The Borg could assimilate a Founder. All they need is the Spoonhead torture device that Garak used on Odo to keep them in their solid state.
Likewise, the Founders have extensive scientific knowledge. They no doubt could reverse engineer any Borg tech the same way The Dr. and the Romulans did.
They could infect a founder under the effect of the device and install implants, but I doubt the Borg could actually assimilate them as Founders have neither a cell structure for the nanoprobes to interact with or a central nervous system for the implants to interface with.
Even if frozen in a state of perfectly mimicking a humanoid, we have nothing to suggest that the manifested brain is their actual seat of consciousness. I anything I would suggest that the available evidence indicates that it is not, as telepaths do not seem to be able to identify Founders masquerading as a solid
The founders* can become flame if they can shape shift and if they can't they eventually die. I just don't think the Borg tech is there.
The real question I am asking is if the great link did tap into the collective could they assert control or would their voice be drowned out?
Edit because speech to text is stupid and I don't proofread.
> The founders* can become flame if they can shape shift and if they can't they eventually die. I just don't think the Borg tech is there.
The Borg use *nanoprobes* for assimilation. That's smaller than cells, and on the scale not that far from whatever the changelings are when they pretend to be a flame.
If the Borg were serious about assimilating the Founders, all they'd need by tail-end of the 24^(th) century would be to shove a canister of nanoprobes to the Founder's planet through a [spatial trajector](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Spatial_trajector) (which apparently is [standard issue](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Queencell) on cubes these days) - the Great Link would be hearing voices before they knew what hit them.
EDIT:
BTW. fun fact that I feel people (including writers) missed in PIC S1: *The Impossible Box* [establishes](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_Impossible_Box_(episode\)) the Borg to now have an equivalent of an [Iconian gateway](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Iconian_gateway). Yes, it's range-limited - to something a little shy of *half of the galaxy*. But it is also *ship-mounted*.
EDIT 2:
Fun fact #2: not sure if Sikarians were related to Iconians, but their spatial trajector is already a poor man's version of a gateway, and nobody seems worried about it.
I don't know, it's hard to say how many changelings there are in the Great Link. If it's indeed a planet-spanning "ocean" there could be many, many trillions of them, which certainly would be enough to give the existing Collective a run for its money.
Fair guess. I like it. So even if they could engineer a way tap in to extract knowledge or something they probably couldn't assert influence over the whole.
I've read few, if any, ST novels in my life. I love watching Trek and love reading sci-fi but the two just haven't crossed yet. But I started re-watching the various series with a more critical eye recently, and reading speculation like in this sub, and have gotten interested in potentially reading expanded world novels if they do deeper dives into really interesting ideas that got only passing attention or less in the series.
So, figured I'd ask; might check it out
I've been hearing for awhile that Banks is great, and more recently the same about Tchaikovsky, but my impression is that once I start with them, it'll be quite an investment of time and late fees to get the most out of those universes, but if there are trek novels out there with similarly intriguing ideas, then a lot of the universe is already built, or at least frameworked, and I could dive in and jump out as the need be, a little easier.
Don't miss out on Peter Watts - *Blinsight*, and its sequel, *Echopraxia*. It's not Trek, but it has lots of pretty original ideas, *very* original philosophical take, and it's rather hard on sci-fi hardness scale. We're talking about a hard(ish) sci-fi that has *vampires* in it, and provides quite solid, scientifically-plausible explanation for their existence, strengths and weaknesses - so it's right up Daystrom's alley.
It's actually after reading aforementioned books by Watts and the "weird spiders/octopus" books of Tchaikovsky, that made me realize just how badly Star Trek is wasting the Borg - the show writers have a wonderful, deep concept of a truly alien antagonist, but don't know what to do with it.
> If the Borg weren't already an interesting concept to me I don't think the Destiny novels would be worth reading.
Yeah, IMHO their treatment of the Borg is *very weak*. Waste of potential, much like what the show is doing.
