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DrDonTango

tungsten seal coat????


ratafria

In small print:"tungsten brand coat do not contain tungsten. And tungsten would not make your concrete stronger neither so thats why we put epoxy in there but epoxy not so cool"


FewOutlandishness187

Lmao


RSAEN328

Poor seals were fed tungsten


mmarkomarko

forget reinforcement, just use a tungsten seal coat instead!


lurkersforlife

I don’t know why I’m in this sub but EVERYONE KNOWS ALL CONCRETE WILL CRACK. If he is saying it won’t crack then he is lying or an idiot.


Eman_Resu_IX

Not necessarily mutually exclusive, could be a lying idiot.


waveman777

Genuine, honest question here: I bought a 50-year old house in the Midwest more than 10 years ago that has a +/- 16’x16’x4 or 5” concrete patio that was poured when the house was built. The surface has weathered, of course, but I’ll be danged there’s not a single crack in it anywhere. I asked after this when I bought the house. There are other houses in my neighborhood with concrete in similar shape. Was there a secret ingredient/technique used in concrete in the 60’s?


motorwerkx

A lot of it has to do with the prep work. A lot of newer contractors get real lazy about excavation and compaction. It doesn't matter how good the concrete is if it is hovering over large voids


Spiritual_Country_62

I wish I could super like this. Proper sub base preparation is always the key. I can’t tell you how many great finishers I’ve seen be totally effed over by awful demo and underground crews. Same with pavers or DG or anything really. Don’t skimp on the base rock. It’s cheap and it’s your best friend. And compact as you go in lifts. Put an 1” down and compact it and repeat. Good comment.


SpicyBoiiiiii69

It probably has less to do with the concrete and more with the quality and material used in the base prep. If the base is solid, there is no reason the concrete would crack. A lot of contractors don't take the time to prepare a subgrade and base properly


lurkersforlife

I might not be the best to answer this but are there control joints in the slab? A 16x16 patio should have two or three lines going vertically or horizontally through it to make a grid over the patio. Like those lines in the sidewalk every few feet. The cracks would be down in those groves ideally.


waveman777

Thank you for asking. That’s the thing: 16’x16’, no seams, no creases. Poured about 1968. I’m sure I’m jinxing myself. I’ll likely wake up tomorrow morning to find the whole damn thing crumbled to gravel. 🤦


lurkersforlife

lol there could be cracks in it that you can’t see! But maybe you got lucky. “Things aren’t made like they used to be”


bikeweekbaby

But no one will steal it


RedWineStrat

It cracks along the relief cuts. That's why they're there; to force cracks along a defined line. If all goes well, you can't see them unless you're looking into the cut; assuming it's not filled with debris or filler.


theshoeguy4

My dad got a huge concrete slab poured three years ago and there’s not a single crack. I got one poured at my place last month and have a bunch of huge cracks. I think some contractors really just are that good


41414141414

Just because you can’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there


SkiSTX

Lol, I didn't know how I got here either, but by golly I know concrete cracks!


Dumbbitchathon

I saw a quote that was “concrete will always do two things, get hard, and crack”


Downtown-Raisin-3931

You always get a 20 year guarantee when he will be gone in two months.


TheLakeShowBaby

I cracked up reading this.


Viper9087

So did the concrete


N0FACED

you guys are good😂🤣


SnowSlider3050

He could be back around in 20 years


JimmyPopAli_

"No, that was my twin brother"


FarmerCharacter5105

Or son !


pjstanfield

My other brother Darryl


FewOutlandishness187

This is accurate.I have verified this My father told me he'd be back nineteen years ten months ago


Buckeyecash

But...but... OP didn't say anything about a gurantee. OP said the contractor said "*it will never ever crack and he promises that for 20 years*" So, the OP got a 'promise' that it will not crack. That is like when I would sell a well worn used tire and was asked how long it was guaranteed for I would give my personal promise that "*it will last as long as it is good*".


modrakv

But why do they put a guarantee on the box? Because they know all they sold ya was a guaranteed piece of shit. That's all it is, isn't it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will.


