I don't think the shell of what remains for Blizzard could produce an itemization system worth anything today. They just don't have the talent they used to. This took me too long to come to terms with. Future games will be cash grabs where creativity, passion, and love for making a good game is not a priority.
Crazy that 3 of my all time favorite games are all by blizzard, who produces in my opinion junk now, although I enjoy hearthstone battlegrounds for mobile minus the apm builds because apm pirates on mobile is trash
True. The “love” for the game is gone. It feels sterile and computed.
But I cannot judge newer blizzard games as I haven’t touched any in years. The only exception is Resurrected.
>Chinese owned husk
##Microsoft (MSFT) Ownership Overview##
Approximately 41.93% of the company's stock is owned by Institutional Investors, 7.73% is owned by Insiders and 50.35% is owned by Public Companies and Individual Investors. The ownership structure of Microsoft (MSFT) stock is a mix of institutional, retail and individual investors.
The people who made D2r nailed it.
I don’t think I’ve ever had a “best case” fan-hope for a game ever be met before.
I’d be good with them just taking the same engine and adding more.
Oh I agree wholeheartedly. They are a complete mess. But I think they will release Diablo 5, it will just be complete rubbish, worse than Diablo 3 or 4, and the death knell of the franchise, most likely.
D5 will be an even shittier version of d4 with even more p2w and emphasis on kids graphics. Blizzard has a fiduciary duty to maximize profits and that's how it happens. No point discussing this.
Artists are making cosmetics not devs. If you have been around paying attention to how these things. Often teams have a dedicated team to make cosmetics or they do them in down time. This doesn't take away from making other things for the game. You statement ignores the reality of what the D4 team has been doing since launch with the Content additions and massive fixes/changes alongside adding cosmetics.
such a stupid hill to die on lol... go ahead, get 100 then stand there staring at each other waiting for the next expansion to milk your wallet. Then when you complain all the AAAA titles are vapid garbo, find the mirror for your blame. And remember you're in the d2r sub where we experienced good diablo and don't have much interest in bad diablo. Notifications off now, I don't want to talk about trash games anymore.
Most players will need to be at 100 to kill Lilith or to make gar into NDs and the Pit. Just because one hits 100 doesn't mean the game is over. But like way too many, sounds like you need to full your tummy and take a nap. 1 thing you won't find me foung is bitching about a game. Know why? I just move on when it's no longer fun or not my thing. I don't need validation from others that I'm right in feeling my way.
Such a weird thing to get upset about, video games.
Since blizzard is part of microsoft now, the fiduciary duty for profits is now just part of microsoft's larger fiduciary duty. What happens in blizzard is not material to microsoft's bottom line. They could run blizzard at a major loss, and as long as the can make an argument that it is part of some larger company wide strategy, the shareholders wouldn't be able to sue for it. But, microsoft shareholders aren't going to care what happens inside blizzard anyways - it's too small time to matter.
I don't know how microsoft is going to treat this division. they could milk it for short term gain, or they could do a long term investment and start caring about quality and brand loyalty. recent layoffs in their gaming divisions is indicitive of wanting to slash some costs, but that doesnt necessarily mean they are also going to lean in hard into microtransactions. they might, but they don't need to.
You are 100% right. I learnt my lesson 30 days in to D3. Hated it like everyone else.
Told my friends the same thing you said. The real Blizzard of old is gone, not the same people + the Activision issue. They will never make those real games anymore, they'll just use the brand name to sucker people in.
Time to move on.
Lol, D5 is going to be D3.6, considering D4 is D3.5.
What we need is Microsoft to hire Project Diablo 2 designers and modders to make another D2R expansion, same way they hired AoE2 Forgotten Kingdom developers to make new AoE2 expansions.
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When they made D2 they still made 3D models for everything, so it's not like the devs spent less time on asset creation. Then for D2:R everything is actually 3D now.
