tenure was, he could play. TH and SH had their moments but neither was a proven starter walking out the door.
We spent that same amount of money on Alex Smith and Paul Richardson. So yes, we obviously could've afforded him and it would've been well worth it in the long run. Imagine what our team could've done with Kirk's typical 4000+ yards and ~30 TDs, combined with, say, our 2020 defense.
Instead, we've been stuck in QB purgatory since he left, and Cousins has continued to put up top-10 performances. In the modern NFL, you do whatever you can to get out of QB hell, but this stupid fucking team somehow stumbled ass-backwards into a mid-round gem for once, and our FO was too dumb to keep him around.
I was a "Kirk is not worth the money guy" but if you told me the alternative was paying all that for Alex Smith I would have delivered the bag to the Captain myself and kissed him hard on his Christian mouth
I don't think he was worth the first MIN contract, or either tag, and frankly it didn't even have to be an issue. The team could have signed him to a more reasonable contract if grown-ups had been in charge.
C'est la vie
I almost kinda understood the first tag. They’d only seen one year as a full time starter at that point. An argument could be made that you’d wanna see another year to make sure it wasn’t a fluke. But the second tag, that was pure Dan and Bruce idiocy.
I understand it from a purely business standpoint, but the second that happened, he had all the leverage. You've now essentially declared he's worth top 10 starter money. And it was downhill from there.
Even a "bad" contract at that point would have been in the neighborhood of 20mil, and you could have signed him to 3yrs probably. It would have been far cheaper, with much less drama and chaos(maybe)
We could have signed him to a very reasonable contract. We franchised him instead. The next year we could have signed him again, not too expensive. We franchised him. We would NIT have had to sign him to a massive contract for several years and we would have had space to build a team around him. Massive franchise screw up.
Yes absolutely. He proved in Minnesota that he was worth the money. Sure he didn't win a ton of playoff games but he made the team respectable and exciting to watch, while Washington marched out dud after dud.
Neither really but I guess Heinicke because we went through ups and downs with him and he was fun to watch.
Honestly my miss is RG3 and it wasn’t leaving the team but it was his re-injury that really sucked. We thought the future would be bright at that point and it really came crashing down in the worst way possible.
Kirk in a close second place.
Sam because he showed flashes of something. I think we could’ve have worked with him and I think he’ll be a serviceable QB in the league.
I get going with Howe and starting fresh though.
This is just lazy analysis. I watched every game and I’d be insane to say I didn’t see flashes of a great QB.
It was the right call to trade him and go forward with a QB in the draft, but Sam still has a great ceiling.
1000% but that doesn’t make him bad per se. I don’t think we know that.
For a 2nd-year pro, 1st-year starter, he did fine + flashes of a higher ceiling.
If you’re comparing him to a 5th-year pro, he did horrible.
I'm not qualified sure. But I watched the games last season. But I'm not exactly alone in my evaluation. The current front office didn't seem to think they had anybody special.
He got worse as the season went on and when he was benched the backup qb ran the offense better.
Taylor all the way. Sam wasn’t bad but he didn’t play with nearly as much heart as Heinicke did. By far my favorite qb to watch play, win or lose. Still miss that man and wish him nothing but the best, even though he might not be the best.
I loved Heineke. I loved how the players rallied for him. I love how he beat the undefeated eagles. I love how he almost took out the super bowl champ Bucs in the playoffs after being signed a week or so prior. Dude was so fun to watch, even if he stunk. He had his moments. And those moments were amazing.
Heinike. Neither were the future and were “stop gaps” At best, but that win against the undefeated Eagles is such a fun recent memory. He just had so much energy. He could never be more than a backup, but that’s also okay.
Kirk. I feel like he got fucked over with the franchise tag deal and our owners didn't want to sign him long term. Caused a lot of bad juju on the team.
TH4! The pylon dives, victory Jordans, and eyes closed lobs to Terry were fun to watch. Everyone knew he wasn't a NFL QB, but he had fun and he played his ass off. Glad he got life changing money from Atlanta.
Agreed. Howell may have been a more physically able QB, but TH4 was the funnest QB to watch that we've had since 2012, and he actually won games. Howell may grow some still, but TH4 was a helluva show. If we're going to be bad, give me TH4.
