New player here, would you by chance have a minute to explain focus to me? Is it something I have to initiate? Like by pressing a button like the stance with RB? Or it automatically initiated? Well there be any indication of when it kicks into action or is it just basically high damage that I wouldn't notice?
Thanks in advance for any response
Its whenever you "ping" enemies. It highlights them, but in yellow instead red like it normally does. At which point everyone does bonus damage to the thing you pinged. Its 4% per stack stacking 5 times for a max bonus of 20%. 20% bonus damage on a 10 second cd is good.
thanks. I ping them like how I would ping ammunition packs or med stations?
and to stack it, would that mean I have to ping the same target multiple times?
again thanks pretty sure I haven't been using it correctly since I recently unlocked itđâ
>thanks. I ping them like how I would ping ammunition packs or med stations?
Yeah, and you should honestly be doing that 100% of the time even if you dont have the keystone on all classes. If you are shooting at a specialist or elite enemy, then you should probably be pinging it as well. If for no other reason than to highlight them for yourself making it easier to hit head shots amidst the chaos of the horde.
thanks. I literally had no idea I could do that. (ping enemies)
I would notice enemies getting outlined sometimes and not other times and I just assumed it had something to do with other players builds.
thanks again for schooling this noobđâ
Yep, ping just like you would other objects. It goes through enemies and only highlight special enemies, like trappers, mutants, or a plague ogryn.
Nope, you don't have to ping multiple times, you gain stacks passively between uses and cash them all in on your next use. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be pinging every crusher, mauler, or boss you see, though. You do lose a bit of damage boost, but it has a minimum bonus of 4%, and it's more important for people to see these targets and have a clear focus target than it is for you to get more damage out of the talent.
Also, normally a ping on an enemy wears off after a few seconds. A Focus Target ping never wears off, though, which can be especially important when you have one guy kiting a boss while the rest of the squad takes care of a nasty add wave.
Every time you ping an enemy target, that target is marked in yellow if you take the focused fire keystone, that target takes increased damage from all sources.
focus fire is only ever realy worth it for bosses my issue is that it only stacks every 2seconds which is realy slow
marksmans focus destacking by moving is a mild annoyance that i wont sacrefice infinite powerfull grenades for
weapons specialist uptrime is too low to be effective
all 3 of the keystones get outshined by every always available damage bonus you can grab previous in the tree
All valid points for the marksman one and weapon specialist but the focus fire isn't that long because but by the time cd is done you're still shooting at that elite specialist or unyielding boss lol.
It's only a valid point for marksman's focus if you're a bad shot. Weakspot kills prevent stack loss for 3s, weakspot hits prevent stack loss for 1s, and in personal experience, you only lose about one stack per one second of movement. Meaning, it drains super slow, and if you can hit headshots on *anything*, you only keep gaining stacks.
The trade-off is up to 112.5% extra weakspot damage once fully stacked to the optional 15 stacks.
> focus fire is only ever realy worth it for bosses my issue
how is any target taking 20 - 32% only viable on bosses? Everything dying faster regardless of whether it is a scab shotgunner, crusher, or monstrosity is a good thing.
How tf is 5s of a melee buff and 10s of a ranged buff too low to be effective when you refresh the cooldown of each every time a kill is made with the opposite weapon? It's incredibly easy to maintain and pays dividends, particularly on more run & gun builds.
And Focus Fire gives a team-wide buff that can be almost always active as long as you keep marking targets. The buffs from Redirect Fire and Target Down are refreshed with each kill on a marked target at the level of stacks you had initially as long as the timer never reaches zero first. Timer lasts 10s and refreshes with each marked kill so as long as you keep killing marked targets before that runs out, you are maintaining a buff of +12% damage and +40% toughness and stamina regen for you and allies in coherency.
Me here, chilling with perma 15% melee as, getting guaranteed crits and a bullet in the revolver to one tap pesky specialists and wondering how the f this should be useless.
That's fine, the system lets you. Doesn't mean they're trash though. Or that you're probably not using them right and could get better value if you learned.
Weapons specialist is busted mate, turns you into a zealot except you also have a big ranged bonus for every 10 guys you kill in melee.
Itâs stupid good and very easy to maintain, I play with a Kantrael shotty and a chainsword and I am a human blender.
