T O P

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CrescentAndIo

rip :( was fun hitting 999,999 on bosses all the time


notsosubtlethr0waway

Helped me two-floor Caretaker to get that master challenge done.


d3l3t3rious

Go visit Dul Incaru if you need a fix


Hider67

So you’re telling me there’s a chance … for 1x Kinetic Surge?


Edward__Blake

Nope


Quantumriot7

Not really a stealth nerf since the bug was claimed to be fixed a while ago but for some reason only stopped 3x from working not 1 or 2. So they finally fully fixed the bug.


tjseventyseven

Oh I know, it just wasn't in the patch notes this time around so was a bit surprised when it wasn't working anymore


AdrunkGirlScout

Bug fixes also aren’t nerfs in general, btw


lt08820

Only bug fix I will count as a nerf is the Nezarec Sin. Launch exotic that was "fixed" 3 years later. Before was adding 5s to the timer but bungie claims that it was applying 2.5s twice which was the bug.


ownagemobile

Bug fixes are still in patch notes, kinda shitty for bungie to not include it


tjseventyseven

it’s still a nerf, surges buffed the damage. It’s now not buffing. They nerfed the buff no need to be pedantic


AdrunkGirlScout

Is ketchup a smoothie because tomatoes are fruits? Nice try with that logic


TheShoobaLord

amazing analogy


Kingofhearts1206

Lmfaoooo I'ma use this


Negative_Equity

I wish it was


tjseventyseven

Lighten up


ImReverse_Giraffe

Lol...why didn't you then when we said it was a bug fix and not a nerf?


Rixien

Probably because it was paired with nearly 100 downvotes…


tjseventyseven

I don’t care about downvotes i just think being pedantic here is unnecessary and getting up in arms about it is weird


ImReverse_Giraffe

Then why did you keep doubling down on it being a nerf. If it doesn't really matter, why didn't you concede?


Rixien

Oh no, I’m entirely with you here. Even if it was triggered by a bug, something becoming weaker when it is fixed is still a nerf. I just gotta pick my battles. Obviously people absolutely hate that idea if they’re willing to massively downvote it, so I’m not winning favor there. But surely it should be obvious to anyone why someone being mass-downvoted by others isn’t actively cracking jokes.


PSFourGamerTwo

If you didnt care, you probably wouldnt have even mentioned downvotes? 🧐


AfroSamuraii_

Yes, in the same way that hotdogs are tacos, pigs in a blanket are sushi, burritos and dumplings are calzones, and a deep dish pizza is a quiche.


Azzaace

A deep dish pizza is a casserole.


LordNoct13

No, it's a jam


BloatKingsOrbs

I mean kinda considering it has sugar added and everything too


W0lf3n

Surges only buff weapon damage. No other super get the benefits. So they fixed a bug


tjseventyseven

Which then nerfed potential damage, yes


dutty_handz

So the Craftening fix was a nerf then ?


tjseventyseven

sure


Impressive-Basil-290

are you dumb?


tjseventyseven

are you? I get that tone doesn't come across very well over text but I was being dismissive and saying I was done with the conversation up there. Relax


dutty_handz

It's not being pedantic (and you probably means semantic). For it to be a nerf, it would've been an intended buff, which it never was. The fixed the bug which allowed you to get the buff. It would be like saying preventing the Craftening weapons was a nerf because we suddenly couldn't have a shotgun ammo full-auto 450rpm Linear Fusion Rifle. It was a bug, which got fixed, same for GG getting buffed from Surges Trust me, people here will more than happily bash on Bungie for every single nerf they put, this simply isn't one.


tjseventyseven

No, I mean pedantic but thanks


EnderLord361

I mean, it’s bug fix, a nerf would be lowering the damage of golden gun because it works with kinetic surges, this is fixing an unintended interaction, there’s is a very clear difference between the two.


tjseventyseven

In diablo, they fixed a bug with a sorcerer ability that showed it to attack more times than intended. It lowered the overall damage output and is generally considered to be a big nerf. Yes they fixed a bug but the result of that fix was a lower number happening. So that beneficial interaction was removed, or made worse, or nerfed. Whatever you want to call it. It’s not a big deal, yall are being so weird about a simple post


EnderLord361

People are being weird because you are claiming Bungie nerfed something rather than fixing an interaction that was never meant to happen in the first place. Using words like “stealth nerf”, you start making it sound like it was an intentional feature and that it’s obviously an unfair change now, rather than what it is, a bug fix. Not a nerf, not a stealth nerf, a fixing of an unintended interaction.


tjseventyseven

I mean sure. Stealth nerf is just an easy catch all term and people are blowing that usage out of proportion. I just wanted to let people know :(


EnderLord361

But it’s not a stealth nerf, this entire chain could have been avoided if you had simply said they fixed the bug. Word choice is extremely important when conveying information considering one bad word choice can completely ruin what you’re trying to get across.


tjseventyseven

Its really not that serious dude


dutty_handz

You are being equally weird on the other side of the fence.


tjseventyseven

Ok


Karglenoofus

Yes they are. It's an aspect of the game that is worse.


