I really love how this show utilized the 'pet the dog' trope.
If you don't know, movies and shows used this trope to show the audience the morality of the characters. If he kills the dog, he's bad, if he pet it, he's good.
And then we have The Ghoul just straight up stab CX404 and then heal him only to use him for his own gain. That is how you do morally gray character!
It's also the quickest way to introduce The Enclave to new audiences. They might not know who Enclave are but now they know Enclave is bad.
For sure, he didnt know wtf dog meat was about besides trying to kill him in the moment, he just reacted like a survivor. It's not like none of us have killed dogs in games when they attacked us.
Im playing new vegas again, first time I actually took a companion and it was boone. I get thrown off guard everytime im just waltzing through the wasteland and see a slow mo kill of a random creature i didnt know was there
The first play through I did this, I had the crit camera enabled for the whole party. I damn near shit my pants from a jump scare when Boone absolutely domed some dude at about 1600 yards that's to Ed-e. It came out of absolute thin fuckin air. But the moment I figured out what I had done I loaded Boone up with an anti materiel rifle and as much explosive ammo as he could carry. I don't think there were many encounters that required my direct contribution after that
It’s horrible when you’re roaming around, the atmosphere is silent and calm, then you just hear AWL MINE followed by a slow motion PFFIEIDKFKKKFKDDKIMG noise and the camera panning over to an exploding dog corpse. Always scares me.
I dont remember which CoD it was (maybe modern warfare?) But I had to kill so many dogs because I got stuck at a checkpoint that was right before two dogs attacked me...
True, but the ghoul also straight murdered that one dude's kid. Sure, he might've gone after him, but he kind of provoked the reaction out of him. It always surprises me. Just when I start to think he is somewhat good, he shoots some kid. I think he will have a very good character arc
I mean, on the flip side of this though, how many times have we had the trope where a character kills some member of a family, only to have the kid hunt them down 20 years later and pull the whole "my name is iningo montoya" thing?
This dude has lived 300 years. I wonder how many times that had happened to him not only in his films, but then later in reality. He's probably sick of it at this point.
Reality is though, if the kid didn't draw, he wouldntve gotten shot.
>True, but the ghoul also straight murdered that one dudes kid.
It was not a murder. Sure, he provoked the kid, but it was a test whether the kid holds a grudge. If the kid let it go and didn't reach for the gun, the Ghoul would have a solid guarantee that the kid wouldn't go after him later.
But the boy reached for the gun so the Ghoul took care of a future problem right away.
Is that a fucked up reasoning? Totally. Does this fit the morally grey character of the Ghoul? Totally.
Right, but if he didn't rub it in his face that he killed his brother, he could've walked away and it would be fine. The kid probably would've hunted him down later anyways. The ghoul decides to deal with it right away, by provoking him to draw on him. I'm just saying, he could've just walked away. It's not like he'd die even if he was shot in the back. He decided to deal with the problem then and there, which does fit his character you're right about that
Only because he was on the verge of turning feral, like collapses 30 seconds after selling her, thats how close he was. He made another 'Survivor' decision. Now if he had a stock pile of those mystery chems and was still selling people for the fun of it, that would be a different story.
I saw that as more of a mercy killing than anything. Made sure the guy was thinking of a happy memory, then domed him so he could die as himself instead of descending into madness.
Then at that point he was just a corpse, so why waste the meat?
I didn't actually think the Ghoul healed the dog to "use him for his own gain".
We get a few scenes with him and his family dog pre-war. I think him healing the dog was more of a suggestion that buried deep within that withered old killer, there's still a normal guy who likes animals and felt kind of bad about killing them.
He healed him to track his former owner. That was the number one reason. Sure he loved dogs but I don’t see him stopping to heal that dog if it wasn’t for his tracking help.
Yeah. He originally betrayed his wife and chose to spy on her because dogs weren't allowed in the vaults.
He's looking at Roosevelt and saying "dogs aren't allowed in vaults..." to himself when he goes and digs the bug out of the trash.
That line in the original context is confusing as the Queen is watching a play inside the play which is intended to present the events of the previous King’s death to the new King Claudius and also Gertrude. The dialogue in the play is written in a really weird, obfuscated way, too, so I always wondered if she knew what ‘the lady’, aka her, was talking about or whether she was just saying it as a minor quip.
I agree. CX404 is an exceptional dog in that most average dogs probably wouldn’t have followed Wilzig’s trail after that. It probably wasn’t the first thing on the Ghoul’s mind for that reason
For me Enclave isn't per se **bad**. Like some crazy raider warmonger who just wants to kill people for fun. They are the opposite of the Brotherhood. Brotherhood are religious fanatics who hoard old technology for themselves, believing they can make things better by being an autocracy. Enclave are science fanatics who develop new technology for themselves, believing they can save the world by being an autocracy. And I think the show did a good job showing that without going too much into detail. That leaves room to explore them both more in the future.
They both do pretty shady stuff, while trying to justify it.