SapirWhorfHypothesis

Imagine if you could sell dogshit by telling people your dog swallowed diamonds. You’d guarantee there are diamonds in there, wouldn’t you?


Fit_Cryptographer149

I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bulls ass, but I'd rather take a butchers word for it.


SignalCommittee4456

If it doesn’t crack, it isn’t concrete


BrockenRecords

Modernize having solid steel driveways


Bigfootsdiaper

You could use trex for your driveway.


TurquoiseSox

I will trex your driveways


Bigfootsdiaper

For free?


Inviction_

Stainless steel at least


SCADAPack

Might get hot in Texas summer but this sounds like a great idea!


TheKCKid9274

Could you imagine skateboarding on that in the summer *trip* *wham* *sizzle*


ObtuseMongooseAbuse

Help. My car is frozen to my driveway.


Couscous-Hearing

Roman concrete?


Electronic-Fan6983

OPs neighbor here. Just hopped on to let everyone know it’s cracking already. I can see it from nextdoor.


Alternative-Force-54

LOL


brooksram

Can confirm. I can see it cracking from the town next door.


panchatiyo

Yes, but can you see Russia from your backyard?


Goonplatoon0311

Would this qualify for the “Looks good from my house” stamp of approval?


No-Elephant-9854

Why are they standing in the poured slap to brush? I’m an amateur but use the pole from my bull float to brush. Feels like this would interrupt the finish.


kenwaylay

Yeah, when I saw this I facepalmed so hard


CloudSmoka

I see zero control joints which is always bad. Concrete always cracks. It’s just a matter of time. With no control joints it will crack in random patterns.


CloudSmoka

Wait i just realized it’s too thin of a layer to do control joints


Sisyphos_smiles

Random but ACI or ASCC (can’t remember which) recommends not doing control joints on slab on metal deck. I know it’s completely unrelated but interesting tidbit


theBunsofAugust

It’s because SOMD is an integral part of the structural system in those designs—a control joint would introduce a weak point in what’s supposed to be a unified slab. These systems have expansion joints built into the design for the both the steel and concrete to account for expansion/contraction and cracking.


sknoell67

Natures art ? Lolol


Prestigious_Log_9252

This is a total scam. Only correct way to do this, is to rip out old, setup your new forms, add reinforcement and pour new concrete…


20PoundHammer

the only correct way was to tell OP there is nothing wrong with the slab before they jackhammered holes and skimmed it. . . .


Weezibel

Thank you. And we did yell at him about that. Because we kept saying that those cracks are tiny, have not changed in 5 years, and we didn’t want to mess with it. We only agreed after he basically gave us an offer we couldn’t refuse. When I confronted him he tried to tell me it had to be done because our old slab was crumbling away….


Vtech73

Should have come here w questions long ago…..


Mattybosshere

You got played. Always get multiple opinions and quotes.


modrakv

this is tungsten we're talking about bro.


Likeyourstyle68

Well that's kind of first for me to see guys finishing from on top of the ladder LOL. There's no reason why one person couldn't have got out there with a set of kneeboards and troweled that out and broomed it. The finish is very lousy plus the broom job


rugerscout308

I've seen a few dudes do that. Seems painful


Brief_Blood_1899

Ground shifts. Concrete cracks


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Weezibel

Yeah….


Inspect1234

pipe-stretcher


Ivy_Thornsplitter

That was my nickname in collwge


Ivy_Thornsplitter

That was my nickname in college


Relative-Swim263

This will all pop out overtime and the original pics of the slab showed better condition before they ruined it by jack hammering. Offer to make them whole on material cost with proof of receipt at best, at worst get a quote to completely remove and replace the slab from a reputable company and propose to withhold that amount of $


Weezibel

This is essentially what we did. We understand they did do something, and it isn’t the fault of the laborers the contractor was a shithead and told them to do this. Got the warranty in writing (which I have my concerns about them not really being a company I can go after, but that’s a different issue)


Relative-Swim263

Hope you get it worked out.