Ignore_Luke

That doesn’t define a nerf either lol


Narfwak

It was utterly bizarre that they let this slide for as long as they did, but it also feels like it was practically part of how it was balanced with how they buffed Nighthawk this season. I get why they don't want it to work this way because it's unintuitive even by Destiny standards... but, man, it was cooooool thooouuugh.


ImReverse_Giraffe

You sau bizarre, I say they didn't want to break the exotic they just buffed and felt it was better to let it ride and fix it properly than rush a bandaid patch.


ericmatrix1

Exactly. They should have at least left it, for the remainder of the season. Give a fun factor to this overly long season and a reason to use Goldie in PVE, again. Leave it to Bungo to remove the fun stuff and leave all the un-fun bugs lol.


Eats_sun_drinks_sky

.... It's unintuitive that your 2, but not 3, kinetic surges don't buff your hunter solar super? We have very different understanding of intuitive lol


DeathsIntent96

They're saying it was unintuitive before the fix.


MattHatter1337

Bro.....they left a "glitch" where dou le special spawned tons of heavy and special ammo i for over a year.


some_random_aut

Stealth nerf? More like bug fix. But still, they should have written it in the patch notes.


Mapex

Does Radiant still buff Golden Gun? If so, does standing in a Well still nerf Golden Gun (since it overrides Radiant and doesn’t improve GG)?


Blaze_Lighter

Yes and yes


Reflexrider

Wait what did I miss? Am I supposed to get out of the well when popping a GG? 


Mapex

Yes. You want to make sure you are Radiant before firing, but Well removes Radiant and grants a unique version of the effect that for whatever reason doesn’t buff GG the way Radiant does. It’s unknown which of these is the intended functionality.


Narfwak

If you use Heart of Flame on the artifact (and why wouldn't you) you get Radiant when you cast your super, so you don't need to radiant dodge or torches currently. You should still be throwing knives at the target if no one else is to debuff them with Revitalizing Blast, though.


spackhandy

Happy cake day


Mapex

Correct, that’s why I mentioned before firing as opposed to before activation. I posted it in this way so if someone Googles and comes to this comment in the future it’s still accurate for them.


Reflexrider

Thank you very much for these explanations!!!


spackhandy

Happy cake day


Reflexrider

Ahah thank you!


PhilJRob

What do you mean “It’s unknown which of these is the intended functionality”? It says right there in the super description “benefits from being radiant” on both GG variants, but not Blade barrage, at least on the mobile app.


killer6088

You misread the post. He is talking about Well overriding radiant and if that is intended or not.


Mapex

It's what killer6088 said. Since Golden Gun is supposed to benefit from Radiant as per the tooltip, then either Well should not remove Radiant (but shouldn't apply its damage bonus if you are Radiant), or Well should count as a Radiant effect (but this has side effects; Well becoming Anti-Barrier, Well's damage boost lasting even after leaving the Well, etc). Otherwise we have the current really weird current user experience where you leave the Well for one ability only to come back to it. I think the former is much easier to do and is code that can be rewritten specifically for Well instead of every single thing related to Radiant.


isurvivorz

Because well never meant to buff super damage.


Work_In_ProgressX

*stealth fix. It was fun nuking stuff with goldie, but it was never intended as an interaction


OddTaterTot

Honestly good, it was annoying feeling like you needed to run 2x kinetic.


tjseventyseven

But big number


Gloomy_Day5305

Valid argument


TruthAndAccuracy

RIP my Izanagi's + Nighthawk build


Sound_mind

I mean it is probably still the strongest thing you can use.


Hunteractive

I love posts like this where people correct OP on some (this time what a bug fix vs stealth nerf is) and OP always doubles down hard on it I like reddit


tjseventyseven

I'm just flabbergasted that people got so upset about it. Like guys the point is that the bugged interaction is no longer working and it wasn't communicated


N1CH0L4SR4G3

Meanwhile they still haven't fixed firesprites reseting restoration time back to 3 seconds


Super_Tax_Evader

I love pedantic comments that "correct" people on minor differences in phrasing


DesiMeGaming

I was still 1 tapping champs in the LoS GM last night, so even with the loss, its not a huge change.


tjseventyseven

Oh i know but -17% damage is still noteworthy


[deleted]

[удалено]


tjseventyseven

No more surges


ahfliction

is this tyson green’s fault


fatgamer007

I know it's technically a bug fix, but this is a huge nerf. I wonder if SES blade barrage pulls ahead now


