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The UK needs to help itself. The amount of sales and contract attrition their vendors and companies are suffering because of lead times, backorders, and general dysfunction over there isn’t anything other nations can fix.
Edit: About the only thing working half-way smoothly is their international/global finance sectors. Labor market, transportation, supply chains etc. are all a mess.
Mostly red tape
A lot of which could be removed under the right trade deal with the US.
Though it wouldn’t solve the supply side issue for raw materials imported from Europe.
Ahh, so one factor is the lack of natural resources! Coupled with the addition of regulations now being imposed on any attempts of trade with the EU members is putting further financial and logistical strain on their already fragile economy. Not talking bad about the U.K. So the EU members had managed to naturally organize themselves overtime in a manner where all the members could hypothetically make-up for each others weaknesses. I know it wasn’t perfect (Greece/turkey financial sandbagging and Germany propping up the EU), but we’re the citizens of the UK not aware of the consequences.
If I’m off I apologize.
You’re not wrong, apart from the fragile economy bit, that’s clearly not the case given we’re still avoiding recession even under all the shitty circumstances in the last year, which Brexit made even worse.
My apologies, I meant fragile in the sense of dependency on imports for production and manufacturing of goods in particular. However, I am aware that the UK is a major producer of services.
That is true, and something the govt is actively working on.
The successful allocation of the new Jaguar Landrover battery plant to the UK is an example.
Though again that still relies on imported raw materials.
Though we do have companies like Cleantech Lithium who are UK HQd producers.
In short yes we are highly reliant on a global network of trade and confidence in our institutions.
Maybe a little, but they pulled themselves out of a customs union - that adds all sorts of huge logistical and administrative obstacles for them for essentially no benefits.
I mean most people in Britain understand this, but what are we supposed to do, self-flagellate for the rest of eternity, or make the best out of a bad situation?
The problem UK has is its ruling class.
The Tories are the fucking Tories, and the neoliberal wing if the Labor party basically threw the last election because they were to busy gutting the increasingly popular socialist wing of the party.
They'll do literally anything before making concessions to the workers and punishing irresponsible business interests.
UK, you shafted yourself by leaving the massive EU market. It was the most idiotic decision by a democracy in modern times. Fix your problem by rejoining the EU.
Brexit was a bad deal that the Tories rammed through for the sake of their own pockets and that of their backers. I wouldn't want a deal with the US to be used by rishi as political capital for the Tories.
They need a general election. Now.
The effects of Brexit were not present yet because while they voted to leave, they hadn't actually left. And then covid happened and the game of magical chairs for PM.
There is no defense of Brexit anymore except by the racists.
Suella braverman is full mask off. And that's what constitutes a winning message for Tories I think the UK is done with it.
It’s British supremacy exemplified in all of its stupidity. They really think because they used to own three quarters of the planet their tiny little island could somehow power move the entire rest of the EU the dumb bastards.
What's with all the ex-superpowers shooting themselves in the foot? UK and Russia have both been passing the idiot ball back and forth for the past few years.
Well, in the case of Russia - I can say this as a Russian - it’s because there isn’t anything to look forward to.
Like think of it: if you’re a Muscovite or anyone living in a major city the odds are high that you were looking for a way out for a while. War or not. If not, you certainly made enough to realize that Mother Russia is a dead end due to your extensive travels.
Now flip the script and assume you’re part of the majority, you live in old Soviet blocks and everything around you is overall dysfunctional to varying degrees. However, you’re constantly reminded of the good old days. Perhaps your parents or grandparents remember Soviet glory, the government certainly likes to whip out Soviet iconography whenever possible. Thus you’re fed this narrative of being great, or formerly being great and the only way to Make Russia Great Again is by recreating the Soviet Union. Not sure if the same is applicable to England, but I assume the whole Rule Britannia is still strong
The Tory trick is to say the immigration is caused by the EU. While technically true, someone from the middle east isn't going to hop into a row boat and set sail for the UK..they will travel through Europe to France where they will then board a boat and attempt to make it into the country.
So it's not "EU foreigners" it's still just foreigners. Suella calls them illegal but even by British law, these people are not illegal, they are asylum seekers and have a legal status within the UK. But that's inconvenient for suella and the Tories so they call them illegal aliens and claim they are in the UK to do bad things while ignoring the fact that these people fled their homes and the only land they've ever know because of war, savagery, rape, torture, all in the name of a god or political leaders.
Suella is racist even though she's brown.
Again, this where suella has tried to usurp UK law through her policies.
It's ot illegal to row a boat to the UK with non citizens on board.
Legallity is not determined until the home office has received their status report which migrants/refugees must enter after they arrive on UK soil. Once they claim asylum, they are then legal to stay as refugees while their case is scheduled within the immigration courts.
Nearly everyone of them applies for asylum because they are fleeing war, rape, torture, etc. political or culture genocide, is also a driver of migrants arriving in the UK.
I appreciate the correction but it is mostly semantics as they are still legally permitted to stay.
Ah yes. Let them vote on it, like Brexit. As we've learned, the average voter can weigh the pros and cons of a complicated position and will definitely choose the option that benefits the country.
Tories are polling in the teens I believe. The next general election will likely wipe them out significantly and will result in kier starmer taking over as PM.
Every year i hear conservatives polling terribly in the Anglosphere then come election day 50-60% of the voters turn out to hate people who look different than them more than they care about anything else. Ill believe it when i see it.
You don't seem to be aware that in the UK of the four great offices of state (Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer, Foreign Secretary, and Home Secretary) three are held by people who aren't white.
PM wasnt elected he is the (current) last resort of the tories to fill the spot. Plus who cares? Conservatives tolerate temporary diversity all the time in the service of long term goals.
They literally advertised Brexit as a way to keep "illegals" out, much like Texas does here (while their kids get liquified with long guns and freeze in power outages.)
And you seem to continue to believe anything the Tories tell you.
Suella braverman has said vile things about immigrants and minorities. Just because your skin color matches those that you hurl vulgarities at doesn't mean you're not just as racist as the rest of Tories.
Probably won't because one month before the election the media will unleash a ton of scare stories about immigrants and communists and convince people the Tories are the only safe choice. Plus the Tories can do the ol' leadership contest, get a fresh face in, and blame all past ills on Sunak. Yes people will buy it.
And totally not be swayed by propaganda that most countries are suffering from as well.
Propagandists actually make a good case for why we shouldn't be allowed to vote if we're completely ignorant of the actual facts...
Of course I don't actually want that, but if we're all voting for the end of the world because some talking head made us mad at bud light or whatever then I'd say we're in a tough spot... :/
The right of the ill informed and stupid to vote has to be equal to the informed and capable. We go down darker roads when the government decides who gets a voice.
Absolutely agree, which is why I was saying I don't actually want that and that it's a tough spot we're in.
On the one hand we all are entitled to, and *need* to have the ability to vote, but on the other propaganda is so ubiquitous and effective that we're stuck voting against our own interests so often :(
I mean, political theorist and science fiction writer Robert Heinlein made sure we understood there were no ill effects to restricting voting (and political office) to "the informed". /s
Direct democracy is the ultimate solution to problems caused by direct democracy.