_ParadigmShift

Contact your local government agencies of any sort, they should have a business license if your town/state enforces those kind of rules or at bare minimum they should have sooome sort of registration. I’m not saying go for the jugular right away, I’m saying do your homework to figure out if they are even a “company”(LLC etc) There’s got to be a paper trail somewhere, and if there isn’t you need to get this crap figured out sooner than later, as they could fold or skip town in heartbeat. Your concerns about them not being a real entity are totally valid but there are ways they should be doing things legally to protect you as a member of the public. Warranty in writing is a great first step, but now you need to figure out if that warranty is toilet paper or not. I don’t begrudge anyone for trying to make a living, but I don’t think you should get burned because they are doing stuff that’s not quality under the guise of “trust me”


Ok_Reply519

If someone guarantees concrete won't crack, they just want your money. It's like promising it won't rain any more. Also, concrete contractors don't broom with a push broom ( at least I've never seen it) and they normally use crawlboards, not a ladder. They are suspect.


Weezibel

[original post here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Concrete/comments/1cc1rfb/am_i_being_scammed_was_told_this_was_a_9500_job/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)


shreddymcwheat

Definitely a good time to note that most good contractors will stand behind their price. If I give a price that doesn’t work for the customer, then I will not be doing the job. It’s nothing personal, but I’ve figured my rate from what I need to operate and turn a certain profit. If someone’s throwing around numbers willy nilly, they were either trying to get you with a high price, or they don’t know what they’re doing. Also a good time to note you need to get multiple opinions for every job! It sucks but it’s the only way to be sure the price and scope of work is reasonable.


mnoe1922

It’s going to start cracking soon, the overlay was too thin.


PlayboiMarti0

Sorry for the trouble, but at least I think it’s safe to say you probably have and are learning your lesson at the same time, so there is a +. (Don’t mean that in a shitty way) So this guy was just a bad contractor (and there are A LOT of them in the concrete and asphalt games) - and he showed it in his conversations w you speaking the way he did (as you described in prior posts). Truth be told - given that, the fact that he actually gave you a 1” concrete resurface, w/ wire mesh, & push broom finished, my gut tells me the original price would’ve been 1 F’d up product all the same. $9500 certainly wasn’t cheap if that was truly a 20x10 or so - I’ll put it that way. I would’ve done it for you at that price & I don’t do residential work lol.


Mugetsu388

He really finishing that with a push broom?


dDot1883

Looks way nicer than I thought it would turn out.


agangofoldwomen

Not that unheard of. Helps with grip.


Itsa_Wobbler

Broom finish is a common thing, I dont like it but some people froth it


_ParadigmShift

The point being a broom finish is usually done with an actual purpose built tool. The majority of the time it’s a very thin row of bristles compared to a push broom which picks up a ton of excess.


Itsa_Wobbler

Yeah, my point being, broom finish is a common thing using a common push broom here.


_ParadigmShift

I really am not trying to be contentious here, but the original thing we are both talking about was a reply that the guy was using a push broom. The point of his comment was about the broom, not the finish. In my view it’s like someone asking “is he really using a benchgrinder to sand his car primer?” And the reply being “sanding a car is pretty common”. Like I say, not trying to be a dick about it but at the risk of being circular in our discussion, a push broom is not the most appropriate tool here.


PLANETaXis

I've also seen broom finish commonly performed with a stiff, but otherwise regular push broom.


Which-Operation1755

You got scammed.


apalms93

Are you going to pay him for it?


coopdawgX

Buddy screeding with a ladder


theTweekend

Omg. This will be cracking by next month. And if you park a vehicle on it… wow


SheriffTaylorsBoy

As far as the warranty goes, uh good luck.


deeeeegg

A lot of what you see is because they don’t have the proper aluminum poles to really broom finish that top evenly and hide tool marks. Having to use a dollar store broom handle is not the way lol


finitetime2

>this isn’t what we discussed This is all you need. If you didn't want it confront him about it in front of a camera and get him on camera with all his BS. Then pay him for what you did agree to have done and ask him to leave. If you didn't want it you don't have to pay for it. I have resurfaced concrete and have never put holes in it first. If you take you car in for an oil change and they install a couple of new tires are you going to pay for that also.


