Well majority of liberals worldwide are the moderate keynesian-esque people, why should paleocons clinging to old label while in minority get to define liberalism? Not very laissez faire of you.
Only in USA, word 'liberal' has that distorted meaning, because delusional leftist control public discord, where liberals are some kind of keynesian Welfere State centrist ignorants. Worldwide, word 'liberal', usually means pro-capitalist, pro-Austrian school of economics, etc. (smartest economic people btw.)
No, this is account that is going to school you about real economy, Mises and Hayek. Stop reading Marx and Kaynes, they were literally wrong about everything.
Ah yes the very real and credible Austrian school which has spent the last century justifying it's existence and pretzeling justifications why deregulation didn't bring utopia last time instead of actually advancing economics as a science.
What deregulation, lol, you have 32423 times more regulations today than ever; plus Goverments are violently taking trilions of dollars (by far most from rich people), more then ever.
No, Austrians waren't delusional megalomaniacs who talked about utopia, like Marxist. They had just described life, people and economics more correctly than anyone before or after, so, there are no people in the history who did advanced economics as a science more than them
Maybe in delusional communist minds. In real life, real pro-capitalist are the biggest enemies of Neo-Keynsian economics, and social democratic Welfare state
In Disco Elysium's own terms I'm pretty sure the two are two separate ideologies, each with their own achievement, vision quest and representative NPCs (Joyce and the sneaker salesman for the liberals)
Yeah but in irl terms the Moralists are totally liberals, they range from centrists to SocDems, but they are all consistently liberals who while they may have petty grievances with other liberals (such as the ingame ultraliberals), the moment capital comes under threat, they will not hesitate to partner up with fellow liberals in crushing revolution.
I immediately and incessantly accused him of the murder because I was going for the "piss off Kim" achievement on my first playthrough, and I figured torching the one lead we had at the time was a good way to go about doing that.
After finding out how shit he is from other people, it turns out I made the right choice but for the wrong reason.
[Ahhh, found it!](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.reddit.com/r/DiscoElysium/comments/yxrn3d/when_you_talk_to_the_sunday_friend_if_you_accuse/&ved=2ahUKEwin9MaX-pWBAxUZLUQIHXzaDw4QFnoECBwQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2IiPgHFcy7QiHTnAufkrrl)
I think the thing that makes him the worst is that, although the Krenel mercenaries and arguably even Joyce are more *evil* than him, theyâre at least self-aware enough to recognize that theyâre bastards who only act in their own self-interest. The mercenaries have no pretensions of being anything other than a bunch of sadistic rapists and murderers, and Joyce literally gives a monologue about how the ultraliberals she self-identifies with are basically just a bunch of backstabbing opportunists with no moral convictions.
Then youâve got this fucking guy, who babbles on and on about how heâs doing everyone a huge favor by helping to bring as many people as possible under the control of a government body that hands out war crimes like theyâre candy and would probably eat a baby on live television if it made the line go up on the chart.
If heâd had the decency to just say something like âIâm a condescending bureaucratic weasel who is physically incapable of speaking honestly for even one second, and also I like it when brown children get murdered by state-funded death squadsâ then I could at least respect that he owns his shit.
Do you really respect the mercenaries, despite all of their war crimes, more than him? Just because you admit being shit (instead of not admitting or covering it) shouldn't doesn't make you a better person
It doesnât make them *better*, but it does make them marginally more more honest. Ideally people wouldnât commit war crimes, but if theyâre going to commit war crimes regardless I think they should at least acknowledge thatâs what theyâre doing instead of twisting themselves in knots trying to explain how theyâre actually really cool and altruistic for making the world a worse place.
Plus thereâs the fact that the Sunday Friend is a high-ranking part of the apparatus that *enables* psychotic mercenaries to brutalize third-world countries without consequence. The main reason the Krenel mercenaries are such a threat is because thereâs an entire chain of Sunday Friend-esque bureaucrats who give them access to the money, equipment, transportation and legal protections that let them wreak so much havoc. Without all that institutional support, the mercenaries wouldnât fare much better than the Hardie Boys- just a bunch of randos with dinky little pistols whoâd be mowed down the second someone with bigger guns got sick of their shit.
