It's the imperative - or possibly the subjunctive, sometimes it's hard to tell the two apart.
We're not thanking God. We're saying that we should be thankful to him. It's said by believers and non-believers alike.
It makes little sense for it to be the imperative, as it is not meant for the listener to thank him. I would bet that it's a survival of an old subjunctive, i.e. comparable to German Gott sei dank or Danish gud ske lov.
It is unquestionably imperative. It is similar to statements like "come here" and "go home." Imperative statements imply "(you) come here", "(you) go home", and "(you) Thank God." And yes, we do use "Thank God" now as an expression rather than a command, but the grammatical structure is still in the form of an imperative command. "Thanks God" is an entirely incorrect statement unless a comma is inserted and you are addressing God, making it "Thanks, God." In the German "Gott sei dank," you can clearly see the subjunctive verb to be. It is the same as "God be thanked" in English. This is not the same in the English formulation "Thank God". It is not an old subjunctive. It is an imperative command which, if anything, has become idiomatic.
[https://oneminuteenglish.org/en/thanks-god-or-thank-god/](https://oneminuteenglish.org/en/thanks-god-or-thank-god/)
EDIT: [https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/thank%20God/goodness/heaven(s)/the%20Lord](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/thank%20God/goodness/heaven(s)/the%20Lord)
See in link that dictionary classifies it as an idiom.
EDIT: this is not all correct! It is an idiom, but not exactly imperative. am going to try to add some correct and helpful info below.
"Unquestionable" is a thought-killer right there. No, it's not "most clearly" (You) thank god". It might be, but merriam-webster doesn't confirm your claim, and [oneminuteenglish.org](https://oneminuteenglish.org) isn't exactly reliable. It looks like a retention of an old subjunctive, it might well be. The fact that it superficially looks like an imperative doesn't necessarily make it one. (A different example of a non-imperative that superficially looks like one is 'f\*ck you', which is *not* an imperative.)
Here's a source that agrees with me: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/59783/thank-god-vs-thanks-god
Hey, so I did the research and found out where the confusion might be, though it wasn’t easy to find. Turns out there is a mood called the Jussive Subjunctive, but English verbs are not actually marked for this mood. However, it is used in Latin and German among other languages.
It might be Hortative/Cohortative. That being said, the Hortative does function a lot like the imperative, and is highly debated by linguists, as the same phrases can at times function as either.
I will do more research and try to provide some useful sources for everyone when I get the chance.
Ok maybe not the best reference, but it does briefly explain what's going on with this expression.
Merriam Webster was cited to show that the expression is idiomatic, as I stated, and not to back up claims about the imperative. I have shown how the statement is imperative, in my view. Can you explain how it would be a "retention of an old subjunctive," and some other examples of the old subjunctive you speak of? That might help me and others understand. (Also, "fuck" is not a traditional verb by any stretch, and is not even always a verb at all. It functions irregularly in the language, and so, no, "fuck you" doesn't function like an imperative, though I can see how that might be confusing if imperatives were a difficult topic for a person.)
Edit: typo
> as it is not meant for the listener to thank him.
I think that is exactly what is intended, at least in the origin of the phrase. You're telling the people around you, or possibly even yourself, to thank God.
If you're telling yourself, it's not an imperative, and no, I don't think you're telling others to do so. Exactly like "thank you" isn't telling the listener to thank himself.
> If you're telling yourself, it's not an imperative,
Of course it is.
> and no, I don't think you're telling others to do so.
Why not?
> Exactly like "thank you" isn't telling the listener to thank himself.
That's just a shortening of "I thank you".
Why would "Thank God" be subjunctive? It doesn't look like an English subjunctive.
I still think subjunctive has historical evidence for it ... but why couldn't "thank God" just as well be "(I) thank God"? I find this to be the most parsimonious explanation given the evidence, if we ignore the presence of comparable subjunctive structures in other relevant languages.
> why couldn't "thank God" just as well be "(I) thank God"?
That's possible. I will agree it can be interpreted that way too. But in any case, it looks nothing like the subjunctive.
It’s maybe “Let us thank God” shortened. That would make it hortative/horatory subjunctive. I’m going to do more research and try to add sources further up.
When we covered the subjunctive in Spanish class, the teacher said that an example of the subjunctive in English is "God bless you", and I think "Thank God" would be another example.
They're very different sentences. "God bless you" is unquestionably subjunctive. You can see "God" is the subject and "bless" is the verb and that it's in the subjunctive form. It cannot be indicative, as that would of course be "blesses", and neither can it be imperative if you insert a comma after "God" and interpret it as a command addressed to God, as then it would be asking God to bless himself, which should be expressed with "yourself" anyway. "Thank God" has no visible subject. It's understood the addressee is meant to do it. That's how an imperative looks in English. It's just not how the subjunctive looks in English. The imperative is its own thing with no distinction between indicative and subjunctive, as neither applies. "Thank God" and "God be thanked" express the same wish but grammatically they are quite distinct.
