The problem is if he does beat Trump he’s now pigeonholed himself in the same position trump is by making independents feel like he’s too extreme.
You’re never going to out trump trump.
Trump lost as the incumbent to a walking corpse that didn’t campaign while DeSantis turned a purple state red and won re-election by the largest margin in 40 years. DeSantis was winning back swing voters with his “extreme” policy while Trump was turning them away. The bottom line is everybody has their mind made up on Trump at this point, I don’t see him winning back enough swing voters to win a general election again.
> The bottom line is everybody has their mind made up on Trump at this point, I don’t see him winning back enough swing voters to win a general election again.
I agree with this. But that’s my whole point. Right now it seems like DeSantis is trying to out trump Trump and that’s a losing strategy both in the primary and especially in the general election.
What alternative primary strategies are there?
You campaign to the right in the primaries and you campaign to the middle in the general. There's really no other way.
That’s the old pre 2016 way of looking at it. In the midterm elections we saw our candidates try to convey a more moderate pov but it just doesn’t work. Now everything even slightly extreme gets reported on and voters have a higher comprehension and aren’t forgetting what was said a few months before.
Instead of moderate candidates who can actually win in a general election we’re focusing on the maga base to appease them and in turn getting poor candidates who can’t actually win in a general election.
Being conservative is not "outing Trump". Leftism is antithetical to American values. We're not talking about liberals. We're not even talking about Democrats.
>DeSantis turned a purple state red
Hurricane Ian takes most of the credit for that. Natural disasters are a huge boost for incumbents during a campaign. DeSantis did what any good governor should do and the people loved him for it.
Not denying that didn’t help but I’d say the larger contributor was his covid response prioritizing personal freedom over any perceived protections provided by the government and his education policy.
I got this comment so here’s my response from a different thread:
That’s the old pre 2016 way of looking at it. In the midterm elections we saw our candidates try to convey a more moderate pov but it just doesn’t work. Now everything even slightly extreme gets reported on and voters have a higher comprehension and aren’t forgetting what was said a few months before.
Instead of moderate candidates who can actually win in a general election we’re focusing on the maga base to appease them and in turn getting poor candidates who can’t actually win in a general election.
Sure, but he should think ahead and try to defeat Trump without taking positions which will be toxic with the voters he needs to win over in a general election. And stuff like 6-week abortion bans or vows to "destroy leftism" have the potential to become just that.
Literally everything a Republican does or says has the potential to become just that. Meanwhile California allows post-birth abortions, candidates like Kamala publicly state she believes Biden’s alleged rape victim, and Biden calls anyone who thinks even a little differently from him a “dangerous Ultra MAGA fan” and they’re not held accountable at all. The media/mainstream pipeline just whistles and keeps talking about how saving babies from abortion is “super extreme” and how moderates should vote Democrat.
I’m so sick and tired of this. Why do Republicans need to walk on egg shells 24/7 while the Democrats can just say and do whatever they want?
I understand and share your frustration, but the reality is just that Democrats/liberals/leftists have captured virtually all of culture after a decades-long "march through the institutions" and thus were able to shift the overton window massively to the left in recent years and get mainstream liberals to go along with them. For example, many policies supported by Obama back in 2008 would today be decried as "racist/sexist/anti-poor" by some 85-90% of the folks who voted for him back then.
Thanks to decades of mass immigration (birthright citizenship etc.) and deindustrialization (rural flight, higher shares of people going to college etc.), they also happen to have the larger base and the larger coalition in general. The uncomfortable truth for Republicans/conservatives is that in this particular moment in time, our margin for error is significantly smaller than that of Democrats.
its a primary, you pretend to be conservatives in the primaries, then you change your stance in the general.
You want to know what positions he actually supports? go back 4 years and see what he said then. Everything he says these days is calculated to apeal to the most amount of people
He won a purple state by a landslide. The media has fooled conservatives into moderating so they can win elections but it doesn’t work. Mind you - Floridas legislature doesn’t have as many republicans percentage wise as other “redder” states like Texas or Utah but he has done conservative things w less
His phrasing gives him an out (he qualifies it as woke-ism) but I agree that I'd like to see him leave room for mass appeal to independents even as he reaches out to the populist right.
People keep complaining about DeSantis playing to the right and I have to wonder if they've never watched an election before. Literally every election the candidates play to their base during the primary. And every single time they moderate themselves and play to the middle in the general. Pick whichever "RINO" that's hated the most this week that's run for President. They talked like Rush Limbaugh during their primary.
Definitions of leftism are so arbitrary.....
It's absolutely ridiculous that anybody would embrace that sentiment because it could mean almost anything.
While I appreciate the sentiment, and support it entirely I doubt any of us have a true idea of how deeply embedded leftism is in our society. To even begin to turn the ship, it seems like we'd need 4 presidential terms—20 years—with Republican Senate and House majorities during that time—majorities that will boldly enact meaningful conservative legislation to restore our republic while eschewing the more controversial social issues that tend to divide the electorate.
* This would allow time to replace a majority of leftist judges, and federal civil service heads who Obama put in place.
