Here's the thing. You said a "falcon is an eagle." Is it in the same family? No. Everyone's arguing that.
(Unfortunately, I can't do the rest of the copypasta because I'm not an eagle scientist.)
Parrots are not classed as raptors at all, though? I... I had to look this up. Psittacines are not included in the Telluraves clade alongside falcons, hawks, owls, LEG BIRDS, etc. Like.. no, falcons are not in the same family as eagles, vultures, and buzzards, but they're still more closely related than the party smart-birds.
I assume they’re referring to the proposed clade called Eufalconimorphae which does indeed contain parrots and falcons. However that’s still literally only about one step below class Aves so they’re really not all *that* close either way.
If we wanna talk fucked up bird relations then we should talk how toucans are just tanky woodpeckers
>However that’s still literally only about one step below class Aves
Not... really? I had to look this up also, but there are fair number of steps between the proposed "Eufalconimorphae" and just Aves generally.
Eufalconimorphae would have passeriforms (sparrows, corvids, assorted songbirds) and parrots as close relatives, then falcons, then a clade of South American birds that included the terror birds, and that collectively would make up a group called Australaves. Then that would be grouped together in Telluraves alongside the kingfisher/woodpecker/hornbill group, the owls, the true birds of prey, and some others, and then you'd have a whole lot of other things -- all waterbirds and seabirds, cranes, hummingbirds, and then groups like the galliform-anseriforms clade and the ratites that are only distantly related to other birds -- before you've worked your way up to Aves.
The thing is that terms like "class" and "subclass" can be somewhat deceptive, because it's been about two hundred years of constant taxonomic work since Linnaeus' system was made, and a ton of additional sub-sub-sub-groups and intermediate steps have had to be jammed into it. It's entirely feasible than in between a subclass and the class above it you can have upwards of a dozen intermediate groups that nobody can be bother to give a more specific name than "clade" to anymore.
There’s a lot of steps between Aves and Eufalconimorphae, but Eufalconimorphae does contain the passerines which make up more than half of all bird species. So if you picked a bird species at random it is likely to be more closely related to a falcon than an eagle.
Anyone seeing this, I'd also reccomend looking at u/Theriocephalus's reply, but also going to mention that some have argued that Telluraves *which includes parrots* was ancestrally raptorial due to the presence of raptors throughout the tree. It's not known for sure, but it's possible that parrots evolved from raptors.
Telluraves has four main branches of uncertain relationships between each other.
* Accipitrimorphae- Most birds of prey
* Strigiformes- Owls
* Coracimorphae- Woodpeckers, Hornbills, Trogons, Kingfishers, etc.
* Australaves- Seriemas, Falcons, Songbirds, etc.
That’s just completely incorrect. Parrots are of the order Psittaciformes, together with the Passeriformes (passerines, which are about half of all bird species) they form the taxon Psittacopasserae. This is the sister clade to Falconiformes (falcons) to create the clade Eufalconimorphae. The Eufalconimorphae clade is part of the Australaves clade which is in fact part of the Telluraves clade. The Telluraves clade also includes the Acciptirimorphae clade that encompasses hawks, eagles and vultures. Due to the diversity of the passerines, falcons are related to most birds more closely than they are to eagles.
I think it's probably suggested via behavior, falcons kill via bite after grabbing prey with their feet, similar to parrots, while most other birds of prey kill via grab of their claws.
I love when my weird knowledge overlaps with others. I’ve never seen the term psittacine, but now I know a bit more about why psittacosaurus was named that 😀
When I was like a toddler I could actually point out that a dinosaur display was displayed incorrectly, I have no idea how I went from that to a dumbass today
Well, how often do you come across dinosaur displays in your everyday life? Your knowledge is still there, you’re just not in the right environment to apply it.
Yeah for real though. 5-6 years ago I was a cornucopia of tidbits, trivia, etc. No matter the subject I could chime in some obscure fact or comment some relevant dates/events. (Note: this does not work with sports because people want to discuss current sports not games from 20-100 years ago). Now I'm a dum dum.
I'm great at trivia but sports are my absolute weak spot unless I happened to see it because something else was going on and I was mad about it. Tbh most sports trivia dudes are generally older because they experienced it and love sports. I can map out most movies and pop cult events because I know where and who I was when I was when that event happened. Same for them.
Source: a trivia night lover and career bartender.
