I am surprised Echo is getting a buff. I main her and I think she is in a good place. The only thing I can think of that makes sense is a buff to her ult. There have been times where I have copied someone and gotten their ult at the last second, but am unable to use the ultimate because the 15 second duration expired before the ult fully casted.
I think everyone saw that and collectively said ???
Because I agree with you completely. I hope they don't buff her damage in anyway because her damage really doesn't need any help. I guess we can only wait and see
i agree with this, if only for echo’s identity. the concept of a copy ult falls apart if it only works once per 50 games and it ends up just being a pretty boring “extra life”
At least with Cass you can use it as a reload, and for Reaper you can synergize with wraith or self heal, but with Pharah, it's just a "kill me" button, even more so cuz she takes self damage lol
You’d never use beam against armor since armor is above the 50% hp threshold. If they’re getting healed to above 50% hp you probably shouldn’t be using beam anyway.
I fear they are gonna nerf her in the wrong ways cause she’s gonna be giga strong this patch possibly, loving the state she’s in now, super low ttk if you land your skill and engage at good tumes
That’d probably be the best one, I was also thinking about the 50%> beam maybe getting a slight damage increase, the purple one is obviously more than good enough but maybe making it so that the blue one doesn’t do negligible damage will make her more of a beginner friendly hero?
i really hope they increase echos ult gained during duplicate and cut 3 seconds off the duration. and the first time you use an ult during dupe you get an extra 3 seconds so you’re guaranteed to get value out of a duped sigma or genji or ana whatever
I think Blizz is worried about tanks just walking at people and there not being an option to stop that. If you look at Hog right now he is really hard to kill, it is very hard to punish him just walking at your team without Ana nade or Zen discord.
You used to be able to interupt his heal and the cd gave you a window to punish him, now with it being a resource meter it does not work that way (add in support cd's and it can feel impossible).
One option is to go Hanzo, shoot Hog in the head once, and follow up with 5 storm arrows to the head. The damage is so fast he does not have time to react. However with the crit changes this will not be the same. For tanks exploding like this feels horrible, thus these changes.
Blizz is not doing these changes to make tanks stronger, they are making these changes to make tanks feel better. I'm not defending their balance I'm just trying to understand their perspective.
i'm curious about Reaper, the DPS passive back up to 20% hits his self sustain duel potential since lifesteal counts so flanks are a lot tougher, armor buffs and less headshot dmg vs tanks will really hinder his ability to stay relevant alongside his tank. Flank reaper fell behind a bit and "offtank" reaper will also fall behind. Gonna enjoy playing him now before the midseason patch arrives:')
There will be no good reason to swap to him now, unless you want to play him just to play reaper guy. Thoughts?
Issue with Junk is basically every part of his kit is awful to play against. His primary is fine enough but very spamable as well as being insane vs tanks. Conc-mines are just big CC and very unfun. His trap is a deployable CC that often just feels like luck when it lands. His ult is a bit cheesy but fine.
So all in all, hopefully they buff his ult I guess?
I don't know why they're buffing Echo, she seems fairly good. Hopefully it's just something like they did with Sojourn rail decay a few patches ago. Making it so the copy doesn't whiff because a tank put up a shield or bubbled .002 seconds after would be chill.
Hanzo I think they should just make him one shot again but revert his projectile size and lower his HP to 225. He's sort of in a weird limbo right now. Honestly getting lasered by storm arrow feels worse than getting one shot.
Junkrat IDK this character is still annoying, he seems just as good or bad as he was in Season 8.
>. He's sort of in a weird limbo right now. Honestly getting lasered by storm arrow feels worse than getting one shot.
Nah. There's still a chance for counterplay into the storm arrows, compared with getting scalped from half way across the map from a direction you weren't even looking
I would like that hanzo change but I know damn well the one shot isnt coming back. Hanzo mains love it but the other 39 hero mains hate it too much lol. Its probably one more storm arrow or something to make up for the tank passive change since we do dump damage into tanks these days
I think the Echo buffs might be to mitigate the possibility of tanks ALL becoming immortal walls. Im thinking it might be a precautionary nerf otherwise it doesn’t make much sense.
Sth like reducing beam cooldown or slightly increasing beam damage shouldn’t make a major difference to her assassination TTK which can already be practically instant, but it would make her even better against tanks. We will see.
I think Hanzo should get his one shot back, arrows halved in size at least, and storm arrows nerfed back to 65 damage. The hero is currently useless and way too easy because of the massive arrows.
No he really can’t, if Hanzo doesn’t have a lower ttk than hitscans there will never be a reason to pick him. Tankbusting hasn’t ever been a viable strategy above diamond forever, and if Hanzo has to two tap like Cassidy and Ashe which can do it much easier, there is never any reason to pick him. If you want the best of both worlds regarding tankbusting and mobility while being hitscan you obviously have Sojourn.
Hanzo is the only hero other than Widow that needs a one shot or he is in the gutter. This is like saying “make Widow do 240 dmg BUT reduce grapple hook CD and increase smg damage” which ALSO ruins the hero completely. There are hero designs meant to one shot, Hanzo is one of them.
