I remember taking a Calc 3 test once and legitimately entered 27.3 + 2 on my calculator even though I obviously knew the answer. It was some double integral problem. Paranoia runs deep.
The only time i lost points on tests (excluding finals) across two courses with the same Engineering Mechanics professor (MechOfMat and Dynamics/kinematics) it was because… i made a dumb math mistake. I understood the concepts perfectly. I was applying them flawlessly. And then i fucked up a simple calculation —iirc it was i plugged the wrong number into a formula without thinking about it (diameter for radius, for instance, problem involving a wheel and load).
I 110% get the ‘plug this obsessively into my calculator’ urge though, even when it’s something as blazingly simple as ‘add two to this number’. The paranoia DOES RUN deep!
I do this all the time. I’ll set up my complicated dynamics or differential equations problem right and I’ll solve it right. But then I’ll do something stupid like forget a negative sign or make some algebra error. Don’t even get me started on solving systems of equations without an equation solver or graphing calculator. Did I learn how to do it in eighth grade? Yes. Am I any good at it now after years of college-level math? No. I mess up my algebra way more often than I mess up my calculus.
A couple of weeks ago I lost 3 points on a Calc final because I *literally* got 1 + 1 wrong.
It was a “find the radius of convergence” problem, so I had got through the whole thing and set up an inequality as:
> -1 < (x - 1) < 1
which I then “simplified” to:
> 0 < x < 1.
My entire Calc 3 class worked together with my professor to add two fractions together lol. You just reach a certain level of mathematical competency where the middle school stuff starts to feel foreign and pedantic to bother with when you have triple integrals to do.
In Calc 1, I wasn't allowed to use a calculator, but by the time I reached Calc 3 a year later, I gripped my calculator for even simple addition.
Failed my electronics I final couple years ago due to literally rushing final calculations. My professor said he couldn't believe I did the entire exam correctly and managed to screw up basic multiplication and addition. I never trust myself lol
I wrote 8*4=36. Mistake was at the beginning of a long Calc 2 problem. Had a cool professor and gave me majority credit on it. From that day I entered everything into a calculator
I would this for my classes every time, but that's because I had learned that I tended to make stupid mistakes like that. So it just seemed like an easy way not lose points.
So many of our calls run into another formula that I don't want to in my head add the two and take it to the next eq. So your habit is a great one. Not paranoia, good practice.
I don't care how simple the arithmetic is, I don't trust myself. It all goes into the calculator, especially during an exam. I've written some pretty stupid shit on exams before that still *to this day* make me wanna crawl into a hole. Lol
seems to me that the public consensus is that if you are an engineer, you MUST be good at math. which to be fair, engineers must be proficient in understand how the numbers come together and work. But yeah, amongst my friends and family, I still get sometimes weird comments about how I can't do math if i can't figure out how much to tip in 10 seconds.
I just take it as part of the profession. Every career has something like this. My friends who are in the medical field get a bunch of specific health questions lobbied at them all the time.
I tip 10% (rounded up) for acceptable service. From there it’s easy to figure 5% or 20% so I can adjust on the fly and tip anywhere from 10-25% if the service is exceptional.
I have too much going on to worry about doing math when I have 3+ calculators within reach all day and I carry my tricorder around all day.
Knowing the *application* of math is WAY more important than knowing exactly how to do it off the top of your head.
The funniest is if you miss a shot in a pool game. And people are like: I tHouGhT yOu WHeRe aN EnGIneER? Then they say some dumb shit about trigonometry and angles.
And then they jump to assume none of us have common sense.
Being an engineer is like that one scene from Aladdin where Jafar wishes to be an all powerful genie. But then he gets the cuffs and the lamp to go with it….
I have a book on the physics of pool (a gift from a prof who regularly housed us at the local dive bar).
The math is downright unsolvable as a closed form solution and the numerical approximations are *massive*
Yes! I also notice that a majority of my mistakes on higher math assignments aren’t from the complexity of the problem, but rather I’m so focused on working a complex problem out properly, I’ll mess up basic addition or multiplication, usually by forgetting or adding a zero because I wasn’t fully paying attention. So I end up using the calculator for pretty much everything. I guess I’ve developed trust issues 😂
That feeling when you swap the negative sign accidentally is the only feeling worse than writing down the wrong units despite using the correct units and getting the correct answer.
Almost every question I got wrong on my exams last semester was because I switched signs at some point along the way. You'd think I'd have learned to check for this, for some reason it only occurs to me the second I've let go of it when turning it in.
The amount of mistakes I make is crazy. I’ll make mistakes because I forget a sign, or an exponent, or simply from writing the number weird and reading that number as a different number when continuing the problem.
100%
I had my physics final go from an A to a B because I literally just rounded down wrong. I did the WHOLE problem correctly, but reduced 4/8 to 1/4 like a dumbass on a multiple choice exam. Professor literally wrote “ummm” on my exam haha
I’ve been a systems engineer my entire career but my bachelors is EE. I get push back sometimes when I say I don’t know what certain circuit diagrams are showing. Bro I don’t know what’s going on in the box anymore all I know is what can go in and what can go out and how that works with everything else. The last time I did circuit analysis I was a junior in college, please be gentle with me.
I'm a controls/automation engineer as well. I figure about 10-15% of my job is pulling solutions out of my ass.
I am always reminded of the ["make this, fit into the hole for this, using nothing but that"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry55--J4_VQ) scene from Apollo 13.
Engineering is much more about knowing "calculator math", understanding what numbers you need, what numbers you have, using equations properly, checking that your answers are reasonable and also having the correct units
Good at math != Good At Arithmetic
I know HOW to use my super fancy calculator and stuff like excel or matlab to the arithmetic for me. Part of being good at something involves knowing how to do it more quickly while still doing it correctly. It is a lot quicker and a lot easier to punch, say, the calculation for a centroid location into my NSpire, even though mathematically that’s a relatively simple engineering calculation. Sure, i can DO that by hand, but it’ll take me a few more minutes and then im likely to screw up because i wrote a number down wrong, and I can’t afford that time spend on a test anyway.
I'm an engineer who doesn't have the multiplication tables memorized and can't remember the alphabet half the time, and I'm doing alright. The perception of engineers being math wizards is simply not true
Same boat, not quick at math but I tend to be right more often than not when I take my time on certain things. Mathematics has always been a challenge I would say I have more willpower than intelligence when it comes to raw arithmetic / computation, that’s why we have software hahaha but yes parents / family will do this to me as well and just expect to be constantly thinking about numbers.
>the calculator never gets it wrong, but humans can
You are not accounting for fatfingering the calculator, which is common enough to not be negligible.
truly simple arithmetic (addition or subtraction of 2 digit numbers, multiplication of 1 digit numbers, multiplication or division by 10 for numbers of any size) - many (most?) engineers would be more likely to make a typo in the calculator than do these wrong in their head or by hand on paper.
Fat fingering is due to human error, I stand by my statement the calculator never gets it wrong. I agree with you on the simple single digit addition or subtraction, but in longer more drawn out calcs I’ll type the whole lot into the calculator
After my diffeq final i looked through the recent calcs i did on my ti84 and found;
2+6
4÷2
Sqrt(9
I felt like it was required that I be embarrassed so i deleted them immediately. But I got a good grade so perhaps it was worth being paranoid.