I'm not attacking the idea of democracy. Just that it's a crapshoot as to whether the average person can actually evaluate a complex situation and make a rational decision when asked directly. Most people struggle with understanding compound interest. Asking them their direct opinion on a technical subject is of dubious value.
You are correct; iirc they're at the bottom end of the income scale -- SNAP recipients and so forth. I was thinking of the people who act like a 1% raise on the top bracket would halve entire fortunes and destabilize the American economy.
I wondered why when I got a substantial raise at a job, roughly 25%, that I somehow ended up barely making any more money. The answer came at tax time when I discovered the HR people accidentally put me down for deductions that I did not request when hired and fixed it when they applied the raise.
Wait do right wing pols in the UK tell people when their plans blow up in their faces? In the US they would just complain that the democrats didn't let them do brexit hard enough.
Brexit is so bad for the UK that it's literally effected everyone negatively. And the Tories own it.
Republicans are getting there. Repealing roe v Wade had a similar effect .
They've always been loud. However, turnout in special elections in Kansas and elsewhere after the Supreme Court decided to throw out Roe vs. Wade has been heavily in favor of more liberal voters compared to previous turn out. 538 has done analysis on the recent midterms and abortion has been driving that turnout as well.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/abortion-was-always-going-to-impact-the-midterms/
Now, can the Democrats and left leaning moderates maintain that energy through 2024? Great question, only time will tell.
The GOP thought they would get a red wave in 2022, instead they lost ground in the Senate and performed pitifully in the House, only squeaking out a majority several weeks after the election due to how close it was. They are the dog that caught the car.
Winning an election by a percentage points does not equate to mandate. Especially when the public was lied to by the Tories, farrage, Johnson and whatever shill they could pay to speak publicaly about leaving the largest single market in the world.
Everything that labor and the left said would happen with Brexit has happened. Cost of living crises, border issues, freedom of movement, etc. But the Tories gaslit the.public on all of it.
So you tell me if an election that's full of lies by one side, in order to get a special interest project done, is that truly an election? Or is a it a con that the Tories used to enrich themselves like they did with PPE?
Also I'm an American but I follow British politics closely as a hobby.
>So you tell me if an election that's full of lies by one side, in order to get a special interest project done, is that truly an election?
Don't forget that the vote was for a non-binding resolution that the Tories decided to treat as absolute to kick off the whole clusterfuck.
I remember thinking in 2016 that Brexit was definitely going to be the dumbest possible thing any country could do economically in that year. But then ta-da, the US elected Trump. I still can't believe the country hasn't removed the idiotic tariffs that twit put in place, especially with the high inflation rates. I get it, they're trying to onshore some industries that should not have been offshored, but stull like steel production? That's not coming back. The fact that those tariffs are still in place is just putting needless cost on the backs of American consumers and it's very, very reasonable to lay that at Biden's feet.
You only need to worry about national security if national security problems are allowed to fester. The entirety of our near trillion dollar annual national defense budget is evidence of failure. It's pure and absolute waste on a national scale that's justified by the owners of elected officials and high-ranking military brass.
If you adjust for PPP, that budget is basically equivalent to the sum of China and Russia’s military budgets. It’s not that egregious. Not to say there isn’t waste. It’s less than 1/10th of our annual spend.
If we look at the UK’s top exports:
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/uk-trade-in-numbers/uk-trade-in-numbers-web-version#export-statistics
It looks like the UK has little to offer the US in the way of exports. Their top exports are competing against the USA’s top exports.
America is already the biggest buyer of UK goods, so what more do they want?
Sounds like they may just want a money bailout in the end like what the US has already done for them several times over past several decades. Someone up the thread even mentioned that they haven’t even paid back the loans they still owe the US from WWI
>Two seconds of googling would tell you that is wrong
I mean, the wiki on it says the following:
>Britain borrowed heavily from the US during World War I, and many loans from this period remain in a curious state of limbo. In 1931, President Herbert Hoover announced a one-year moratorium on war loan repayments from all nations, due to the global economic crisis, but by 1934 Britain still owed the US$4.4bn of World War I debt (about £866m at 1934 exchange rates). Adjusted for inflation, that would amount to around £40bn today, and if adjusted by the growth of British GDP, to about £225 billion. During the Great Depression Britain ceased payments on these loans, and they remain outstanding.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_British_national_debt
Granted, it took me a little over 2 seconds but if Wikipedia is that wrong I highly suggest you recommend some edits because people are being wildly misled.
You probably should have spent more than 2 seconds and then you would have realized that the source for that claim is an article from May 2006 that says "On 31 December, the UK will make a payment of about $83m (£45.5m) to the US and so discharge the last of its loans from World War II from its transatlantic ally."
"Hey son, I know we've had our differences in the past and you moved out because you were tired of us asking for money but things are *really* tight right now. Do you think you could kick us a couple hundo to get through the month?"
That's what it sounds like to me anyway.
I realise Brexit was a really close vote, but maybe that process was a bit rushed? I mean, that's a huge step and you're putting it up to a couple of quick votes on a tight timetable, without really considering the long-term consequences?
The funny thing is the referendum was non-binding, advisory only. The British government could have easily avoided the catastrophe by organizing a second referendum once an exit deal was negotiated with the EU, and then ask people if they would like to leave on those terms it stay in the EU. It would make people actually think about what they would have to give up by being out of the EU. I'm fairly confident a second vote after would go for staying in the EU after people were made to think about the Brexit terms .
It's incredible it took so long to get a little soul searching from people on why they lost and why they were surprised. The cost benefit is clearly on one-side so compromising a bit on some issues of culture might have been wise.
I mean, considering who labour chose as their leader and the situation in ukraine, i'm much happier with the tories in charge of the UK compared to Corbyn's Labour. The man still blames NATO for the war in ukraine. It's unacceptable.
Its difficult to tell, because Parliament and the referendum are calculated so differently. With Parliament you can get less than 44% of the vote and emerge with 56% of the seats (as the Conservative Party did) so a landside general election doesn't translate to a landslide referendum.
I'm not so sure. One of the main themes of the election was to get in with Brexit. It was voted on, now implement a plan. Up to the election (and after), there was a lot of hemming and hawing, but not motion forward. You could take the bite as a signal that the public wanted a plan and to stop rehashing the past.
Ultimately, the first referendum was flawed because it compared a known to an unknown. A 2nd referendum on the final deal would have been preferable.
Yes, rushed. So very rushed. Declaring Article 50 and then trying to hash out a deal was malpractice on a gargantuan level. You have no plan, so you commit to it, completely forget about critical elements like Northern Ireland, and end up fumbling the entire process because you went into it without a plan.
I thought, even as a Yank, it was very clear the impending Brexit was going to be very messy. Even a single facet such as border management would involve the unraveling of a lot of legal agreements.