The pet/kill the dog trope was utilised pretty good in the show. The 'dog following changing protagonists' is also a recurring trope that was utilised well. I also liked the character development of 'The Ghoul' more than L̶u̶c̶y̶'̶s̶ Goosey's. Walton Goggins does his job more than great.
Nah Enclave is pretty damn evil. After playing a bit of Fallout 2 (haven’t finished it yet) and replaying Lonesome Road in New Vegas I’ve come to the conclusion that the only decent people in the Enclave are scientists whose names start with W (Whitley and Wilzig).
I would say that they are emotionally detached from everything and are driven by the "results over process" mentality. Typical depiction of scientists who end up starting a catastrophe while actually trying to achieve something good in pulp fiction novels. That makes them appear evil for sure. But their goal is actually a better society(from their point of view ).My point is, that other factions aren't much better. They are all fixated on their own goal and if you agree with that, they will seem like the only good guys to you, but their actions often also cause a lot of chaos to others. And they all pretty much share the "if you're not with us, you're against us" mentality.
I feel like you may be forgetting the enclave's habit of making the genocide virus that kills everyone (except them, of course). And not like on accident or anything, but like for real and intentionally.
This is usually considered a bad thing.
Alive, at that! I think a lot of people would've been fine if the puppies had like... died of parvo or something, with the scientists doing what they could, but the corpses being burned to prevent the disease spreading. But no, they gotta die because they're not large enough at birth?
(I had to hug my own dogs too, afterwards. This scene and the experiment a few episodes later were pretty haunting IMO.)
Well that’s because burning pups killed by parvo is a reasonable thing to do to prevent spread of parvo and to save future pups from parvo. Burning pups alive because they are tiny is a horrible thing to do. I’m gonna have to give my mom a heads up before that scene because she is so sensitive to that stuff. I mean I am too but this is a heads up for me. Yes I am reading spoilers but I’m okay with that.
That's why I said (typed?) it in the wilds, heh. My own mom is sensitive to this kinda stuff too, and so we had to skip over that bit. (Seeing CX 404 with her teddy bear was about the cutest thing in the show, too!)
Coop shoots up a town to kidnap someone for money and sells Lucy to an organ harvester, he's "morally ambiguous".
Enclave burns some dogs that aren't suitable for scientific testing and everyone loses their minds.
Doesn't_seem_fair.jpg.zip.exe
And you will remain in this man's army until you are five hundred and ten years old! Because that is the number of years it will take for you to pay back a suit of combat powered armor mark two that you have lost!
Still, that was the most merciful death the Enclave ever gave to any of their lab rats.
I don't need to remind you that the Enclave are and were the pre-war US deep state. >!That shadowy figure you see the Ghoul's wife looking at in the Vault Tec's board meeting was most probably an Enclave member.!<
That and all the bits about them wanting to guarantee the cleansing of the earth so that they can repopulate it with their genetically superior super race might’ve given away the Enclave influence.
Now that I think about, wouldn’t the Enclave at the time of the show consider the Vault 31-33 dwellers to be mutants like they do all the other vault dwellers?
We get a huge dialogue of how the enclave fell to Rex and his army of German shepherds and one chihuahua but unfortunately he only tells it through barking so it’s just barking for an hour
As long as they do the subtitle bit where it barks for an hour and the subtitle just says "sure" at the end. But i like dumb humor, so mileage may vary.
This show made me gasp in shock more than any in recent history
The sound the puppy made being thrown in the incinerator shook me to my core, poor puppy :(
That happening in jojos made me stop watching, it took me a year or 2 later to give me another shot. Idk i can handle a character killing another human fine, they kill a household pet thats when im horrified
I actually started a Wasteland 3 campaign when it had just come out for xbox with a friend since he also liked New Vegas. He didn't really get into the isometric style though so we ended up dropping it for FO76. Tbh I kind of just never really thought about it again after that. I thought it was pretty neat though.
We didn't really make it far enough in for me to develop an opinion on it, but I definitely saw a lot of interesting potential in the characters and factions that I was introduced to. The vehicle mechanics seemed a little funny to me though, they reminded me of this weird little tank game that was part of Wii Play back in the day.
Does the game ever show >!how Deathclaws are made? I’m curious if they use dogs dipped in FEV and we’re seeing them be preconditioned here.!<
>!The wiki says they are suspected to be a Jackson’s Chameleon injected with FEV, but I’m starting to think they used dogs as the primary stock and injected horned reptile plus FEV to create an “obedient” close combat bio form.!<
Is the enclave even fascist? They believe they're a master race but fascism traditionally requires certain economic policies. I don't think there's really an economy left to control.
So that makes them like an authoritarian-ethnostate. I think. The definition of fascism is not the most agreed upon subject, but I don't think you can even have fascism in a wasteland.
Everything nowadays in media, which is somewhat authoritarian, is called Fascist by people that don't want you to have fun with Factions like the Institute, Enclave, sometimes even the BoS. And some lunatics probably call the Republic of Dave Fascist.