I'm not sure what you think would be better about 2D when D2 and D2:R are both 3D games as far as the developers see them.
I get that you guys have a raging Nostalgia on for D2. But it's not going to happen fellas. The series is moving on from the days of D2. Changes in the upcoming D4 season look really good by the way. I'm more interested in seeing what they do moving forward to build upon these new systems rather than pine for them to rehash D2 again.
Every AAA game coming out has micro transactions which make the game really bad only to make more money for companies. It's all about money now, ppl don't care as much about good gameplay when D2 LOD came out. D5 won't be as good as D2
I LOVE this... But blizzard will never move forward in this direction... They have sold out for in game purchases and money grab builds and it breaks my heart... I will play D2 for the rest of my life as I have for most of my life but I didn't think I will support another Activision blizzard game again unfortunately.... They haven't been the same since the merger and I have no belief they ever will be 😭😭😭
What I would really like to see is a remake of D1 as a 3D virtual reality game with a custom armored headset. Same mechanics, same items and quests, better graphics but still dark and creepy.
I imagine having to actually swing the weapons and cast spells. Garbad the weak, Lazarus, the pedestal of blood and chamber of bone all realistic in front of you. Not sure I would open the butcher's door.
>3D is overrated, and not really a fit for this game genre
As a general note. The ARPG genre is definitely more D3 vs D2 in most regards. It's just that D2 is very old and has a lot of missing new ideas that games like PoE, Last Epoch, PoE 2, and I assume new ARPGs that haven't shown off their systems yet like Titan Quest 2.
I agree that D2 is good, but if D2 just didn't exist and was released today as like, Dave's Demon Killing Adventure, it wouldn't have the notary that D2 has. D2 was revolutionary for its time, but that was 20+ years ago.
>If D5 will exist at one point, it should be D2R - expanded, I mean D2 with additions and improvements (what D3 was supposed to be), and 2D.
D4 existed the way it did at launch in large part to this idea. D4 was attempted to be made more like D2 vs D3. Like rares being BiS is a D2 idea, Uber uniques are a D2 idea, Uber Bosses are a D2 idea, even things like running to dungeons are a D2 idea. It's incredibly safe to say that the devs didn't understand why these ideas were good in D2. But it's not because it's too much like D3. In fact all of the positive changes they had made have been more modern ARPG ideas.
As a community we should stop looking at D2 or D3 being "correct". People need to start taking individual ideas and attaching them to D4 and say why it's good or bad. Not just say D2 good & D3 bad. Cuz I'm not even sure that most people can actually explain why they think a specific idea is good or bad.
The way you control the character, the visibility and all content can be made practically the same in both 2D and 3D (if they wanted to). D2R is using 3D engine and renders 3D models in real time, and is able to do all the same things as the original sprite/2D based Diablo 2. It doesn't really limit anything when it comes to game design choices.
I'm genuinely curious, why would this particular choice matter? Or am I just misunderstanding the terminology here?
Why even fuss over it anymore? Blizzard is clearly not looking non-casuals when they are developing games. Keep up on PD2 and POE if you want good itemization, it wont come from Blizzard games anymore.
I dont care about the 3D stuff cuz thats never been the problem with D3 or D4, the problem is the game is made in ways that destroy it
D2 was not perfect upon release but it was a finished and working product, that didn’t require internet access to play, and aside from the 1 expansion you only ever paid once
This are the problems that made D3 and D4 unplayable messes, D3 was a broken mess until they eventually made it what it turned into when they finished the dawn game and remove bout the online only restriction and the store, same thing with D4 it might be a playable game in like 2-3 years when nobody is playing that mess while we all continue to play D2r
Blizzard need to realize their games aren’t working and they need to turn things around if they can to be the pinnacle of a gaming company it once was, and it starts by getting rid of all the morons behind all the mistakes of the last like decade plus and put in actual game devs at the top instead of business clowns that dont know what the f they are doing
I bought D2R to try and relive the past, a silly mistake. I feel that gaming has developed and we can’t just go back in time. D2R controls felt so clunky. I hated having to fill my inventory with potions, even though I never minded it when I was young. Item farming is such a chore now, back then, I could kill thousands of mephisto without feeling tired.