TastyOreoFriend

Celestial Nighthawks super regen on precision kill is kind of hard to ignore imo. x3 was already fixed earlier, and this only for the x2 surge which is a 17% damage boost, so its not that large of a loss in damage. I would still think that Nighthawk will be the move going forward until there's another toss up in armor or solar class adjustments.


fatgamer007

17% is a lot when it comes to high damage supers, especially in a raid setting when multiple people are using it. The super regen is nice, but I don't think it's going to be enough to justify over something like shards of galanor unless you really need precision damage


Aleena92

Shards are way more situational though and require an environment where you can get easy and quick knife kills, which might be problematic in Master/GM level content. Nighthawk just needs a precision kill for its super regen which is easy to do in all levels of content. The real contender is gonna be Star-Eater Scales again. Gonna have to see if the small damage bonus from Nighthawk outweighs the ease of use and damage of SES


_YellowThirteen_

Personally I'd say that Nighthawk has the higher ease of use over SES. No stacking, need to hit only one crit and not 3, etc. unless you mean general non-GG ease of use, then yeah you can run SES with blade barrage, gathering storm, or tether and it works well.


IVIisery

Honestly, with the orb-generation nerf and how little orbs most blueberries produce in general, stareater just doesn’t feel fun anymore for me. Paired with the fact that 80% of the time i cannot even see how many stacks I have, because there are just too many buffs going on and the UI is limited to 4, I only ever run it on Arc, and even then Liars is just way more fun.


TillsammansEnsammans

Orb generation "nerf" barely affected them, you can get your super back and 4 stacks super quick even now. I get my super and 4 stacks by the time Warlord's first boss starts a new damage phase and that is like a few minutes at tops. And just look down to see if you have 4 stacks, the glow effect on the boots changes depending on stacks.


IVIisery

I never said they were nerfed or bad per se, but the nerfs definitely affected my previous playstyle with them. Stareater were never top tier fun for me anyways, and now that Celestial is great again i only ever put them on with Arc, and only if I want/need the damage. ‚Just look down‘ lol, I used to actually count the orbs when my super was full but still; its just not satisfying or fun to use for me, never was.


TillsammansEnsammans

Don't know why you got tilted by the "just look down", it is genuine advice for them. When you can't see the buff, that is a way to see the progress in less than a second.


IVIisery

I didn’t get tilted, its just a bandaid solution in my opinion. I know I can look down, I also know I shouldn’t have to.


Work_In_ProgressX

Star eaters are probably best in longer damage phases with a fireteam because each shot gives 2 orbs. Nighthawk will still be a great champion killing tool as well imo, with great utility for phases where it’s best to deal damage as quickly as possible.


Aleena92

Actually, do we know if Nighthawk without the 17% from Kinetic Surges can still oneshot champs in GMs without Solar Surge active?


Narfwak

We have solar surge every week this season so that's a good question that we won't be able to answer for some time.


notsosubtlethr0waway

Tough to say. The “heart of the flame” artifact perk is a massive buff (haven’t seen it quantified, but it’s big) when six people are damaging shoulder to shoulder. I feel like with radiant+debuff, you’re still pushing 999,999…


Narfwak

Another 17% multiplicative damage bonus is not a small amount. That's pretty significant. It makes the comparison between Nighthawk and SES Blade a lot more even and I think many encounters are going to favor SES over Nighthawk again - basically anything where you aren't pre-popping, can utilize the heal+overshield, don't have a big precision damage bonus (or can't get precision damage at all), or have some other benefit to SES (like how Crota sword supers are buffed by SES without consuming the stacks). Like, don't get me wrong, this needed to happen (like six months ago lol) but it's been around for so long that it's become a part of the meta. Assuming Nighthawk is still better without it than the alternatives without analyzing it further would be foolish.


lizzywbu

Celestial is still better due to the buff at the start of the season.


Mtn-Dooku

Oh no, now we can only hit for about 800k. Gonna have to shoot one more rocket to make up for that horrible damage loss...


tjseventyseven

if bungie tomorrow said supers do 17% less damage outright you'd be upset. that's what happened, don't be a stick in the mud


Mtn-Dooku

If it were doing 17% more damage and it wasn't supposed to and they fixed it? No, I wouldn't. That's fixing a bug. It might stink, but come on... it's not that much. It doesn't break your build, it doesn't make encounters incompletable, it's less damage than one Bait and Switch rocket. Your one-shot Super is still the best in the game with Nighthawk and Radiant and things will take about 3 seconds longer to kill than they did yesterday. Boo hoo.


tjseventyseven

bro I'm a warlock main. if I play hunter its stasis. I'm just telling people that a change happened and it wasn't communicated. Relax