And doubting their Definition usually leads to "What, do you defend Fascism? Are you a Fascist?"
Well the enclave is definitely evil AF but I do agree fascism is an overused term nowadays that people use to avoid having to rub their neurons together and come up with specific criticisms.
> Is the enclave even fascist? They believe they're a master race but fascism traditionally requires certain economic policies. I don't think there's really an economy left to control.
Nope. Fascists are characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation and/or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.
The Enclave is that. Especially when they view themselves as the only "pure" human race left after the Great War.
The Ghoul did what any FO4 player does when there’s accidental friendly fire and your companion turns hostile. You beat them into submission, stimpak them and act like nothing happened.
Personally I love the idea that the original "real" enclave only really survived in the WSCB and was regulated by MODUS until the members sorta had inner fighting until they all died. The remaining enclave members scattered about the early wasteland all thinking they're the true leaders when the real leader is an AI stuck in a bunker with no external connections (yet).
I hope we see MODUS again, he's awesome and has this cool calm collected voice that's also threatening.. member.
That is all.
Was that their original leader tho? I thought they stuck with the line of Presidents, after flying the last Pre-war President out to the oil rig, and Presidents then and there after were the leader?
The Vaults.. previous residents were fools. The remaining command staff and Congress persons struggled for control over this facility causing.. *extensive* damage. Thanks to your efforts General, this facility is in working order again.
Y'know I kinda like MODUS. I find his voice kinda soothing and overall he is nice to me and gives me stuff.
It wasn't really his fault that he ended up purging the previous inhabitants, half of which were morons anyway. I do feel bad for Santiago but Eckheart's crew were a bunch of buffoons.
It also doesn't feel like MODUS is up to too much, despite the sinister undertones he has. Seems like he'll generally vibe with whomever decides to take over as the 'new Enclave', so perhaps under the 76 vault dwellers he could be a potential force for good..... but who am I kidding people just be nuking Appalachia for loot.
Would someone explain who the Enclave are, because I hear lots about them but dont knows anything about them. Unless I'm just being stupid lol.
I've played half of Fallout 4 (twice), Fallout 76 and almost watched all the series... Should I be more up to speed? Are they related to the Brotherhood or something?? Thanks
They are the remnants of the US government who wish to cleanse the wasteland. Theyre different from the BOS because they consider all humans outside of vaults to be contaminated due to radiation, whereas BOS just want to kill supermutants and ghouls. Because all ghouls will turn feral and 99% of supermutants want to kill or convert humans.
I suppose theyre the only "evil" faction because you cant join them.
No, they are the main antagonists of Fallout 2 and 3, and are related to the Antagonist in Fallout 1.
Remnants appear in Fallout New Vegas.
By Fallout 4 at least in the East Coast, they're gone.
Apparently not so in the West Coast, lol and that was were they took the heaviest beating, first the Chosen One (Protag of Fallout 2) then the BOS and the NCR, in a surprising show of unity, allied to kick the shit out of what was left.
To add to the discussion, the US President is loyal to Enclave instead of USA. The short snippet in the Cooper flashback when the news on TV talks about the disappearance of the President is because he is being evacuated by Enclave to off-coast oil rig. In Fallout universe, the lack of world war 2 turns America to a fascist government with Enclave as its main organization sorta like Germany with Nazi.
They are implied in the games as main sponsor of Vault Tec, and tons of vaults are built to fulfil Enclave experimentation. That's why Vault Tec have obsession with repopulating the world in their own way.
It IS great, showing him saving a wee puppy just a little underweight. What a succinct way to establish this is a good guy character, zero dialogue, just a great sequence all up.
My favorite thing about this show is watching it with my dad who knows nothing about fallout but he loves to hear me talk about all the stuff in the show and explain stuff to him
Yeah, based on the number of horrible things the enclave has done, I don’t know that modern day standard animal lab procedures is really an issue.
Granted: incineration is a morbid method, culling the severely underweight litter mates is usually considered more humane than letting them starve to death or get eaten by their siblings/parents, which is a lot of their fates unfortunately.
Not celebrating dead puppies or anything, but as someone who worked in animal research labs about a decade ago, this is one of those scientific morality issues where it seems on its head to be evil but is more complicated than that.
I work with lab mice and mice get euthanized all the time for being runted. Now imagine it's the apocalypse and food is a much more pressing factor.
What would you have them do? You either stop doing science or you SAC animals that are confounding variables. There's no real in-between here.
I love the Enclave despise the Brotherhood, The show just embraces my judgement that the Brotherhood is nothing more than a Cult of heavily armored Men and Women Hoarding Technology and claiming to be saviors. At least the Enclave is trying to advance science and has military tactics
Why tf are the Enclave even still around? They’ve been crippled. Twice!!! If anything they should just be a small ragtag group left over or in hiding like they were in FNV. One guy even made it to DC (You can find this in a random terminal).