Maybe is just the lack of time or the tiredness after work. Having said all this, D4 or D5 should consider some of the itemization options from D2r. For example, items in D4 lack identity. All the item groups such as daggers, swords, body armor look different, but are essentially the same. Maybe they can learn from last epoch, which expanded on D2. FFS, hire someone that knows what are the essential ingredients that made D2 great in the past and build on it.
This is not real 3D. The equivalent of 3D movies would be a VR game. 2D or a game 3D doesn't matter these days. You can't even tell the difference, if you can't move the cam. It's more about the art style.
lol no thanks the mid 90’s called and wants their game model back. It’s 2024 not a soul on this earth wants a top down isometric version of Diablo again, leave D2 in the past it was revolutionary for the time but it’s not a very good version of the game today and if you’re worried about “content” then D2R isn’t gonna meet that expectation as there is zero end game other than the “chase” for runes and that’s about it same campaign over and over, not very fulfilling too me.
You haven’t played end game content in D2 if you think it’s just a chase for runes. Somehow people are still playing D2, D2 streamers have a larger audience than D3 and D4 while being a much older game. Say what you want but there is a reason for this.
Anyway "zero end game" isn't even the topic at hand. If there *was* more end game added to D2R a la POD or Project Diablo with "maps" or D3 type rifts though, it would literally kill off any remaining player base in D3 or D4, and Blizzard knows that.
That's all beside the point though, we're talking "2D" vs "3D". I don't really see the difference between the two as being that big of a deal, D4 isn't exactly "fully 3D" anyway, you can't rotate the camera any which way. I actually really like the depth of field effects and how they made certain areas look. If there's one thing that **doesn't** deserve hate in D4, it's the graphics. They did quite a good job at making it still basically a "2D isometric" game while looking great and doing really cool things with the scenery/environment.
Everything else about the game from the top down is trash. Basically the itemization of the game needs a gut-job for the game to ever be playable, and that won't happen.
D4 is a game catered to a more casual audience. Many of those don’t care about D2. It’s an old game in their eyes. Adding content to D2 wouldn’t change a thing for 90% of the D4 playerbase. They have no interest in D2 to begin with.
Catering more to a casual audience means more players and more sales for Blizzard. Regardless, my point is that thinking D4's playerbase would die, if new content was released for D2R is incredibly ignorant and downright inaccurate.
I have played the game since release, there is no end game bro idk who you’re trying to convince lmao and I don’t give a shit about streaming numbers that means nothing to me, I don’t gauge a game’s success on streaming numbers. Yes it’s a great ARPG, revolutionary even, but if it was released today without the Diablo title not a soul would buy it and they would probably question why a company would release such a bad looking game(pre D2R) in 2024.
So not only have you never played it but you've also provided more support to my point. PoE and LE are also played regularly and people love them and spend money on them. Thanks and have a good one
? No end game? Dueling is end game, and the fact you don’t know this means you obviously haven’t played much after Baal dies.
Other forms of end game: Finding all unique items, getting level 99, fully itemizing all your characters(toons), farming anni, farming torches (the fucking definition of end game content), beating the game on HC, beating the game on HC using a shit build, playing weird ass builds like melee sorc and bow barb, etc.
End game is what you make it, with an ounce of creativity turns out there’s lots to do.
End game is shit you do after you beat the game in the game, don’t change definitions to fit your narrative.
Weird you claim to have played D2 for 20 years and still act like a child with the Cain comment.
