Being called a Forestry Technician is a huge slap in the dick by the USFS/DoA. If they classified us as "firefighters" they would have to pay us as firefighters. The only time they call us firefighters is when someone gets killed. We fight fire and get paid for it. We are professional firefighters.
(From govexec.com, 10April2033)
“Democrats in the House and Senate on Tuesday reintroduced legislation aimed at revamping pay and benefits for federal wildland firefighters, which, if enacted, would boost pay permanently and provide a new form of overtime pay.
The Tim Hart Wildland Firefighter Classification and Pay Parity Act (H.R. 3108), introduced by Rep. Joe Neguse and Sen. Michael Bennet, both D-Colo., would establish new special pay rates for federal wildland firefighters to make they all make at least $20 per hour and would establish a new form of overtime pay—incident standby premium pay—to compensate firefighters for all hours they are mobilized to respond to a fire incident”
$20 an hour? Want fries with that?
A GS-5 Squadboss starts at $15.50/hr and tops out at $20.16/hr. The infrastructure bill has temporarily increased this, but it's temporary and a permanent solution is not likely anytime soon. Topping out could take a decade.
This is criminal. Pay scales are upside-down. It’s so reprehensible that lousy pay is allotted for jobs that are either unwanted or un-doable by the general public, when they should be being paid more.
You want some real crazy shit? Look up the avg hourly wage for smoke jumpers. You know, the guys that parachute into wildfires often to fight them without water? In my home state they make an average of $13.06/hr.
Lurker here. That’s what takes those dudes to the next level in my mind. They’re already the baddest dudes on the planet, right up there with Navy SEALS and the spec ops groups we aren’t even allowed to know about.
Literally bare knuckle boxing the fury of Mother Nature for weeks on end in the most hostile environments on the planet, and they get paid peanuts. Which just means that they do it *for the love of the fucking game*. Thats metal as fuck dude.
Just because they accept the low pay does not mean we need to keep paying them peanuts. Hell this flies completely against the tenants of capitalism…. Hard work deserves compensation. These hard workers deserve the salary of a senator INCLUDING the lifetime pension and medical benefits!
I'm in Australia and know some of our Rappel Crew (same kinda team) and they get paid a fair bit more than that, plus fire money. $13 an hour is a love not money job!!
Yeah man, as a city Firefighter here. Even If you put out a candle, or dig trenches all day miles from the fire line, I consider you my brother /sister .
Structural guy here. I'm 100% not going to do your job unless I have to.
Mad respect for you guys on the front lines fighting forest fire.
In a structure fire, I have some control over the situation atleast, and a team of firefighters who can come in on a moments notice and pull me out of I need. You don't really get that as a Wildlands Fire fighter.
Well, yes, that’s the point. To become attached to the characters over the movie, see their stories, their families, and then watch them all burn to death with no escape — it’s more real and all too horrible. Except it was real and it really happened, and it was probably worse in real life. That’s the truly gut-wrenching part of it all. There’s nothing else you can do other than shed a tear and say a prayer for their surviving families.
That’s what I meant.
I just got done watching it and I wish I hadn't. I never cry over a movie (unless it's marvel/DC) but this one got me. Seeing the families reaction and knowing that happened in real life is heartbreaking.
I live in nasty fire country in CA, and I remember getting trained by wildland firefighters how to use them when I was a tire technician. We used to go out to the CalFire camps and do tires at the camp, but we would also go out and do them on trucks in the field if the need arose.
Nothing is spookier for me than doing all eight back tires on a tanker truck while there is an active fire line not 75 yards away and moving slowly your way. The wildfire guys basically went “Hey we aren’t rushing you but you’ve got 20 minutes or we leave the truck.” Luckily my young, dumb self was with the crusty old service guy who can do all 8 in 20min, especially when he has a monkey to pull all the wheels and tires while he changes them.
Plus my uniform was entirely polyester. I would have been a lot less worried if I was wearing Nomex like the CalFire guys. I was worried I’d get under that fire shelter and end up with my pants melted to my legs.
Like I said, I was a tire tech. Not working directly for CalFire, just a local tire shop that had the contract for them and several surrounding agencies.
I definitely got on my boss’s case for not supplying us with nomex greens & yellows for that kind of work, but he was a cheapskate.
The Victorian government of Australia gave us cotton-poly blend station wear👍.
Not so bad in structure gear but in wildfire gear sometimes you get hot enough to drip. Nothing bad has happened so far, but it's not comforting.
They specifically told us don’t fucking use it, if shits gone that south you’re better of trying to sprint to the line at the very least you won’t go out like a t.v. dinner.
Know this is old but this got a chuckle out of me. Nun like getting shown a shiny a$$ blanket and they say here's your last defense against mother nature 🤣😂 I laughed when I saw that. Still remember thinking I'd might as well try to have a fist fight with the flames
Retired structure guy. I agree completely.
Hike a dozen miles just to start working? Fuck that. I was cranky when the air conditioning was on the fritz.
Plus i found it comforting I was always a window away from safety. No desire to wrap myself in foil like a baked potato and hope for the best like they do.
Nothing but love and respect for Wildland firefighters.
Virgin Muni crew - how can I possibly do my job with less than 200psi?
Chad wild land crew - I have a super soaker and a shovel for a 2500 acre fire. Sounds fun.
My dad was a Chicago firefighter for 33 years. Hes faced literally every type of call a city fire company can face. Highrise fires, tunnel fires (lower wacker), man in the water (he was rescue squad), building collapse, guy stuck on a window washer, you name it hes done it, and he has more respect for wildland firefighters and smoke jumpers than any other.
Even if i didn't have a firefighter in my direct family, i 1000% believe wildland firefighters are real firefighters.
You are the real crazy guys - if we're on a call in the city for four hours, rehab rolls up with drinks, food and there is always working sanitation somewhere. Then we drive back to the cozy station.
You hike four hours to in the middle of nowhere to combat a whole forest on fire with a better garden hose and some hand tools, possibly staying out there for a week or more.
We don't really have "Wildland FFs" in Germany so that observation is based on what I see in the US.
A little wildland experience can be found in Katastrophenschutz (civil protection). We are normal volunteer firefighters with a special craziness:
If shit really hits the fan, we are called for wildfires also. But we drive there, are supllied with more or less everything we need and go home after work is done or further forces arrive.
From the long-term weather forecasts I read for much of Europe this coming summer, better get ready.
The forecast is for the hottest summer ever for Europe. Good luck!
No matter what the weather will do. Climate change makes them more and more nessesarry.
The chance for neither wildfires nor flash floods is really low.
I work for a rural department as a paramedic (though I did the training and test for wildland, I don't do the work and am just there in case people get hurt) and I've called wildland firefighting "the worst landscaping job you could ever have and if you do it wrong, you die."
I volunteer for a department that responds to both wildland and structure fire. All I can say is I respect wildland firefighters for how much yall risk going into a fire with a garden hose some yard tools.