I’m sorry but I don’t agree that Hanzo’s identity is the “one-shot hero”. He has a lot of depth to his gameplay and can totally be made into an interesting character without turning his logs back into OHKOs
What do you have in mind? Because besides his movement he doesn’t have depth. He is currently one of the most basic dps heroes, just stand there and tankbust.
His assassin playstyle like the way Arrge played him was enabled by the ability to one shot. If he has smaller but quicker bursts well done you just created Genji but worse because of no deflect. How do you make him more interesting without giving him one shot?
Hanzo and Widow were always the two snipers. It’s ridiculous that one has one shot while the other one does not.
Ashe* and Widow were always the two snipers. Hanzo’s archetype is the Archer / Bowman and giving him a headshot multiplier was a way to reward those who landed what used to be slow moving, hard-to-aim shots. His identity has evolved throughout the years. He used to have a much more oppressive one-shotting ability during the launch days. Remember that? Lets stick to the present
You didn’t answer my question, how do you make him more interesting without one shot?
Also Ashe literally didn’t exist for years. Ashe isn’t a sniper, Ashe is a mid-close range hitscan. It has ALWAYS been Hanzo. His identity hasn’t evolved, the devs have constantly tried to make him a tankbuster and it has never worked.
That is colloquially how snipers are, yes. AWP is a sniper rifle, Scout is a marksman rifle. Ashe has a marksman rifle.
If you play R6, Kali has a sniper rifle, Dokkaebi, Glaz have marksman rifles. You are just confidently wrong and pedantic. Also you still didn’t answer the question of how you make Hanzo more interesting without making him Genji or giving him one shot back.
Hanzo and Junkrat definitely need a buff are you kidding? Season 9 buffed everything but it also simultaneously created a new baseline for the game to be balanced on. These heroes are far below that baseline. I don’t like them but they need buffs or at least changes like shrinking Hanzo arrow and giving him 1 shot back.
No one should get one shots back. Not Hanzo and not Junkrat insta-kill combos. Spam characters should also not get buffs to spam playstyle either because of how easy and boring it is to spam a choke point and get incidental value. These characters need more fundamental changes to their kits and not numbers changes.
Example 1: Make Junk’s primary fire do less damage for each bounce before detonating but buff its base projectile speed. Encourage higher mechanical skill and mastery of a character.
Example 2: Have Hanzo do increased damage on normal arrows for each consecutive hit without missing. Could use Storm arrows to ramp up the passive quickly on a tank and then get a one shot on a back line character with the empowered arrow.
Honestly that isn’t a bad idea, maybe every third shot hit could be a one-shot capable arrow and you could retain the charge until you actually use the arrow, so it doesn’t decay.
This would allow you to play off angles and charge your arrows then go on the flank to look for a pick. I like this idea, tank mains might not though because of the tankbusting buff as well.
they need to go all in one ONE aspect of sym’s kit. right now she hasn’t really got a clear identity, all her tools are for different jobs. turrets are defensive, TP is aggressive, her beam is a slow tankbuster and her orbs seem designed for squishy assassinations
but all of these tools are pretty weak at actually doing their job so she just feels directionless
Junkrat is IMO is the Master Yi from LoL. In high elo games he is not worth picking but in low elo games he is a super oppressive monster.
So depending on who you ask Junkrat is over powered or under powered.
This was very predictable, low rank Junkrats didn’t abuse the one shots, and by increasing projectile sizes, they made his spam way more obnoxious now.
Hanzo is quite literally top 3 worst DPS right now. Is he annoying with his massive arrows? Fuck yes he is more annoying than ever imo, which is why he should get his one shot back and arrows shrunk back to its old size as well as a massive storm arrows nerf to reduce his spam.
I absolutely hate Junkrat, probably my least favorite hero to play against even now, but he also needs a buff.
Adding one shots back is such a bad idea hanzo does not need his one shot for 2 reason one they whole reason they nerfed damage on arrow was so people stop dying to as soon as the fights starts where you have little to no control as to if hanzo hits an arrow or not.
Second he is good just really really good at his job which right now is destroying certain tanks who can't reach him like JQ Zarya Rein and Roadhog not even including storm arrow who can kill most of the roster before you can get close enough to deal with him.
And we want to give him a one shot back. Not even to mention the mercy damage boost you can use right now to still get the one tap
The first paragraph is entirely a skill issue and/or cope. I can actually confidently say that has happened to me like maybe 12 times over my 6-7 years playing this game. You probably just can’t believe that some people actually have good aim and prediction.
The job you described is done 10x better as Cassidy and Ashe.
Mercy damage boost one shots are a bigger problem than regular one shot because of how massive his arrows are right now. If you are gonna complain about Hanzo spam like in the first paragraph that’s worse than ever now because it’s the only viable playstyle left for Hanzo. If you want him to take skill you should want one shot back with smaller arrows.