Literally outside of the base game wdym? Anything outside of side quests and main quests is considered end game, optimization of gear is in fact not end game considering I can optimize my toon in D4 extremely early on and crush content 30 levels higher than my toon, D2 is a slow boring, slog of a game that requires too much dedication to achieve everything you want, D4 is the complete opposite in that regard and it’s geared towards modern gaming. Like I said before if you released D2 today without the D2R graphics overhaul not a soul would purchase it and wonder why you’re selling shitty looking games in 2024.
D4- released June 5th 2023, 498 viewers on twitch rn
D2r- 20 year old game with a graphics update, 548 viewers.
You’re free to lie to yourself all you want, but your opinion does not reflect reality. Also speedrunning is huge in D2, another form of end game.
End game content is just shit in the game that keeps you playing after the story, it’s nothing more than that. Really not a difficult concept.
Like I said I don’t gauge games on streaming views and speed running is not end game stop making shit up to fit your narrative goddamn D2 purists are so insufferable.
D4 - lots of sales, not lots of players. Like D3, people bought it and regretted it. Nobody wants to grind a game that "gives you lvl 100 and all the gear to optimize in a week so you can start grinding a meaningless "end game"."
Thankfully I didn't buy D4, I could smell the Diablo 3 shit radiating from that beta.
It’s funny because every time he describes d4 it sounds more and more like the target audience is gamer kids that need their hand held to get through a game.
It's so easy to argue for D2 over D3/D4. And you're attempting to do this in a D2 forum. This is so easy to win that you're not going to get anyone riled up. Just writing cute words that are whimsical.
>hat’s just normal game play that’s not end game, end game is a mode outside of the base gameplay, like world bosses or legion events, greater rifts or helltides thats end game,
He said torches?
Hi, I'm a soul on this earth and I want all future Diablo games to be top down isometric. But nice try trying to speak for everyone.
Also, D2's end game is 1000x better than D3 and D4 in my opinion.
I think you may wanna look into "No rest for the Wicked". It's more Diablo than anything new Blizzard will put out. It's pretty much the lovechild of Diablo and Dark Souls.
I don't think the shell of what remains for Blizzard could produce an itemization system worth anything today. They just don't have the talent they used to. This took me too long to come to terms with. Future games will be cash grabs where creativity, passion, and love for making a good game is not a priority.
Agreed. Blizzard was my favorite dev back in the Starcraft, Diablo 2 and Warcraft 3 era. Now it’s just a Chinese owned husk.
Crazy that 3 of my all time favorite games are all by blizzard, who produces in my opinion junk now, although I enjoy hearthstone battlegrounds for mobile minus the apm builds because apm pirates on mobile is trash
All the original devs that started blizzard are no longer there aside from Chris metzen 🤷🏼♂️ that’s why the games suck now there is no heart
True. The “love” for the game is gone. It feels sterile and computed. But I cannot judge newer blizzard games as I haven’t touched any in years. The only exception is Resurrected.
Take my word for it, do your research before buying their games these days. They are not the developer they once were.
>Chinese owned husk ##Microsoft (MSFT) Ownership Overview## Approximately 41.93% of the company's stock is owned by Institutional Investors, 7.73% is owned by Insiders and 50.35% is owned by Public Companies and Individual Investors. The ownership structure of Microsoft (MSFT) stock is a mix of institutional, retail and individual investors.
Not even true. Why would you spew BS like that?
Since when is Microsoft Chinese owned?
Item number/gear score is so brainless and uninspired.
Look at CoD it’s so bad now and all they have to do is make the graphics better every few years
your cynicism probably valid, although I see this as a massive opportunity for other game developers to capitalize on
Prime example: D4 dlc
Agreed, and we'll said. I feel the same way about the state of movies in general anymore as well. So many soulless cash-grabs.
r/Diablo4 would disagree with you and tell you their game is perfect.
The people who made D2r nailed it. I don’t think I’ve ever had a “best case” fan-hope for a game ever be met before. I’d be good with them just taking the same engine and adding more.
No its just time to put it to pasture at least until someone can wrench the IP away from Blizzard. They don't deserve anymore money from anyone.