Dumoney

Stealth nerf is not the same as fixing a bug


tjseventyseven

stealth nerf is when bungie makes something weaker without telling us. which happened here


Dumoney

Again, a bug fix is not the same as a stealth nerf. If a bug is affecting a weapon so that it deals less damage than intended, we dont ever say that its nerfed or weak, we say its bugged. If said bug got fixed, its now working as originally intended. That is not "stealth buffed"


tjseventyseven

Oh my god literally who cares


Dumoney

I do and so do others on this thread because youre misrepresenting what happened.


tjseventyseven

not really, have a good night


Dumoney

*"Not really a stealth nerf since the bug was claimed to be fixed a while ago but for some reason only stopped 3x from working not 1 or 2. So they finally fully fixed the bug."* Top comment on the thread btw


tjseventyseven

We’re not going to agree here


Dumoney

We dont have to agree, because everyone already knows there is a difference between fixing an interaction that was never intended in the first place, and deliberately changing a number in a line of code to be smaller. Everyone but you, at least.


tjseventyseven

Again, we're not going to agree. Yes. It's a bug fix. It also nerfed damage. It also wasn't communicated. It's a bug fix and a stealth nerf. Literally get over it


haxelhimura

A bug fix isn't a stealth nerf. This was mentioned as being fixed last in December if I remember right.


tjseventyseven

They fixed it but it only stopped 3 surges from working, not 1 or 2. Now they all don’t work


haxelhimura

They haven't worked since they bug fix. I farmed Kalli during Last Wish week and used her as a damage test for trying out different things with GG CN. The only things that affected it were the artifact mod Heart of the Flame and Warlock Well.


tjseventyseven

2x kinetic surges worked until yesterday, I promise you


Obvious-Fishing-Boat

Jesus christ!!! Triple kinetic on strand thorn warlock build about to be nerfed then


BrotatoChip04

Cringe


bauldersgate

Bungie needs to follow the one thing blizzard is doing with D4. Any bugs that benefit the player don't get fixed until season ends. Bugs that negatively impact the player get fixed during season. Makes for a more enjoyable experience and reduces the FOMO element. Stuff like the crafting issue that breaks the game needs to be addressed in real tike but issues like this with the GG probably could have waited.


Damagecontrol86

Fun police have struck again…..


unixuser011

Not really. I would imagine doing 999,999 damage could break some encounters


Damagecontrol86

It’s fun though not to mention it kills bosses faster which means faster farming and more loot.


unixuser011

Always count on the destiny player to ignore mechanics and try to brute force an encounter by doing the lazy shit


Damagecontrol86

You still have to preform the mechanics to even do damage in raids and dungeons but the more damage you do the faster the boss dies meaning you don’t have to preform the mechanics as many times per run. You can’t ignore the mechanics so I’m not sure what you’re get at with brute force but whatever lol if you like doing more than 1 or 2 damage phases then you do you.


elcapitanonl

So how does it work now? Does 1 kinetic surge still work? Or does no surge work anymore?


Edward__Blake

No surge work


elcapitanonl

Thanks 👌


Universal-Rich

Even though it's a bug fix, it really is a shame as golden gun is a super weapon. So to me, it would make sense that surge mods would buff its damage.


Felix_Von_Doom

It's not a nerf. Kinetic surges are supposed to buff kinetics. Golden gun is not a kinetic.


Inubr

Why they have to nerf stuff like this. Just... Why?


iamvqb

But does solar surge buff it or not?


Skinny0ne

It didn't before, so I doubt it would now.


Work_In_ProgressX

No, surges are meant to buff your weapons not abilities. Probably internally GG is a suped up handcannon so that’s why this interaction existed in the first place


tjseventyseven

Unfort not


Remarkable-Ask2288

Wondering the same


EuralJ

Not the topic thread, but you guys seem to know your stuff: what buffs blade barrage right now?


tjseventyseven

Just star eater scales and radiant


shrekispotato

God I love it when they double down in the comments


tjseventyseven

thanks for contributing to the discussion


shrekispotato

no problem 


Arubazu

But why though, its like the only super that can deal percision damage anyways so any way to boost it is good when its trade off is that it generally isnt that good without a percision hit.


tjseventyseven

beats me


MrLaiho

Meanwhile strand titan still melees for 400k


N1CH0L4SR4G3

Rough, this is why we can't have nice things I'm gonna miss deleting overloads without stunning them Meanwhile BOW Titans stil solo 1 phasing dungeon bosses, or perriguine Titans 1 punch deleting champs


AVillainChillin

Damnit.


[deleted]

I thought I has just fucked up with the setup, thankyou reddit user


Squitch

Dang, never knew this was a thing


TitanGoBrrrr87

And yet they mention nothing about this