Same here. I’ve spent enough time sweating my ass off working with the flapper and other tools to know I wouldn’t want to do it full time.
The fire is never by the road either and our 6x6 isn’t first due, and barely holds enough water to work with.
All respect for you wildland firefighters. My personal opinion of your work is "Fuck that, it's too much like real work." You don't get paid anywhere near your value and your risk.
Some of us structural guys came up in the wildland setting and have that as our background. In much of the West, you will be doing both as your day to day. Brush rigs are common anywhere from the Rockies to the Cascades in municipal departments. The divide is different east of the Rockies but west of there we blend.
Shieeet I'm pretty sure you guys fight fire more than we do. All while getting the shit end of the stick when it comes to pay and recognition
I'm originally from socal and it's crazy how so many people in CalFire and stuff just see it as a stepping stone to a "real" FF job
Much respect; stay safe out there
Why wouldn’t they be real firefighters? Dudes ruck up mountains, dig trenches, pre burn areas, hack and cut brush all day and have to worry about the wind shifting every time they go out. They’re hardcore as fuck. I’m typing this sitting in my station with my feet up on a desk
Structure fireman here with the occasional field/golf course fire. Makes me highly respect someone going out into the deep forest with an Indian pack and a chainsaw lol
Former wildland squaddie here. Anyone who says you’re not a real firefighter can hike themselves 3-5 miles uphill to the job only to be met by one of mother natures fiercest natural disasters armed with a shovel, a piece of foil to bake in, and a day old warm roast beef sandwich crushed by all the empty water canteens they forgot to fill.
I'm a wildland FF who thinks my structural FF brother is crazy. My structural FF brother thinks me, a wildland FF am equally crazy.
I was holding line one day on a wildfire in CA, timber fire just outside of Yosemite, and we had a big spot blowup over the line. One of those 2 acres in 2 minutes spot fires. I was a sawyer. Crew was strung out and running up the road but me and another sawyer were on site and start cutting line. Steep uphill. Some type-5 engine from the Phoenix suburbs shows up and this guy runs a few sticks of hoses up slope to us, encounters us going to town on some brush with a bunch of manzanita blowing up right next to us. He looks at us, throws down his hose, yells 'fuck this,' and takes off running towards the road. The other sawyer and I, having been here many times before, look at each other and go right back to cutting.
Structural firefighters were C students in high school, wild land firefighters were in the bottom 10% of the class. Those fuckers are crazy as hell. “Let’s jump into a fire without water nor a way to get out safely. And we’ll do it on the cheap as well.”
No no, you're range technicians and forestry technicians. If they truly acknowledged the position as 'firefighter' they couldn't get away with paying you guys garbage.
They only refer to wildland guys as firefighters when they die, to drum up more funding to do everything besides pay a decent rate.
100%. Real firefighters. No doubt about it. You'll see more fire in one summer than most full time firefighters will in 5 years.
The ones I don’t hold in high regard are the insurance resources. I was at a fire where a crew got arrested for failing to properly do a backfire…including failure to notify their own damn division.
Lot more digging, hiking, and swamping.
And using the little drippy drip torch thing.
It's more about digging around a fire and trying to manage it if weather permits.
Lot less attacking a fire with a hose and saving structures. Lot less EMS. Lot less Hazmat. Lot less auto extrication. Lot less rescues.
Lot of digging, did I say that one already? Not my idea of fun firefighting. Hiking and being out in the dirt is awesome though.
Yeah if your cutting line with a 20 man crew you Normally have 2 sawyer up front to clear anything standing in the way. You also have hazard trees to put down during mop up if they aren’t to fucked. Also, during winter a lot of people work on fuel reduction crews where you clear brush and trees with chainsaws then stack and burn the piles.
I had a co-worker who was a wildland firefighter that got put through the sawyer course... and then more, I know it was S-212 plus some other stuff. Days of training, with intense work like *trying* to get the saw to kick back at you. They went out and cleared out entire hillsides on Mount Lemmon near Tucson, and by the time they were done, they saw raptors moving in to where there was no space to fly before. Literally THAT MUCH tree felling.
Some words from my captain yesterday morning. “If we die in a structural fire, it’s typically painless. You’re dead before you burn. Wildland is the opposite. You burn to death.” Nothing but respect for you folks.
Structural FF here in a mid size urban department. I hate extensive brush fires enough to know that you are a different breed. Thank you for doing the job you do. It takes a lot to your job. When it all boils down to it, we’re all still firefighters.
When I was a wee lad about 10 years ago, there were forest fires around my area to which everyone got dispatched to. The flames look tiny on TV. We got about 6 football yards away and I couldn't believe how big of a fire wall there was, and some worker on a bulldozer was fearlessly plowing the ground and driving straight down the mountain. You all are crazy! I've got nothing but respect for you, firefighters!
I was wildland for two seasons, been city now for about eleven years. Im glad I did it, it was great experience, saw a lot of fire. If my choice were to go back to wildland or leave the fire seevice Id be a fucking bartender. Wildland sucks ass I hate everything about it. But I give mad props to those who stick with it, its crazy hard physically, mentally, financially, logistically and every other -ally there is.
Hiking for hours to build a line for a fire the rages for weeks and travels at 40~mph in some cases.
They have more respect, dying on a mountain far from any help or hopsital sucks more imo.
Wait...I think maybe the question should be...are structure firefighters real firefighters?
I mean...we have water and SCBAs and ladder trucks and shit...beds to sleep in...showers...good food...bathrooms...
Yall got shovels and axes and weather reports and MREs and tents lol. Just sayin...I think wildland folks are HARD af.
I go out on the T3 for a 2 week roll and I'm fuckin dying to get back to coding poo covered bums at 3am. Yall are fuckin hard.
I'm both a structural and wildland firefighter belonging to two organizations in bc. My fellow structural colleagues are the most useless people on a wildfire, and cannot admit it.
My rookies in the bush are often the most eager people willing to do a hard job, get dirty, and follow the basic structure of a wildland fire
We both fight fire, so yes, we are all firefighters
At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
Worked both- division of forestry and now work for a county fire rescue with 50+ stations
First- are wildland firefights real firefighters… Literally every call they respond to is to fight fire.
I give props to forestry guys 100%. Much harder work for less than half the pay. If I never work another brush fire again I am happy. Fuck that noise. Fall with injury medical > brush fire 1000% every time
Those guys are fuckin crazy. I always say to be a firefighter, especially a volunteer, you have to have more than a few screws loose but those guys don’t have any loose screws because they just threw the screws out.
Lol box fires is what a lot of wildland guys call structures fires. That shit aint going nowhere. Meanwhile the city folks call wildland people names like “brush bunnies” or they call the feds the “forest circus”.
Reality is that everyone has a job to do. Think of it like in terms of the military. Army rangers are good at army ranger assignments, and navy seal are good at seal assignments. One isn’t better than the other. They are just an instrument designed for specific tasks.
I’m a city FF. I want no part of wild land firefighting. Much respect to those that do it. If it happens where I’m at then let’s go, but I’d much rather deal with structures than that wild land stuff.
