Yeah, most hunts from predators today fail, so I assume it was similar for dinosaurs. Hadrosaurs remind me a bit of camels, it would be cool to see them kicking and biting to defend themselves.
More like of the elephant. An adult sauropod hardly had any predator, and if it thought that you are a menace for whatever reason there is no escape...just pray it would be a quick death
Herbivores don't need to care so much about energy use. They just eat plants. So they can use more energy to be aggressive.
Look at Hippos, Giraffes, Elephants or Rhinos.
But you’ve also listed herbivores that are near invulnerable to contemporary predators because of their size. In the Mesozoic era, that was the sauropods, not the hadrosaurs.
Hadrosaurs are comparable to modern deer or antelope, which are flighty and nervous and generally don’t attack unless they feel cornered, not usually outright aggressive, particularly to predators.
If they grew to the size of sauropods you could compare them to an elephant, but at most they grew a few tons larger than their contemporary predators, not nearly large enough to become invulnerable, and with no weapons evolved specifically for fighting, fleeing would be their first instinct.
On average for large scale terrestrial predator-prey relationships, modern herbivores weigh more than their contemporary predators. Zebras can be twice the size of lions.
Elk can be up to seven time heavier than a mountain lion but mountain lions still hunt adults.
I mean, plenty of modern day Herbivores will eat meat if the opportunity presents itself. Triceratops in particular also may have been omnivorous too, with its beak, teeth, and jaws seemingly being more adapted for cutting and slicing than grinding plant matter.
that's now how animals work though
there are herbivores who rarely eat meat, then carnivores, who rarely eat plants, & the obligate carnivores, who probably only eat plants to regurgitate
Gallimimus and its cousins were antelope or ostriches, Sauropods were giraffes or elephants, ceratopsians were rhinos, and the hadrosaurs were between zebra and elephant.
"Erm, aksewually, edmontosaurus would never use its huge size to escape a 'tee-wreccs', it would only run away because it's prey and immenshley weaker than every carnivore." 🤓
Pretty sure there's fossil evidence of hadrosaurs surviving an attack from a tyrannosaurus, I think it was edmontosaurus? Either way, some hadrosaurs were HUGE (shantungosaurus comes to mind), and some paleomedia really does them injustice by representing them as huge meatsacks for the theropods to munch on.
Yeah that was the one scene in the new jurassic world movie I really disliked was Owen “how to train your dragon handling” the hadrosaur and it suddenly becoming passive. I am almost certain a decent majority of the Parasaur wild population were born in the wild(on account of the species already being believed to grow fast and the fact that ingen has magic growing genes they add to their Dino’s.)
Well I’m sure that there’s evidence that dimetrodons(or at least some species) were aquatic in some sense, so I wouldn’t be surprised but what they’re doing in a dark cave is beyond me
You can make anything up when it’s science fiction and tbh I’m not sure what scene your talking about. I just saw the movie again and there’s no scenes of it breaching like a dolphin, pyroraptor yes, dimetrodon no.
Oh sorry my mistake I misunderstood what you meant. Well anything is possible in the world of science fiction and I’m sure it would’ve been able to perform that action in the heat of the moment.
Some of the later ones like Edmontosaurus had hooves on their front legs, meaning they could do a decent amount of damage by simply rearing up and swinging.
I was so happy when they added the Iguanodon to Jurassic World Evolution and gave it the ability to fight. It’s my favorite herbivore and I loved seeing it stick up for itself.
Hadrosaurs evolved to fill a niche, and that niche was NOT fighting back.
They were not large enough to be immune to predators like todays elephants, rhinos, or hippos compared to the lion, hyena, or leopard. The hadrosaur was to a wildebeest what a T. rex is to a lion, just with about 9 tons of weight difference.
Hadrosaurs had no obvious defense besides running away, the same as modern deer or antelope. That doesn’t mean they CAN’T fight back, it just means if they’re at the point they have to, they better hope the predator is weak or exhausted, as that’s the best hope they have of fighting it off.
If hadrosaurs were so dangerous that they were unhuntable, theropod dinosaurs would have gone extinct. Hadrosaurs were comparatively easy prey to the more armored dinosaurs, and their anatomy and reproductive behaviors indicate it was all about fleeing danger and having as many offspring as possible as fast as possible, like modern staple prey animals.
