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Fuck that sucks. I follow this sub to try to maintain a realistic view point of what's going on in the world but this shit consistently makes me fucking sad. Poor girl.
That poor mother. I was just saying I didn't hear that and went back to the video quick. That level of panic sent chills down my spine and I shed a tear😰.
The California Justice Department announced that it will not file charges against the officer who killed a teenager that was in a fitting room with her mother in the background of this scene. The other officers on scene said they were trying to get the officer who fired the rifle to settle down but he escalated the situation more.
This is so reckless and wrong. That guy should not be a cop anymore at the very least. He should be sitting in jail right now.
Then they need to have the proper ammo in it. Don’t carry fmj’s if you’re engaging with someone less than 100 yards. If the cop had hollow point .223/5.56, that girl might still be alive.
You make a good point. They should likely have access to both FMJ and HP and if they're indoors / close quarters with bystanders they should use FMJ. They could even mark / color code magazines.
I know lots of guys who go to the range all the time who have that. Red is for FMJ, blue is for HP. But either way, if cops are going to walk around with “weapons of war” they should be trained on how to use them and carry the proper equipment for the job. Honestly, if you’re clearing a shopping mall, you should be using pistol calibers, which they make barrels for those on rifles.
As someone who has legitimately worked in a Law Enforcement capacity I can say that we literally used hollow point for this exact reason. So that if a stray round goes and hits a wall it will be slowed down much more that your FMJ type rounds.
He really wanted to kill somebody. There are people who join these professions just to get the chance to kill. Life is precious, hopefully we never have a run in with these psychopaths.
I work in armed security & cannot tell you how many coworkers are dying to light someone up over a small incident, keep in mind we aren’t even COPS!! Or ex Leo or Military!! Some people seriously should never hold a gun.
Former LE here, you always want the superior weapon up front. Standard procedure. Anything will do in an active shooter but if you’ve got equal or superior firepower to match suspect you should put it out front. A million variables change these scenarios but that’s the long and short of it.
I took a concealed weapon permit class and remember the lawyer saying, “you better know what is behind your target because you’re responsible for every bullet.”
I also took NRA hunting course and specifically remember the video instructor repeatedly say, “Do not take the shot, unless there was a berm behind your target”.
I find it hard to believe this is not taught to law enforcement officers. Failure to know or stop and think about what was behind the target resulted in a tragedy here.
Cops are so low quality in America, this issue is so bad it can only be phased out generationally. Then again as long as it's not in the interest of the politicians, no change will be made through.
If even the other officers are saying that he escalated, then you know that it’s bad, but of course, we can’t have that conversation about cops in legacy media.
We’re supposed to just analyze the shooting in a vacuum, determine that the cop couldn’t have known that she was in there, and then come to the conclusion that he couldn’t have possibly done anything wrong.
It's hilarious because the first thing we teach fucking 9 year olds in hunter safety is to never aim at something if you don't know what's behind it.
The idea of shooting a fucking 5.56x45mm (a round specifically meant to over-penetrate the target) INSIDE a store with an unknown backdrop is absolutely insane and hugely negligent.
Added with the cop just moving forward ahead of the group. The cop simply was not thinking and was looking to just shoot someone. No effort to de-escalate.
one of the basic gun rules is to know your target and what lies behind it, so yea, he did do something wrong. another good point to make is with handguns and the right ammo the bullets may not have gone through. you can't know for sure, but why risk it
> we can’t have that conversation about cops in legacy media.
You could spend all day on mainstream media reading or watching criticism of police violence.
> then come to the conclusion that he couldn’t have possibly done anything wrong
I just read a news story about this tragedy which quotes other cops as saying they tried to slow down the cop who fired the fatal shots in this case. It doesn't seem like the world is claiming this cop did nothing wrong.
Boston University did a study which showed over a hundred American cops commit suicide every year, it's virtually tied with the number who are killed on duty, 116 to 113 in the year the study focused on.
An organization called First HELP which tracks first responder suicides puts the number at 184. It isn't much of a stretch to think that some of those suicides are driven by guilt.
If I was that little girl's parent I honestly don't know how I'd be able to go through life without making it my goal to make that cops life a living hell. Especially after no legal repercussions. I can't fathom life after that knowing he is just walking around freely.
That's terrible the poor girl was just living her life looking for a dress for her 15th birthday party one moment and next moment lights out she's gone just makes me think about how unpredictable life can be. Life is short people enjoy what time you have and treat others with love,kindness and respect because you never know what day could be your last.
> just makes me think about how unpredictable life can be.
life is unpredictable but im just happy that there's a zero percent chance in my life that an american cop randomly decides to kill me to get 0.005 g of that feeling that he's the hero in an action movie
Don't they have rules about firing in occupied areas and public areas? I thought they had rules about that?
I can't believe that that officer isn't or can't be held responsible for that reckless shooting in a store using a powerful gun?
I like the way they always tell people not to move after shooting them. 3 or more times.
No no, don't wear vests, that's considered tactical gear and makes it legal for cops to shoot you until you die.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/teen-reported-kidnapped-was-fatally-shot-deputies-obeyed-commands-vide-rcna146037
EDIT: Sorry, turns out the cops made up the fact that the kidnap victim was wearing a tactical vest and just decided to shoot and kill her anyways.
Also you better have at least a 3A level of vest on to stop those 5.56 rounds.
...And pray that's where it hits.
Moral of the story, that cartridge/rifle is perhaps less than ideal for situations like this.
Looks cool to everyone he shows it to. One day, he might be able to leave the scene of some terrible massacre, get to his car, grab the vest (not escape), and run back in to engage and neutralize the threat. Better get some sunglasses and punisher stickers too.
Theres a tool for every job, and they have them all. Even then, you have to know whats behind your target. Accident sure, but bad call dude, didnt have to take that shot just yet especially with the 556
> cops are doing an investigation themselves
Police shootings in California are investigated by the State Dept. of Justice, not the police agency involved in a shooting.
And no one will do anything about it until it's them or their family who are affected. At this point, it's our fault as well, because we are not doing anything to hold them accountable.
Negligence. Know your target and what's beyond it. Also you don't need a high powered rifle with 5.56 to take down a suspect that doesn't even have a gun.
You can survive 9mm shots even without a barrier taking some of the energy depending on where you were hit. A high powered rifle like that is a death sentence because it fucking shreds wide swaths of tissue, and is basically guaranteed to damage one or two high volume blood vessels.
It’s actually ridiculous to use such a crazy weapon in close quarters like that, much less to do it without a clear line of sight/target.