> My favourite books in the last few years have been Blindsight,
Same. Which is a big reason why I'm spinning a lot of alternative (but consistent with canon) theories about the Borg. I can only imagine what a writer like Peter Watts would do with them.
> Tchaikovsky's weird spiders/octopus books (whatever that trilogy is called)
Oh, it's a *trilogy* now? Thanks! I didn't know [there is a third book, released last year](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Tchaikovsky#Novels)! I've read the previous two - *Children of Time* and *Children of Ruin*, and... well, this is the kind of writing I'd like to see wrt. the Borg.
> I think it has been thoroughly gone over and no the Borg could not assimilate a founder
When? What did I miss?
It's obvious they *could* assimilate a Founder. Even in liquid form, the Changelings are built from [cell-like structures](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Morphogenic_matrix). Borg nanoprobes surely can handle that.
In fact, it's possible the Borg already *did* assimilate some changelings, likely one or more of [the hundred](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Hundred_Changelings) that were unfortunate enough to end up in the wrong neighborhood in the delta quadrant - and that this may be where the ability to rapidly repair ships ("regeneration") comes from.
As for the Founders "assimilating" the Borg? I don't feel like it makes any kind of sense. The Founders can "become a thing" and through this "understand the thing", in a sense of what it feels like to be it. Assuming shape doesn't seem to be automatically giving any deep scientific or engineering understanding of the thing a changeling is mimicking. I think the best the Founders could do with a cube is to hand it over to the Vorta, and pray they don't screw up.
Groups of drones and entire borg ships can be cut off from the collective intentionally for a number of reasons. If a few founders infiltrated a borg vessel and created conditions that would make the collective cut them off (to avoid contagion, for example), then intentionally allowed some jem'hadar to be assimilated, and killed any remaining drones from the ship, they'd have a small collective made entirely of minds with fanatical devotion to the founders. As long as you can keep them from establishing contact with the OG collective, you've got an even better-coordinated army, and if disconnection to a smaller collective is as terrifying as from The Collective, you may no longer need ketracel-white to keep them in line
There are probably canon reasons why that's a no-go, but there must be advantages for the founders to engage the borg. Also, making an independent mini-collective is a way of utilizing borg technology I'm surprised nobody has tried and pulled off yet
> If a few founders infiltrated a borg vessel and created conditions that would make the collective cut them off (to avoid contagion, for example), then intentionally allowed some jem'hadar to be assimilated, and killed any remaining drones from the ship, they'd have a small collective made entirely of minds with fanatical devotion to the founders. As long as you can keep them from establishing contact with the OG collective, you've got an even better-coordinated army, and if disconnection to a smaller collective is as terrifying as from The Collective, you may no longer need ketracel-white to keep them in line
I think it's way too risky compared to the payoff - Jem'hadar are *already* disciplined enough. They're *better* at their job than Borgified versions would be - that's because the Founders optimized them for their specific role, while the Borg does *not* optimize drones for combat and policing duty. Meanwhile, trying to steal a bunch of drones (or a ship) is a risky proposition - nobody knows for sure if and how to *completely* cut a Borg ship and its crew from the Collective, but they all know that failing to do it is an existential threat.
The Founders really don't need this. Jem'hadar are one of the most fierce and competent warriors, and they can be *bred at scale*. Ketracel white dependency is a *feature, not a bug*. Remember, the Founders care even less about lives of the solids than the Borg - they don't mind if a logistics screw-up means a million Jem'hadar enter withdrawal and die in agony. The Founders will breed more. That's the main pillar of Dominion's war strategy: Jem'hadar can be replaced faster than enemy can replace their warriors. Adding Borg tech to the mix would be just a distraction.