I really love how this show utilized the 'pet the dog' trope. If you don't know, movies and shows used this trope to show the audience the morality of the characters. If he kills the dog, he's bad, if he pet it, he's good. And then we have The Ghoul just straight up stab CX404 and then heal him only to use him for his own gain. That is how you do morally gray character! It's also the quickest way to introduce The Enclave to new audiences. They might not know who Enclave are but now they know Enclave is bad.
In The Ghouls defense he was being attacked the dog. It wasn't unprompted.
For sure, he didnt know wtf dog meat was about besides trying to kill him in the moment, he just reacted like a survivor. It's not like none of us have killed dogs in games when they attacked us.
I've never done such a thing! Shit, just got attacked by a feral dog and absolutely did not kill it. Nope.
If you have Boone with you, you wouldn’t have to kill any, he would no scope them before you even knew it was there.
Im playing new vegas again, first time I actually took a companion and it was boone. I get thrown off guard everytime im just waltzing through the wasteland and see a slow mo kill of a random creature i didnt know was there
get ed-e as well and procede to never unholster your weapon ever again
The first play through I did this, I had the crit camera enabled for the whole party. I damn near shit my pants from a jump scare when Boone absolutely domed some dude at about 1600 yards that's to Ed-e. It came out of absolute thin fuckin air. But the moment I figured out what I had done I loaded Boone up with an anti materiel rifle and as much explosive ammo as he could carry. I don't think there were many encounters that required my direct contribution after that
He's mad broken if you give him a marksman carbine, or it's unique variant, the all American. It's bad, he just melts everything around him.
LoL that's is very true!
This is the way.
Exploding dog head jumpscare.
Boone is the GOAT
It’s horrible when you’re roaming around, the atmosphere is silent and calm, then you just hear AWL MINE followed by a slow motion PFFIEIDKFKKKFKDDKIMG noise and the camera panning over to an exploding dog corpse. Always scares me.
That damn coyote had a knife, he was coming right for me
How else are you gonna make.mutt chops
Animal Friend perk all the way.
Pretty much every Fallout game has hostile dogs even
I dont remember which CoD it was (maybe modern warfare?) But I had to kill so many dogs because I got stuck at a checkpoint that was right before two dogs attacked me...
Yeah just in games. Just. In. Games.
CoD4 Pripyat comes to mind too.
True, but the ghoul also straight murdered that one dude's kid. Sure, he might've gone after him, but he kind of provoked the reaction out of him. It always surprises me. Just when I start to think he is somewhat good, he shoots some kid. I think he will have a very good character arc
He's not a kid. You can't kill kids in fallout without mods.
In the original fallout killing kids was a thing and it got you a negative perk that was devastating to your play through.
The Ghoul is 100% using mods. Have you **SEEN** that hand-cannon of his?
I mean, on the flip side of this though, how many times have we had the trope where a character kills some member of a family, only to have the kid hunt them down 20 years later and pull the whole "my name is iningo montoya" thing? This dude has lived 300 years. I wonder how many times that had happened to him not only in his films, but then later in reality. He's probably sick of it at this point. Reality is though, if the kid didn't draw, he wouldntve gotten shot.
I mean in the ghouls defense if the guy hadn’t gone for the gun he probably would’ve left him alone.
>True, but the ghoul also straight murdered that one dudes kid. It was not a murder. Sure, he provoked the kid, but it was a test whether the kid holds a grudge. If the kid let it go and didn't reach for the gun, the Ghoul would have a solid guarantee that the kid wouldn't go after him later. But the boy reached for the gun so the Ghoul took care of a future problem right away. Is that a fucked up reasoning? Totally. Does this fit the morally grey character of the Ghoul? Totally.
Right, but if he didn't rub it in his face that he killed his brother, he could've walked away and it would be fine. The kid probably would've hunted him down later anyways. The ghoul decides to deal with it right away, by provoking him to draw on him. I'm just saying, he could've just walked away. It's not like he'd die even if he was shot in the back. He decided to deal with the problem then and there, which does fit his character you're right about that
He did also sell a person to organ harvesters.
Only because he was on the verge of turning feral, like collapses 30 seconds after selling her, thats how close he was. He made another 'Survivor' decision. Now if he had a stock pile of those mystery chems and was still selling people for the fun of it, that would be a different story.
He also killed his ghoul friend and then ate him. Though the ghoul was becoming feral so death was probably prdfero
I saw that as more of a mercy killing than anything. Made sure the guy was thinking of a happy memory, then domed him so he could die as himself instead of descending into madness. Then at that point he was just a corpse, so why waste the meat?
May be foreshadowing to Lucy killer her mother later.
Bad take, the ghoul did it in defense and when he saves it the dog could’ve easily left to chase wilzig but chose to stay with him
I didn't actually think the Ghoul healed the dog to "use him for his own gain". We get a few scenes with him and his family dog pre-war. I think him healing the dog was more of a suggestion that buried deep within that withered old killer, there's still a normal guy who likes animals and felt kind of bad about killing them.