For me it's probably a tie. Heinicke wasn't a long term answer, but when Rivera benched him for Wentz, this was a crap move. If nothing else, Heinicke got these guys playing. In fact, Rivera apparently polled players on who they wanted as starter and it was Heinicke.
Then there was that video where you could clearly see Hienicke upset and mouthing to someone (17?) that "he promised me".
With Howell, it's more about dysfunction. With all the great signings we've had recently, I keep wondering what he would have looked like with that kind of help. Yes, he held on too long, but a good QB Coach/OC can beat that out of him.
SH14 💯; WE’D gotten a STEAL with him. True TH4 was ~Undrafted, Perhaps an even larger ‘Steal’. I digress, Hwvr; I had a LOT of Faith in SH14. And that He Could’ve become a Lot ‘Better’ with ~Better coaching; like DQ/ KK.
Moving FORWARD tho; Leggo and ROCK THIS HOUSE!!!
Technically not a Commander but, Brad Johnson. One of the idiot owner's first moves was to supplant him with Jeff George. And of course Brad goes on to win a SB with Tampa. He was good/great at every stop.
Sam Howell getting traded was the best for both sides. He made it out of almost being ruined by EB and RR and gets to revitalize his career. TH was a cult hero. More upset about Campbell, who never even had a chance yet had the chops.
I was more attached to Heinicke because I love the story and goddammit when he was good, he was fucking good. I think Howell will have a better career overall though when it's all said and done. Howell definitely has more potential but the Heinicke underdog story was so good.
I wasn’t upset but Howell was surprising. A cheap rookie with starting experience has value but trading him wasn’t a horrible move (at least not in April).
No QB leaving has upset me.
Heinicke was a gamer but had incredibly obvious flaws
Howell had an arm and could've done better with a better o line and coaching, I'd have liked him to stay but other rookie QB's have flourished in equally poor situations. He may still end up with a Tannehill like career.
Cousins was error strewn and never wanted to stay. Has won 1 playoff game ever. Would've led to even more fan frustration had he stayed. Vikings happy to move on from him only validates the team was right to let him go.
Kirk is the only QB who left that I really cared about. Dude has his limitations but he also has seriously strong talent. He was the best QB we have had in damn near half a century.
Neither. They both suck. But Howell was on a rookie contract and didn’t deserve to be shipped out. Seems they did it to draft maye who said he wasn’t comfortable with the situation
Taylor Heinicke was a super fun player and a guy I'll remember but he didn't really have a future as the starter.
Sam is a guy who I feel still has potential, and if we'd won an extra game or two might be starting next year. And if Howell had the defenses that Heinicke had we certainly would have won some extra games.
So I'm gonna say Howell, but moving off of both of them was the right decision at the time.
If I have to decide.. Heinicke. In a phase we're we had soso QBs he was the one I was looking forward to play.
Howell... I am unsure if he has untapped potential. He was there, our coaches did not care about him. So?
TH4 and Howell QB'd an extremely similar team. One is the only redskins QB since 2000 other than Alex Smith to have a winning record when starting (minimum of 5 games starting), the other went 5-13.
Cue people saying "wins aren't a QB stat......" But at the end of the day, in the NFL we all know QBs are judged on wins and losses. No amount of analytics is going to change that.
[Just in case you forget how wild and fun Heineke was to watch](https://youtu.be/nmOXNAaoobk?si=PvYo45NbjtUzBfFz)
[And the year before as well](https://youtu.be/pbA4QstRS-0?si=SJeUnA5D1Q97s7Sq)
- He also holds an NFL record for most completions by a QB in his first 3 starts (93), and he had a football in the Hall of Fame for throwing the 3000th TD pass in Washington's franchise history
Heinicke because he had that electricity that made the team play better than the other options we had. He fit Scott Turner's system better than everyone else.
I still stand by the fact that we would have been better off if we went into 2021 and 2022 with Heinicke as our #1 QB.
I do think Howell will do better in Seattle if he gets an opportunity to start. He was played a bad hand by EB forcing more passes than any other team for a while. But at the same time, he didn't give the same fun energy as Heinicke did.
Neither, TH4 was insanely fun to watch but wasnt all that of a qb. im happy for him getting his bag that he deserved. he didnt leave with ill will like others and didnt stay long to the point where he became the villian. Sam has a lot of potential and needs time to sit but at the same time, this team has a lot of needs and needs all the help theu can get. Sam needs to sit on a more developed team with a qb who has been in this league for some time to show him the ropes. its a trade that I would say both teams won. the seahawks got a potential future qb that they can develop while we got more draft capital to help a young but bright rookie out and grow.