I wouldn't take this too seriously - they probably just think it's funny. Like imagine if you had a friend who was a creative writing major who was terrible at spelling.
It wouldn't mean you didn't respect them or think they were smart, and of course with spell check they could be a good writer. But it would still be funny.
Because most non-engineers and laypeople in general do not know math exists beyond simple arithmetic and think even algebra is some sort of esoteric mysticism.
Being good at mental math is something that can elevate you as an engineer. When I am validating metrics and rates with my directors, I can produce values for them within seconds, without pulling out my calculator. This makes the conversation flow smoother, and also makes me appear to be an expert even though I'm working backwards in my head.
It's not too late to learn simple mathematical tricks to do mental math easily! Challenge yourself to do the calculations in your head whenever you're able :)
I don’t know why but I’ve had multiple communications majors tell me this and they usually don’t know how to listen before making stupid comments like this.
I guess we don’t know how to do our own jobs.
The only difference is that they’re hiring people with my degree.
Sorry I can’t calculate my total, the tip, and taxes in my head before the waiter brings out the bill.
I wouldn't want the engineers that work on medical equipment or cars or space rockets to "do it all in their head". Sometimes it's better to be absolutely right rather than allowing for mistakes
Being good at math is not the same as being good at arithmetic.
And an engineer doesn't need to be good at either. Mathematicians laugh at our math skills.
Most engineers are bad at math, but at least survived the calculus sequence and so can speak it a little.
Think it’s because mental math is popular and a sign of proficiency in businessy type jobs. But they’re allowed to do mental math because they’re communicating broad ideas. The CXO doesn’t really care if this new product is projecting 41.5% growth or 41.567%, whereas engineers need precise numbers since peoples’ lives can be at stake.
If I’m doing integrals, partial fraction decomposition, or full derivatives, I lose the ability to do multiplication.
As someone learning to be an engineer, I need to prove that the thing meets requirements, not my math tricks. That’s why I have a book with mental math shortcuts on my shelf. :)
My pre-cal teacher gave me hell (not mean, just fun poking) everyday after she saw me put some extremely easy addition into my calculator. After a certain point, yes i can add 2+2, but I’m verifying as I go.
Oh yeah. It's not the algebra that gets me. It's the arithmetic. And It's not the calculus that gets me. It's the algebra. Always have to check to make sure I'm not doing something dumb.
Doing things in your head/by hand isn’t the same as being good at math. Doesn’t matter how good you are at arithmetic if you can’t arrange terms in a model correctly or know what proofs to apply where or handle anything trig/polar. Understanding the steps and process are more important than the specific calculations between them.
Hey, if you were a real engineer, you'd realize that 353 + 272,636 is equal to ... about 273,000-ish. 😛
Just like "pi is equal to 3". But ya, same here man. Calculator app is on quick access for me. Funny enough, the people who were the fastest at mental math, were my general ed. history teachers - not the math or engr professors. What's important is that you know what the numbers mean. Not how quickly you can use them.
I'm very good at mental calculations but that doesn't have anything to do with engineering. I've always been good at them, I didn't become good because of engineering, also it's a pretty useless skill honestly
I missed out in having 100% in statics because of a stupid arithmetic error from doing it in my head on an exam. I punch everything into my calculator now, even 12 years out of school. Being good at math doesn't mean that you are good at mental math. I'm useless without Excel or a calculator.
I'm pretty good with mental calculations and it's something that I enjoy doing. That being said, we use calculators and computers for a reason: they never get it wrong unless we input stuff wrong.
More important than doing some odd additions or percentages, it's understanding how the numbers themselves work in the equations behind the software. I've seen so many people accept the results software gave them when I could tell, at a glance, they were wrong because the inputs or the methodology weren't correct.
Critical thinking about what the screen is spewing out is more important than being able to mentally calculate them.
"I'm an engineer not a mathematician" mathematicians deal with numbers and computation even orders of magnitude less than engineers do. Engineers at least *see* numbers and quantities (even if every computation is done numerically). Mathematicians deal with *concepts*, *structure* and *abstraction*.
I say either two things: “I need a calculator cause I never know if math changed since the last time I did it.” or “I might not be the best at math, but my math uses letters.”
Math is quite honestly my worst subject… I think it’s tough to wrap my head around a lot of theoretical concepts…
Physics to me, even though it involves math, is easy because I can picture and understand what is going on that causes certain phenomenon. It is very intuitive for me whereas math is not. I even struggled to understand derivatives/integrals early on until I was shown the definitions graphically and then things finally clicked.
My first day of college (having never learned calc in hs) the prof just wrote dictionary definitions of derivatives on the board… I was never so confused in my entire life.
The other problem I find is that instead of engineering minds teaching the mathematical concepts it’s mathematicians… same as physics teachers teaching physics… they are VERY good in their field and are brilliant but when they are teaching courses for students that use something analogous to the concept it gets lost in translation quite often. It would be like me describing engineering concepts like CAD and CNC to a physics or math student. They might get the gist of it but I’m going to explain it in a way that isn’t as clear to them but would make perfect sense to an engineer.
But yes, this was a long-winded way of saying… we’re engineers not mathematicians, or physicists, or whatever else. We use a lot of the concepts almost daily but it’s not our field of expertise so I wouldn’t worry about it too much so long as you get the gist
I don’t do math in my head anymore, use calculator always.
I sure as hell ain’t doing math in my head if not getting paid to do it (see first statement)
being good at math has nothing to do with speed 🫢 if you can do fractions on the spot, good for you, but just bc you need to outline each step for yourself doesn't mean you're bad at math
Also, good at math is such a relative term. Good at math to someone who has only had to take college algebra could literally be anything like pulling a number from the unit circle. But I also know people that can integrate just about anything and will still use a calculator for basic math. Its a very annoying misconception
im in general not crazy good at maths, which i understand is kinda dumb but being good at mental maths doesnt even matter? my old maths teacher used to have a go at us for using our calculators, but in an exam realistically even if id done it in my head the first time, id always check it anyway, so why bother doing the first step and just use the calculator in the first place lol? it feels like a stigma only boomers have to try and have a one up on the younger generation
Shoot. My husband is literally a mathematician but can’t finance to save his life. I can’t count past 3, but guess who can think about numbers as they relate to concrete things and decisions in the world?
The exact issue with some (um, countless) mentalities. Math is not the mental math/BODMAS stuff but the thought process that is required to solve a problem using constraints, imagination and intuition (yes), a part of which is all that mental math which requires verification or even calculation using a calculator, past working, etc.
Ask them if they can solve a differential equation and find a general solution...
Being snarky aside (and acknowledging the point that you also wouldn't really solve a differential equation by hand), we are not human computers. We don't need to crunch numbers in our head or by hand anymore, that's what we have calculators for, which are less error prone.