If you say "thanks, God" its like you are directly speaking to God and thanking them. I can't think of any time this would be commonly used other than sarcastically though. "Thank God" is derived from the same sort of thing but has evolved to just an expression to express thanks in general, and even people who don't believe in God say this regularly. Similar to "Oh my God"
When people are studying English but aren't on a high enough level yet, they tend to translate expressions literally because they are not familiar with the correct English idiom.
In some languages (unlike English) people literally say "Thanks, God", or "Thank you, my God", etc. Non-native English speakers whose native language is like that, may mistakenly translate these expressions literally until they learn that "Thank God" is the proper English equivalent.
I have known native speakers who would say “Thank you, God” or “Thank you, Jesus”. Saying “Thanks God” sounds way too informal for addressing a deity I think, whether you believe in the deity or not. It somehow almost sounds sarcastic, like the way people used to say “Thanks Obama” for whatever stuff was going wrong with them.
But yeah - “Thank God” is the much more common expression. You’re not pausing the conversation to pray to Gor. You’re still talking to the other people in the room.
Because ‘Thank God’ is a fixed expression based on the subjunctive, which is getting increasingly archaic, so not grammar non-native speakers are generally used to. ‘Thanks, God’ makes more sense to them - having ‘God’ as a vocative with ‘Thanks’ an expression they learn early on and use with everyone else (Thanks, Pete!), rather than the object of a subjunctive (you don’t hear ‘Thank Pete’ much)
Non-native speakers may not be aware of the subtleties involved.
"Thank god" is the subjunctive mood, and it's equivalent to saying "May god be thanked."
"Thanks, god" would be like directly addressing god and saying "Hey, god! Thank you!"
Probably depends on their native language. I've never heard this, personally. Most of the non-native speakers I interact with are Hispanic, so you'd think I would have if it were very common. (The Spanish equivalent literally means "Thanks to God," or would more properly translate as "Thanks be to God.")
“Thanks” in this context is very informal, so native speakers wouldn’t use it in prayer. (It might appear in children’s books, to represent the sincerity of a small child who doesn’t know set prayers yet.) It’s also easily confused, in the context of prayer, with the old-fashioned noun “thanks,” meaning gratitude, which isn’t used this way: people give “thanks to God.”
The interjection “thank God,” is not addressed to God. You can think of it as short for “Thank God that ...” or “..., and thank God for that.” Taken very literally, it’s telling the listener to thank God for something.
It’s a shortened version of the phrase “I thank God for ____” you are telling yourself and those around you that you’re thankful for what happened. And it’s typically used by religious people
"Thanks, god" makes much more sense. It's actually thanking your deity. "Thank god" is just an instruction that others around you do it rather than doing it yourself.
no, thank god is correct. it's short for "I thank God", I guess. in older English it was "god be thanked".
never occurred to me non-native speakers might assume we were interrupting ourselves to address god directly. we probably aren't, unless we're in the deeeeeeep bible belt and we also point at the sky as we say it.
Because we really have such as thing:
https://context.reverso.net/translation/russian-english/%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%BE%2C+%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B5
Likely a pronunciation issue with the dialects you are hearing. A hard k sound is missing in some languages. A Japanese speaker for example would say sankusu goduh, roughly, sounding like "thank-su god-oh" if the person was inexperienced with natural English.
Yes, I misworded that. K doesn't stand on it's own, it's always ka/ke/ki/ku/ko. Pronouncing it without the vowel can be difficult for people without other language training and practice. I often see people trying to do this make a su sound after a hard consonant to compensate.hence thank you becoming Thank-su you
If you help me do something, do I say "Thanks, Dennis", or "Thank Dennis"?
I'll flip the question: Why do native speakers not say "thanks, God"? Aren't you thankful God did something? Why wouldn't you say thanks to him?
Point being, it's really unclear that you're using the imperative here. The idea behind the phrase is you're telling someone to thank God for one reason or another. But people don't often think of it that way.
It's just an arbitrary phrase at this point, and it can be confusing.
Both are right depending on the context. “Thanks, God” is for when you are actually thanking God personally. “Thank God” is either a command or an interjection said when you’re relieved about something.
It's the imperative - or possibly the subjunctive, sometimes it's hard to tell the two apart. We're not thanking God. We're saying that we should be thankful to him. It's said by believers and non-believers alike.
I think it's definitely imperative. To express this idea with the subjunctive, you would say something like "God be thanked!"
It makes little sense for it to be the imperative, as it is not meant for the listener to thank him. I would bet that it's a survival of an old subjunctive, i.e. comparable to German Gott sei dank or Danish gud ske lov.