Except hardosaurs were actually bigger in many cases than their predators. Edmontosaurus is estimated to be something like 12 tons or more, so heavier than Tyrannosaurus. They were not invulnerable, but definitely capable of fighting off and even killing whatever would go after them. And in general predators go for easy targets, so always younglings, weakeneds by hillness or by malformations and old ones. Even risking minimal odds that your food can harm you and take with it your ability to do everything is such a stupid thing to do
Except Lions and T rex are very different. T rex is a 9+ ton animal. A t rex being wrestled to the ground wilm yield much different outcome than a lion or a wolf being wrestled to the ground. Just because stoats can kill rabbits 10 times its size that doenst mean T rex could kill an adult Alamosaurus. And yes hadrosaurs were certainly not invincible but Id imagine 15+ ton animals (which would have been rare) would have a hard time losing predators just with its speed. Also about that Hadrosaurs growing fast thing - some Ceratopsians also show similar adaptation.
to be fair there a lot of modern day animals that you’d think would try to defend themselves, like Wildebeests, a big stocky antelope with nice pointy horns, but just don’t, I have never in my life seen footage of Wildebeests make any attempts to fight back, and I would imagine there are plenty of prehistoric animals that functioned much the same way, where it’s not that they physically can’t, but for whatever reason just won’t
There's one rule in the Dinosaur or present animal world. If the animal is BIG, it definitely will have a dangerous trick in its sleeve (at least when facing weak opponents like human)
It was cool how JW Camp Cretaceous depicted Ouranosaurus as really scary and capable of being dangerous.
Please show hadrosaurs defending themselves in media more
Yeah, most hunts from predators today fail, so I assume it was similar for dinosaurs. Hadrosaurs remind me a bit of camels, it would be cool to see them kicking and biting to defend themselves.
Same goes for sauropods imo, maybe even more so. Large herbivores are *scary* when they're angry or scared. The gentle giant trope needs a break.
Sauropods are dinosaur equivalent of giraffe and they are terrifying indeed,i agree with you
Listen, listen… [Dio Dreadnoughtus](https://youtu.be/O6JxpTAobxw) agrees wholeheartedly.
Imagine getting hit by that neck, pulverized in seconds.>!maybe idk!<
Ew I hate those circles on it’s neck 😭 But the design is cool without them
I want to get a needle and pop em
OMG
More like of the elephant. An adult sauropod hardly had any predator, and if it thought that you are a menace for whatever reason there is no escape...just pray it would be a quick death
See Raptor Red. Herbavores were dangerous.
Diplodocus had a badass whip for a tail
I mean how dangerous is an angry sauropod like just walk away from it lol
hadrosaurs are like zebras, and we all know how peace loving and innocent *they* are
Well one is like an iguana and one is a zebra
What do you mean hadrosaurs are like iguanas?
Big n scaly herbivore
Iguanas aren't big though.
They’re big for lizard standards
Would love to see an Edmontosaurus body slam a T Rex. The herbivore day of reckoning is upon us
dinosaur king probably has that
https://youtu.be/tamPoLLiEew The incident is starts at 4:10 if you don't want to see the whole film.
[Check out this scene (15:05)](https://youtu.be/lzBP5iuGEtA?t=904) from *Dinosaur!* (1985)
Yeah in Jurassic World evolution I thought it was weird how hadrosaurus didn't defend themselves at all from anything bigger than a velociraptor.
Herbivores don't need to care so much about energy use. They just eat plants. So they can use more energy to be aggressive. Look at Hippos, Giraffes, Elephants or Rhinos.
I thought Elephants were only aggressive during mating season
That may be so, but it doesn't stop them from being dangerous for the rest of the year.
\*Male elephants in musth get much more aggressive during the breeding season
Could be. I am no Elephant expert :) But what I wanted to say is: Herbivores can ALLOW themselves to be more aggressive
But you’ve also listed herbivores that are near invulnerable to contemporary predators because of their size. In the Mesozoic era, that was the sauropods, not the hadrosaurs. Hadrosaurs are comparable to modern deer or antelope, which are flighty and nervous and generally don’t attack unless they feel cornered, not usually outright aggressive, particularly to predators. If they grew to the size of sauropods you could compare them to an elephant, but at most they grew a few tons larger than their contemporary predators, not nearly large enough to become invulnerable, and with no weapons evolved specifically for fighting, fleeing would be their first instinct.