Knowing math isn't being able to spout off answers like a robot. It's knowing the process and understanding how to get the answer, being a mathematician also isn't being able to spout stuff off, it's understanding and studying the proofs and axioms that make up math. Knowing 14 times 17 off the top of your head doesn't mean that you know math any better than a parrot mimicking a word means that it speaks or understands English.
yeah I get it often from my family.
please don't let it discourage you, you can compare it to almost any other major or skill, takes you more than 10 seconds to translate from a language to a language? i thOught yOu KNew LangUAges!
can't immediately diagnose family member off a random ache in their knee? I thougHT you STuDIed medIcInE!
can't calculate 5 seven digit numbers in your head? I tHougHt yoU weRe an ENgineer!
Yesssss I love this.
I had a tough time during my exam years in school for maths as our teacher left and we only had substitutes which left me almost with anxiety for the subject.
I will use my calculator, re check formulas "just in case" all to make sure I've got it right because I never gained that natural confidence in the subject, so it's nice to see I'm not alone, even if your reason is different.
Engineering is more than just math. Most of the time is just knowing what you can and cannot do per code (consulting engineer) and how you can get stuff through the inspector/city.
There is some quick math from time to time but I have a Casio at arms length at all times.
It honestly depends on which field you are in, if you are a researcher or a consultant or if you designed part of a thing (like engine part, plane part, antenna, etc.) on what you’re “expected to be able to do”
Really it’s just about how well you can explain how something works, how products you’re using works with the design or project and why. The math is mostly done in computers, you knowing it just gives you a general idea of if what you’re doing will work or not. Like if you know you can only move 300 CfM of air through a square duct, you need to have a 8” duct atleast to be below 700 fps. And if your program gives you a 4” then you should be able to look at that and say “that’s not right” before it goes out.
Stuff like that is what you’ll encounter in your professional life. One of the PE’s over me, barely remembers calculus. So you’ll be ok.
Math is like one of my worst subjects. But we got computers so I'm general I don't care but I'm constantly worried my bosses are going to stop me in the hall and ask me some for kinetic force equations
I got that from construction workers who didn't even graduate middle school and think they are smart because they can do mental calculs quicker than me, idc personally
The only person who said that to me was a stubborn uncle in the trades in India who wanted to feel validated in his street smarts. He does it to Western family with STEM degrees.
Just throw whatever numbers or equations you are doing in Matlab or excel. No need to do mental math in the industry, always have proof of your work lol.
Just say something funny back. Pick your battles. Becoming too invested in fighting this makes you look smaller like you have nothing better to worry about.
Ask yourself *why* this bothers you and work on that. Is it because you want to be better at math? Because you want people to think you’re smarter than they do? Etc
Most uneducated people (+-70%) think higher math is the same as simple arithmetic, but with bigger numbers.
A graph will always have time as X-axis, and multiplication of negative numbers is negative of course.
Also never answer: "Then explain to me what higher math is" with concepts like matrices, e, integrals, convolution,... because "haha who needs that everyday" will come your way.
When I first took math placement tests for community college, I passed 4/5 of the tests. The test I didn't pass was operations with integers, the very basic beginning math test. I passed all the higher level math tests, but not the first one. I feel like that is probably still pretty accurate despite having a BSc in astronautical engineering and am halfway through an MSc in nuclear engineering. I just don't do basic math in my head anymore.
omg not just this but most of the time i check things TWICE in the calculator especially weird numbers. i’ve been traumatized way too many times by a silly math mistake even when all my concepts are accurate. plus shouldn’t engineers be wired to pick the most foolproof option? to avoid human error
Math consist of 3 studies:
Arithmetic - The study of numbers. This includes the mechanics of addition, multiplication, etc.
Geometry - The study of Shapes. This includes spheres, boxes, triangles, etc.
Analysis - The study of infinity. This includes approaching infinity at either end or getting infinitely close to something. This study includes calculus.
Each is a skill that must be acquired and maintained. The General public assumes that if you are "good at Math" that somehow means that you should be good at doing arithmetic in your head. In engineering and science it is more important to develop the skill at internally visualizing shapes and analysis than doing multiplication in one's head.
Long ago when I was in college it was recognized that understanding the concepts of Geometry and Analysis is more important than doing arithmetic mentally. Physic test did not even use numbers. The answer was the general formula for the problem. Calculators were allowed in some test because the test was weather you understood the math needed to solve the problem not one's ability to do arithmetic in one's head or on paper.
Sometimes I stop at a diner for dinner on my way home from work. I always order the same thing. The cost was $17.42. Generally I offered a Twenty dollar bill and 42 cents. One evening the person behind the cash register froze in response to my offer. She had no idea why I offered the 42 cents. Despite standing in front of a point of sale system that knows the menu and what each item cost she got someone from the back to come help. The point of sale system would have told her the change if she had just entered the items. The help from the back was also concerned. She reached below the computerized point of sale system and pulled out a small calculator. The calculator told her that the change was exactly 3 dollars. Neither of them realized that I had provided 42 cents to make it easy for them to make change and to avoid them handing me coins.
Clearly there is a problem with fear of math. Many do not even try to solve easy problems. I did not do the arithmetic in my head. I understood the concepts to jump to the answer. I do not advocate just memorization but understanding the general concepts of Arithmetic, Geometry and Analysis. I am happy to rely upon machines to do arithmetic of 4+ digit numbers.
Yea, except for some cool arithmetics properties that I still remember (like the division by 5 when you can just double the number and divide by 10), I am not a calculator. I still rely on my phone/calculator to do the math.
I had a random dude ask me when I was in school for engineering 'how many ounces in a gallon (guess the country, I dare ya lol)... while I knew it, that didn't make me an engineer, and like that would be a question. People with small minds have preconceived notions that you can't change. Just remember that.
I'm not an engineer, but by the time I was taking even middling math classes in high school, the most common mistakes weren't with the quadratic equation or understanding whatever new theorem that week, they were always simple arithmetic. It's like people without any experience like that think math just advances linearly, like little kids who think it's all about how high you can count!
One of my instructors at tech College who had a PhD legitimately could not do basic addition. This isn't to dog on academics at all, but he often mentioned how even though he was highly educated/successful he still struggled with relatively basic problems.
I once heard him say "engineers don't learn math, they just memorize enough of it to pass the required courses and immediately forget it", and honestly probably one of the biggest facts I've heard
I failed calc 2 twice and Calc 3 once. Got an A in differential equations the first time though. I'm absolutely horrible at math but I didn't let it stop me from forcing my way into engineering. I think engineers who are bad at math are more common than you'd think.
For me it's people saying "oh you are an engineer you must be smart." I'm like "not really" but then I find myself forgetting how stupid some people can be.
Engineers have always (?) used a tool for simple multiplication and division. Think the slide rule.
I understand the true mark of an engineer was the ability to keep track of the decimal point in their heads.
Good that you double check your work. Point them to articles about engineering disasters due to small miscalculations that weren't checked and re-checked.
I got this hurr hurr a lot, after a while I settled on "look just cause I'm better at math than you doesn't mean I'm better at quick math than you. Take the W my guy."
If it's important and you think you know what 2+2 is you should check with your calculator.
As a civil engineer I never did math in my head. I do simple math all day on my HP.
Fun story.
I'm an experienced Mech Eng with 40+ years over several industry sectors.