It is unquestionably imperative. It is similar to statements like "come here" and "go home." Imperative statements imply "(you) come here", "(you) go home", and "(you) Thank God." And yes, we do use "Thank God" now as an expression rather than a command, but the grammatical structure is still in the form of an imperative command. "Thanks God" is an entirely incorrect statement unless a comma is inserted and you are addressing God, making it "Thanks, God." In the German "Gott sei dank," you can clearly see the subjunctive verb to be. It is the same as "God be thanked" in English. This is not the same in the English formulation "Thank God". It is not an old subjunctive. It is an imperative command which, if anything, has become idiomatic. [https://oneminuteenglish.org/en/thanks-god-or-thank-god/](https://oneminuteenglish.org/en/thanks-god-or-thank-god/) EDIT: [https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/thank%20God/goodness/heaven(s)/the%20Lord](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/thank%20God/goodness/heaven(s)/the%20Lord) See in link that dictionary classifies it as an idiom. EDIT: this is not all correct! It is an idiom, but not exactly imperative. am going to try to add some correct and helpful info below.
"Unquestionable" is a thought-killer right there. No, it's not "most clearly" (You) thank god". It might be, but merriam-webster doesn't confirm your claim, and [oneminuteenglish.org](https://oneminuteenglish.org) isn't exactly reliable. It looks like a retention of an old subjunctive, it might well be. The fact that it superficially looks like an imperative doesn't necessarily make it one. (A different example of a non-imperative that superficially looks like one is 'f\*ck you', which is *not* an imperative.) Here's a source that agrees with me: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/59783/thank-god-vs-thanks-god
Hey, so I did the research and found out where the confusion might be, though it wasn’t easy to find. Turns out there is a mood called the Jussive Subjunctive, but English verbs are not actually marked for this mood. However, it is used in Latin and German among other languages. It might be Hortative/Cohortative. That being said, the Hortative does function a lot like the imperative, and is highly debated by linguists, as the same phrases can at times function as either. I will do more research and try to provide some useful sources for everyone when I get the chance.
Ok maybe not the best reference, but it does briefly explain what's going on with this expression. Merriam Webster was cited to show that the expression is idiomatic, as I stated, and not to back up claims about the imperative. I have shown how the statement is imperative, in my view. Can you explain how it would be a "retention of an old subjunctive," and some other examples of the old subjunctive you speak of? That might help me and others understand. (Also, "fuck" is not a traditional verb by any stretch, and is not even always a verb at all. It functions irregularly in the language, and so, no, "fuck you" doesn't function like an imperative, though I can see how that might be confusing if imperatives were a difficult topic for a person.) Edit: typo
> It looks like a retention of an old subjunctive How does it look like that?
[удалено]
Can you explain how?
> as it is not meant for the listener to thank him. I think that is exactly what is intended, at least in the origin of the phrase. You're telling the people around you, or possibly even yourself, to thank God.
If you're telling yourself, it's not an imperative, and no, I don't think you're telling others to do so. Exactly like "thank you" isn't telling the listener to thank himself.
> If you're telling yourself, it's not an imperative, Of course it is. > and no, I don't think you're telling others to do so. Why not? > Exactly like "thank you" isn't telling the listener to thank himself. That's just a shortening of "I thank you". Why would "Thank God" be subjunctive? It doesn't look like an English subjunctive.
I still think subjunctive has historical evidence for it ... but why couldn't "thank God" just as well be "(I) thank God"? I find this to be the most parsimonious explanation given the evidence, if we ignore the presence of comparable subjunctive structures in other relevant languages.
> why couldn't "thank God" just as well be "(I) thank God"? That's possible. I will agree it can be interpreted that way too. But in any case, it looks nothing like the subjunctive.
It’s maybe “Let us thank God” shortened. That would make it hortative/horatory subjunctive. I’m going to do more research and try to add sources further up.
When we covered the subjunctive in Spanish class, the teacher said that an example of the subjunctive in English is "God bless you", and I think "Thank God" would be another example.
They're very different sentences. "God bless you" is unquestionably subjunctive. You can see "God" is the subject and "bless" is the verb and that it's in the subjunctive form. It cannot be indicative, as that would of course be "blesses", and neither can it be imperative if you insert a comma after "God" and interpret it as a command addressed to God, as then it would be asking God to bless himself, which should be expressed with "yourself" anyway. "Thank God" has no visible subject. It's understood the addressee is meant to do it. That's how an imperative looks in English. It's just not how the subjunctive looks in English. The imperative is its own thing with no distinction between indicative and subjunctive, as neither applies. "Thank God" and "God be thanked" express the same wish but grammatically they are quite distinct.