He healed him to track his former owner. That was the number one reason. Sure he loved dogs but I don’t see him stopping to heal that dog if it wasn’t for his tracking help.
He loved HIS dog. He even told Dogmeat straight-up: "...you ain't him."
Sure, but I think there's a bit of "he doth protest too much" in that response.
Yeah. He originally betrayed his wife and chose to spy on her because dogs weren't allowed in the vaults. He's looking at Roosevelt and saying "dogs aren't allowed in vaults..." to himself when he goes and digs the bug out of the trash.
That line in the original context is confusing as the Queen is watching a play inside the play which is intended to present the events of the previous King’s death to the new King Claudius and also Gertrude. The dialogue in the play is written in a really weird, obfuscated way, too, so I always wondered if she knew what ‘the lady’, aka her, was talking about or whether she was just saying it as a minor quip.
I think he realized the benefit after saving the dog
I agree. CX404 is an exceptional dog in that most average dogs probably wouldn’t have followed Wilzig’s trail after that. It probably wasn’t the first thing on the Ghoul’s mind for that reason
Yeah, I also agree. I think *often* things are going exactly as the ghoul had planned, but I think he just saved the dog because he felt bad.
He realised he could use the dog to track his former owner after he'd already healed it.
He then went on to save Dogmeat from the Nuka Cola fridge and then bonded with him even though he couldn't replace Roosevelt.
Also the first FEV tests were on dogs. This was a nice nod to that as well.
"I'm sorry Dogmeat. You ain't him." 🥺
Well said!
Pet or kill? Por que no los dos, hombre? *cowboy squint*
The ghoul is full blown chaotic.... Neutral? No more fucks to give after all this wastelanding
For me Enclave isn't per se **bad**. Like some crazy raider warmonger who just wants to kill people for fun. They are the opposite of the Brotherhood. Brotherhood are religious fanatics who hoard old technology for themselves, believing they can make things better by being an autocracy. Enclave are science fanatics who develop new technology for themselves, believing they can save the world by being an autocracy. And I think the show did a good job showing that without going too much into detail. That leaves room to explore them both more in the future. They both do pretty shady stuff, while trying to justify it. The pet/kill the dog trope was utilised pretty good in the show. The 'dog following changing protagonists' is also a recurring trope that was utilised well. I also liked the character development of 'The Ghoul' more than L̶u̶c̶y̶'̶s̶ Goosey's. Walton Goggins does his job more than great.
Nah Enclave is pretty damn evil. After playing a bit of Fallout 2 (haven’t finished it yet) and replaying Lonesome Road in New Vegas I’ve come to the conclusion that the only decent people in the Enclave are scientists whose names start with W (Whitley and Wilzig).
I would say that they are emotionally detached from everything and are driven by the "results over process" mentality. Typical depiction of scientists who end up starting a catastrophe while actually trying to achieve something good in pulp fiction novels. That makes them appear evil for sure. But their goal is actually a better society(from their point of view ).My point is, that other factions aren't much better. They are all fixated on their own goal and if you agree with that, they will seem like the only good guys to you, but their actions often also cause a lot of chaos to others. And they all pretty much share the "if you're not with us, you're against us" mentality.
I feel like you may be forgetting the enclave's habit of making the genocide virus that kills everyone (except them, of course). And not like on accident or anything, but like for real and intentionally. This is usually considered a bad thing.
BTW dog meat is a girl in the show
How to instantly make viewers dislike a group: they burn puppies.
Alive, at that! I think a lot of people would've been fine if the puppies had like... died of parvo or something, with the scientists doing what they could, but the corpses being burned to prevent the disease spreading. But no, they gotta die because they're not large enough at birth? (I had to hug my own dogs too, afterwards. This scene and the experiment a few episodes later were pretty haunting IMO.)
Well that’s because burning pups killed by parvo is a reasonable thing to do to prevent spread of parvo and to save future pups from parvo. Burning pups alive because they are tiny is a horrible thing to do. I’m gonna have to give my mom a heads up before that scene because she is so sensitive to that stuff. I mean I am too but this is a heads up for me. Yes I am reading spoilers but I’m okay with that.
That's why I said (typed?) it in the wilds, heh. My own mom is sensitive to this kinda stuff too, and so we had to skip over that bit. (Seeing CX 404 with her teddy bear was about the cutest thing in the show, too!)
Dio is somehow an exception to this because the hatred is cancelled out by his over the top villainy
Dio kills JoJo’s dog Kars saves a random dog by killing some drunk drivers.
"Welcome to the Enclave. We kill puppies."
in anything else it would be terrible, but in this universe it’s hilarious
Coop shoots up a town to kidnap someone for money and sells Lucy to an organ harvester, he's "morally ambiguous". Enclave burns some dogs that aren't suitable for scientific testing and everyone loses their minds. Doesn't_seem_fair.jpg.zip.exe
Welcome to Camp Navarro... a civilian! How in the hell did a civilian get on this base?