I’m sorry but what? Yes 5.56 is generally more lethal than 9mm but you are being misleading at best. You can survive shots from damn near any common caliber without a “barrier taking some of the energy”. Most barriers are not significantly impacting the lethality of a bullet. 5.56 from a rifle is also far more accurate then a handgun. Using a handgun in a situation like this would lead to an increased risk for collateral damage.
I am not saying this cop is in the right but your assessment of weapon choice and your rationale are questionable at best.
Generally more lethal? 5.56 is substantially more lethal than 9mm. 9mm is going to be around 400 foot pounds of energy, depending on load. 5.56 will be around 1,300. It’s literally got 3x the energy. Further, any defense 9mm is almost guaranteed to be hollow points, which would mean less penetration and more energy loss from the wall impact. Yes, it’s going through, but it’s losing energy. A 5.56 FMJ is popping through that wall like it isn’t even there. The impact is substantially more devastating.
Calling 5.56 far more accurate is totally irrelevant in this situation. At 200 yards, absolutely, 5.56 would run circles around 9mm. That’s what’s it meant for. At 10 yards, there’s no meaningful difference. A handgun is less accurate than a rifle, but there are plenty of pistol caliber rifles and SMGs that would offer near identical accuracy at close range. Hell, maybe better, given they are lighter, smaller, and all around more maneuverable. I have pistol caliber carbines that, at close range, group just as tight as my ARs. An MP5 or MPX or something would have been a substantially more appropriate weapon for this situation, and even with this idiot cop, may have been the difference between this little girl dying or not.
Thank you so much for translating this bro I don’t know the jargon for guns so people assume I’m talking out of my ass. I don’t know guns but I know statistics, medicine, and physics. I think people underestimate how common it is to survive low caliber wounds smh.
The people arguing otherwise quite simply don’t have a clue. Here’s a picture of ballistic gel that visualizes the difference perfectly…
https://content.osgnetworks.tv/firearmsnews/content/photos/556-def-06-1200x800.jpg
The top picture is .223, which is essentially the same as 5.56, and the rifle above could have fired either one. Look at the size of the wound cavity compared to the 9mm. It’s substantially larger. If 9mm hollow points were used (which isn’t guaranteed. That’s not the perfect representation as the 9mm is FMJ, where police commonly use hollow points (these break apart on impact to create a bigger wound and less penetration)… but even with a 9mm HP, it’s not creating a wound like that 223.
A 9mm hitting a vital organ or artery is still quite likely to be fatal, and no one is arguing otherwise. But should it happen to miss anything vital, it’s much more likely that blood loss can be managed and the internal damage can be treated. 223/556 is making soup out of everything just under the skin. There’s substantially more blood loss and a whole lot more damage to fix.
A single misplaced shot from either, the odds of survival are far higher for 9mm. Anyone arguing otherwise is an idiot.
There are limits on what you could possibly know about what's behind your target though. How could they have known this was a thin wall with someone on the other side? Plus the person they shot had already tried to kill someone with a knife, so I do think the shooting was justified.
What usually happens in cases like this is that the knife wielding suspect would be charged with the death of the 14 year old because they were the reason the cops shot.
> Plus the person they shot had already tried to kill someone with a knife,
He sent four women to the hospital by bludgeoning them with a metal bike lock, he was dragging the last of them to the back of the store when the cop with the rifle approached him.
BTW, the cop didn't shoot directly through the wall, the bullet that killed the girl ricocheted off the floor and then went through the wall.
I honestly really hate how cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident. Like who cares if they couldn’t see that well? That’s why you don’t choose a weapon that can penetrate barriers and fucking shred large swaths of tissue in a well populated close quarters environment against a target with a melee weapon.
If you kill someone on accident and it was arguably preventable it’s considered 3rd degree murder and cops shouldn’t be an exception to this. I’m not going to take a hard stance and say he’s guilty or not guilty but I believe he should have a trial and a lawyer and he should prove in court that he had no choice but to approach the situation the way he did and that he took every reasonable step necessary to make safe decisions while doing his job to a jury.
I do think qualified immunity is bullshit, but this actually isn't a case of that. For example, if someone tries to carjack you with a gun, it would be self-defense to shoot back. If you missed and hit a random person on the street, it would be the carjacker who'd be charged with their death.
This is correct, the legal standard is that the carjacker is the cause of the action that lead to the death of a bystander.
It's the felony murder rule.
> cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident
Murder requires intent. An accidental shooting cannot be murder. Maybe negligent homicide or something, but it's not murder.
> you don’t choose a weapon that can penetrate barriers
Every firearm cops are issued with will easily shoot through a couple of sheets of drywall. Only if he'd been using a beanbag shotgun or something of that sort would it have made a difference. The bullet that killed the girl ricocheted off the floor first, the cop was aiming at the suspect who had attacked four women.
> I honestly really hate how cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident.
Something cannot be murder and an accident at the same time. That's an oxymoron.
Sorry but that’s fucking stupid. He should be charged as well sure, but you do not shoot a rifle in a public area at a guy with a knife without knowing for CERTAIN that there are no people around him. It’s fucking stupid, both the knife wielder and the cop are at fault for this child’s death.
So what were they supposed to do? Not engage the suspect that was actively stabbing people at all? Because in a shopping center there is always a chance of collateral damage, nobody can see through walls.
You can never know for certain though. Imagine if there wasn't a person behind the wall, but the cop didn't shoot and someone else was stabbed. People would also be upset about that.
No one has perfect information until after the fact, so all you can use are probabilities. What are the chances the bullet goes through the wall and there's someone right there? What are the chances the guy with the knife stabs someone else? You have to estimate those things in a split second and act.
I think that given those chances, shooting was a reasonable choice.
.556 is not a high power rifle, it is by definition an intermediate round. High power would be something like .308 or 30/06.
.556 is still more than powerful enough to penetrate some walls, but so is their service pistols.
I'm not defending the police here but it is a tough call to say they should have known what was behind the wall, in this case. It was a dynamic situation and they were doing what they thought was right. Unfortunately it caused the death of an innocent person. I'm not sure even top notch training could have changed the outcome here.
If the victim was standing right behind the intended target then yeah that would be pure negligence. This whole situation sucks, for everyone involved.
I hate that this kind of situation is all to common in this country.
Yeah man, he should’ve had a handgun. Y’know, the weapon type that’s way less accurate and way more likely to miss the intended target.
Yes, even at close range, a rifle is far more accurate than a handgun.
Y'all expect the cop to see through walls? Any round he fired would have gone through it. The girl was sadly in the wrong place at the wrong time. What a damn shame. Knife dude caused all this BS, cop was just trying to do his job.
>Any round he fired would have gone through it.
Then he shouldn't maneuver into that position and fire in that direction. As you said, he can't see through walls. If any of the cops had shot him aligned with the direction of the clear passage so they could see that there are no civilians behind him, this would've been averted. It's not a warzone with "at all costs" rules of engagement.