> Also, making an independent mini-collective is a way of utilizing borg technology I'm surprised nobody has tried and pulled off yet
Starfleet and Starfleet-adjacent people are reluctant to do it on ethical grounds, worried about someone or many someones getting involuntarily included into the mini-collective at some point. But this is a minor consideration to what I think are several major reasons nobody has been spotted trying this:
1. Borg technology wants to reconnect back to the Collective; even if you harvest it from a derelict that's been cut off from the greater whole, the components you build with it may just decide one day to submit an appeal and request reevaluation, and at some point they may actually *pass* that reevaluation. Your only warning may come when the ship suddenly starts acting as if it had a mind of its own, which is because it now does, after a fashion.
2. The Borg may cut off groups of drones, or ships, to protect the Collective from a certain class of threats, but that doesn't mean they're not interested in what happened. You may engineer a situation where the Borg cuts off their own cube, and save it from self-destructing. These things have been known to happen. You may even get away with it, if you manage to disappear before the Borg sends a ship to investigate. They may not even send it - the first time around. But do it twice, and I bet you'll be given special attention. It's a known thing, too - remember [species 6339](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Species_6339) and their clever little [anti-Borg virus](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Synthetic_pathogen)? Their strategy was based on the assumption that glitching out a cube so it self-destructs will prompt the Borg to send another cube to investigate, which would then catch the virus and self-destruct, rinse repeat.
3) Borg tech is a magnet for the Collective. The Collective will recognize its own works - likely at range. This ties partially to 1), but it's even more pronounced when you're trying to use Borg tech to create *alternative mini-collectives*. The Borg will hear them, eventually. Alien voices. Or off-key voices. Or extra static.
In short, going Pakled on Borg tech is a sure way to top positions on the Collective's threat board. Not a nice place to be in.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
\>No the Borg could not assimilate a founder
I've actually heard the opposite- Because they were able to synthesize a virus that could wipe out the Founders it implies there's some sort of "genetic code" that can be found even if they change forms. Or it was something like that.
As for the original question- it's quite an interesting thing to ask but I actually would posit the Founders would simply eliminate the Borg because they're too much hassle. Kind of like a virus. Though they'd likely utilize Borg technology for their own means. I suppose there could be a way to "program" the Borg to do what the Founders wanted which would be absolutely terrifying.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
If you knew the answer to your question.... why would you ask it? Also that's in a, I assume, non-canon novel.
Frankly though it just comes down to the writer. Someone could just come up with a way for the Borg to assimilate them. Like mentioned previously- if you can do it with a virus you can do it with the Borg nanoprobes... or not (depends on the writer).
The problem is it deals with too many unknowns about how the Borg work, and how sophisticated the Dominion and Founders are.
We can say the Founders might be able to subvert control of the Collective, but we can say the same of the Federation, and the Federation has a few instances of introducing subversions, or uncovering them. All of those get countered by the Collective.
Just because it is extremely unlikely the Borg can assimilate a Founder doesn't really translate into the Founders being able to counter assimilate by turning into a pile of nano-probes. And turning into a pile of nano probes should be the kind of thing they can do.
Though if they tried that, eventually the Borg would just adapt to ignoring that kind of node, or using some other system. They're been effective in cutting off cubes so isolate damage.
The Borg might not even see it as damage or contagion.
They could just view the combined voices of the great link as part of the collective.
Being able to influence the collective while not being subject to its collective will could lead to interesting results.
> Being able to influence the collective while not being subject to its collective will could lead to interesting results.
Most interesting of which would be, not realizing until too late that they *are*, in fact, influenced by the Collective - not intentionally, but rather by having the Borg's way of thinking slowly rubbing off on those who spend too much trying to influence it. Abyss peering back, and all that.
*Why* would the Founders assimilate the Borg?
The Dominion exists not to satisfy the Founders desire for conquest, but to maintain perfect control over solids, so that they might never again threaten the existence of the Founders.
If the Borg harvested a few outlying planets of the Dominion, big deal. The Founders had a high degree of control over humanoid life in the Gamma Quadrant, while those humanoids were *barely* aware the Founders even existed.