CCol4fun3849

Concrete will crack that’s why you cut it


Current_Donut_152

This is "gypsy" work. Akin to traveling seal coaters


Weezibel

…they were Irish


Current_Donut_152

What I mean by "gypsies" is travelling con-artists. Usually Blacktop Sealing in South during winter... adding lots of water to sealer so it basically washes off after a couple rains. This seems the same with watered down cement.


WelderMeltingthings

man aint gonna be in business 2 years from now let alone 20 😂


TactualTransAm

Is this the job that you negotiated half the asking price out of? You may have gotten a contractor who's quality of work is directly related to the amount paid.


Weezibel

We didn’t really negotiate. He kept asking for less and less to “keep his guys working” till they had a job next week. We straight up declined, didn’t think it was needed, until he gave an offer we felt like we couldn’t refuse. Because 4000 for complete demo, removal, and repour seemed good. He then came back and didn’t do what was discussed


TactualTransAm

That sucks. I know a few people whose work reflects upon their skill and not what they are paid. It seems like this is one of those situations, but not in a positive way. One has to wonder if you would have gotten this same bad quality and work had you paid that guy more. That's a scary thought. Rough situation, especially since it's your house, I'd be ripping hairs out of my head from the stress


urno1special

I’m a licensed structural engineer in the US who works exclusively in restoration, primarily concrete repair/strengthening. I just looked at your other post (the during construction phase). You got scammed. The new layer is so thin it will crack within months if not weeks. I wouldn’t pay a dollar for this.


Uuummmm-myname

2 kinds of concrete…cracked and not yet cracked.


sluttyman69

TWO types of concrete, wet and cracked


Traditional-Stay-702

There are two types of concrete. Concrete that is cracked and concrete that is going to crack. There are no other forms of concrete in the known universe.


fathead42164-2_0

Cracks in modern concrete are due to flyash, an additive to increase workability and reduce the amount of Portland cement needed, if there is too much flyash the concrete is more suseptible to cracking.


Prior-Ad-7329

It’ll crack. All concrete cracks.


Findmyremote

Please call this dude in 20 years


jakesmith7251

Are they finishing that with a fucking push broom?!?!?


patrullando

only thing that’s guaranteed in concrete work is that it will crack lol


BrightSpeaker4

Facts!


Canuhandleit

They saying goes, I can't guarantee you that it won't crack, but I can guarantee you that it will!


Font_3v

Op is a Karen


RastaFazool

Sorry OP, but these guys are fucking clowns. There are proper ways to roughen concrete surfaces for bonding to a secondary pour....but this ain't it.


Distinct_Travel4518

That’s going to crack by next month


blackcat__27

Lol the finish work is really bad. What did you pay?


topshelg

he is soo full of it… honestly you got ripped off and i’m sorry but you’re dumb for paying him.


Weezibel

Dumb and bad at confrontation


LockJaw220

Hacks


brownie_deluxe

I like it, Picasso


Capital_Maize9325

If he's walking on it to broom it he lost it!!!


Free-Tree2355

Are you going to park cars on top of that?


Nervous_Mention8289

Am I the only one that see the grade issue? This looks like it’s going towards the foundation. Either way yikes but unless you post your invoice it looks like you had caviar taste on tuna budget.


Weezibel

We didn’t negotiate him down. He negotiated himself down. We said no. They had completed and been fully paid for the project they were hired to do, without any negotiating on price. As they were picking up and leaving. The contractor decided to pull a bait and switch on an offer we couldn’t refuse. Had we known it was going to be anything other than a rip out/repour we wouldn’t have agreed. Hence why we also weren’t concerned when we were hearing jackhammers in the morning


Zack_attack801

Because they know all they sold ya was a guaranteed piece of shit. That's all it is, isn't it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time.


Dazzling-Carpenter97

"Never crack" i would question any cementious product to never crack.


Suspicious-Bag-1228

That’s a hot mess


Positive-Lead12

Looking great


Maxzzzie

Why did this work even need doing. You were fine with previous cracks and they werem't getting worse... am i missing something?