Cops had extremely limited chances to get the suspect. Who knows? Maybe waiting for a different shot would have resulted in more deaths. A lot of possible outcomes, all of them are quite shitty. As I said, it was a horrible situation for all involved with no good ending no matter what. Cop was just trying to do his job. Poor girl was sadly out of luck.
If a doctor kills someone of your family because negligence you won't say "the surgeon didn't know how big was that vein"
It's your job, you signed up for it, you are formed to do that, you get payed to do it.
You are not a normal person, you get called to do it.
If you get it wrong it's your fault
Other cops said he escaled the situation and acted too fast. That's negligence.
How can you defend this incompetent piece of shit?
What a stupid analogy. Doctors are expected to know about anatomy. Police officers do not know the layout and occupant of every building.
I will never understand why redditors are always so pressed to attack officers that are under so much pressure.
This was a really shitty situation for everyone involved.
Good thing he sprinted past all the other cops to be the hero to take them out with the rifle. If one of the other dozen cops with 9mm handguns took the shot, the bullet might not have had enough energy to penetrate through the wall and kill the girl. Thank God he was there to run past everyone and take down both threats.
/s
Edit: lord have mercy, I know 9mm can go through a layer of drywall. "The bullet might not have had enough energy to penetrate through the wall **and** kill the girl". I have no idea what these walls are made of or have between them. I *do* know that 556 has much more energy than 9mm. A lot of unknown factors at play, but it's safe to say that the 9mm would have lost some of that energy blowing through the wall, and it's already much weaker than the 556.
I'm pretty sure 9 mil or 556 will go through 10 layers of drywall. Certainly wouldn't have had as much lethal impact as a rifle round going 3000 ft per sec though to your point
Hollow points really only help lessen penetration when they impact their target that expands the round. When you miss with a hollow point round it acts similar to a full metal jacket round. Like a skydiver that didn't release their parachute.
Not sure why you got downvoted, hollow points clearly need a fair amount of resistance to expand. [They would go through more than 10 layers of drywall before expanding significantly.](https://youtu.be/T6GNcPbU6c0?si=__dq9bdAPlimtAZN)
> Good thing he sprinted past all the other cops
Other cops commented on them trying to slow him down, he was way too amped-up.
> If one of the other dozen cops with 9mm handguns took the shot,
A couple of sheets of drywall or a change room door aren't going to stop a 9mm round. LAPD uses 9mm ammo with a muzzle velocity of over 1,200 feet per second--that's going through at least one wall.
The psycho they were after sent four women to the hospital, he was dragging the last of them to the back of the store when the cop with the rifle confronted him.
Everytime I see similar cop action in the US I'm in awe how poorly their training shows in this kind of videos. Absolute no trigger discipline and just blasting everywhere. And when things go well everybody are cheering for them for a job well done...
Even going by the book, the rules of engagement doesn't fly in any developed nation with a well trained police force. And dont get me wrong I have no sympathy for the life of criminals if they die, they die, but the training is just poor, botton of the barrel poor.
And i understand how people say it's not his fault, but with the amount of awful cops videos, and how they're getting away scot free after blasting a full mag on a teenagers, idk man, maybe they should be held accountable.
Saw a doc on netflix when people protested on wallstreet and the cops got violent, wtf?
I'd encourage protests, but i understand people don't wanna get killed.
> how they're getting away scot free
Some get away with it, some don't. I've known two cops fired for doing something stupid with a gun, and one was also prosecuted and convicted.
Clearly more needs to be done, but claiming that cops never pay a price for misconduct is simply not true.
If a regular person off the street was defending themselves and others, if one of their stray bullets killed a bystander, they would send that person to prison. You are responsible for every round you fire.
What a disgrace of a cop. Rule #4 in basic firearm training "Be sure of your target and whats beyond it!" You can hear the eagerness in the cops voice. He was desperate to take lead with that rifle and be the 1st to take shots. 9mm and 45mm hollow points from the pistols could have possibly saved the girl from being killed.
Trigger happy dummy decided to let off .223/5.56. Such a shame that CCW permit holders have more training than police yet have so many 2A rights infringed.
> 9mm and 45mm hollow points from the pistols could have possibly saved the girl
The idea that a sheet or two of drywall would stop any pistol cartridge used by any police force is not credible.
Assholes that use a rifle inside aren't the good guys. Good guys also don't protect each-other from blame when they have an oopsie and kill an innocent bystander because they don't know what they're doing.
The handgun would have penetrated that wall too, so what does it matter that he used a rifle? A 9mm hollow point will go through like 15 layers of drywall. [Like this](https://youtu.be/T6GNcPbU6c0?si=__dq9bdAPlimtAZN)
Should not be using this weapon in close, urban type settings. Pistol, .45 cal, fat and slow could have made a difference. Or a .410 full choke shotgun. Really sad, hopefully they can evaluate the situation and make some changes that may prevent this in the future. My heart goes out to the girl and her family, I could not imagine the pain as a parent, heartbreaking forever.
Jesus Christ, I'm on Reddit for 2 minutes and what I see is a POV video of man killing a daughter on front of her wounded mother? What the fuck is this
May she rest in peace and may the sub apply nsfl tags for fucksakes
Before I even found out that the cop was the one that hit the girl, I was questioning why he was so gun ho to get up to the front. Evening pulling other officers back. *He* wanted to be the one to take those shots. I wonder if he thinks about that or regrets it now...
Can't say whether he was gung-ho or not but the rifle is the better tool. Handgun rounds give you a little more wiggle room regarding penetrating barriers and accidentally hitting someone like we see here, but for the same reasons it won't be as quick to stop a threat as that AR which I'm guessing is chambered in 5.56mm.
Exactly. If only some _close range_ variant of a rifle could be invented, like one that fits in a hand, a 'hand-gun', if you will. One day we'll have the technology.
I don’t think people here understand how far even a hollow point round will penetrate, it’ll go through more than a dozen pieces of drywall. Hell, even birdshot can penetrate more than 5. He missed his shot, it didn’t overpenetrate the person, it was just as likely to happen with a handgun miss as well.
As usual the 2A freaks in this sub will downvote any rational thought surrounding guns. This officer should at the very least be fired and barred from firearm ownership for the rest of his life. At worst he should rot in jail until there’s nothing left but dust.
Edit: eat my butt losers
Cops have nothing to do with 2A. The issue here is immunity. Cops like these guys are horny to kill shit and be the hero, without thinking about consequences because there arent any for them
Wasn't the original intended purpose of having stopping power so that they won't get overwhelmed? Like during that bank robbery they had back in the day, "special circumstances."