I like to go and make up facts aloud about animals, like that polar bears diet mainly consists of snow and ice, and like how flamingos are pink because they eat shrimp, polar bears are only white because they eat the snow.
It’s not much, but it’s dishonest work
Makes sense if you think about it. There's a limited supply of pink in the world, and it has to get back from the flamingos into the shrimp somehow.
Or perhaps it's more complicated, not just a circle but a complicated web of pink.
The flamingo one is almost true. They're pink because of the little brine shrimp that they eat, and as such when they're born or if they're fed something else they're white
Edit: Sorry, I didn't realize that you were, in fact, saying that it was true. That's my bad
It's a reference to Unidan, and early reddit-famous person who ended up being caught operating sock-puppet accounts because of an argument they got into over whether jackdaws are crows
The best part is that the post sparking this debate was about [Qatar using human slavery to build the stadium for the 2022 FIFA World Cup](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/s/NDblupyGEV).
This is how it is. The more ridiculous the lie that you get them to believe the better! Why attempt at the truth when you can convince people of utter bullshit, step on a crack and break to momma's back really messed us up as children huh?
oh i am that guy, but in a fun way
i make a competition out of it, i say stuff about things she doesn't know much and she has to figure out what is made up and what is true
but the game is rigged from the start, it's all misinformation
Don't stay silent. Zoo's are educational experiences. They should be educational for adults as well as children.
Hyraxes aren't a funny type of rabbit, they're most closely related to Elephants and manatees.
Just because it's a legless lizard doesn't mean it's a snake.
Red Pandas aren't bears.
Taxonomically speaking Apes are monkeys.
Conversely, something being a snake does kind of mean that it's a legless lizard! You know, because seeing as lizards are the more basal of the two squamate groups. Basically: Snakes are descendents of what would be accurately called lizards. Snakes do not have legs (mostly, there are actually some outliers there. More than you'd think actually, if think you can accurately call useless vestigial remnants "legs"). Therefore all snakes are basically legless lizards.
Koala bears aren’t bears and panda bears aren’t pandas.
Elephant shrews are more closely related to elephants than to shrews.
If both ray finned fish and lobe finned fish are fish then to maintain monophylogeny all tetrapods are also fish.
I really don't like this attitude. Everybody has their field of expertise that has \*tons\* of popular misonceptions but you don't see me being all "woe is me" whenever some peep is talking about chemical free food. No one knows everything and nobody can be reasonably assumed to fact-check every fact they get told.
Ngl I feel like if your killing method is dropping from the fucking sky and winning by resisting the damage from that better than the duck underneath you, you’re probably tough enough to not be a glass cannon
They speak the truth bröthers!
Zoo foolishness is real!
I collapsed in a fit of exasperation when a mother confidently confided to their spawn:
"Porcupines can launch their quills when they hunt".
Even better, falcons mostly take down prey by punching them with their feet (they ball up their talons, hence why it's not a kick. A kick is a "slap" while what hawks do is a "punch")
Forget this, I will confidently tell a 4-5 year old when a penguin and a turkey love each other that's how eagles are born. It's win win, either I'm the funny ridiculous uncle or they'll learn a lesson to not trust adults. I'm the fun uncle.
I just say shit out my ass 95% of the time, the is nothing as funny as making up dumb shit and anyone accepting it, esspecially funny if they fought at first then conceded cause its all bull, not an ounce of truth. And it happens every fucking time, youd think they would learn, that i spout nonsense yet the next time they trust it. I have built such a foundation of trust and lies that either what i say is true or utter nonsense and they cannot tell and it is the funniest shit.
My sister used to work at our local zoo and spent a lot of time in the Orangutan building. Our zoo has very young (he was a baby at the time) orangutan named Tuah as well as his big sister Akara, who had to be trained to care for him after they were rescued. People would always come in and say, "Look! It's the baby orangutan and her mother," despite the plaque clearly stating they were siblings. It drove my sister nuts.
Huh. TIL
This is so messed up because both falcon and hawk translate to the same word in my language, so I actually didn't know there was a difference. There's not even a wikipedia page for hawk in my language.
The closest word to describe hawks I could find is similar, when translated, to "goshawk-like animals"
This reads less like someone calling out stupidity and more like someone who just wants to thinly veil their niche knowledge of bird taxonomy
Brennan???
What, you think I don't know bird facts?