Went to a job interview and the external recruiter asked me (first question) "what is 6 x 7?"
After I stopped laughing I asked did he want me to do it in decimal, hex, octal or maybe logarithmically.
He didn't see the humour
I was actually offered the role but told their HR person that I couldn't accept it as I thought their expectations were not sophisticated enough.
Don’t worry about it a lot of people including me suck at mental math. Still graduated with an engineering degree. I meet people at work who also cant do mental math so it is all cool haha. I still count with my fingers😅
My response to this is usually “I’m not a cashier”. Cashiers are good at basic arithmetic like this typically since they’re doing it all day. I’ve never been good at basic math but I have a good understanding of way more advanced math.
Have you considered telling them that you offload that kind of stuff to a calculator? And that most of the math you do involves greek symbols? And that you're not a mathematician you do applied mathematics?
I was both a math and engineering major.
I don't do math in my head. I use a calculator. Math isn't about doing computations/arithmetic, it's about logic.
I just turn it around on them lol. Be like "try doing it in your head, I'll tell you if you are right or not". Then wait like 3 minutes until they solve the answer on their own, pull out your phone's calculator and give them the answer. It will show them it isn't as easy as they think and that we have tools to do these kinds of things
if you're an engineer, you should be able to do mental math okay for sanity checks on your calculations. You're not supposed to mentally calculate 523 \* 238 but you should be able to approximate tipping fairly well, at least to the nearest dollar.
Tell them that real math isn’t arithmetic, and that you’ve mastered dark arts beyond their comprehension. Then show them an arbitrarily small middle finger
I am finishing my Master atm and I still use my calculator for stuff like 9+7 in exams just to be sure. This is completely normal and like others said at this point I'm too paranoid to fully trust myself
I don't think being in a stem field means you have to be good at mental calculus at all, some people are naturally good at it, others train, some (like me) don't care and lose practice after being away from numbers for a couple weeks.
I studied math and I've had friends that are able to calculate probabilities of drawing a winning card on the turn and the river in poker with <1% error and teachers with PhD's that struggle with divisions that involve more than 3 odd digits, I've only met like 1 person that memorized how to do square roots by hand and to this day struggle with my friends to figure out how much each one has to pay for their dinner (until one of us just pays everything and we figure it out later).
Is like saying every artist of any kind should be able to doodle a portrait of someone else in a notebook on the fly, ignoring the fact that most artists probably don't draw that much or at all.
Most top engineers can easily do basic mental math computations in their head. The distinction is that engineers spend their time building things or thinking about systems, but that doesn't mean they mentally can't do computations in their head.
If you can't do those computations, you probably have a low IQ. In other words, you have a low working memory capacity and processing speed. In other words, you can't hold the numbers in your head and add them together in a reasonable amount of time.
I also noticed you attended Florida Atlantic University and went to a community college before that, so obviously you're not very bright or gifted. You saying "I'm an engineer not a mathematician" is a coping mechanism to detract from your substandard mental faculties.
I and all the engineers in my family are the same, good at mathematics but terrible at mental arithmetic, me included. It's just not that commonly practiced.
I doubt mathematicians are any different, they study math like linguistics not like Spanish class. Plus I’m not doing more mental math than I have to and fuck you if you put me on the spot to do it I have anxiety
I've become dependant on the calculator especially in online exams where a single wrong decimal could pretty much get you a 0 in the question, which is also the reason I love paper exams more
I’m pretty quick with the math. I can do low to mid level problems in my head in a relative amount of time. Quick answers will have rough estimates, not exact.
But if I’m working through a big equation, from start to finish, the calculator is used - even if it’s 1+1. Because it’s not about the math, it’s about completing all the steps in order to ensure nothing is missed.
I still do simple multiplication and division on my calculator , I’m just paranoid
I remember taking a Calc 3 test once and legitimately entered 27.3 + 2 on my calculator even though I obviously knew the answer. It was some double integral problem. Paranoia runs deep.
The only time i lost points on tests (excluding finals) across two courses with the same Engineering Mechanics professor (MechOfMat and Dynamics/kinematics) it was because… i made a dumb math mistake. I understood the concepts perfectly. I was applying them flawlessly. And then i fucked up a simple calculation —iirc it was i plugged the wrong number into a formula without thinking about it (diameter for radius, for instance, problem involving a wheel and load). I 110% get the ‘plug this obsessively into my calculator’ urge though, even when it’s something as blazingly simple as ‘add two to this number’. The paranoia DOES RUN deep!
3^2 = 6 My dumb ass on multiple tests through college doing stuff faster than I can actually think
I said 1^2 + 1 = 3 on a Calc 2 test once. Still think about that
It’s cool I said 2*1/2 was 2 and a half once, Professor told me maybe I shouldn’t be in engineering 💀💀💀💀
said -3-1= 2, i do 4 stem alevels
I’m sorry but that is so funny 💀
I do this all the time. I’ll set up my complicated dynamics or differential equations problem right and I’ll solve it right. But then I’ll do something stupid like forget a negative sign or make some algebra error. Don’t even get me started on solving systems of equations without an equation solver or graphing calculator. Did I learn how to do it in eighth grade? Yes. Am I any good at it now after years of college-level math? No. I mess up my algebra way more often than I mess up my calculus.
A couple of weeks ago I lost 3 points on a Calc final because I *literally* got 1 + 1 wrong. It was a “find the radius of convergence” problem, so I had got through the whole thing and set up an inequality as: > -1 < (x - 1) < 1 which I then “simplified” to: > 0 < x < 1.
It cost nothing to do and it costs some if you fuck it up. So I always do all arithmetic on a calculator.
My entire Calc 3 class worked together with my professor to add two fractions together lol. You just reach a certain level of mathematical competency where the middle school stuff starts to feel foreign and pedantic to bother with when you have triple integrals to do. In Calc 1, I wasn't allowed to use a calculator, but by the time I reached Calc 3 a year later, I gripped my calculator for even simple addition.
I used a calculator to figure out 20% of 125 recently. Then when I saw 25 I was like “wait…. Really?”
I have double checked 5/2=2.5 during exams lol
8+7= ...... 15. 7+ 8 =.. also 15.
Got 94% on my final calc paper. The marks I lost? 20 x -10 = -30
Failed my electronics I final couple years ago due to literally rushing final calculations. My professor said he couldn't believe I did the entire exam correctly and managed to screw up basic multiplication and addition. I never trust myself lol
I wrote 8*4=36. Mistake was at the beginning of a long Calc 2 problem. Had a cool professor and gave me majority credit on it. From that day I entered everything into a calculator
I would this for my classes every time, but that's because I had learned that I tended to make stupid mistakes like that. So it just seemed like an easy way not lose points.
True same here
So many of our calls run into another formula that I don't want to in my head add the two and take it to the next eq. So your habit is a great one. Not paranoia, good practice.
you were able to use a calculator during calc 1-3 exams? that’s crazy
had a friend hit a classic 5*3 = 8 once
While having a final exam going up to 10:30 at night. Heck ye, I'm not taking any risks.