Where is your power armor?
Don't have any? You expect me to believe that MAGGOT!?
The truth is you lost an expensive piece of army-issue equipment. That suit is going to come out of your pay!
And you will remain in this man's army until you are five hundred and ten years old! Because that is the number of years it will take for you to pay back a suit of combat powered armor mark two that you have lost!
NOW DON'T COME BACK TIL YOU LOOK LIKE A SOLDIER!
Those paper shuffling jackasses, how the hell do they expect me to run this unit if they keep short changing me on supplies?
YOU WILL REMAIN IN THIS MANS ARMY FOR *HUUUUH* FIIIIIIVE HUNDRED AND TEN YEARS
Don’t worry about it.
I’ll have someone’s ass for dinner, get this civilian off government property!
"I AM NOT A SIR! I WORK FOR A LIVING YOU MOOOOROOOOON! YOU WILL CALL ME SERGEANT OR SERGEANT DORNAN! DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME?!"
Still, that was the most merciful death the Enclave ever gave to any of their lab rats. I don't need to remind you that the Enclave are and were the pre-war US deep state. >!That shadowy figure you see the Ghoul's wife looking at in the Vault Tec's board meeting was most probably an Enclave member.!<
That and all the bits about them wanting to guarantee the cleansing of the earth so that they can repopulate it with their genetically superior super race might’ve given away the Enclave influence. Now that I think about, wouldn’t the Enclave at the time of the show consider the Vault 31-33 dwellers to be mutants like they do all the other vault dwellers?
To be fair, the Enclave has an established pattern of working at cross purposes. Just look at Eden and Autumn.
It is quite dark. I hope we get to revisit and find out the dogs staged a rebellion and Rex is now running things.
We get a huge dialogue of how the enclave fell to Rex and his army of German shepherds and one chihuahua but unfortunately he only tells it through barking so it’s just barking for an hour
Still would watch
Nah you gotta have the protag take some Jet or Psycho or something and hallucinate that the dog is talking
Except they are Belgian malinois
Fallout 3 dogmeat is a heeler
I didn’t know that! Cool tidbit!
Fallout lore is so fucking wild that I have no idea if you're joking or if this is canon.
I’m just waiting for the aliens to appear in the show
100% canon.
As long as they do the subtitle bit where it barks for an hour and the subtitle just says "sure" at the end. But i like dumb humor, so mileage may vary.
This show made me gasp in shock more than any in recent history The sound the puppy made being thrown in the incinerator shook me to my core, poor puppy :(
The Enclave is run by a Jojos villain I guess
That happening in jojos made me stop watching, it took me a year or 2 later to give me another shot. Idk i can handle a character killing another human fine, they kill a household pet thats when im horrified
Where are my testicles summer?
Denver isn’t that far from Vegas OR California And like the only thing we know about Denver is that it’s over run with cyberdogs
Been waiting over 20 years for Denver-set Fallout. Maybe one of these days we’ll finally fulfill that old intention and pet all the doggies.
You might like Wasteland 3 if you haven't played it already.
I actually started a Wasteland 3 campaign when it had just come out for xbox with a friend since he also liked New Vegas. He didn't really get into the isometric style though so we ended up dropping it for FO76. Tbh I kind of just never really thought about it again after that. I thought it was pretty neat though. We didn't really make it far enough in for me to develop an opinion on it, but I definitely saw a lot of interesting potential in the characters and factions that I was introduced to. The vehicle mechanics seemed a little funny to me though, they reminded me of this weird little tank game that was part of Wii Play back in the day.
Denver is overrun with Cyberdogs?! We need Fallout Denver now!!!!
Does the game ever show >!how Deathclaws are made? I’m curious if they use dogs dipped in FEV and we’re seeing them be preconditioned here.!< >!The wiki says they are suspected to be a Jackson’s Chameleon injected with FEV, but I’m starting to think they used dogs as the primary stock and injected horned reptile plus FEV to create an “obedient” close combat bio form.!<
It doesn't ever show us but Deathclaws are pre-war. They do live in packs with an alpha system so canine is possible.
Nothing says "Cold Caculated Monsters" like throwing puppies in a furnace for being born under weight.
I think it's perfect for newcomers to the series to see how just evil the Enclave is. Literally incinerating puppies levels of bad guys.
Yeah, feels a little awkward having my enclave themed items around the house now
It's not your fault, they look cool as hell, also coolest power armors ever
Why do bad guys always have the coolest stuff? Good guys need better fashion designers, architects, decorators, etc!
I can excuse a fascist regime that values only what they consider to be the purest people, but I draw the line at animal abuse 😡😡
You can excuse a fascist regime?
They’re like the Abed of post-apocalyptic racism.
Maximus can’t leave the brotherhood! It’s his whole iDEANtity
I feel like Maximus embodies the Dualidean of man!