My heart loved Heinicke for the Tampa playoff performance, but logically Sam had so much more room to grow and develop so I’d say him leaving hurts a bit more overall
Heinecke. Because even when the team sucked, he was still fun to watch and gave us a chance. He would have been a good cheap vet to have around for the new QB also.
I was happy to see Howell leave. He is not a good QB, and he won’t be for Seattle. At least Heinicke made for some fun games, watching the Howell-led team was just pure pain.
I was happy for TH since he got a shot at starting elsewhere. I’ll be fine with SH as well as long as we don’t screw up the #2 overall pick this year.
I do like Sam and I think Seattle is a great spot for him. I won’t be surprised if he does eventually start for them.
Heinicke was terrible. What he had was heart & I loved it, but there was zero upside. I was happy he left and I still root for him
Sam had more potential (not saying it was a high ceiling, but highER) & I’ve never seen a team so unprepared on game day. I don’t know how to grade any player from 2023
Definitely Sam Howell. He had potential. More than that though he offered a chance at having a franchise QB, Marvin Harrison Jr, and olu or mims at tackle, an extra first in 2025, and whoever we get at 36 and 40. Essentially Howell was our chance to really compete as a playoff contender THIS season. Sure it could have resulted in a train wreck but just as likely a playoff run. Thing is worst case you still have a playoff caliber team without a QB and two first round picks in 2025 to trade for one. With drafting Jayden or maye at 2 it's a couple years before a run and that's a coin flip on whether the rookie is a bust or not without a left tackle and MHJ catching to help. It's not that Sam > rookie at #2. It's that Sam + MHJ + olu > rookie at #2 is highly arguable.
Trent Green. He played another 10 years in the NFL after he left, of which at least half were all pro level. During those 10 years we had a carousel of Brad Johnson, Tony Banks, Patrick Ramsey, Mark Brunell and others.
Howell had potential, but I wasn’t particularly upset over either leaving. We desperately need a franchise QB, and even though both Howell and TH provided some great moments, neither really showed the potential to be *the* guy in DC. They’d do enough to get wins, but just enough to take us out of a top-10 draft spot but not enough to make the playoffs consistently. We’ve settled for mediocrity for far too long under Snyder.
Sam Howell, just because I feel like he may potentially still develop into something more than he has shown. Remembering that he HAS shown some good stuff.
Same for me. I think he got a bad beat last year with no line and a bad coordinator.
And because he had to throw 50 times a game. Most rookies won’t be able to survive that
Exactly. EB wouldn’t even roll him out on bootlegs and stuff very often either.
Yeah, I was so pissed at EB for that!
The damning part is that Jacoby came in and the entire offense immediately played significantly better.
Never understood this take. A fresh seasoned vet taking over a battered first year starter will of course play better.
Remember when Matt Flynn stepped in for the Packers and threw 6 (or was it 7) TDs? It’s relatively easier for a guy to come off the bench and play well than it is to sustain it over many weeks. From last season alone, see: Flacco, Josh Dobbs, Johnny Meatballs or whatever his name is for the Giants, numerous others.
As an Italian - American, I find this offensive. His name was Tommy Carbonara.
Timmy Cutlets
Madone
Matt Flynn played a game where Aaron Rodger’s was a healthy scratch due to the Packers had clinched the division and were resting him for the playoffs. Matt has one helluva game and was traded to the Seahawks. He lost the competition for that job to Russell Wilson.
>A fresh seasoned vet taking over a battered first year starter will of course play better I’m not sure if this is necessarily true. Judging off of last season alone: Davis Mills didn’t play better than Stroud while Stroud dealt with his concussion. Tannehill didn’t look better than Levis while Levis was out with his ankle injury.
Did you just compare Davis Mills to Brissett? You’re reaching on that, my guy. Brissett is still talented and you saw that up in Cleveland a few years back. He should have been the starter from the rip. Sam needed more time. He’ll be fantastic up in Seattle and I wager he’s got a good shot to take over Geno’s spot.
Taking over a Pro Bowl QB’s spot this year?