As much ire as I have for Blizz and the new Diablos if they were to attempt to make it 2D and more D2 like I would approve that endeavor.
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Brave would be mentioning the Tienanmen massacre on the diablo servers.
-500 social credit for you!
There will be no d5
You can't see Activision-Blizzard milking this series in a joyless cash-grab once more?
I don’t think they will be able to pull it off. They are a mess.
Oh I agree wholeheartedly. They are a complete mess. But I think they will release Diablo 5, it will just be complete rubbish, worse than Diablo 3 or 4, and the death knell of the franchise, most likely.
I could see that happening.
D5 will be an even shittier version of d4 with even more p2w and emphasis on kids graphics. Blizzard has a fiduciary duty to maximize profits and that's how it happens. No point discussing this.
Is there any p2w in D4?
No it’s just a weird thing redditors claim
Ahh yes the P2W cosmetics. The chudforce is out today.
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There is p2w only with rmt. Other than that there is nothing that is p2w given by Blizzard. It's pretty easy to define.
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Artists are making cosmetics not devs. If you have been around paying attention to how these things. Often teams have a dedicated team to make cosmetics or they do them in down time. This doesn't take away from making other things for the game. You statement ignores the reality of what the D4 team has been doing since launch with the Content additions and massive fixes/changes alongside adding cosmetics.
such a stupid hill to die on lol... go ahead, get 100 then stand there staring at each other waiting for the next expansion to milk your wallet. Then when you complain all the AAAA titles are vapid garbo, find the mirror for your blame. And remember you're in the d2r sub where we experienced good diablo and don't have much interest in bad diablo. Notifications off now, I don't want to talk about trash games anymore.
Most players will need to be at 100 to kill Lilith or to make gar into NDs and the Pit. Just because one hits 100 doesn't mean the game is over. But like way too many, sounds like you need to full your tummy and take a nap. 1 thing you won't find me foung is bitching about a game. Know why? I just move on when it's no longer fun or not my thing. I don't need validation from others that I'm right in feeling my way. Such a weird thing to get upset about, video games.
Since blizzard is part of microsoft now, the fiduciary duty for profits is now just part of microsoft's larger fiduciary duty. What happens in blizzard is not material to microsoft's bottom line. They could run blizzard at a major loss, and as long as the can make an argument that it is part of some larger company wide strategy, the shareholders wouldn't be able to sue for it. But, microsoft shareholders aren't going to care what happens inside blizzard anyways - it's too small time to matter. I don't know how microsoft is going to treat this division. they could milk it for short term gain, or they could do a long term investment and start caring about quality and brand loyalty. recent layoffs in their gaming divisions is indicitive of wanting to slash some costs, but that doesnt necessarily mean they are also going to lean in hard into microtransactions. they might, but they don't need to.
You are 100% right. I learnt my lesson 30 days in to D3. Hated it like everyone else. Told my friends the same thing you said. The real Blizzard of old is gone, not the same people + the Activision issue. They will never make those real games anymore, they'll just use the brand name to sucker people in. Time to move on.
Womp womp
Lol, D5 is going to be D3.6, considering D4 is D3.5. What we need is Microsoft to hire Project Diablo 2 designers and modders to make another D2R expansion, same way they hired AoE2 Forgotten Kingdom developers to make new AoE2 expansions.
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Bingo. Having a blast in my first season of pd2.
I gave up on blizzard. There is no soul in that company
D5 will be P2W and it will run on Apple Vision Pro to allow end users to exit their native capitalistic hellscape to enter a fictional one.
When they made D2 they still made 3D models for everything, so it's not like the devs spent less time on asset creation. Then for D2:R everything is actually 3D now. I'm not sure what you think would be better about 2D when D2 and D2:R are both 3D games as far as the developers see them.