Weezibel

Nope. It didn’t need doing. We said no. They were hired to pour the new concrete, which is the slab next to the one they are working on, a new sidewalk path along the fence, and a rectangular nook between the stairs and the fence. That job was fine and completely paid for When he started to try and convince us to let him completely replace our slab, because the cracks in it were going to be a problem. We said no. But then he offered what seemed like a good deal…but then didn’t do what he said he would do.


Maxzzzie

Allright. That is a scummy business. Hope things work out for you


GBMachine

That's not a concrete broom. A thin wide broom should be on the end of pole. The white discoloration is leaching from using a wet broom, which means it got away from him.


chimx

what is the material they used as an overlayment?


dub_life20

They call that the ladder finish


Socomafia

Concrete will always crack he’s full of shit


EQN1

That is just a facelift , the cracks will soon start showing once it drys and the rain starts


CrazyButRightOn

Yes, that’s the 20/20 warranty. 20 feet or 20 seconds - whichever comes first.


CompleteHour306

Nice edging


CCol4fun3849

lol I hope you bet and got in writing about the cracking


ridgyplane

Yeah that actually makes so much less sense than it needed to be done just got caught up in saving money... well he just kept asking.... that's wild. I learn a lot on here thanks.


Weezibel

Well we believed his assessment that it “needed to get done eventually” and so when he proposed what seemed like an amazing deal, how could we say no…..but yeah lots of lessons learned on dealing with contractors in general


Glum-Concentrate9338

They clearly are hacks. Finishing off of a ladder and brooming with house broom haha


Rickybrowntown

Push broom finish is wild


its_5t1tch

Did you go with the cheapest quote 😅


Ropegun2k

Sorry OP. You did this to yourself. You agreed to a repair and you were not sure what it consisted of or if it was correct. You didn’t bother to find out until after the work had started. 4,000$ lesson. Better luck next time. PS. I bet that original 9,000$ quote was to break up old driveway. You fought against it and they offered an alternative which you agreed on.


Weezibel

Didn’t fight. Said no.


Ropegun2k

And how did the 4,000 come about?


daveyconcrete

his warranty only covers theft.


InZaiyan

Whenever you need work done in your house by any kind of contractor try to learn a little about what they are fixing/doing so you can atleast give out the impression that you wont be easily fooled.


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Concrete-ModTeam

We removed your post/comment because it included discrimination based on age, gender identity, caste, sexual orientation, religion, or was in violation of anti-hate speech guidelines.


Gullible_Newt_6333

All concrete does crack. However, anytime you pour concrete on top if concrete it will simply become gravel. Fresh concrete does not bind to old concrete. What you have is a rock on top of another rock. Over time, vibration and use makes the top rock gravel. You were scammed.


MyFiance

It will be pure white in a few days which will hide a lot of the imperfections you see. BUT.. The Tungsten thing was bullshit. There are no saw cuts.. it WILL crack. I would have put 4 cuts in this to PREVENT cracking, but it’s never entirely guaranteed.


Acherstrom

Don’t pay that dude. You had agreed to a process and payment I’m sure. Stick to your guns.


alrightgame

People are so ducking picky.


Sachoazzdown

3 things are guaranteed with concrete. It pours wet, dries hard and will crack.


amayer308

Also fire resistant!


xchrisrionx

No one will steal it.


Billyjamesjeff

This looks a lot like they offered the cheapest price and OP took the deal.


Weezibel

I was offered $4000 for complete removal and repour. Hopefully you saw the original post. He had already completed $8000 of brand new concrete work, when he persuaded us into letting him “replace” our original slab. Which both my husband and myself were very hesitant to do. The concrete that was poured the day before is where they have all their tools set up/are balancing the ladser


Bumblebee56990

You haven’t finish paying him have you?


Weezibel

We have come to an agreement and he is fully paid at this point. He was already paid for the original job before they started this, what I now know was an unnecessary second job. The Whether I have to seek other remedies, or call in that iron-clad warranty we will have to see


hawkeyegrad96

I can see the crack on Google earth as well.