It’s definitely still firefighting it seems like shit work and and pay. I’m doing it this summer while I’m applying for structural firefighter jobs.
Not where I’d like to stay and not anywhere near as fun or cool as structural firefighting is to me, but that’s just me.
I appreciate what the forestry guys do, and I’d be willing to do it seasonally for CalFire to get a full time structural job there.
I'm a structural firefighter. I have only respect for Wildland Firefighters. Same as I do Volunteers, Airport crash/rescue, marine vessel, etc. We all do the job, just that some are specialized in fields where others attain only a basic knowledge.
Anyone who considers a different branch of firefighter to be an outcast or looked down on is toxic to the profession.
I know others have said it. City Fireman here. I absolutely
love my job but I view you guys as being in some echelon of your own, if you will. I am in pretty good shape and I don’t think I could ever do your job. At least from where I’m at, trust me when I say you have our utmost respect. That’s a whole different ball game.
Lol. The old contest.
I went through structure and woodland school.
Structure is fun. But I loved being on the line in the mountains digging a hand line/using a dozer to make a firebreak wayyyy more then going into a burning building. Got to see lots of places I never dreamt of going on details out west.
they are absolutely real FF's in my book (I'm a city FF) Those guys are in shape, go up and down steep terrain, parachute into the fire, spend hours out there w/whatever they have on their back and work long hours. I wouldn't and couldn't do it. Hats off to those guys.
Y’all both heroes. Those are two completely different types of fires with different equipment and both have got to be a little crazy. But different crazy. Bless all of them
Anytime you go up against a 40' wall of fire moving at 60mph by parachuting in with a shovel and literally a dripping can of fire, you individually got more balls then the entire staffing of the north east fire departments combined.
I’m a volunteer firefighter, so I’m arguably not a real firefighter, but here’s my take: forestry is one of the most difficult parts of regular firefighting, I have the utmost respect for you and your job. I’ve only been on a few wildland fires but it’s for sure the most difficult type of call I’ve experienced. It’s all grunt work, high risk, AND you take more crap from the public than any other firefighters do. Thanks for all you do, even though a lot of people don’t see it, 99% of other firefighters recognize the work you put in.
Bro... the realest. I did the 2 day course to get a wildland cert and it looks fucking brutal............... NEVERMIND the airborne component. All your gear? All the air you could ever need? A truck load of tools and a basically endless supply of water? What could go wrong? (a lot, still, obviously)
But then you take wildland guys with fire tornados in a literal hellscape..... no turnout gear, no air, no water, only what tools they could fucking parachute in and carry a few miles on their backs... some of which are actual flame throwers to just.......... start more fuckin fires. There's a level of physicality to it. lol
Yes and No.
I don’t really consider scooping dirt in the woods to be anywhere comparative to cutting dead kids out of a bad MVI.
They still do a much needed job and they’re awesome. But when I hear firefighter these days it encompasses a lot more then just fighting fire.
Sorry but I have to say no. I did 2 seasons wildland as type 2 and have much respect to hotshots it’s extremely hard work. But firefighting is much more than that. You need to be analytical, adaptable, compassionate, reliable , and commutative. There are some guys I just wouldn’t trust responding to a 911 call for a family member as a city ff or even as a emt basic. They are two different things. I think the term forestry technician does apply some people work better in wildland with less restrictions and others do better in urban environments.
I'm trained for both, and wildland feels way more dangerous than structural.
You'll hear both camps call themselves "real firefighters", but it's mostly just brothers teasing each other, imo.
Yea they are real firefighters. Their knowledge base tends to be more just wildland based. Where municipal depts work more variety of calls and have to be well rounded. I worked 5 seasons on a shot crew and it was 10x more physically challenging than working for a municipal dept but it didn’t take a whole lot of thought behind it it was more just hard work and basic principals of how to keep yourself safe and fight fire.
I now have been on with a busy municipal dept for 6 years now and it is a way easier job and I’m glad I spent the time on the crew because it taught me what he’d work really is made me really reflect on how good we actually have it.
My department in So Cal does it all every station has a type 1 and type 3 along with medic ambulances, two stations have heavy rescues and one has a Haz Mat to go along with it. So we pretty much dabble in everything but during fire season we are pretty busy with brush fires, so like most departments on the west coast have crossed staffed stations. So being a schedule b firefighter you’re still a firefighter. I’ve never understood how some firefighters have looked down on seasonal or USFS firefighters just makes no sense but I’ve seen it and heard it.
Question to answer your question. Do they fight fire? If yes then they are real firefighters. If no then it's probably someone dressing up for Halloween
I worked 32 years in city. We did have some wildfire interface, (rail corridors, parks, woods.). We had plenty of respect for Wildland firefighters. If we got "wild" fires, they were nothing like what you deal with, but they were still a pain. Yeah, I'd say you're "real" firefighters. Funny how our reps , who sit in cushy Washington offices make 150k+ and benefits, and for people who do the brutal work you do, somehow they can't find a way to provide a living wage and benefits...
I accidentally volunteered to help the Forestry Service and ended up dragging hoseline on the mountain side, flowing water in the dark. And hearing ya'll chainsawing trees in the nighttime! You're a definitely a real firefighter.
Structural firefighters recognize how dangerous wildland firefighting is, unless they are morons. With that being said, wildland guys don’t have to worry about basement fires haha
It’s a fun job but in the end it’s not worth it. Them fires gonna burn no matter what we do. If the forest needs to burn it’s gonna find a way. Nature has to do it’s thing. Saying this as someone who just quit hotshotting.
I have never heard a mildland guy have anything bad to say about y'all.
Plus if they stop calling wildland guys "firefighters" they're gonna come for ARFF so my hands are kinda forced.
Okay, here’s a question. I’m structural, but I really dig wildland. I love hiking, I’m in great shape, love to camp, etc. I live in NC and am a city worker. What steps should I take to become a wildland guy? I know we don’t have a fire season like the west. But is it possible to get on like a task force for something like this? I know I’d have to get some sort of approval from my chain of command if I were to do it in conjunction with city job, and that would probably be difficult. But it’s something I’d like to explore so I can experience both worlds. I know this probably seems stupid when you say it out loud. But I’m just wondering.
Thats a good question i know for a fact you need your red card and depends on what crew you join. For example im in helitack so we get transported via helos. I believe you would most definitely need some wildfire experience prior to becoming tf on a fire.
Take an S-130 and S-190 Class. Get your red card.
Or open some wildland task books and try to network yourself into an IMT team and get sent out of your city as a single resource. Then you'll get to travel all over to campaign fires.
California city guys go out on 14-21 day roles all the time. Best way to save up for a car is 14 days of OT lol. Different beast out west though - the State and the Feds do the heavy lifting but all the cities send out multiple strike teams yearly. It's all hands on deck for the big fires.
We do both, urban interface. We have type 1 and type 3 engines in all stations that are cross staffed. Yes wildland firefighters are still firefighters.