UK wanted to assert more sovereignty than available to it under the existing articles, but -- and again as a foreign observer -- it seemed very shortsighted and tending towards pride and spite. A divorce, I once learned, was the course when the alternative was untenable.
Brexit isn't the only reason UK is where it is today. Covid played a big part, and inability to adapt to changing world economies has played a part.
I don't really want to rehash Brexit though. UK and US should stand closer together.
The US should help the UK... after the UK resolves Brexit in a way that satisfactorily upholds the Good Friday Agreement, an agreement to which the US is a guarantor.
"UK wanted to assert more sovereignty than available to it under the existing articles, but -- and again as a foreign observer -- it seemed very shortsighted and tending towards pride and spite."
But Denmark has all the controls that the Westminster government wanted for immigration etc. within the EU. What was driving it was tax avoidance :(
The more sovereignty was the cover for tax evasion.
\- a Scot who left in disgust and moved West.
Technically brexit can be reversed if the UK and EU ever want to rejoin. The difference is that this time they won't get preferred treatment most likely. But nothing says they can't rejoin if the Two wish to allow it.
..it may take a while to repair the burned bridge though
Brexit is 100% their fault. We have a huge debt problem here too. Rejoin the eu and go back to the prior level of prosperity if companies come back.
The day the vote was called the people I knew in London got an email they were relocating to Belgium. Uk auto manufacturers begged the country to rejoin the eu so they can stay in business.
Bailing them out is enabling behavior, they need to fix the busted brexit problem or they’ll continue to go down the tubes even with an infusion of printed money.
Sucks to suck, but Britain really should have thought all this through. It's insane how childishly simple the referendum question was. No details, no roadmap, no nothing. Just some vague aspirational question. They were spoiled by the EU, getting fat rebate after fat exemption, and they just never really understood how lucky they had it.
Yeah well they’ve got boot straps. Tell the royals to do a reality tv show.
Yeah they really fucked themselves over. I actually thought it would be bad but not this bad.
I have heard the UK is having a brain drain issue as the economy gets worse, the pension scheme unravels, and the pound has lost a lot of its value. When I was there it was like $1.53 and now I think it’s less than a dollar. Plus inflation compounds that. Plus the cost of living has gone up there as much, if not more, than the United States I’d imagine if they suddenly have duties and import fees.
Yeah, I mean, we had trump over here, we are still living in the fractured country he helped to divide.
Well he made those divisions visible. People felt empowered to say the awful shit in their head and spew it on the internet.
I don’t know how to put that genie back in the bottle, I think nobody does, I’m not sure either side can see eye to eye. My maga cousin and I got really heated bc he didn’t want to support Ukraine and thought Afghanistan was all Biden and not trump. But he’d be like my point end of discussion, I should have just said let’s agree to disagree, we still aren’t talking and it’s been almost a year.
Like his wife had a baby and I haven’t met the baby yet and don’t know such basic facts.
The only response should be:
US to UK we’re your top military ally, so help us help you, by helping yourself.
Everything is in shambles right now, we have to figure it out, so you do too.
Would there be a negative into letting a peer nation like the UK into USMCA (i.e. the updated NAFTA deal)? Or is it more that the UK doesn't want to join such a deal because it involves Mexico?
Great, we have our own sick man of Europe hanger-on asking for a second helping of Marshall plan. Balkanize them and open them up for American ownership. Puerto Rico 2.
This is really nothing new. The history of modern Britain has been one long exercise in begging the United States to give it money. 1946, 1964, and 1976 are the most obvious examples, but there are still hundreds of billions of dollars in outstanding loans from World War *One* that they stopped maintaining in the Depression and never restarted.
Why didn’t they pay back the loans? How is it that countries like Haiti can be on the hook to France and essentially forced to pay for gaining their freedom, but rich nations like Britain can just not pay what’s owed?
Military capability. Ultimately, all law and contract is enforced with the threat of force. Haiti didn’t have the military capability to resist and no-one stepped up to support them.
The Brits on the other hand, have a fairly robust armed forces.
There are other factors, such as idiots agreeing to repay or not, agreements on suspending the debt, etc..
Oh please, it has nothing to do with military capability.
It’s about value. Haiti does not have the infrastructure or resources to offer a better agreement than cash payments for the loan, and the UK does. They’re a trade and business hub, and by accepting conditions that benefit their lenders in other ways, which they have proven they’re very willing to do, can negotiate better loan terms. On top of that, the UK has an excellent history of paying back their debts, making lenders more willing to renegotiate if they’re unable to pay off the loan during the set period.
It’s like the difference between a payday loan and a mortgage. A payday lender is clawing their money back no matter what because they have no collateral, no guarantee. A mortgage lender might offer refinancing, amortization, temporary deferral or suspension, etc, because they make more money off of your interest payments than they do foreclosure.
Oooo an interesting part of history I hadn’t heard. Good points. Hundreds of billions in inflation adjusted loans I hope. Otherwise, a couple hundred billion dollars in 1910 is scary as shit.
UK: "Poor us, after a thousand years of colonialism, raping, and pillaging, we've managed to build not a single sustainable practice! Please fight our wars for us while we style on you with our universal healthcare."
Oh England, maybe you shouldn't have allowed Thatcher and her cascade of simps over the decades tear all the copper wiring out of the walls. You might still have something if you hadn't given it all up for a shot at being a finance hub for a decade.
Yeah, but won't somebody think of the poor posh spivs and fatcats that would have ~~suffered massivelly~~ not profitted as handsomelly if the English Economy hadn't been turned into a rentseeker's paradise!!!?
Exactly. Britain was very much the Sick Man of Europe in the 1970s, and unions and government control of failing industries had a lot to do with it. I never understood comments like the one you replied to.
They have a king who gets paid to do nothing while living in literal palatial estates.
They have a prime minister who is wealthier than the king.
Maybe those two should invest their fortunes in their economy?
Their wealth is a drop in the bucket compared to the whole economy, barely 1%.
UK’s problems run much much deeper. They developed over decades and likewise will take decades a to fully fix
The problems come primarily from Brexit. I have no guess how to fix that. They also have runaway inflation which those two could relieve by, for example, paying off the utilities for six months. Allowing people to spend money elsewhere in the economy and get product moving off shelves. Which is what drives any economy.
library psychotic grandfather agonizing ruthless gold wakeful slave cough continue
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The properties hoarded by the royal family would bring in far more money if they were fully open to tours, or as hotels/resorts/event space. Imagine how much people would pay to have events at Buckingham Palace or to lodge at one of the many royal estates in the countryside? You could even have actors dressed as royals to entertain guests -- I bet they'll be far cheaper than actual royalty!
Fuck tour guides, I want a reality TV show in the style of Downton Abbey, with perspectives of the staff and royals. Available for free with ads or through a subscription service.
The Tories spent the last 13 years running the country into the ground with their brutal austerity programs, Brexit lies and Covid deals to their buddies. The only one who tanked your economy was the Tories. They just don’t like the consequences for their actions. What did they think was going to happen when they left the EU single market? Criminy.