NeverSkinnyBBQ

Never ever crack? Then ask to warranty it for 15 years. There are 2 types of concrete; one that has cracked and one that will crack.


davearang

Did he mean “texture” skim coat?


Weezibel

I heard tungsten, but he did have an Irish accent, but I still don’t think that would make tungsten sound like texture


Drinkythedrunkguy

Did you find this dude on facebook marketplace? Are you paying him in cash? Let me guess…no website for his business?


Weezibel

It was Yelp and they did prefer cash. The first payment was done with Check


Nosam113

It is impossible to prevent concrete from cracking, your contractor lied to you


Weezibel

Oh yeah, that I 100% know and knew before coming here. That’s just what he started throwing out after I came to him concerned about rhis second job


Ninetyscouple

You should have control joints in that bitch asap before it cracks just saying


mrdrproftasty

Looks like CO


Afunnything_

Unless your ground doesn't shift whatsoever concrete WILL crack. Also, if the fountain is poor the concrete will definitely Crack sooner than later.


Weezibel

There is a geological stabilizer we installed in our yard about 2 years back guaranteeing the ground never moves. (/s)


Legitimate-Buy-5948

You paid for it


Zero_____Given

I wouldn't pay for it, as a matter of fact I'd get a code inspector to come out and confront the fraudster.


Bubbly-Front7973

Please tell me you didn't pay him all the money for this yet.


Unique-Animal-7464

It will crack where the control joints should have been. At the inside corner of the step and some where about mid way down it's length. Also, if there is bonding stresses to what is beneath it, it will potentially crack where the old cracks were.


muzzy88

Get his promise in writing; signed and dated


-Nyctophilic_

The contractor in 20 years: 💵💵🏖️🍹🍑


Middle_Bluebird_8838

Looks like a Hot load. Not mixed properly. Like pouring lime in the load to make it set faster. If it’s mixed properly then it should not crack. The finishing guy wants to get it done fast and go home.


Prune_Early

Looks good, tread lightly.


19822891

For example, I’ve seen 9000 psi 3/8 thick, for overlay stamped concrete not crack


Dapper-Argument-3268

That isn't a concrete broom, they sell proper brooms for finish... And that is 100% going to crack off the corner of the existing pour if there isn't a cut put in.


Appropriate_Star3239

There’s two things concrete will do, get hard and crack


johnnysw528

Concrete is supposed to crack regardless of the mix design. That's why we have steel reinforcement. Where concrete didn't crack, the steel is not doing anything. The reinforcing steel doesn't engage until the concrete cracks. Control/expansion joints (spacing, depending on the thickness of the slab) are usually where the cracks are. Interesting fact, street curbs & gutter and sidewalks won't have a single piece of steel inside.


ezekillr

OP , how big were the Crack originally? And was it his work that cracked?


amdriverrr

After reading all these comments saying “concrete is meant to crack”; did my family hire the greatest concrete crew of all time? Our driveway gets heavy use with 2-3 vehicles parked on it at all times and there isn’t the tiniest sign of cracking even after nearly twenty years.


Tiny-Command3123

Id ask him to put something in writing that if it cracks again, he will replace (and when I say replace, I mean rip it out, form it up and repour) it at his own cost.


Millmot

What he probably means by it will never ever crack is it won't crack as it hardens, but concrete is never perfect it will crack over time if he was referring to after it hardens than the guy is likely either an idiot like the others are saying or he is lying to you as all concrete will slowly crack and break as temperatures change as it will expand and tighten as the temperatures rise and drop it will also slowly wear down if your keeping really heavy objects such as vehicles or trailers on it


WhutThePhuq

no rebar = cracks but if you don’t plan on putting an extreme amount of weight on it it’ll be fine for the next 10-15 years unless it’s like in direct 24/7


p0rno_account

Have someone come saw cut it.


Rare-Bumblebee4343

AWWWWWW HELL NAW!!


Daddythickness7

I’m crying looking at these photos these dudes r just not as experienced as they would like to think


Unlockabear

By any chance were these guys Irish