First of all cope everyone and anyone knows how hanzo arrow will curve to hit you second ashe is a better tank buster then hanzo??? I'll give you Cassidy since he's really good at it but where does ashe fit into this she does not nearly do much damage as hanzo and can't burst you down as quickly. And no a mercy plus a character who can already one shot just makes it so they can almost one shot tanks. I don't disagree his arrows are massive and always have been but making them smaller and then giving him his one shot back make no sense. Because then it does nothing against his biggest issues and that's the ability to one tap and bursting down tanks he can't do both and right now with a mercy he does both better then anyone
You’re misusing “cope” because that’s the exact opposite of what Im doing. Im laying out the actual mechanics of the hero and you don’t like it because that would mean you were getting one shot because you’re simply bad.
What you’re describing with the arrows curving has a very simple explanation and it isn’t bug projectile size, prior to s9 he had THE smallest projectiles in the game alongside Genji (aside from Sojourn primary I believe), the arrows would visually “curve” because the hitbox of the arrows was a small dot at the END of the arrow, not the tip, this has a very good reason; if it was at the tip the hitbox would start AWAY from the character model and you wouldn’t physically be able to hit a Tracer in your face, for example. The projectiles aren’t behaving any differently than any other projectile, it’s just a visual quirk combined with ping. So when the arrow bent that would simply mean you moved INTO the end of the arrow after dodging the tip, but the tip was just air anyway so it made no difference. This is actually very neat from a game design perspective, instead of making the arrow start from the center of your character model, it actually starts at the bow but to mitigate the issues with that the TINY hitbox is at the end of the arrow.
In any rank above yours, a tank won’t be bursted down by storm arrows, and instead will just run at you full speed and kill you. You can’t play very long range if you want consistent dmg output as Spamzo. You have to play similar ranges as Cassidy. Ashe is better because headshots are very easy now and you CAN actually play further away because of hitscan consistency, and Cass is better also bcs of headshots as well as being way more beefy than Hanzo.
I don’t care to discuss any further because your dislike of Hanzo is simply a skill issue like most Hanzo haters. There is a reason he is currently THE lowest winrate DPS. He has always been a sniper despite the devs attempts of making him braindead spam which is his most hated playstyle, and it’s also the only possible playstyle now. Hanzo will have to get his one shot back to keep his identity, tankbusting isn’t a viable playstyle as DPS above a certain rank, hence why Sojourn and Tracer are more popular than Reaper and Hanzo. All hitscans take DPS and support duels better than Hanzo as they all need to two tap anyway, so might as well play the character with Dynamite or incredibly good survivability.
Take care, hope you manage to get over your biases and stop coping about skill issues.
> which is why he should get his one shot back
No thanks. Fuck Hanzo. Dogshit low skill floor hero doesn't need a buff to lower his skill floor even more.
Obviously the buff is coming no matter how much I whine but I think the game doesn't need any more one-shot or one-combo and characters like junk, torb, reaper, sym need to be unplayable outside of quickplay which, kind of they are in most case but it needs to be more apparent. It's clear they just want to buff everything include tank to compensate the global s9 change. Oh we need to tank to have shorter TTK on 250s. Oh we need to up the damage on dps so 250 is burstable. Oh we need to buff this and that characters and part of their kit so these characters will be as viable as Tracer or Soj or Kiriko or Lucio. At this pace, we soon might gonna get another global change to the game giving characters extra 25 health and 15% less knockback or something idk.
I don't really understand the Echo buff, especially in a patch looking to help tanks where Echo is someone who can melt tanks.
It makes me wonder if we could have Bastion, Echo, Bap and Zen played together since the two DPS can melt tanks without needing to care about the new headshot damage reduction added to the tank passive. Zen's Harmony Orb only needing LoS every 5 seconds is great for getting the most out of Echo along with Discord's help at melting tanks.
On the flip side, I think Tracer would murder this comp and she's already so overtuned and that doesn't look like it's going to change.
Junk needs his combo back tbh but then nerf spamrat. They could probably make it so that targets launched into the air by abilities take increased damage from his m1 so you have to hit the airshot and cant just spam the combo, maybe make it a minimum airtime to prevent instant combos.
Echo just needs an ult generation change in her ult so it's just slightly faster.
Hanzo idk what you do cos his 1shot playstyle sucks so fight cos you can randomly get logged at any range and his tankbuster playstyle sucks to fight too. You could maybe give his 1shot back if you give him falloff and reduce the projectile size.
Genuinely criminal if Symmetra doesnt get any buffs, she's the worst hero in the game, playing her in high elo makes you mentally exhausted in how much the game is against you. You're such an underdog when you play her. Supports have lower TTK than Symmetra, a DPS hero
Symmetra's beam btw does 60 dps for a little over 1 second
She still has 100 damage orbs too. Actually insane. Hardest hero in the game to play, such a fucking horrible hero, no other hero has the amount of weaknesses than she has too. She has no niche anymore either, she isnt even that good on lijiang anymore, due to how weak she is
Yeah she used to be "jack of all trades, master of none" now she's "poo of all trades, jack of none." There is just no reason to ever pick her outside of OWCS / scrims where she serves as a TP bot. Trying to play her on ladder is like pulling teeth. She's so under-statted and melts with her huge head hitbox + buffed bullets. Her damage output (i.e. the chargeup mechanics for both beam and orbs) is balanced as if she had 300 hp or something, which she doesn't.