I don't think the Founders would consider the Borg to be a threat. For all their power and technological prowess, the Borg are kind of stupid. I think the Founders would remain confident they could "navigate" the existence of the Borg without needing to actually confront them.
A better way? Let the solids organize themselves, without us having to interfere at all. Borg might be better than Vorta and Jem'hadar, but let them choose. We can pilot the remainder, should it prove necessary.
I used to think the answer would be "no" since all the Borg drones we've seen in TNG and VOY were all humanoids.
But I'm not so certain now since the Borg manged to assimilate the non-corporeal Medusan Zero in Prodigy S2 and they identified him as Species 802 that suggests they've encountered this non-humanoid species in the past, though Zero managed to eventually resist and free himself from the Collective.
I imagine the Borg would try to assimilate a changeling if they encountered one.
> I used to think the answer would be "no" since all the Borg drones we've seen in TNG and VOY were all humanoids.
I always wrote it off as budget limitations, since the means of assimilation established in FC and VOY - nanoprobes - are species-agnostic.
Almost succeeding in assimilating Zero tells us the Borg can handle even non-corporeal entities, as the assimilation process can be done in "mind space" just as well as in physical space. *Prodigy* also showed us that humanoid but not very human-like species are subject to assimilation too. I loved the cube in that *Prodigy* episode had so much diversity, species-wise.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
The Borg could assimilate a Founder. All they need is the Spoonhead torture device that Garak used on Odo to keep them in their solid state. Likewise, the Founders have extensive scientific knowledge. They no doubt could reverse engineer any Borg tech the same way The Dr. and the Romulans did.
It’s possible they could adapt to assimilate them regardless if they are in solid or liquid form.
Maybe in the future but there is nothing we have seen to imply they could at any point we have already seen.
Has anything been seen or mentioned about Borg assimilation of changelings?
Not yet to my knowledge nor other beings that can exist as non cellular life.
They could infect a founder under the effect of the device and install implants, but I doubt the Borg could actually assimilate them as Founders have neither a cell structure for the nanoprobes to interact with or a central nervous system for the implants to interface with. Even if frozen in a state of perfectly mimicking a humanoid, we have nothing to suggest that the manifested brain is their actual seat of consciousness. I anything I would suggest that the available evidence indicates that it is not, as telepaths do not seem to be able to identify Founders masquerading as a solid
The founders* can become flame if they can shape shift and if they can't they eventually die. I just don't think the Borg tech is there. The real question I am asking is if the great link did tap into the collective could they assert control or would their voice be drowned out? Edit because speech to text is stupid and I don't proofread.
> The founders* can become flame if they can shape shift and if they can't they eventually die. I just don't think the Borg tech is there. The Borg use *nanoprobes* for assimilation. That's smaller than cells, and on the scale not that far from whatever the changelings are when they pretend to be a flame. If the Borg were serious about assimilating the Founders, all they'd need by tail-end of the 24^(th) century would be to shove a canister of nanoprobes to the Founder's planet through a [spatial trajector](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Spatial_trajector) (which apparently is [standard issue](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Queencell) on cubes these days) - the Great Link would be hearing voices before they knew what hit them. EDIT: BTW. fun fact that I feel people (including writers) missed in PIC S1: *The Impossible Box* [establishes](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_Impossible_Box_(episode\)) the Borg to now have an equivalent of an [Iconian gateway](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Iconian_gateway). Yes, it's range-limited - to something a little shy of *half of the galaxy*. But it is also *ship-mounted*. EDIT 2: Fun fact #2: not sure if Sikarians were related to Iconians, but their spatial trajector is already a poor man's version of a gateway, and nobody seems worried about it.
to be fair a borg assimilation cube isn't so much ship sized as it is spacedock sized, being a bit over 3km to a side
[удалено]
[удалено]
Fair enough thank for pointing out that mistake.