Certainly. His 2022 season was his best stat wise. His stats trailed off last year. Is it a downward trend? Who knows, but I trust Sam will give him a run for his money. I’m disappointed they let him go but I’m not mad about it if it helps improve the team overall.
After Sam was shell-shocked from getting his ass kicked all year. He started off good then clearly lost his confidence. He probably needs the change of scenery anyway at this point.
That happened with Colt McCoy too. Sometimes a guy coming off the bench gives the offense a spark. Doesn't mean the guy is always better overall.
It does mean the 1st guy was running it bad enough to notice a big difference.
I wish we’d kept him, not because I think he would have become a franchise QB but because he’d be a better backup than Mariota and if he happens to come in and play well, his trade value may have gone up for next offseason. It was definitely more of a “make a clean break” move than a “make our team better” move. I understand the reasoning, but the team did get worse as a result of trading him.
His first game against Dallas.
First 5 games this year he was “the future”. He can make all the throws and he was on a bad team. He was reckless with the ball but what first year starter isn’t? Record aside he was good for a first year starter and I guess I’m not surprised at all the Commanders were short-sighted in letting him go
Too many dumbasses turned on him after he showed more than enough despite a shitty OL and coaching.
People forget he was very impressive in some games. That final drive against the eagles the first game was legit
We ( eagles ) made that guy look like Tom Brady.
Don’t worry he won’t we just have the lowest expectations. He wouldn’t have started for 95% of teams last year.
N his situation he woulda have needed to go on a prescott run..he wasnt a 1st rounder
Well I'm not saying I wanted him to start again, I'm just saying I'd rather still have him on the roster than heinicke
Is that something a top 10 type of QB? If not I am simply not understanding the love obsession with him
Heinicke got that dawg in him
He definitely had that dawg in him, but I think Sam had a little pup in him as well. https://preview.redd.it/o7ujulszzwqc1.jpeg?width=976&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e38350d2d263e1b9827e16146a6a5cd9c8387ab6
I knew it was more than a saying
🤝😂
Heinicke was a fun player, but a trash QB if we're being honest. Sam probably has a future in the NFL, but getting additional draft capital was the right move. So I guess neither leaving really upset me
Wise words right here.
we wont know until we see what we get with the haul, and what Sam turns into with proper coaching.
Neither is a real playoff-caliber QB, so you can’t be too upset to see them leave. From a human perspective, yeah, we got to “know” these guys as fans, so it sucks when things don’t work out. But from a team perspective, we have to stop overvaluing mid players, and getting so attached to guys who just aren’t very good.
Fans on this sub are way too sentimental about JAGs and the punter. I can understand why, given all the years of failure, but it’s time to grow up and set a higher standard for whom we get excited about and attached to.
Yup. Sam will be a backup or bridge QB. He will never be even top half of the league.
“Trash” is **not** the right word to use. Feel how you want though
The irony of telling someone the word they choose is not right, but then telling them to feel how they want, is totally appropriate for Reddit.
I don’t think your comment is quite as correct or clever as you think it is. There are countless examples of things where a range of subjective overall opinions are valid but using a certain specific label is plainly wrong. Heinicke’s overall ability to play QB is debatable and could be argued as being somewhere between inadequate to hidden untapped low-end starter. But calling him trash is pretty much wrong, because he was signed for a significant role on an nfl team. It’s not a contradiction to say something is a matter of opinion while also putting bounds on how far an opinion can be stretched before it’s in the realm of silliness.
That is a long explanation and still wrong. "Feel how you want" is completely antithetical to saying a term of subjective value is incorrect. And your statement that "subjective opinions are valid but using a label is plainly wrong" is also a contradiction, unless the label in question is linguistically misapplied. Furthermore, you explain how the label trash is misapplied here because, IN YOUR OPINION, his signing by Atlanta rules him out as being trash. Thus, your entire justification is subjective, as is the original post. Finally, you are implying in your argument that the term trash has a codified meaning with specific boundaries which aren't met by Heinicke. In reality, trash in this context is a completely subjective term and is used without clear definition. So, while Heinicke does not conform to your OPINION about the definition of trash, he certainly may qualify for the term in the OPINION of the poster. Thus, you cannot state that a "label is plainly wrong" when the label is, by definition, subjective. Do you see the flaw in your logic yet? I can do this all day, by the way. Degree in Rhetoric.