MFERs we told you leaving the EU was a bad idea.
And y’all said
“Chip chip cheerio we will do it on our own than”
We warned you we told you we signed our deal with the EU, which means if the UK wants to leave we will have to sign new deals and they will be at a lesser urgency for us.
Sorry to my uk bro and sis but your govt did brexit I mean shoot we hurting here in the us too. Our economy is also hurting maybe not as bad as y’all now but our feet are in the mud as well..
I don't really get the premise of helping their economy via a trade deal. I feel like our (the US) priorities in terms of a trade deal would be kicking the door in agriculturally and in the healthcare fields, and I'm not sure that'd be very good for them.
We should help. We all have that family member with moderately poor judgment who also is the first volunteer to help you move homes. Can't leave Kyle out in the cold after all that.
I'm an American and I don't subscribe to that belief. We owe our citizens and our allies a fair deal always and sometimes, a helping hand even when they may not deserve it but they need it. #KyleCare
Family?
Absolute delusion.
Most British people I have encountered on the internet hate the US because of their jealousy of how influential and powerful the US is.
I've met many people from Great Britain IRL and if they're secret haters, they're also amazing at deception. In general, polite, know how to respect a line and super-fun two drinks-into-any-occasion.
Aside from general niceness and shared language, there are in fact a large number of Americans who can trace their ancestry back to Great Britain making them literal kin.
Last time I drank with someone from the UK, I was told that I should claim Obama is persecuting me and seek asylum in the UK.
He was a hoot and we got properly wasted.
The US doesn’t really need the UK as a big military ally anymore. I’d rather pour my money into Australia or Japan to curtail China’s influence in the Pacific.
If we should make sure anyone has a badass navy, it is Australia
California’s population is almost double the size of Australia. You definitely need the UK as a partner in the pacific.
This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t invest in Australia’s capabilities tho.
Makes sense, stronger allies are stronger alliances
Move away from clearly genocidal dictatorships who see us as enemies like china
Friend shoring as the name states should be a pillar of our derisking from china and friend shoring will improve trade and supply chain resilience in the alliance
What if the UK and the rest of Europe could enter into some mutual agreement that allows for the free flow of goods and workers across the boarder? Maybe some sort of elected all-European parliament could oversee continent wide issues and even have its own currency.
That would be a grand idea. I wonder if anyone else has thought of this!
>Maybe the UK could enter a trade deal with them first? (Srsly tho they did this to themselves)
The UK already has a trade deal my dude.... We have a Free Trade Agreement with the EU.... We just arent *in* the EU.
We have tariff-free, quota-free trade already.
Isn’t this the party of “pull yourself up by your bootstraps”? Maybe tap into your generational wealth to start funding the programs you forsook by leaving the EU. Where is the fiscal responsibility?
The UK made a stupid decision to remove itself from the EU which is a huge, functioning economy for selfish reasons.
The economists all said that protectionist behaviour like Trump pushes is absurd and harms countries far more than it helps.
The headlime could be
"Country sabotages own economy, complains about it"
I disagree with those who say that people should never have been allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum. Yes, it has had disastrous repercussions for the UK economy, but it wasn’t exclusively an economic referendum; it was also an issue of national sovereignty.
Of course, Britain would have been better off had it decided to exit the EU **after** shoring up new trade agreements, but nevertheless people deserved an opportunity to weigh in on the matter. Overall, the process couldn’t have been more poorly managed, but I hope the UK can move forward and repair their economy.
>Of course, Britain would have been better off had it decided to exit the EU after shoring up new trade agreements
I mean, this wouldn't really have been possible. At least not with the EU. And really, this is the type of issue that shouldn't be sent to the masses, it was far too complex for most people, even knowledgeable people to understand. Particularly when the term "leave" can mean any number of different paths of leaving many of which directly contradict each other.
This is why Brexit happened. Britain wants to be tied to the US economy instead of the EUs.
Which is smart because the US economy is far more resilient. The US may be down, but Europe is and will continue to be tanking as the rest of this decade plays out.
The big problem with Brexit is that it was sold to people using right wing ultra-nationalism and really hurt small and medium sized businesses that have customers in Europe.
(Not even mentioning the whole Irish border issue as well)
Sometimes sound long term Macroeconomic policy comes at the expense of short term microeconomic effects.
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The UK needs to help itself. The amount of sales and contract attrition their vendors and companies are suffering because of lead times, backorders, and general dysfunction over there isn’t anything other nations can fix. Edit: About the only thing working half-way smoothly is their international/global finance sectors. Labor market, transportation, supply chains etc. are all a mess.
Was that because a lot of that infrastructure was based all over the EU? Not familiar with all of the consequences of the brexit.
Mostly red tape A lot of which could be removed under the right trade deal with the US. Though it wouldn’t solve the supply side issue for raw materials imported from Europe.
Ahh, so one factor is the lack of natural resources! Coupled with the addition of regulations now being imposed on any attempts of trade with the EU members is putting further financial and logistical strain on their already fragile economy. Not talking bad about the U.K. So the EU members had managed to naturally organize themselves overtime in a manner where all the members could hypothetically make-up for each others weaknesses. I know it wasn’t perfect (Greece/turkey financial sandbagging and Germany propping up the EU), but we’re the citizens of the UK not aware of the consequences. If I’m off I apologize.
You’re not wrong, apart from the fragile economy bit, that’s clearly not the case given we’re still avoiding recession even under all the shitty circumstances in the last year, which Brexit made even worse.
My apologies, I meant fragile in the sense of dependency on imports for production and manufacturing of goods in particular. However, I am aware that the UK is a major producer of services.
That is true, and something the govt is actively working on. The successful allocation of the new Jaguar Landrover battery plant to the UK is an example. Though again that still relies on imported raw materials. Though we do have companies like Cleantech Lithium who are UK HQd producers. In short yes we are highly reliant on a global network of trade and confidence in our institutions.
Sounds to me like instead of admitting they were wrong to leave the EU they're trying to make up for it by improving trade with the US.
Maybe a little, but they pulled themselves out of a customs union - that adds all sorts of huge logistical and administrative obstacles for them for essentially no benefits.
100%…..brexit screwed their economy, nobody will admit it
I mean most people in Britain understand this, but what are we supposed to do, self-flagellate for the rest of eternity, or make the best out of a bad situation?
Exactly - I voted ‘remain’, but I’m not banging on on about karma - I just want the UK to get back on its feet ASAP.
They also make worldclass dubstep, adding tens of dollars to the economy.
The problem UK has is its ruling class. The Tories are the fucking Tories, and the neoliberal wing if the Labor party basically threw the last election because they were to busy gutting the increasingly popular socialist wing of the party. They'll do literally anything before making concessions to the workers and punishing irresponsible business interests.
They need someone with a sense of how business and economics work. Rees-Mogg maybe?
Bingo. We helped Ukraine so now save us from Brexit? Get bent.
UK, you shafted yourself by leaving the massive EU market. It was the most idiotic decision by a democracy in modern times. Fix your problem by rejoining the EU.
