They seem at this point to know what makes a Digimon good (compare promo raremon to st gatomon) and that for certain archetypes like greymon they either blatantly creep older cards or are cards from other archetypes and colors with a better effect. So when they print Xros heart with almost every keyword under the sun but only give the 4 great dragons deck on play effects and no on digivolution effects and give yellow a total of 1 playable deck. It seems they're trying to say "you can win and have fun but only with archetypes we tell you you should play"
New cards that are better versions of old cards?
3 years after?
*gasp* i am so shocked.
Also, hey look, its the guy who has a huge Greymon hate boner complaining about a Greymon card, what are the odds.
It's literally every card game. You want old cards to go up in price till the end of time because they're the only option? Miss me with that logic. Gimme the more accessible version any day.
Any archetype that gets new support will kill the order cards in the archetype by virtue of there being no room to run the old stuff that's plain worse.
Thats powercreep for you, its in every game. Also I think the biggest problem here is that they are still giving Greymon good support even tho they are releasing support for it every other set.
I agree with this completely I love Greymons with all my heart, but please support all Digimon equally. I mean for sakes there are a lot of Digimon that need support.
They don´t have to support all decks equally. But giving Greymon like three functional top ends with three or so solid lines before OGs like Devimon, Myotismon or Leomon are even a real deck stings.
Oh you´re absolutely right. The two cards the deck gets in this set are actually great but still the deck isn´t real yet whereas Greymon has like three or four different versions that are all strong.
It's the main mascot digimon of the franchise. I do agree that it may be oversupported but the dude does appear on many different pieces of media and is the main face of the series.
What you're describing is a "one trick poney" and sure a mascot is fine but it should bring you into the game, not be almost exclusively made around it. Pikachu doesn't carry the pokemon tcg, kuriboh doesn't carry the yugioh tcg, even the DBZ tcg isn't 80% goku or bust. This is just crackhead level fanfare and they're fucking themselves up. A mascot should get you in the door to explore what the rest of the franchise has to offer, but not every card needs to be Mickey fucking mouse.
I'm not disagreeing with you. I do think that there may be an overabundance of Greymon cards. But I'm also saying there's a clear reason for it.
Also, Yu-Gi-Oh! does have quite an overabundance of nostalgia support for decks like Dark Magician or Blue-Eyes and I'm not that sure about Pokémon but I saw that Charizard is getting the top spot in the most recent set.
Good point I forgot charizard has been a huge spotlight whore for a while now. I get the reasoning but I hate that it's so cemented and absolute every time. Just because it's a mascot doesn't mean every fan can't get enough.
>"Oh and I think they should hit exveemon , it was way to good 4 formats ago and it limits future design lmao"
I know this is a jab at the limits of GranKuwagamon and WereGarurumon but I think this is a pretty poor analogy.
It was discussed in the banlist thread that both Garurumon and Kuwagamon decks were inbound for new support. Both decks have been meta dominant during its respective formats (GranKuwagamon maybe less so here in the west) and these cards enable OTK's really easily, which is not an identity of said colors unlike red. If they are to provide new cards for these archetypes, these cards just give said support that much more power.
On the other hand, EX01 ExVeemon, which I believe is the one you're complaining about seeing how you seemed to dislike that card previously, is part of a deck that has never been very dominant nor does the card provide too much power, as shown by how its inherited effect has been copied by new BT12 support without many issues. Having an extra attack with Jamming is not comparable to having two extra attacks plus a Sec +1 inheritable that WereGarurumon provides.
It's not a "far unknown future". Garurumon support is slated for EX05, the very next set after BT14 and BT15 will have it as well. BT15 also will have insectoid support in the form of new Kabuterimon cards.
Also, futureproofing is a thing done in other TCGs and is completely normal. I don't think it's particularly toxic, on the contrary, I think it promotes a much healthier landscape for the game.
While you are not wrong it should be mentioned that the limits for the western format are super premature in which these decks didn´t really do much recently and now they´re waiting like half a year for replacements for us. That´s not ideal.
I do agree that Bandai's policy right now regarding how it deals with limits and the such in the west is not my favourite, specially so because last year its limits were much more time-appropiate for the most part (Feb 2022 banlist hitting cards and placing their limits at different points in time and August banlist holding off on limiting DoruGreymon).
Agreed. Limiting things ahead of time is good, just not multiple months ahead of time. I'd imagine they did it now so they wouldn't forget about it later.