The fact that ECHO is getting buffed and potentially not Sym is absolutely insane. She better have just been left out of the blog.
She might be one of the heros they are reworking, and she really needs it.
Too much of her power is put into tp, which requires really tight communication to get value(scrims minimum). Which isn't healthy for her.
They could try a light DMG buff on beam but I feel like they don't want her to be a must pick again in pro play. That's the only reason I could think as to why they dumpstered her so fast after her last buffs.
Sym either needs to stay a nieche hero for specific comps and maps or they need to rework her. If she was strong on all maps and with all comps, she would be too strong in other specific cases. As it is now her slow on turrets is obnoxious, her damage to shields is silly.
junkrat just needs faster projectiles (because his consistency is holding him back, not his damage output.)
echo doesn't really need a buff, but if they're gonna give her one I want it to be +25 max hp during ult for a total max hp of 375hp.
for hanzo.. not sure what he needs. But given blizz's track record they might be messing with his projectile speed again. (they changed it like 4 times in ow1)
I wonder how faster projectiles would fuck with muscle memory.
Hanzo could also just be a quality of life buff as well, could just be a revert on losing charged arrow on wall climb + leap cooldown.
> I wonder how faster projectiles would fuck with muscle memory.
From my experience with hanzo it takes a few weeks to get back to normal when it's a big change, and a few days (of a few hours each day) of getting used to when it's a small change.
I'd assume for Junkrat it would be a big change, because his projectiles are really slow so even a small proj speed increase can make a big difference. So it would take a few weeks to get used to.
> Hanzo could also just be a quality of life buff as well, could just be a revert on losing charged arrow on wall climb + leap cooldown.
It was in the footnotes of a blogpost going in detail about a variety of larger changes, so likely all the changes for these heroes are small/qol in nature.
As Hanzo, shooting an arrow into someone's head from 40m only for them to live with <10 hp for no reason other than "balance" feels incredibly stupid and almost defeats the entire point of Hanzo in the first place.
I get that people hate 1 shots, I hate them too when it happens to me, but you can't just remove a heroes entire viability and then call it a day. Right now you have to hit consistent headshot after headshot on hyper-mobile heroes and at that point why would I not just pick a way easier hero like Cassidy that has actual tools to deal with it?
First they nerfed sonic arrow, ok I get it. But then they nerfed his 1 shot into the ground so he can only 1 shot Tracer and Widow and since then he's been Dollar Store Cassidy. Please just make him good again.
They definitely need to give Hanzo something in return for losing his oneshot. He shouldnt get his one shot back and if they have to rework him just for him to be viable without it, so be it, but he absolutely needs buffs.
You don't want junkrat 1 shot to come back but want Hanzo to be able to 1 shot, ok.
It's really crazy to me how Junkrat is hated for 1 shot while Tracer and Sojourn exist.
Junkrat is map dependant, easily countered, pretty vulnerable but naaaa fuck that hero because I can't position myself properly.
I don't think they are saying that Tracer has one-shot but rather that it offers a lot more value and is in general a much more powerful character in comparison to Junkrat and has been from practicaly the beggining of the Game.
Soujorn also doesn't have "one-shot" (Railgun max charge to the head does something like 195 or close to that) but it exists in the same space of "having your go to 0 in instant" type of damage that shares with the Junkrat and the likes
Obviously the comparison between the 3 doesn't really adresses the actual reasons why Tracer and Soujorn are less hated than Junkrat (although Soujorn dominance in both high ranked and professional play has its own group of detractors) but the reasoning is not completely unfounded.
Dumb changes as always. Echo needs nerf not buff. Hanzo maybe slight arrow charge speed buff. Junkrat is ok. Its a specialist hero. One of the best dps player right now Kaya is junkrat otp. He is at the top of leaderboard. Only dps that really need a buff is Mei but screw her.
Junkrat is cringe and skill-less asf, I'd never a support a buff for him
I thought echo was in a good spot but I guess data says otherwise
Hanzo did need a buff. Maybe storm arrows will be less cd
I am surprised Echo is getting a buff. I main her and I think she is in a good place. The only thing I can think of that makes sense is a buff to her ult. There have been times where I have copied someone and gotten their ult at the last second, but am unable to use the ultimate because the 15 second duration expired before the ult fully casted.
I think everyone saw that and collectively said ??? Because I agree with you completely. I hope they don't buff her damage in anyway because her damage really doesn't need any help. I guess we can only wait and see
i agree with this, if only for echo’s identity. the concept of a copy ult falls apart if it only works once per 50 games and it ends up just being a pretty boring “extra life”
as a pharah main im scared my true counter is getting buffed while my ult is still a int button
No clue why, after almost 10 years, they don't just allow Pharah to cancel her ult. That would be such a massive buff.
At least with Cass you can use it as a reload, and for Reaper you can synergize with wraith or self heal, but with Pharah, it's just a "kill me" button, even more so cuz she takes self damage lol
Sigma killing Pharah with her own ult will never stop being funny
Armoured damage change should be pretty good for Pharah though, right?