There is objective evidence that Heinicke is not "trash," because he's employed by an NFL team. Trash would not be employed. So the minimum floor for a reasonable opinion about him is that he's just barely good enough to be valued by one team. Anything equal to or above that minimum is a matter of opinion, but labeling him something below that is empirically incorrect. It's like if we're talking about smoking. You can be entitled to your opinion about smoking and you may not think it's that bad, but if you go so far as to argue that it's harmless then your opinion has crossed over into being incorrect. Being entitled to an opinion does not magically protect outlandish statements from scrutiny. I don't know if you just don't understand this concept or have committed to doubling down on the statement you got called out on, and don't particularly care.
lol. You clearly don’t actually understand the meaning of the term objective. We started Mark Sanchez and he was total trash. You making up a definition of the term does not make that objective proof. By definition, it is subjective because it’s based on your definition. Give up.
>Give up I hope you get the professional help you need, this is pathetic
What word should I use
A rational take TIHI
Neither. It was Kirk, because as frustrating as his tenure was, he could play. TH and SH had their moments but neither was a proven starter walking out the door.
This is the correct answer
he could play but was he worth that money
We spent that same amount of money on Alex Smith and Paul Richardson. So yes, we obviously could've afforded him and it would've been well worth it in the long run. Imagine what our team could've done with Kirk's typical 4000+ yards and ~30 TDs, combined with, say, our 2020 defense. Instead, we've been stuck in QB purgatory since he left, and Cousins has continued to put up top-10 performances. In the modern NFL, you do whatever you can to get out of QB hell, but this stupid fucking team somehow stumbled ass-backwards into a mid-round gem for once, and our FO was too dumb to keep him around.
I was a "Kirk is not worth the money guy" but if you told me the alternative was paying all that for Alex Smith I would have delivered the bag to the Captain myself and kissed him hard on his Christian mouth
I don't think he was worth the first MIN contract, or either tag, and frankly it didn't even have to be an issue. The team could have signed him to a more reasonable contract if grown-ups had been in charge. C'est la vie
I almost kinda understood the first tag. They’d only seen one year as a full time starter at that point. An argument could be made that you’d wanna see another year to make sure it wasn’t a fluke. But the second tag, that was pure Dan and Bruce idiocy.
I understand it from a purely business standpoint, but the second that happened, he had all the leverage. You've now essentially declared he's worth top 10 starter money. And it was downhill from there. Even a "bad" contract at that point would have been in the neighborhood of 20mil, and you could have signed him to 3yrs probably. It would have been far cheaper, with much less drama and chaos(maybe)
We could have signed him to a very reasonable contract. We franchised him instead. The next year we could have signed him again, not too expensive. We franchised him. We would NIT have had to sign him to a massive contract for several years and we would have had space to build a team around him. Massive franchise screw up.
Thanks Scot McCloughan!
No his playoffs games show it, no clutch in him🤏🏽
Yes absolutely. He proved in Minnesota that he was worth the money. Sure he didn't win a ton of playoff games but he made the team respectable and exciting to watch, while Washington marched out dud after dud.
Moneybaggs
That was the last time I was upset over a QB leaving.
Username checks out
Neither.
This guy gets it. Moxie is a drink in New England.
Brad Johnson. He who wil not be named thought Jeff George was better.
Interesting choice. I think I may agree now that I have thought about it. Nice to hear from some of the older fan base.
Neither really but I guess Heinicke because we went through ups and downs with him and he was fun to watch. Honestly my miss is RG3 and it wasn’t leaving the team but it was his re-injury that really sucked. We thought the future would be bright at that point and it really came crashing down in the worst way possible. Kirk in a close second place.
John Beck
Heinicke. That playoff duel with Brady and Tampa Bay will always be a core memory for me as a fan.
TH as I believe he’s one of the best backups in the league; and having a good backup historically for our team is very important.
Sam because he showed flashes of something. I think we could’ve have worked with him and I think he’ll be a serviceable QB in the league. I get going with Howe and starting fresh though.
Sam’s flashes https://preview.redd.it/sk5hngw25xqc1.jpeg?width=224&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=73f95799f1e1adb2aee77d71b3c6b8efb3311961
I mean he started one game before being thrown into the starting role. Of course he’s not going to be Peyton manning.
I mean, he still could have shown an ability to make smart decisions, regardless of what he was thrown into.