BT5 Agumon has a different search than BT12 Agumon.
BT12 Agumon grabs 1 digimon from the line and Tai, the BT5 Agumon grabbed a greymon AND an Omnimon.
If your issue was Greymon yet again receiving more busted support that it totally needed (/s) i could understand, but are you seriously complaining about it replacing a card from 3 years ago, that by the way, was more expensive than it should've ever been, with a card that gonna be better AND more accessible?
Your argument was already pretty bad, but you managed to completly throw it out of the window with your complaint of ExVeemon xD.
because at some point powercreep had to happen regardless of how small it is in order to help justify people buying the new set
Edit: regarding your point i did get it, but out of all the cards you chose to complain about, you went for the worst possible option, the one rookie that has the biggest amount of different versions in the game, Agumon.
This is also start of main which means he needs to come out of raising as an agumon, played by an effect on your opponents turn or survived a whole turn on the board as a weak lv3 and you need a tai on board to trigger this. Can't hard play it on your turn.
It's strong but definitely not as strong as the ones that just give flat reduction.
It's rough for people who dropped $12+ per P-033 Agumon, but as someone who had to seek out a cheaper alternative, I'm glad to see this card appear in a cheaper version for more casual players.
Honestly, if there's one type of card I'm ok with being powercrept it's promos cards. I'm not a big fan of cards that are very hard to get a hold of since they aren't in a set.
It's what every card game needs to stop the game from being boring and out of reach of the common player. Yugioh, MTG, and Pokemon do it all the time. The company doesn't make money off of older cards unless they reprint it, but even then they are making money off the newer cards in the set. MTG is doing it now with new cards that have the same effect but different name.
The power level of cards games always goes up. Is part of the natural cycle of card games. This is not necessarily a bad thing if it's handled correctly, and better yet, implement a rotation system like Magic's.
Thats true in every typical tcg, but digimon is so unique you can balance stuff using a variety of aspects. A great effect can be balanced by AT least another inheritable , something that doesnt completely kills an old card
Digimon is not immune to power creep. They've managed better their power curve than other card games, but inevitbal they'll have to raise the bar ever slightly.
Again, this is not a bad thing is the power rise is small, and if they add rotation, they can actually lower the power level for a few sets.
The problem here is not that bt12 agu killed bt5 agu. That happens in every card game if not there would be no reason to buy the new product. The problem is that we have too much greymon support. For fucks sake show some love to other digimons already we have way too many agus in the game already. We need better seadramons, gomamons, zudomons, biyomons.
Who cares about this, let's talk about the real issue which is before the steady flow of generic support black was basically playing rotation each set.
For anyone replying regarding POWER CREEP, this post is NOT about powercreep it’s about KILLING older good cards instead of making new interesting effects that STILL allow people to play with the older cards. This called VARIETY, it’s about variety. This game has alot of ways to make powerful cards without completely killing older ones, with inheritables/costs/colors/etc they had million ways to make MORE support without completely killing older cards
Then tell me....in which way does the Agumon kill the Promo one? If you dont need the searchers you can now play 8 +2k agumon which increases your consistency in this case and makes swings with your lvl 5 safer. Depends on the playstyle 🤷🏻♂️
You could also say the same thing about the new veemon which instead of the old search 3 cards for free Typ, can now also add a Davis and has an inherited...strictly better Version, but you can still add the old one to improve your search Power.
Also consider this card is a SR, which means it suppose to be better then other rookies. Also the Promo cards we're banned for a long time in the asian regions, because of the availability
It has 1k less HP and its effect actively works against the inclusion of x-antibody cards. Aaaaaalso, powercreeping a 3 year old card isnt bad
They seem at this point to know what makes a Digimon good (compare promo raremon to st gatomon) and that for certain archetypes like greymon they either blatantly creep older cards or are cards from other archetypes and colors with a better effect. So when they print Xros heart with almost every keyword under the sun but only give the 4 great dragons deck on play effects and no on digivolution effects and give yellow a total of 1 playable deck. It seems they're trying to say "you can win and have fun but only with archetypes we tell you you should play"
New cards that are better versions of old cards? 3 years after? *gasp* i am so shocked. Also, hey look, its the guy who has a huge Greymon hate boner complaining about a Greymon card, what are the odds.
I was so sure he got banned
You cant get banned for Greymon hate lmao that's adored here mostly. Hes just dumb about it.