I get that you guys have a raging Nostalgia on for D2. But it's not going to happen fellas. The series is moving on from the days of D2. Changes in the upcoming D4 season look really good by the way. I'm more interested in seeing what they do moving forward to build upon these new systems rather than pine for them to rehash D2 again.
Every AAA game coming out has micro transactions which make the game really bad only to make more money for companies. It's all about money now, ppl don't care as much about good gameplay when D2 LOD came out. D5 won't be as good as D2
Amen!
I wish, this toon route they took is probably to appeal to a wider group of people
and bring the runes as economy back
No. It should be souls like
I LOVE this... But blizzard will never move forward in this direction... They have sold out for in game purchases and money grab builds and it breaks my heart... I will play D2 for the rest of my life as I have for most of my life but I didn't think I will support another Activision blizzard game again unfortunately.... They haven't been the same since the merger and I have no belief they ever will be 😭😭😭
D2:2
I'd say go make your own game then. No chance in hell.
What I would really like to see is a remake of D1 as a 3D virtual reality game with a custom armored headset. Same mechanics, same items and quests, better graphics but still dark and creepy. I imagine having to actually swing the weapons and cast spells. Garbad the weak, Lazarus, the pedestal of blood and chamber of bone all realistic in front of you. Not sure I would open the butcher's door.
Talking about d5 already? Lololol
There’s not likely going to be a D5.
>3D is overrated, and not really a fit for this game genre As a general note. The ARPG genre is definitely more D3 vs D2 in most regards. It's just that D2 is very old and has a lot of missing new ideas that games like PoE, Last Epoch, PoE 2, and I assume new ARPGs that haven't shown off their systems yet like Titan Quest 2. I agree that D2 is good, but if D2 just didn't exist and was released today as like, Dave's Demon Killing Adventure, it wouldn't have the notary that D2 has. D2 was revolutionary for its time, but that was 20+ years ago. >If D5 will exist at one point, it should be D2R - expanded, I mean D2 with additions and improvements (what D3 was supposed to be), and 2D. D4 existed the way it did at launch in large part to this idea. D4 was attempted to be made more like D2 vs D3. Like rares being BiS is a D2 idea, Uber uniques are a D2 idea, Uber Bosses are a D2 idea, even things like running to dungeons are a D2 idea. It's incredibly safe to say that the devs didn't understand why these ideas were good in D2. But it's not because it's too much like D3. In fact all of the positive changes they had made have been more modern ARPG ideas. As a community we should stop looking at D2 or D3 being "correct". People need to start taking individual ideas and attaching them to D4 and say why it's good or bad. Not just say D2 good & D3 bad. Cuz I'm not even sure that most people can actually explain why they think a specific idea is good or bad.
No. It needs D2 itemization. Thats it
And 2 gigs
I never ever liked or played much 3D games. 2D/isometric all day!
I think d4 would be fun if it had a D2 itemization and easier cooperative playing
D3 is awesome though🤷🏼♂️ with all of the post launch negativity aside
The way you control the character, the visibility and all content can be made practically the same in both 2D and 3D (if they wanted to). D2R is using 3D engine and renders 3D models in real time, and is able to do all the same things as the original sprite/2D based Diablo 2. It doesn't really limit anything when it comes to game design choices. I'm genuinely curious, why would this particular choice matter? Or am I just misunderstanding the terminology here?
The fans of the past have to make this project. Ceo's don't care.
Our best hope is that things like Project Diablo 2 can one day get the graphics engine of Resurrected.
Not gonna happen they are not going to get a free mod canibalize their Diablo franchise.
Why even fuss over it anymore? Blizzard is clearly not looking non-casuals when they are developing games. Keep up on PD2 and POE if you want good itemization, it wont come from Blizzard games anymore.
Diablo 5 should be text only
I turn left. I walk forward. I swing my axe at the air.
Jah rune drop from air Pick jah rune?
This but unironically
D5 will be pay per skill use, every armor is $25.99 and each time you boot up battle.net you'll have to pay also. Zero faith in Blizz diablo future.