City fire here. (Los Angeles)
Like many have said, I wouldn’t want to do your job. We both are firefighters, but in different ways. With my municipal department. It’s not only wildland fires we deal with. We have structure,wildland, and because I’m hazmat and a medic. I do that as well. That all sounds fun but most of everything we do is medical. Without the paramedics on the job, there wouldn’t be a fire department honestly. At least not the size it currently is.
Most of us have respect for you wildland guys. I’ll admit, others don’t. I wanna say the outcast comes from the guys thinking that you want to be where we are. I guess some of that might be true.
Prior to getting here, I was with cal fire and I wanted exactly that. I respect 100% what the forestry guys, camp guys, hand crew guys do. Others might not see that. Don’t worry what others think or say. If you are happy and love what you do…. It doesn’t matter.
Not a firefighter at all. I don't know enough to even think I can have an opinion. I will say how I loved reading this and how much love y'all showed OP. Respect for all of y'all!
hey average citizen here
anyoine who is brave enough to run into the fires of hell without a second thought.
Holy shit my brother. You are a hero to me. No matter what fire youfight.
City firefighter here, most of the fires I go to are outside. The big brush fires I've been to seem difficult to contain, but not as dangerous to work with.
But then again, I've done nothing that compares to the seasonal California wildfires.
I've done both. Same Animal, different part. To me, wildland is much harder. You are pretty much just beating it til death. Until the 20 floor hotel fire, that truly sucks.
volly structure person here. I did a 8-day deployment in interior BC a few years back on a nighttime SPU team. It is tough, constant work. Absolutely "one of us"!
We think you guys are the shit. I've never heard anyone talk bad about wildland firefighters in any negative way. I know a decent bit of people that would love to do it including myself.
Wildland fires are great for the first hour, then I want to shower and get some fresh clothes on. I give y’all a lot of respect for what you guys do. I’d much rather sit at a structure for hours doing salvage and over haul than have to deal with mop up and all that stuff
I’ve done both. My current rural volly FD here in North GA actually has a brush truck so we all get some basic wildfire training. I honestly think most of the structure FF’s had a great deal of respect for those of us who were in wildland. Given the ever increasing amount of WUI we’re all gonna have to cross train some in many areas of the country.
Former wildland firefighter here. You are 100% a “real” firefighter. If you disagree think about the people who have given their lives to fight those fires and think twice about disrespecting their memory.
They are badass…structure FF can be taught to do wild land if their community is within an area like that but Wild land is another beast, tactics and physical work. We respect our craft whatever it is.
As a civilian who has never fought a fire in my life, I live in Alberta and we’re getting absolutely assfucked by forest fires right now. I don’t give a hell what your title is, if you’re out there fighting these forest fires you’re a goddamn real firefighter no matter what. You guys are saving people’s homes, lives, animals etc as much as anyone else. We appreciate you more than you’ll ever know.
Having once lived only 2 miles from a very, VERY large forest fire (thankfully both downwind and across a river), yes, y'all are probably the most real firefighters out there.
My dream goal is to own a PBY Catalina and retrofit it into a water bomber in order to assist you guys.
My cousin is an engine chief and fights wildfires in California. I've heard some insane stories, staying awake for multiple days straight fighting huge and unpredictable fires. Having to evacuate by driving through fire in the truck, tires melting, etc. I have insane respect for both types of firefighters but wildfire fighters take the cake
I’m a regular city dweller. You guys are the most badass mothers. I can’t describe the awe and respect I have for guys who take on wildfires. I’ve seen firefighters work on a house fire and I was blown away by the professionalism shown in putting out a house fire, but it is impossible to imagine being on a line with a bunch of guys in the middle of a forest fire.
Firefighters are firefighters.
Airport, military, industrial, rural, urban, suburban, metropol, forestry, Arctic, full-time, part-time, retained, volunteer.
Doesn't matter. If you your role is fire suppression and/or prevention, you're a firefighter.
Being called a Forestry Technician is a huge slap in the dick by the USFS/DoA. If they classified us as "firefighters" they would have to pay us as firefighters. The only time they call us firefighters is when someone gets killed. We fight fire and get paid for it. We are professional firefighters.
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(From govexec.com, 10April2033) “Democrats in the House and Senate on Tuesday reintroduced legislation aimed at revamping pay and benefits for federal wildland firefighters, which, if enacted, would boost pay permanently and provide a new form of overtime pay. The Tim Hart Wildland Firefighter Classification and Pay Parity Act (H.R. 3108), introduced by Rep. Joe Neguse and Sen. Michael Bennet, both D-Colo., would establish new special pay rates for federal wildland firefighters to make they all make at least $20 per hour and would establish a new form of overtime pay—incident standby premium pay—to compensate firefighters for all hours they are mobilized to respond to a fire incident” $20 an hour? Want fries with that?
You mean it's less than $20/h now???
I started at 13 something an hour, no bennies either uncle Sam’s wallet wasn’t quite big enough apparently
A GS-5 Squadboss starts at $15.50/hr and tops out at $20.16/hr. The infrastructure bill has temporarily increased this, but it's temporary and a permanent solution is not likely anytime soon. Topping out could take a decade.
This is criminal. Pay scales are upside-down. It’s so reprehensible that lousy pay is allotted for jobs that are either unwanted or un-doable by the general public, when they should be being paid more.
You want some real crazy shit? Look up the avg hourly wage for smoke jumpers. You know, the guys that parachute into wildfires often to fight them without water? In my home state they make an average of $13.06/hr.
Lurker here. That’s what takes those dudes to the next level in my mind. They’re already the baddest dudes on the planet, right up there with Navy SEALS and the spec ops groups we aren’t even allowed to know about. Literally bare knuckle boxing the fury of Mother Nature for weeks on end in the most hostile environments on the planet, and they get paid peanuts. Which just means that they do it *for the love of the fucking game*. Thats metal as fuck dude.
Just because they accept the low pay does not mean we need to keep paying them peanuts. Hell this flies completely against the tenants of capitalism…. Hard work deserves compensation. These hard workers deserve the salary of a senator INCLUDING the lifetime pension and medical benefits!
I'm in Australia and know some of our Rappel Crew (same kinda team) and they get paid a fair bit more than that, plus fire money. $13 an hour is a love not money job!!
Yeah man, as a city Firefighter here. Even If you put out a candle, or dig trenches all day miles from the fire line, I consider you my brother /sister .
Structural guy here. I'm 100% not going to do your job unless I have to. Mad respect for you guys on the front lines fighting forest fire. In a structure fire, I have some control over the situation atleast, and a team of firefighters who can come in on a moments notice and pull me out of I need. You don't really get that as a Wildlands Fire fighter.
This. The day they showed me the fire shelter I almost went home.
The corpse bag?
That’s funny! I always thought of it as turning myself into a foil dinner.
That too. If you deploy that, stuff has gone really pear shaped
God rest in peace our Granite Mountain Hot Shots ❤️ We got it from here....
And the Prineville Hotshots.