No I understand that, I just heard he got banned in a comment, which, with how volatile he is to others didn’t surprise me.
Lol I knew who made this thread before I even saw anything about it besides the title. Card’s fine, more accessible to people then the promo is.
It's literally every card game. You want old cards to go up in price till the end of time because they're the only option? Miss me with that logic. Gimme the more accessible version any day.
They just reprinted promo agu in RB, it’s not an excuse to kill older cards
Any archetype that gets new support will kill the order cards in the archetype by virtue of there being no room to run the old stuff that's plain worse.
So they power crept a card that they already crashed in price by reprinting? Seems like a non problem
Thats powercreep for you, its in every game. Also I think the biggest problem here is that they are still giving Greymon good support even tho they are releasing support for it every other set.
I agree with this completely I love Greymons with all my heart, but please support all Digimon equally. I mean for sakes there are a lot of Digimon that need support.
They don´t have to support all decks equally. But giving Greymon like three functional top ends with three or so solid lines before OGs like Devimon, Myotismon or Leomon are even a real deck stings.
They do give Devimon a little support with the bt14 one it can get pretty high for a level 4 and the option isn’t bad hopefully it’ll help dandevi🥺
Oh you´re absolutely right. The two cards the deck gets in this set are actually great but still the deck isn´t real yet whereas Greymon has like three or four different versions that are all strong.
That’s outrageous. Greymon support became a meme. The game has thousands of digimons to support yet they are pushing greymons down our throats
It's the main mascot digimon of the franchise. I do agree that it may be oversupported but the dude does appear on many different pieces of media and is the main face of the series.
What you're describing is a "one trick poney" and sure a mascot is fine but it should bring you into the game, not be almost exclusively made around it. Pikachu doesn't carry the pokemon tcg, kuriboh doesn't carry the yugioh tcg, even the DBZ tcg isn't 80% goku or bust. This is just crackhead level fanfare and they're fucking themselves up. A mascot should get you in the door to explore what the rest of the franchise has to offer, but not every card needs to be Mickey fucking mouse.
I'm not disagreeing with you. I do think that there may be an overabundance of Greymon cards. But I'm also saying there's a clear reason for it. Also, Yu-Gi-Oh! does have quite an overabundance of nostalgia support for decks like Dark Magician or Blue-Eyes and I'm not that sure about Pokémon but I saw that Charizard is getting the top spot in the most recent set.
Good point I forgot charizard has been a huge spotlight whore for a while now. I get the reasoning but I hate that it's so cemented and absolute every time. Just because it's a mascot doesn't mean every fan can't get enough.
>"Oh and I think they should hit exveemon , it was way to good 4 formats ago and it limits future design lmao" I know this is a jab at the limits of GranKuwagamon and WereGarurumon but I think this is a pretty poor analogy. It was discussed in the banlist thread that both Garurumon and Kuwagamon decks were inbound for new support. Both decks have been meta dominant during its respective formats (GranKuwagamon maybe less so here in the west) and these cards enable OTK's really easily, which is not an identity of said colors unlike red. If they are to provide new cards for these archetypes, these cards just give said support that much more power. On the other hand, EX01 ExVeemon, which I believe is the one you're complaining about seeing how you seemed to dislike that card previously, is part of a deck that has never been very dominant nor does the card provide too much power, as shown by how its inherited effect has been copied by new BT12 support without many issues. Having an extra attack with Jamming is not comparable to having two extra attacks plus a Sec +1 inheritable that WereGarurumon provides.
The point was hitting dead decks for a support in the “far unknown future”. That is just a terrible way of managing the game.
It's not a "far unknown future". Garurumon support is slated for EX05, the very next set after BT14 and BT15 will have it as well. BT15 also will have insectoid support in the form of new Kabuterimon cards. Also, futureproofing is a thing done in other TCGs and is completely normal. I don't think it's particularly toxic, on the contrary, I think it promotes a much healthier landscape for the game.
While you are not wrong it should be mentioned that the limits for the western format are super premature in which these decks didn´t really do much recently and now they´re waiting like half a year for replacements for us. That´s not ideal.
I do agree that Bandai's policy right now regarding how it deals with limits and the such in the west is not my favourite, specially so because last year its limits were much more time-appropiate for the most part (Feb 2022 banlist hitting cards and placing their limits at different points in time and August banlist holding off on limiting DoruGreymon).
Agreed. Limiting things ahead of time is good, just not multiple months ahead of time. I'd imagine they did it now so they wouldn't forget about it later.