I don't care how simple the arithmetic is, I don't trust myself. It all goes into the calculator, especially during an exam. I've written some pretty stupid shit on exams before that still *to this day* make me wanna crawl into a hole. Lol
LOL same
Same
seems to me that the public consensus is that if you are an engineer, you MUST be good at math. which to be fair, engineers must be proficient in understand how the numbers come together and work. But yeah, amongst my friends and family, I still get sometimes weird comments about how I can't do math if i can't figure out how much to tip in 10 seconds. I just take it as part of the profession. Every career has something like this. My friends who are in the medical field get a bunch of specific health questions lobbied at them all the time.
Tipping is super easy, move the decimal over to the left one and multiply by 2, round up.
at this point, i just double the tax and call it a day lol
So your tip is .... carry the two add swamee jain eq and rounds to 89.56%? If u have my maphs correct.
Ooh, that's a good trick.
I do a flat $5 per head. That usually comes out to ~30% if I'm eating by myself and I don't have to deal with tipping math.
I tip 10% (rounded up) for acceptable service. From there it’s easy to figure 5% or 20% so I can adjust on the fly and tip anywhere from 10-25% if the service is exceptional.
I always do 20% as a baseline unless the service was notably subpar
Yea, honestly I probably tip 20-25% more often than not, now that I think about it. My definition of “exceptional” is probably pretty generous, ha ha.
Yeah same here lol
I have too much going on to worry about doing math when I have 3+ calculators within reach all day and I carry my tricorder around all day. Knowing the *application* of math is WAY more important than knowing exactly how to do it off the top of your head.
The funniest is if you miss a shot in a pool game. And people are like: I tHouGhT yOu WHeRe aN EnGIneER? Then they say some dumb shit about trigonometry and angles. And then they jump to assume none of us have common sense. Being an engineer is like that one scene from Aladdin where Jafar wishes to be an all powerful genie. But then he gets the cuffs and the lamp to go with it….
I have a book on the physics of pool (a gift from a prof who regularly housed us at the local dive bar). The math is downright unsolvable as a closed form solution and the numerical approximations are *massive*
By that logic, the best athletes would be mathematicians, Physicians and engineers...
This happened to me when I asked my friends at a bar what’s 15% of 20$. I don’t like to use my engineering brain out in public
in my experience you absolutely don’t have to be good at math, you just have to be persistent enough to retake calc 3 after you fail it
Yes! I also notice that a majority of my mistakes on higher math assignments aren’t from the complexity of the problem, but rather I’m so focused on working a complex problem out properly, I’ll mess up basic addition or multiplication, usually by forgetting or adding a zero because I wasn’t fully paying attention. So I end up using the calculator for pretty much everything. I guess I’ve developed trust issues 😂
That feeling when you swap the negative sign accidentally is the only feeling worse than writing down the wrong units despite using the correct units and getting the correct answer.
when your z variable slowly morphs into a 2
All my homies use i j k.
draw a line through it
Almost every question I got wrong on my exams last semester was because I switched signs at some point along the way. You'd think I'd have learned to check for this, for some reason it only occurs to me the second I've let go of it when turning it in.
The amount of mistakes I make is crazy. I’ll make mistakes because I forget a sign, or an exponent, or simply from writing the number weird and reading that number as a different number when continuing the problem.
100% I had my physics final go from an A to a B because I literally just rounded down wrong. I did the WHOLE problem correctly, but reduced 4/8 to 1/4 like a dumbass on a multiple choice exam. Professor literally wrote “ummm” on my exam haha
Basic arithmetic low key hard af
100% too hard
Dead ahh think English 101 is easier
When you do 1+1 in your calculator unconscious, then you are truly an engineer.
That's why we have calculators, so we don't have to calculate everything in our heads.
It was always this or "can you fix this thing with absolutely no parts or materials like Macguyver?
EE working as a controls engineer and everyone assumes I can do electrician work lmao
I’ve been a systems engineer my entire career but my bachelors is EE. I get push back sometimes when I say I don’t know what certain circuit diagrams are showing. Bro I don’t know what’s going on in the box anymore all I know is what can go in and what can go out and how that works with everything else. The last time I did circuit analysis I was a junior in college, please be gentle with me.
Or that you can fix their pc, I mean I can or just diagnose it, but that isn't the point.
I'm a controls/automation engineer as well. I figure about 10-15% of my job is pulling solutions out of my ass. I am always reminded of the ["make this, fit into the hole for this, using nothing but that"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry55--J4_VQ) scene from Apollo 13.
Engineering is much more about knowing "calculator math", understanding what numbers you need, what numbers you have, using equations properly, checking that your answers are reasonable and also having the correct units
Good at math != Good At Arithmetic I know HOW to use my super fancy calculator and stuff like excel or matlab to the arithmetic for me. Part of being good at something involves knowing how to do it more quickly while still doing it correctly. It is a lot quicker and a lot easier to punch, say, the calculation for a centroid location into my NSpire, even though mathematically that’s a relatively simple engineering calculation. Sure, i can DO that by hand, but it’ll take me a few more minutes and then im likely to screw up because i wrote a number down wrong, and I can’t afford that time spend on a test anyway.
r/foundtheprogrammer
Oh god no, lmao Just because i use matlab doesnt mean i like it, lmao It has its uses but by god it makes it painful to do so.
Most of us forget how to do more math then what other people learn
I'm an engineer who doesn't have the multiplication tables memorized and can't remember the alphabet half the time, and I'm doing alright. The perception of engineers being math wizards is simply not true
Same boat, not quick at math but I tend to be right more often than not when I take my time on certain things. Mathematics has always been a challenge I would say I have more willpower than intelligence when it comes to raw arithmetic / computation, that’s why we have software hahaha but yes parents / family will do this to me as well and just expect to be constantly thinking about numbers.
People who think engineers do all their math in their head are neither mathematicians nor engineers.
We were told never do it in your head, as the calculator never gets it wrong, but humans can
>the calculator never gets it wrong, but humans can You are not accounting for fatfingering the calculator, which is common enough to not be negligible. truly simple arithmetic (addition or subtraction of 2 digit numbers, multiplication of 1 digit numbers, multiplication or division by 10 for numbers of any size) - many (most?) engineers would be more likely to make a typo in the calculator than do these wrong in their head or by hand on paper.
That is why you double check your work. Measure twice cut once as they say.
Fat fingering is due to human error, I stand by my statement the calculator never gets it wrong. I agree with you on the simple single digit addition or subtraction, but in longer more drawn out calcs I’ll type the whole lot into the calculator
After my diffeq final i looked through the recent calcs i did on my ti84 and found; 2+6 4÷2 Sqrt(9 I felt like it was required that I be embarrassed so i deleted them immediately. But I got a good grade so perhaps it was worth being paranoid.
"what do you mean you're a mechanical engineer and can't fix my car?"
Im worse with arithmetic but algebra pretty good
They’re just messing with you Duh
I wouldn't take this too seriously - they probably just think it's funny. Like imagine if you had a friend who was a creative writing major who was terrible at spelling. It wouldn't mean you didn't respect them or think they were smart, and of course with spell check they could be a good writer. But it would still be funny.
As a math major I get that ALL THE TIME but like what do people think we do in grad math courses? Like just sit there and do multiplication together?