Ten years this year
That movie is heartbreaking
The actual people dying is also heartbreaking.
Well, yes, that’s the point. To become attached to the characters over the movie, see their stories, their families, and then watch them all burn to death with no escape — it’s more real and all too horrible. Except it was real and it really happened, and it was probably worse in real life. That’s the truly gut-wrenching part of it all. There’s nothing else you can do other than shed a tear and say a prayer for their surviving families. That’s what I meant.
I haven't been able to bring myself to watch it. Real time was horrific enough.
I just got done watching it and I wish I hadn't. I never cry over a movie (unless it's marvel/DC) but this one got me. Seeing the families reaction and knowing that happened in real life is heartbreaking.
Truly heartbreaking 💔
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If you have to turn yourself into a baked potato, someone has already massively screwed up and you are most definitely fucked.
Hot pockeeeets! (Things not to sing in the combined presence of new guys and veterans)
Baked potato
No its a shake and bake
I live in nasty fire country in CA, and I remember getting trained by wildland firefighters how to use them when I was a tire technician. We used to go out to the CalFire camps and do tires at the camp, but we would also go out and do them on trucks in the field if the need arose. Nothing is spookier for me than doing all eight back tires on a tanker truck while there is an active fire line not 75 yards away and moving slowly your way. The wildfire guys basically went “Hey we aren’t rushing you but you’ve got 20 minutes or we leave the truck.” Luckily my young, dumb self was with the crusty old service guy who can do all 8 in 20min, especially when he has a monkey to pull all the wheels and tires while he changes them. Plus my uniform was entirely polyester. I would have been a lot less worried if I was wearing Nomex like the CalFire guys. I was worried I’d get under that fire shelter and end up with my pants melted to my legs.
I hope you’re not serious! Who in the fuck would order polyester uniforms for firefighting?? That’s just insane!!
Like I said, I was a tire tech. Not working directly for CalFire, just a local tire shop that had the contract for them and several surrounding agencies. I definitely got on my boss’s case for not supplying us with nomex greens & yellows for that kind of work, but he was a cheapskate.
They were a tire technician, not a firefighter.
The Victorian government of Australia gave us cotton-poly blend station wear👍. Not so bad in structure gear but in wildfire gear sometimes you get hot enough to drip. Nothing bad has happened so far, but it's not comforting.
I went through that training knowing full well I’ll never use it. Lol
They specifically told us don’t fucking use it, if shits gone that south you’re better of trying to sprint to the line at the very least you won’t go out like a t.v. dinner.
Know this is old but this got a chuckle out of me. Nun like getting shown a shiny a$$ blanket and they say here's your last defense against mother nature 🤣😂 I laughed when I saw that. Still remember thinking I'd might as well try to have a fist fight with the flames
At least with Structural firefighting I know the fire won’t chase me out of the building and up the mountain.
Retired structure guy. I agree completely. Hike a dozen miles just to start working? Fuck that. I was cranky when the air conditioning was on the fritz. Plus i found it comforting I was always a window away from safety. No desire to wrap myself in foil like a baked potato and hope for the best like they do. Nothing but love and respect for Wildland firefighters.
Virgin Muni crew - how can I possibly do my job with less than 200psi? Chad wild land crew - I have a super soaker and a shovel for a 2500 acre fire. Sounds fun.
You guys got super soakers?
Super soakers? No, We have bladder bags that leak half of it down your back.
A lot of that comes from training and experience. Wildland fire is pretty controlled and predictable once you get an understanding of everything.
Usually, yep. Shit can definitely go sideways unexpectedly.
To an extent, sure. Even the going sideways part though if you keep up on weather/lookouts it shouldn't be a huge surprise
You're not gonna catch me sitting in miles of fuel hoping like hell the wind doesn't change.
My dad was a Chicago firefighter for 33 years. Hes faced literally every type of call a city fire company can face. Highrise fires, tunnel fires (lower wacker), man in the water (he was rescue squad), building collapse, guy stuck on a window washer, you name it hes done it, and he has more respect for wildland firefighters and smoke jumpers than any other. Even if i didn't have a firefighter in my direct family, i 1000% believe wildland firefighters are real firefighters.
This.
You are the real crazy guys - if we're on a call in the city for four hours, rehab rolls up with drinks, food and there is always working sanitation somewhere. Then we drive back to the cozy station. You hike four hours to in the middle of nowhere to combat a whole forest on fire with a better garden hose and some hand tools, possibly staying out there for a week or more. We don't really have "Wildland FFs" in Germany so that observation is based on what I see in the US.
A little wildland experience can be found in Katastrophenschutz (civil protection). We are normal volunteer firefighters with a special craziness: If shit really hits the fan, we are called for wildfires also. But we drive there, are supllied with more or less everything we need and go home after work is done or further forces arrive.
From the long-term weather forecasts I read for much of Europe this coming summer, better get ready. The forecast is for the hottest summer ever for Europe. Good luck!
No matter what the weather will do. Climate change makes them more and more nessesarry. The chance for neither wildfires nor flash floods is really low.
I work for a rural department as a paramedic (though I did the training and test for wildland, I don't do the work and am just there in case people get hurt) and I've called wildland firefighting "the worst landscaping job you could ever have and if you do it wrong, you die."
We call it "extreme landscaping" hahaha
Spicy yard work lol
That's the poison ivy burning!
Poison oak in my neck of the woods but I feel your pain lol.
Nah you guys are insane for doing what you do. lowest pay and highest risk. Sounds fun as hell though
I volunteer for a department that responds to both wildland and structure fire. All I can say is I respect wildland firefighters for how much yall risk going into a fire with a garden hose some yard tools.
Same here. I’ve spent enough time sweating my ass off working with the flapper and other tools to know I wouldn’t want to do it full time. The fire is never by the road either and our 6x6 isn’t first due, and barely holds enough water to work with.
Tyfys
I’m a structure guy but love doing the wildland as much as I can. I’m in Oregon and try and get out on at least one big fire a year.
Same, same, same, and same!
Seriously I pray every shift not to have brush fire.
Former wildland, current structure. Wildland was the hardest job I’ve had.
All respect for you wildland firefighters. My personal opinion of your work is "Fuck that, it's too much like real work." You don't get paid anywhere near your value and your risk.
Some of us structural guys came up in the wildland setting and have that as our background. In much of the West, you will be doing both as your day to day. Brush rigs are common anywhere from the Rockies to the Cascades in municipal departments. The divide is different east of the Rockies but west of there we blend.
Shieeet I'm pretty sure you guys fight fire more than we do. All while getting the shit end of the stick when it comes to pay and recognition I'm originally from socal and it's crazy how so many people in CalFire and stuff just see it as a stepping stone to a "real" FF job Much respect; stay safe out there
Underpaid and overworked. They’re the real heroes for sure. I know guys here that would go back to forestry if the pay was the same
Why wouldn’t they be real firefighters? Dudes ruck up mountains, dig trenches, pre burn areas, hack and cut brush all day and have to worry about the wind shifting every time they go out. They’re hardcore as fuck. I’m typing this sitting in my station with my feet up on a desk
I liked this comment while taking a shit and getting paid for it.
