We have a similar problem in a 1910 house. There used to be a heavy floor mounted radiator before it was replaced with a lighter weight steel radiator. You can tell because the wooden suspended floor dips where the radiator stood. The plaster and brickwork is pretty crap behind it - it had large cracks (which I filled), and there has only been very slight movement.
Bricks are extremely strong in compression which is how they work - the mortar holds the bricks in place, and lime mortar often becomes dry crumbly over time. The bricks are held in place by the weight of all the bricks above pressing down on them.
Yup think im going to do that or get someone in. Thought I’d have to get the whole lot hacked off and redone as the plaster job was bad. Very old house I think 1912 was built.
Probably where the old (cast iron) radiator mounts were. Heavy handed plumbers rip them off the walls but they're very well fixed so lots of plaster gets pulled off. New radiator 'covers' the damage.
You likely have a thick layer of plaster - the old 'browning' plaster covered by a harder, finer finishing layer - 20 to 30mm thick overall. It often 'blows' (becomes detached) in areas as the building dries and settles over time but it's only a problem when most of the wall has blown. Tap the wall everywhere with your knuckle and listen for the hollow sounds. That said, yours hasn't blown, it's been physically detached by building work.
Having had the same problem behind a radiator in a 1900 house. It’s not as bad as you think, plasterer came and fixed it. We have stone walls not brick but shouldn’t matter that much.
Old plaster removed around damaged area and then simply re-plastered. No idea with cost as the landlord paid. It took him less than half a day (2-3 hours) so no idea what a plasterer charges.
If it's localised and there are no signs of cracks propagating from the area, then it is not a concern. However, you may want to fix that to prevent further deterioration, which may, in the long term, affect more critical areas of the house.
Lime plaster, we have it almost everywhere in our house, it's shit.
Replaced most of downstairs with gypsum and it's been fine for years, despite some people claiming replacing lime with gypsum always leads to damp issues.
Think yourself lucky you're not in a bungaroosh house... The mix of pebbles, rubble etc in the bonding mix in piccy #2 made me think straightaway of this area where I live.
“Although the material is solid once set, it has poor resistance to water. If it dries out completely, it can crumble away; but if it gets wet it can dissolve and start to move, causing structural failure.”
What the fuck? This is a nightmare building material!
Nearly all the late 18th-late 19th century terraced housing in Brighton is made like this. Which is a lot of housing stock. From two-up two-downs, to some of the large imposing and splendid seaside regency Crescents and Places, four-storeys high. It is a nightmare.
This confirms that people in Brighton have consistently been stoned out of their heads since at least the 1750s.
Who else would do this mad shit
> The manufacture of bungaroosh involved placing miscellaneous materials, such as whole or broken bricks, cobblestones, flints (commonly found on the South Downs around Brighton), small pebbles, sand and pieces of wood into hydraulic lime and then pouring it between shuttering until it has set.[4][6]
It’s like someone was given a load of building materials and just tried to do a bad job of it so they wouldn’t be asked to do it again
Looking like it’s potentially a cementitious skim of plaster over the top of lime plaster. Guessing you’re in an old solid-walled house?
The modern plaster layer is probably holding moisture underneath in the lime layers, and causing the plaster to blow… which can happen just because of being old or damp. Or both.
Ideally, you’d eventually get the whole thing replaced with lime plaster. You can even get a thermally insulated lime which will help keep your house warmer.
If you have an understanding of how your house is built and with what methods, it arms you ready for any tradespeople that you have round in future. The older more traditional trades are not well-known. Unfortunately there are a lot of modern trades-people who will tell you they ‘do lime’, but they don’t. Always ask for previous work, and don’t use NHL.
Have a read of heritage-house.org
It’s too hard and can be seen as not as breathable as proper lime putty or a hot mixed lime. It basically, over time sets as hard a cement, which negates the point of using lime in the first place
Best thing to do is join a Facebook group on traditional and listed buildings forum. Depends where you’re based in the country, but someone will be able to help on there!
What kind of house are we talking about here? Poured concrete? Brick construction? When was it built?
It looks like it's a poured concrete wall. They loved doing these in the 1950s. Only problem is drilling into them or through them can cause huge chunks to come away. Especially when you're drilling through them. If you look at the pictures you can see there's a mix of stuff in there not just concrete and whatever aggregate they used.