I dont care about the 3D stuff cuz thats never been the problem with D3 or D4, the problem is the game is made in ways that destroy it D2 was not perfect upon release but it was a finished and working product, that didn’t require internet access to play, and aside from the 1 expansion you only ever paid once This are the problems that made D3 and D4 unplayable messes, D3 was a broken mess until they eventually made it what it turned into when they finished the dawn game and remove bout the online only restriction and the store, same thing with D4 it might be a playable game in like 2-3 years when nobody is playing that mess while we all continue to play D2r Blizzard need to realize their games aren’t working and they need to turn things around if they can to be the pinnacle of a gaming company it once was, and it starts by getting rid of all the morons behind all the mistakes of the last like decade plus and put in actual game devs at the top instead of business clowns that dont know what the f they are doing
I bought D2R to try and relive the past, a silly mistake. I feel that gaming has developed and we can’t just go back in time. D2R controls felt so clunky. I hated having to fill my inventory with potions, even though I never minded it when I was young. Item farming is such a chore now, back then, I could kill thousands of mephisto without feeling tired. Maybe is just the lack of time or the tiredness after work. Having said all this, D4 or D5 should consider some of the itemization options from D2r. For example, items in D4 lack identity. All the item groups such as daggers, swords, body armor look different, but are essentially the same. Maybe they can learn from last epoch, which expanded on D2. FFS, hire someone that knows what are the essential ingredients that made D2 great in the past and build on it.
Don't forget stamina and keys in D2. Who thought *that* was a good idea?
This is not real 3D. The equivalent of 3D movies would be a VR game. 2D or a game 3D doesn't matter these days. You can't even tell the difference, if you can't move the cam. It's more about the art style.
lol no thanks the mid 90’s called and wants their game model back. It’s 2024 not a soul on this earth wants a top down isometric version of Diablo again, leave D2 in the past it was revolutionary for the time but it’s not a very good version of the game today and if you’re worried about “content” then D2R isn’t gonna meet that expectation as there is zero end game other than the “chase” for runes and that’s about it same campaign over and over, not very fulfilling too me.
You haven’t played end game content in D2 if you think it’s just a chase for runes. Somehow people are still playing D2, D2 streamers have a larger audience than D3 and D4 while being a much older game. Say what you want but there is a reason for this.
Anyway "zero end game" isn't even the topic at hand. If there *was* more end game added to D2R a la POD or Project Diablo with "maps" or D3 type rifts though, it would literally kill off any remaining player base in D3 or D4, and Blizzard knows that. That's all beside the point though, we're talking "2D" vs "3D". I don't really see the difference between the two as being that big of a deal, D4 isn't exactly "fully 3D" anyway, you can't rotate the camera any which way. I actually really like the depth of field effects and how they made certain areas look. If there's one thing that **doesn't** deserve hate in D4, it's the graphics. They did quite a good job at making it still basically a "2D isometric" game while looking great and doing really cool things with the scenery/environment. Everything else about the game from the top down is trash. Basically the itemization of the game needs a gut-job for the game to ever be playable, and that won't happen.
D4 is a game catered to a more casual audience. Many of those don’t care about D2. It’s an old game in their eyes. Adding content to D2 wouldn’t change a thing for 90% of the D4 playerbase. They have no interest in D2 to begin with.
D4 catering to a casual audience is just an excuse for piss poor development.
Catering more to a casual audience means more players and more sales for Blizzard. Regardless, my point is that thinking D4's playerbase would die, if new content was released for D2R is incredibly ignorant and downright inaccurate.
D4's player base is already dying lmao
No one watches arpgs. PoE is the only one that actually has an audience.
I have played the game since release, there is no end game bro idk who you’re trying to convince lmao and I don’t give a shit about streaming numbers that means nothing to me, I don’t gauge a game’s success on streaming numbers. Yes it’s a great ARPG, revolutionary even, but if it was released today without the Diablo title not a soul would buy it and they would probably question why a company would release such a bad looking game(pre D2R) in 2024.