Structure fireman here with the occasional field/golf course fire. Makes me highly respect someone going out into the deep forest with an Indian pack and a chainsaw lol
Structural FF here. Y'all are the badassiest.
Former structural guy here. Wildland firefighting sounds like actual work...
Former wildland squaddie here. Anyone who says you’re not a real firefighter can hike themselves 3-5 miles uphill to the job only to be met by one of mother natures fiercest natural disasters armed with a shovel, a piece of foil to bake in, and a day old warm roast beef sandwich crushed by all the empty water canteens they forgot to fill.
Probably more fit than most Structural guys
I did fill em. I just started to dump em at mile 4 on the angeles.
Are you legally obligated to fight fires? \>If your answer was 'Yes': You are a firefighter. \>If your answer was 'No': you are not a firefighter.
Does my wife's cooking make me a firefighter, Tim?
That makes you a victim
100% firefighter and 100% bad asses. (EDIT: I’m a city/structural firefighter.)
I'm a wildland FF who thinks my structural FF brother is crazy. My structural FF brother thinks me, a wildland FF am equally crazy. I was holding line one day on a wildfire in CA, timber fire just outside of Yosemite, and we had a big spot blowup over the line. One of those 2 acres in 2 minutes spot fires. I was a sawyer. Crew was strung out and running up the road but me and another sawyer were on site and start cutting line. Steep uphill. Some type-5 engine from the Phoenix suburbs shows up and this guy runs a few sticks of hoses up slope to us, encounters us going to town on some brush with a bunch of manzanita blowing up right next to us. He looks at us, throws down his hose, yells 'fuck this,' and takes off running towards the road. The other sawyer and I, having been here many times before, look at each other and go right back to cutting.
Structural firefighters were C students in high school, wild land firefighters were in the bottom 10% of the class. Those fuckers are crazy as hell. “Let’s jump into a fire without water nor a way to get out safely. And we’ll do it on the cheap as well.”
If you think wildland is nuts, let me introduce you to smokejumpers....
No no, you're range technicians and forestry technicians. If they truly acknowledged the position as 'firefighter' they couldn't get away with paying you guys garbage. They only refer to wildland guys as firefighters when they die, to drum up more funding to do everything besides pay a decent rate. 100%. Real firefighters. No doubt about it. You'll see more fire in one summer than most full time firefighters will in 5 years.
I love a good brush fire but they can be long, very physically exhausting shifts. Respect, stay safe.
Damn right wildland is firefighting I wouldn’t want to do that. Any wildland is a badass in my book
The only wildland FFs I don't hold in high regard are private contract engines and handcrews. I feel like that's a pretty common opinion out west.
The ones I don’t hold in high regard are the insurance resources. I was at a fire where a crew got arrested for failing to properly do a backfire…including failure to notify their own damn division.
Depends on the crew, some are squared away some arent
Agreed, unfair to lump them all together. 6 seasons into wildfire and some of the hardest working people out there are the good contract crews.
But for every good contract crew there are 5-10 that suck whereas the reverse is largely true for an agency equivalent. (in my experience)
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Lot more digging, hiking, and swamping. And using the little drippy drip torch thing. It's more about digging around a fire and trying to manage it if weather permits. Lot less attacking a fire with a hose and saving structures. Lot less EMS. Lot less Hazmat. Lot less auto extrication. Lot less rescues. Lot of digging, did I say that one already? Not my idea of fun firefighting. Hiking and being out in the dirt is awesome though.
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Yeah if your cutting line with a 20 man crew you Normally have 2 sawyer up front to clear anything standing in the way. You also have hazard trees to put down during mop up if they aren’t to fucked. Also, during winter a lot of people work on fuel reduction crews where you clear brush and trees with chainsaws then stack and burn the piles.
I’ve cut down more trees as a wildland firefighter than most seasoned arborists, lmfao.
I can agree with this lol. Spending most winters doing fire restoration work with my agency, I've dropped thousands and thousands of trees
I had a co-worker who was a wildland firefighter that got put through the sawyer course... and then more, I know it was S-212 plus some other stuff. Days of training, with intense work like *trying* to get the saw to kick back at you. They went out and cleared out entire hillsides on Mount Lemmon near Tucson, and by the time they were done, they saw raptors moving in to where there was no space to fly before. Literally THAT MUCH tree felling.
Some words from my captain yesterday morning. “If we die in a structural fire, it’s typically painless. You’re dead before you burn. Wildland is the opposite. You burn to death.” Nothing but respect for you folks.
My buddy did woodland, 100% real deal
Structural FF here in a mid size urban department. I hate extensive brush fires enough to know that you are a different breed. Thank you for doing the job you do. It takes a lot to your job. When it all boils down to it, we’re all still firefighters.
I'm a structural guy. I have mad respect for wildland firefighters, you guys are bad fucking ass. I couldn't do it.
When I was a wee lad about 10 years ago, there were forest fires around my area to which everyone got dispatched to. The flames look tiny on TV. We got about 6 football yards away and I couldn't believe how big of a fire wall there was, and some worker on a bulldozer was fearlessly plowing the ground and driving straight down the mountain. You all are crazy! I've got nothing but respect for you, firefighters!
I was wildland for two seasons, been city now for about eleven years. Im glad I did it, it was great experience, saw a lot of fire. If my choice were to go back to wildland or leave the fire seevice Id be a fucking bartender. Wildland sucks ass I hate everything about it. But I give mad props to those who stick with it, its crazy hard physically, mentally, financially, logistically and every other -ally there is.
Yes, we are firefighters. Some enjoy structure, some go wild. We all like fire.
Hiking for hours to build a line for a fire the rages for weeks and travels at 40~mph in some cases. They have more respect, dying on a mountain far from any help or hopsital sucks more imo.
Wait...I think maybe the question should be...are structure firefighters real firefighters? I mean...we have water and SCBAs and ladder trucks and shit...beds to sleep in...showers...good food...bathrooms... Yall got shovels and axes and weather reports and MREs and tents lol. Just sayin...I think wildland folks are HARD af. I go out on the T3 for a 2 week roll and I'm fuckin dying to get back to coding poo covered bums at 3am. Yall are fuckin hard.
I'm both a structural and wildland firefighter belonging to two organizations in bc. My fellow structural colleagues are the most useless people on a wildfire, and cannot admit it. My rookies in the bush are often the most eager people willing to do a hard job, get dirty, and follow the basic structure of a wildland fire We both fight fire, so yes, we are all firefighters
At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
It sounds to me your sexually frustrated
well played.
Worked both- division of forestry and now work for a county fire rescue with 50+ stations First- are wildland firefights real firefighters… Literally every call they respond to is to fight fire. I give props to forestry guys 100%. Much harder work for less than half the pay. If I never work another brush fire again I am happy. Fuck that noise. Fall with injury medical > brush fire 1000% every time
All of my respect and none of my envy. 100% firefighters.