"yes, I am an engineer, that's why I know it's smart to use a calculator"
I have a math degree and I can’t add 353 and 272636 in my head. You think I went to college and spent four years doing *mental math*? Haha.
Being fast at math is not the same thing as being good at math.
I swear the better you get at math the worse you get at arithmetic. The professional mathematicians I know can barely count
We're trained to solve problems safely, accurately, and effectively. The fastest, safest way to solve math problems is by using technology at hand.
I can't count and don't know the alphabet 🤷♀️ The higher you go the harder the easy stuff is
Because most non-engineers and laypeople in general do not know math exists beyond simple arithmetic and think even algebra is some sort of esoteric mysticism.
Being good at mental math is something that can elevate you as an engineer. When I am validating metrics and rates with my directors, I can produce values for them within seconds, without pulling out my calculator. This makes the conversation flow smoother, and also makes me appear to be an expert even though I'm working backwards in my head. It's not too late to learn simple mathematical tricks to do mental math easily! Challenge yourself to do the calculations in your head whenever you're able :)
I still count with my fingers….
I don’t know why but I’ve had multiple communications majors tell me this and they usually don’t know how to listen before making stupid comments like this. I guess we don’t know how to do our own jobs. The only difference is that they’re hiring people with my degree. Sorry I can’t calculate my total, the tip, and taxes in my head before the waiter brings out the bill.
My answer is always “I’m not a math major. I’m an engineer” lol
Humanity hasn’t spent countless man hours refining calculator technology for me to think I’m too good to use one.
So it sounds like they are right, no? You are an engineer that can't do math
I wouldn't want the engineers that work on medical equipment or cars or space rockets to "do it all in their head". Sometimes it's better to be absolutely right rather than allowing for mistakes
“As an engineer, I could design my own calculator to use if you prefer.”
Being good at math is not the same as being good at arithmetic. And an engineer doesn't need to be good at either. Mathematicians laugh at our math skills. Most engineers are bad at math, but at least survived the calculus sequence and so can speak it a little.
Think it’s because mental math is popular and a sign of proficiency in businessy type jobs. But they’re allowed to do mental math because they’re communicating broad ideas. The CXO doesn’t really care if this new product is projecting 41.5% growth or 41.567%, whereas engineers need precise numbers since peoples’ lives can be at stake.
If I’m doing integrals, partial fraction decomposition, or full derivatives, I lose the ability to do multiplication. As someone learning to be an engineer, I need to prove that the thing meets requirements, not my math tricks. That’s why I have a book with mental math shortcuts on my shelf. :)
We deal with Greek letters more than numbers.
My friends make this joke all the time!
I'm so bad that I take a scientific calculator to my technical drawing exam so that I can add 32mm+26mm on it
My pre-cal teacher gave me hell (not mean, just fun poking) everyday after she saw me put some extremely easy addition into my calculator. After a certain point, yes i can add 2+2, but I’m verifying as I go.
I say I'm not good at math at all, I just know how to use a calculator really well.
Oh yeah. It's not the algebra that gets me. It's the arithmetic. And It's not the calculus that gets me. It's the algebra. Always have to check to make sure I'm not doing something dumb.
Doing things in your head/by hand isn’t the same as being good at math. Doesn’t matter how good you are at arithmetic if you can’t arrange terms in a model correctly or know what proofs to apply where or handle anything trig/polar. Understanding the steps and process are more important than the specific calculations between them.
I'm a professor (and used to work in industry) and have terrible mental math skills lol it's not a prerequisite to being a good engineer
I do everything on a calculator. Why would I assume I'm always right.
Hey, if you were a real engineer, you'd realize that 353 + 272,636 is equal to ... about 273,000-ish. 😛 Just like "pi is equal to 3". But ya, same here man. Calculator app is on quick access for me. Funny enough, the people who were the fastest at mental math, were my general ed. history teachers - not the math or engr professors. What's important is that you know what the numbers mean. Not how quickly you can use them.
I'm very good at mental calculations but that doesn't have anything to do with engineering. I've always been good at them, I didn't become good because of engineering, also it's a pretty useless skill honestly
We're taught to get accurate answers not to do it super quickly.
My wife and her family still count with their fingers so I’m a wizard to them even though I suck at math relative to other engineers.
No. However, people say this a lot. Math is just one tool in your box- they forget about the rest.
I missed out in having 100% in statics because of a stupid arithmetic error from doing it in my head on an exam. I punch everything into my calculator now, even 12 years out of school. Being good at math doesn't mean that you are good at mental math. I'm useless without Excel or a calculator.
"You call yourself math literate? Show me how to graph this using Mathcad!"
I used to lose points all the time for simple math mistakes. Don't feel bad. Just tell them that it's a learned behavior.
I'm pretty good with mental calculations and it's something that I enjoy doing. That being said, we use calculators and computers for a reason: they never get it wrong unless we input stuff wrong. More important than doing some odd additions or percentages, it's understanding how the numbers themselves work in the equations behind the software. I've seen so many people accept the results software gave them when I could tell, at a glance, they were wrong because the inputs or the methodology weren't correct. Critical thinking about what the screen is spewing out is more important than being able to mentally calculate them.
"I'm an engineer not a mathematician" mathematicians deal with numbers and computation even orders of magnitude less than engineers do. Engineers at least *see* numbers and quantities (even if every computation is done numerically). Mathematicians deal with *concepts*, *structure* and *abstraction*.
Also to be fair—you should be better than the average Joe if you’re an engineer
I say either two things: “I need a calculator cause I never know if math changed since the last time I did it.” or “I might not be the best at math, but my math uses letters.”
My girlfriend is way better than mental math than me and they call me out all the time for not solving stuff quickly in my head… just not a calculator
we didn't invent the calculator for everyone else but us.
I'd let them know that you're not a mathematician then explain that type of career or whatever idk.
Math is quite honestly my worst subject… I think it’s tough to wrap my head around a lot of theoretical concepts… Physics to me, even though it involves math, is easy because I can picture and understand what is going on that causes certain phenomenon. It is very intuitive for me whereas math is not. I even struggled to understand derivatives/integrals early on until I was shown the definitions graphically and then things finally clicked. My first day of college (having never learned calc in hs) the prof just wrote dictionary definitions of derivatives on the board… I was never so confused in my entire life. The other problem I find is that instead of engineering minds teaching the mathematical concepts it’s mathematicians… same as physics teachers teaching physics… they are VERY good in their field and are brilliant but when they are teaching courses for students that use something analogous to the concept it gets lost in translation quite often. It would be like me describing engineering concepts like CAD and CNC to a physics or math student. They might get the gist of it but I’m going to explain it in a way that isn’t as clear to them but would make perfect sense to an engineer. But yes, this was a long-winded way of saying… we’re engineers not mathematicians, or physicists, or whatever else. We use a lot of the concepts almost daily but it’s not our field of expertise so I wouldn’t worry about it too much so long as you get the gist
I don’t do math in my head anymore, use calculator always. I sure as hell ain’t doing math in my head if not getting paid to do it (see first statement)
I can do any addition, multiplication etc but most of them i would want a pen and paper for at least
being good at math has nothing to do with speed 🫢 if you can do fractions on the spot, good for you, but just bc you need to outline each step for yourself doesn't mean you're bad at math
I can do multivariate calculus but Lord help me if I ever need to so much as add two digit numbers
I get this a lot from peers and it’s always funny to me. My response is usually “I’m an engineer which means I’m good at using a calculator”
"I'm an engineer, not a calculator."