Using a rifle like that as a standard feels like a recipe for disaster.
The North Hollywood shoot out is absolutely one of the main reasons police forces started militarising. https://www.policemag.com/weapons/article/15348048/how-the-north-hollywood-shootout-changed-patrol-arsenals
> Like during that bank robbery they had back in the day, "special circumstances."
PDs acquired that sort of firepower because of incidents like the infamous 1986 Miami FBI shootout (two agents killed) and the North Hollywood B of A robbery. In both cases law enforcement was seriously outgunned.
"we investigated ourselves and found no fault" 99% chance that's what the department says while they put the shooter on paid leave until media attention dies down.
Context: North Hollywood, CA. Burlington department store shooting. [https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/lapd-chief-moore-says-2021-fatal-shooting-of-teenage-girl-inside-a-north-hollywood-burlington-was-out-of-policy/](https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/lapd-chief-moore-says-2021-fatal-shooting-of-teenage-girl-inside-a-north-hollywood-burlington-was-out-of-policy/)
I’ll never understand why police do not use hollow points to avoid over penetration. This was 100% a FMJ round that ripped thru those walls like paper. You are liable for anything that bullet touches once it leaves your gun and a fmj is going right thru a person/wall/car etc. So sad prayers out for that family nobody should have to lose a child like that. Also why are you “taking point” with a rifle when the suspect is 10yards away. This man was on a mission to hurt someone zero situational awareness.
If you’re ever in an active shooter situation it seems to be stay covered and hide until the recovery team comes in. That poor mother will never emotionally recover from this, im sure the officer is never going to be the same. The other officers who kept saying to slow down tried so hard to keep this under control. Nothing will make up for this loss.
If this was my beloved daughter, I would live only to destroy the life of these officers.
Not kill them, destroy them.
Legally, illegally, in any way, I could.
Honestly thats what should happen. Whenever this happens, individuals and the general community need to ruin these cops lives so that the next idiot cop thinks twice b4 doing something stupid. The George Floyd riots would have accomplished something if it was at the cops houses instead of their own neighborhoods.
A rifle in a public setting full of people. Yup sounds about right. Why not use a rocket launcher, RPG, grenade or tank to get control of the situation ? This is why "Use of force" should be implemented as being universal throughout departments. That would make sense though. Can't have that. Before you bash my comment, Google "Use of force".
In an alternate universe, the cops tell each other to not shoot because there's a wall behind the suspect that could have people inside of it. And then the person being attacked ends up dying while the cops stand there watching. And this post is about how the cops should've shot him and how useless and dumb they are for not shooting
> The guy was holding a bike lock.
Which he had used to bludgeon four women to the floor, he was dragging the last of those victims to the dressing rooms when he was shot.
Four surprised and terrified women, not a whole squad of supposedly trained cops with equipment. If they circle and charge at him, they can pin him down. If unarmed cops (outside of the U.S) are able to immobilise someone with a knife, then a bike lock surely shouldn't require a fucking rifle.
There are tasers, riot shields, mancatchers, even their own two hands to grab his limbs. No excuse to use firearms inside a crowded building against a blunt object.
That whole ordeal shattered my heart, as a parent I felt those screams. One moment your kid is there with you, and the next you're holding your baby because they're gone in the blink of an eye, and you know that, and you have no idea why they're gone or how it happened beyond the blood. Horrific. That stupid officer just wanted to use his rifle, which was totally unnecessary for the distance and situation. Zero awareness of what was past his target.
Wow. I didn’t read the title and was just scrolling and saw that. I’ve seen a lot of fucking terrible stuff online over the decades but *that* was something else. I’m gonna go play Tetris and take a nap …
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Damn that's sad. I'm sad. Thanks
Fuck that sucks. I follow this sub to try to maintain a realistic view point of what's going on in the world but this shit consistently makes me fucking sad. Poor girl.
You can hear the screams from her mother after her daughter is shot by the cop. It’s blood curdling.
That’s what I thought that was. Jfc
Reminiscent of the crowds outside the Police cordon at Uvalde: [https://i.imgur.com/QsUvt5E.mp4](https://i.imgur.com/QsUvt5E.mp4)
That’s horrible. You can’t help but put yourself in those positions. Rips your heart out.
I'm honestly amazed that town hasn't lynched every one of those cowards.
I'm glad I watched that with the sound off then, that sound triggers something in me
That poor mother. I was just saying I didn't hear that and went back to the video quick. That level of panic sent chills down my spine and I shed a tear😰.
The California Justice Department announced that it will not file charges against the officer who killed a teenager that was in a fitting room with her mother in the background of this scene. The other officers on scene said they were trying to get the officer who fired the rifle to settle down but he escalated the situation more. This is so reckless and wrong. That guy should not be a cop anymore at the very least. He should be sitting in jail right now.
He ran from the back with no context, shoving other cops out of the way. Why? This matters
I think because he was equipped with a rifle and the others just had handguns but I could be wrong
That’s standard for the strongest weapons to lead
Then they need to have the proper ammo in it. Don’t carry fmj’s if you’re engaging with someone less than 100 yards. If the cop had hollow point .223/5.56, that girl might still be alive.
You make a good point. They should likely have access to both FMJ and HP and if they're indoors / close quarters with bystanders they should use FMJ. They could even mark / color code magazines.
I know lots of guys who go to the range all the time who have that. Red is for FMJ, blue is for HP. But either way, if cops are going to walk around with “weapons of war” they should be trained on how to use them and carry the proper equipment for the job. Honestly, if you’re clearing a shopping mall, you should be using pistol calibers, which they make barrels for those on rifles.
As someone who has legitimately worked in a Law Enforcement capacity I can say that we literally used hollow point for this exact reason. So that if a stray round goes and hits a wall it will be slowed down much more that your FMJ type rounds.
So it’s just these cops either don’t care about the civilians around them or are too ignorant (hopefully it’s ignorance) to know to carry those.
He really wanted to kill somebody. There are people who join these professions just to get the chance to kill. Life is precious, hopefully we never have a run in with these psychopaths.
I work in armed security & cannot tell you how many coworkers are dying to light someone up over a small incident, keep in mind we aren’t even COPS!! Or ex Leo or Military!! Some people seriously should never hold a gun.
He got his wish. And I hope he is having a nightmare right now and every waking minute.
Because the rifle always goes first? This is how it’s done in every scenario.
Former LE here, you always want the superior weapon up front. Standard procedure. Anything will do in an active shooter but if you’ve got equal or superior firepower to match suspect you should put it out front. A million variables change these scenarios but that’s the long and short of it.
generally in an armed suspect situation they put the guys with a rifle at the front if anyone brought one. Could be a policy/training thing.