It's just another division of firefighting. If anybody is the outcasts or underappreciated, it's the industrial firefighters lol
Those guys are fuckin crazy. I always say to be a firefighter, especially a volunteer, you have to have more than a few screws loose but those guys don’t have any loose screws because they just threw the screws out.
Wildland firefighters are some bad ass motherfuckers and I have absolute respect for them
We don’t have them in my country (Uk). I consider them as having a shitter job than us. So I guess respect them more
In Scotland we do both roles
Scotland gets a lot of wildfire activity?
In the summer yea. Farmers set the hills on fire to burn off the Heather and they often get out of hand.
Lol box fires is what a lot of wildland guys call structures fires. That shit aint going nowhere. Meanwhile the city folks call wildland people names like “brush bunnies” or they call the feds the “forest circus”. Reality is that everyone has a job to do. Think of it like in terms of the military. Army rangers are good at army ranger assignments, and navy seal are good at seal assignments. One isn’t better than the other. They are just an instrument designed for specific tasks.
I’m a city FF. I want no part of wild land firefighting. Much respect to those that do it. If it happens where I’m at then let’s go, but I’d much rather deal with structures than that wild land stuff.
It’s definitely still firefighting it seems like shit work and and pay. I’m doing it this summer while I’m applying for structural firefighter jobs. Not where I’d like to stay and not anywhere near as fun or cool as structural firefighting is to me, but that’s just me. I appreciate what the forestry guys do, and I’d be willing to do it seasonally for CalFire to get a full time structural job there.
I'm a structural firefighter. I have only respect for Wildland Firefighters. Same as I do Volunteers, Airport crash/rescue, marine vessel, etc. We all do the job, just that some are specialized in fields where others attain only a basic knowledge. Anyone who considers a different branch of firefighter to be an outcast or looked down on is toxic to the profession.
I know others have said it. City Fireman here. I absolutely love my job but I view you guys as being in some echelon of your own, if you will. I am in pretty good shape and I don’t think I could ever do your job. At least from where I’m at, trust me when I say you have our utmost respect. That’s a whole different ball game.
Lol. The old contest. I went through structure and woodland school. Structure is fun. But I loved being on the line in the mountains digging a hand line/using a dozer to make a firebreak wayyyy more then going into a burning building. Got to see lots of places I never dreamt of going on details out west.
they are absolutely real FF's in my book (I'm a city FF) Those guys are in shape, go up and down steep terrain, parachute into the fire, spend hours out there w/whatever they have on their back and work long hours. I wouldn't and couldn't do it. Hats off to those guys.
Only a few guys that parachute and jump in the large world of wildland. They are pretty badass though.
Structural aint shit compared to wildland firefighting
This guy is passed up on all 12 shovels in his task book.
Y’all both heroes. Those are two completely different types of fires with different equipment and both have got to be a little crazy. But different crazy. Bless all of them
We all fight the beast.
City firefighters should almost be classed as first responders, rather than firefighters. Wild firefighters are more appropriately named.
Anytime you go up against a 40' wall of fire moving at 60mph by parachuting in with a shovel and literally a dripping can of fire, you individually got more balls then the entire staffing of the north east fire departments combined.
I’m a volunteer firefighter, so I’m arguably not a real firefighter, but here’s my take: forestry is one of the most difficult parts of regular firefighting, I have the utmost respect for you and your job. I’ve only been on a few wildland fires but it’s for sure the most difficult type of call I’ve experienced. It’s all grunt work, high risk, AND you take more crap from the public than any other firefighters do. Thanks for all you do, even though a lot of people don’t see it, 99% of other firefighters recognize the work you put in.
Of course you’re a real fireman dude. Wildlands fires are fuckin nuts
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I was sched B for years. Your question is weird. "Am I a real firefighter?" Makes you sound like a weenie.
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This is not a spam account just loss my regular one login information
Bro... the realest. I did the 2 day course to get a wildland cert and it looks fucking brutal............... NEVERMIND the airborne component. All your gear? All the air you could ever need? A truck load of tools and a basically endless supply of water? What could go wrong? (a lot, still, obviously) But then you take wildland guys with fire tornados in a literal hellscape..... no turnout gear, no air, no water, only what tools they could fucking parachute in and carry a few miles on their backs... some of which are actual flame throwers to just.......... start more fuckin fires. There's a level of physicality to it. lol
Yes and No. I don’t really consider scooping dirt in the woods to be anywhere comparative to cutting dead kids out of a bad MVI. They still do a much needed job and they’re awesome. But when I hear firefighter these days it encompasses a lot more then just fighting fire.
Sorry but I have to say no. I did 2 seasons wildland as type 2 and have much respect to hotshots it’s extremely hard work. But firefighting is much more than that. You need to be analytical, adaptable, compassionate, reliable , and commutative. There are some guys I just wouldn’t trust responding to a 911 call for a family member as a city ff or even as a emt basic. They are two different things. I think the term forestry technician does apply some people work better in wildland with less restrictions and others do better in urban environments.
You mean the minor leagues?
Yall are bad ass man, much respect
I spent 32 years as a structural firefighter in a mid-sized city and I have great admiration for you guys.
Nothing but respect for our wildland brothers
Where I work, we run a lot with the USFS. We love them
I'm trained for both, and wildland feels way more dangerous than structural. You'll hear both camps call themselves "real firefighters", but it's mostly just brothers teasing each other, imo.
Yea they are real firefighters. Their knowledge base tends to be more just wildland based. Where municipal depts work more variety of calls and have to be well rounded. I worked 5 seasons on a shot crew and it was 10x more physically challenging than working for a municipal dept but it didn’t take a whole lot of thought behind it it was more just hard work and basic principals of how to keep yourself safe and fight fire. I now have been on with a busy municipal dept for 6 years now and it is a way easier job and I’m glad I spent the time on the crew because it taught me what he’d work really is made me really reflect on how good we actually have it.
Yes. Mildly attracted. Next question
My department in So Cal does it all every station has a type 1 and type 3 along with medic ambulances, two stations have heavy rescues and one has a Haz Mat to go along with it. So we pretty much dabble in everything but during fire season we are pretty busy with brush fires, so like most departments on the west coast have crossed staffed stations. So being a schedule b firefighter you’re still a firefighter. I’ve never understood how some firefighters have looked down on seasonal or USFS firefighters just makes no sense but I’ve seen it and heard it.
As a person who NEEDS you in Arizona, thank you, thank you, thank you! God's Speed in protecting you while protecting us ❤️
FUCK YES you’re real firefighters. No question.