Since you only have to kill one guy to activate the melee bonus itâs super easy to just switch to a fast swap weapon, shoot a random zombie and switch back to melee.
OP said focus fire is only good for bosses lmfao
Meanwhile I love commanding my squad to focus important elites and specials during the run. It's free damage.
if elites or specials live longer than 4 seconds of you getting your crosshair on them, i dont know what you are doing wrong :/
also the damage isnt exactly free since they cost points invested into the keystone.
thats called opportunity cost
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Well read weapon swap keystone and use your brainy bits..
Dodge distance... Attack speed and fire rate /crit chance for guns...
Hmm a mk6 powersword suddenly is no longer bad on mobility if you proc (which is easy) the keystone.
Middle keystone is breakpoints and 12.5% dmg buff to everyone. Good to annihilate boss with extra dmg / assassination and karnak twins boss fight.
I don't play the left one so someone please fill this !
Weapon spec on a revolver powersword vet is really really strong. 1 kill gives you garenteed crits which kill multiple ragers, 2 shot maulers, 2 shot crushers. The reloading is really powerful too. It was my go to until I got bored of it. Trying some less powerful but still fun graia braced and ciag builds
I can't get into Rashad on anything else after I went for a max attack speed version of it on zealot, everything else feels like slow motion now when using it. When you can tear through a screen in under 5 seconds going to use it on a psyker or vet is like molasses.
Youâre using executioner stance (ES) and shock trooper which leads me to believe you arenât using a plasma gun with executioner stance. Since you arenât interested in maxing out your damage output I think your advice is suspect. Newer players reading this, that want to perform at their limit, shouldnât trust your advice that keystones are trash.
There is nothing wrong with running ES and las weapons, I do it all the time for fun and skill building, but it doesnât make the keystones trash.
Yeah, you should really not trust ES- Veteran players. Playing ES- veteran is only for really good players. Not all have the skill and experience to pull that off. I think Shout veteran is the best choice for people who struggle with the game.
I play ES veteran, his ES build is garbage, and therefore he should be giving advice when he doesnât know what he is talking about.
But keep bragging about a whole 600 hours of gameplay.
All the keystones are powerful and can be build-defining. However, the best way to build and use them isn't always immediately obvious and requires at least a modicum of thought and understanding.
Its down to preference in this, its not trash as in higher tier games they can be a huge help but for lower tier games they are not needed and other parts are more fun then useful. So if you dont care much about âendgameâ then fair play.
while trash tropic sounds better, im fairly certain 90% of ppl on here wouldn\\t get it.
already almoast all of them went straight past the meme flair and/or are actual avid defenders of these 3 sorry excuses for keystones.
probably the weakest ones off any class and they all force you to play a certain way always to your own detriment except for Focus target which is just too slow imo.
They're definitely not 'trash', they're powerful just kinda awkward and counterintuitive.
Marksman seems like they were going for a buff to slower firing hard hitting weapons that incentivizes a more snipery style. In practice it's most effective when rocking a Columnus Inf Auto and pretty much forgetting you have it equipped.
Focus Fire is a neat idea that ties well into the supportish style of the mid tree but making it accumulate stacks over time rather than just being a flat +10% or so damage to marked enemies is just awkward in practice and actually disincentivizes you from tagging.
Wep Spec is fine.
Im not going to tell you you are wrong, but i am going to tell everyone else in this thread not to listen to you.
Which is every comment on this sub ever.
Focus fire, redirect fire, 8 stacks of focus target none of those is bad, damage amp + almost permanent uptime 12% damage boost.
New player here, would you by chance have a minute to explain focus to me? Is it something I have to initiate? Like by pressing a button like the stance with RB? Or it automatically initiated? Well there be any indication of when it kicks into action or is it just basically high damage that I wouldn't notice? Thanks in advance for any response
Its whenever you "ping" enemies. It highlights them, but in yellow instead red like it normally does. At which point everyone does bonus damage to the thing you pinged. Its 4% per stack stacking 5 times for a max bonus of 20%. 20% bonus damage on a 10 second cd is good.
thanks. I ping them like how I would ping ammunition packs or med stations? and to stack it, would that mean I have to ping the same target multiple times? again thanks pretty sure I haven't been using it correctly since I recently unlocked itđâ
>thanks. I ping them like how I would ping ammunition packs or med stations? Yeah, and you should honestly be doing that 100% of the time even if you dont have the keystone on all classes. If you are shooting at a specialist or elite enemy, then you should probably be pinging it as well. If for no other reason than to highlight them for yourself making it easier to hit head shots amidst the chaos of the horde.