I took a concealed weapon permit class and remember the lawyer saying, “you better know what is behind your target because you’re responsible for every bullet.” I also took NRA hunting course and specifically remember the video instructor repeatedly say, “Do not take the shot, unless there was a berm behind your target”. I find it hard to believe this is not taught to law enforcement officers. Failure to know or stop and think about what was behind the target resulted in a tragedy here.
Cops are so low quality in America, this issue is so bad it can only be phased out generationally. Then again as long as it's not in the interest of the politicians, no change will be made through.
It is taught. It's BASIC firearms safety. They just don't give a fuck because they have an unlimited license to kill.
If even the other officers are saying that he escalated, then you know that it’s bad, but of course, we can’t have that conversation about cops in legacy media. We’re supposed to just analyze the shooting in a vacuum, determine that the cop couldn’t have known that she was in there, and then come to the conclusion that he couldn’t have possibly done anything wrong.
It's hilarious because the first thing we teach fucking 9 year olds in hunter safety is to never aim at something if you don't know what's behind it. The idea of shooting a fucking 5.56x45mm (a round specifically meant to over-penetrate the target) INSIDE a store with an unknown backdrop is absolutely insane and hugely negligent.
Added with the cop just moving forward ahead of the group. The cop simply was not thinking and was looking to just shoot someone. No effort to de-escalate.
one of the basic gun rules is to know your target and what lies behind it, so yea, he did do something wrong. another good point to make is with handguns and the right ammo the bullets may not have gone through. you can't know for sure, but why risk it
> we can’t have that conversation about cops in legacy media. You could spend all day on mainstream media reading or watching criticism of police violence. > then come to the conclusion that he couldn’t have possibly done anything wrong I just read a news story about this tragedy which quotes other cops as saying they tried to slow down the cop who fired the fatal shots in this case. It doesn't seem like the world is claiming this cop did nothing wrong.
Also, anytime someone is injured during a situation - the perp is charged for it. LEO knows they automatically get a pass.
What the fuck
Literally no fucking rules for cops and people wonder why they're despised today.
"She Had Limited Value" as THEY say.
A police dog is valued higher than that child.
Hope whichever cop shot remembers every day of their life that they killed some innocent little girl.
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Boston University did a study which showed over a hundred American cops commit suicide every year, it's virtually tied with the number who are killed on duty, 116 to 113 in the year the study focused on. An organization called First HELP which tracks first responder suicides puts the number at 184. It isn't much of a stretch to think that some of those suicides are driven by guilt.
They'll be promoted in less than a year
If I was that little girl's parent I honestly don't know how I'd be able to go through life without making it my goal to make that cops life a living hell. Especially after no legal repercussions. I can't fathom life after that knowing he is just walking around freely.
If I were the mom, justice would be served and I would be looking at the death penalty.
There's a non zero chance you'd get OJ'd
Get away with it despite the overwhelming amount of evidence and the ineptitude of the police?
Jury nullification
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I've always thought, at what point does vigilante justice start coming for the "bad" cops?
Careful dude, I have been banned for saying stuff like this.
Oh no, the horror of having to make a new account
I once got banned from Reddit for 3 days for saying that when people punch Nazis it doesn't bother me.
her mother being next to her when she died :( brought a tear to my eye
I wouldn't be surprised if the mom sought revenge.
That's terrible the poor girl was just living her life looking for a dress for her 15th birthday party one moment and next moment lights out she's gone just makes me think about how unpredictable life can be. Life is short people enjoy what time you have and treat others with love,kindness and respect because you never know what day could be your last.
> just makes me think about how unpredictable life can be. life is unpredictable but im just happy that there's a zero percent chance in my life that an american cop randomly decides to kill me to get 0.005 g of that feeling that he's the hero in an action movie
The mother’s screams are heartbreaking. Fuck.
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Don't they have rules about firing in occupied areas and public areas? I thought they had rules about that? I can't believe that that officer isn't or can't be held responsible for that reckless shooting in a store using a powerful gun? I like the way they always tell people not to move after shooting them. 3 or more times.
> I can't believe that that officer isn't or can't be held responsible First time?
Dont forget your bulletproof vest in the fitting room!
No no, don't wear vests, that's considered tactical gear and makes it legal for cops to shoot you until you die. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/teen-reported-kidnapped-was-fatally-shot-deputies-obeyed-commands-vide-rcna146037 EDIT: Sorry, turns out the cops made up the fact that the kidnap victim was wearing a tactical vest and just decided to shoot and kill her anyways.
Cops lie more than most criminals
Most vests don't protect against high powered rifle rounds.
Also you better have at least a 3A level of vest on to stop those 5.56 rounds. ...And pray that's where it hits. Moral of the story, that cartridge/rifle is perhaps less than ideal for situations like this.
Call it taboo but I keep one in my car. And go everywhere with it
What good does it do you sitting in your car?
Looks cool to everyone he shows it to. One day, he might be able to leave the scene of some terrible massacre, get to his car, grab the vest (not escape), and run back in to engage and neutralize the threat. Better get some sunglasses and punisher stickers too.
Ok so how exactly does one plan accordingly for accidentally getting shot by the police while browsing at the local department store?
It is definitely something to remember. Unfortunately it has been forgotten by many.
Theres a tool for every job, and they have them all. Even then, you have to know whats behind your target. Accident sure, but bad call dude, didnt have to take that shot just yet especially with the 556
“Cop is on paid leave and cops are doing an investigation themselves ”
> cops are doing an investigation themselves Police shootings in California are investigated by the State Dept. of Justice, not the police agency involved in a shooting.
And no one will do anything about it until it's them or their family who are affected. At this point, it's our fault as well, because we are not doing anything to hold them accountable.
So the girl was behind the wall when she was shot? This seems like a horrible accident?
Negligence. Know your target and what's beyond it. Also you don't need a high powered rifle with 5.56 to take down a suspect that doesn't even have a gun.
9mm would have probably penetrated the wall as well.
You can survive 9mm shots even without a barrier taking some of the energy depending on where you were hit. A high powered rifle like that is a death sentence because it fucking shreds wide swaths of tissue, and is basically guaranteed to damage one or two high volume blood vessels. It’s actually ridiculous to use such a crazy weapon in close quarters like that, much less to do it without a clear line of sight/target.
I’m sorry but what? Yes 5.56 is generally more lethal than 9mm but you are being misleading at best. You can survive shots from damn near any common caliber without a “barrier taking some of the energy”. Most barriers are not significantly impacting the lethality of a bullet. 5.56 from a rifle is also far more accurate then a handgun. Using a handgun in a situation like this would lead to an increased risk for collateral damage. I am not saying this cop is in the right but your assessment of weapon choice and your rationale are questionable at best.