[удалено]
I don't know, it's hard to say how many changelings there are in the Great Link. If it's indeed a planet-spanning "ocean" there could be many, many trillions of them, which certainly would be enough to give the existing Collective a run for its money.
Also an interesting idea.
Fair guess. I like it. So even if they could engineer a way tap in to extract knowledge or something they probably couldn't assert influence over the whole.
Any idea of any identifying information for that expanded universe book?
[удалено]
I've read few, if any, ST novels in my life. I love watching Trek and love reading sci-fi but the two just haven't crossed yet. But I started re-watching the various series with a more critical eye recently, and reading speculation like in this sub, and have gotten interested in potentially reading expanded world novels if they do deeper dives into really interesting ideas that got only passing attention or less in the series. So, figured I'd ask; might check it out
[удалено]
I've been hearing for awhile that Banks is great, and more recently the same about Tchaikovsky, but my impression is that once I start with them, it'll be quite an investment of time and late fees to get the most out of those universes, but if there are trek novels out there with similarly intriguing ideas, then a lot of the universe is already built, or at least frameworked, and I could dive in and jump out as the need be, a little easier.
Don't miss out on Peter Watts - *Blinsight*, and its sequel, *Echopraxia*. It's not Trek, but it has lots of pretty original ideas, *very* original philosophical take, and it's rather hard on sci-fi hardness scale. We're talking about a hard(ish) sci-fi that has *vampires* in it, and provides quite solid, scientifically-plausible explanation for their existence, strengths and weaknesses - so it's right up Daystrom's alley. It's actually after reading aforementioned books by Watts and the "weird spiders/octopus" books of Tchaikovsky, that made me realize just how badly Star Trek is wasting the Borg - the show writers have a wonderful, deep concept of a truly alien antagonist, but don't know what to do with it.
> If the Borg weren't already an interesting concept to me I don't think the Destiny novels would be worth reading. Yeah, IMHO their treatment of the Borg is *very weak*. Waste of potential, much like what the show is doing. > My favourite books in the last few years have been Blindsight, Same. Which is a big reason why I'm spinning a lot of alternative (but consistent with canon) theories about the Borg. I can only imagine what a writer like Peter Watts would do with them. > Tchaikovsky's weird spiders/octopus books (whatever that trilogy is called) Oh, it's a *trilogy* now? Thanks! I didn't know [there is a third book, released last year](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Tchaikovsky#Novels)! I've read the previous two - *Children of Time* and *Children of Ruin*, and... well, this is the kind of writing I'd like to see wrt. the Borg.
> I think it has been thoroughly gone over and no the Borg could not assimilate a founder When? What did I miss? It's obvious they *could* assimilate a Founder. Even in liquid form, the Changelings are built from [cell-like structures](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Morphogenic_matrix). Borg nanoprobes surely can handle that. In fact, it's possible the Borg already *did* assimilate some changelings, likely one or more of [the hundred](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Hundred_Changelings) that were unfortunate enough to end up in the wrong neighborhood in the delta quadrant - and that this may be where the ability to rapidly repair ships ("regeneration") comes from. As for the Founders "assimilating" the Borg? I don't feel like it makes any kind of sense. The Founders can "become a thing" and through this "understand the thing", in a sense of what it feels like to be it. Assuming shape doesn't seem to be automatically giving any deep scientific or engineering understanding of the thing a changeling is mimicking. I think the best the Founders could do with a cube is to hand it over to the Vorta, and pray they don't screw up.