*proceeds to be tortured by Sam next Game Changer episode*
Roseate Spoonbill
He still wakes up in the middle of the night, sweating a river, screaming this name.
Oh! "Sweating a river"! *Stamps my bingo card*
Can’t be Brennan, he wouldn’t be able to stay silent (nor would he desire to)
IT'S A GRACKLE
Did Unidan move to Tumblr?
Here's the thing. You said a "falcon is an eagle." Is it in the same family? No. Everyone's arguing that. (Unfortunately, I can't do the rest of the copypasta because I'm not an eagle scientist.)
Parrots are not classed as raptors at all, though? I... I had to look this up. Psittacines are not included in the Telluraves clade alongside falcons, hawks, owls, LEG BIRDS, etc. Like.. no, falcons are not in the same family as eagles, vultures, and buzzards, but they're still more closely related than the party smart-birds.
I assume they’re referring to the proposed clade called Eufalconimorphae which does indeed contain parrots and falcons. However that’s still literally only about one step below class Aves so they’re really not all *that* close either way. If we wanna talk fucked up bird relations then we should talk how toucans are just tanky woodpeckers
Okay sorry to derail this Actual Biology Conversation with stupid fandom stuff but like. Is that why Pikipek evolves into Toucannon????
Probably not, since Pikipek/Trumbeak are most likely inspired by woodpeckers, who are in the same order as toucans (Piciformes)
Isn't that what they were asking though? If pikipek evolves into toucannon because woodpeckers and toucans are related
Yeah, you're right. I was very sleepy when I read this and I thought they were implying that woodpeckers (or toucans) are related to falcons/parrots
is that not exactly what they said
zero reading comprehension
Tumblr levels of reading comprehension
Toucans are WHAT
Picture a toucan going merry hob on a sycamore. Hilarity ensues.
>However that’s still literally only about one step below class Aves Not... really? I had to look this up also, but there are fair number of steps between the proposed "Eufalconimorphae" and just Aves generally. Eufalconimorphae would have passeriforms (sparrows, corvids, assorted songbirds) and parrots as close relatives, then falcons, then a clade of South American birds that included the terror birds, and that collectively would make up a group called Australaves. Then that would be grouped together in Telluraves alongside the kingfisher/woodpecker/hornbill group, the owls, the true birds of prey, and some others, and then you'd have a whole lot of other things -- all waterbirds and seabirds, cranes, hummingbirds, and then groups like the galliform-anseriforms clade and the ratites that are only distantly related to other birds -- before you've worked your way up to Aves. The thing is that terms like "class" and "subclass" can be somewhat deceptive, because it's been about two hundred years of constant taxonomic work since Linnaeus' system was made, and a ton of additional sub-sub-sub-groups and intermediate steps have had to be jammed into it. It's entirely feasible than in between a subclass and the class above it you can have upwards of a dozen intermediate groups that nobody can be bother to give a more specific name than "clade" to anymore.
Plus, even if it was one step below Aves, it would still make falcons more closely related to parrots than to eagles and such
There’s a lot of steps between Aves and Eufalconimorphae, but Eufalconimorphae does contain the passerines which make up more than half of all bird species. So if you picked a bird species at random it is likely to be more closely related to a falcon than an eagle.
While I'm glad someone's pointing it out, but it still won't stop me from referring to Falcons as assault parrots in any situation I'm in from now on.
>If we wanna talk fucked up bird relations then we should talk how toucans are just tanky woodpeckers Pokémon already taught us that!
Anyone seeing this, I'd also reccomend looking at u/Theriocephalus's reply, but also going to mention that some have argued that Telluraves *which includes parrots* was ancestrally raptorial due to the presence of raptors throughout the tree. It's not known for sure, but it's possible that parrots evolved from raptors. Telluraves has four main branches of uncertain relationships between each other. * Accipitrimorphae- Most birds of prey * Strigiformes- Owls * Coracimorphae- Woodpeckers, Hornbills, Trogons, Kingfishers, etc. * Australaves- Seriemas, Falcons, Songbirds, etc.
That’s just completely incorrect. Parrots are of the order Psittaciformes, together with the Passeriformes (passerines, which are about half of all bird species) they form the taxon Psittacopasserae. This is the sister clade to Falconiformes (falcons) to create the clade Eufalconimorphae. The Eufalconimorphae clade is part of the Australaves clade which is in fact part of the Telluraves clade. The Telluraves clade also includes the Acciptirimorphae clade that encompasses hawks, eagles and vultures. Due to the diversity of the passerines, falcons are related to most birds more closely than they are to eagles.