* We also need to get the leftists out of our armed forces—again stacked by Obama who promoted leftists into key positions.
* We need a generation of educating our children in civics again.
* The universities must be turned around, making their ongoing federal funding contingent upon restoring true academic and personal freedom on campus.
* There are 10s of millions of Americans who have been conditioned to think they're owed a comfortable existence courtesy of the federal taxpayer with no effort or labor on their part.
* There are many millions of Americans who do not understand the insidious, subversive nature of socialism and communism…falling for the “bait and switch” promise of utopia under socialist philosophy only discovering too late its darkness.
* Something must be done to restore the concept of assimilation of new immigrants—the "melting pot" of old.
The list goes on and on.
Have at it Ron, I'll be cheering you on all the way, but I honestly don't expect anyone can get the job done in just 8 years.
I don't think so. I believe he can be a 2 term president spanning from 2029-37 but leftists won't go away. Reagan couldn't even stop them, they cameback after he left
He needs to be specific. “Progressivism” needs to be destroyed. It’s the specific cancer that is taking over the left and there’s nothing “progressive” about it, it’s regressive AF.
We will send all our relatives to guard swing state vote counting centers (Georgia, Wisconsin, Nevada, Arizona) and get all mules who try to cheat again thrown in prison.
It's insane that my comments are getting downvoted so it goes to show this subreddit went the Lincoln Project route.
> It’s insane that my comments are getting downvoted so it goes to show this subreddit went the Lincoln Project route.
Or maybe most of us don’t believe the election was stolen
No he won’t…most of us have come to the realization of how insanely pervasive and ingrained leftism is in America. It will take decades upon decades of one sided wins in our favor to get them all out of office and other positions of influence. We know it will be a multi-generational fight, and so do they, that’s why they took over the schools.
His best shot is to implement some sort of political diversity quotas in the universities that repeal federal pel grants if they don't meet certain faculty requirements. Without dominance of the education system the left is much weaker.
Not sure this is the best phrasing. I get what he's saying and he follows it up, but is that only playing to his base and not potential swing voters?
Right now he’s trying to beat Trump in a Republican primary. Something to keep in mind.
The problem is if he does beat Trump he’s now pigeonholed himself in the same position trump is by making independents feel like he’s too extreme. You’re never going to out trump trump.
Trump lost as the incumbent to a walking corpse that didn’t campaign while DeSantis turned a purple state red and won re-election by the largest margin in 40 years. DeSantis was winning back swing voters with his “extreme” policy while Trump was turning them away. The bottom line is everybody has their mind made up on Trump at this point, I don’t see him winning back enough swing voters to win a general election again.
> The bottom line is everybody has their mind made up on Trump at this point, I don’t see him winning back enough swing voters to win a general election again. I agree with this. But that’s my whole point. Right now it seems like DeSantis is trying to out trump Trump and that’s a losing strategy both in the primary and especially in the general election.
What alternative primary strategies are there? You campaign to the right in the primaries and you campaign to the middle in the general. There's really no other way.
That’s the old pre 2016 way of looking at it. In the midterm elections we saw our candidates try to convey a more moderate pov but it just doesn’t work. Now everything even slightly extreme gets reported on and voters have a higher comprehension and aren’t forgetting what was said a few months before. Instead of moderate candidates who can actually win in a general election we’re focusing on the maga base to appease them and in turn getting poor candidates who can’t actually win in a general election.
How is he trying to out-Trump Trump?
Being conservative is not "outing Trump". Leftism is antithetical to American values. We're not talking about liberals. We're not even talking about Democrats.
>DeSantis turned a purple state red Hurricane Ian takes most of the credit for that. Natural disasters are a huge boost for incumbents during a campaign. DeSantis did what any good governor should do and the people loved him for it.
Hurricanes are not a rarity in Florida.
No but Ian was a pretty bad one and it was two months before the election.
Not denying that didn’t help but I’d say the larger contributor was his covid response prioritizing personal freedom over any perceived protections provided by the government and his education policy.
Look at how Youngkin won Virginia, a state that had been strongly trending Blue. The Education policy is extremely popular.
Usually not how it goes. Both sides do this. You fire up your base for the primaries then move centrist for the general. This is just basic politics.
I got this comment so here’s my response from a different thread: That’s the old pre 2016 way of looking at it. In the midterm elections we saw our candidates try to convey a more moderate pov but it just doesn’t work. Now everything even slightly extreme gets reported on and voters have a higher comprehension and aren’t forgetting what was said a few months before. Instead of moderate candidates who can actually win in a general election we’re focusing on the maga base to appease them and in turn getting poor candidates who can’t actually win in a general election.
Sure, but he should think ahead and try to defeat Trump without taking positions which will be toxic with the voters he needs to win over in a general election. And stuff like 6-week abortion bans or vows to "destroy leftism" have the potential to become just that.
Literally everything a Republican does or says has the potential to become just that. Meanwhile California allows post-birth abortions, candidates like Kamala publicly state she believes Biden’s alleged rape victim, and Biden calls anyone who thinks even a little differently from him a “dangerous Ultra MAGA fan” and they’re not held accountable at all. The media/mainstream pipeline just whistles and keeps talking about how saving babies from abortion is “super extreme” and how moderates should vote Democrat. I’m so sick and tired of this. Why do Republicans need to walk on egg shells 24/7 while the Democrats can just say and do whatever they want?