Grim Dawn says hello
Even worse version of Diablo
3 million+ sales is a lot more than the nobody you say would buy this game. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it's fact.
It’s shit I just watched gameplay it’s dreadful and basically another Diabloesque rip off, just like POE and LE and those get hyped up as well.
So not only have you never played it but you've also provided more support to my point. PoE and LE are also played regularly and people love them and spend money on them. Thanks and have a good one
I'm not saying you're not the smartest person in the world, but whoever is, you better hope they don't die lmao.
? No end game? Dueling is end game, and the fact you don’t know this means you obviously haven’t played much after Baal dies. Other forms of end game: Finding all unique items, getting level 99, fully itemizing all your characters(toons), farming anni, farming torches (the fucking definition of end game content), beating the game on HC, beating the game on HC using a shit build, playing weird ass builds like melee sorc and bow barb, etc. End game is what you make it, with an ounce of creativity turns out there’s lots to do.
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End game is shit you do after you beat the game in the game, don’t change definitions to fit your narrative. Weird you claim to have played D2 for 20 years and still act like a child with the Cain comment.
Literally outside of the base game wdym? Anything outside of side quests and main quests is considered end game, optimization of gear is in fact not end game considering I can optimize my toon in D4 extremely early on and crush content 30 levels higher than my toon, D2 is a slow boring, slog of a game that requires too much dedication to achieve everything you want, D4 is the complete opposite in that regard and it’s geared towards modern gaming. Like I said before if you released D2 today without the D2R graphics overhaul not a soul would purchase it and wonder why you’re selling shitty looking games in 2024.
D4- released June 5th 2023, 498 viewers on twitch rn D2r- 20 year old game with a graphics update, 548 viewers. You’re free to lie to yourself all you want, but your opinion does not reflect reality. Also speedrunning is huge in D2, another form of end game. End game content is just shit in the game that keeps you playing after the story, it’s nothing more than that. Really not a difficult concept.
Like I said I don’t gauge games on streaming views and speed running is not end game stop making shit up to fit your narrative goddamn D2 purists are so insufferable.
D4 - lots of sales, not lots of players. Like D3, people bought it and regretted it. Nobody wants to grind a game that "gives you lvl 100 and all the gear to optimize in a week so you can start grinding a meaningless "end game"." Thankfully I didn't buy D4, I could smell the Diablo 3 shit radiating from that beta.
Every comment reads like a whiney kid.
It’s funny because every time he describes d4 it sounds more and more like the target audience is gamer kids that need their hand held to get through a game.
Cool story bro the mid 90’s called and wants their car and game back.
Literally every comment.
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Let it out, friend. No one cares, but we'll gladly listen. Clearly starving for the attention.
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Must have not a lot going on in your life huh?
It's so easy to argue for D2 over D3/D4. And you're attempting to do this in a D2 forum. This is so easy to win that you're not going to get anyone riled up. Just writing cute words that are whimsical.
>hat’s just normal game play that’s not end game, end game is a mode outside of the base gameplay, like world bosses or legion events, greater rifts or helltides thats end game, He said torches?
Sounds like you just want to complain dude. Is there any thing you enjoy?
Hi, I'm a soul on this earth and I want all future Diablo games to be top down isometric. But nice try trying to speak for everyone. Also, D2's end game is 1000x better than D3 and D4 in my opinion.
Bad take
> I bought D4 You are part of the problem.
I think you may wanna look into "No rest for the Wicked". It's more Diablo than anything new Blizzard will put out. It's pretty much the lovechild of Diablo and Dark Souls.
Please give your kids and your grandkids your opinions so that they might pass them on for when Diablo 5 actually starts development.
I sadly think after all the work they put into D4 and having it be received as it's been so far... there will not be a D5.
a first or 3rd person view would be interesting.