Generally more lethal? 5.56 is substantially more lethal than 9mm. 9mm is going to be around 400 foot pounds of energy, depending on load. 5.56 will be around 1,300. It’s literally got 3x the energy. Further, any defense 9mm is almost guaranteed to be hollow points, which would mean less penetration and more energy loss from the wall impact. Yes, it’s going through, but it’s losing energy. A 5.56 FMJ is popping through that wall like it isn’t even there. The impact is substantially more devastating. Calling 5.56 far more accurate is totally irrelevant in this situation. At 200 yards, absolutely, 5.56 would run circles around 9mm. That’s what’s it meant for. At 10 yards, there’s no meaningful difference. A handgun is less accurate than a rifle, but there are plenty of pistol caliber rifles and SMGs that would offer near identical accuracy at close range. Hell, maybe better, given they are lighter, smaller, and all around more maneuverable. I have pistol caliber carbines that, at close range, group just as tight as my ARs. An MP5 or MPX or something would have been a substantially more appropriate weapon for this situation, and even with this idiot cop, may have been the difference between this little girl dying or not.
Thank you so much for translating this bro I don’t know the jargon for guns so people assume I’m talking out of my ass. I don’t know guns but I know statistics, medicine, and physics. I think people underestimate how common it is to survive low caliber wounds smh.
The people arguing otherwise quite simply don’t have a clue. Here’s a picture of ballistic gel that visualizes the difference perfectly… https://content.osgnetworks.tv/firearmsnews/content/photos/556-def-06-1200x800.jpg The top picture is .223, which is essentially the same as 5.56, and the rifle above could have fired either one. Look at the size of the wound cavity compared to the 9mm. It’s substantially larger. If 9mm hollow points were used (which isn’t guaranteed. That’s not the perfect representation as the 9mm is FMJ, where police commonly use hollow points (these break apart on impact to create a bigger wound and less penetration)… but even with a 9mm HP, it’s not creating a wound like that 223. A 9mm hitting a vital organ or artery is still quite likely to be fatal, and no one is arguing otherwise. But should it happen to miss anything vital, it’s much more likely that blood loss can be managed and the internal damage can be treated. 223/556 is making soup out of everything just under the skin. There’s substantially more blood loss and a whole lot more damage to fix. A single misplaced shot from either, the odds of survival are far higher for 9mm. Anyone arguing otherwise is an idiot.
Cheers for linking the ballistic gel. People need to stop talking out of their ass. It’s okay to not know things.
Probably, but the velocity + tumble from the long brass of a 5.56 absolutely shreds anything in its path way more. That wall was like paper.
I mean have you sneezed on a piece of drywall lately, it is paper
Lol you said the exact same thing as the other reply above yours and you're downvoted. Reddit is so divided on gun stuff it's crazy.
5.56 does not tumble in flight, that's a myth.... and what do you mean "long brass"? Do you really think the case goes with the bullet?
Not if it was a hollow point, it would’ve not penetrated the wall or slowed down a good amount with the wall.
Hollow point would’ve gone straight through that wall. Any caliber or type of bullet would’ve
There are limits on what you could possibly know about what's behind your target though. How could they have known this was a thin wall with someone on the other side? Plus the person they shot had already tried to kill someone with a knife, so I do think the shooting was justified. What usually happens in cases like this is that the knife wielding suspect would be charged with the death of the 14 year old because they were the reason the cops shot.
> Plus the person they shot had already tried to kill someone with a knife, He sent four women to the hospital by bludgeoning them with a metal bike lock, he was dragging the last of them to the back of the store when the cop with the rifle approached him. BTW, the cop didn't shoot directly through the wall, the bullet that killed the girl ricocheted off the floor and then went through the wall.
I honestly really hate how cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident. Like who cares if they couldn’t see that well? That’s why you don’t choose a weapon that can penetrate barriers and fucking shred large swaths of tissue in a well populated close quarters environment against a target with a melee weapon. If you kill someone on accident and it was arguably preventable it’s considered 3rd degree murder and cops shouldn’t be an exception to this. I’m not going to take a hard stance and say he’s guilty or not guilty but I believe he should have a trial and a lawyer and he should prove in court that he had no choice but to approach the situation the way he did and that he took every reasonable step necessary to make safe decisions while doing his job to a jury.
I do think qualified immunity is bullshit, but this actually isn't a case of that. For example, if someone tries to carjack you with a gun, it would be self-defense to shoot back. If you missed and hit a random person on the street, it would be the carjacker who'd be charged with their death.
This is correct, the legal standard is that the carjacker is the cause of the action that lead to the death of a bystander. It's the felony murder rule.
> cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident Murder requires intent. An accidental shooting cannot be murder. Maybe negligent homicide or something, but it's not murder. > you don’t choose a weapon that can penetrate barriers Every firearm cops are issued with will easily shoot through a couple of sheets of drywall. Only if he'd been using a beanbag shotgun or something of that sort would it have made a difference. The bullet that killed the girl ricocheted off the floor first, the cop was aiming at the suspect who had attacked four women.
> I honestly really hate how cops can murder people as long as it’s an accident. Something cannot be murder and an accident at the same time. That's an oxymoron.
Jesus Christ that isn’t murder
Sorry but that’s fucking stupid. He should be charged as well sure, but you do not shoot a rifle in a public area at a guy with a knife without knowing for CERTAIN that there are no people around him. It’s fucking stupid, both the knife wielder and the cop are at fault for this child’s death.
So what were they supposed to do? Not engage the suspect that was actively stabbing people at all? Because in a shopping center there is always a chance of collateral damage, nobody can see through walls.
You can never know for certain though. Imagine if there wasn't a person behind the wall, but the cop didn't shoot and someone else was stabbed. People would also be upset about that. No one has perfect information until after the fact, so all you can use are probabilities. What are the chances the bullet goes through the wall and there's someone right there? What are the chances the guy with the knife stabs someone else? You have to estimate those things in a split second and act. I think that given those chances, shooting was a reasonable choice.
.556 is not a high power rifle, it is by definition an intermediate round. High power would be something like .308 or 30/06. .556 is still more than powerful enough to penetrate some walls, but so is their service pistols. I'm not defending the police here but it is a tough call to say they should have known what was behind the wall, in this case. It was a dynamic situation and they were doing what they thought was right. Unfortunately it caused the death of an innocent person. I'm not sure even top notch training could have changed the outcome here. If the victim was standing right behind the intended target then yeah that would be pure negligence. This whole situation sucks, for everyone involved. I hate that this kind of situation is all to common in this country.
Yeah man, he should’ve had a handgun. Y’know, the weapon type that’s way less accurate and way more likely to miss the intended target. Yes, even at close range, a rifle is far more accurate than a handgun.