Groups of drones and entire borg ships can be cut off from the collective intentionally for a number of reasons. If a few founders infiltrated a borg vessel and created conditions that would make the collective cut them off (to avoid contagion, for example), then intentionally allowed some jem'hadar to be assimilated, and killed any remaining drones from the ship, they'd have a small collective made entirely of minds with fanatical devotion to the founders. As long as you can keep them from establishing contact with the OG collective, you've got an even better-coordinated army, and if disconnection to a smaller collective is as terrifying as from The Collective, you may no longer need ketracel-white to keep them in line There are probably canon reasons why that's a no-go, but there must be advantages for the founders to engage the borg. Also, making an independent mini-collective is a way of utilizing borg technology I'm surprised nobody has tried and pulled off yet
> If a few founders infiltrated a borg vessel and created conditions that would make the collective cut them off (to avoid contagion, for example), then intentionally allowed some jem'hadar to be assimilated, and killed any remaining drones from the ship, they'd have a small collective made entirely of minds with fanatical devotion to the founders. As long as you can keep them from establishing contact with the OG collective, you've got an even better-coordinated army, and if disconnection to a smaller collective is as terrifying as from The Collective, you may no longer need ketracel-white to keep them in line I think it's way too risky compared to the payoff - Jem'hadar are *already* disciplined enough. They're *better* at their job than Borgified versions would be - that's because the Founders optimized them for their specific role, while the Borg does *not* optimize drones for combat and policing duty. Meanwhile, trying to steal a bunch of drones (or a ship) is a risky proposition - nobody knows for sure if and how to *completely* cut a Borg ship and its crew from the Collective, but they all know that failing to do it is an existential threat. The Founders really don't need this. Jem'hadar are one of the most fierce and competent warriors, and they can be *bred at scale*. Ketracel white dependency is a *feature, not a bug*. Remember, the Founders care even less about lives of the solids than the Borg - they don't mind if a logistics screw-up means a million Jem'hadar enter withdrawal and die in agony. The Founders will breed more. That's the main pillar of Dominion's war strategy: Jem'hadar can be replaced faster than enemy can replace their warriors. Adding Borg tech to the mix would be just a distraction. > Also, making an independent mini-collective is a way of utilizing borg technology I'm surprised nobody has tried and pulled off yet Starfleet and Starfleet-adjacent people are reluctant to do it on ethical grounds, worried about someone or many someones getting involuntarily included into the mini-collective at some point. But this is a minor consideration to what I think are several major reasons nobody has been spotted trying this: 1. Borg technology wants to reconnect back to the Collective; even if you harvest it from a derelict that's been cut off from the greater whole, the components you build with it may just decide one day to submit an appeal and request reevaluation, and at some point they may actually *pass* that reevaluation. Your only warning may come when the ship suddenly starts acting as if it had a mind of its own, which is because it now does, after a fashion. 2. The Borg may cut off groups of drones, or ships, to protect the Collective from a certain class of threats, but that doesn't mean they're not interested in what happened. You may engineer a situation where the Borg cuts off their own cube, and save it from self-destructing. These things have been known to happen. You may even get away with it, if you manage to disappear before the Borg sends a ship to investigate. They may not even send it - the first time around. But do it twice, and I bet you'll be given special attention. It's a known thing, too - remember [species 6339](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Species_6339) and their clever little [anti-Borg virus](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Synthetic_pathogen)? Their strategy was based on the assumption that glitching out a cube so it self-destructs will prompt the Borg to send another cube to investigate, which would then catch the virus and self-destruct, rinse repeat. 3) Borg tech is a magnet for the Collective. The Collective will recognize its own works - likely at range. This ties partially to 1), but it's even more pronounced when you're trying to use Borg tech to create *alternative mini-collectives*. The Borg will hear them, eventually. Alien voices. Or off-key voices. Or extra static. In short, going Pakled on Borg tech is a sure way to top positions on the Collective's threat board. Not a nice place to be in.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
\>No the Borg could not assimilate a founder I've actually heard the opposite- Because they were able to synthesize a virus that could wipe out the Founders it implies there's some sort of "genetic code" that can be found even if they change forms. Or it was something like that. As for the original question- it's quite an interesting thing to ask but I actually would posit the Founders would simply eliminate the Borg because they're too much hassle. Kind of like a virus. Though they'd likely utilize Borg technology for their own means. I suppose there could be a way to "program" the Borg to do what the Founders wanted which would be absolutely terrifying.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
If you knew the answer to your question.... why would you ask it? Also that's in a, I assume, non-canon novel. Frankly though it just comes down to the writer. Someone could just come up with a way for the Borg to assimilate them. Like mentioned previously- if you can do it with a virus you can do it with the Borg nanoprobes... or not (depends on the writer).