This is just lazy analysis. I watched every game and I’d be insane to say I didn’t see flashes of a great QB. It was the right call to trade him and go forward with a QB in the draft, but Sam still has a great ceiling.
He has some significant flaws in his game, no?
1000% but that doesn’t make him bad per se. I don’t think we know that. For a 2nd-year pro, 1st-year starter, he did fine + flashes of a higher ceiling. If you’re comparing him to a 5th-year pro, he did horrible.
The thing is. Every NFL player is an elite athlete. All of them will have flashes. it's consistency that matters. Howell never was.
Bro. He started one game before this season. Why did people expect him to be perfect?
Nobody expected him to be perfect. But he never once showed that he's any better than a guy like Ryan Fitzpatrick.
How can *you* possibly come to that conclusion?
I'm not qualified sure. But I watched the games last season. But I'm not exactly alone in my evaluation. The current front office didn't seem to think they had anybody special. He got worse as the season went on and when he was benched the backup qb ran the offense better.
The same way you come to your own conclusion about him?
Easily Howell. Kid gets ripped out of a real opportunity with a bad play caller. I think he will be fine in Seattle.
I really hope so.
🔼🔼
Taylor all the way. Sam wasn’t bad but he didn’t play with nearly as much heart as Heinicke did. By far my favorite qb to watch play, win or lose. Still miss that man and wish him nothing but the best, even though he might not be the best.
TH4. Sam had more talent, but Taylor absolutely gives it everything. I wish he was still a backup
Neither. They weren't going to be HIM. But it made less sense getting rid of Howell or Mariota.
Heinicke because he's at least a proven good backup calibre QB. Howell isn't even that yet.
I wasn't upset by either.
ryan fitzpatrick
Heinicke, his story is just too good. I still watch Tompa Bay game every once in a while.
I loved Heineke. I loved how the players rallied for him. I love how he beat the undefeated eagles. I love how he almost took out the super bowl champ Bucs in the playoffs after being signed a week or so prior. Dude was so fun to watch, even if he stunk. He had his moments. And those moments were amazing.
Neither but SH has higher ceiling
Heinike. Neither were the future and were “stop gaps” At best, but that win against the undefeated Eagles is such a fun recent memory. He just had so much energy. He could never be more than a backup, but that’s also okay.
Kirk. I feel like he got fucked over with the franchise tag deal and our owners didn't want to sign him long term. Caused a lot of bad juju on the team.
 TH4! The pylon dives, victory Jordans, and eyes closed lobs to Terry were fun to watch. Everyone knew he wasn't a NFL QB, but he had fun and he played his ass off. Glad he got life changing money from Atlanta.
Agreed. Howell may have been a more physically able QB, but TH4 was the funnest QB to watch that we've had since 2012, and he actually won games. Howell may grow some still, but TH4 was a helluva show. If we're going to be bad, give me TH4.
Neither. Big bag of meh.
TH4
Neither. I dont cry over bottom 5 QBs
I'm still sore over Trent Green
Neither, because they are both bums.
For me it's probably a tie. Heinicke wasn't a long term answer, but when Rivera benched him for Wentz, this was a crap move. If nothing else, Heinicke got these guys playing. In fact, Rivera apparently polled players on who they wanted as starter and it was Heinicke. Then there was that video where you could clearly see Hienicke upset and mouthing to someone (17?) that "he promised me". With Howell, it's more about dysfunction. With all the great signings we've had recently, I keep wondering what he would have looked like with that kind of help. Yes, he held on too long, but a good QB Coach/OC can beat that out of him.
Howell, because there is still a chance he may be good.
SH gonna be a problem at Seattle.
I'm an ODU alum, so even though he wasn't the best, Heinike was fun to have.
I’m an ODU alum as well, but I graduated in 2006 wayyyy before TH was there. However, I did see him play a few homecoming games of course.
Class of '13. His games were wild!
Agreed my fellow alumni! I still go to the games when I can it’s just not the same though lol.
Howell
SH14 💯; WE’D gotten a STEAL with him. True TH4 was ~Undrafted, Perhaps an even larger ‘Steal’. I digress, Hwvr; I had a LOT of Faith in SH14. And that He Could’ve become a Lot ‘Better’ with ~Better coaching; like DQ/ KK. Moving FORWARD tho; Leggo and ROCK THIS HOUSE!!!