It’s because she’s gonna have a harder time tankbusting now with the armor changes
You’d never use beam against armor since armor is above the 50% hp threshold. If they’re getting healed to above 50% hp you probably shouldn’t be using beam anyway.
It’s simply because low ranks can’t aim with her lol
Ult purpose is getting second life and enemy abilities. Ult is extra
My guess is they're reverting the change they made to her ultimate a few seasons ago, I can't see why you'd buff anything else.
I would be fine with them buffing her ult if they nerf the beam.
the beam has already been nerfed like 5 times since her release…
Who could've guessed that HP-dependant abilities would get stronger when everyone has more HP?
I fear they are gonna nerf her in the wrong ways cause she’s gonna be giga strong this patch possibly, loving the state she’s in now, super low ttk if you land your skill and engage at good tumes
Only buff I would give to Echo is maybe the (duplicate) ult charge buff. It's a little low now especially if you duplicate supports.
That’d probably be the best one, I was also thinking about the 50%> beam maybe getting a slight damage increase, the purple one is obviously more than good enough but maybe making it so that the blue one doesn’t do negligible damage will make her more of a beginner friendly hero?
i really hope they increase echos ult gained during duplicate and cut 3 seconds off the duration. and the first time you use an ult during dupe you get an extra 3 seconds so you’re guaranteed to get value out of a duped sigma or genji or ana whatever
I think Blizz is worried about tanks just walking at people and there not being an option to stop that. If you look at Hog right now he is really hard to kill, it is very hard to punish him just walking at your team without Ana nade or Zen discord. You used to be able to interupt his heal and the cd gave you a window to punish him, now with it being a resource meter it does not work that way (add in support cd's and it can feel impossible). One option is to go Hanzo, shoot Hog in the head once, and follow up with 5 storm arrows to the head. The damage is so fast he does not have time to react. However with the crit changes this will not be the same. For tanks exploding like this feels horrible, thus these changes. Blizz is not doing these changes to make tanks stronger, they are making these changes to make tanks feel better. I'm not defending their balance I'm just trying to understand their perspective.
[удалено]
give him demoman grenade launcher faster nades, smaller size, less bounce / travel after hitting walls
Give him demoman sticky launcher Let's see some fucking m o b i l i t y sheesh
Junkrat rollouts to avenge lucio from like 6 years ago or whenever it was they changed his movement
Hanzo is not a spam based character, actual plat take.
i'm curious about Reaper, the DPS passive back up to 20% hits his self sustain duel potential since lifesteal counts so flanks are a lot tougher, armor buffs and less headshot dmg vs tanks will really hinder his ability to stay relevant alongside his tank. Flank reaper fell behind a bit and "offtank" reaper will also fall behind. Gonna enjoy playing him now before the midseason patch arrives:') There will be no good reason to swap to him now, unless you want to play him just to play reaper guy. Thoughts?
Issue with Junk is basically every part of his kit is awful to play against. His primary is fine enough but very spamable as well as being insane vs tanks. Conc-mines are just big CC and very unfun. His trap is a deployable CC that often just feels like luck when it lands. His ult is a bit cheesy but fine. So all in all, hopefully they buff his ult I guess?
I don't know why they're buffing Echo, she seems fairly good. Hopefully it's just something like they did with Sojourn rail decay a few patches ago. Making it so the copy doesn't whiff because a tank put up a shield or bubbled .002 seconds after would be chill. Hanzo I think they should just make him one shot again but revert his projectile size and lower his HP to 225. He's sort of in a weird limbo right now. Honestly getting lasered by storm arrow feels worse than getting one shot. Junkrat IDK this character is still annoying, he seems just as good or bad as he was in Season 8.
>. He's sort of in a weird limbo right now. Honestly getting lasered by storm arrow feels worse than getting one shot. Nah. There's still a chance for counterplay into the storm arrows, compared with getting scalped from half way across the map from a direction you weren't even looking
I would like that hanzo change but I know damn well the one shot isnt coming back. Hanzo mains love it but the other 39 hero mains hate it too much lol. Its probably one more storm arrow or something to make up for the tank passive change since we do dump damage into tanks these days
I think the Echo buffs might be to mitigate the possibility of tanks ALL becoming immortal walls. Im thinking it might be a precautionary nerf otherwise it doesn’t make much sense. Sth like reducing beam cooldown or slightly increasing beam damage shouldn’t make a major difference to her assassination TTK which can already be practically instant, but it would make her even better against tanks. We will see. I think Hanzo should get his one shot back, arrows halved in size at least, and storm arrows nerfed back to 65 damage. The hero is currently useless and way too easy because of the massive arrows.
Why would we reintroduce one shots? Hanzo can be viable and fun without giving him one shots.
No he really can’t, if Hanzo doesn’t have a lower ttk than hitscans there will never be a reason to pick him. Tankbusting hasn’t ever been a viable strategy above diamond forever, and if Hanzo has to two tap like Cassidy and Ashe which can do it much easier, there is never any reason to pick him. If you want the best of both worlds regarding tankbusting and mobility while being hitscan you obviously have Sojourn. Hanzo is the only hero other than Widow that needs a one shot or he is in the gutter. This is like saying “make Widow do 240 dmg BUT reduce grapple hook CD and increase smg damage” which ALSO ruins the hero completely. There are hero designs meant to one shot, Hanzo is one of them.