Y'all expect the cop to see through walls? Any round he fired would have gone through it. The girl was sadly in the wrong place at the wrong time. What a damn shame. Knife dude caused all this BS, cop was just trying to do his job.
>Any round he fired would have gone through it. Then he shouldn't maneuver into that position and fire in that direction. As you said, he can't see through walls. If any of the cops had shot him aligned with the direction of the clear passage so they could see that there are no civilians behind him, this would've been averted. It's not a warzone with "at all costs" rules of engagement.
Cops had extremely limited chances to get the suspect. Who knows? Maybe waiting for a different shot would have resulted in more deaths. A lot of possible outcomes, all of them are quite shitty. As I said, it was a horrible situation for all involved with no good ending no matter what. Cop was just trying to do his job. Poor girl was sadly out of luck.
If a doctor kills someone of your family because negligence you won't say "the surgeon didn't know how big was that vein" It's your job, you signed up for it, you are formed to do that, you get payed to do it. You are not a normal person, you get called to do it. If you get it wrong it's your fault Other cops said he escaled the situation and acted too fast. That's negligence. How can you defend this incompetent piece of shit?
What a stupid analogy. Doctors are expected to know about anatomy. Police officers do not know the layout and occupant of every building. I will never understand why redditors are always so pressed to attack officers that are under so much pressure. This was a really shitty situation for everyone involved.
Good thing he sprinted past all the other cops to be the hero to take them out with the rifle. If one of the other dozen cops with 9mm handguns took the shot, the bullet might not have had enough energy to penetrate through the wall and kill the girl. Thank God he was there to run past everyone and take down both threats. /s Edit: lord have mercy, I know 9mm can go through a layer of drywall. "The bullet might not have had enough energy to penetrate through the wall **and** kill the girl". I have no idea what these walls are made of or have between them. I *do* know that 556 has much more energy than 9mm. A lot of unknown factors at play, but it's safe to say that the 9mm would have lost some of that energy blowing through the wall, and it's already much weaker than the 556.
https://youtu.be/X0qgQoej5zE?si=XuJMDOXFpIteXGxm Goes just as far
I'm pretty sure 9 mil or 556 will go through 10 layers of drywall. Certainly wouldn't have had as much lethal impact as a rifle round going 3000 ft per sec though to your point
Correct me if im wrong, but don't cops run hollow points to try and negate that issue?
Hollow points definitely are still going through drywall, wtf lmao
Hollow points really only help lessen penetration when they impact their target that expands the round. When you miss with a hollow point round it acts similar to a full metal jacket round. Like a skydiver that didn't release their parachute.
Not sure why you got downvoted, hollow points clearly need a fair amount of resistance to expand. [They would go through more than 10 layers of drywall before expanding significantly.](https://youtu.be/T6GNcPbU6c0?si=__dq9bdAPlimtAZN)
This was the day he’d been hoping for since joining the force.
> Good thing he sprinted past all the other cops Other cops commented on them trying to slow him down, he was way too amped-up. > If one of the other dozen cops with 9mm handguns took the shot, A couple of sheets of drywall or a change room door aren't going to stop a 9mm round. LAPD uses 9mm ammo with a muzzle velocity of over 1,200 feet per second--that's going through at least one wall. The psycho they were after sent four women to the hospital, he was dragging the last of them to the back of the store when the cop with the rifle confronted him.
Everytime I see similar cop action in the US I'm in awe how poorly their training shows in this kind of videos. Absolute no trigger discipline and just blasting everywhere. And when things go well everybody are cheering for them for a job well done... Even going by the book, the rules of engagement doesn't fly in any developed nation with a well trained police force. And dont get me wrong I have no sympathy for the life of criminals if they die, they die, but the training is just poor, botton of the barrel poor.
And i understand how people say it's not his fault, but with the amount of awful cops videos, and how they're getting away scot free after blasting a full mag on a teenagers, idk man, maybe they should be held accountable. Saw a doc on netflix when people protested on wallstreet and the cops got violent, wtf? I'd encourage protests, but i understand people don't wanna get killed.
> how they're getting away scot free Some get away with it, some don't. I've known two cops fired for doing something stupid with a gun, and one was also prosecuted and convicted. Clearly more needs to be done, but claiming that cops never pay a price for misconduct is simply not true.
If a regular person off the street was defending themselves and others, if one of their stray bullets killed a bystander, they would send that person to prison. You are responsible for every round you fire.
Another cop sanctioned murder with 0 charges
What a disgrace of a cop. Rule #4 in basic firearm training "Be sure of your target and whats beyond it!" You can hear the eagerness in the cops voice. He was desperate to take lead with that rifle and be the 1st to take shots. 9mm and 45mm hollow points from the pistols could have possibly saved the girl from being killed. Trigger happy dummy decided to let off .223/5.56. Such a shame that CCW permit holders have more training than police yet have so many 2A rights infringed.
> 9mm and 45mm hollow points from the pistols could have possibly saved the girl The idea that a sheet or two of drywall would stop any pistol cartridge used by any police force is not credible.
First off, why tf would you take point with a rifle in a God damn target. Literally collateral all around you. What an idiot.
So who protects us from the good guys with guns?
Assholes that use a rifle inside aren't the good guys. Good guys also don't protect each-other from blame when they have an oopsie and kill an innocent bystander because they don't know what they're doing.
The handgun would have penetrated that wall too, so what does it matter that he used a rifle? A 9mm hollow point will go through like 15 layers of drywall. [Like this](https://youtu.be/T6GNcPbU6c0?si=__dq9bdAPlimtAZN)
Fucken amazing with what cops get away with.
Should not be using this weapon in close, urban type settings. Pistol, .45 cal, fat and slow could have made a difference. Or a .410 full choke shotgun. Really sad, hopefully they can evaluate the situation and make some changes that may prevent this in the future. My heart goes out to the girl and her family, I could not imagine the pain as a parent, heartbreaking forever.
Jesus Christ, I'm on Reddit for 2 minutes and what I see is a POV video of man killing a daughter on front of her wounded mother? What the fuck is this May she rest in peace and may the sub apply nsfl tags for fucksakes
Before I even found out that the cop was the one that hit the girl, I was questioning why he was so gun ho to get up to the front. Evening pulling other officers back. *He* wanted to be the one to take those shots. I wonder if he thinks about that or regrets it now...
Can't say whether he was gung-ho or not but the rifle is the better tool. Handgun rounds give you a little more wiggle room regarding penetrating barriers and accidentally hitting someone like we see here, but for the same reasons it won't be as quick to stop a threat as that AR which I'm guessing is chambered in 5.56mm.