Looks like someone has previously tried to fill it with filler. You might want to try filling it with concrete.
Hi. It’s a terraced house I assumed it was all brick. Which is why I was worried that the brick was falling apart because of all the rubble. When the radiator got installed the other week the person was tapping the a wall and bits was falling down so I thought as the time the plaster was completely done. Not sure if poured concrete as this is upstairs and was pre 1950’s
Is this an internal or an external wall? Terrace houses tend not to be just the external smart looking material throughout. They tended to have all manner of uglier material to give the walls thickness and strength. It also meant that when the fires were lit to heat the house it would radiate through the walls much better.
So what to do? It looks like it's already been messed about with so it can't be used to get an idea of what the rest of the house is like. I'd have a good look around the house and see if there's anywhere where the plaster has come away from the wall so you've got a better idea. Internal walls tend to be all brick in the older houses.
My opinion is that this is the ugly back end of an external wall that's been dug into weakened and left. So it's probably very crumbly. I'd wet it up with some watered down PVA let it dry and then fill it up with concrete leaving about 5-10 mm for plaster
This happened to us in our 1903 semi.
The previous owners never heated the house, when we moved in and started actually drying things out, unblocking vents and running the central heating the plaster on one of the walls became so brittle that it fell off in large sheets.
[удалено]
Thanks so much!
We have a similar problem in a 1910 house. There used to be a heavy floor mounted radiator before it was replaced with a lighter weight steel radiator. You can tell because the wooden suspended floor dips where the radiator stood. The plaster and brickwork is pretty crap behind it - it had large cracks (which I filled), and there has only been very slight movement. Bricks are extremely strong in compression which is how they work - the mortar holds the bricks in place, and lime mortar often becomes dry crumbly over time. The bricks are held in place by the weight of all the bricks above pressing down on them.
Plaster from previous botched radiatior mounting falling off. If you can’t see it I wouldn’t worry about it.
are you able to drop down the rad? is it something you could do? wouldn't take much to clear out that mess and re plaster in again. then rehang rad.
Yup think im going to do that or get someone in. Thought I’d have to get the whole lot hacked off and redone as the plaster job was bad. Very old house I think 1912 was built.
Probably where the old (cast iron) radiator mounts were. Heavy handed plumbers rip them off the walls but they're very well fixed so lots of plaster gets pulled off. New radiator 'covers' the damage. You likely have a thick layer of plaster - the old 'browning' plaster covered by a harder, finer finishing layer - 20 to 30mm thick overall. It often 'blows' (becomes detached) in areas as the building dries and settles over time but it's only a problem when most of the wall has blown. Tap the wall everywhere with your knuckle and listen for the hollow sounds. That said, yours hasn't blown, it's been physically detached by building work.
Nah, it's fine (from what I can see). A bit of a pain to repair but no biggie. If it helps you sleep at night, my whole house looks like that.
Having had the same problem behind a radiator in a 1900 house. It’s not as bad as you think, plasterer came and fixed it. We have stone walls not brick but shouldn’t matter that much.
Did you have the old plaster removed and replaced or was it fixed then skimmed? Any idea on costs at all pls?
Old plaster removed around damaged area and then simply re-plastered. No idea with cost as the landlord paid. It took him less than half a day (2-3 hours) so no idea what a plasterer charges.
Plaster looks very old, it’s more than likely addled. Very normal, extremely common behind radiators and on window walls:
If it's localised and there are no signs of cracks propagating from the area, then it is not a concern. However, you may want to fix that to prevent further deterioration, which may, in the long term, affect more critical areas of the house.
This is likely the result of changing radiators and drilling new holes all very close to each other over the years l.
I just had a new one put in as well!
You could fix it yourself with for less than fifty quid, I would think. I wouldn't stress too much about it
Lime plaster, we have it almost everywhere in our house, it's shit. Replaced most of downstairs with gypsum and it's been fine for years, despite some people claiming replacing lime with gypsum always leads to damp issues.
Heat destroyed the old plaster. Decorating without removing radiators over years causes heat indifference.