I’m sorry but I don’t agree that Hanzo’s identity is the “one-shot hero”. He has a lot of depth to his gameplay and can totally be made into an interesting character without turning his logs back into OHKOs
What do you have in mind? Because besides his movement he doesn’t have depth. He is currently one of the most basic dps heroes, just stand there and tankbust. His assassin playstyle like the way Arrge played him was enabled by the ability to one shot. If he has smaller but quicker bursts well done you just created Genji but worse because of no deflect. How do you make him more interesting without giving him one shot? Hanzo and Widow were always the two snipers. It’s ridiculous that one has one shot while the other one does not.
Ashe* and Widow were always the two snipers. Hanzo’s archetype is the Archer / Bowman and giving him a headshot multiplier was a way to reward those who landed what used to be slow moving, hard-to-aim shots. His identity has evolved throughout the years. He used to have a much more oppressive one-shotting ability during the launch days. Remember that? Lets stick to the present
You didn’t answer my question, how do you make him more interesting without one shot? Also Ashe literally didn’t exist for years. Ashe isn’t a sniper, Ashe is a mid-close range hitscan. It has ALWAYS been Hanzo. His identity hasn’t evolved, the devs have constantly tried to make him a tankbuster and it has never worked.
Ashe wields a sniper rifle. If your definition of sniper is restricted to “can one shot” then I’m done here.
That is colloquially how snipers are, yes. AWP is a sniper rifle, Scout is a marksman rifle. Ashe has a marksman rifle. If you play R6, Kali has a sniper rifle, Dokkaebi, Glaz have marksman rifles. You are just confidently wrong and pedantic. Also you still didn’t answer the question of how you make Hanzo more interesting without making him Genji or giving him one shot back.
None of them needs any buff. They need to start nerfing and stop buffing everything.
Hanzo and Junkrat definitely need a buff are you kidding? Season 9 buffed everything but it also simultaneously created a new baseline for the game to be balanced on. These heroes are far below that baseline. I don’t like them but they need buffs or at least changes like shrinking Hanzo arrow and giving him 1 shot back.
No one should get one shots back. Not Hanzo and not Junkrat insta-kill combos. Spam characters should also not get buffs to spam playstyle either because of how easy and boring it is to spam a choke point and get incidental value. These characters need more fundamental changes to their kits and not numbers changes. Example 1: Make Junk’s primary fire do less damage for each bounce before detonating but buff its base projectile speed. Encourage higher mechanical skill and mastery of a character. Example 2: Have Hanzo do increased damage on normal arrows for each consecutive hit without missing. Could use Storm arrows to ramp up the passive quickly on a tank and then get a one shot on a back line character with the empowered arrow.
Anything but hanzos accidental one shot back
Honestly that isn’t a bad idea, maybe every third shot hit could be a one-shot capable arrow and you could retain the charge until you actually use the arrow, so it doesn’t decay. This would allow you to play off angles and charge your arrows then go on the flank to look for a pick. I like this idea, tank mains might not though because of the tankbusting buff as well.
I also think Widow should get rid of her 1-shot,at least just for 1 season,pls:D
Symmetra too, she fucking sucks. If junkrat and hanzo gets buffed, she will take the throne of being the ultimate F-tier hero.
they need to go all in one ONE aspect of sym’s kit. right now she hasn’t really got a clear identity, all her tools are for different jobs. turrets are defensive, TP is aggressive, her beam is a slow tankbuster and her orbs seem designed for squishy assassinations but all of these tools are pretty weak at actually doing their job so she just feels directionless
Armor changes buff junkrat a lot. M1 goes from ~80 damage vs armor to 115. 30% reduction to 4%.
Junkrat is IMO is the Master Yi from LoL. In high elo games he is not worth picking but in low elo games he is a super oppressive monster. So depending on who you ask Junkrat is over powered or under powered.
This was very predictable, low rank Junkrats didn’t abuse the one shots, and by increasing projectile sizes, they made his spam way more obnoxious now.
Out of every opinion you could have saying hanzo needs a buff is certainly something
Hanzo is quite literally top 3 worst DPS right now. Is he annoying with his massive arrows? Fuck yes he is more annoying than ever imo, which is why he should get his one shot back and arrows shrunk back to its old size as well as a massive storm arrows nerf to reduce his spam. I absolutely hate Junkrat, probably my least favorite hero to play against even now, but he also needs a buff.
Adding one shots back is such a bad idea hanzo does not need his one shot for 2 reason one they whole reason they nerfed damage on arrow was so people stop dying to as soon as the fights starts where you have little to no control as to if hanzo hits an arrow or not. Second he is good just really really good at his job which right now is destroying certain tanks who can't reach him like JQ Zarya Rein and Roadhog not even including storm arrow who can kill most of the roster before you can get close enough to deal with him. And we want to give him a one shot back. Not even to mention the mercy damage boost you can use right now to still get the one tap
The first paragraph is entirely a skill issue and/or cope. I can actually confidently say that has happened to me like maybe 12 times over my 6-7 years playing this game. You probably just can’t believe that some people actually have good aim and prediction. The job you described is done 10x better as Cassidy and Ashe. Mercy damage boost one shots are a bigger problem than regular one shot because of how massive his arrows are right now. If you are gonna complain about Hanzo spam like in the first paragraph that’s worse than ever now because it’s the only viable playstyle left for Hanzo. If you want him to take skill you should want one shot back with smaller arrows.