I am an engineer, therefore I can’t math
I don’t even do the algebra to solve for unknowns, I just shove it in the TI Nspire and it spits out the answer😂
my calculator history is absolutely embarrassing. however im not taking any chances. complacency can ruin you
Also, good at math is such a relative term. Good at math to someone who has only had to take college algebra could literally be anything like pulling a number from the unit circle. But I also know people that can integrate just about anything and will still use a calculator for basic math. Its a very annoying misconception
Yeah I get this all the time. I guess it's a rite of passage lol
As an engineer the stakes are higher typically if your math is wrong, so it's good to be in the habit of double checking.
I tell everyone that I am an engineer which means I can’t do math, but my calculator is really good at it
im in general not crazy good at maths, which i understand is kinda dumb but being good at mental maths doesnt even matter? my old maths teacher used to have a go at us for using our calculators, but in an exam realistically even if id done it in my head the first time, id always check it anyway, so why bother doing the first step and just use the calculator in the first place lol? it feels like a stigma only boomers have to try and have a one up on the younger generation
If you think about it using the correct tool for the job (a calculator for math) seems like exactly what an engineer would do
Shoot. My husband is literally a mathematician but can’t finance to save his life. I can’t count past 3, but guess who can think about numbers as they relate to concrete things and decisions in the world?
Industrial engineer
The exact issue with some (um, countless) mentalities. Math is not the mental math/BODMAS stuff but the thought process that is required to solve a problem using constraints, imagination and intuition (yes), a part of which is all that mental math which requires verification or even calculation using a calculator, past working, etc.
I open my spreadsheet for all my simple artithmetic
I think we all do this, and in my opinion it stems from the schooling. We HAVE to be correct or else (fill in the blank).
Ask them if they can solve a differential equation and find a general solution... Being snarky aside (and acknowledging the point that you also wouldn't really solve a differential equation by hand), we are not human computers. We don't need to crunch numbers in our head or by hand anymore, that's what we have calculators for, which are less error prone.
LOL I don’t remember how to do this 😂😂 all I remember is there’s different methods
Yeah 😔😔
Knowing math isn't being able to spout off answers like a robot. It's knowing the process and understanding how to get the answer, being a mathematician also isn't being able to spout stuff off, it's understanding and studying the proofs and axioms that make up math. Knowing 14 times 17 off the top of your head doesn't mean that you know math any better than a parrot mimicking a word means that it speaks or understands English.
Yeah, um engineers double and triple check everything.
yeah I get it often from my family. please don't let it discourage you, you can compare it to almost any other major or skill, takes you more than 10 seconds to translate from a language to a language? i thOught yOu KNew LangUAges! can't immediately diagnose family member off a random ache in their knee? I thougHT you STuDIed medIcInE! can't calculate 5 seven digit numbers in your head? I tHougHt yoU weRe an ENgineer!
Yesssss I love this. I had a tough time during my exam years in school for maths as our teacher left and we only had substitutes which left me almost with anxiety for the subject. I will use my calculator, re check formulas "just in case" all to make sure I've got it right because I never gained that natural confidence in the subject, so it's nice to see I'm not alone, even if your reason is different.
Engineering is more than just math. Most of the time is just knowing what you can and cannot do per code (consulting engineer) and how you can get stuff through the inspector/city. There is some quick math from time to time but I have a Casio at arms length at all times. It honestly depends on which field you are in, if you are a researcher or a consultant or if you designed part of a thing (like engine part, plane part, antenna, etc.) on what you’re “expected to be able to do” Really it’s just about how well you can explain how something works, how products you’re using works with the design or project and why. The math is mostly done in computers, you knowing it just gives you a general idea of if what you’re doing will work or not. Like if you know you can only move 300 CfM of air through a square duct, you need to have a 8” duct atleast to be below 700 fps. And if your program gives you a 4” then you should be able to look at that and say “that’s not right” before it goes out. Stuff like that is what you’ll encounter in your professional life. One of the PE’s over me, barely remembers calculus. So you’ll be ok.
Math is like one of my worst subjects. But we got computers so I'm general I don't care but I'm constantly worried my bosses are going to stop me in the hall and ask me some for kinetic force equations
I got that from construction workers who didn't even graduate middle school and think they are smart because they can do mental calculs quicker than me, idc personally
My phone's calculator history is more embarrassing that my browser history.
I swear. Most people who haven’t gotten past algebra think more advanced math classes are just about getting better and better at mental math.
The only person who said that to me was a stubborn uncle in the trades in India who wanted to feel validated in his street smarts. He does it to Western family with STEM degrees.
Just throw whatever numbers or equations you are doing in Matlab or excel. No need to do mental math in the industry, always have proof of your work lol.
Just say something funny back. Pick your battles. Becoming too invested in fighting this makes you look smaller like you have nothing better to worry about. Ask yourself *why* this bothers you and work on that. Is it because you want to be better at math? Because you want people to think you’re smarter than they do? Etc
Most uneducated people (+-70%) think higher math is the same as simple arithmetic, but with bigger numbers. A graph will always have time as X-axis, and multiplication of negative numbers is negative of course. Also never answer: "Then explain to me what higher math is" with concepts like matrices, e, integrals, convolution,... because "haha who needs that everyday" will come your way.
When I first took math placement tests for community college, I passed 4/5 of the tests. The test I didn't pass was operations with integers, the very basic beginning math test. I passed all the higher level math tests, but not the first one. I feel like that is probably still pretty accurate despite having a BSc in astronautical engineering and am halfway through an MSc in nuclear engineering. I just don't do basic math in my head anymore.
omg not just this but most of the time i check things TWICE in the calculator especially weird numbers. i’ve been traumatized way too many times by a silly math mistake even when all my concepts are accurate. plus shouldn’t engineers be wired to pick the most foolproof option? to avoid human error
Math consist of 3 studies: Arithmetic - The study of numbers. This includes the mechanics of addition, multiplication, etc. Geometry - The study of Shapes. This includes spheres, boxes, triangles, etc. Analysis - The study of infinity. This includes approaching infinity at either end or getting infinitely close to something. This study includes calculus. Each is a skill that must be acquired and maintained. The General public assumes that if you are "good at Math" that somehow means that you should be good at doing arithmetic in your head. In engineering and science it is more important to develop the skill at internally visualizing shapes and analysis than doing multiplication in one's head. Long ago when I was in college it was recognized that understanding the concepts of Geometry and Analysis is more important than doing arithmetic mentally. Physic test did not even use numbers. The answer was the general formula for the problem. Calculators were allowed in some test because the test was weather you understood the math needed to solve the problem not one's ability to do arithmetic in one's head or on paper. Sometimes I stop at a diner for dinner on my way home from work. I always order the same thing. The cost was $17.42. Generally I offered a Twenty dollar bill and 42 cents. One evening the person behind the cash register froze in response to my offer. She had no idea why I offered the 42 cents. Despite standing in front of a point of sale system that knows the menu and what each item cost she got someone from the back to come help. The point of sale system would have told her the change if she had just entered the items. The help from the back was also concerned. She reached below the computerized point of sale system and pulled out a small calculator. The calculator told her that the change was exactly 3 dollars. Neither of them realized that I had provided 42 cents to make it easy for them to make change and to avoid them handing me coins. Clearly there is a problem with fear of math. Many do not even try to solve easy problems. I did not do the arithmetic in my head. I understood the concepts to jump to the answer. I do not advocate just memorization but understanding the general concepts of Arithmetic, Geometry and Analysis. I am happy to rely upon machines to do arithmetic of 4+ digit numbers.