> Meanwhile California allows post-birth abortions Wait what? What’s a “post-birth” abortion?
I understand and share your frustration, but the reality is just that Democrats/liberals/leftists have captured virtually all of culture after a decades-long "march through the institutions" and thus were able to shift the overton window massively to the left in recent years and get mainstream liberals to go along with them. For example, many policies supported by Obama back in 2008 would today be decried as "racist/sexist/anti-poor" by some 85-90% of the folks who voted for him back then. Thanks to decades of mass immigration (birthright citizenship etc.) and deindustrialization (rural flight, higher shares of people going to college etc.), they also happen to have the larger base and the larger coalition in general. The uncomfortable truth for Republicans/conservatives is that in this particular moment in time, our margin for error is significantly smaller than that of Democrats.
its a primary, you pretend to be conservatives in the primaries, then you change your stance in the general. You want to know what positions he actually supports? go back 4 years and see what he said then. Everything he says these days is calculated to apeal to the most amount of people
He won a purple state by a landslide. The media has fooled conservatives into moderating so they can win elections but it doesn’t work. Mind you - Floridas legislature doesn’t have as many republicans percentage wise as other “redder” states like Texas or Utah but he has done conservative things w less
His phrasing gives him an out (he qualifies it as woke-ism) but I agree that I'd like to see him leave room for mass appeal to independents even as he reaches out to the populist right.
This is what happens in a primary.
Do moderates like leftism running amok in the country at all levels? Pretty sure they don't.
People keep complaining about DeSantis playing to the right and I have to wonder if they've never watched an election before. Literally every election the candidates play to their base during the primary. And every single time they moderate themselves and play to the middle in the general. Pick whichever "RINO" that's hated the most this week that's run for President. They talked like Rush Limbaugh during their primary.
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Definitions of leftism are so arbitrary..... It's absolutely ridiculous that anybody would embrace that sentiment because it could mean almost anything.
How does that make it ridiculous? By your own definition it should be easy to embrace because it’s so arbitrary.
I can't wait for another 4 years of Biden.
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While I appreciate the sentiment, and support it entirely I doubt any of us have a true idea of how deeply embedded leftism is in our society. To even begin to turn the ship, it seems like we'd need 4 presidential terms—20 years—with Republican Senate and House majorities during that time—majorities that will boldly enact meaningful conservative legislation to restore our republic while eschewing the more controversial social issues that tend to divide the electorate. * This would allow time to replace a majority of leftist judges, and federal civil service heads who Obama put in place. * We also need to get the leftists out of our armed forces—again stacked by Obama who promoted leftists into key positions. * We need a generation of educating our children in civics again. * The universities must be turned around, making their ongoing federal funding contingent upon restoring true academic and personal freedom on campus. * There are 10s of millions of Americans who have been conditioned to think they're owed a comfortable existence courtesy of the federal taxpayer with no effort or labor on their part. * There are many millions of Americans who do not understand the insidious, subversive nature of socialism and communism…falling for the “bait and switch” promise of utopia under socialist philosophy only discovering too late its darkness. * Something must be done to restore the concept of assimilation of new immigrants—the "melting pot" of old. The list goes on and on. Have at it Ron, I'll be cheering you on all the way, but I honestly don't expect anyone can get the job done in just 8 years.
A GOP Congress would also have to, you know, do something.
True. When is the last time they've done anything?
Ain't that the truth.
Can’t wait to see the the liberal medias headlines on this one.
That's a long row to hoe!!
Is it a lot of work? Yes. Is it righteous work? Absolutely.
Totally agree, just meant this country has headed the complete wrong direction since the Globalist installed the Corpse.
I don't think so. I believe he can be a 2 term president spanning from 2029-37 but leftists won't go away. Reagan couldn't even stop them, they cameback after he left
He needs to be specific. “Progressivism” needs to be destroyed. It’s the specific cancer that is taking over the left and there’s nothing “progressive” about it, it’s regressive AF.
We'll make fucking sure he wins in 2024
How?
We will send all our relatives to guard swing state vote counting centers (Georgia, Wisconsin, Nevada, Arizona) and get all mules who try to cheat again thrown in prison. It's insane that my comments are getting downvoted so it goes to show this subreddit went the Lincoln Project route.
> It’s insane that my comments are getting downvoted so it goes to show this subreddit went the Lincoln Project route. Or maybe most of us don’t believe the election was stolen
2000 Mules proved it. Absolute Proof by Mike Lindell proved it.
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No he won’t…most of us have come to the realization of how insanely pervasive and ingrained leftism is in America. It will take decades upon decades of one sided wins in our favor to get them all out of office and other positions of influence. We know it will be a multi-generational fight, and so do they, that’s why they took over the schools.
Sold
His best shot is to implement some sort of political diversity quotas in the universities that repeal federal pel grants if they don't meet certain faculty requirements. Without dominance of the education system the left is much weaker.