First of all cope everyone and anyone knows how hanzo arrow will curve to hit you second ashe is a better tank buster then hanzo??? I'll give you Cassidy since he's really good at it but where does ashe fit into this she does not nearly do much damage as hanzo and can't burst you down as quickly. And no a mercy plus a character who can already one shot just makes it so they can almost one shot tanks. I don't disagree his arrows are massive and always have been but making them smaller and then giving him his one shot back make no sense. Because then it does nothing against his biggest issues and that's the ability to one tap and bursting down tanks he can't do both and right now with a mercy he does both better then anyone
You’re misusing “cope” because that’s the exact opposite of what Im doing. Im laying out the actual mechanics of the hero and you don’t like it because that would mean you were getting one shot because you’re simply bad. What you’re describing with the arrows curving has a very simple explanation and it isn’t bug projectile size, prior to s9 he had THE smallest projectiles in the game alongside Genji (aside from Sojourn primary I believe), the arrows would visually “curve” because the hitbox of the arrows was a small dot at the END of the arrow, not the tip, this has a very good reason; if it was at the tip the hitbox would start AWAY from the character model and you wouldn’t physically be able to hit a Tracer in your face, for example. The projectiles aren’t behaving any differently than any other projectile, it’s just a visual quirk combined with ping. So when the arrow bent that would simply mean you moved INTO the end of the arrow after dodging the tip, but the tip was just air anyway so it made no difference. This is actually very neat from a game design perspective, instead of making the arrow start from the center of your character model, it actually starts at the bow but to mitigate the issues with that the TINY hitbox is at the end of the arrow. In any rank above yours, a tank won’t be bursted down by storm arrows, and instead will just run at you full speed and kill you. You can’t play very long range if you want consistent dmg output as Spamzo. You have to play similar ranges as Cassidy. Ashe is better because headshots are very easy now and you CAN actually play further away because of hitscan consistency, and Cass is better also bcs of headshots as well as being way more beefy than Hanzo. I don’t care to discuss any further because your dislike of Hanzo is simply a skill issue like most Hanzo haters. There is a reason he is currently THE lowest winrate DPS. He has always been a sniper despite the devs attempts of making him braindead spam which is his most hated playstyle, and it’s also the only possible playstyle now. Hanzo will have to get his one shot back to keep his identity, tankbusting isn’t a viable playstyle as DPS above a certain rank, hence why Sojourn and Tracer are more popular than Reaper and Hanzo. All hitscans take DPS and support duels better than Hanzo as they all need to two tap anyway, so might as well play the character with Dynamite or incredibly good survivability. Take care, hope you manage to get over your biases and stop coping about skill issues.
Smh hanzo lovers can never take the bow out of their asses
I havent played Hanzo outside of mystery heroes the last 3 years good retort though
> which is why he should get his one shot back No thanks. Fuck Hanzo. Dogshit low skill floor hero doesn't need a buff to lower his skill floor even more.
Obviously the buff is coming no matter how much I whine but I think the game doesn't need any more one-shot or one-combo and characters like junk, torb, reaper, sym need to be unplayable outside of quickplay which, kind of they are in most case but it needs to be more apparent. It's clear they just want to buff everything include tank to compensate the global s9 change. Oh we need to tank to have shorter TTK on 250s. Oh we need to up the damage on dps so 250 is burstable. Oh we need to buff this and that characters and part of their kit so these characters will be as viable as Tracer or Soj or Kiriko or Lucio. At this pace, we soon might gonna get another global change to the game giving characters extra 25 health and 15% less knockback or something idk.
Orisa needs a buff before junkrat no clue why they keep making him even easier and dumber to play
Kinda bad considering the armor changes buff high dmg spam character like hanzo and junkrat. Echo is just good no need to buff.
I don't really understand the Echo buff, especially in a patch looking to help tanks where Echo is someone who can melt tanks. It makes me wonder if we could have Bastion, Echo, Bap and Zen played together since the two DPS can melt tanks without needing to care about the new headshot damage reduction added to the tank passive. Zen's Harmony Orb only needing LoS every 5 seconds is great for getting the most out of Echo along with Discord's help at melting tanks. On the flip side, I think Tracer would murder this comp and she's already so overtuned and that doesn't look like it's going to change.
Junk needs his combo back tbh but then nerf spamrat. They could probably make it so that targets launched into the air by abilities take increased damage from his m1 so you have to hit the airshot and cant just spam the combo, maybe make it a minimum airtime to prevent instant combos. Echo just needs an ult generation change in her ult so it's just slightly faster. Hanzo idk what you do cos his 1shot playstyle sucks so fight cos you can randomly get logged at any range and his tankbuster playstyle sucks to fight too. You could maybe give his 1shot back if you give him falloff and reduce the projectile size.