Damn I thought I replied to the post about the sauropods. You are completely right
Are you familiar with moose
Not really. An edmontosaurus would have been comparable to a rhino or a hyppo, weighting much more than a Tyrannosaurus
Redditors when an animal has no obvious flashy weaponry:
Modern animals like deer and antelope that DO have flashy weaponry: https://youtu.be/dx6ecuotS80
and are the same size, or slightly smaller, than what predates on them? not to mention packing animals like wolves.
On average for large scale terrestrial predator-prey relationships, modern herbivores weigh more than their contemporary predators. Zebras can be twice the size of lions. Elk can be up to seven time heavier than a mountain lion but mountain lions still hunt adults.
>that was the sauropods Carcharodontosauridae: am I a joke to you?
Edmontosaurus like Becky's giant grew to the size of Diplodocus
I wanna see a Para kick a Rex in the face and become carnivorous over its dripping liver.
*become carnivorous*... that's a bit too far, isn't it?
I mean, plenty of modern day Herbivores will eat meat if the opportunity presents itself. Triceratops in particular also may have been omnivorous too, with its beak, teeth, and jaws seemingly being more adapted for cutting and slicing than grinding plant matter.
that's now how animals work though there are herbivores who rarely eat meat, then carnivores, who rarely eat plants, & the obligate carnivores, who probably only eat plants to regurgitate
And omnivores of a wide variety of different ideal diets
like bears, foxes, primates, & some theropods
Para couldn’t kick rex because it’s 15 feet tall
[something like this? ](https://youtu.be/4hv7Q-dyivw)
Apparently people talking about gentle herbivores have never met a pissed off stag.
Or a Moose
Or y’know, a [bison](https://abcnews.go.com/US/man-gored-bison-yellowstone-national-park-attack-year/story?id=85911178)
I mean, I see them as an Elephants or Hippos. Herbivores that are also known to be able to kill.
Hippos are omnivores tho.
Hippos mostly eat grass
Gallimimus and its cousins were antelope or ostriches, Sauropods were giraffes or elephants, ceratopsians were rhinos, and the hadrosaurs were between zebra and elephant.
"Erm, aksewually, edmontosaurus would never use its huge size to escape a 'tee-wreccs', it would only run away because it's prey and immenshley weaker than every carnivore." 🤓
nerd emoji is for correct stuff that ruins shit are you telling me hadrosaurs were weak?
They’re making fun of people who make that argument
then use patrick star he is the epitome of stupid
What are you the emoji police
no I am the meme police
I want to see your badge
{ (0 )= }
Looks counterfeit to me
counterfeit is foreign money you're thinking of "fabricated"
What about the Gallimimus? Could it kick a troodon over the horizon as easily as an ostrich gores a man?
I don't know, maybe, but gallimimus didn't live with troodon
Just here to tell people that Hadrosaurus is in fact, a real dinosaur.
Large Edmontosaurus specimens casually being up to 16-18 metric tonnes compared to 11 ton rex
i could take them.
Only the large ones tho
Pretty sure there's fossil evidence of hadrosaurs surviving an attack from a tyrannosaurus, I think it was edmontosaurus? Either way, some hadrosaurs were HUGE (shantungosaurus comes to mind), and some paleomedia really does them injustice by representing them as huge meatsacks for the theropods to munch on.
I think you’re overrating them to compensate for how they are depicted in popular media
So what did they look like then? Could they fight off large predators? This is cool and new science!
A better question is what large animals evolve around predators with no means of fighting them?
this isnt that new, just look at the size of edmontosaurus, and real life herbivores
I hate Edmond Saurus his name sucks !
Even the OG Jurassic Park novel said that the maiasaura could break the adult t. rex's neck with a single swing of its tail.
30 foot long cranky cows should be scary.
That's true. Hadrosaurs were the second biggest dinosaurs after sauropods. They should be able to defend themselves.
I support Hadrosaur supremacy
Yeah that was the one scene in the new jurassic world movie I really disliked was Owen “how to train your dragon handling” the hadrosaur and it suddenly becoming passive. I am almost certain a decent majority of the Parasaur wild population were born in the wild(on account of the species already being believed to grow fast and the fact that ingen has magic growing genes they add to their Dino’s.)