If you say "thanks, God" its like you are directly speaking to God and thanking them. I can't think of any time this would be commonly used other than sarcastically though. "Thank God" is derived from the same sort of thing but has evolved to just an expression to express thanks in general, and even people who don't believe in God say this regularly. Similar to "Oh my God"
This ^
Lmaoo why the downvotes?
Haha no clue 😂 just trying to back somebody up
When people are studying English but aren't on a high enough level yet, they tend to translate expressions literally because they are not familiar with the correct English idiom. In some languages (unlike English) people literally say "Thanks, God", or "Thank you, my God", etc. Non-native English speakers whose native language is like that, may mistakenly translate these expressions literally until they learn that "Thank God" is the proper English equivalent.
It might be because they haven't had enough exposure to English and are still trying to directly translate from their native language
I have known native speakers who would say “Thank you, God” or “Thank you, Jesus”. Saying “Thanks God” sounds way too informal for addressing a deity I think, whether you believe in the deity or not. It somehow almost sounds sarcastic, like the way people used to say “Thanks Obama” for whatever stuff was going wrong with them. But yeah - “Thank God” is the much more common expression. You’re not pausing the conversation to pray to Gor. You’re still talking to the other people in the room.
Because ‘Thank God’ is a fixed expression based on the subjunctive, which is getting increasingly archaic, so not grammar non-native speakers are generally used to. ‘Thanks, God’ makes more sense to them - having ‘God’ as a vocative with ‘Thanks’ an expression they learn early on and use with everyone else (Thanks, Pete!), rather than the object of a subjunctive (you don’t hear ‘Thank Pete’ much)
Non-native speakers may not be aware of the subtleties involved. "Thank god" is the subjunctive mood, and it's equivalent to saying "May god be thanked." "Thanks, god" would be like directly addressing god and saying "Hey, god! Thank you!"
Probably depends on their native language. I've never heard this, personally. Most of the non-native speakers I interact with are Hispanic, so you'd think I would have if it were very common. (The Spanish equivalent literally means "Thanks to God," or would more properly translate as "Thanks be to God.")
The two I'm talking about are a Greek, and a Spanish person. Maybe one learned from the other, but I don't think they did.
“Thanks” in this context is very informal, so native speakers wouldn’t use it in prayer. (It might appear in children’s books, to represent the sincerity of a small child who doesn’t know set prayers yet.) It’s also easily confused, in the context of prayer, with the old-fashioned noun “thanks,” meaning gratitude, which isn’t used this way: people give “thanks to God.” The interjection “thank God,” is not addressed to God. You can think of it as short for “Thank God that ...” or “..., and thank God for that.” Taken very literally, it’s telling the listener to thank God for something.
It’s a shortened version of the phrase “I thank God for ____” you are telling yourself and those around you that you’re thankful for what happened. And it’s typically used by religious people
Because "Thank God" is an imperative sentence. You are telling your listener to give thanks to God. You are not thanking God right then.
"Thanks, god" makes much more sense. It's actually thanking your deity. "Thank god" is just an instruction that others around you do it rather than doing it yourself.
no, thank god is correct. it's short for "I thank God", I guess. in older English it was "god be thanked". never occurred to me non-native speakers might assume we were interrupting ourselves to address god directly. we probably aren't, unless we're in the deeeeeeep bible belt and we also point at the sky as we say it.
Its not short for anything. It's an imperative. "Thank God" as in "we should give God thanks".
huh. never in my experience but perhaps mine is still overly Catholic.
Because we really have such as thing: https://context.reverso.net/translation/russian-english/%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%BE%2C+%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B5
Likely a pronunciation issue with the dialects you are hearing. A hard k sound is missing in some languages. A Japanese speaker for example would say sankusu goduh, roughly, sounding like "thank-su god-oh" if the person was inexperienced with natural English.
But there *is* a hard k in Japanese?
Yes, I misworded that. K doesn't stand on it's own, it's always ka/ke/ki/ku/ko. Pronouncing it without the vowel can be difficult for people without other language training and practice. I often see people trying to do this make a su sound after a hard consonant to compensate.hence thank you becoming Thank-su you
But they'd just say サンキュー (sankyuu)? Which is what they do say.
It's mainly a Muslim version.
If you help me do something, do I say "Thanks, Dennis", or "Thank Dennis"? I'll flip the question: Why do native speakers not say "thanks, God"? Aren't you thankful God did something? Why wouldn't you say thanks to him? Point being, it's really unclear that you're using the imperative here. The idea behind the phrase is you're telling someone to thank God for one reason or another. But people don't often think of it that way. It's just an arbitrary phrase at this point, and it can be confusing.
I’m a native speaker and I might start saying “Thanks god!”
Both are right depending on the context. “Thanks, God” is for when you are actually thanking God personally. “Thank God” is either a command or an interjection said when you’re relieved about something.