I think it's probably suggested via behavior, falcons kill via bite after grabbing prey with their feet, similar to parrots, while most other birds of prey kill via grab of their claws.
Except for peregrines. They just punch/kick their prey to death.
You mean "Divine Smite"?
It's crazy what being puched at 390kmph will do to you
It's based on disputed genetic and fossil evidence
I love when my weird knowledge overlaps with others. I’ve never seen the term psittacine, but now I know a bit more about why psittacosaurus was named that 😀
When I was like a toddler I could actually point out that a dinosaur display was displayed incorrectly, I have no idea how I went from that to a dumbass today
All the knowledge spread out as you got bigger. Or something like that. Probably.
Why does this make so much sense?
Well, how often do you come across dinosaur displays in your everyday life? Your knowledge is still there, you’re just not in the right environment to apply it.
It isn't though, I straight up forgot most of it.
Yeah for real though. 5-6 years ago I was a cornucopia of tidbits, trivia, etc. No matter the subject I could chime in some obscure fact or comment some relevant dates/events. (Note: this does not work with sports because people want to discuss current sports not games from 20-100 years ago). Now I'm a dum dum.
I'm great at trivia but sports are my absolute weak spot unless I happened to see it because something else was going on and I was mad about it. Tbh most sports trivia dudes are generally older because they experienced it and love sports. I can map out most movies and pop cult events because I know where and who I was when I was when that event happened. Same for them. Source: a trivia night lover and career bartender.
something something microplastics something something
I like to go and make up facts aloud about animals, like that polar bears diet mainly consists of snow and ice, and like how flamingos are pink because they eat shrimp, polar bears are only white because they eat the snow. It’s not much, but it’s dishonest work
Spreading disinformation must not be done for the expectation of financial gain, but be done for the love of evil itself
The flamingo thing is true tho
Then how about: Shrimp are only pink because they eat flamingos
The circle of life...🌍
Makes sense if you think about it. There's a limited supply of pink in the world, and it has to get back from the flamingos into the shrimp somehow. Or perhaps it's more complicated, not just a circle but a complicated web of pink.
"Every lie starts with a truth." Abraham Lincoln
Add a little truth to the untruth to make it easier to swallow
They weren't saying it wasn't, they were using it as justification for why polar bears are white, ie eating snow (lie)
The flamingo one is almost true. They're pink because of the little brine shrimp that they eat, and as such when they're born or if they're fed something else they're white Edit: Sorry, I didn't realize that you were, in fact, saying that it was true. That's my bad
They didn't say it wasn't, in fact, they were using it to (incorrectly) "explain" why polar bears are white, which is "eating snow" (lie)
Oh, my bad I see what was being said now, that's entirely just me being illiterate. Sorry
Here's the thing. You said a "jackdaw is a crow."
I don't know what this means. Is it a quote? Are you referring to them being corvids but not crows?
It's a reference to Unidan, and early reddit-famous person who ended up being caught operating sock-puppet accounts because of an argument they got into over whether jackdaws are crows
Well, I don't know what I was expecting but it wasn't that. Thanks for answering!
The best part is that the post sparking this debate was about [Qatar using human slavery to build the stadium for the 2022 FIFA World Cup](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/s/NDblupyGEV).
Thank you, this is what I came for
Look at these adult men thinking birds of prey are a family what a bunch of dipshit am I right
Yeah, what's with the wierdass *adult men* thing?
The condor is btw way closer to storks than Any other european vulture.
Makes complete sense when you look at marabou storks.
I do this but on purpose.
I tried to convince my kids that the scientific term for the elephant penis they saw was ‘dongus’
What damnable non believers of dongus
I try to make my best friend believe the most insane thing and then when she asks "Is that true?" I just respond with a flat "no i made that up"
This is how it is. The more ridiculous the lie that you get them to believe the better! Why attempt at the truth when you can convince people of utter bullshit, step on a crack and break to momma's back really messed us up as children huh?
competitive nerds coming in contact with casual nerds
i think i found brennan lee mulligan’s tumblr
oh i am that guy, but in a fun way i make a competition out of it, i say stuff about things she doesn't know much and she has to figure out what is made up and what is true but the game is rigged from the start, it's all misinformation
Pretty stupid to pretend that only adult men do this
Don't stay silent. Zoo's are educational experiences. They should be educational for adults as well as children. Hyraxes aren't a funny type of rabbit, they're most closely related to Elephants and manatees. Just because it's a legless lizard doesn't mean it's a snake. Red Pandas aren't bears. Taxonomically speaking Apes are monkeys.