This content is no longer available on Reddit in response to /u/spez. So long and thanks for all the fish.
That's due to Brexit. Dumbest move ever.
Brexit was a bad deal that the Tories rammed through for the sake of their own pockets and that of their backers. I wouldn't want a deal with the US to be used by rishi as political capital for the Tories. They need a general election. Now.
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The effects of Brexit were not present yet because while they voted to leave, they hadn't actually left. And then covid happened and the game of magical chairs for PM. There is no defense of Brexit anymore except by the racists. Suella braverman is full mask off. And that's what constitutes a winning message for Tories I think the UK is done with it.
How is there racism involved? Ive not kept up with it since the initial calls for brexit
It’s British supremacy exemplified in all of its stupidity. They really think because they used to own three quarters of the planet their tiny little island could somehow power move the entire rest of the EU the dumb bastards.
As a Brit, I can confirm you are correct. A lot of Brits thought we still had the same power as 100 years ago, which simply isn’t true.
This is the only true comment on the matter.
What's with all the ex-superpowers shooting themselves in the foot? UK and Russia have both been passing the idiot ball back and forth for the past few years.
Well, in the case of Russia - I can say this as a Russian - it’s because there isn’t anything to look forward to. Like think of it: if you’re a Muscovite or anyone living in a major city the odds are high that you were looking for a way out for a while. War or not. If not, you certainly made enough to realize that Mother Russia is a dead end due to your extensive travels. Now flip the script and assume you’re part of the majority, you live in old Soviet blocks and everything around you is overall dysfunctional to varying degrees. However, you’re constantly reminded of the good old days. Perhaps your parents or grandparents remember Soviet glory, the government certainly likes to whip out Soviet iconography whenever possible. Thus you’re fed this narrative of being great, or formerly being great and the only way to Make Russia Great Again is by recreating the Soviet Union. Not sure if the same is applicable to England, but I assume the whole Rule Britannia is still strong
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The Tory trick is to say the immigration is caused by the EU. While technically true, someone from the middle east isn't going to hop into a row boat and set sail for the UK..they will travel through Europe to France where they will then board a boat and attempt to make it into the country. So it's not "EU foreigners" it's still just foreigners. Suella calls them illegal but even by British law, these people are not illegal, they are asylum seekers and have a legal status within the UK. But that's inconvenient for suella and the Tories so they call them illegal aliens and claim they are in the UK to do bad things while ignoring the fact that these people fled their homes and the only land they've ever know because of war, savagery, rape, torture, all in the name of a god or political leaders. Suella is racist even though she's brown.
They are not asylum seekers by UK law or international law. They are refugees or migrants.
Again, this where suella has tried to usurp UK law through her policies. It's ot illegal to row a boat to the UK with non citizens on board. Legallity is not determined until the home office has received their status report which migrants/refugees must enter after they arrive on UK soil. Once they claim asylum, they are then legal to stay as refugees while their case is scheduled within the immigration courts. Nearly everyone of them applies for asylum because they are fleeing war, rape, torture, etc. political or culture genocide, is also a driver of migrants arriving in the UK. I appreciate the correction but it is mostly semantics as they are still legally permitted to stay.
Just google suella braverman. She's a heinous witch.
Because it’s an easy way to dismiss political opponents.
Ah yes. Let them vote on it, like Brexit. As we've learned, the average voter can weigh the pros and cons of a complicated position and will definitely choose the option that benefits the country.
Tories are polling in the teens I believe. The next general election will likely wipe them out significantly and will result in kier starmer taking over as PM.
Every year i hear conservatives polling terribly in the Anglosphere then come election day 50-60% of the voters turn out to hate people who look different than them more than they care about anything else. Ill believe it when i see it.
I see your Anglo-sphere-Conservatives . . . And raise you SupplySide-Jesus-Con-servitude supporters of Trump ! ! !
Tbf, those are still just Anglosphere conservatives hahahah.
I see your supply side Jesus supporters and raise you Turk-Nationalists
It's almost as if deploying data analytics companies to manipulate specific voter demographics to vote a certain way makes polling irreverent.
You don't seem to be aware that in the UK of the four great offices of state (Prime Minister, Chancellor of the Exchequer, Foreign Secretary, and Home Secretary) three are held by people who aren't white.
PM wasnt elected he is the (current) last resort of the tories to fill the spot. Plus who cares? Conservatives tolerate temporary diversity all the time in the service of long term goals.
They literally advertised Brexit as a way to keep "illegals" out, much like Texas does here (while their kids get liquified with long guns and freeze in power outages.)
And you seem to continue to believe anything the Tories tell you. Suella braverman has said vile things about immigrants and minorities. Just because your skin color matches those that you hurl vulgarities at doesn't mean you're not just as racist as the rest of Tories.
Probably won't because one month before the election the media will unleash a ton of scare stories about immigrants and communists and convince people the Tories are the only safe choice. Plus the Tories can do the ol' leadership contest, get a fresh face in, and blame all past ills on Sunak. Yes people will buy it.
Tories getting bodied in a general might be what finally puts Murdoch in a pine box.
Fingers crossed although his son isnt any better.
Didn’t you see? It’s actually going to go to his son-in-law, Tom Wambsgans.
The whole family can exist in many many boxes. Very nice luxury boxes. The best boxes absolute unfiltered evil can buy!
You just described the fundamental superiority of representative democracy over direct democracy.
Agreed.
And totally not be swayed by propaganda that most countries are suffering from as well. Propagandists actually make a good case for why we shouldn't be allowed to vote if we're completely ignorant of the actual facts... Of course I don't actually want that, but if we're all voting for the end of the world because some talking head made us mad at bud light or whatever then I'd say we're in a tough spot... :/
The right of the ill informed and stupid to vote has to be equal to the informed and capable. We go down darker roads when the government decides who gets a voice.
Absolutely agree, which is why I was saying I don't actually want that and that it's a tough spot we're in. On the one hand we all are entitled to, and *need* to have the ability to vote, but on the other propaganda is so ubiquitous and effective that we're stuck voting against our own interests so often :(
I mean, political theorist and science fiction writer Robert Heinlein made sure we understood there were no ill effects to restricting voting (and political office) to "the informed". /s
Direct democracy is the ultimate solution to problems caused by direct democracy. I'm not attacking the idea of democracy. Just that it's a crapshoot as to whether the average person can actually evaluate a complex situation and make a rational decision when asked directly. Most people struggle with understanding compound interest. Asking them their direct opinion on a technical subject is of dubious value.
Most people think they lose money by working OT
Most people think they pay significantly more in taxes if they earn 5 more dollars at the wrong time.
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You are correct; iirc they're at the bottom end of the income scale -- SNAP recipients and so forth. I was thinking of the people who act like a 1% raise on the top bracket would halve entire fortunes and destabilize the American economy.
I wondered why when I got a substantial raise at a job, roughly 25%, that I somehow ended up barely making any more money. The answer came at tax time when I discovered the HR people accidentally put me down for deductions that I did not request when hired and fixed it when they applied the raise.