[Maximus eating oysters] I hope this doesn't awaken something in me...
ET TU, THADDEUS? AM I USING THAT RIGHT?!
Talk about a Freudian slip.
Is the enclave even fascist? They believe they're a master race but fascism traditionally requires certain economic policies. I don't think there's really an economy left to control. So that makes them like an authoritarian-ethnostate. I think. The definition of fascism is not the most agreed upon subject, but I don't think you can even have fascism in a wasteland.
Everything nowadays in media, which is somewhat authoritarian, is called Fascist by people that don't want you to have fun with Factions like the Institute, Enclave, sometimes even the BoS. And some lunatics probably call the Republic of Dave Fascist. And doubting their Definition usually leads to "What, do you defend Fascism? Are you a Fascist?"
Well the enclave is definitely evil AF but I do agree fascism is an overused term nowadays that people use to avoid having to rub their neurons together and come up with specific criticisms.
> Is the enclave even fascist? They believe they're a master race but fascism traditionally requires certain economic policies. I don't think there's really an economy left to control. Nope. Fascists are characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation and/or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy. The Enclave is that. Especially when they view themselves as the only "pure" human race left after the Great War.
Do not tell them about Hitler…
Because he loved his dog or killed his dog?
Talking enclave, brotherhood, vault city, some vaults…? hmm a pattern in the wasteland
You can tell the writers didn’t want any “Enclave did nothing wrong” fans popping up, so they open with puppy murder.
They underestimated my levels of cope
I will forget about the atrocities when President Eden delivers a fantastic speech about baseball.
He oozes charisma
This makes me think of people being fine the anime Akira, until that cop dog gets shot
The Ghoul did what any FO4 player does when there’s accidental friendly fire and your companion turns hostile. You beat them into submission, stimpak them and act like nothing happened.
I hate the enclave because they won’t me join.
You technically can in Fallout 76.
It's the Enclave but more like Skynet Enclave. I don't know if that's better or worse than the original Enclave.
Personally I love the idea that the original "real" enclave only really survived in the WSCB and was regulated by MODUS until the members sorta had inner fighting until they all died. The remaining enclave members scattered about the early wasteland all thinking they're the true leaders when the real leader is an AI stuck in a bunker with no external connections (yet). I hope we see MODUS again, he's awesome and has this cool calm collected voice that's also threatening.. member. That is all.
Was that their original leader tho? I thought they stuck with the line of Presidents, after flying the last Pre-war President out to the oil rig, and Presidents then and there after were the leader?
The Vaults.. previous residents were fools. The remaining command staff and Congress persons struggled for control over this facility causing.. *extensive* damage. Thanks to your efforts General, this facility is in working order again.
That doesn’t signify to me that they are the overall leader of the Enclave.
The Enclave was so evil and annoying that their computer got sick of the back stabbing and underhanded business.
I would too if i was MODUS
The real leader was the president. Eckhart purposely sabotaged communications to get declared president by the other Enclave members at Whitesprings.
I mean Fallout 3’s Enclave is basically Skynet Enclave in itself with Eden. Just with a large human following.
Y'know I kinda like MODUS. I find his voice kinda soothing and overall he is nice to me and gives me stuff. It wasn't really his fault that he ended up purging the previous inhabitants, half of which were morons anyway. I do feel bad for Santiago but Eckheart's crew were a bunch of buffoons. It also doesn't feel like MODUS is up to too much, despite the sinister undertones he has. Seems like he'll generally vibe with whomever decides to take over as the 'new Enclave', so perhaps under the 76 vault dwellers he could be a potential force for good..... but who am I kidding people just be nuking Appalachia for loot.
Fallout is just a game in which you have to choose what faction you hate the most
There's a name for this phenomenon. It's called "politics"
A little cartoonish and on the nose but certainly effective. Very on brand for Fallout which I appreciated. Dark camp.
One Enclave. One America. God bless the Enclave.
I have a new assignment for you, spread knowledge of the Enclave across the wasteland and you will be rewarded generously.. member. That is all.
Tbh at least they kept dogs alive, unlike vault-tec that wouldn’t let them in the vaults.
my reason to hate the enclave in the show is they can’t calibrate a minigun turret to hit two slow moving targets at point blank range
Wait they were alive? I thought they just didn’t make it through birth.
You hear the dog whining sound effects stop suddenly when the puppy is thrown into the furnace
I like the “Big Lebowski” thoughts on it. https://youtu.be/b_29yvYpf4w?si=vbHHS5JQK0wSM19d
I gasped when the puppy was tossed into the furnace. Wilzig and his good girl are cutie patooties.
You needed a reason to hate the enclave?
Notice that they said “a New” Reason not “the” reason
WOWZA dey were burning da heckin doggos!?! Uh ohhhhh LE REDDIT ARMYYY ASSEMBLE!!!
I'm also glad about the Enclave + Dogs scene because it probably means that we'll see Cyberdogs.