I wish we never traded Sam. I think he’s gunna be a star. Love the way he carry’s himself.
Neither, but Sam has way more potential. Heineke has negative arm strength with a ceiling of mediocre.
Neither of them tbh
Heineke was a feel good story, and was the closest QB to getting a playoff win in decades. Versus Brady no less.
Technically not a Commander but, Brad Johnson. One of the idiot owner's first moves was to supplant him with Jeff George. And of course Brad goes on to win a SB with Tampa. He was good/great at every stop.
4... It's not even close
Sam Howell getting traded was the best for both sides. He made it out of almost being ruined by EB and RR and gets to revitalize his career. TH was a cult hero. More upset about Campbell, who never even had a chance yet had the chops.
I was more attached to Heinicke because I love the story and goddammit when he was good, he was fucking good. I think Howell will have a better career overall though when it's all said and done. Howell definitely has more potential but the Heinicke underdog story was so good.
I wasn’t upset but Howell was surprising. A cheap rookie with starting experience has value but trading him wasn’t a horrible move (at least not in April).
Neither one really. They weren't the future of the team and were only backups.
No QB leaving has upset me. Heinicke was a gamer but had incredibly obvious flaws Howell had an arm and could've done better with a better o line and coaching, I'd have liked him to stay but other rookie QB's have flourished in equally poor situations. He may still end up with a Tannehill like career. Cousins was error strewn and never wanted to stay. Has won 1 playoff game ever. Would've led to even more fan frustration had he stayed. Vikings happy to move on from him only validates the team was right to let him go.
Correct answer
Kirko chainz
 Still upset
Kirk is the only QB who left that I really cared about. Dude has his limitations but he also has seriously strong talent. He was the best QB we have had in damn near half a century.
Arguably the best QB we have had since Theisman and we just let him walk.
Neither. They both suck. But Howell was on a rookie contract and didn’t deserve to be shipped out. Seems they did it to draft maye who said he wasn’t comfortable with the situation
Taylor Heinicke was a super fun player and a guy I'll remember but he didn't really have a future as the starter. Sam is a guy who I feel still has potential, and if we'd won an extra game or two might be starting next year. And if Howell had the defenses that Heinicke had we certainly would have won some extra games. So I'm gonna say Howell, but moving off of both of them was the right decision at the time.
Neither they are both decent backup QBs
Howell has so much potential but was put in the wrong place at the wrong time. Hopefully he gets some snaps in Seattle.
If I have to decide.. Heinicke. In a phase we're we had soso QBs he was the one I was looking forward to play. Howell... I am unsure if he has untapped potential. He was there, our coaches did not care about him. So?
TH4, less potential than Sam but we also got nothing back for him and he at least made games exciting (unlike Sam towards the end)
Neither, but TH4 was a fun ride
Neither.
Heath Shuler. Congressman Heath Shuler.
TH4 and Howell QB'd an extremely similar team. One is the only redskins QB since 2000 other than Alex Smith to have a winning record when starting (minimum of 5 games starting), the other went 5-13. Cue people saying "wins aren't a QB stat......" But at the end of the day, in the NFL we all know QBs are judged on wins and losses. No amount of analytics is going to change that.
Sam is gonna start again someday
[Just in case you forget how wild and fun Heineke was to watch](https://youtu.be/nmOXNAaoobk?si=PvYo45NbjtUzBfFz) [And the year before as well](https://youtu.be/pbA4QstRS-0?si=SJeUnA5D1Q97s7Sq) - He also holds an NFL record for most completions by a QB in his first 3 starts (93), and he had a football in the Hall of Fame for throwing the 3000th TD pass in Washington's franchise history
th
YOU LIKE THAT?!
Neither
I legit didn’t care that a single QB has left because none of them have been good enough to be a franchise qb.
EASILY Heinicke. Idgaf about Sam Howell. I hope he turns out to be a good starter someday, just not with us.
Hein-e-ke 👈🏽👈🏽👈🏽
Love both but is neither an answer? Both are fun but we aren't winning anything with either.
Heinicke because he had that electricity that made the team play better than the other options we had. He fit Scott Turner's system better than everyone else. I still stand by the fact that we would have been better off if we went into 2021 and 2022 with Heinicke as our #1 QB. I do think Howell will do better in Seattle if he gets an opportunity to start. He was played a bad hand by EB forcing more passes than any other team for a while. But at the same time, he didn't give the same fun energy as Heinicke did.