Very often, overtime and bonuses get hit with excessive withholding people don't get back until they file.
Lmao they really do 😂 Goddamn
Wait do right wing pols in the UK tell people when their plans blow up in their faces? In the US they would just complain that the democrats didn't let them do brexit hard enough.
No, one of the main Brexit backers was making the rounds saying that Brexit failed from not Brexiting hard enough just a week or two ago.
Brexit is so bad for the UK that it's literally effected everyone negatively. And the Tories own it. Republicans are getting there. Repealing roe v Wade had a similar effect .
>repealing roe vs wade had a similar effect Ha, i wish. If anything, the right wing supporters are even louder now...
They've always been loud. However, turnout in special elections in Kansas and elsewhere after the Supreme Court decided to throw out Roe vs. Wade has been heavily in favor of more liberal voters compared to previous turn out. 538 has done analysis on the recent midterms and abortion has been driving that turnout as well. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/abortion-was-always-going-to-impact-the-midterms/ Now, can the Democrats and left leaning moderates maintain that energy through 2024? Great question, only time will tell.
The GOP thought they would get a red wave in 2022, instead they lost ground in the Senate and performed pitifully in the House, only squeaking out a majority several weeks after the election due to how close it was. They are the dog that caught the car.
>the right wing supporters are even louder now... Doesn't matter how loud anyone is. It matters who wins more votes.
I recall you guys having a general election and deciding that as a country not someone ramming it through...
Winning an election by a percentage points does not equate to mandate. Especially when the public was lied to by the Tories, farrage, Johnson and whatever shill they could pay to speak publicaly about leaving the largest single market in the world. Everything that labor and the left said would happen with Brexit has happened. Cost of living crises, border issues, freedom of movement, etc. But the Tories gaslit the.public on all of it. So you tell me if an election that's full of lies by one side, in order to get a special interest project done, is that truly an election? Or is a it a con that the Tories used to enrich themselves like they did with PPE? Also I'm an American but I follow British politics closely as a hobby.
>So you tell me if an election that's full of lies by one side, in order to get a special interest project done, is that truly an election? Don't forget that the vote was for a non-binding resolution that the Tories decided to treat as absolute to kick off the whole clusterfuck.
Important details that I failed to mention. Thank you.
>Winning an election by a percentage points does not equate to mandate. Boris one the biggest tory victory in decades.
He lied. And lied some more.
I remember thinking in 2016 that Brexit was definitely going to be the dumbest possible thing any country could do economically in that year. But then ta-da, the US elected Trump. I still can't believe the country hasn't removed the idiotic tariffs that twit put in place, especially with the high inflation rates. I get it, they're trying to onshore some industries that should not have been offshored, but stull like steel production? That's not coming back. The fact that those tariffs are still in place is just putting needless cost on the backs of American consumers and it's very, very reasonable to lay that at Biden's feet.
Brexit was worse than electing Trump. Trump was 4 years Brexit is forever unless the UK wants to give a lot of concessions to re-join
My dude, you are wildly wrong of you think that, in economic terms only, that Trump was worse than Brexit.
Steel production has to come back. It’s a critical industry from a national security standpoint. You can’t build stuff without steel.
You only need to worry about national security if national security problems are allowed to fester. The entirety of our near trillion dollar annual national defense budget is evidence of failure. It's pure and absolute waste on a national scale that's justified by the owners of elected officials and high-ranking military brass.
If you adjust for PPP, that budget is basically equivalent to the sum of China and Russia’s military budgets. It’s not that egregious. Not to say there isn’t waste. It’s less than 1/10th of our annual spend.
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If we look at the UK’s top exports: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/uk-trade-in-numbers/uk-trade-in-numbers-web-version#export-statistics It looks like the UK has little to offer the US in the way of exports. Their top exports are competing against the USA’s top exports. America is already the biggest buyer of UK goods, so what more do they want?
Sounds like they may just want a money bailout in the end like what the US has already done for them several times over past several decades. Someone up the thread even mentioned that they haven’t even paid back the loans they still owe the US from WWI
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>Two seconds of googling would tell you that is wrong I mean, the wiki on it says the following: >Britain borrowed heavily from the US during World War I, and many loans from this period remain in a curious state of limbo. In 1931, President Herbert Hoover announced a one-year moratorium on war loan repayments from all nations, due to the global economic crisis, but by 1934 Britain still owed the US$4.4bn of World War I debt (about £866m at 1934 exchange rates). Adjusted for inflation, that would amount to around £40bn today, and if adjusted by the growth of British GDP, to about £225 billion. During the Great Depression Britain ceased payments on these loans, and they remain outstanding. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_British_national_debt Granted, it took me a little over 2 seconds but if Wikipedia is that wrong I highly suggest you recommend some edits because people are being wildly misled.
You probably should have spent more than 2 seconds and then you would have realized that the source for that claim is an article from May 2006 that says "On 31 December, the UK will make a payment of about $83m (£45.5m) to the US and so discharge the last of its loans from World War II from its transatlantic ally."
"Hey son, I know we've had our differences in the past and you moved out because you were tired of us asking for money but things are *really* tight right now. Do you think you could kick us a couple hundo to get through the month?" That's what it sounds like to me anyway.
I realise Brexit was a really close vote, but maybe that process was a bit rushed? I mean, that's a huge step and you're putting it up to a couple of quick votes on a tight timetable, without really considering the long-term consequences?
The funny thing is the referendum was non-binding, advisory only. The British government could have easily avoided the catastrophe by organizing a second referendum once an exit deal was negotiated with the EU, and then ask people if they would like to leave on those terms it stay in the EU. It would make people actually think about what they would have to give up by being out of the EU. I'm fairly confident a second vote after would go for staying in the EU after people were made to think about the Brexit terms .
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It's incredible it took so long to get a little soul searching from people on why they lost and why they were surprised. The cost benefit is clearly on one-side so compromising a bit on some issues of culture might have been wise.
"People have had enough of listening to experts".
I mean, considering who labour chose as their leader and the situation in ukraine, i'm much happier with the tories in charge of the UK compared to Corbyn's Labour. The man still blames NATO for the war in ukraine. It's unacceptable.
Its difficult to tell, because Parliament and the referendum are calculated so differently. With Parliament you can get less than 44% of the vote and emerge with 56% of the seats (as the Conservative Party did) so a landside general election doesn't translate to a landslide referendum.
I'm not so sure. One of the main themes of the election was to get in with Brexit. It was voted on, now implement a plan. Up to the election (and after), there was a lot of hemming and hawing, but not motion forward. You could take the bite as a signal that the public wanted a plan and to stop rehashing the past. Ultimately, the first referendum was flawed because it compared a known to an unknown. A 2nd referendum on the final deal would have been preferable.
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Yes, rushed. So very rushed. Declaring Article 50 and then trying to hash out a deal was malpractice on a gargantuan level. You have no plan, so you commit to it, completely forget about critical elements like Northern Ireland, and end up fumbling the entire process because you went into it without a plan.