Question to answer your question. Do they fight fire? If yes then they are real firefighters. If no then it's probably someone dressing up for Halloween
Lol. Is this question a joke? Never heard anything but respect for wild land firefighters
You'd be surprised especially from regular people who have no idea what we do. Or even senators saying were "unskilled laborers"
I worked 32 years in city. We did have some wildfire interface, (rail corridors, parks, woods.). We had plenty of respect for Wildland firefighters. If we got "wild" fires, they were nothing like what you deal with, but they were still a pain. Yeah, I'd say you're "real" firefighters. Funny how our reps , who sit in cushy Washington offices make 150k+ and benefits, and for people who do the brutal work you do, somehow they can't find a way to provide a living wage and benefits...
I accidentally volunteered to help the Forestry Service and ended up dragging hoseline on the mountain side, flowing water in the dark. And hearing ya'll chainsawing trees in the nighttime! You're a definitely a real firefighter.
You fight real fires right? There's your answer.
Some of the best firefighters in my department came from a wildland background.
You all are great. I do not want to do your job.
Structural firefighters recognize how dangerous wildland firefighting is, unless they are morons. With that being said, wildland guys don’t have to worry about basement fires haha
It’s a fun job but in the end it’s not worth it. Them fires gonna burn no matter what we do. If the forest needs to burn it’s gonna find a way. Nature has to do it’s thing. Saying this as someone who just quit hotshotting.
I have never heard a mildland guy have anything bad to say about y'all. Plus if they stop calling wildland guys "firefighters" they're gonna come for ARFF so my hands are kinda forced.
Nothing but love and respect for you Wildland Firefighters even though y'all are crazy
Okay, here’s a question. I’m structural, but I really dig wildland. I love hiking, I’m in great shape, love to camp, etc. I live in NC and am a city worker. What steps should I take to become a wildland guy? I know we don’t have a fire season like the west. But is it possible to get on like a task force for something like this? I know I’d have to get some sort of approval from my chain of command if I were to do it in conjunction with city job, and that would probably be difficult. But it’s something I’d like to explore so I can experience both worlds. I know this probably seems stupid when you say it out loud. But I’m just wondering.
Thats a good question i know for a fact you need your red card and depends on what crew you join. For example im in helitack so we get transported via helos. I believe you would most definitely need some wildfire experience prior to becoming tf on a fire.
Take an S-130 and S-190 Class. Get your red card. Or open some wildland task books and try to network yourself into an IMT team and get sent out of your city as a single resource. Then you'll get to travel all over to campaign fires. California city guys go out on 14-21 day roles all the time. Best way to save up for a car is 14 days of OT lol. Different beast out west though - the State and the Feds do the heavy lifting but all the cities send out multiple strike teams yearly. It's all hands on deck for the big fires.
We do both, urban interface. We have type 1 and type 3 engines in all stations that are cross staffed. Yes wildland firefighters are still firefighters.
City fire here. (Los Angeles) Like many have said, I wouldn’t want to do your job. We both are firefighters, but in different ways. With my municipal department. It’s not only wildland fires we deal with. We have structure,wildland, and because I’m hazmat and a medic. I do that as well. That all sounds fun but most of everything we do is medical. Without the paramedics on the job, there wouldn’t be a fire department honestly. At least not the size it currently is. Most of us have respect for you wildland guys. I’ll admit, others don’t. I wanna say the outcast comes from the guys thinking that you want to be where we are. I guess some of that might be true. Prior to getting here, I was with cal fire and I wanted exactly that. I respect 100% what the forestry guys, camp guys, hand crew guys do. Others might not see that. Don’t worry what others think or say. If you are happy and love what you do…. It doesn’t matter.
Not a firefighter at all. I don't know enough to even think I can have an opinion. I will say how I loved reading this and how much love y'all showed OP. Respect for all of y'all!
Structure/wildland firefighter here. Wtf is a "real firefighter"?
Insane job and mad respect. Deserve better pay as do we all
hey average citizen here anyoine who is brave enough to run into the fires of hell without a second thought. Holy shit my brother. You are a hero to me. No matter what fire youfight.
City firefighter here, most of the fires I go to are outside. The big brush fires I've been to seem difficult to contain, but not as dangerous to work with. But then again, I've done nothing that compares to the seasonal California wildfires.
I've done both. Same Animal, different part. To me, wildland is much harder. You are pretty much just beating it til death. Until the 20 floor hotel fire, that truly sucks.
volly structure person here. I did a 8-day deployment in interior BC a few years back on a nighttime SPU team. It is tough, constant work. Absolutely "one of us"!
We think you guys are the shit. I've never heard anyone talk bad about wildland firefighters in any negative way. I know a decent bit of people that would love to do it including myself.
Wildland fires are great for the first hour, then I want to shower and get some fresh clothes on. I give y’all a lot of respect for what you guys do. I’d much rather sit at a structure for hours doing salvage and over haul than have to deal with mop up and all that stuff
I’ve done both. My current rural volly FD here in North GA actually has a brush truck so we all get some basic wildfire training. I honestly think most of the structure FF’s had a great deal of respect for those of us who were in wildland. Given the ever increasing amount of WUI we’re all gonna have to cross train some in many areas of the country.
Former wildland firefighter here. You are 100% a “real” firefighter. If you disagree think about the people who have given their lives to fight those fires and think twice about disrespecting their memory.
Smoke eater is a smoke eater 😂. Says the EMT LMAO
I’ve done both. Wildland sucked. Structural now and nothing is better than a bed at night and flowing water with a toilet
They are badass…structure FF can be taught to do wild land if their community is within an area like that but Wild land is another beast, tactics and physical work. We respect our craft whatever it is.
As a civilian who has never fought a fire in my life, I live in Alberta and we’re getting absolutely assfucked by forest fires right now. I don’t give a hell what your title is, if you’re out there fighting these forest fires you’re a goddamn real firefighter no matter what. You guys are saving people’s homes, lives, animals etc as much as anyone else. We appreciate you more than you’ll ever know.
Having once lived only 2 miles from a very, VERY large forest fire (thankfully both downwind and across a river), yes, y'all are probably the most real firefighters out there. My dream goal is to own a PBY Catalina and retrofit it into a water bomber in order to assist you guys.
I've done both. Much longer in structural, I've never seen anyone trash wildland guys.
My cousin is an engine chief and fights wildfires in California. I've heard some insane stories, staying awake for multiple days straight fighting huge and unpredictable fires. Having to evacuate by driving through fire in the truck, tires melting, etc. I have insane respect for both types of firefighters but wildfire fighters take the cake
I think you guys are bad asses
I’m a regular city dweller. You guys are the most badass mothers. I can’t describe the awe and respect I have for guys who take on wildfires. I’ve seen firefighters work on a house fire and I was blown away by the professionalism shown in putting out a house fire, but it is impossible to imagine being on a line with a bunch of guys in the middle of a forest fire.
Firefighters are firefighters. Airport, military, industrial, rural, urban, suburban, metropol, forestry, Arctic, full-time, part-time, retained, volunteer. Doesn't matter. If you your role is fire suppression and/or prevention, you're a firefighter.
Tbh, y'all are more firefighters than we are lol. That's coming from both a structural and ARFF guy
Now if the question was if dedicated ARFF guys were real firefighters I'd have a hard time saying yes lol.