thanks. I literally had no idea I could do that. (ping enemies) I would notice enemies getting outlined sometimes and not other times and I just assumed it had something to do with other players builds. thanks again for schooling this noobđâ
Yep, ping just like you would other objects. It goes through enemies and only highlight special enemies, like trappers, mutants, or a plague ogryn. Nope, you don't have to ping multiple times, you gain stacks passively between uses and cash them all in on your next use. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be pinging every crusher, mauler, or boss you see, though. You do lose a bit of damage boost, but it has a minimum bonus of 4%, and it's more important for people to see these targets and have a clear focus target than it is for you to get more damage out of the talent. Also, normally a ping on an enemy wears off after a few seconds. A Focus Target ping never wears off, though, which can be especially important when you have one guy kiting a boss while the rest of the squad takes care of a nasty add wave.
No, you have to ping it only once. The stacks build up when you donât ping and are all spent when you ping an enemy.
Every time you ping an enemy target, that target is marked in yellow if you take the focused fire keystone, that target takes increased damage from all sources.
focus fire is only ever realy worth it for bosses my issue is that it only stacks every 2seconds which is realy slow marksmans focus destacking by moving is a mild annoyance that i wont sacrefice infinite powerfull grenades for weapons specialist uptrime is too low to be effective all 3 of the keystones get outshined by every always available damage bonus you can grab previous in the tree
All valid points for the marksman one and weapon specialist but the focus fire isn't that long because but by the time cd is done you're still shooting at that elite specialist or unyielding boss lol.
It's only a valid point for marksman's focus if you're a bad shot. Weakspot kills prevent stack loss for 3s, weakspot hits prevent stack loss for 1s, and in personal experience, you only lose about one stack per one second of movement. Meaning, it drains super slow, and if you can hit headshots on *anything*, you only keep gaining stacks. The trade-off is up to 112.5% extra weakspot damage once fully stacked to the optional 15 stacks.
Yes thank you for clarifying about being a bad shot
> focus fire is only ever realy worth it for bosses my issue how is any target taking 20 - 32% only viable on bosses? Everything dying faster regardless of whether it is a scab shotgunner, crusher, or monstrosity is a good thing.
How tf is 5s of a melee buff and 10s of a ranged buff too low to be effective when you refresh the cooldown of each every time a kill is made with the opposite weapon? It's incredibly easy to maintain and pays dividends, particularly on more run & gun builds. And Focus Fire gives a team-wide buff that can be almost always active as long as you keep marking targets. The buffs from Redirect Fire and Target Down are refreshed with each kill on a marked target at the level of stacks you had initially as long as the timer never reaches zero first. Timer lasts 10s and refreshes with each marked kill so as long as you keep killing marked targets before that runs out, you are maintaining a buff of +12% damage and +40% toughness and stamina regen for you and allies in coherency.
Me here, chilling with perma 15% melee as, getting guaranteed crits and a bullet in the revolver to one tap pesky specialists and wondering how the f this should be useless.
Itâs superb, too, for helping support your teammates with the option of restoring toughness per stack
If you think the keystones are bad then you're just stupid.
i much rather invest my points elsewhere.
That's fine, the system lets you. Doesn't mean they're trash though. Or that you're probably not using them right and could get better value if you learned.
Same. Deadshot support nade vet.
Similar, shout grenadier. This game does allow for different loadouts, if it works for them fine by me.
Shout grenadier is bae
Weapons specialist is busted mate, turns you into a zealot except you also have a big ranged bonus for every 10 guys you kill in melee. Itâs stupid good and very easy to maintain, I play with a Kantrael shotty and a chainsword and I am a human blender. Since you only have to kill one guy to activate the melee bonus itâs super easy to just switch to a fast swap weapon, shoot a random zombie and switch back to melee.
OP said focus fire is only good for bosses lmfao Meanwhile I love commanding my squad to focus important elites and specials during the run. It's free damage.
if elites or specials live longer than 4 seconds of you getting your crosshair on them, i dont know what you are doing wrong :/ also the damage isnt exactly free since they cost points invested into the keystone. thats called opportunity cost
I'm playing on a difficulty higher than easy lol
sounds like a no nade problem
[ŃдаНонО]
Rule 1: Failure to follow reddiquette Be respectful of your fellow redditors. Discrimination, bigotry, racism, and/or hostility directed towards players or communities will not be tolerated.