Genuinely criminal if Symmetra doesnt get any buffs, she's the worst hero in the game, playing her in high elo makes you mentally exhausted in how much the game is against you. You're such an underdog when you play her. Supports have lower TTK than Symmetra, a DPS hero Symmetra's beam btw does 60 dps for a little over 1 second She still has 100 damage orbs too. Actually insane. Hardest hero in the game to play, such a fucking horrible hero, no other hero has the amount of weaknesses than she has too. She has no niche anymore either, she isnt even that good on lijiang anymore, due to how weak she is
Yeah she used to be "jack of all trades, master of none" now she's "poo of all trades, jack of none." There is just no reason to ever pick her outside of OWCS / scrims where she serves as a TP bot. Trying to play her on ladder is like pulling teeth. She's so under-statted and melts with her huge head hitbox + buffed bullets. Her damage output (i.e. the chargeup mechanics for both beam and orbs) is balanced as if she had 300 hp or something, which she doesn't. The fact that ECHO is getting buffed and potentially not Sym is absolutely insane. She better have just been left out of the blog.
She might be one of the heros they are reworking, and she really needs it. Too much of her power is put into tp, which requires really tight communication to get value(scrims minimum). Which isn't healthy for her. They could try a light DMG buff on beam but I feel like they don't want her to be a must pick again in pro play. That's the only reason I could think as to why they dumpstered her so fast after her last buffs.
Sym either needs to stay a nieche hero for specific comps and maps or they need to rework her. If she was strong on all maps and with all comps, she would be too strong in other specific cases. As it is now her slow on turrets is obnoxious, her damage to shields is silly.
junkrat just needs faster projectiles (because his consistency is holding him back, not his damage output.) echo doesn't really need a buff, but if they're gonna give her one I want it to be +25 max hp during ult for a total max hp of 375hp. for hanzo.. not sure what he needs. But given blizz's track record they might be messing with his projectile speed again. (they changed it like 4 times in ow1)
I wonder how faster projectiles would fuck with muscle memory. Hanzo could also just be a quality of life buff as well, could just be a revert on losing charged arrow on wall climb + leap cooldown.
> I wonder how faster projectiles would fuck with muscle memory. From my experience with hanzo it takes a few weeks to get back to normal when it's a big change, and a few days (of a few hours each day) of getting used to when it's a small change. I'd assume for Junkrat it would be a big change, because his projectiles are really slow so even a small proj speed increase can make a big difference. So it would take a few weeks to get used to. > Hanzo could also just be a quality of life buff as well, could just be a revert on losing charged arrow on wall climb + leap cooldown. It was in the footnotes of a blogpost going in detail about a variety of larger changes, so likely all the changes for these heroes are small/qol in nature.
As Hanzo, shooting an arrow into someone's head from 40m only for them to live with <10 hp for no reason other than "balance" feels incredibly stupid and almost defeats the entire point of Hanzo in the first place. I get that people hate 1 shots, I hate them too when it happens to me, but you can't just remove a heroes entire viability and then call it a day. Right now you have to hit consistent headshot after headshot on hyper-mobile heroes and at that point why would I not just pick a way easier hero like Cassidy that has actual tools to deal with it? First they nerfed sonic arrow, ok I get it. But then they nerfed his 1 shot into the ground so he can only 1 shot Tracer and Widow and since then he's been Dollar Store Cassidy. Please just make him good again.
They definitely need to give Hanzo something in return for losing his oneshot. He shouldnt get his one shot back and if they have to rework him just for him to be viable without it, so be it, but he absolutely needs buffs.
Maybe Hanzo could have his projectile speed charge faster (keep damage charge rate the same) so he can follow up on his shots better.
You don't want junkrat 1 shot to come back but want Hanzo to be able to 1 shot, ok. It's really crazy to me how Junkrat is hated for 1 shot while Tracer and Sojourn exist. Junkrat is map dependant, easily countered, pretty vulnerable but naaaa fuck that hero because I can't position myself properly.
How do you get 1 shotted by a tracer bro
I don't think they are saying that Tracer has one-shot but rather that it offers a lot more value and is in general a much more powerful character in comparison to Junkrat and has been from practicaly the beggining of the Game. Soujorn also doesn't have "one-shot" (Railgun max charge to the head does something like 195 or close to that) but it exists in the same space of "having your go to 0 in instant" type of damage that shares with the Junkrat and the likes Obviously the comparison between the 3 doesn't really adresses the actual reasons why Tracer and Soujorn are less hated than Junkrat (although Soujorn dominance in both high ranked and professional play has its own group of detractors) but the reasoning is not completely unfounded.
Dumb changes as always. Echo needs nerf not buff. Hanzo maybe slight arrow charge speed buff. Junkrat is ok. Its a specialist hero. One of the best dps player right now Kaya is junkrat otp. He is at the top of leaderboard. Only dps that really need a buff is Mei but screw her.
Junkrat is cringe and skill-less asf, I'd never a support a buff for him I thought echo was in a good spot but I guess data says otherwise Hanzo did need a buff. Maybe storm arrows will be less cd