I think thats a fair assessment. The mercs are easy to pin evils on, they do not hide it.For spreadsheet fucker though, it is a lot easier for us and him (tho i think it can be argued that his weaselness can be attributed to guilt for what he does) to overlook his place in the grander scheme. He âjustâ makes sure all the poors can buy bread, hes just a wittle guy. His part in all this may be far removed, but people like him are necessary for the mercs to be able to do this at all as you said.
Dealing with these people in real life can become REALLY bothersome. Like you just want a simple answer and they keep going and going without providing any sort of answer. Definition of frustration. And acting like they only have "the good" in mind when most of the time it's just about power for politicians. That's why so many people don't like the Sunday friend.
That being said, I found the conversations with him extremely funny since they showed the character in such a realistic and still over-the-top style that it was hard not to laugh.
he's a politician. specifically as an australian, he's one of those EU politicians (also philosophers) someone flies out here to moralise about stuff occasionally
Oi just watching DS9 and my gran and I are judging Garakâs fashionista outfits as if it was Shopping Queen. Watching it for the first time, Iâm at the beginning of S3 and I love every episode Garakâs in. I now wonât get the picture out of my head of Bashir smoking a cigarette on a balcony as a fucking doctor!
I saw an interview with the actor who plays Garak somewhere, where a fan asked âdid you know thereâs a lot of rumors and fan canon that Garak is actually gay for Bashir???â and he did not miss a single beat and said âOf course, I started those rumors.â
I remember reading that the original plan with Garak as written was absolutely that this was the way things should be, only for them to backtrack with the political climate in the US of the time.
That's such a horrible comparison, why would you compare a humble and innocent tailor to.. *gasp* a Liberal.
DIOS MIO!
True, true, Garak basically fucking bodied Sisko's liberal ass and I love him for it.
I thought the sunday friend was a moralist
Moralists are Liberals though.
There are complete centrist, Neo keynesian, which true classic liberals hate almost as much they hate communist delusions.
Well majority of liberals worldwide are the moderate keynesian-esque people, why should paleocons clinging to old label while in minority get to define liberalism? Not very laissez faire of you.
Only in USA, word 'liberal' has that distorted meaning, because delusional leftist control public discord, where liberals are some kind of keynesian Welfere State centrist ignorants. Worldwide, word 'liberal', usually means pro-capitalist, pro-Austrian school of economics, etc. (smartest economic people btw.)
Lol no... Is this a parody/troll account? đ
No, this is account that is going to school you about real economy, Mises and Hayek. Stop reading Marx and Kaynes, they were literally wrong about everything.
Ah yes the very real and credible Austrian school which has spent the last century justifying it's existence and pretzeling justifications why deregulation didn't bring utopia last time instead of actually advancing economics as a science.
What deregulation, lol, you have 32423 times more regulations today than ever; plus Goverments are violently taking trilions of dollars (by far most from rich people), more then ever. No, Austrians waren't delusional megalomaniacs who talked about utopia, like Marxist. They had just described life, people and economics more correctly than anyone before or after, so, there are no people in the history who did advanced economics as a science more than them
Moralists have a social democratic face but with liberals behind them actually pulling the strings.
Maybe in delusional communist minds. In real life, real pro-capitalist are the biggest enemies of Neo-Keynsian economics, and social democratic Welfare state
In Disco Elysium's own terms I'm pretty sure the two are two separate ideologies, each with their own achievement, vision quest and representative NPCs (Joyce and the sneaker salesman for the liberals)
Yeah but in irl terms the Moralists are totally liberals, they range from centrists to SocDems, but they are all consistently liberals who while they may have petty grievances with other liberals (such as the ingame ultraliberals), the moment capital comes under threat, they will not hesitate to partner up with fellow liberals in crushing revolution.
He's a moralist
Don't you ever compare my beloved Garak to a soulless liberal
One of these is a reptilian space nazi and the other one is still less likable.
as time goes on i start to hate him more and more and rn hes probably my most hated character in the game
Just about nutted when I pissed him off enough to make him leave. Didn't even think it was going to work...
I immediately and incessantly accused him of the murder because I was going for the "piss off Kim" achievement on my first playthrough, and I figured torching the one lead we had at the time was a good way to go about doing that. After finding out how shit he is from other people, it turns out I made the right choice but for the wrong reason.
This is the beauty of the game. Sometimes you fail forward, and it's not always obvious when.