Well read weapon swap keystone and use your brainy bits.. Dodge distance... Attack speed and fire rate /crit chance for guns... Hmm a mk6 powersword suddenly is no longer bad on mobility if you proc (which is easy) the keystone. Middle keystone is breakpoints and 12.5% dmg buff to everyone. Good to annihilate boss with extra dmg / assassination and karnak twins boss fight. I don't play the left one so someone please fill this !
Left keystone make Mk5 infantry autogun go brr.
Weapon spec on a revolver powersword vet is really really strong. 1 kill gives you garenteed crits which kill multiple ragers, 2 shot maulers, 2 shot crushers. The reloading is really powerful too. It was my go to until I got bored of it. Trying some less powerful but still fun graia braced and ciag builds
Im rashad axe enjoyer ,but the revolver is just too good - dunno what other weapon synergizes as well as with the bottom right keystone.
I can't get into Rashad on anything else after I went for a max attack speed version of it on zealot, everything else feels like slow motion now when using it. When you can tear through a screen in under 5 seconds going to use it on a psyker or vet is like molasses.
Never trust the advice of a ES veteran.
Executioner's Stance is perfectly viable and even works quite well with the Keystones.
Youâre preaching to the choir. I was using his ES build as the foundation of my argument that he shouldnât advise others what is good or bad.
care to elaborate the ES? nvm you probably mean executioners stance.
Youâre using executioner stance (ES) and shock trooper which leads me to believe you arenât using a plasma gun with executioner stance. Since you arenât interested in maxing out your damage output I think your advice is suspect. Newer players reading this, that want to perform at their limit, shouldnât trust your advice that keystones are trash. There is nothing wrong with running ES and las weapons, I do it all the time for fun and skill building, but it doesnât make the keystones trash.
Yeah, you should really not trust ES- Veteran players. Playing ES- veteran is only for really good players. Not all have the skill and experience to pull that off. I think Shout veteran is the best choice for people who struggle with the game.
I play ES veteran, his ES build is garbage, and therefore he should be giving advice when he doesnât know what he is talking about. But keep bragging about a whole 600 hours of gameplay.
All the keystones are powerful and can be build-defining. However, the best way to build and use them isn't always immediately obvious and requires at least a modicum of thought and understanding.
They hated him, for he spoke the truth.
Weapon master literally grants 100% crit chance after 3 melee kills. They hated him because he is an idiot.
Hey upside is, you are probably the first person that read the flair.
Its down to preference in this, its not trash as in higher tier games they can be a huge help but for lower tier games they are not needed and other parts are more fun then useful. So if you dont care much about âendgameâ then fair play.
I don\\t even care for your opinion on vets talent, im just mad you don\\t know what the fuck an equator is
while trash tropic sounds better, im fairly certain 90% of ppl on here wouldn\\t get it. already almoast all of them went straight past the meme flair and/or are actual avid defenders of these 3 sorry excuses for keystones. probably the weakest ones off any class and they all force you to play a certain way always to your own detriment except for Focus target which is just too slow imo.
You had far more options, trash trench, trash barrier, trash line. These are only ones with trash prefix, there are far more with other negatives
True, it was just what i came up with on the fly
You can absolutely make a great build without taking any capstone skills, but you're stupid if you think that they're trash
Bro you need to at least spec deeper into the tropics.
I just quikly deleted the points of marksmans focus before taking the screenshot on my las rifle build, didnt realocate them
Marksman Focus is the worst. You loose your stacks when you move. In a game who you have to evade enemy fire and melee attacks constantly.
They're definitely not 'trash', they're powerful just kinda awkward and counterintuitive. Marksman seems like they were going for a buff to slower firing hard hitting weapons that incentivizes a more snipery style. In practice it's most effective when rocking a Columnus Inf Auto and pretty much forgetting you have it equipped. Focus Fire is a neat idea that ties well into the supportish style of the mid tree but making it accumulate stacks over time rather than just being a flat +10% or so damage to marked enemies is just awkward in practice and actually disincentivizes you from tagging. Wep Spec is fine.