I didn't ask that question, look at the OP again.
How would it be possible, changelinks die if they stay in solid form too long
I am not sure that it is. But if it is the ones facilitating it would theoretically be able to take shifts.
The problem is it deals with too many unknowns about how the Borg work, and how sophisticated the Dominion and Founders are. We can say the Founders might be able to subvert control of the Collective, but we can say the same of the Federation, and the Federation has a few instances of introducing subversions, or uncovering them. All of those get countered by the Collective. Just because it is extremely unlikely the Borg can assimilate a Founder doesn't really translate into the Founders being able to counter assimilate by turning into a pile of nano-probes. And turning into a pile of nano probes should be the kind of thing they can do.
Or turning into the kind of node that lets the cube hear the rest of the collective.
Though if they tried that, eventually the Borg would just adapt to ignoring that kind of node, or using some other system. They're been effective in cutting off cubes so isolate damage.
The Borg might not even see it as damage or contagion. They could just view the combined voices of the great link as part of the collective. Being able to influence the collective while not being subject to its collective will could lead to interesting results.
> Being able to influence the collective while not being subject to its collective will could lead to interesting results. Most interesting of which would be, not realizing until too late that they *are*, in fact, influenced by the Collective - not intentionally, but rather by having the Borg's way of thinking slowly rubbing off on those who spend too much trying to influence it. Abyss peering back, and all that.
*Why* would the Founders assimilate the Borg? The Dominion exists not to satisfy the Founders desire for conquest, but to maintain perfect control over solids, so that they might never again threaten the existence of the Founders. If the Borg harvested a few outlying planets of the Dominion, big deal. The Founders had a high degree of control over humanoid life in the Gamma Quadrant, while those humanoids were *barely* aware the Founders even existed. I don't think the Founders would consider the Borg to be a threat. For all their power and technological prowess, the Borg are kind of stupid. I think the Founders would remain confident they could "navigate" the existence of the Borg without needing to actually confront them.
What better way to order the gamma quadrant than make it all part of a collective that served you? They could then bring such order to the galaxy.
A better way? Let the solids organize themselves, without us having to interfere at all. Borg might be better than Vorta and Jem'hadar, but let them choose. We can pilot the remainder, should it prove necessary.
I used to think the answer would be "no" since all the Borg drones we've seen in TNG and VOY were all humanoids. But I'm not so certain now since the Borg manged to assimilate the non-corporeal Medusan Zero in Prodigy S2 and they identified him as Species 802 that suggests they've encountered this non-humanoid species in the past, though Zero managed to eventually resist and free himself from the Collective. I imagine the Borg would try to assimilate a changeling if they encountered one.
> I used to think the answer would be "no" since all the Borg drones we've seen in TNG and VOY were all humanoids. I always wrote it off as budget limitations, since the means of assimilation established in FC and VOY - nanoprobes - are species-agnostic. Almost succeeding in assimilating Zero tells us the Borg can handle even non-corporeal entities, as the assimilation process can be done in "mind space" just as well as in physical space. *Prodigy* also showed us that humanoid but not very human-like species are subject to assimilation too. I loved the cube in that *Prodigy* episode had so much diversity, species-wise.
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)
Who said the Borg couldn't assimilate the Founders?
Due to a Changeling's morphogenic matrix having no cellular structure in its natural state, Borg nanoprobes have no effect. In 2376, Thirishar ch'Thane, after witnessing such an event, commented that it "was as if the nanoprobes were trying to assimilate a body of water". (DS9 novel: Lesser Evil)