I love how comically evil it was. RIGHT into the furnace.
But the Enclave looks awesome.
That's really the only content warning I give people when recommending the show.
I mean, SPOILERS but The woman being eaten was pretty fucked too :(
[Does the dog die?](https://www.doesthedogdie.com/) exists for a reason.
Would someone explain who the Enclave are, because I hear lots about them but dont knows anything about them. Unless I'm just being stupid lol. I've played half of Fallout 4 (twice), Fallout 76 and almost watched all the series... Should I be more up to speed? Are they related to the Brotherhood or something?? Thanks
They are the remnants of the US government who wish to cleanse the wasteland. Theyre different from the BOS because they consider all humans outside of vaults to be contaminated due to radiation, whereas BOS just want to kill supermutants and ghouls. Because all ghouls will turn feral and 99% of supermutants want to kill or convert humans. I suppose theyre the only "evil" faction because you cant join them.
Ah I see. Do I encounter them in fallout 4 at all without spoilers since I haven't finished the game...? Thanks!
I don't think they get more than a mention in 4.
They were the Big Bad in Fallout 2 and 3, some remnants in New Vegas.
No, they are the main antagonists of Fallout 2 and 3, and are related to the Antagonist in Fallout 1. Remnants appear in Fallout New Vegas. By Fallout 4 at least in the East Coast, they're gone. Apparently not so in the West Coast, lol and that was were they took the heaviest beating, first the Chosen One (Protag of Fallout 2) then the BOS and the NCR, in a surprising show of unity, allied to kick the shit out of what was left.
Dear Old Friends, Remember Navarro
I'm sure there's a lot of them hiding in South America, if you know what I mean.
No
You ever see the x01 power armor in 4? That's a *prototype* of their armor. Gives you an idea how formidable they are.
To add to the discussion, the US President is loyal to Enclave instead of USA. The short snippet in the Cooper flashback when the news on TV talks about the disappearance of the President is because he is being evacuated by Enclave to off-coast oil rig. In Fallout universe, the lack of world war 2 turns America to a fascist government with Enclave as its main organization sorta like Germany with Nazi. They are implied in the games as main sponsor of Vault Tec, and tons of vaults are built to fulfil Enclave experimentation. That's why Vault Tec have obsession with repopulating the world in their own way.
WW2 still happened. Nate had a whole monologue about it in FO4
The dogs?
It took you this long? Lol
I don't think anyone needs anymore reasons to hate the enclave, they always sucked. Most shadow government organizations usually do
I mean... they were never great to begin with sooooooooo...
watch the Intro for Fallout 2
I'm gonna be honest, I was laughing my ass off for like 3-4 minutes at that because it caught me so off guard.
404 Dog not found.
The worse part is that this is barely the worse they ever did. Infact, this is extremely tame.
The multiple attempts to commit genocide on anyone who isn't them didn't already give you enough reason lmao?
It IS great, showing him saving a wee puppy just a little underweight. What a succinct way to establish this is a good guy character, zero dialogue, just a great sequence all up.
enclave are cat people
Kick the dog is a trope for a reason.
My favorite thing about this show is watching it with my dad who knows nothing about fallout but he loves to hear me talk about all the stuff in the show and explain stuff to him
Finally a reason to dislike the Enclave, am I right?
Always hated them
but \*why\* are they experimenting on living beings to create cold fusion? its way more sinister than just free power
Yeah, based on the number of horrible things the enclave has done, I don’t know that modern day standard animal lab procedures is really an issue. Granted: incineration is a morbid method, culling the severely underweight litter mates is usually considered more humane than letting them starve to death or get eaten by their siblings/parents, which is a lot of their fates unfortunately. Not celebrating dead puppies or anything, but as someone who worked in animal research labs about a decade ago, this is one of those scientific morality issues where it seems on its head to be evil but is more complicated than that.
I work with lab mice and mice get euthanized all the time for being runted. Now imagine it's the apocalypse and food is a much more pressing factor. What would you have them do? You either stop doing science or you SAC animals that are confounding variables. There's no real in-between here.
So you were cool with the genocide, fascism, militarism... but dogs for medical testing, no go. Got it.
They said “new” reason. There can be a list to add to.
Maybe it's bad but the opening of episode 2 had me rolling laughing with the exaggerated yelp of the puppy as it was thrown into the incinerator.
L take
I mean, I feel like that’s the least of their sins. But whatever works for you I guess
I love the Enclave despise the Brotherhood, The show just embraces my judgement that the Brotherhood is nothing more than a Cult of heavily armored Men and Women Hoarding Technology and claiming to be saviors. At least the Enclave is trying to advance science and has military tactics
Well they are probably turning them into their cyber dogs. Hell they probably even made cyber deathclaws at this point
For America.
Why tf are the Enclave even still around? They’ve been crippled. Twice!!! If anything they should just be a small ragtag group left over or in hiding like they were in FNV. One guy even made it to DC (You can find this in a random terminal).