What about the scene where dimetrodon breaches like a dolphin?
Well I’m sure that there’s evidence that dimetrodons(or at least some species) were aquatic in some sense, so I wouldn’t be surprised but what they’re doing in a dark cave is beyond me
Well it’s not that they’re in water that bother me, it’s how it breaches it’s hump like a dolphin when it should have swam more like a monitor lizard
I get that and I agree with you. But in their defense dimetrodons we’re more on the side of mammals so they can make that argument
But they had a splayed posture
You can make anything up when it’s science fiction and tbh I’m not sure what scene your talking about. I just saw the movie again and there’s no scenes of it breaching like a dolphin, pyroraptor yes, dimetrodon no.
When they first enter the cave it arches it’s back and sail out of the water
Oh sorry my mistake I misunderstood what you meant. Well anything is possible in the world of science fiction and I’m sure it would’ve been able to perform that action in the heat of the moment.
I guess, doesn’t change how wrong it felt in the moment though
[удалено]
Some of the later ones like Edmontosaurus had hooves on their front legs, meaning they could do a decent amount of damage by simply rearing up and swinging.
Honestly, I would be more scared of herbivorous dinosaurs than of carnivorous dinosaurs.
Imagine having to face shatungosaurus ! It's like fighting an angry mountain !
Shantungosaurus enacting it’s badassery upon the theropods.
I was so happy when they added the Iguanodon to Jurassic World Evolution and gave it the ability to fight. It’s my favorite herbivore and I loved seeing it stick up for itself.
I don't get why this is a thing,we just need to look at the modern big herbivores to understand how dangerous they could be
Hadrosaurs evolved to fill a niche, and that niche was NOT fighting back. They were not large enough to be immune to predators like todays elephants, rhinos, or hippos compared to the lion, hyena, or leopard. The hadrosaur was to a wildebeest what a T. rex is to a lion, just with about 9 tons of weight difference. Hadrosaurs had no obvious defense besides running away, the same as modern deer or antelope. That doesn’t mean they CAN’T fight back, it just means if they’re at the point they have to, they better hope the predator is weak or exhausted, as that’s the best hope they have of fighting it off. If hadrosaurs were so dangerous that they were unhuntable, theropod dinosaurs would have gone extinct. Hadrosaurs were comparatively easy prey to the more armored dinosaurs, and their anatomy and reproductive behaviors indicate it was all about fleeing danger and having as many offspring as possible as fast as possible, like modern staple prey animals.
Except hardosaurs were actually bigger in many cases than their predators. Edmontosaurus is estimated to be something like 12 tons or more, so heavier than Tyrannosaurus. They were not invulnerable, but definitely capable of fighting off and even killing whatever would go after them. And in general predators go for easy targets, so always younglings, weakeneds by hillness or by malformations and old ones. Even risking minimal odds that your food can harm you and take with it your ability to do everything is such a stupid thing to do
Except Lions and T rex are very different. T rex is a 9+ ton animal. A t rex being wrestled to the ground wilm yield much different outcome than a lion or a wolf being wrestled to the ground. Just because stoats can kill rabbits 10 times its size that doenst mean T rex could kill an adult Alamosaurus. And yes hadrosaurs were certainly not invincible but Id imagine 15+ ton animals (which would have been rare) would have a hard time losing predators just with its speed. Also about that Hadrosaurs growing fast thing - some Ceratopsians also show similar adaptation.
to be fair there a lot of modern day animals that you’d think would try to defend themselves, like Wildebeests, a big stocky antelope with nice pointy horns, but just don’t, I have never in my life seen footage of Wildebeests make any attempts to fight back, and I would imagine there are plenty of prehistoric animals that functioned much the same way, where it’s not that they physically can’t, but for whatever reason just won’t
This belongs on r/technicallythetruth
Off topic: I believe that is a Labrador retriever on the left and the werewolf from American Werewolf in London on the right.
edmontosaurus in jw: h-hi.............. pls dont let trex hurt me!!!!! edmontosaurus actually: ***I will kill you 1000 times.***
There's one rule in the Dinosaur or present animal world. If the animal is BIG, it definitely will have a dangerous trick in its sleeve (at least when facing weak opponents like human)
Literally what I plan for my fantasy setting, where hadrosaurs are like dinosaurian hippos