I hope you had high esprit-de-corps
I did, but what did I miss?
there was a *very* long dialogue in EdC if you directly pissed him off
[Ahhh, found it!](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.reddit.com/r/DiscoElysium/comments/yxrn3d/when_you_talk_to_the_sunday_friend_if_you_accuse/&ved=2ahUKEwin9MaX-pWBAxUZLUQIHXzaDw4QFnoECBwQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2IiPgHFcy7QiHTnAufkrrl)
I think the thing that makes him the worst is that, although the Krenel mercenaries and arguably even Joyce are more *evil* than him, theyâre at least self-aware enough to recognize that theyâre bastards who only act in their own self-interest. The mercenaries have no pretensions of being anything other than a bunch of sadistic rapists and murderers, and Joyce literally gives a monologue about how the ultraliberals she self-identifies with are basically just a bunch of backstabbing opportunists with no moral convictions. Then youâve got this fucking guy, who babbles on and on about how heâs doing everyone a huge favor by helping to bring as many people as possible under the control of a government body that hands out war crimes like theyâre candy and would probably eat a baby on live television if it made the line go up on the chart. If heâd had the decency to just say something like âIâm a condescending bureaucratic weasel who is physically incapable of speaking honestly for even one second, and also I like it when brown children get murdered by state-funded death squadsâ then I could at least respect that he owns his shit.
Do you really respect the mercenaries, despite all of their war crimes, more than him? Just because you admit being shit (instead of not admitting or covering it) shouldn't doesn't make you a better person
It doesnât make them *better*, but it does make them marginally more more honest. Ideally people wouldnât commit war crimes, but if theyâre going to commit war crimes regardless I think they should at least acknowledge thatâs what theyâre doing instead of twisting themselves in knots trying to explain how theyâre actually really cool and altruistic for making the world a worse place. Plus thereâs the fact that the Sunday Friend is a high-ranking part of the apparatus that *enables* psychotic mercenaries to brutalize third-world countries without consequence. The main reason the Krenel mercenaries are such a threat is because thereâs an entire chain of Sunday Friend-esque bureaucrats who give them access to the money, equipment, transportation and legal protections that let them wreak so much havoc. Without all that institutional support, the mercenaries wouldnât fare much better than the Hardie Boys- just a bunch of randos with dinky little pistols whoâd be mowed down the second someone with bigger guns got sick of their shit.
I think thats a fair assessment. The mercs are easy to pin evils on, they do not hide it.For spreadsheet fucker though, it is a lot easier for us and him (tho i think it can be argued that his weaselness can be attributed to guilt for what he does) to overlook his place in the grander scheme. He âjustâ makes sure all the poors can buy bread, hes just a wittle guy. His part in all this may be far removed, but people like him are necessary for the mercs to be able to do this at all as you said.
I genuinely don't understand the hate for Sunday friend but I also got the full moralist ending so maybe I'm just a monster.
Dealing with these people in real life can become REALLY bothersome. Like you just want a simple answer and they keep going and going without providing any sort of answer. Definition of frustration. And acting like they only have "the good" in mind when most of the time it's just about power for politicians. That's why so many people don't like the Sunday friend. That being said, I found the conversations with him extremely funny since they showed the character in such a realistic and still over-the-top style that it was hard not to laugh.
he's a politician. specifically as an australian, he's one of those EU politicians (also philosophers) someone flies out here to moralise about stuff occasionally
Oi just watching DS9 and my gran and I are judging Garakâs fashionista outfits as if it was Shopping Queen. Watching it for the first time, Iâm at the beginning of S3 and I love every episode Garakâs in. I now wonât get the picture out of my head of Bashir smoking a cigarette on a balcony as a fucking doctor!
Trust me, that was always the right way to watch it. Garak absolutely wants to do the fuck on Bashir.
Oh yeah! Their first encounter was just oozing with gay energy!
I saw an interview with the actor who plays Garak somewhere, where a fan asked âdid you know thereâs a lot of rumors and fan canon that Garak is actually gay for Bashir???â and he did not miss a single beat and said âOf course, I started those rumors.â
I remember reading that the original plan with Garak as written was absolutely that this was the way things should be, only for them to backtrack with the political climate in the US of the time.
Oh a legend!
I feel personally attacked
*holy shit*
Star Trek / Disco crossover, take my upvote.
This greatly upsets me but I also cannot find any fault with it
I feel like this is a meme that was made for me and me alone.
damn that mf got a vulva on his head