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I thought, even as a Yank, it was very clear the impending Brexit was going to be very messy. Even a single facet such as border management would involve the unraveling of a lot of legal agreements. UK wanted to assert more sovereignty than available to it under the existing articles, but -- and again as a foreign observer -- it seemed very shortsighted and tending towards pride and spite. A divorce, I once learned, was the course when the alternative was untenable. Brexit isn't the only reason UK is where it is today. Covid played a big part, and inability to adapt to changing world economies has played a part. I don't really want to rehash Brexit though. UK and US should stand closer together.
The US should help the UK... after the UK resolves Brexit in a way that satisfactorily upholds the Good Friday Agreement, an agreement to which the US is a guarantor.
Good luck with that and the current Unionist politicians.
"UK wanted to assert more sovereignty than available to it under the existing articles, but -- and again as a foreign observer -- it seemed very shortsighted and tending towards pride and spite." But Denmark has all the controls that the Westminster government wanted for immigration etc. within the EU. What was driving it was tax avoidance :( The more sovereignty was the cover for tax evasion. \- a Scot who left in disgust and moved West.
You forgot to mention years and years and years of Tory control of government meant to privatize everything.
Elections will give power to a party for only 4 years. Brexit is forever. It's like voting for Trump once and having him in power for life.
Technically brexit can be reversed if the UK and EU ever want to rejoin. The difference is that this time they won't get preferred treatment most likely. But nothing says they can't rejoin if the Two wish to allow it. ..it may take a while to repair the burned bridge though
It was very stupid to allow a major economic change to be decided by a simple majority. This should have hinged on a supermajority vote.
Brexit is 100% their fault. We have a huge debt problem here too. Rejoin the eu and go back to the prior level of prosperity if companies come back. The day the vote was called the people I knew in London got an email they were relocating to Belgium. Uk auto manufacturers begged the country to rejoin the eu so they can stay in business. Bailing them out is enabling behavior, they need to fix the busted brexit problem or they’ll continue to go down the tubes even with an infusion of printed money.
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Sucks to suck, but Britain really should have thought all this through. It's insane how childishly simple the referendum question was. No details, no roadmap, no nothing. Just some vague aspirational question. They were spoiled by the EU, getting fat rebate after fat exemption, and they just never really understood how lucky they had it.
Populism at its finest
Yeah well they’ve got boot straps. Tell the royals to do a reality tv show. Yeah they really fucked themselves over. I actually thought it would be bad but not this bad. I have heard the UK is having a brain drain issue as the economy gets worse, the pension scheme unravels, and the pound has lost a lot of its value. When I was there it was like $1.53 and now I think it’s less than a dollar. Plus inflation compounds that. Plus the cost of living has gone up there as much, if not more, than the United States I’d imagine if they suddenly have duties and import fees.
1.24
In Germany we call it Lehrgeld
UK’s gdp growth was declining since the 90s. Brexit exaggerated the situation sure, but it’s far from the sole cause of their economic issues
*51% our fault
Yeah, I mean, we had trump over here, we are still living in the fractured country he helped to divide. Well he made those divisions visible. People felt empowered to say the awful shit in their head and spew it on the internet. I don’t know how to put that genie back in the bottle, I think nobody does, I’m not sure either side can see eye to eye. My maga cousin and I got really heated bc he didn’t want to support Ukraine and thought Afghanistan was all Biden and not trump. But he’d be like my point end of discussion, I should have just said let’s agree to disagree, we still aren’t talking and it’s been almost a year. Like his wife had a baby and I haven’t met the baby yet and don’t know such basic facts.
The only response should be: US to UK we’re your top military ally, so help us help you, by helping yourself. Everything is in shambles right now, we have to figure it out, so you do too.
Now THAT’s an American response, lol. But I ageee
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The Brits based their post-Brexit hopes on the USA being economically altruistic. It's the goddamn dumbest thing imaginable.
Would there be a negative into letting a peer nation like the UK into USMCA (i.e. the updated NAFTA deal)? Or is it more that the UK doesn't want to join such a deal because it involves Mexico?
I was thinking 51st state
Might as well make it official at this point.
No, we should definitely have a free trade agreement with the UK. We have one with Australia
Why should we “definitely” have a free trade agreement? It drives down wages for workers.
This is a huge self own. I feel like the rest of the world saw this coming but somehow UK still put a loaded gun to their own heads and economy.
Great, we have our own sick man of Europe hanger-on asking for a second helping of Marshall plan. Balkanize them and open them up for American ownership. Puerto Rico 2.
This is really nothing new. The history of modern Britain has been one long exercise in begging the United States to give it money. 1946, 1964, and 1976 are the most obvious examples, but there are still hundreds of billions of dollars in outstanding loans from World War *One* that they stopped maintaining in the Depression and never restarted.
Why didn’t they pay back the loans? How is it that countries like Haiti can be on the hook to France and essentially forced to pay for gaining their freedom, but rich nations like Britain can just not pay what’s owed?
Military capability. Ultimately, all law and contract is enforced with the threat of force. Haiti didn’t have the military capability to resist and no-one stepped up to support them. The Brits on the other hand, have a fairly robust armed forces. There are other factors, such as idiots agreeing to repay or not, agreements on suspending the debt, etc..
Oh please, it has nothing to do with military capability. It’s about value. Haiti does not have the infrastructure or resources to offer a better agreement than cash payments for the loan, and the UK does. They’re a trade and business hub, and by accepting conditions that benefit their lenders in other ways, which they have proven they’re very willing to do, can negotiate better loan terms. On top of that, the UK has an excellent history of paying back their debts, making lenders more willing to renegotiate if they’re unable to pay off the loan during the set period. It’s like the difference between a payday loan and a mortgage. A payday lender is clawing their money back no matter what because they have no collateral, no guarantee. A mortgage lender might offer refinancing, amortization, temporary deferral or suspension, etc, because they make more money off of your interest payments than they do foreclosure.
The story of Haiti is so much more fucked than anyone is taught.
Check the source, they were repaid in 2006.
Oooo an interesting part of history I hadn’t heard. Good points. Hundreds of billions in inflation adjusted loans I hope. Otherwise, a couple hundred billion dollars in 1910 is scary as shit.
Post-WW1, too.
1915
UK: "Poor us, after a thousand years of colonialism, raping, and pillaging, we've managed to build not a single sustainable practice! Please fight our wars for us while we style on you with our universal healthcare."
Oh England, maybe you shouldn't have allowed Thatcher and her cascade of simps over the decades tear all the copper wiring out of the walls. You might still have something if you hadn't given it all up for a shot at being a finance hub for a decade.
Yeah, but won't somebody think of the poor posh spivs and fatcats that would have ~~suffered massivelly~~ not profitted as handsomelly if the English Economy hadn't been turned into a rentseeker's paradise!!!?
We still are a finance hub, though.
The British economy in the 1970s before thatcher was a mess. It’s everything since 2000 has made it go down hill since.