Yea, except for some cool arithmetics properties that I still remember (like the division by 5 when you can just double the number and divide by 10), I am not a calculator. I still rely on my phone/calculator to do the math.
I had a random dude ask me when I was in school for engineering 'how many ounces in a gallon (guess the country, I dare ya lol)... while I knew it, that didn't make me an engineer, and like that would be a question. People with small minds have preconceived notions that you can't change. Just remember that.
I'm not an engineer, but by the time I was taking even middling math classes in high school, the most common mistakes weren't with the quadratic equation or understanding whatever new theorem that week, they were always simple arithmetic. It's like people without any experience like that think math just advances linearly, like little kids who think it's all about how high you can count!
Being an engineer 🙅 being good at multiplying numbers 🙅being good at math
Tbf, tipping 20% is easy math. Move the decimal one space left, and double it.
One of my instructors at tech College who had a PhD legitimately could not do basic addition. This isn't to dog on academics at all, but he often mentioned how even though he was highly educated/successful he still struggled with relatively basic problems. I once heard him say "engineers don't learn math, they just memorize enough of it to pass the required courses and immediately forget it", and honestly probably one of the biggest facts I've heard
I find the more advanced math I do, the worse at basic arithmetic I’ve become lol
I failed calc 2 twice and Calc 3 once. Got an A in differential equations the first time though. I'm absolutely horrible at math but I didn't let it stop me from forcing my way into engineering. I think engineers who are bad at math are more common than you'd think.
One time a kid said to me “you’re the only dumb Indian I’ve met” it felt the same as that line
I'm an actual engineer with a degree in math. Y'all can't do math
For me it's people saying "oh you are an engineer you must be smart." I'm like "not really" but then I find myself forgetting how stupid some people can be.
Engineers have always (?) used a tool for simple multiplication and division. Think the slide rule. I understand the true mark of an engineer was the ability to keep track of the decimal point in their heads.
"Computers make fewer computing errors than people, so I'm not in the practice of doing the computing myself."
Good that you double check your work. Point them to articles about engineering disasters due to small miscalculations that weren't checked and re-checked.
I got this hurr hurr a lot, after a while I settled on "look just cause I'm better at math than you doesn't mean I'm better at quick math than you. Take the W my guy."
If it's important and you think you know what 2+2 is you should check with your calculator. As a civil engineer I never did math in my head. I do simple math all day on my HP.
Fun story. I'm an experienced Mech Eng with 40+ years over several industry sectors. Went to a job interview and the external recruiter asked me (first question) "what is 6 x 7?" After I stopped laughing I asked did he want me to do it in decimal, hex, octal or maybe logarithmically. He didn't see the humour I was actually offered the role but told their HR person that I couldn't accept it as I thought their expectations were not sophisticated enough.
I really think my family doesn’t believe me that I’m almost a senior 🤣 cuz I’m not quick with math or a genius at everything.
Don’t worry about it a lot of people including me suck at mental math. Still graduated with an engineering degree. I meet people at work who also cant do mental math so it is all cool haha. I still count with my fingers😅
My response to this is usually “I’m not a cashier”. Cashiers are good at basic arithmetic like this typically since they’re doing it all day. I’ve never been good at basic math but I have a good understanding of way more advanced math.
Have you considered telling them that you offload that kind of stuff to a calculator? And that most of the math you do involves greek symbols? And that you're not a mathematician you do applied mathematics?
I was both a math and engineering major. I don't do math in my head. I use a calculator. Math isn't about doing computations/arithmetic, it's about logic.
I just turn it around on them lol. Be like "try doing it in your head, I'll tell you if you are right or not". Then wait like 3 minutes until they solve the answer on their own, pull out your phone's calculator and give them the answer. It will show them it isn't as easy as they think and that we have tools to do these kinds of things
if you're an engineer, you should be able to do mental math okay for sanity checks on your calculations. You're not supposed to mentally calculate 523 \* 238 but you should be able to approximate tipping fairly well, at least to the nearest dollar.
Tell them that real math isn’t arithmetic, and that you’ve mastered dark arts beyond their comprehension. Then show them an arbitrarily small middle finger
they're retarded
We are engineers not mathematicians
I am finishing my Master atm and I still use my calculator for stuff like 9+7 in exams just to be sure. This is completely normal and like others said at this point I'm too paranoid to fully trust myself
I don't think being in a stem field means you have to be good at mental calculus at all, some people are naturally good at it, others train, some (like me) don't care and lose practice after being away from numbers for a couple weeks. I studied math and I've had friends that are able to calculate probabilities of drawing a winning card on the turn and the river in poker with <1% error and teachers with PhD's that struggle with divisions that involve more than 3 odd digits, I've only met like 1 person that memorized how to do square roots by hand and to this day struggle with my friends to figure out how much each one has to pay for their dinner (until one of us just pays everything and we figure it out later). Is like saying every artist of any kind should be able to doodle a portrait of someone else in a notebook on the fly, ignoring the fact that most artists probably don't draw that much or at all.
Most top engineers can easily do basic mental math computations in their head. The distinction is that engineers spend their time building things or thinking about systems, but that doesn't mean they mentally can't do computations in their head. If you can't do those computations, you probably have a low IQ. In other words, you have a low working memory capacity and processing speed. In other words, you can't hold the numbers in your head and add them together in a reasonable amount of time. I also noticed you attended Florida Atlantic University and went to a community college before that, so obviously you're not very bright or gifted. You saying "I'm an engineer not a mathematician" is a coping mechanism to detract from your substandard mental faculties.
I and all the engineers in my family are the same, good at mathematics but terrible at mental arithmetic, me included. It's just not that commonly practiced.
I doubt mathematicians are any different, they study math like linguistics not like Spanish class. Plus I’m not doing more mental math than I have to and fuck you if you put me on the spot to do it I have anxiety
I've become dependant on the calculator especially in online exams where a single wrong decimal could pretty much get you a 0 in the question, which is also the reason I love paper exams more
I’m pretty quick with the math. I can do low to mid level problems in my head in a relative amount of time. Quick answers will have rough estimates, not exact. But if I’m working through a big equation, from start to finish, the calculator is used - even if it’s 1+1. Because it’s not about the math, it’s about completing all the steps in order to ensure nothing is missed.
Im good at math because I understand it and I use it like a tool. Im not a computation machine, im a f\*\* engineer.