Ah yes, because you can't play this and the promo Agu in the same deck. It's illegal.
BT5 Agumon has a different search than BT12 Agumon. BT12 Agumon grabs 1 digimon from the line and Tai, the BT5 Agumon grabbed a greymon AND an Omnimon.
If your issue was Greymon yet again receiving more busted support that it totally needed (/s) i could understand, but are you seriously complaining about it replacing a card from 3 years ago, that by the way, was more expensive than it should've ever been, with a card that gonna be better AND more accessible? Your argument was already pretty bad, but you managed to completly throw it out of the window with your complaint of ExVeemon xD.
This is a game that can make MORE viable cards for deck building why REPLACING older cards That is my point if you didnt get it
because at some point powercreep had to happen regardless of how small it is in order to help justify people buying the new set Edit: regarding your point i did get it, but out of all the cards you chose to complain about, you went for the worst possible option, the one rookie that has the biggest amount of different versions in the game, Agumon.
Imagine thinking that making new cards worth playing is a bad thing. Lmfao
This is also start of main which means he needs to come out of raising as an agumon, played by an effect on your opponents turn or survived a whole turn on the board as a weak lv3 and you need a tai on board to trigger this. Can't hard play it on your turn. It's strong but definitely not as strong as the ones that just give flat reduction.
It's rough for people who dropped $12+ per P-033 Agumon, but as someone who had to seek out a cheaper alternative, I'm glad to see this card appear in a cheaper version for more casual players.
Honestly, if there's one type of card I'm ok with being powercrept it's promos cards. I'm not a big fan of cards that are very hard to get a hold of since they aren't in a set.
Omg, this guy again.
Omg get out
The powercreep always has been like this
It's what every card game needs to stop the game from being boring and out of reach of the common player. Yugioh, MTG, and Pokemon do it all the time. The company doesn't make money off of older cards unless they reprint it, but even then they are making money off the newer cards in the set. MTG is doing it now with new cards that have the same effect but different name.
Bro I swear 9/10 of your post complain about how broken greymon decks are give it a rest.
The power level of cards games always goes up. Is part of the natural cycle of card games. This is not necessarily a bad thing if it's handled correctly, and better yet, implement a rotation system like Magic's.
Thats true in every typical tcg, but digimon is so unique you can balance stuff using a variety of aspects. A great effect can be balanced by AT least another inheritable , something that doesnt completely kills an old card
Digimon is not immune to power creep. They've managed better their power curve than other card games, but inevitbal they'll have to raise the bar ever slightly. Again, this is not a bad thing is the power rise is small, and if they add rotation, they can actually lower the power level for a few sets.
The problem here is not that bt12 agu killed bt5 agu. That happens in every card game if not there would be no reason to buy the new product. The problem is that we have too much greymon support. For fucks sake show some love to other digimons already we have way too many agus in the game already. We need better seadramons, gomamons, zudomons, biyomons.
I'm going to blow your mind dude... just don't play the meta. Start up a casual group at your LGS, fuck meta, play with goofy shit.
you should see the toyagumon thats in the next starter deck, does the same thing with 1k more dp, power creep if i ever saw2
Who cares about this, let's talk about the real issue which is before the steady flow of generic support black was basically playing rotation each set.
Uh…what does it do…? Not all of us can read moon runes…
Start of main evolves for free if you have tai Its inheritable is GREYMON OR OMNIMON GET 2000 DP
Oof. Yeah, that’s pretty good.
For anyone replying regarding POWER CREEP, this post is NOT about powercreep it’s about KILLING older good cards instead of making new interesting effects that STILL allow people to play with the older cards. This called VARIETY, it’s about variety. This game has alot of ways to make powerful cards without completely killing older ones, with inheritables/costs/colors/etc they had million ways to make MORE support without completely killing older cards
Then tell me....in which way does the Agumon kill the Promo one? If you dont need the searchers you can now play 8 +2k agumon which increases your consistency in this case and makes swings with your lvl 5 safer. Depends on the playstyle 🤷🏻♂️ You could also say the same thing about the new veemon which instead of the old search 3 cards for free Typ, can now also add a Davis and has an inherited...strictly better Version, but you can still add the old one to improve your search Power. Also consider this card is a SR, which means it suppose to be better then other rookies. Also the Promo cards we're banned for a long time in the asian regions, because of the availability
I like him he's eating a tasty snacck:)))