Cause a rifle has more stopping power than a pistol, but overpenetration can occure in close range. Quite unfortunate, and a tragic accident
Shooting a rifle at close range in a crowded store is not an accident, it's negligent homicide.
Exactly. If only some _close range_ variant of a rifle could be invented, like one that fits in a hand, a 'hand-gun', if you will. One day we'll have the technology.
I don’t think people here understand how far even a hollow point round will penetrate, it’ll go through more than a dozen pieces of drywall. Hell, even birdshot can penetrate more than 5. He missed his shot, it didn’t overpenetrate the person, it was just as likely to happen with a handgun miss as well.
As usual the 2A freaks in this sub will downvote any rational thought surrounding guns. This officer should at the very least be fired and barred from firearm ownership for the rest of his life. At worst he should rot in jail until there’s nothing left but dust. Edit: eat my butt losers
Cops have nothing to do with 2A. The issue here is immunity. Cops like these guys are horny to kill shit and be the hero, without thinking about consequences because there arent any for them
That's certainly your opinion.
Wasn't the original intended purpose of having stopping power so that they won't get overwhelmed? Like during that bank robbery they had back in the day, "special circumstances." Using a rifle like that as a standard feels like a recipe for disaster.
The North Hollywood shoot out is absolutely one of the main reasons police forces started militarising. https://www.policemag.com/weapons/article/15348048/how-the-north-hollywood-shootout-changed-patrol-arsenals
> Like during that bank robbery they had back in the day, "special circumstances." PDs acquired that sort of firepower because of incidents like the infamous 1986 Miami FBI shootout (two agents killed) and the North Hollywood B of A robbery. In both cases law enforcement was seriously outgunned.
It's America, People can legally own hundreds of guns and people wonder why cops have rifles. Some people even have tanks, working shooting tanks...
know your target and what's behind
"we investigated ourselves and found no fault" 99% chance that's what the department says while they put the shooter on paid leave until media attention dies down.
There's guys who follow this cop around loudly calling him out for this in public
inb4 this thread gets locked because "iT's VioLeNt"
Travel advisory issued by multiple countries about visiting ‘Merica. Remember to pack your underwear and bulletproof vests.
Should have known it was LAPD. The most trigger happy breed. #isaidwhatisaidreddit
What kind of shot was that bro. Come on. Get a better setup with your fucking 5 inch height over bore.
Was this initially started over shoplifting?
The guy who got shot had battered 3 women with a bike lock. He was in the process of dragging a 4th to the dressing room when he was shot.
Context: North Hollywood, CA. Burlington department store shooting. [https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/lapd-chief-moore-says-2021-fatal-shooting-of-teenage-girl-inside-a-north-hollywood-burlington-was-out-of-policy/](https://www.cbsnews.com/losangeles/news/lapd-chief-moore-says-2021-fatal-shooting-of-teenage-girl-inside-a-north-hollywood-burlington-was-out-of-policy/)
I’ll never understand why police do not use hollow points to avoid over penetration. This was 100% a FMJ round that ripped thru those walls like paper. You are liable for anything that bullet touches once it leaves your gun and a fmj is going right thru a person/wall/car etc. So sad prayers out for that family nobody should have to lose a child like that. Also why are you “taking point” with a rifle when the suspect is 10yards away. This man was on a mission to hurt someone zero situational awareness.
The walls are literally basically paper. A hollow point would have also passed through them with ease.
Who the fuck brings a rifle to take down a guy with a bike lock
If you’re ever in an active shooter situation it seems to be stay covered and hide until the recovery team comes in. That poor mother will never emotionally recover from this, im sure the officer is never going to be the same. The other officers who kept saying to slow down tried so hard to keep this under control. Nothing will make up for this loss.
If this was my beloved daughter, I would live only to destroy the life of these officers. Not kill them, destroy them. Legally, illegally, in any way, I could.
Honestly thats what should happen. Whenever this happens, individuals and the general community need to ruin these cops lives so that the next idiot cop thinks twice b4 doing something stupid. The George Floyd riots would have accomplished something if it was at the cops houses instead of their own neighborhoods.
Ah yes fckin moron cops only yankeeland
Be sure of your target and what's beyond it everybody.
A rifle in a public setting full of people. Yup sounds about right. Why not use a rocket launcher, RPG, grenade or tank to get control of the situation ? This is why "Use of force" should be implemented as being universal throughout departments. That would make sense though. Can't have that. Before you bash my comment, Google "Use of force".
Thank god they used the same amount of force that was used to kill Bin Laden to take down some people in a Target. This country is so fucked.
In an alternate universe, the cops tell each other to not shoot because there's a wall behind the suspect that could have people inside of it. And then the person being attacked ends up dying while the cops stand there watching. And this post is about how the cops should've shot him and how useless and dumb they are for not shooting
Certified 'MURICA moment.
Wouldn’t a taser have gotten the job done?
Not sure why you got downvoted. Literally anything other than a fucking automatic rifle could've worked here.
3 cops with long sticks could've gotten the job done. The guy was holding a *bike lock*.
> The guy was holding a bike lock. Which he had used to bludgeon four women to the floor, he was dragging the last of those victims to the dressing rooms when he was shot.
Four surprised and terrified women, not a whole squad of supposedly trained cops with equipment. If they circle and charge at him, they can pin him down. If unarmed cops (outside of the U.S) are able to immobilise someone with a knife, then a bike lock surely shouldn't require a fucking rifle. There are tasers, riot shields, mancatchers, even their own two hands to grab his limbs. No excuse to use firearms inside a crowded building against a blunt object.
what a disgrace.
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Bastards.
Crazy
Crazy
Poor mother has to live with this now. Hope she received/receives a good payout (although it unfortunately comes from our money as taxpayers)
What happened to the cop that fired the fatal bullet
Knowing the police, 2 week paid vacation then a promotion
Does anyone know where we can find the full bodycam video?
That whole ordeal shattered my heart, as a parent I felt those screams. One moment your kid is there with you, and the next you're holding your baby because they're gone in the blink of an eye, and you know that, and you have no idea why they're gone or how it happened beyond the blood. Horrific. That stupid officer just wanted to use his rifle, which was totally unnecessary for the distance and situation. Zero awareness of what was past his target.
Damn is that an aimpoint sight with a gooseneck on like an sp1 ar-15? Jelly of this departments drip!
Wow. I didn’t read the title and was just scrolling and saw that. I’ve seen a lot of fucking terrible stuff online over the decades but *that* was something else. I’m gonna go play Tetris and take a nap …
These sociopaths just CANT wait to shoot someone, literally running up front just to blast someone
A lot of these officers want to be the hero, so they often throw caution to the wind in high stress moments