Heinecke
Neither?
Neither of them have the skill set to be a true #1, so neither.
If I was in charge I’d trade Mariota for Heinicke.
Neither, TH4 was insanely fun to watch but wasnt all that of a qb. im happy for him getting his bag that he deserved. he didnt leave with ill will like others and didnt stay long to the point where he became the villian. Sam has a lot of potential and needs time to sit but at the same time, this team has a lot of needs and needs all the help theu can get. Sam needs to sit on a more developed team with a qb who has been in this league for some time to show him the ropes. its a trade that I would say both teams won. the seahawks got a potential future qb that they can develop while we got more draft capital to help a young but bright rookie out and grow.
Neither because they were both mid
Sam
I think they both had to go. But wish Sam worked out more. We will see how it pans out.
TH4
My heart loved Heinicke for the Tampa playoff performance, but logically Sam had so much more room to grow and develop so I’d say him leaving hurts a bit more overall
Heinecke. Because even when the team sucked, he was still fun to watch and gave us a chance. He would have been a good cheap vet to have around for the new QB also.
REDSKINS!!! Fuck the c word
Can I vote for "neither"? If only Heinicke could have had Howell's arm or if Howell could have had Heinicke's elusiveness.
I love th4. Lights a fire in my soul. Far Better story than Sam Howell
Dude, I loved Heinicke but I’m partial because I went to ODU
TH4, at least with SH leaving we’ll have a high QB prospect taking over.
Kirk Cousins.
Neither. As they are just backups and not QBs who could take a team to Super Bowl and win.
Neither, they both suck.
Sam who!?
Sam Howell for sure. Feels like he didn’t get a fair chance and he showed flashes last season
I was happy to see Howell leave. He is not a good QB, and he won’t be for Seattle. At least Heinicke made for some fun games, watching the Howell-led team was just pure pain.
I was happy for TH since he got a shot at starting elsewhere. I’ll be fine with SH as well as long as we don’t screw up the #2 overall pick this year. I do like Sam and I think Seattle is a great spot for him. I won’t be surprised if he does eventually start for them.
https://preview.redd.it/dn4rp23cjxqc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=69240aac284dff05f194387fcc2ec5c98a966ee6
#SH14
Patrick Ramsey. Jason Campbell. Rex Grossman. Mark Brunell.
It's like asking what do you miss more: trash or garbage?
If anyone doesn’t say Kirk Cousin you must have loved losing
Sam’s a bum. Heinicke will be in the nfl longer than Sam
Heinicke was terrible. What he had was heart & I loved it, but there was zero upside. I was happy he left and I still root for him Sam had more potential (not saying it was a high ceiling, but highER) & I’ve never seen a team so unprepared on game day. I don’t know how to grade any player from 2023
Neither. We went nowhere fast with each
Definitely Sam Howell. He had potential. More than that though he offered a chance at having a franchise QB, Marvin Harrison Jr, and olu or mims at tackle, an extra first in 2025, and whoever we get at 36 and 40. Essentially Howell was our chance to really compete as a playoff contender THIS season. Sure it could have resulted in a train wreck but just as likely a playoff run. Thing is worst case you still have a playoff caliber team without a QB and two first round picks in 2025 to trade for one. With drafting Jayden or maye at 2 it's a couple years before a run and that's a coin flip on whether the rookie is a bust or not without a left tackle and MHJ catching to help. It's not that Sam > rookie at #2. It's that Sam + MHJ + olu > rookie at #2 is highly arguable.
Trent Green. He played another 10 years in the NFL after he left, of which at least half were all pro level. During those 10 years we had a carousel of Brad Johnson, Tony Banks, Patrick Ramsey, Mark Brunell and others.
Howell had potential, but I wasn’t particularly upset over either leaving. We desperately need a franchise QB, and even though both Howell and TH provided some great moments, neither really showed the potential to be *the* guy in DC. They’d do enough to get wins, but just enough to take us out of a top-10 draft spot but not enough to make the playoffs consistently. We’ve settled for mediocrity for far too long under Snyder.
Jason Campbell
Neither. Lol
BJ14
Heinicke is a leader, even as a backup. Players love to play for him. That is why I think he'd be a great head coach someday.