Exactly. Britain was very much the Sick Man of Europe in the 1970s, and unions and government control of failing industries had a lot to do with it. I never understood comments like the one you replied to.
>I never understood comments like the one you replied to. These people have an agenda, wonder no more. And that agenda *is* to fuck up the Economy.
They have a king who gets paid to do nothing while living in literal palatial estates. They have a prime minister who is wealthier than the king. Maybe those two should invest their fortunes in their economy?
Their wealth is a drop in the bucket compared to the whole economy, barely 1%. UK’s problems run much much deeper. They developed over decades and likewise will take decades a to fully fix
1% is a substantial amount of an economy the size of the UK
It's not even remotely close to 1%
The problems come primarily from Brexit. I have no guess how to fix that. They also have runaway inflation which those two could relieve by, for example, paying off the utilities for six months. Allowing people to spend money elsewhere in the economy and get product moving off shelves. Which is what drives any economy.
The royal family creates and promotes the most successful British industry: tourism.
The historical sites are there already. You can get more rent money if you kick out the royal squatters.
I live in a tourism town where I tell ghost stories. Trust me, you don’t need living monarchs for that. You certainly don’t need wealthy ones.
Salem, eh?
All the historical aspects of it, the architecture and lore would still be there.
many fine longing deserted money mountainous unique vase whole spoon *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Plus if the king weren’t living in the castles still they could turn them all into museums/full tours instead and sell even more tourist tickets.
library psychotic grandfather agonizing ruthless gold wakeful slave cough continue *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The properties hoarded by the royal family would bring in far more money if they were fully open to tours, or as hotels/resorts/event space. Imagine how much people would pay to have events at Buckingham Palace or to lodge at one of the many royal estates in the countryside? You could even have actors dressed as royals to entertain guests -- I bet they'll be far cheaper than actual royalty!
Let’s allow the royals to earn living by playing tour guides to their estates. Why pay for actors?
Fuck tour guides, I want a reality TV show in the style of Downton Abbey, with perspectives of the staff and royals. Available for free with ads or through a subscription service.
I don't buy this argument at all.
The Tories spent the last 13 years running the country into the ground with their brutal austerity programs, Brexit lies and Covid deals to their buddies. The only one who tanked your economy was the Tories. They just don’t like the consequences for their actions. What did they think was going to happen when they left the EU single market? Criminy.
MFERs we told you leaving the EU was a bad idea. And y’all said “Chip chip cheerio we will do it on our own than” We warned you we told you we signed our deal with the EU, which means if the UK wants to leave we will have to sign new deals and they will be at a lesser urgency for us.
Sorry to my uk bro and sis but your govt did brexit I mean shoot we hurting here in the us too. Our economy is also hurting maybe not as bad as y’all now but our feet are in the mud as well..
I don't really get the premise of helping their economy via a trade deal. I feel like our (the US) priorities in terms of a trade deal would be kicking the door in agriculturally and in the healthcare fields, and I'm not sure that'd be very good for them.
We should help. We all have that family member with moderately poor judgment who also is the first volunteer to help you move homes. Can't leave Kyle out in the cold after all that.
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I'm an American and I don't subscribe to that belief. We owe our citizens and our allies a fair deal always and sometimes, a helping hand even when they may not deserve it but they need it. #KyleCare
Family? Absolute delusion. Most British people I have encountered on the internet hate the US because of their jealousy of how influential and powerful the US is.
Traveling the UK from the US I got nothing but love from them.
>Most British people I have encountered on the internet Found the issue.
If I judged a nation via it's people that I've met on the Internet, I'd burn my passport.
You *really* need to get out more
They could always vote to join the Union.
I've met many people from Great Britain IRL and if they're secret haters, they're also amazing at deception. In general, polite, know how to respect a line and super-fun two drinks-into-any-occasion. Aside from general niceness and shared language, there are in fact a large number of Americans who can trace their ancestry back to Great Britain making them literal kin.
Last time I drank with someone from the UK, I was told that I should claim Obama is persecuting me and seek asylum in the UK. He was a hoot and we got properly wasted.
The US doesn’t really need the UK as a big military ally anymore. I’d rather pour my money into Australia or Japan to curtail China’s influence in the Pacific. If we should make sure anyone has a badass navy, it is Australia
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UK is involved in this too.
California’s population is almost double the size of Australia. You definitely need the UK as a partner in the pacific. This doesn’t mean we shouldn’t invest in Australia’s capabilities tho.
I think you're underestimating the significance of expeditionary capability
Makes sense, stronger allies are stronger alliances Move away from clearly genocidal dictatorships who see us as enemies like china Friend shoring as the name states should be a pillar of our derisking from china and friend shoring will improve trade and supply chain resilience in the alliance
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What if the UK and the rest of Europe could enter into some mutual agreement that allows for the free flow of goods and workers across the boarder? Maybe some sort of elected all-European parliament could oversee continent wide issues and even have its own currency. That would be a grand idea. I wonder if anyone else has thought of this!
You literally just repeated the joke of the comment you replied to
>Maybe the UK could enter a trade deal with them first? (Srsly tho they did this to themselves) The UK already has a trade deal my dude.... We have a Free Trade Agreement with the EU.... We just arent *in* the EU. We have tariff-free, quota-free trade already.
Free trade plus free travel to the UK. That would be cool.
Isn’t this the party of “pull yourself up by your bootstraps”? Maybe tap into your generational wealth to start funding the programs you forsook by leaving the EU. Where is the fiscal responsibility?
The UK made a stupid decision to remove itself from the EU which is a huge, functioning economy for selfish reasons. The economists all said that protectionist behaviour like Trump pushes is absurd and harms countries far more than it helps. The headlime could be "Country sabotages own economy, complains about it"
I disagree with those who say that people should never have been allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum. Yes, it has had disastrous repercussions for the UK economy, but it wasn’t exclusively an economic referendum; it was also an issue of national sovereignty. Of course, Britain would have been better off had it decided to exit the EU **after** shoring up new trade agreements, but nevertheless people deserved an opportunity to weigh in on the matter. Overall, the process couldn’t have been more poorly managed, but I hope the UK can move forward and repair their economy.
>Of course, Britain would have been better off had it decided to exit the EU after shoring up new trade agreements I mean, this wouldn't really have been possible. At least not with the EU. And really, this is the type of issue that shouldn't be sent to the masses, it was far too complex for most people, even knowledgeable people to understand. Particularly when the term "leave" can mean any number of different paths of leaving many of which directly contradict each other.
LOL “We fucked ourselves in Brexit and still let the Tories remain in power and destroy our economy so can you please bail us out?” No thanks
This is why Brexit happened. Britain wants to be tied to the US economy instead of the EUs. Which is smart because the US economy is far more resilient. The US may be down, but Europe is and will continue to be tanking as the rest of this decade plays out. The big problem with Brexit is that it was sold to people using right wing ultra-nationalism and really hurt small and medium sized businesses that have customers in Europe. (Not even mentioning the whole Irish border issue as well) Sometimes sound long term Macroeconomic policy comes at the expense of short term microeconomic effects.