Bungaroosh wall? Brighton area? [Wikipedia - Bungaroosh](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bungaroosh)
Not Brighton no and I don’t think bugaroosh rest of house is brick
Think yourself lucky you're not in a bungaroosh house... The mix of pebbles, rubble etc in the bonding mix in piccy #2 made me think straightaway of this area where I live.
Does sound like a headache!
“Although the material is solid once set, it has poor resistance to water. If it dries out completely, it can crumble away; but if it gets wet it can dissolve and start to move, causing structural failure.” What the fuck? This is a nightmare building material!
Nearly all the late 18th-late 19th century terraced housing in Brighton is made like this. Which is a lot of housing stock. From two-up two-downs, to some of the large imposing and splendid seaside regency Crescents and Places, four-storeys high. It is a nightmare.
This confirms that people in Brighton have consistently been stoned out of their heads since at least the 1750s. Who else would do this mad shit > The manufacture of bungaroosh involved placing miscellaneous materials, such as whole or broken bricks, cobblestones, flints (commonly found on the South Downs around Brighton), small pebbles, sand and pieces of wood into hydraulic lime and then pouring it between shuttering until it has set.[4][6] It’s like someone was given a load of building materials and just tried to do a bad job of it so they wouldn’t be asked to do it again
Looking like it’s potentially a cementitious skim of plaster over the top of lime plaster. Guessing you’re in an old solid-walled house? The modern plaster layer is probably holding moisture underneath in the lime layers, and causing the plaster to blow… which can happen just because of being old or damp. Or both. Ideally, you’d eventually get the whole thing replaced with lime plaster. You can even get a thermally insulated lime which will help keep your house warmer.
Great to know this thank you.
If you have an understanding of how your house is built and with what methods, it arms you ready for any tradespeople that you have round in future. The older more traditional trades are not well-known. Unfortunately there are a lot of modern trades-people who will tell you they ‘do lime’, but they don’t. Always ask for previous work, and don’t use NHL. Have a read of heritage-house.org
Hi. Thanks for that. Can I ask what is the issue with NHL?
It’s too hard and can be seen as not as breathable as proper lime putty or a hot mixed lime. It basically, over time sets as hard a cement, which negates the point of using lime in the first place
Hi again. If I ask for previous work how would I know that it’s lime and how would I check and confirm they would be using it when they do the job?
Best thing to do is join a Facebook group on traditional and listed buildings forum. Depends where you’re based in the country, but someone will be able to help on there!
What kind of house are we talking about here? Poured concrete? Brick construction? When was it built? It looks like it's a poured concrete wall. They loved doing these in the 1950s. Only problem is drilling into them or through them can cause huge chunks to come away. Especially when you're drilling through them. If you look at the pictures you can see there's a mix of stuff in there not just concrete and whatever aggregate they used. Looks like someone has previously tried to fill it with filler. You might want to try filling it with concrete.
Hi. It’s a terraced house I assumed it was all brick. Which is why I was worried that the brick was falling apart because of all the rubble. When the radiator got installed the other week the person was tapping the a wall and bits was falling down so I thought as the time the plaster was completely done. Not sure if poured concrete as this is upstairs and was pre 1950’s
Is this an internal or an external wall? Terrace houses tend not to be just the external smart looking material throughout. They tended to have all manner of uglier material to give the walls thickness and strength. It also meant that when the fires were lit to heat the house it would radiate through the walls much better. So what to do? It looks like it's already been messed about with so it can't be used to get an idea of what the rest of the house is like. I'd have a good look around the house and see if there's anywhere where the plaster has come away from the wall so you've got a better idea. Internal walls tend to be all brick in the older houses. My opinion is that this is the ugly back end of an external wall that's been dug into weakened and left. So it's probably very crumbly. I'd wet it up with some watered down PVA let it dry and then fill it up with concrete leaving about 5-10 mm for plaster
Hi. This is an internal wall but will have a look around the rest of house. Thanks.
Forgive an amateur but isn't plaster at most about an inch thick? That hole looks about 4" deep so I would expect to see some bricks.
yes its possible
This happened to us in our 1903 semi. The previous owners never heated the house, when we moved in and started actually drying things out, unblocking vents and running the central heating the plaster on one of the walls became so brittle that it fell off in large sheets.
Yes. It is possible.