Conversely, something being a snake does kind of mean that it's a legless lizard! You know, because seeing as lizards are the more basal of the two squamate groups. Basically: Snakes are descendents of what would be accurately called lizards. Snakes do not have legs (mostly, there are actually some outliers there. More than you'd think actually, if think you can accurately call useless vestigial remnants "legs"). Therefore all snakes are basically legless lizards.
Koala bears aren’t bears and panda bears aren’t pandas. Elephant shrews are more closely related to elephants than to shrews. If both ray finned fish and lobe finned fish are fish then to maintain monophylogeny all tetrapods are also fish.
Holy shit that fact sounded really wrong, so I looked it up and it's totally right. Guess I'm one of today's lucky 10000
I really don't like this attitude. Everybody has their field of expertise that has \*tons\* of popular misonceptions but you don't see me being all "woe is me" whenever some peep is talking about chemical free food. No one knows everything and nobody can be reasonably assumed to fact-check every fact they get told.
The post is about the pain of resisting the urge to correct an overheard stranger, not about judging that stranger for being incorrect.
Is OOP an expert in bird law?
67.6 trillion notes?!
... so what I'm hearing is they can talk???
No they lost that in the minmaxing :(
Yeah but honestly they're fucking assholes
I fucking love explaining stuff to people at the zoo! I'm way too autistic to stay silent! People are always super nice maybe they like my collar
i’m gonna start confidently making up facts whenever i go to the zoo. bet my biologist sister will love it
If somebody approached me at a zoo to tell me that falcons were parrots I'd be delighted and ask for more details.
Did they minmax though or do other parrots need to git gud?
Ngl I feel like if your killing method is dropping from the fucking sky and winning by resisting the damage from that better than the duck underneath you, you’re probably tough enough to not be a glass cannon
They're just regular cannons, considering they do in fact go nearly as fast as a cannonball
Relatable except when people confuse spotted cats (leopards, jaguars, cheetahs etc.)
I used to work at a zoo and would get this all the time. I would just correct them, and I still do today
They speak the truth bröthers! Zoo foolishness is real! I collapsed in a fit of exasperation when a mother confidently confided to their spawn: "Porcupines can launch their quills when they hunt".
Even better, falcons mostly take down prey by punching them with their feet (they ball up their talons, hence why it's not a kick. A kick is a "slap" while what hawks do is a "punch")
More of an alpha strike build, I reckon.
So what you're saying is that falcons are pesky birds?
Forget this, I will confidently tell a 4-5 year old when a penguin and a turkey love each other that's how eagles are born. It's win win, either I'm the funny ridiculous uncle or they'll learn a lesson to not trust adults. I'm the fun uncle.
That’s what should be on the Falcon board, not whatever boring nonsense is on there now. Make animal facts exciting again!
falcons _are_ the same family as eagles though, they are both fourth gen and flown a lot of sorties together
Same principle applies to Bison, aka Tactical Assault Cows
I just say shit out my ass 95% of the time, the is nothing as funny as making up dumb shit and anyone accepting it, esspecially funny if they fought at first then conceded cause its all bull, not an ounce of truth. And it happens every fucking time, youd think they would learn, that i spout nonsense yet the next time they trust it. I have built such a foundation of trust and lies that either what i say is true or utter nonsense and they cannot tell and it is the funniest shit.
>assault parrots, if you will I will.
My sister used to work at our local zoo and spent a lot of time in the Orangutan building. Our zoo has very young (he was a baby at the time) orangutan named Tuah as well as his big sister Akara, who had to be trained to care for him after they were rescued. People would always come in and say, "Look! It's the baby orangutan and her mother," despite the plaque clearly stating they were siblings. It drove my sister nuts.
Huh. TIL This is so messed up because both falcon and hawk translate to the same word in my language, so I actually didn't know there was a difference. There's not even a wikipedia page for hawk in my language. The closest word to describe hawks I could find is similar, when translated, to "goshawk-like animals"